Here is an updated interview list. Any other invites other than that below? Board has been pretty quiet. Any opinions of the various programs?

Akron City
Akron General
Albany
Albert Einstein - Philly
Allegheny General Hospital
Beaumont
Beth israel-deaconess
Cook County
Detroit Receiving
Drexel
Duke
Eastern Virginia
Emory
Grand Rapids
Hennepin
Henry Ford
Indiana
King-Drew (Compton (LA), CA)
Lincoln
Long Island Jewish
LSU-Baton Rouge
LSU-New Orleans
Maine Medical Center
Mayo Clinic
MCW
Metrohealth
Morristown, NJ
Mount Sinai
North Shore
Ohio State
Orlando
Regions Hospital (in MN)
Resurrection
Saginaw
Sinai-Grace (Detroit)
St. John (Detroit)
St. Vincent's
St.Luke's - Roosevelt
St.Luke's in PA
SUMMA/Akron City
SUNY Stonybrook
SUNY Upstate - Syracuse, NY
Texas Tech
Thomas Jefferson
UAB (Alabama-Birmingham)
University of Arizona
UCI
Uconn
U of Florida
University of Maryland
Umass
University of Michigan
UMKC
UNC
U of Rochester
USC
University of Virginia-Charlottesville
Vanderbilt
WashU
Wright State
Yale
York Hospital/Penn State

michigan state - kalamazoo
christiana care, newark delaware

Hi,

What does it mean if I have applied to those places and haven't heard anything from them.

I know that I am not the top applicant, but I am hoping for a least one interview!! I applied all over the place!

Thanks and Good Luck

Texas A & M / Scott and White.

Also Kentucky and UT-Southwestern in Dallas.

Melb - I also am getting a little squeamish. I've gotten interviews, just not at the places I wanted, and a lot of them aren't that competitive.

I'm starting to wonder what the interview cutoffs are at some of these places.

Interview offer from Geisinger...

what residencies do you not consider competitive?

Melb, what were you numbers (step 1 and clinical grades)? I think it just means that you got the first pass, meaning when more applicants decline the interview during the first pass, you might get an interview off the waitlist. It's probably too early to really panic. There are still several programs (a little less than 1/2 it looks like) that haven't given out interviews yet.

I'm waiting basically to hear from Palmetto Richland (South Carolina) and the North Carolina programs (Carolinas, which I know IS competitive, as well as UNC, Wake Forest, and Duke).

I've got a 242/249 on my Steps, and rank in the top quarter of my class (with all A's in the third year). I'd like to meet the people who are getting the first pass interviews ahead of me and shake their hands.

I don't think Palmetto-Richland or Carolinas has invited anyone to interview yet. Has anyone else heard anything? How about UNC? I know Duke has extended interviews (though not first hand). I have invites from 7-8 programs and am still waiting on the ones in North and South Carolina. I guess we just move a little slower down south.
I heard from Medical College of Virginia and Johns Hopkins today.

I haven't heard from Palmetto, Carolinas, Wake, or UNC. I have a fairly good app with 249/248 boards and good letters, but my app wasn't complete until towards the end of October. It's good to hear that I'm not the only one still waiting though.

Interviews:
Hennepin
Mayo
UMKC
Arizona
UConn
Christiana
Christ Advocate (I'm not sure that one was mentioned above)

My application also wasn't complete until October 24th, so I'm hoping that factored into it. I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one who's a little anxious. I do have offers from a couple of the places I wanted to hear from, but I was under the impression the floodgates of offers would open from everywhere on November 1 when Dean's Letters went public, and I guess it's taking some of these places a while to sort through all their applications. At least, I hope that's the story. Have people gotten offers from Florida-Jacksonville yet? That's another one I want to hear from.

Here's the list of invites I've gotten personally so far - it sounds a lot like the same list you guys have:
Wright State
Missouri-KC
Hennepin
LSU-Baton Rouge
Vanderbilt
Kentucky
Maryland
Orlando
Eastern Virginia
Arkansas
UT-Southwestern
Mayo
Texas A & M/Scott And White
Michigan St.-Kalamazoo
York (PA)

I feel your pain Melb. I have one solitary interview and one rejection so far. My (e)mailbox would have virtual spiderwebs in it if it weren't for all the debt consolidation and porn spam.:mad:

JP

Can I ask when you got your Vandy offer? That's one that I (and my wife!) have been eagerly awaiting. I waited until Oct 31 to send my third LOR (I was waiting for a second EM letter that I still haven't gotten!), so I'm hoping that they just haven't gotten around to it yet.

October 30 is when Vandy said hello to me.

So is hasn't been all that long. I had four letters listed, and it took while to get that fourth one to come in. (Of course, it was one of my EM letters.)

I hope you hear from them. Sounds like you have good numbers, at least as good as mine, so you should stand a great chance, I'd say. I hope we all hear from where we want to hear from, in fact. Good luck to everyone!

P.S. I did hear from Jacksonville today, as well as West Virginia.

is this helpful to you guys? Here's another updated list:

Akron City
Akron General
Albany
Albert Einstein - Philly
Allegheny General Hospital
Arkansas
Arizona
Beaumont
Beth israel-deaconess
Christ Hospital - Advocate
Christiana Care
Cook County
Detroit Receiving
Drexel
Duke
Eastern Virginia
Emory
Grand Rapids
Hennepin
Henry Ford
Indiana
Kentucky
King-Drew (Compton (LA), CA)
Lincoln
Loma Linda
Long Island Jewish
LSU-Baton Rouge
LSU-New Orleans
Maine Medical Center
Maimonides
Mayo Clinic
MCW
Metrohealth
Michigan State - Kalamazoo
Morristown, NJ
Mount Sinai
Newark Beth Israel
North Shore
Ohio State
Orlando
Regions Hospital (in MN)
Resurrection
Saginaw
Sinai-Grace (Detroit)
St. John (Detroit)
St. Vincent's
St.Luke's - Roosevelt
St.Luke's in PA
SUMMA/Akron City
SUNY Stonybrook
SUNY Upstate - Syracuse, NY
Texas A&M
Texas Tech
Thomas Jefferson
UAB (Alabama-Birmingham)
University of Arizona
UCI
Uconn
U of Florida
University of Maryland
Umass
University of Michigan
UMKC
UNC
Upenn
U of Rochester
USC
UTSW
University of Virginia-Charlottesville
Vanderbilt
WashU
Wright State
Yale
York Hospital/Penn State

add Alameda County - Highland Hospital

Add UC-Davis, just got it this evening.

Case Western... woohoo!!

Do you know anything about Case Western? Is it a good program? How does it compare to others?

haha we all seem to have gotten interviews at Case Western. We all probably got the same email this morning. Funny how in the email i can see all the other applicants email addresses! Now I can prank email everyone and clog their email addresses with so much spam you will NEVER be able to filter through to the real interviews. That's one way to get rid of the competition. Hahhaha now all i need next is to boil your bunny and serve it for dinner.

Just kidding. But I do think it was weird that it wasnt' a BCC in the email.

Quin... is it high on your list? I know pretty much nothing about this program. Trying to decide if I should make the trek out there or not. (As you can see.. i have no life, other than checking this stupid board).

Hey bud. Pretty much everything is high on my list. I have only interviewed at one place (St. Vincent's), rotated through two EM residencies, so I am definately keeping everything as objective as I can. I really don't have anything to tie me down to any geographical area... so I really have very few rate limiting steps when it comes to where I like. So what I will base my ROL on is my initial feel of the place and if I believe I will be uber-confident when I finish the residency.

Of course, I ask around all the residents I work with their opinions on the different residencies. And this information is not objective. But it is nice to get the scoop on places before you go...

Hey bud. Pretty much everything is high on my list. I have only interviewed at one place (St. Vincent's), rotated through two EM residencies, so I am definately keeping everything as objective as I can. So in my view, everything is ranked #1... it is any negatives that I perceive that will drop them down. Kind of like in high school where your teacher said everyone starts with 100%.

I really don't have anything to tie me down to any geographical area... so I really have very few rate limiting steps when it comes to where I like. So what I will base my ROL on is my initial feel of the place and if I believe I will be uber-confident when I finish the residency.

Of course, I ask around all the residents I work with their opinions on the different residencies. And this information is not objective. But it is nice to get the scoop on places before you go...

Hey Case Western here, too!!! Also, Pametto-Richland and UNC-Chapel Hill. Now, just waiting for Carolinas--has anyone heard?

Invite from OHSU Portland today...

Anyone hear any rejections? Anyone get the big stiff arm?

mike

Originally posted by Future EM?
Quin... is it high on your list? I know pretty much nothing about this program. Trying to decide if I should make the trek out there or not. (As you can see.. i have no life, other than checking this stupid board).

CWRU is a really good program... you are making a mistake if you just brush it off and don't go.

mike

REJECTION!! From University of Cincinnati. Anyone get an interview?

Made some phone calls today:

Carolinas--it will be the end of the month or beginning of December before offers come out

South Carolina--started sending them out today

Vandy--still sending them (I actually made my interview date while I was on the phone...that's awesome!)

U of Chicago--still sending out invites

U of Virginia--due to personal matters, the coordinator has been gone, but she is back and there are offers waiting to be sent out

Indiana--still sending out offers

Virginia Commonwealth--they've sent out most of their offers already (not sure about this one)

Baystate--still sending offers out

Disclaimer: JAYDOC3, INC takes no responsibility for the accuracy of this email or any damage due to the contents therein.

Originally posted by Spud
REJECTION!! From University of Cincinnati. Anyone get an interview?

I got the axe from Cinci and Pitt. I have a good friend at Pitt so I must extra suck or my friend isn't so good. heh

mike

Received invites at Cincy and Case Western. Cincy is the one that's thought of one of the top 5 programs, right? What makes it such a great program (other than being the oldest)? My scores and grades weren't that great, not sure how I got these interviews.

Originally posted by IamTomRiddle
Received invites at Cincy and Case Western. Cincy is the one that's thought of one of the top 5 programs, right? What makes it such a great program (other than being the oldest)? My scores and grades weren't that great, not sure how I got these interviews.

It's hard to say since the programs aren't officially ranked, but Cinci is viewed as a prestigious program. I had a good board score and decent, but not perfect grades and a few publications, one in EM.

I heard that they are big on research and a guy I talked to quoted the PD as saying they specifically look for people going into academics (so no talk of working in the sticks in your interview). I didn't mention research in my personal statement. Also, with the whole LOR balance thing, I went with people who knew me really well over "status"... I didn't kiss ass to any famous people which is prob. a big negative for my application. Oh well.

mike

Has anyone heard from Temple or Hopkins?

I heard from Hopkins around Wednesday of this past week. Did not apply to Temple.

Originally posted by Spud
I heard from Hopkins around Wednesday of this past week. Did not apply to Temple.

It would be useful if someone is keeping a list of interviews if they could keep the dates people are going, too. It would be interesting to meet the people behind the login names.

For me: Metro/Nov 12, Wright St/Nov 20, Vandy/Nov 22, Maryland/Dec 10, U of Mich/Dec 14, St. Vincent's/Dec 17, W. Va/Dec 19, SUMA-Akron/Jan 14, Orlando/Jan 16, Jacksonville/Jan 17, Baton Rouge/Jan 23, New Orleans/Jan 24

Anyone have matching dates?

mike

I know that Indy has been giving out interviews, but is there anyone else still waiting for them? I have all the interviews i wanted except there.

I looked at the SAEM site and it says under the interviews section that they invite via phone call. Is that correct? Anyone been invited there and they did so by calling you??

Here is the quick link to look for yourself.
http://www.saem.org/rescat/in.htm#indiana

Thanks
T

I applied to Indy but haven't heard anything back yet. Odd thing is I havent' heard from ANY Chicago programs or Indy. I have all the interviews I want really, except those out there. I'm sure most will be given out this upcoming week. Weird-o.

My own personal travel schedule (subject to change) looks like this, for those who want to meet this man of mystery:

West Virginia 11/21
Eastern Virginia 12/02
Jacksonville 12/05
Maryland 12/10
Michigan State-Kalamazoo 12/16
Vanderbilt 12/20
Mayo 1/03
Orlando 1/07
Kentucky 1/10
Scott And White 1/15
Baton Rouge 1/16

There are several of these I'd like to drop if better offers arrive. Anyone who's going to be any of those places, though, feel free to say hello.

I also heard from Pittsburgh today. I'm worried - any program where people at work on a SATURDAY sending out e-mail is sending me the wrong kind of message. :p

I received my Indy invite by email in early Oct. but I am cancelling it so there might be a new spot open.

Resurrection and Cook county gave out offers on 11/4, maybe more will be coming? Haven't heard from any of the other chicago places, has anyone else?

I am still waiting for Indiana. Have almost all of my interviews also, except there. Ohiodiva heard in early Oct via email--I thought they sent out emails stating they were waiting for Dean's Letters? Anyone else heard from Indiana??

Originally posted by Spud
I am still waiting for Indiana. Have almost all of my interviews also, except there. Ohiodiva heard in early Oct via email--I thought they sent out emails stating they were waiting for Dean's Letters? Anyone else heard from Indiana??

I haven't heard anything from Indiana except the generic dean's email.

mike

Yeah spud, i received that email too (i'm sure we all did) that said they wont offer any interviews until Deans letters come out. Oh well, I guess a little more waiting can't hurt that much.

I got an Indiana interview Nov.1- Interviews at other places already mentioned -rejected from Pitt and Cinncinatti- ww

You know- I just heard from U. of Chicago by phone- I am out of town & haven't thought about phone invites- I am excited about U of C!

Sad.. I was really hoping for programs in Chicago, did any of the other programs give out invites? Northwestern, UIC? I know Christ, Resurection, Cook (and of course, U of C). It's so weird.. you got the U of C, but didn't get Cincy. I got Cincy, but didn't get U of C!

BTW, what are the dates being offered by U of C?

About Indy,

Heard from a classmate that they only have one interview date left as of today (Jan 25). He was going to be out of town and was looking for someone that would switch with him (Indy apparently ok'd it).

Anyway, for all of you (and myself) hoping for Indy interviews, that does not sound promising.

They said that they are interviewing on Tue & Wen Nov-Jan...Since it was a call, not email- I don't have the available dates. I have a friend that got a Northwestern interview a week or so ago, but not me- ww

Stanford is sending out invites....

Wake checked in this evening. For a nice change, they actually have more than 5-6 interviews dates too.

Received an invite from Resurrection and Albany.

Negatron from UMDNJ-Camden, as well as EVMS.

Got a Baystate (MA) today.

mike

Jaydoc - I was also (very) happy to hear from Wake today. I wish the OTHER North Carolina programs would also check in with me!

I also got one from Louisville - don't know if anyone had mentioned them yet or not.

Invites from Medical College of GA and UCLA Olive view....

Not sure if this one has been mentioned...

Virginia Commonwealth

We need to enlist Future EM to tally up the names again

Akron City
Akron General
Alameda County - Highland
Albany
Albert Einstein - Philly
Allegheny General Hospital
Arkansas
Arizona
Beaumont
Beth israel-deaconess
Christ Hospital - Advocate
Christiana Care
Ucinn
Cook County
Detroit Receiving
Drexel
Duke
Eastern Virginia
Emory
George Washington
Grand Rapids
Hennepin
Henry Ford
Indiana
Johns Hopkins
Kentucky
King-Drew (Compton (LA), CA)
Lincoln
Loma Linda
Long Island Jewish
LSU-Baton Rouge
LSU-New Orleans
Maine Medical Center
Maimonides
Mayo Clinic
MCW
Medical College of Georgia
Metrohealth
Michigan State - Kalamazoo
Morristown, NJ
Mount Sinai
Newark Beth Israel
North Shore
Northwestern
Ohio State
Orlando
Pitt
Regions Hospital (in MN)
Resurrection
Saginaw
Sinai-Grace (Detroit)
St. John (Detroit)
St. Vincent's
St.Luke's - Roosevelt
St.Luke's in PA
Stanford
SUMMA/Akron City
SUNY Stonybrook
SUNY Upstate - Syracuse, NY
Texas A&M
Texas Tech
Thomas Jefferson
UAB (Alabama-Birmingham)
University of Arizona
UCI
UCLA - Oliveview
Uconn
U of Chicago
U of Florida
University of Maryland
Umass
University of Michigan
UMDNJ
UMKC
UNC
Upenn
U of Rochester
USC
UTSW
University of Virginia-Charlottesville
Vanderbilt
Virginia Commonwealth
Wake Forest
WashU
Wright State
Yale
York Hospital/Penn State

Add Madigan, Univ. Calif. - Davis and Oregon Health Sciences.

Got on the wait list at Indiana. I know there are obviously interview offers from Indiana out there, but are they giving out rejections as well?

Quinn,

Did they call/email you and tell you that you are on the wait list or did you call them?

They emailed me today. I emailed them back to be put on their wait list. They said they historically take one or more people from their waitlist. They got a great program so I didn't hesitate.

On the other hand, got a big old spank on the booty from Duke and Emory today.

I also got the same thing from Duke and Emory. Must be a good day for mass-murdering people's dreams out there in Durham and Atlanta.

:)

A big fat NO from Emory here, too. (Who wants to live in Atlanta, anyway?) Bah Humbug!

I got my Duke and Emory bitch-slaps within a few minutes of each other. Oh well, no hard feelings. I feel comfortable with where I stand now, and I hope all the posters and readers are in the same position as I.
+pissed+

Chalk up another victim of the Emory slap upside the head here!!

Well, at least they had the class to let us know instead of letting us flap in the wind!

Got the big stiff arm from Emory also.

mike smith

Got the big NO from Emory and Duke, but got an interview at Denver!!!!!!

Damn Melb you go brother! Congrats.

Hey quick poll...

are there any other DO M4s applying out there besides me?

Who in the hell is Emory interviewing, anyway????

Got double denied today by Duke and Indiana. (I have been previously denied by Oregon and Pitt)
I was a little surprised about Duke; the program is only one year old...and I have received offers from some pretty solid places (Univ of Cin, Case, UMass, Michigan, Wash, 13 total)
I guess there comes a point when programs just throw the applications in the air and see who lands on top.

Originally posted by shaft
Got double denied today by Duke and Indiana. (I have been previously denied by Oregon and Pitt)
I was a little surprised about Duke; the program is only one year old...and I have received offers from some pretty solid places (Univ of Cin, Case, UMass, Michigan, Wash, 13 total)
I guess there comes a point when programs just throw the applications in the air and see who lands on top.

I've gotten like 16-17 interviews so far, including CWRU, Orlando, Vanderbilt, U of MI, and both FL programs, which people have told me are pretty good places. I got the axe at Cinci, Emory, and Pitt. I have not heard anything from Indy, any Chicago programs, any Arizona programs, Denver, Hennepin, or Christiana.
Obviously, unless these programs are late reviewers, things aren't looking good... especially Indiana.

Back before the Dean's letter, I got kind of a rushing email from UMass where they basically insinuated they wanted to interview me right away but never got my board scores. I had my registrar and ERAS fix the problem and I have not heard from them since. WTF?

I wonder why Duke is so picky, I know it's a prestigious background, but they just started their EM program. (I didn't apply there.)

mike

I am really SHOCKED I got Denver, I kind of excepted to get Duke because I thought they wouldn't be that competitve (seeing as they just started). Has anyone applied to New York Columbia/Cornell (they are a new program this year) or Kings County (NY), Metropolitan (NY), Beth Israel (NY), NYU Bellvue--any news from these guys?

Good luck everyone!!!

Mel

That's great melb that you got Denver. I really don't know much about the program other than it is in pretty high demand. I do know a couple of people that were in surgery residencies there and they quit and went to EM. They said that the place was pretty up tight and for lack of a better word....malignant. As it stands with any place though, I always prefer to see for myself as opposed to taking someones skewed opinion. Hell, if they quit a residency program, why wouldn't they say bad things about the place right?

I too have not received the welcome letter from Indy...hmm. I have also been invitied to fairly competitive places CWRU, Portland oregon, Hennepin, UMass plus about 10 more. I don't understand what they are doing. I also didn't get invited to Henry Ford...what the heck???

MikeCWRU... I did an outside rotation at UMass this year. Let me tell you, they are a fantastic program. I know the secretary and res. director pretty well and I don't understand what they were doing with your stuff. They are very well organized and understanding of our situations. If you have questions, give Carol Bloom a call, arguably one of the nicest people ever!!!

Caveat: these of course, are my ramblings and humble opinions. Feel free to Email me or IM me (via AOL) if you want to chat...

Good luck everyone...

Originally posted by Path
MikeCWRU... I did an outside rotation at UMass this year. Let me tell you, they are a fantastic program. I know the secretary and res. director pretty well and I don't understand what they were doing with your stuff. They are very well organized and understanding of our situations. If you have questions, give Carol Bloom a call, arguably one of the nicest people ever!!!

Caveat: these of course, are my ramblings and humble opinions. Feel free to Email me or IM me (via AOL) if you want to chat...

Good luck everyone...

Yes, she was very nice when I talked to her on the phone. She gave me the impression (maybe it was just friendliness and not the actual situation) that they didn't want to make a bad impression with me and wanted to complete my app right away. I just don't understand all the rushing to hear nothing for the past couple of weeks. I have already received my other MA interview and would like a yea or nay so I can schedule them together.

On the flip side, hae you visited CWRU? It's an awesome program too. I just had my interview there this past week.

mike

Originally posted by mikecwru

On the flip side, hae you visited CWRU? It's an awesome program too. I just had my interview there this past week.

mike


No I haven't seen CWRU. My interview there is on Dec 3rd and I am really looking forward to it. It is nice to hear someone from there talk about the place in a positive way. Who else knows the place better, right?

Originally posted by mikecwru

On the flip side, hae you visited CWRU? It's an awesome program too. I just had my interview there this past week.

mike

CWRU/MetroHealth... you interviewed there? How was it? I have an interview set up early December (after yours, Path)... would you mind putting up a post about it on the other thread here? It'd be nice to have a heads up...

So....... am I the only DO applicant here????????

Originally posted by QuinnNSU
CWRU/MetroHealth... you interviewed there? How was it? I have an interview set up early December (after yours, Path)... would you mind putting up a post about it on the other thread here? It'd be nice to have a heads up...

So....... am I the only DO applicant here????????

I interviewed there this week. It's my home program and my #1 choice. The new program director is a great guy and a really popular attending. The most consistent criticisms I hear about CWRU is that the residents work (too) hard (pretty much true) and that they're not happy (not true). The shifts are 12 hours and there's about 20 of them a month. The ED is extremely busy and is currently handling 20k over what the ED was built for, but they're building a 2x big ED scheduled to open 3/2004.

What makes the program good for me is that I like the people a lot, which should probably be the primary reason for everyone, taking a backseat to prestige. The pathology combination of the county hospital and the Cleveland Clinic is good. The EM program is politically powerful at metro. The attendings are great and laid back. LifeFlight is the 2nd busiest in the country and is largely resident run. Metro houses the med control for Cleveland EMS. Metro is adult/peds/high level burn center. The off service rotations are great, especially the traditional second year ICU months. I like the feeling of the hospital overall compared to others I've been in. There are lots of star docs who chose the county hospital over a university one because they're more into serving the poor. Ultrasound training is pretty good here. There are lots of other smaller, but significant pluses. I think you'll like the program. They don't wine you and dine you at the interview like other places, but ask yourself: why are the other places wining and dining you?

The biggest downsides to metro/ccf are:
* they work you hard
* EM is not as politically powerful at CCF
* just one month of elective time and that's new this year
* they pay for oncall meals but the cafeteria closes at 7 PM!!! (EM shifts are 7-7s!!). The cafeteria at CCF is much nicer.
* you will not get as many fringe benefits as other programs: no new palm, health club membership, etc. no big screen TVs in the lounges.... get used to smacking the side of the TV.
* the busy nature sometimes leads to moving the meat with some attendings, but I think they are in the minority and the minority of occasions.
* if you're from a huge city (NYC/LA) you're probably going to think lowly of Cleveland, but give it a chance. Have some of the residents or local med students take you out and show you the town. It's better than you think.

mike

Just want to throw my 2 cents in...

I called Indiana and they told me ALL of their interview slots are filled. So that means if you haven't gotten an interview, don't expect one.

Arizona said they will be sending out rejection letters today (11/15/02).

I've gotten a couple of my top choices thus far, but I'm still stewing because I haven't heard from Vandy, Northwestern, BI (Boston), and Mass Gen. What's the latest word on these places????

I've gotten about 18 interviews, but will probably only take 14-15. I'm going to be broke as a joke after this is over with.

Thanks for the info about CWRU! That was helpful.

Maricopa this morning! ww

Just be thankful your not an fmg trying to get interviews. Step 1-239, step 2-252, great lor's and only 6 interviews so far, wait listed at every other place that I've called, one rejection (emory). Oh well, maybe some of those waiting list offers will come in.

6 interviews (so far!) is nothing to sneeze at. I know people who only had 4 interviews that matched... and Emory, well, I think there's a pervaililng sentiment about Emory on this thread as it is...
:)

Is there anyone out there who has heard from Northwestern. I got invites to all the other Chicago programs plus Indy but am yet to hear from them. Have they started their invites yet??

Oh yeah...and has anybody heard from UCLA-Harbor??

thanks for the words quinn

Yes, Northwestern is giving out interviews- don't know about Harbor- ww

Surprisingly, I got an interview from the much maligned Emory, but I've been rejected by handfuls of mediocre programs. I've also been rejected by most of the competitive programs, like UCLA/Harbor, Indiana, Highland (Oakland), UCSD. And yet I've been invited by CWRU.

My application is a disgrace. I'm ranked near the very bottom of my class, my board scores are perfectly average (at least I never failed Step I or II), and I have done no EM research. I have 1 strong LOR from an unknown EM attending (he was FP-trained, in fact) at an unknown EM program. My other LORs are from surgery and peds.

In short, my credentials stink, but Emory invited me. 'Nuff said about their wayward criteria.

Now who can help me figure out why CWRU would invite a semi-loser like me?

My theory: EM is NOT ONE HALF AS COMPETITIVE as it's made out to be. What a friggin' joke! Sure, it's hard to land a spot in California or Arizona, and sure, Denver and Cincy are killer-competitive, but there are literally DOZENS of programs out there that don't give a damn about your class rank or board scores; they just want bodies!

Every time I hear someone say, "ER [sic] is pretty competitive," I laugh. Aloud. :laugh:

hornet OUT

what is cwru?

i figured it out- ww

So, 3 rejections so far:
UCLA- olive view,
brown
highland
all programs cited "large numbers of applicants" and said"good luck with everything". whatever

granted interviews (and this may help the NY people who don't post their interviews)
St lukes roosevelt
Kings county
LIJ
Northshore
Jacobi
Charity
Resurrection
Emory
GW

still waiting on like 10 programs, i guess i didn't make the cut. if anyone wants to know about the ny programs (incl maimo, methodist, lincoln, brooklyn- all of which i didn't apply to) just ask.
good luck
:cool:

CWRU = Case Western Reserve Univ.

I am still waiting on Northwestern. Have Carolinas (in Charlotte) sent out invites yet? I haven't heard anyone mention them.

As for EM being competitive, it really is. Thing is, it depends on which statistic you look at. Each year, EM fills about 97% of their entire nationwide slots in the match. That means that it fills up completely. However, I've also read that about 90% of EM applicants get their top 3 choices. Go figure.


Rejected from Arizona and Maricopa this AM.:( Oh well...
Accepted at Wake Forest...

I wonder when I should just count my losses...

eemer,

hey i am curious about the NY programs. i randomly applied to several programs on the eras --> click.click.click.click. ... and i know absolutely nothing about them.

can you tell me a little about beth isreal, mainmondes, mt saini, long island jewish, lincoln? (maybe even if you know a little about NJ programs like Morristown, or rochester too) is there a reason that you didn't apply to them? i want to be more selective in choosing interviews.

thanks for your help.

i've heard some talk questioning it's (LA king) financial stability, but i really don't know the whole story... anybody know anything about that? Cali people, perhaps?

thanks

Accreta

I still haven't heard from Carolinas. I read earlier that they said end of November, beginning of December for interview invites. I guess they can afford to be picky!

The word I've heard is that LA County is running a huge deficit. They were threatening to shut down Harbor Hospital (of UCLA Harbor fame). This happens every few years, the last time the Governor baled them out. He said he wasn't going to do it again. On the other hand, several people I've talked to that went through one of the many UCLA residencies says that they threaten to shut Harbor down every couple of years and that it probably won't happen because it would leave a big hole in the county. This is the first time I'd heard USC/King was threatening to close but it makes sense as they get their money from the same source as Harbor.

Not all programs give out rejections, right? Do you know what the chances are for the following programs if I haven't heard?

UCLA-oliveview (some got rejections from here?)
Boston Medical Center (have they given them out yet?)
Jacobi (do they give out rejections or just don't hear?)
NYU (did they give out interviews yet?)
U of C
Northwestern
UIC

Thanks!

Got the axe from both programs in Arizona, so with my plane ticket money, I went and bought myself a flat LCD 17" ViewSonic monitor so that I can view SDN in exceptional clarity.

Wait till you see what I buy when I get the axe from Denver... a Cleveland to Denver ticket is really expensive.

I haven't heard anything from Indiana either. Some people have been saying they got "rejected" from Indiana... did those people get a tangible rejection or just not hear anything like some of us?

Oh well, off to Wright St, then Vandy next week . . .

mike

Originally posted by mikecwru
Got the axe from both programs in Arizona, so with my plane ticket money, I went and bought myself a flat LCD 17" ViewSonic monitor so that I can view SDN in exceptional clarity.

Wait till you see what I buy when I get the axe from Denver... a Cleveland to Denver ticket is really expensive.

I haven't heard anything from Indiana either. Some people have been saying they got "rejected" from Indiana... did those people get a tangible rejection or just not hear anything like some of us?

Oh well, off to Wright St, then Vandy next week . . .

mike

Congrats on the monitor...im jealous.

I called Indiana on Friday to see what was going on. The lady there confirmed that there are no more interview spots left. I asked her about my app. and she said that "it was still under review and that I may still be put on the wait list". Hmmmm, let me think.....I have a slim chance of making onto a list that once you are on it, you have a slim chance of getting an interview. I guess I'm not gonna hold my breath.

Good luck at Vandy, and be sure to post how Wright State is, I'm going there in December.

Path...

I did get an email from Indiana, they put me on the waiting list (if I want). It says they historically match with one or more people from their waiting list every year............................ go figure.
not much news for me this week... one interview offer, 4 rejections, one waitlist...
q

I agree with Hornet. EM is not so much competitive as it is just utterly random. :confused:

And I don't know if anyone has mentioned it, but Ohio State is apparently sending invites only as snail mail, as I got mine today without ever having seen an e-mail. So watch your box for Buckeye stuff, I guess.

Morristown is a nice little (6 res per year) community-based program in a decent suburban setting. I rotated there in the ED as a med student last year and on medicine and surgery as well.

Pros- The program director (Richard Shih) is a tox-trained great, personable guy who is really interested in giving you a quality education. He takes a personal interest in all of his residents. In the ED, there is a reasonable workload (19 12hr shifts per month). No med/surg floors in the residency. Rotations down in Newark at University give some inner-city flavor to a few of the rotations (trauma, peds, OB).

Cons- The hospital is fairly busy, but the acuity is only moderate. A level II trauma center with almost no penetrating trauma. EM residents are by far the best residents in the hospital, with the off-service experience being fair accordingly (decent # of FMGs, etc). At least when I was there, no u/s in the ED. Lots of call (q3) off-service in the main hosp.

Originally posted by jonbonjovi

can you tell me a little about beth isreal, mainmondes, mt saini, long island jewish, lincoln? (maybe even if you know a little about NJ programs like Morristown, or rochester too) is there a reason that you didn't apply to them? i want to be more selective in choosing interviews.
[/B]

Has anybody interviewed at the following programs, or otherwise knows something about them:

Univ. of Arkansas,Little Rock
Jackson, Mississippi
Emory, Georgia

I'm looking for resident happiness, quality of training, etc..... Univ. of Arkansas would be great, as their website has been down for a while.

Thanks so much.

Grrrrrrrrrrrrr Emory...........+pissed+
j/k.

I suppose if the last few posters wished to ask a question about Wright State's EM program, I am willing to answer.

Hey eemer,

Would love to hear more about the following NY programs:
Mt. Sinai
St. Luke's
North Shore

Thanks!

Got an interview offer from East Carolina University... didn't see it on the interview list...

South Carolina checked in this AM

As far as the Carolinas program is concerned, the coord. told me on the phone that it would be "the end of this month or the beginning of December."

Medical College of GA sent an invite today...
(know they have done it before but just so people know they are still sending out invites)

Just joining the thread, not sure what has been mentioned before and not willing to use a checklist to see which programs have been mentioned. As a help to others, I know for a fact that the following programs have extended interviews:
New Mexico, Arizona, Maricopa, UCLA-Harbor (friend, not me :() Loma Linda, UCIrvine, UCDavis, Stanford, Oregon, Hennepin, Regions, Wisconsin, Kalamazoo, Grand Rapids, Indiana, Wright State, Ohio State, Summa (Akron), Case Western, Pittsburgh, Geisinger, West Virginia, Rochester, Syracuse, Albany, UMASS, Maine. So if any of those are new, toss them on the list.

I'm still waiting on UCLA-Harbor, Carolinas, North Carolina, and Madigan, although the only one I'll add to my list if they call is UCLA. I'm already looking at $5000. I hope this interview trail is fun.

I got my second UCLA-Harbor rejection today. I guess they were saying not only no but hell no.

Any FMGs on the board, where have you gotten interviews at?
Thanks!

I am an FMG--with low board scores---have interviews at:

St. Lukes-NY
Northshore
Columiba
Denver


How about you--where did you go to school?

Melb

so here is the deal (from my very unprofessional vantage point) on NY programs- and my editorial on how they have responded to my app

NYU- still no word, they are real picky about their applicants. very cerebral place, lower trauma than the rest of NY, very into academic teaching. people are interesting, i don't know how "fun" they are

mt sinai- also no word for me. the thing about mt sinai is most of the clinical training occurs at elmhurst, which is in queens. Mt sinai itself doesn't have that great of an EM experience (surgery, medicine real strong), so that may be something to consider. don't know much else.

Jacobi- in the bronx, the oldest and most respected of the nY programs. 2-4, so prelim comes into effect. my interview is tomorrow, i heard it is a rather relaxed interview. the people are great, i have a few friends who are residents there and they are happy, although they work their asses off (at least in the PGY 2 year)

Kings County- already had the interview, definately a cool place. in the less desirable area of brooklyn (although that leads to better em, right?). the people are great, they all seem to truly enjoy hanging out with eachother. academics are picking up there, they have a lot of research on the horizon. clinically, there is probably no greater place in ny, but you need to be willing to push your own patients and draw your own labs because the ancillary services suck

north shore- 1-3, in long island, but having that caveat said, it is an extremely busy ED. can't comment on the interview, thats next week. ancillary services are great, the hospital has a lot of money and they treat their residents well.

LIJ: 2-4, they claim to have a decent amount of trauma, although i have not seen it for myself. don't really know much more about the program, they also have an EM/IM program that seems to be very well respected.

Lincoln: 2-4 you will work your ass off, and become a greater clinician than you ever thought possible, however that will come at the expense of your personal life. they work hard all 3 years and the academics are supposedly less than perfect

st. lukes: on the upper west side of manhattan, the residents are absurdly happy at this program. they get a decent amount of trauma and volume, but really no program in manhattan gets great numbers. i have heard the teaching is good and the residents come out well trained.

maimo, methodist: both in brooklyn. maimo is a new program, this will only be their second class. the ED there is extremely busy as well and they do their trauma at lutheran , another Level 1 in brooklyn. Methodist is a small program in a nice area of brooklyn (park slope), level 2, they do their trauma at kings county. residents are happy.

NYP- nothing to say, people seem to have high hopes for Dr. Carter (formerly of NYU, not the TV show) and his new program. I still have not received an interview there, but they seem to be slightly slow this year with the clerical stuff. the program structure looks very interesting, and it should be cool to see how it evolves.

that's it for NY, if i left anything out i am sorry. hope this helped some of you. any feeback

Just wondering if anyone out there has heard from UCSF-Fresno and University of Southern California. Not much west coast talk on this board...everyone seems to be either from the east or midwest. One more thing...anyone that has heard from Harbor, how long ago did you hear....still waiting on that one.

I'm with you still waiting for Harbor & USC- What does anyone think about the risk of Harbor closing in the next 3 years?

I got an invite from USC about 3 weeks ago. Still waiting on UCLA Harbor. Got the big NO from UCSD today.....

to make some of you feel better, cali don't like me
rejected from highland, harbor and olive view. waiting on USC, totally no word. as far as UCSD, they rejected my friend who is a sick candidate. i have no idea what they are smoking.

Be glad about UCSD. I got the invite from them but they sure weren't friendly and it's a real pain in the ass because you have to do the prelim year at Scripps. So you have to interview there also and they don't have dates even remotely close together so I will have to make 2 trips. I'm thinking about declining cause I doubt they'll take me anyway.

I have a friend that got Fresno. (Didn't apply there myself, I'm looking for PGY1-3.) Don't know anyone with USC however. You're not the only West Coast person around, UCI told me they had 450 apps for 6 spots, Madigan told me 290 for 4. And for a combined program with a guaranteed commute (Madigan and U of Washington are an hour apart in good traffic) I have no idea why it is so popular. I have a friend going into Derm that also got the double rejection....tough to keep us all straight I guess. Now that I think about it, that friend who got Fresno rotated out there, so I guess that interview doesn't count on our list.

On the California programs.... Got USC by snail mail yesterday. Nothing from Fresno, Drew, Kern, or Davis. Stanford (EM) a couple of weeks ago. Rejects from Highland, Oliveview, and UCSD. And in the adding insult to injury category I received my 3rd rejection from Harbor today.

Hey, Tonem,

Have you considered sending Harbor a rejection letter?

Got some love, albeit later than most of you, from Christiana earlier today.

Am typing this from my hotel room in Dayton for Wright St. Never surfed the net over the TV before!! Really kind of awkward ... zoomed in on a small portion of the screen, keyboard sucks, and no mouse.

mike

Desperado wrote:

"Now that I think about it, that friend who got Fresno rotated out there, so I guess that interview doesn't count on our list."


Why not? Any interview you go to counts in my book, and from what I hear many people end up matching in programs they rotated through (even though their interviews don't count
;) ).

Just joining in after lurking for a while. Recieved an invite from the new USF program in Tampa. Did anyone else apply? Anyone out there know what the structure for the program is going to be? I've been looking for some sort of web information or someone with the inside scoop but have not seen/heard much.

I am a student at USF and I chose not to apply to the program. I did many rotations at TGH and speaking with the housestaff from different services they didn't have much respect for certain EM attendings. To the credit of the program they did fire one of those attendings, but with this info and the abscence of any senior residents I didn't feel like this was the program for me. I don't know if they have brought in other faculty.

As far as trauma, TGH sees alot. Right now surgery manages all the traumas with anesthesia responsible for the airway. I don't know how that will change with the new residency. As far as Tampa goes, it is a nice place to live and TGH is in a nice neighborhood.

I called Harbor today. They sent out confirmation emails on November 18th. Apparently my email box rejected it, or else my wife deleted it because she doesn't want to live in LA. Hmmm....At any rate, I was glad I called and encourage anyone out there who is still waiting on UCLA-Harbor (no invite and no rejection) to call. If they try to reject you three times I would suggest sending them a rejection.

With regards to interviews during externships not counting, of course they count in the grand scheme of things, but they don't count on this list that people check to see if a program they are interested in has sent out invites.

Hi All

I'm a longtime listener, first-time caller...


Just wondering if anyone has heard from either the Harvard Affiliated (MGH/BW) or Bellevue in NY. I haven't seen anyone mention them. Seems a bit late for programs to start handing out interviews....

code brown,
my impression is that mGH has invited everyone it is going to invite (which doesn't include me)
i haven't heard of anyone hearing from bellevue (though I have a feeling someone will read this and confirm that they heard).
I also heard from an EMed intern that last year he received multiple interviews AFTER thanksgiving.
I don't know what to make of that.
Doesn't seem like a program could be all that interested if they take that long...
Is it just me, or does this process kinda really suck.

I concur. It's a pretty miserable process.

But the alternative, should they succeed in striking down the match, would likely be chaos, and would probably involve each of us sitting down with lists of every program and frantically trying to call them all and double-cross each other to try and sign contracts first. Imagine how dirty the business world is, and then add to it how competitive medical students are by nature...ugh.

At least now, it's sort of centralized, and there's some semblance of authority. Even if it's a little heavy-handed authority.

Thanks for the info y'all. I'm surprised that Bellevue is being so mysterious...

I agree that the system does work pretty well though. A little worrysome when you consider how much rides on that little envelope, but all in all a fair process.

Does anyone know how many people programs ultimately rank?

Kern Medical Center sent out invitations today....

Rejected by UNC today. A buddy got an interview there a couple of days ago.

I emailed Denver and asked about my application status. I was told that I would hear very shortly, which obviously was pretty ominous. When did Denver start sending out invites? Is their schedule already full?

Also, I'll ask again... did anyone actually get a REJECTION from Indiana or just didn't hear anything? I emailed them too and got "Well, our schedule is full.... but you're not rejected.... maybe you'll be on the waitlist."

mike

Got an interview offer at USF/Tampa General (think it got mailed here last week but I just got back from a month's rotation so i just got it).

El Rejectione from Upstate NY.

From Indiana, I've simply heard nothing. No rejection, no acceptance, no wait list. Just cold silence.

Got the rejection from UNC also, and the wait list from Maine.

I don't know who that guy was who got all his interview offers after Thanksgiving, but I'm thinking I'm getting nothing but rejections and wait lists these days.

For me, Indiana gave me a waitlist about 3-4 weeks ago... haven't heard anything since...

And I really don't expect too many more invites to come in either... I think I've made it through the first and second filters, and if they dont' like me from that, they won't like me ever...

Has anyone gotten ANY communication whatsoever from any of the places you have interviewed at???

I finally heard from Indiana..... NO soup for you.

It's about time I heard something, rejection or not.

Apparently today is national rejection day. Got hosed from Denver, Indiana and Baystate since I had my coffe. Every time I check my email, another program has rejected me.
+pissed+
Fortunately I have a full interview season as it is, and overall I think it's better to know than to sit there not knowing from a bunch the places you applied to. On that note, I still have not heard from about a third of the places I applied to, is that everyone elses experience too?

Haha, I think its kinda funny how we try to come up with different ways of saying rejected...

I applied to 45 programs (all east of the Mississippi).

I have gotten my extra point kick blocked from 6 places.
Interview offers from ~19 or so, waitlist at Indiana. So I guess I am still flapping in the breeze for about half (18, just checked).

Thankfully I feel very comfortable with my standings now and will likely cancel some interview dates (and also email that I won't set up an interview date... I dont' want to leave the residencies flappin' either).

I've called all the programs that I haven't been rejected from yet. About a third, I got the dreaded voice mail. The others say," still considering/still interviewing." I think they are waiting for you all to cancell those interviews you don't want. SO GET CRACKING! There are plenty of people waiting for those spots.:)

got the heisman from uc davis today (what do you think of that one quinnsu?)

I got the high hard one from Indiana myself. All these rejections aren't too good for the ego. I'm such a looser. I hope I match!

Got an interview from Carolinas today!!!

...and waitlisted by Indiana. Can't win 'em all.

ah blackcat that one was a great one, made me actually chuckle a bit. Can't wait till I get another "Dear John" email to see what I can come up with...

I'll pose this question again, though, has anyone gotten any contact via phone/email/letter from any of the places that you guys have interviewed at? I.e. post interview notices?

Carolinas...and it's about time!

Also got Baystate today and the ole reject from Indiana. IU must be notifing everyone one way or the other this week.

Final total:

22 applications
16 offers
4 rejects
2unknowns (New Mexico and Oregon)--but I'm not waiting for either one

And I'll interview at 10-12 including
Arizona, UC-Davis, UMKC, Hennepin, Mayo, Christ (IL), Peoria, Vandy, Carolinas, Wake Forest, UVA, Commonwealth, and S. C.

quinn - i got a generic thanks for visiting, hope you are interested from jacobi/montefiore after interviewing.

I am presently in my second year of residency so I applied for the 2001 match. Being an FMG, I applied to I believe 47 programs, was wait-listed at 2, interviewed at 4, and rejected from many. As a matter of fact, I am still waiting to hear one way or another from about 6-12 programs. I guess that at this point it is safe to assume that they are not interested huh?

EMIMG, thanks for the laugh! I've applied to 23 programs, rejected from 14 so far. I called one of my top picks today, and got the harshest rejection so far. "Did you check your e-mail today? Well, if it isn't there, then you may get a letter, if I could match up your name to an e-mail address." I feel like I've been kicked in the head, and deservedly so for being such a loser.

Got Carolinas...but since UNC rejected me I'm not sure going all the way across the country for one interview is exactly financially wise. I'll probably cancel. I hope one of you pick it up.

My totals aren't quite final yet, but I applied at 35 programs total, generally all on or east of the Mississippi, and mostly in medium-sized or smaller cities. I got 24 interview offers, I'm thinking.

Waitlisted at Virginia and Indiana and Maine.
Dropped cold at UNC and Duke and Emory.

Still waiting on Carolinas, UConn, Christiana, Wisconsin, and Medical College of Georgia, although right now, Carolinas is the only one of those five I'd accept.

No news today. I wouldn't mind any communication from any residency, even a rejection. I just want to be able to use my new synonyms for the big "R" word.

Not heard: MCV, U of Va, Christ, U of Mass, NWestern---none look good this late and I am 99.99% sure I'm about to get the axe from U of VA... they filled up their interview slots.

The big stiff arm: Arizona, Maricopa, Hennepin, Indiana, Emory, Denver

Invited: Akron Gen, Baton Rouge, Baystate, UT SW, Jacksonville, Maryland, Metro/CCF, Orlando, OSU, Toledo, U of MI, Vanderbilt, WVA, Wright St, Christiana, Summa/Akron
... of which I've interviewed at already:
Akron Gen, Ohio State, CWRU, Wright St, Vandy. Going to Maryland, U of MI, WVA and St Vinnie's in December.

I'm a special case, though. I found out that an important LOR was lukewarm (I had no idea) so that's why I got axed at a lot of the big names... otherwise, my app would have been really strong. My other LORs are strong, good step 1, better than average clinical grades, published in EM, etc, etc.

Where did you interview at? I've only got like 6 interviews too, none from my school's affiliated hospitals in NYC either! Figures?

Did you interview for another specialty?? :)

What you will find out (or already have found out)...there may be little rhyme or reason for whom residencies choose to interview.
A lesser known residency will decline you, while a big name will invite you. That is exactly what happened to me last year.

What you are likely to find is that many programs differ only slightly...and the major difference may be geography. Even starting pay is similar across the board.
Best of luck to those who are interviewing right now.

DocW-
you are exactly right. I know people with similar board scores/grades/(I'm sure clinical grades) as mine, and they are being offered interviews where I am not, and vice versa. Very very odd.

Anyways, I hope everyone here has a great T-giving...

I know that there is some arbitrary element to the interviewing process, but still, there is a definite trend for me... I'm getting axed at the majority of major places. I have decent board scores (245), half HP/half honors in clinicals, an honors in my EM rotation, and I'm published in EM. None of my LOR are from national people, but I confirmed that a SLOR I have basically had all of the middle boxes checked. This was an SLOR that was sent to ALL institutions. So, for me, my LORs have been causing me a lot of problems. I can live with the programs I got rejected by, but I just don't want to be bottom of the heap for the programs I *did* interview at. Hopefully, despite this major flaw, I'm still an ok candidate at some institutions, because I got about 14-15 interviews BEFORE the dean's letter went out. Anyone from last year or beyond have a unknown crappy LOR? I hope this doesn't kill me. I can't understand how I got honors in a rotation, good verbal comments, and a ****ty LOR.... everyone DOES NOT get honors in this particular rotation.

mike

Mike, I feel your pain, man. There is definitely not the same - or even similar - selection criteria at the various EM programs.

You got manhandled by Emory and Hennepin, while being invited by some top places like Orlando, Christiana, Baystate, UTSW, and Maryland.

I, on the other hand, was sliced and diced by all of those programs, as well as by Jacksonville, Summa/Akron, and Wright State.

But somehow, Emory and Hennepin want me?

Wait a minute, lemme get this straight: Summa/Akron and Wright State, in Sticksville, USA want no part of me, but famously cool Emory and Hennepin are breaking down my door?

(And why did Jacksonville, Orlando, and UTSW also rain on my parade? That really hurt my feelings.)


hornet


synonym add-ons in this post: manhandled, sliced and diced, rained on my parade.

others:
dropkicked (my all-time favorite)
beaten down
abused
"made me call cps" (child-protection services)
vaporized ("Jacksonville vaporized me 5 days p getting my app")
atomized
excoriated
disemboweled
hung me out to dry
threw me in a bag and beat me with a lead pipe
suckerpunched
kicked me in the groin
gave me a texas t*tty twister
grabbed me by the short and curlies and wouldn't let go
bent me over and made a woman out of me
f*cked me and the horse i rode in on
f*cked me running
(there are limitless variations on "f*ck")
"sewed my labia together" (i swear, a female friend of mine said this; it's rather the opposite of getting f*cked, no?)
sent me to nebraska
told me to go f*ck myself
packed a cabbage in my knapsack and told me to push off
called my mom and told her i sucked
smacked my ass and told me i liked it
told me to watch ricki lake and scratch my b*lls

others?

Hornet -
Come on brother how am I supposed to beat those?!?!?!?! Now I just have to hope I don't get cold-cocked by another residency... come on 20 more interview offers!!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by Hornet871
Mike, I feel your pain, man. There is definitely not the same - or even similar - selection criteria at the various EM programs.

synonym add-ons in this post: manhandled, sliced and diced, rained on my parade.
others?

Well, like I said, I'm way over the places I got rejected at, because most of the places (with the exception of AZ) I would not have been too found of the cities themselves.

I just hope that because of this, at the places I DID interview at, I'm not #102 on their rank list.

Also, don't knock Wright St.... I actually enjoyed the place a lot. I was really impressed by their "big ED," at Miami Valley and the people were really nice. From the rumors I've heard, a lot of people would enjoy Wright St a lot more than what I've heard about Emory.

PS: You forgot "axe" and "the big stiff arm," my personal favorites.

mike

.PS: You forgot "axe" and "the big stiff arm," my personal favorites.

Not quite. I was adding to the list, not rehashing the best ones.

I do love "the big stiff arm", by the way, but it's a little misleading at first. I liken getting wait-listed to being stiff-armed, since it's not a finalizing maneuver, but merely something that temporarily staves off the inevitable.

Wright State? Sure, it's probably a good program, and perhaps it's "famously benign", and therefore competitive, like Baystate and Oregon Health Sciences, but it seems more than a little illogical that they would turn me down while Hennepin and Emory would not.

Wright State? Wright State? Sorry, man, but just uttering those words drains one of credibility. Say it aloud and see for yourself.


hornet OUT

P.S. How about a list of "famously benign" programs? My prediction is that NO ONE will share such a list, since everyone wants to keep these programs to himself. Makes sense, I suppose, since everyone you tell will potentially take that position away from you.

How about one of you already-established docs (like EMIMG) letting us know what these programs are? I know that EMIMG is fond of doing procedures and working hard, but some of us are going into EM for precisely the opposite reasons: we want to work as little as possible, starting at residency and continuing through the rest of our careers. Don't work a day past 45, I say, and retire to the Caribbean.

Just my two cents. Now bring the backlash noise.

Hey, don't get me wrong....I want to retire at an early age as well....probably not to the Caribbean since I went to medical school down there.

The great thing about my residency is that I really feel I will be comfortable wherever I go, whatever setting it is I choose in which to practice. Most people that have graduated from my residency state that they are bored with where they are because there are very few places that will have the acuity that we are seeing with the lack of ancillary support with which we function. However, with that being said, our graduates go to academic settinigs, and they go to community settings; however, the feel very prepared with everything they will see. I guess my philosophy is I would rather get beat down for three years, and feel comfortable doing anything that would present to an ED that I will work at rather than skating by for three years and having something that I may feel uncomfortable dealing with.

One of our attendings who trained at our program stated that he has done everything you can imagine Emergency Physicians can do with the exception of a perimortem C-section and there was one that he missed out on a couple years ago.

You need to determine what type of environment you want both for residency and for the future. I will tell you that if you bust your butt off in residency and go to a program which is very intense, you will have no problems adjusting to various practices throughout the country. However, if you go to a "country-club", you may have difficulty stepping into some of the programs out there. We have had attendings that have trained at one of the "big University Medical programs" out near us and then came on as an attending but just could not deal with some of the things we had to deal with. It is just different strokes for different folks.

Best of luck.

Hi...some of you may recall me from EMRA...I won't tell you the embarrassing amount of programs I applied to this year, to ensure I get SOMETHING...but, tried and true, every day, more rejectile vomit (<--- co-opted from some General Surgery folks - not mine, unfortunately) from these programs...the record is 7 in one day.

Even so, have 3 interviews, and they're not bad places (St. John's - Detroit, Mt. Sinai - NY, SUNY - Buffalo), so go figure.

Being an FMG with average boards just doesn't cut it with a lot of programs - the irony being, all USMLE scores are equal. To hold FMG's to a higher number is just idiotic...I mean, is this "Animal Farm"? Are some more equal than others?? Not to mention that "schoolism" is illegal...

A few things I've seen this year (being my second year applying) - I haven't seen a program change it's rejection letter this year (a few even have the same abysmal grammar and spelling errors - pretty unprofessional, but, then again...), but Ohio State and Henry Ford come to mind for being classy...paper rejections for online apps. The Charity rejection is very solicitous, as was Davis. One program in Pennsylvania maintains their self-serving attitude, indicating that "if initial criteria aren't met, the applicant" is inconvenienced by the interview....meaning, the interview doesn't change anything....so.........why bother to interview? I wrote back this same thing last year, and quoted the two studies, where PD's indicated what was important, and the interview trumps them all (ie, as long as you get there, it's a whole new season). They didn't respond to me. Go figure. The irony is that, with 10 years of EM, having done student health, was president of EMC, World University Games, blah blah blah, I don't make the cut, but a friend who has a lower Step I than me, and is acclaimed to be the worst student in their class, gets an interview there.

OK, so much for my whining...a few truisms abound...one is that, if you try to figure out why one person gets interviewed and the other doesn't, you'll flip, because there is no rhyme or reason. One framework is 1. their own students 2. people who rotated there 3. anyone else left over, with high boards on down, with a cut to the front of the line for anyone who is "underrepresented" in EM (ie, women and minorities)...doubt that? Check the FREIDA workforce statistics.

Another is about post-Thanksgiving interviews...since most programs are rather equal, they look for a lot of the same, which is why the same core of 200-300 people get selected - when these people realize that they don't want to interview at 30 places, they start to cancel.

Regardless, I'll get something somewhere...I comfort myself with the knowledge that I'm a good doc already, and no patient in any ER gives a damn where you were a resident - every patient assumes the doctor is Harvard or Yale or Oxford or Cambridge or Sorbonne, if s/he is doing good by the patient.

OK, I'm all better now!

I'm just curious, and I truly mean no disrespect, because I believe what you are saying about what's important in an applicant (i.e. not medical school attended)....but didn't you FMGs know this was coming when you enrolled at an institution outside the US? When I considered applying to non-US schools I was warned by many that it would be very difficult to get a residency position back in the US. Also, who is getting rejected by general surgery programs? I've got a lot of friends who only applied to 5 places, and have 5 interviews-all of which are begging them to come.

The first time I applied to med school, there were 11 applicants for every 4 spots. My premedical guidance (in retrospect) was a joke - I DIDN'T know there would be this much discrimination. At the same time, I knew that, if you were good enough, it didn't matter where you were from - and "us FMG's" come from the heavy people states like California and New York - out of everyone who applies for medical school in the US, about 30% are from those two states alone.

Also, who is the new director of NIH? An FMG from Algeria...so the government isn't discriminating against who's the best.

And what other option did I have? Not become a doctor? The patients I see deserve a doc as good as me. D.O.? I don't believe in the philosophy, and I've met more than one person who did D.O. for the idea, versus the allopathic lockstep that the only reason people go osteopath is 'cause they can't get into an M.D. program.

If you put me in a room with 9 other MD's from US schools, and had to match schools with people, I can guarantee that you couldn't do it.

And, believe me - I've seen 6 straight years of EM residents at one program, and seen residents in action from 6 different programs, and being a US grad does not give a monopoly on being a good EP. There are some studs, yet, also, I've seen several that are an embarrassment to EM, and I had to ask myself how they got into a program.

That's the difference between medical residency and the rest of the world - using standards that don't translate: whereas in business you're evaluated by how much money you can bring in, and how well you do your job, to get a medical residency, your pedigree and very nonspecific indicators (grades, board scores (which, incidentally, is an overt misuse of USMLE scores, as per the NBME)) are used, with recommendations (experts in the field, who have seen you in action) only being supplementary.

Ever hear the phrase, "Sometimes the best man for the job is a woman"? The corollary is "Sometimes the best doctor for an American patient is a foreign doc". All I'm saying is that people should be seen as individuals, instead of being docked right at the front for having done two years of preclinical in the Caribbean. It's not like I've been away for all my adult life - and my work as paramedic/firefighter, and 3 student electives, and 2 months in two ED's (all in the US, in New York and New Jersey) as an intern, show my dedication and commitment to EM moreso than someone who hasn't even done their single EM elective by September 1, when they're putting in their app for EM.

Do you really think the net of application committees is truly specific and sensitive at US med schools? If so, I have a prime piece of land for you.

As far as the surgery rejections, they came from this network - one of the more recent threads, which I got to with one click.

I guess one big problem with my argument is that I am mixing two points - being FMG and having bad USMLEs. I have two friends doing anesthesia next year - one at Yale, and the other at Tufts (after being the first FMG I ever knew to interview at Mass. General); there was the high scorer in the US on Step I and Step II, who got her EM #1 choice, and another that applied to 100 programs, and got 50 interview offers.

Now I am talked out...for anyone stomaching this whole thing, the bottom line is that any EM program can take any average person, and make a qualified (if not brilliant, or creative) EP out of them, like an edible loaf of bread from any flour.

I guess I didn't understand your D.O. comment...but I am sorry for your frustration.
Have you considered doing an internship or prelim surgery year first, THEN reapplying? It is what many, many people do.

Best of luck. Trust me, there is no conspiracy against you...sometimes back luck happens to good people.

10 years ago, when I first started applying to med school, a bunch of people told me that the only reason people do D.O. is because they can't get into M.D., which I now know is false. I don't believe in the philosophy, and I didn't want to possibly take a position from someone who did.

Got the rejection from Madigan today. They said all interview spots are filled. My finals....30 applications, 28 invites, 2 rejections, I'll go to 20. Not sure what Madigan and UNC wanted....but they didn't want me.

30 apps, 28 invites, and 20 interviews? Sounds to me like you are a pretty strong candidate. Maybe you should pick your top 10-12 and leave the scraps for others! There are alot of people out there who would love to have any one of those "extra" spots that you are taking.

I got a lot of rejections, but I did get an invite from Madigan. I've decided not to go, however, because of its "military affiliations".

Just what is Madigan, anyway? Do the civilians get a different training from the military people? How will it affect my marketability post-residency coming from a "military program"?

If you know anything else about Madigan, please share.


Thanks.

madigan is a combined residency with the university of washington.
they accept 4 civilians per year.
they receive outstanding training and have each class scored among the top 3 in the inservice last year.
i know a lot of physicians from there, and they are all outstanding.
i don't think it should affect your marketability.

Anyone hear why Beth Israel in NYC is on provisional accredidation status? Any thoughts on the program/hospital? Deciding if I want to interview there...

Valid criticism EdinOh...I wanted to interview at at least 15 places....the main reason I'm not tossing 5 more is that the ones I would toss are places I will drive through on my way between interviews at places I'm really interested in. The way all these programs offer invites over the course of a two month period, you never know how many you will end up with in the end, but you line them up as you go, or risk being put on the waiting list. Then at the end, you're stuck with either trying to rearrange them all, or just going ahead with the original schedule and going to too many interviews.. You're right though, I can't complain, its a wonderful problem to have. Another reason I'm going to so many is that many of the ones I'm going to are very competitive, I wouldn't be surprised at all to go to my 7th or 8th choice with the caliber of programs and the caliber of the applicant pool. If you are a middle of the road candidate, applying to middle of the road residencies, I think you can get away with 10. But if you're only interviewing at competitive places, I think going to less than 15 is risking not matching, something I'm not willing to do. As far as others "picking up the scraps", the 5 programs I would toss aren't the ones I hear people talking about wanting to hear from on the forum. I've got a couple of good friends I'd give interviews to if I could, but it just doesn't work that way. Besides, do you really think they will rank you high enough to match there if they don't rank you high enough to be on the regular interview list? Maybe on occasion, but I would argue that very few people end up matching at a place where they were invited after someone else cancelled an interview.

Originally posted by Desperado
Besides, do you really think they will rank you high enough to match there if they don't rank you high enough to be on the regular interview list? Maybe on occasion, but I would argue that very few people end up matching at a place where they were invited after someone else cancelled an interview.

Your argument has merit, up to this point. An extension would be, why bother to interview at all? There should be no waitlist, because very few people that interview off the waitlist get matched. When someone cancels, just leave the spot unfilled. However, this goes in the face of the idea that, if you get an interview, that is the most important factor deciding whether they want you or not - which is what has universally been said by PDs and Chairpeople; who's right? Also, that is the purpose of the match - unless they don't rank people at all, programs might very well end up with these same.

Desperado, Yeah I wish I had more interviews but I feel like I have enough right now to match. I would like 1 or 2 more for breathing room if you know what I mean. They are your interviews so I guess it is your business what you do with them. You should match well with those numbers. I understand what you mean about the more competitive programs.

From what I have gathered early on the interview trail is that more people are accepting more interviews than in years past. If this is the case then it seems to me that the programs better make their ROLs long enough or there will be more unfilled spots and more unmatched applicants.

I agree with Apollyon though. Everything I have read and been told leads me to believe that once you get to the interview you generally have as much of a shot as the next guy in matching at that particular program. This of course doesn't take into consideration the few applicants that did rotations at the place or went to school there and thus are known by the program. Once those people are placed in their respective spots on the program's ROL I think each remaining applicant is judged equally.

Originally posted by edinOH
Desperado, Yeah I wish I had more interviews but I feel like I have enough right now to match. I would like 1 or 2 more for breathing room if you know what I mean. They are your interviews so I guess it is your business what you do with them. You should match well with those numbers. I understand what you mean about the more competitive programs.

From what I have gathered early on the interview trail is that more people are accepting more interviews than in years past. If this is the case then it seems to me that the programs better make their ROLs long enough or there will be more unfilled spots and more unmatched applicants.

I agree with Apollyon though. Everything I have read and been told leads me to believe that once you get to the interview you generally have as much of a shot as the next guy in matching at that particular program. This of course doesn't take into consideration the few applicants that did rotations at the place or went to school there and thus are known by the program. Once those people are placed in their respective spots on the program's ROL I think each remaining applicant is judged equally.

Hey EDinOH, check your PM box or PM me your e-mail address.

mike