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-   -   Gunner Training? (http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=664718)

DoctwoB 06-20-2011 11:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lrkoehle (Post 11152576)
I guess they figure if you rated something a 5, then you must absolutely know it cold. For instance the fact that epineurium covers the entire neurovascular bundle is not something that will leave me any time soon, even in 60-90 days. Perhaps they should change their discription of what makes a 5 to "you knew it without any effort and will remember it in 60 days without seeing it again."
Fair enough, though really I don't rate something a 5 unless it is absolutely effortless (a typical review of 50Qs will have many 4's and 1 or 2 5's) and I still end up with things 60-90 days later. Not a major issue though.


On an unrelated note, I wish there was a little more consistency in how much info was in each card. I was like "Yay, I'm 4 cards away from being down with pharm" until realizing that the toxicology card was 30Qs of "symptoms/treatment of intoxication w/ every substance known to man" and the notable drug toxicities was 30Qs of lists of "all drugs that cause side effect X, then side effect Y, etc."


I know I'm nitpicking. Overall I think GT is awesome and a major help and definitely worth the money (especially now that I see that most Qbanks are over 2x the price).

MedStudentWanna 06-23-2011 05:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDrToBe (Post 11114457)
SDN doesn't allow folks to post codes (they delete them and suspend the posters).
From the tGT website:

Quote:
Yes, we offer all interested students a free 2-week free trial. We give our current members free 1-month trials that they can send to their friends so ask your friends and ask them to invite you to get a free 1-month trial. Or, you can simply go to one of these forums to see if people will send you a free 1-month trial. There are other great resources at these forums as well!
Now, if SDN suspends folks for doing what GT has asked, there's something screwed up here.

Let me repeat the question asked earlier -- will someone be willing to send us the code please? The promo code that's automatically filled in is for 2 weeks, not one month. Would someone be willing to share the one-month code?

bbydoc 06-23-2011 05:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MedStudentWanna (Post 11173889)
From the tGT website:



Now, if SDN suspends folks for doing what GT has asked, there's something screwed up here.

Let me repeat the question asked earlier -- will someone be willing to send us the code please? The promo code that's automatically filled in is for 2 weeks, not one month. Would someone be willing to share the one-month code?
send you a message...

dozitgetchahi 06-23-2011 05:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lrkoehle (Post 11114519)
Having just read this entire thread, I will try to very succinctly sum up what I've gathered about it. It doesn't seem to be a replacement for FA or UWorld, but is an adjunct to them. The purpose seems to be to keep the material you learn in class fresh, so you don't waste time learning stuff in class then forgetting it. While doing this, the repetitions lead to the material being committed to long-term memory. So it's kind of similar to reading and reviewing FA with class, but they also have questions to go with your reviewing.
This is probably true overall. In most sections I thought GT was doing a very good job of representing all the material FA had on the subject while adding a good amount of high yield points - but there are exceptions. I thought their neuro section was woefully inadequate (it only seemed to have about 1/3 the material of the FA neuro chapter). Some basic science sections, however (like micro) are awesome.

lrkoehle 06-23-2011 06:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dozitgetchahi (Post 11174039)
This is probably true overall. In most sections I thought GT was doing a very good job of representing all the material FA had on the subject while adding a good amount of high yield points - but there are exceptions. I thought their neuro section was woefully inadequate (it only seemed to have about 1/3 the material of the FA neuro chapter). Some basic science sections, however (like micro) are awesome.
Yeah, now that I have spent about a week and a half using it (and going thorugh ~80% of neuro), I agree that neuro is a bit thin. I don't know if that represents their feedback on the importance of neuro for step-I or not though. I figure if I can master everything they have, then filling in the lacking areas with FA won't be too hard.

I've heard repeatedly that neuro is weak on GT, does anyone think anything else is weak on GT, or is that the biggest weakness?

secants 06-23-2011 07:06 PM
I tried using Gunner training for my Neuro shelf and I agree that it was really lacking so I just ended up reviewing with FA.

Sillyband 06-24-2011 07:06 PM
About how long does going through all of the cards/questions in GT take? Everyone says that is really time consuming and I am wondering how long it would take to get through if I put in about 2 hrs/day?

JPanda 06-24-2011 07:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sillyband (Post 11179997)
About how long does going through all of the cards/questions in GT take? Everyone says that is really time consuming and I am wondering how long it would take to get through if I put in about 2 hrs/day?
It all depends on how fast of a reader you are. I'm a pretty fast reader and on average i can get through 100 questions in an hour. And there are 6000 questions. Just start early and use it as to passively learn. Don't rely on it for more than 2 hours a day.

C5toC9 06-25-2011 08:28 AM
The reason why GT's neuro section looks terrible compared to the others is because it hasn't been majorly revised. When GT first started, all the sections were like that and it was a very cursory overview of FA. As months went on, sections get slowly updated (sometimes you have to rebank the questions/cards). I assume the Neuro section will get revised in the near future as well.

Radonkulous 06-26-2011 07:57 PM
I hear neuro and anatomy are the 2 that are lacking. Just did the cardio section. Thought it was pretty solid.

lrkoehle 06-28-2011 10:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPanda (Post 11180024)
It all depends on how fast of a reader you are. I'm a pretty fast reader and on average i can get through 100 questions in an hour. And there are 6000 questions. Just start early and use it as to passively learn. Don't rely on it for more than 2 hours a day.
:thumbup: This is definitely the point of it. Long-term repetition that leads to lasting memories, instead of the cram & dump approach most of us use with our classes.

100 questions/hr is a good pace, and right around what I do too. Obviously the material you know better is quicker to get through, so it's beneficial to really understand and learn each card before you just bank the questions and move on. If you bank too many questions, it takes longer to get through and you have to keep reviewing the same questions over and over so you have a huge number each day (so you retain less each day and perpetuate the vicious cycle).

Quote:
Originally Posted by C5toC9 (Post 11181773)
The reason why GT's neuro section looks terrible compared to the others is because it hasn't been majorly revised. When GT first started, all the sections were like that and it was a very cursory overview of FA. As months went on, sections get slowly updated (sometimes you have to rebank the questions/cards). I assume the Neuro section will get revised in the near future as well.
What happens when they revise stuff? Does it make you rebank the cards or at least let us know that stuff was updated? I've already gone over 97% of neuro, and I don't plan on going though all of it again (just reviewing stuff if I don't recall it).

Zenfudge 06-28-2011 10:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lrkoehle (Post 11199960)
What happens when they revise stuff? Does it make you rebank the cards or at least let us know that stuff was updated? I've already gone over 97% of neuro, and I don't plan on going though all of it again (just reviewing stuff if I don't recall it).

Underneath the flashcards tab there is a "Revised Flashcards" and "New Review Questions" section.

There are some pretty substantial revisions in some of the sections, and some of the changes just repackage the same material into more palatable chunks with improved mnemonics. I had to retackle an embryo card since it was revised and the material was much more logically laid out.

Now, if only they hammered out some nice anatomy and neuro revisions...

IvyHopeful20 06-29-2011 12:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenfudge (Post 10897662)
Agree with what is being said about the wacky timing of the cards. This happens to me as well. If I use the "power analytics" graphs to check my progress, it looks like someone on meth drew the graphs. I think this is reflective of not only the program, but with what kind of mood I am in when I grade myself.

One way to circumvent (or at least reduce) this is to make sure you don't let the percentage of cards covered get too far away from your mastery. The going is very slow, but if you do this, the instances of WTF cards are more spaced out than if you get too overzealous. Also, if the program says "we recommend that you do questions, and stop banking cards", it is a good idea to heed their advice. At least this is what has worked for me thus far.

I was at ~ 11% mastery and 13% cards banked about a month ago, and after doing about 1.5 hours a night for the past month I am a little over 15% mastery and 17% banked. This is with finals for MS1 going on, and so right now I am in a holding pattern and just maintaining. Hopefully I can surge over the summer a bit.

Maybe if enough of us chime in, they will reformat things.
You spend hour and a half in this per day in addition to studying for your regular classes? :scared:

Zenfudge 06-29-2011 01:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by IvyHopeful20 (Post 11200228)
You spend hour and a half in this per day in addition to studying for your regular classes? :scared:
Yes, and here is how I find the time:

1. As a general rule, I don't go to lecture.
2. I attend a pass/fail school.
3. I set a threshold of performance on our exams. I made a deal with myself during first year that I would study outside material only as long as it didn't hurt my grades...well, my grades actually increased after using GT.
4. I immediately complete and turn in any extracurricular BS our school mandates we do; e.g. essays on our feelings or culture competency. I do that stuff ASAP and without thought.
5. I'm not doing Euler derivations or anything; most of it is raw memorization.


To be candid though, I am pretty intense with my studies. At least I am up front about it. Super industrious people that are in the closet need to kick rocks.

I think my school is probably an "easier" program compared to what I hear others going through (which frankly scares the crap out of me). So, I compensate. Sucks being me I guess.

unsung 06-29-2011 12:33 PM
There really should be a way to "focus" on one section to "master" it 100% before other sections. This would've been useful during MSII classes, before the final for cardio, for ex.

I don't know what I'm complaining about tho', since I'm only going to be using it a few wks more lol.

Also, anyone know anything about the "new" GT that's supposedly in dev? I hear there might be a version for Step 2 ?! That would be sweet.

IvyHopeful20 06-29-2011 02:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenfudge (Post 11200270)
Yes, and here is how I find the time:

1. As a general rule, I don't go to lecture.
2. I attend a pass/fail school.
3. I set a threshold of performance on our exams. I made a deal with myself during first year that I would study outside material only as long as it didn't hurt my grades...well, my grades actually increased after using GT.
4. I immediately complete and turn in any extracurricular BS our school mandates we do; e.g. essays on our feelings or culture competency. I do that stuff ASAP and without thought.
5. I'm not doing Euler derivations or anything; most of it is raw memorization.


To be candid though, I am pretty intense with my studies. At least I am up front about it. Super industrious people that are in the closet need to kick rocks.

I think my school is probably an "easier" program compared to what I hear others going through (which frankly scares the crap out of me). So, I compensate. Sucks being me I guess.
Please correct me if I'm wrong but from what I understand about M1, the vast majority of stuff is extremely low yield for the USMLE (assuming a standardish cirriculum of anatomy, biochemistry, etc first year)....spending an extra 1.5 hours a day seems like a lot of extra hours to spend on stuff that's barely relevant? Second year stuff from what I hear is very high yield so it makes sense to me.

Zenfudge 06-29-2011 04:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by IvyHopeful20 (Post 11202946)
Please correct me if I'm wrong but from what I understand about M1, the vast majority of stuff is extremely low yield for the USMLE (assuming a standardish cirriculum of anatomy, biochemistry, etc first year)....spending an extra 1.5 hours a day seems like a lot of extra hours to spend on stuff that's barely relevant? Second year stuff from what I hear is very high yield so it makes sense to me.
In the bold lies the rub. Our school has a tinge of path (~ the first 5 chapters in Robbins) toward the end of first year and a highly, almost irritatingly integrated curriculum. Either way, I never really understood the "M1 is not high-yield" argument. If M1 isn't high yield, then why is biochem, immuno, micro, pharm, etc. given such a heavy treatment in FA? I had all those classes first year and I am pretty sure those concepts will be tested. Perhaps they will be tested from a more clinical slant, but I still think not having to cram those details during my dedicated study time will pay off.

But, your point is well taken. Your main focus should be on classes.

Oh, and I am a second year now. I wish I had used GT from day one.

IvyHopeful20 06-29-2011 08:02 PM
Ah. Immuno, path and pharm are all second year courses though (at least the traditional curriculums I looked at). But of course if you're a second year, it makes sense to use gt for that long. Approx. how much (per day) do you use gt the first year?

Zenfudge 06-29-2011 11:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by IvyHopeful20 (Post 11204753)
Ah. Immuno, path and pharm are all second year courses though (at least the traditional curriculums I looked at). But of course if you're a second year, it makes sense to use gt for that long. Approx. how much (per day) do you use gt the first year?

I didn't really start GT until a little over halfway through 1st year. That was probably for the best since the first few weeks of med school were a bit of a shock for me.

My time with it has varied, but I probably average an hour a night. I ramp things up when our curriculum slows or if I am already grasping the lectures sufficiently. My mastery goes up a paltry 1% a week at my current pace.

DoctwoB 06-30-2011 05:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by unsung (Post 11202274)
There really should be a way to "focus" on one section to "master" it 100% before other sections. This would've been useful during MSII classes, before the final for cardio, for ex.

I don't know what I'm complaining about tho', since I'm only going to be using it a few wks more lol.

Also, anyone know anything about the "new" GT that's supposedly in dev? I hear there might be a version for Step 2 ?! That would be sweet.
You can. Under your review questions for the day tab, you can choose to review all questions in a given subject (Over 800 for micro!).

Daedra22 06-30-2011 06:46 AM
I've been trying to get through most of the first year material before school starts again at the end of July. Some of it is already done because I started GT last semester... however, there's still a lot of material left to go. I just finished biochem and I only have 3 more weeks of summer - still have pharm, half of micro and 4 or 5 systems to comb through.

How important do y'all think it is to finish up the first year material? Will I be kicking myself in a few months if I don't get through it? I'm trying to balance "plenty of time off" with "sufficiently prepared going into second year," which is especially hard since I'm doing research.

zebalong 06-30-2011 09:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daedra22 (Post 11206201)
I've been trying to get through most of the first year material before school starts again at the end of July. Some of it is already done because I started GT last semester... however, there's still a lot of material left to go. I just finished biochem and I only have 3 more weeks of summer - still have pharm, half of micro and 4 or 5 systems to comb through.

How important do y'all think it is to finish up the first year material? Will I be kicking myself in a few months if I don't get through it? I'm trying to balance "plenty of time off" with "sufficiently prepared going into second year," which is especially hard since I'm doing research.
I do it every morning... calculate the number of flash cards you have to do- and just do it. try your best to focus while doing it but don't kick yourself over missing small points on the questions. Just try to learn from them, this is a long term retention tool and anything you miss will be shown again to you... over and over... until you do it get it.

DoctwoB 06-30-2011 10:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zebalong (Post 11206710)
I do it every morning... calculate the number of flash cards you have to do- and just do it. try your best to focus while doing it but don't kick yourself over missing small points on the questions. Just try to learn from them, this is a long term retention tool and anything you miss will be shown again to you... over and over... until you do it get it.
The problem with adding stuff quickly isn't adding the material, its the massive accumulation of questions you get in your daily bank. I've been adding a lot this summer, and am averaging around 300 questions a day (not including new ones I add from cards).

Daedra22 06-30-2011 10:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctwoB (Post 11206992)
The problem with adding stuff quickly isn't adding the material, its the massive accumulation of questions you get in your daily bank. I've been adding a lot this summer, and am averaging around 300 questions a day (not including new ones I add from cards).
Lite mode or normal? I've been doing lite just because I've been pressed for time...

bchandler 07-02-2011 02:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Day man (Post 11068112)
here's what i don't get (and maybe i'm an idiot): i'm trying to use it to direct my studying. so today is biochem, so i'd like to do all the biochem cards and get them done first. but when you do the complete all questions for "biochem" option, it doesn't take that into account in your daily schedule. so pretty much i just did 100 review cards for no reason. very frustrating.

I don't know if this isn't possible or something, but it would be worth your while to update this in the next iteration. being able to focus the review questions each day before doing the other randoms would make it really marketable to those using FA in addition to this program. my two cents (again).
Hi Day Man, great feedback. The "do by subject" option was meant to help people who want to prepare for a test (e.g. biochem) that they have coming up and do ALL the current AND future day's biochem review questions at once. But what you are suggesting (letting you do biochem questions for today first, then another subject, etc.) is a very good idea. We are working on a new version of GT so all of this feedback is very very helpful! In the future, you will have much more intuitive control of what to review, when, what you want to have in "memory control", and possibly when things are scheduled for review. Thanks for the great feedback.

JasonE 07-02-2011 05:56 PM
so im gonna start my second year in about a month.

i wanna start this up. I'll have to do about 12 cards/day until the year starts to be all caught up. will this be too much?

lrkoehle 07-03-2011 09:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonE (Post 11218350)
so im gonna start my second year in about a month.

i wanna start this up. I'll have to do about 12 cards/day until the year starts to be all caught up. will this be too much?
Depends on how well you retained stuff from first year. If you look at the cards and know essentially all the details, then 12 is easy. If you or your school glossed over details from the cards, then it will take more time. Still, 12 cards a day should be reasonable with 2-3 hours of time dedicated each day.

JasonE 07-04-2011 01:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lrkoehle (Post 11224131)
Depends on how well you retained stuff from first year. If you look at the cards and know essentially all the details, then 12 is easy. If you or your school glossed over details from the cards, then it will take more time. Still, 12 cards a day should be reasonable with 2-3 hours of time dedicated each day.
thx for the reply. ya i started it up. its cool and seems useful.

are you doing the lite more or comprehensive? im thinking comprehensive for now, but lite as soon as school starts

Alvarez13 07-04-2011 08:57 AM
I'm really starting to like this program. I've only been doing all the physiology for the past week and reading BRS Physio along with it has been the perfect combo. FA has also been a great supplement.

I think Kaplan and Rx Qbanks have references to FA sections on each question. Would it be possible to do this with GT? I realize that this would be a time consuming request, but man would that be cool.

lrkoehle 07-04-2011 01:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonE (Post 11224915)
thx for the reply. ya i started it up. its cool and seems useful.

are you doing the lite more or comprehensive? im thinking comprehensive for now, but lite as soon as school starts
I tried the comprehensive for a little bit, but it was a little too intense for me (1 week old son at home + research during the day = lite mode all the way). Comprehensive will have you doing a lot more questions per card and for daily review, so it will be slower to get through everything from first year that way. Try it for a day or two and see if you can stay on top of everything. Worst case you just switch back to lite mode.

bruinhd 07-05-2011 01:53 PM
*deleted*

JPanda 07-05-2011 03:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alvarez13 (Post 11225654)
I'm really starting to like this program. I've only been doing all the physiology for the past week and reading BRS Physio along with it has been the perfect combo. FA has also been a great supplement.

I think Kaplan and Rx Qbanks have references to FA sections on each question. Would it be possible to do this with GT? I realize that this would be a time consuming request, but man would that be cool.

You should totally write to GT about this because they are very amendable to changing their program to better suit the needs of the students.

nick_carraway 07-05-2011 04:41 PM
Any kind soul want to send me a 4 month trial code? I believe I read somewhere that you get a free month once it's redeemed too.

Alvarez13 07-05-2011 05:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick_carraway (Post 11232789)
Any kind soul want to send me a 4 month trial code? I believe I read somewhere that you get a free month once it's redeemed too.
Check PM

Alvarez13 07-05-2011 05:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPanda (Post 11232227)
You should totally write to GT about this because they are very amendable to changing their program to better suit the needs of the students.
Consider it done.

bbydoc 07-06-2011 02:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick_carraway (Post 11232789)
Any kind soul want to send me a 4 month trial code? I believe I read somewhere that you get a free month once it's redeemed too.
wow, there is a 4 month trial code?:D

ahowardmd 07-06-2011 11:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick_carraway (Post 11232789)
Any kind soul want to send me a 4 month trial code? I believe I read somewhere that you get a free month once it's redeemed too.
I second this :-). I'd like to give this GT a shot for a couple months. Pleaseee.

nick_carraway 07-06-2011 03:59 PM
Check your PMs, you two. Sharing the love!

Alvarez13 07-06-2011 04:31 PM
I'm doing the daily scheduled review questions and every once in a while it throws in a multiple choice question. Great, expect these questions often times contain pharm and path concepts that I haven't got to yet and make the questions a waste. Any way to turn this off? I just want it to be 100% open answer based off of the flashcards right now.

lrkoehle 07-06-2011 04:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbydoc (Post 11235662)
wow, there is a 4 month trial code?:D
I hope this is a typo. Is there really a FOUR month trial code? My one month code is about up; I would've loved to have had four months...

How does the free month thing work if someone signs up with the code you give them? Say one of my friends signs up for a GT account, thus giving me a free month, would I get a refund if I had signed up for a 10 month subscription? Does it only apply to the monthly recurring subscription? If so, that would suck, because it is more expensive to do month to month and I already know I will be using this program for almost a year...

nick_carraway 07-06-2011 06:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lrkoehle (Post 11238950)
I hope this is a typo. Is there really a FOUR month trial code? My one month code is about up; I would've loved to have had four months...

How does the free month thing work if someone signs up with the code you give them? Say one of my friends signs up for a GT account, thus giving me a free month, would I get a refund if I had signed up for a 10 month subscription? Does it only apply to the monthly recurring subscription? If so, that would suck, because it is more expensive to do month to month and I already know I will be using this program for almost a year...
Oh damn. It's for a 1 month trial, sorry. In my excitement at becoming one of the cool kids, I totally missed the fact that everyone was telling me there was a typo.

Alvarez13 07-10-2011 06:56 PM
You guys think FA and GT Biochem is enough to prepare for step I Biochem? Do I need to man up and go through RR Biochem?

I haaaaaaaaaate Biochem :mad:

mrx2 07-10-2011 07:06 PM
I only used GT and World for biochem and I felt very prepared for the questions that showed up on the exam. Goljan is pretty good, but if your issue is trying to memorize the tiny details I'd concentrate on GT. Although Goljan is well written, 5 minutes after you read the page you will probably forget half the names etc. Just my opinion

nielse2 07-11-2011 12:49 AM
Anyone out there want to hook me up and PM me the one month free trial code??? I would appreciate it. thanks.

Alvarez13 07-11-2011 04:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrx2 (Post 11259914)
I only used GT and World for biochem and I felt very prepared for the questions that showed up on the exam. Goljan is pretty good, but if your issue is trying to memorize the tiny details I'd concentrate on GT. Although Goljan is well written, 5 minutes after you read the page you will probably forget half the names etc. Just my opinion
I don't think I have the time to do the whole RR Biochem. I can't retain this subject to save my life.

mrx2 07-11-2011 05:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alvarez13 (Post 11264249)
I don't think I have the time to do the whole RR Biochem. I can't retain this subject to save my life.
If the problem is retaining then I definitely recommend GT over RR biochem

Daedra22 07-11-2011 06:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrx2 (Post 11264565)
If the problem is retaining then I definitely recommend GT over RR biochem
Not that I've taken Step 1, but it does seem to me that GT is great for retaining things that won't stick otherwise. I've been learning some of the random stuff seemingly by osmosis as the questions come up.

lilPhysician 07-11-2011 06:20 PM
Probably Not
 
I haven't heard anyone mention them since they're so new. But 6,000 flash cards is pretty much like condensing First Aid. I feel the boards are also much more about integration and application than learning rote facts. I guess its good for an initial refresher/exposure but I don't think its comprehensive Step prep.

DoctwoB 07-11-2011 06:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilPhysician (Post 11264883)
I feel the boards are also much more about integration and application than learning rote facts. I guess its good for an initial refresher/exposure but I don't think its comprehensive Step prep.
The boards are about knowing, integrating, and applying the facts. I certainly agree that pure memorization of GTs facts is not sufficient prep, but it provides the factual memorization baseline, from which you can practice integrating/applying with UWorld, NBMEs, etc.

mrx2 07-11-2011 07:14 PM
,


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