question that I need to clarify.
1) can some one explain some of the popular military programs for after dental school?
2) what are the beneifts? I know that they will pay me full tuition. Also... heard about some kind of stipend... please explain in detail... liike how much..
3)Will I still get paid like a dentist salary whi.e I am in military as dentist?
4)Is there any chances that military dentist could be enlisted to go to war?
5)also, I want to specialize in orthodonic. Is it going to be after the military? or... specialize and go to military.
6)can some one tell me about how many percent in the school of dentistry join the military?
7)I want to hear from reader... if they are willing to go to military service... and why? or... why not?

Thank you

question that I need to clarify.
1) can some one explain some of the popular military programs for after dental school?
2) what are the beneifts? I know that they will pay me full tuition. Also... heard about some kind of stipend... please explain in detail... liike how much..
3)Will I still get paid like a dentist salary whi.e I am in military as dentist?
4)Is there any chances that military dentist could be enlisted to go to war?
5)also, I want to specialize in orthodonic. Is it going to be after the military? or... specialize and go to military.
6)can some one tell me about how many percent in the school of dentistry join the military?
7)I want to hear from reader... if they are willing to go to military service... and why? or... why not?

Thank you

The military programs are great, if you so choose to go that route! Your dental tuition will be paid for in full, as well as any student loans. Usually, the pay-back is committing 4-6 years time in service once you have graduated. Secondly, the military will only pay you as a Captain (O-3) or a Major (O-4) rank. If you specialize, you will do that immediately afterward you graduate. Unless, you are call to go to Iraq just as I did (twice).

Additionally, not many student go into the military after dental school, because they feel as if it is not a benefit. I'm prior military, so I would not hesitate to join once I complete D-school.

I have been the USAF route and loved it (8 years - ages 18-25). I just did not have the opportunity to go the dental while I was in.

Choosing the right organization can make all of the difference in your life. Marines. The only real branch of the service. Everything else is support.

I would check out the Forum Federal Agencies, Military Dentistry

full tuition..pretty nice stipend (still might have to take out a small loan like I am if you have major expenses)...country service..good experience...you can choose to stay in the reserves after ur service (or stay active) for those 20 yrs and get that pension....when you come out...you'll be a pretty hot ticket. I really feel any established dentist would be glad to take someone w/ 4 yrs of experience under their wing...unless you decide to go right into practice for yourself. You "can" go to Iraq...but according to my very reliable sources..they really only take the people who make careers in the military. It's unlikely you'll get snatched up during your years of payback for the scholarship. even when ur done and you're on inactive reserve...you "can" get called up...but wont.

full tuition..pretty nice stipend (still might have to take out a small loan like I am if you have major expenses)...country service..good experience...you can choose to stay in the reserves after ur service (or stay active) for those 20 yrs and get that pension....when you come out...you'll be a pretty hot ticket. I really feel any established dentist would be glad to take someone w/ 4 yrs of experience under their wing...unless you decide to go right into practice for yourself. You "can" go to Iraq...but according to my very reliable sources..they really only take the people who make careers in the military. It's unlikely you'll get snatched up during your years of payback for the scholarship. even when ur done and you're on inactive reserve...you "can" get called up...but wont.

BS

So it matter when you sign up for how much of D-school they will pay for you or will they always pay for the entirety of your loans? I heard it was something like you serve for the same amount of years of d-school that you have them pay.

Choosing the right organization can make all of the difference in your life. Marines. The only real branch of the service. Everything else is support.

Semper Fi to that!!!!!!!!!!!!

Former USMC

Though I am not in the program under the army/navy scholarship, I have been in contact with my local medical recruiter and recently had him speak to our schools Pre-Dental Society. I am currently deciding whether to do this program and this is what I understand of it all...Note when I say army or navy, military or service - i mean any of those programs because they're basically identical

1.) Plain and simple, it's popular because they will pay for school so you will have no real monitory debts after graduation and owe them only 4 years of service in return. Additionally, while in dental school they give you the stipend, pay for tools, books, etc. Also, while in "service" you are paid a salary and more stipend for housing, food, etc. While you're paying back your years, paid national holidays, random days off, lots of vacation (I want to say you get almost 40-50 days off a year).

2.) The stipend you receive while you're in dental school (10.5 months/year) you get approx $1,300 (that was last years amount, possibly going up this year) and then the 1.5 months you are not in school you go on "duty" which is basically being sent to Houston or DC army/navy hospital to learn about how to be an officer, how the military (army, navy, etc whatever you pick) operates, what is expected of you, etc. During this time you will be paid as an officer (get approx $5k for the 1.5 months). If your school does not allow time off, the army/navy understands and you don't have to go on this training duty.

3-4.) When you become a dentist (graduate dental school) you pick about 5 places to be sent to and you're off. NO you will not be put on the lines given a gun to go fight in the war. The army has just invested $200k in you; do you really think they'd risk something happening to you? You will be doing what you have been trained to do, fix teeth. You can be at a hospital in the USA or on a base in Hawaii or in the Middle East. Your rank I believe is Major and the pay is around $50,000. You can live on the base which is a self-contained town with playgrounds (if you have kids), shopping malls, food stores, etc and best part - all tax free. If you chose to live off base, they give you an additional food/housing stipend to pay for rent/mortgage (amount depends on location in the USA).

5.) Specializing - if you choose to specialize, the army will pay for this as well. You will do your training in a joint army/navy program (possibly be with either Scholarshiped army/navy students or be taught by army/navy specialists (it all depends). Due to the high demand in wanting to be an ortho or oral surgeon in civilian life, the ratios of apply:accepted across the country is very low as these programs are very hard to get into. If you do it through the military, the ratio is extremely lower, giving you a much higher chance of being accepted into their program (and obtaining your ultimate goal). The amount of years paid back depends on program (ortho approx 3, oral surgery approx 5) and you will still be receiving your pays. This is where it may get confusing...The army has just paid for 4 years of dental school so you owe them 4 years back. But what if you want to do OMS which is another 5 years of paid education, accumulating 9 years? Do you owe them 9 years in return? The answer is NO. Between the two programs, your dds/dmd and your specializing, whichever has the most years associated with it is the amount of years you owe. Example (remember, years are approx, I do not exactly remember): Dental School = 4 years, Ortho specialize = 3 --- you owe 4. However, Dental School = 4 years, OMS specialize = 5 year --- you owe 5. Not a bad deal either way.

6.) I do not know the percentage but I am sure there are a few per school who do it.

Extra - upon the conclusion of the years you owe (3.5 years into the 4), the military will be wanting to keep you. How do you think they entice you to stay? Money. No obligation "stipends." I don't know how true it is, but our recruiter said he heard an OMS at the end of his payback term, was given around $8-10k to stay. In addition, with all these years you are in the service, paying back your debt you rank will go up so your pay will go up. If you specialize, you owe more years but your pay goes up due to your newly acquired skills. Now think about this...you're paying back you years but you're also accumulating years towards army retirement (20 total). I know it may seem like a long time, but after an OMS military education you have done 5 of 20 years. Depending on your age, you could be retiring at 50-55. What retirement pay is, I have no idea. Also, the service can provide a lot for you. As stated earlier with all the days off you get or vacations, you can stay at bases worldwide (Hawaii's pretty nice). Do you like to sky-dive, learn how to fly a plane, see what its like to do army training (but not actually have your a** kicked) - the military provides these types of services for you to take part in which I thought was pretty cool.

Hope this all helped and was not too much or too confusing.

Uh CRH,

FYI, OMS is 4yrs in the military. It is 4yr or 6yr in the civillian world. Most military programs require a possible year of GP before going to OMS, that is why it might be five, but the actual OMS training is 4yrs. ADA requires the program to be 48months, of which 30 months minimum to be of clinical OMS training.

So it matter when you sign up for how much of D-school they will pay for you or will they always pay for the entirety of your loans? I heard it was something like you serve for the same amount of years of d-school that you have them pay.

it depends on the scholarship...all the branches have 4 yr scholarships..and there are 3 and 2 yr available as well. Most say that for it to be worth it that, you should AT LEAST do the 3. B/c if you do 2..you still owe 3 yrs of service...bad deal...and yes..the 3 and 4 yrs are "one for one"..they paid for 4 yrs..u serve 4. Same w/ the 3. But the scholarship..covers all of your tuition, books, lab fees, etc. They just dont cover living expenses..thats what the stipend is for. I think if you join after dschool you wont get all your loans paid off...they have FAP's (financial assistance programs). I dont know much about them but I believe they will help you pay back some of the debt you've built up.

Go Marines! Semper Fi forever!

Everything else is just warming a chair.

umm...i dont think the marines offers health professions scholarships. You may get to work w/ the Marines if you go via the Navy...but nothing is offered directly through the Marines.

Being a Devil Doc is the closest a medic will ever get to being operational military.

im applying this year and have spoken to an air force advisor about applying for the HPSP program.

i was wondering if you have the option of choosing to specialize in a civilian program following graduation, then serving the four years you owe for dental school after completing your civilian specialty training?

the advisor replied 'yes' when i asked him this, but im not sure that he completed understood my question.

the reason i ask -- i guess one wouldn't have any reason to seek civilian specialty training if you wanted to do ortho, endo, etc. but what if you decided to do the 6-year OMFS track which the military doesn't provide?

or would you end up having to serve back the four years for dental school first, then leave the military and seek civilian training if you decided on the 6-yr track?

I think the military has a 4 yr OMFS. but regarding specializing in general..you can do it at a civilian institution following graduation..but if they pay for it...you are going to owe back more time. So if u went ortho on their dime...u'd owe your 4 yrs for dschool then 2 yrs for ortho. That's basically how the whole thing works....one for one.

so... the time line will be...if I want to specialize ortho..

Undergraduate (4yrs) -> Dental school (4yrs) -> military service (4yrs) -> ortho specialization (2 yrs)

is this correct time line???
Also... HOW HARD is it to get into army, navy or air force
and how different are they???

BS

nope..not only from my recruiter (who i know some might say is just full of it)..but also from a close relative...a Colonel, a surgeon, in the USAF..who clearly knows more about it than anyone you could ever talk to

Some would suggest that a Colonel has been is so long that they have outlived any real threat of clinical work because they have been promoted to adminstrative function.

I was just looking at the military medicine thread. Apparently the USAF's reputation for medicine is pretty poor. www.medicalcorpse.com
But then again, this info is from a Lieutenant Colonel.

Some would suggest that a Colonel has been is so long that they have outlived any real threat of clinical work because they have been promoted to adminstrative function.

I was just looking at the military medicine thread. Apparently the USAF's reputation for medicine is pretty poor. www.medicalcorpse.com
But then again, this info is from a Lieutenant Colonel.

You would think so...but that's not the case here. He knows plenty about who gets sent where b/c he has done it...and not b/c he was made to go, but because he volunteered himself. My father has also spent adequate time on USAF bases...telling me that they treat their dentists like gold. Why? b/c they want to keep them...because w/ the limited # of people getting scholarships or coming in out of private practice..they try to make the deal as sweet as possible for you. So it all depends...but I can tell you, or anyone, w/ almost certainty..that the likelihood of being shipped off somewhere while ur doing ur HPSP payback..as a DENTIST...is slim to none. I can see why it would be more likely as a physician. You would need them there if someone needs immediate care. Dental work is mainly prep work for people who get sent off to war...wouldn't be too many "dental" emergencies...at least not many that are life or death situations. This is why I said that its unlikely you'll get shipped off during payback....didnt mean to step on anyone's toes or offend anybody. I just try my best to get rid of the stigma that military dentistry is this god awful creation.

I'll preface this by saying I don't have firsthand knowledge, but I have heard from several reliable sources that you are pretty much guaranteed to deploy in the Army (12-15 months) and there is a pretty good chance you will deploy in the Navy (6-8 months). The Air Force is better because they aren't spread as thin, but anyone who is going to take the scholarship should assume they are going to deploy because otherwise it could be a rude awakening if it does happen.

I'll preface this by saying I don't have firsthand knowledge, but I have heard from several reliable sources that you are pretty much guaranteed to deploy in the Army (12-15 months) and there is a pretty good chance you will deploy in the Navy (6-8 months). The Air Force is better because they aren't spread as thin, but anyone who is going to take the scholarship should assume they are going to deploy because otherwise it could be a rude awakening if it does happen.

well right..i probably should have clarified that my info has come from the USAF side. I dont know much about the army or navy. I have just been informed from reliable sources as well that w/ the AF...u pretty much dont have anything to worry about. I mean even if you do get deployed...it's not like ur going to go somewhere in the line of fire..you'll be working at a medical facility which is probably pretty damn secure. Plus, it all depends on your lifestyle. If you have a family...maybe you need to think about it more. But if you're single...deployment really wont be that big of a deal. Bottom line is..everyone has their opinions..everyone has their info...it all comes down to that person's decision.

I'll preface this by saying I don't have firsthand knowledge, but I have heard from several reliable sources that you are pretty much guaranteed to deploy in the Army (12-15 months) and there is a pretty good chance you will deploy in the Navy (6-8 months). The Air Force is better because they aren't spread as thin, but anyone who is going to take the scholarship should assume they are going to deploy because otherwise it could be a rude awakening if it does happen.

I am currently enlisted in the Army and I can confirm this statement.

I am currently enlisted in the Army and I can confirm this statement.

yes, but is it the same for regular army dental officers? i know in the guard while enlisted people are activated for 12-15 months, dental officers are only activated for 90 days + days at mob station. (although i heard they're going to start the 90 count when you reach the mob station and not in country)

Yes, as an active duty army dental officer you will be deployed for 12-15 months after 1.5-2.5 years of getting out of d-school, guaranteed.

But... if we elect a democratic president... i'm pretty sure we'll be out of iraq soon. And by the time we graduate we'll probably have no more deployments. :confused:

Yes, as an active duty army dental officer you will be deployed for 12-15 months after 1.5-2.5 years of getting out of d-school, guaranteed.

But... if we elect a democratic president... i'm pretty sure we'll be out of iraq soon. And by the time we graduate we'll probably have no more deployments. :confused:

And socialized medicine/healthcare! Thank GOD I chose dentistry.

so whats the time frame that students to apply for a military scholarship? Is it before they start school but after they are accepted?

Moving.

Wow, great info. Thanks for posting.

I have always got conflicting accounts on pay. Does your time in school really count towards pay? I have heard some say that you are an 0-3 with <2 and others say that you've got four under your belt. Does anyone know which is correct?

Thank you NAVY DDS 2010 for the helpful and detailed posts. Actually makes me want to join now...hmm...

tons and tons of great info here...I wish I had the time to read through it all so in case this question is answered already I apologize..i'll keep it short. If ur goin on the HPSP...yay or nay on shooting for the AEGD if you think u'll probably serve your time and come out once its up?(this may change but as of right now..my intentions are to not make a career in the military...but I have most definitely not ruled out the possiblity) Why or why not? My dentist says no, but thats b/c he wants me to take over his place assuming he's still there in 8 yrs, which is a BIG assumption cuz he's already in his early 60s.

Navy DDS, between you and Squids, I don't know who provides the best info. You guys should be recruiters, but then again, you wouldn't be this knowledgeable about the dental side of the Navy.

I have a question. I thought you could apply without an acceptance letter? I am pretty sure you can, but I could be wrong. Other than that, everything you posted was very informative and accurate.

I am wondering why the Navy is the only branch that offers the HSCP? It would make sense if they all did it, but it is a great option for the Navy; just another way to garner applicants and future dentists.

Truthfully, I know a bunch of people who say they couldn't afford dental school without the military, especially those with families. The cost of dental school can be simply outrageous.

Go Navy!

Does anyone know of the age requirements/restrictions for applying for the HSCP or HCSP?

I think you may have to be commissioned by 35, but the age has either recently been increased, or there are also waivers. I have heard people around 45 or so getting those scholarships, but don't quote me on that.

I thought I would post some info from the AF perspective. Just so you know, I don't have any prior military experience aside from the HPSP program.

I would definitely agree that the Air Force is having the easiest time filling their spots, making it the most competitive when it comes to getting a scholarship. And yes, Navy DDS is right, you can begin applying without an acceptance letter, but you cannot be considered for a scholarship until you have one. I received a 3 yr scholarship from the AF. I received my acceptance letter in January and by the time I completed my app it was the end of February and all the 4 yr scholarships were already gone (for the class beginning that Fall). The Army still had plenty of scholarships left and contacted us, but we had already decided we wanted to go the AF route. This year, the AF scholarships were gone by January.

Another, quick note... with the AF, you have the option to apply to a specialty program, but you are REQUIRED to apply to AEGD. So, if you don't get into a specialty or don't apply to one, there is still a chance that you will have an extra year of AEGD after you graduate before you begin paying your scholarship years back.

Since I received the 3 yr scholarship, I was not able to go to COT (commisioned officers training) before I started dental school. They are not currently allowing 3 yr scholarship recipients to attend this summer (which is the only summer I get a break from school). So, I will be attending COT as soon as I graduate (as soon as I graduate, I will become an O-3, or captain). I will go to COT, then off to a base for either my specialty, AEGD or to begin working as a general dentist.

While I am in dental school, I am an O-1 (second lt). I received $400 this year for clothing (even though I don't need a uniform yet). I can currently fly Space A, however my dependents cannot since I am not active duty. I shop at the nearest commisary and exchange. I receive a stipend of $1320 a month, except for when I am on active duty. While I am in dental school I am required to serve 45 days a year on Active Duty Tour, for dental students they just put you on "Campus Tour", which means I get full active duty pay and benefits as an O-1 for those 45 days, but I don't do anything other than attend school as usual. The only restriction is that I cannot leave the country during this time without notifying the AF first. Of course, I also get my tuition, books and fees paid for which is nice since I'm not getting in-state tuition! I went to the nearest military installation that offers CAC's, it happened to be a Naval Air Station, to get my military ID. There are lots of places that give you discounts if you have your military ID with you (we got free passes to Busch Gardens).

We asked about going overseas, because we thought it would be an awesome opportunity. They told us there isn't much chance of going, unless you commit to going career with them. The AF only sends dentists to AF bases, they will not station you on carriers, field stations etc.. The only bases overseas are in Germany, Italy, Japan, South Korea, Turkey, England, and a small island off of Spain. Plus Guam, Alaska and Hawaii if you want to call those overseas. As a result, in the AF, it is actually considered a privelege among medical and dental officers to be stationed over there.

That is all I can think of for now...

Another, quick note... with the AF, you have the option to apply to a specialty program, but you are REQUIRED to apply to AEGD. So, if you don't get into a specialty or don't apply to one, there is still a chance that you will have an extra year of AEGD after you graduate before you begin paying your scholarship years back.


From everything I have heard, you are correct in saying that you are required to apply for the AEGD, but you are not required to accept it if you are selected.

From everything I have heard, you are correct in saying that you are required to apply for the AEGD, but you are not required to accept it if you are selected.

Can someone verify this please?

It is true. I am on the Air Force HPSP. Everyone applies.

Quoted from above: From everything I have heard, you are correct in saying that you are required to apply for the AEGD, but you are not required to accept it if you are selected.

Whoa, this thread is the first I have heard of this mandatory AEGD stuff. I was one signature away from signing up for the four year AF scholarship last year but still had some doubts. I am now in the application process for the three year scholarship. Can someone confirm the following: You MUST apply for an AEGD or specialty program but you are NOT required to accepted it if selected? The extra year would be a huge turn off for me as I am a slightly older applicant.

Quoted from above: From everything I have heard, you are correct in saying that you are required to apply for the AEGD, but you are not required to accept it if you are selected.

Whoa, this thread is the first I have heard of this mandatory AEGD stuff. I was one signature away from signing up for the four year AF scholarship last year but still had some doubts. I am now in the application process for the three year scholarship. Can someone confirm the following: You MUST apply for an AEGD or specialty program but you are NOT required to accepted it if selected? The extra year would be a huge turn off for me as I am a slightly older applicant.

I would also like this confirmed...if we're forced to apply and then forced to accept, that extra year would be a bit of a turn-off for me as well. I'm a bit of an older applicant too (26). My recruiter told me that "they highly recommend doing that program," but I sensed a little hesitation as if he wasn't giving me the whole story.

Another Q...I heard that the AF is planning on implementing something soon where all 4 year applicants to the AF that didn't receive the scholarship will automatically be granted the 3-year. This means they wouldn't need to go through the application process again. Can anyone else confirm is this has been implemented or is still in the works?

What was posted is correct. You are required to apply for it but not required to accept it. Its really not a big deal, if you don't want to do it then just decline it.

The answer is YES you have to apply for the AEGD-1 program. The follow-on is NO you don't have to accept it. You would be a fool not to. The AEGD-1 program will be the best educational year you have ever had. Hands down. I would do it again in a heart beat. You will do more in one year of an AEGD than you would if dental school lasted a decade. Even if you decide not to make the military a career (most don't), you will be more marketable than anyone heading out to private practice from dental school, ie. more marketable. Plus, what residency pays their AEGD's $65K/year.

Before you decide to turn down an AEGD, ponder this...

How many ortho cases did you complete in dental school? I did eight start to finish in my AEGD.

How many endo retreats/apical surgeries? I did about 15.

How many IV sedation/3rd molar cases? I did 86 (only the AF credentials AEGD residents in IV sed).

How many connective tissue grafts? I did 8.

How many implants? I did 10.

How many CERAC restorations, open flap curettage with apically positioned flaps, frenectomies, tori removals, full anterior cosmetic cases, etc..?

How many TRULY medically compromised patients, head/neck cancer patients, pre-cardiac surgery clearance extractions, reduced fractures, major space infections, etc., etc. ?

You get the point. Even if you decide you don't like the endo, perio, ortho, etc. at least you will have clinical experience. This will only help the GP.
If you are thinking of specializing, you will know really quick if you truly want to apply. I thought I wanted to do pedo, now I'm starting OMS. Go figure.

If you do not do an AEGD-1 you will probably end up on an "amalgam line". You will to do all the full cuspal coverage amalgams you can handle, more exams than you have mirrors, and an occasional crown. The military "credentials" their dentists. This means you can only do what the credentialing board says you can do. Without the AEGD, its not much.

2. Your chances of getting into a specialty residency right out of dental school are pretty much non existent. I can only speak for the AF, but there were only a few who were accepted to a specialty out of school. You may be able to get into perio or pros, but other than that you have no chance. There is a chance to get into OMS, but you will have to spend one year as a general dentist at either Travis or Lackland. Why not spend that year in an AEGD.

I had a lot of friends doing AEGDs all over the country in the civilian world. with the exception of maybe Colorado's (IV and 3rds), no one even came close. The location of the AEGD is key. Ask the residency directors, not the recruiter, what their program offers. They will talk to you. They like that kind of stuff. Also, interview in person.

It may not be for everyone, but there are a whole lot of pluses.

On the retention bonus pay tables, some of the lower listings, ie, general dentist, there is (ACP - advanced clinical practice) in parentheses. Does anyone know what this means? Does it means you have to be a general dentist with certain qualifications, aegd, years, or combination of all the above to get the retention bonus? Also, I believe the comprehensive/operative dentist is someone who has done the AEGD-2...is this correct?

Yes you're right. An A-dentist (completed the AEGD-2) is eligible for "board" pay. Other general dentists are not. I am not postive about the Multi-year retention bonus, but it is tiered so different people get different things.

Everyone gets VSP (veriable special pay), and ASP (additional special pay)
OMS gets ISP (incentive special pay).

http://www.military.com/benefits/military-pay/special-pay/special-pay-for-dental-officers

Just FYI everyone..and not that this is relavant to anything. I Just met a former enlisted member of the USAF tonight...he was stationed at Travis AFB..he dated a girl who worked as a dental tech...and he said that they did all kinds of stuff at that office....including cosmetic dentistry. This was like..5 years ago...along w/ all the surgical type stuff civilians do. So anyone who says you cant get good "experience" in the military...well...has no idea what they are talking about. just thought i'd give everyone something to chew on :D

Just FYI everyone..and not that this is relavant to anything. I Just met a former enlisted member of the USAF tonight...he was stationed at Travis AFB..he dated a girl who worked as a dental tech...and he said that they did all kinds of stuff at that office....including cosmetic dentistry. This was like..5 years ago...along w/ all the surgical type stuff civilians do. So anyone who says you cant get good "experience" in the military...well...has no idea what they are talking about. just thought i'd give everyone something to chew on :D

Common misconception from a lot of people. :thumbup:

I agree. From the civilian and military dentists that I worked with, most of the military dentists were just as sound clinically if not better. Dentists in private practice routinely performed root canals without rubber dams and cut all sorts of other corners, none of which occurred with the military.

Sadly, a lot of people see was is depicted on t.v. or hearsay and decide what the military is all about.

Am I the only practicing military dentist on this forum? Anyway, here to give you some real stories. Let me just say, at least on the Navy side, what you do really really depends on where you're stationed and to a lesser extend who the boss is. I happen to be in a pretty nice environment where in-office bleaching does happen now and then, along with some occasional cosmetic procedures. We own a top notch intra-oral camera and digital radiography units. Restoring implants happen and lots of crown and bridge work is there, too.

On the other hand, if you happen to be that luck guy who gets stationed at a recruit depots like MCRD in San Diego and Parris Island, you'll probably be doing pulpectomies and placing amalgam all day, all year until you move to the next duty station. You'll become an expert at carving that "amalgamcrown" with that fifth cusp and all. So, what you do really depends where you are. Sorry to ruin anyone's dreams if you're headed there...maybe you can come to my duty station one day. :D

I agree with you again. Yes, I do cosmetic procedures. I am fortunate enough to have a lot of autonomy. I give my patients what they need. If they need anterior units, I'll do all ceramics. I quit doing gold anteriors after dental school. For some reason, my patients don't want them. Go figure.
It does depend where you are, what your patient load is like, and what your commander's philosophy is.

I just finished some internal bleaching today. We just ordered a CERAC scanner, we have digital radiography, intraoral cameras, and a lot of "bells and whistles". We have another scanner where I can scan dies and send the data to Peterson AFB for fabrication of ceramic posteriors/anteriors. Unfortunately, they won't buy the 15" flat screens I put in for.

I do spend plenty of time doing full cuspal coverage amalgams for patients who may be deploying in the near future. Obviously if the patient load is high, like it is for me right now, the patients may have to wait a few months for some elective things.

I hope this helps.

What was posted is correct. You are required to apply for it but not required to accept it. Its really not a big deal, if you don't want to do it then just decline it.

I heard it mentioned that those student dentists who don't undergo the AEGD spend significantly more time on the "amalgam line" than those that do? Anyone with experience here?

Read the previous posts.

When to apply - as soon as you decide you want to go the military route and have an acceptance letter in hand. Even if the branch of the military you desire to apply with doesn't have any scholarships available, your package can go to the selection board and once OCT 1st rolls around, you can be granted a scholarship. That is how I got mine this past year. Once I determined I wanted the Navy HSCP scholarship, there were none available. So, once OCT 1st came around and the HSCP was available, I got the call stating I had the scholarship. A few days later I signed the paperwork.


NAVY DDS 2010,
so, if you accepted the scholarship after OCT 1st, does that mean it took effect the following semester (spring semester)? was it effective immediately? or did it not take effect until the start of the next year and so you were responsible for coming up with the money to pay for that first year of school? after OCT 1st, does it become a 3 year scholarship or still 4? basically, if you are a first year dental student and accept the scholarhip after OCT 1st, when does it take effect? thanks.

Which Air Force AEGD programs are considered "good". Are there any that you try to avoid? How likely are you to get your top choice?

Thanks NAVY DDS 2010. I, as well as many of the other readers of this forum, truly appreciate all of your very helpful information.

The application can be submitted, but in order for the file to be sent to the board your file must be complete which includes having been accepted into a program. In my case, I was already attending school for almost 2 months before I sent in the application, so the letter was pretty much pointless then. Now, there are always circumstances where exceptions are made. I was supposed to have two interviews, but that never happened.

For the Army, you can submit your application and be approved for the HPSP before receiving acceptance into a dental school. The Army has automatic acceptance if you have a cumulative GPA of 3.5 or higher, a DAT of 19 or higher, you meet all other requirements (ie. physical, security check, etc.,) and there are still scholarships available. Instead of submitting your acceptance letter with your packet, you submit a memorandum listing the dental schools to which you have applied. If you haven't been accepted to dental school by August 1st, the scholarship is withdrawn.

AR 601-105 (http://www.usarec.army.mil/im/formpub/REC_PUBS/R601_105.pdf)

Before you decide to turn down an AEGD, ponder this...

How many ortho cases did you complete in dental school? I did eight start to finish in my AEGD.

How many endo retreats/apical surgeries? I did about 15.

How many IV sedation/3rd molar cases? I did 86 (only the AF credentials AEGD residents in IV sed).

How many connective tissue grafts? I did 8.

How many implants? I did 10.

How many CERAC restorations, open flap curettage with apically positioned flaps, frenectomies, tori removals, full anterior cosmetic cases, etc..?

How many TRULY medically compromised patients, head/neck cancer patients, pre-cardiac surgery clearance extractions, reduced fractures, major space infections, etc., etc. ?


Sorry, I'm a bit late in responding, I just joined the forum. I went through the Army's AEGD at Fort Lewis and while the program was great and I learned a lot, we did not get to do anywhere near as much as you did in the AF. No full ortho cases, a couple apicos and retreats, no IV sed, no implants, a couple tissue grafts, one over denture, a few crown lengthenings.

So look at what the program in your service offers before committing any more time.

On the retention bonus pay tables, some of the lower listings, ie, general dentist, there is (ACP - advanced clinical practice) in parentheses. Does anyone know what this means?

ACP is a new program that the Army started this year. The ACP program has a list of requirements that need to be completed after completing the AEGD 1-year. It's a long list that includes clinical experience and military experience, like getting your Expert Field Medical Badge and going to the Combat Casualty Care Course. The advisers on the program expect it to take about 2 years after the AEGD program to meet all the requirements. Once you have completed those it allows junior officers to be eligible for a multi-year bonus.

I would also like this confirmed...if we're forced to apply and then forced to accept, that extra year would be a bit of a turn-off for me as well. I'm a bit of an older applicant too (26). My recruiter told me that "they highly recommend doing that program," but I sensed a little hesitation as if he wasn't giving me the whole story.
Another Q...I heard that the AF is planning on implementing something soon where all 4 year applicants to the AF that didn't receive the scholarship will automatically be granted the 3-year. This means they wouldn't need to go through the application process again. Can anyone else confirm is this has been implemented or is still in the works?

I can tell you what my recruiter told me about the AEGD. "The AF requires it, thus making your payback 5 years". This was a turn off for me too, but I still might do it. On a positive note, he said an AEGD would give me the equivalent of 7 years experience in just one year.

at this point and time it is not required. I have a friend who just graduated dschool..she went on the 3 yr scholarship.. she had to apply, got accepted to her first choice of residency..but she declined it. So no they do not make you.

I finally heard that I'll be receiving the 3-year scholarship. I'm guessing if your school has summer sessions (as mine does) they will also pay for that tuition as well correct?

I'm still a bit unsure about the process of entering a specialty after school. Assuming you're a top notch student and competitive to get a specialty program, is the Navy going to kill your plan b/c they need you as a GP? This link http://www.nomi.med.navy.mil/pages/nmetc/Dentalliaison.htm
says it's rare and only 5 out of 70 HPSP students were permitted to defer to a residency. Do you think that's b/c only 5 out of 70 were accepted into one or were some some poor sods denied their specialty?

I know in the Army it would be rare to be able to defer in order to do a civilian specialty program, Navy I don't know about but I would assume it is the same. Both Services are short on general dentists right now so they want you on board as soon as possible. On the other hand, if you want to specialize in a field that they are having trouble filling, they may be willing to let you do the residency on your own. If you want to do ortho or endo you probably won't have much luck, but if you are more interested in oral surgery or perio you may have a better chance.

It never hurts to ask in the military, just understand that everything is based on the needs of the military and those needs aren't always the same as your own.

I can tell you what my recruiter told me about the AEGD. "The AF requires it, thus making your payback 5 years". This was a turn off for me too, but I still might do it. On a positive note, he said an AEGD would give me the equivalent of 7 years experience in just one year.

Does that mean five years after the AEGD?

Does that mean five years after the AEGD?

No. It would be four years after the AEGD for a four year scholarship.

The AF and probably Army and Navy are year for year with no less than three years of active duty pay back. If you receive a three year scholarship it will be a three year pay back. The same with a four year scholarship. Four for four.

Now days, the residency does not count as a payback year. So if you get a four year and do the AEGD-1, you will still owe four years afterward. If you get a three year, you will owe three afterward.

Still not a bad deal for the education you receive. Plus $150K/5 years is still some good money. Five years after graduation, no student loans and tons of experience.

Five years after graduation, no student loans and tons of experience.

One other consideration is that, depending on where you are currently licensed, and where you want to practice when you get out, 5 years puts you into the window for reciprocity or licensure by credentials.

Dear Snozberries or anyone who might know,

I'm a D4 student AF HPSP, scheduled to have an interview with an AEGD director in 2 wks.

How is the AF AEGD-2 differ from the AEGD-1 in terms of cases, program structure, etc?
There is only one base that offers the AEGD-2: that is, Lackland AFB. About how many residents do they accept?

I'm contemplating on applying for either an AEGD-1 or -2, but not totally sure of the latter. I do know that I would like to do at least an AEGD-1, however. In that case, which base would you recommend as the best/better AEGD-1 locations?

Please advise. Thank you so much in advance.
Toothfairy



The answer is YES you have to apply for the AEGD-1 program. The follow-on is NO you don't have to accept it. You would be a fool not to. The AEGD-1 program will be the best educational year you have ever had. Hands down. I would do it again in a heart beat. You will do more in one year of an AEGD than you would if dental school lasted a decade. Even if you decide not to make the military a career (most don't), you will be more marketable than anyone heading out to private practice from dental school, ie. more marketable. Plus, what residency pays their AEGD's $65K/year.

Before you decide to turn down an AEGD, ponder this...

How many ortho cases did you complete in dental school? I did eight start to finish in my AEGD.

How many endo retreats/apical surgeries? I did about 15.

How many IV sedation/3rd molar cases? I did 86 (only the AF credentials AEGD residents in IV sed).

How many connective tissue grafts? I did 8.

How many implants? I did 10.

How many CERAC restorations, open flap curettage with apically positioned flaps, frenectomies, tori removals, full anterior cosmetic cases, etc..?

How many TRULY medically compromised patients, head/neck cancer patients, pre-cardiac surgery clearance extractions, reduced fractures, major space infections, etc., etc. ?

You get the point. Even if you decide you don't like the endo, perio, ortho, etc. at least you will have clinical experience. This will only help the GP.
If you are thinking of specializing, you will know really quick if you truly want to apply. I thought I wanted to do pedo, now I'm starting OMS. Go figure.

If you do not do an AEGD-1 you will probably end up on an "amalgam line". You will to do all the full cuspal coverage amalgams you can handle, more exams than you have mirrors, and an occasional crown. The military "credentials" their dentists. This means you can only do what the credentialing board says you can do. Without the AEGD, its not much.

2. Your chances of getting into a specialty residency right out of dental school are pretty much non existent. I can only speak for the AF, but there were only a few who were accepted to a specialty out of school. You may be able to get into perio or pros, but other than that you have no chance. There is a chance to get into OMS, but you will have to spend one year as a general dentist at either Travis or Lackland. Why not spend that year in an AEGD.

I had a lot of friends doing AEGDs all over the country in the civilian world. with the exception of maybe Colorado's (IV and 3rds), no one even came close. The location of the AEGD is key. Ask the residency directors, not the recruiter, what their program offers. They will talk to you. They like that kind of stuff. Also, interview in person.

It may not be for everyone, but there are a whole lot of pluses.

Dear Snozberries or anyone who might know,

I'm a D4 student AF HPSP, scheduled to have an interview with an AEGD director in 2 wks.

How is the AF AEGD-2 differ from the AEGD-1 in terms of cases, program structure, etc?
There is only one base that offers the AEGD-2: that is, Lackland AFB. About how many residents do they accept?

I'm contemplating on applying for either an AEGD-1 or -2, but not totally sure of the latter. I do know that I would like to do at least an AEGD-1, however. In that case, which base would you recommend as the best/better AEGD-1 locations?

Please advise. Thank you so much in advance.
Toothfairy

Since I did not complete the AEGD-2, I can only speak from what my residency directors and other O-6s have said. The AEGD-2 is definitly comprehensive. It is a two year residency consisting of all aspects of dentistry. They do all the bread and butter stuff plus tons of IV 3rds, implants (both placing and restoring), a good number of ortho cases start to finish, and alot more "specialty" cases of endo, pros, and perio.

It would be extremely difficult to get into the AEGD-2 out of dental school. I know a guy who was an AF Academy grad, class president, great grades, and a guaranteed 20 year guy who didn't get in. He did the AEGD-1 first. I don't know if he applied for the two year yet. You could always apply for the AEGD-2 and 1. What's the worse they could do, say no. I think everyone who does the AEGD-2 did the 1 first.

As far as the best bases do to the AEGD-1. I would call each of the programs and ask what their program offers. Certain specialists like ortho and pedo are not at every base. Who-is-where changes so frequently, I could not accuratly tell you. I would ask each director what their program offers, and see what fits with your goals.

Dear AF Dentites,

I'm preparing for my AEGD-1 interview.

Might you have any pointers, advice, things to ask or ponder? My preferences include Bollings AFB,Travis AFB, Eglin AFB, Langley AFB.
Any insights on the program at the above sites?

Your thoughts are greatly appreciated.

toothfairy2

I am married and considering the military scholarship (applying for dental school this year). The prospects of getting financial support, serving the country, seeing different places...etc all sound interesting to me. However, what is the likelihood of being able to take my family with me during the payback years? We don't have kids yet, but may do by that time. I guess army, navy, air force all approach the family differently. Anyone can help me on which one(s) would be more accommodating?

As far as I know all the services are about the same regarding families. They will move you, your wife and kids. Unless you do a hardship tour, like a year in Korea, or get deployed, you will be with your family. Just don't get stuck doing both, like me (I'm Army though).

When we graduated, before we were married, my wife headed to Alaska to start private practice, while I did the AEGD in Washington. It sounded like I could get to Alaska after the residency, but they didn't care, even though spots were open up there. So I went to Korea instead then was home only a year before they deployed me, for maybe 15 months now. So we've been together 12 out of 50 months, of the 50, 38 were due to the Army (she would have come to Washington if we had gotten married earlier).

Make sure your wife is ready for the commitment. 5 day work weeks, early mornings, being on call. That said, you get 4 days off for most federal holidays, a light Christmas schedule, and 30 days leave (but that includes weekends and holidays: if you want to take a week off over labor day, you'd take 7 days of leave even though you would get 4 off anyway).

If you have a family I would look to the Air Force so you don't get stuck away for a year or 15 months on deployments. If you can get stationed in Europe, you will have great travel opportunities.

Thanks BQUAD!

I've open a new thread on this topic under the main directory, since this seems to be a new topic.

New Thread (http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=444590)

you cannot submit an application without having an acceptance letter. that is part of the application package that gets sent to the board. The government, finacially, doesn't work off the normal calendar year. It's fiscal year runs from October 1st to the following September 30th. So, If you apply in JUL, AUG or SEP, the pickings may be slim or none as far as scholarships go. Once OCT rolls around, the new batch of scholarships become available.

Each branch is different when it comes to scholarship availability. Right now, the Air Force has the easiest time filling its scholarships, so the earlier in the fiscal year the better and they can be a little pickier at selection. The Navy varies from year to year, but they usually fill all their slots by the end of the fiscal year. The Army is hurting. They are undermanned and have the highest amount of scholarships available in which they are not all filled, so if you are in need of money, you can pretty much be guaranteed of getting one from them. I am NOT going to say whether I think going the Army route is a good idea or not because I have no experience there and that topic has its own thread which I would expect soemone to comment there instead of here if they want to bash the Army.

When to apply - as soon as you decide you want to go the military route and have an acceptance letter in hand. Even if the branch of the military you desire to apply with doesn't have any scholarships available, your package can go to the selection board and once OCT 1st rolls around, you can be granted a scholarship. That is how I got mine this past year. Once I determined I wanted the Navy HSCP scholarship, there were none available. So, once OCT 1st came around and the HSCP was available, I got the call stating I had the scholarship. A few days later I signed the paperwork.

Current policy for Navy is to accept an HPSP package without a letter of acceptance; then reveiw, process, and board the package, and give apporval all the way up to final acceptance so that when the applicant does get accpeted to a school all they have to do is go to their local recruiter and sign/swear in.

Navy also has a 'Field Select' program where the recruiter is authorized to offer a scholarship on the spot if the applicant passes a basic background check (questionairre), has a 3.5 or better GPA and a 19 or better on the DAT. Actually going to school on the Navy dime however is contingent on passing a physical and security screeing and meeting height and weight rqmts. All of which occur later as the application is processed.

HSCP may be a little different as they need to bring you directly on active duty to initiate the program.

i have a question regarding the hardship tour in korea.

i'll be receiving the army hpsp soon, and i really hope to go to korea after i'm finished with dental school. i understand there are 1-year and 2-year commitments, and that we are allowed to bring families for the 2-year... am i allowed to bring my family over on my own expense, if i only manage to get the 1-year tour?

i plan on trying to get the 2-year, but as we all know, there are no guarantees..

thanks in advance for all your help.

pk.

First of all, you will have a pretty decent chance of getting a 2 year tour in Korea, and it will keep you out of the worst part. Those with families are generally stationed in Seoul or further south, instead of up north where there are more restrictions.

You can bring you family over at your own expense, but there are disadvantages. It's discouraged, but you can still do it.

1. They will not be able to get access to the commissary due to rationing, you can still go, but there are limitations on how much you can spend a month.

2. If you are required to live on base, then you will pay the full cost of renting a seperate apartment off post for your family, and you will no longer be eligible for BAH since your family won't be living in the US.

3. They will only be eligible for emergency medical and dental care, not routine care.

4. If you get stationed closer to the DMZ there are more restrictions, like curfews, that would make it harder to live with your family even if you rented them a place off post.

The advantages of course are seeing your family and getting to travel around Asia.

If you get stuck with the hardship tour, current Army policy does not give you any credit for spending time away from your faimly as far as deployments go. You are generally given a year after returning, then you will probably deploy, so you will have 2 years away from you family (happened to me). I'm trying to change that policy but haven't had any luck so far.

So I'd say go for the 2 year but really think about it before taking the 1 year slot.

I'm not sure I've ever seen a straight answer to this: (Specifically for the Air Force, but probably the same for other branches)
I know that the AEGD-1 is considered a neutral year (does not count toward payback). However, what about the other residencies? How about the AEGD-2? Are any of them concurrent payback? (ex. 4 year HPSP payback + 1 year AEGD-1 + 3 year Prostho residency = 8 year service; or is some of the 4 years of HPSP payed back with the 3 year residency?)

can one choose to have the army pay for 3 years worth of dental school and thus only serve 3 years?
how does this time commitment work?
thanks

Your total commitment is 8 years regardless of how many years the scholarship is for, it just varies how much time is active duty. 4 yr scholarship = 4 years active + 4 years Independent Ready Reserve. 3 yr Scholarship = 3 years active and 5 years IRR.

I don't think they have involuntarily recalled IRR dentists yet but the Army corps keep getting smaller and if deployments continue, they will have to dip into the IRR at some point. IRR deployments are for 90 days, plus about another month in training and processing time.

what is independent reserve?
is that when you are working privately, but if the army calls u up u got to go?

Yes, IRR means you are still on a list that the Army can call up if needed, but you are otherwise free to work wherever you like. You don't have to do the 1 weekend a month, 2 weeks a year like the regular reserves.

Apparently there is something called muster duty, where you may be called to report to a base just for a day to ensure you are still in the area and they have your contact info. My friend just had to do that.

hey lt dan, i'm a 3rd year in the af hpsp, too. what do you need to do fly space A?

Could anyone give more info on going into specialties from Navy and Air Force? The required commitment time does not go up, the year you can apply and realistically get into a specialty program, etc.

I am very interested in a HPSP, but would like more info on the specialty programs.