Non-Trad "Secrets" of Application Success

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The plan was really simple: graduate next May, get married and honeymoon in June, and move to a new place in July to start med school. Life has a funny way of changing plans, though. In August, before we could start going on interviews, my fiancee died.

I'm so so sorry. I can't imagine going through interview season with that kind of loss.

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Thanks everyone for sharing all these words of wisdom!!! I'm not applying until next year, but I'm sure the advice will be useful : )
 
Thanks. ALL of this info is really helpful. Best wishes to you.
 
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I'm finally a success and can post here :) Most of the bases have been covered but wanted to add my two cents:

1) If you have anything at all wrong with your application (seems like a lot of us non-trads have some kind of past mistakes we're working on) you should apply broadly and by this I mean a lot of schools, a wide range of schools, and MD and DO programs both. DO programs are much more likely to sit down and look over your file and give you a chance if you've made an effort to show you've changed. They also have lower averge GPA and MCAT as a general rule. I got zero allopathic interviews and am so so so glad I applied to DO programs as well. Don't go into this process overly confident. You'll be eaten for breakfast.

2) Keep in mind the school you think you want may not wind up being so desirable in the end. The school I ended up choosing was literally the last school I thought I'd want to go to a year ago. You go on interviews and get a feel for the schools and the student body and your opinion often times changes. Don't get too fixated on one school. My dream school wound up being a very bad fit for me personally.

3) This process is not kind. It is stressful and expensive and there will be times you sit and weep and want to give up. But when you get that acceptance it's all worth it :) It's a lot like childbirth :) But less messy :laugh: Hang in there!
 
There are a few tidbits of advice that I can give. A little bit about my background. I had a little too much fun in college added to no direction (4 majors in 1 year) and my UG GPA was in the dumps. I had to not only rebuild my GPA but also prove that I can do the work and build my self confidence.

So here is my advice:

1. Realize that you are preparing for a marathon and not a sprint. When you do not set a strict time line, then you realize that when things happen they happen. It will take a lot of time but it will be well worth it.

2. Come up with good study habits. It took me 3.5 years to find one that worked for me. I used it in grad school and it paid off. It also worked for the MCAT prep.

3. Never give up, but realize that there may be things that you have to give up. OK, this one is cryptic. Never give up on you ultimate goal of becoming a doctor. But realize that sometimes you cannot commit to going out with friends, meeting people, going to the game. There were many, many Saturday nights that I was in the coffee shop studying. I would rather have gone out with my wife, but that was not in the cards at the time.

4. Be focused. Self explanatory

5. Start writing your personal statement in January and have 5 different people read it. Use the time between January and May to buy a book on personal statements and do what it suggests. Remember, you are trying to sell yourself without being there. This is the first glimpse that the schools have of who you are. Keep editing until you think there is nothing more to edit, and then give your essay to 5 other people and edit some more. CHECK FOR SPELLING ERRORS ALL THE TIME.

6. Apply early. You are allowed to start filling out the AAMCAS and AACOMAS in May. Have your transcripts mailed at this time or just before. Take 1 hour each day to fill out the application. It will take some time. Confirm with EACH school that you attended that the transcripts were mailed out. After one week, confirm with each application sevice that they were received. Get your LORs into your pre-med office or interfolio ASAP. Once the application season starts in early June, Submit.

7. Keep a file of each school. As soon as you receive the secondary, start working on it. Again, have 5 people look over your essays and then send it in. Give yourself a 1-2 week turnaround per application. Remember, the earlier you apply the better your chances. Mark down the dates on your file of when you received the secondary and when it was sent. IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO ENSURE THAT THE SCHOOL RECEIVED EVERYTHING. Have your LORs sent as soon as you get the secondary. One week after sending in the secondary call the school to confirm that your file is complete.

8. Once you get an interview invitation, PREPARE, PREPARE, PREPARE. Go to the school's website and find out everything you can about the school. Go on the interview feedback section of SDN and read the kind of questions that were asked. Prepare everything you can about current health care trends. But most importantly, PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE. Get some one to interview you and video tape it. Then watch the video tape and note your responses, your body language, and your demeanor. You MUST have questions. There is no problems with writing the questions down and referring to your notes at the interview. This shows that you were prepared. If you are applying DO, KNOW ABOUT OSTEOPATHY. go to the AOA website and find out everything you can about OMM/OMT and not just that it was developed by AT Still. Give the interviewer a firm handshake, show confidence. When answering a question, look EVERYONE in the eye. Move back a forth between interviewers because you are not just talking to one person. Show them that you belong in that school. Remember, YOU ARE ON THE ENTIRE DAY. You are being evaluated from the time you arrive until you leave. NEVER TALK ABOUT ANOTHER SCHOOL at the interview. Even when you are talking to the students.

9. Send a thank you card and know that you did your best.

Good luck.
 
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I'm presently graduating from Law and am in the process of applying for med.
I wasnt sure where to ask my question, but i suppose it can be qualified as... untraditional.

My situation is that i have A-s in all my science classes (pre-reqs), that i took in college and a couple as electives in uni. However my law grades are not so strong.
I also wrote the MCAT which i did well, but not outstanding. 30S to be blunt.

so any advice on what to stress?
what is really the weight given to your grades if theyre not science grades?
 
Hi, all. I found SDN late last year when I was procrastinating on my secondaries. I've mostly lurked since then, occasionally piping up when I had something relevant to say. Q of Q wrote a textbook example of how to apply. My process is closer to a "How not to."

GPA: Overall was solid, but weak in BCPM, owing to taking upper level classes w/o taking the lower level classes first. Bad idea. However, I have a PhD from a well-recognized lab and my grad GPA was good, so I think that helped assuage worries.

MCAT: Study. Study hard. It's been over 20 years since I took physics, so I knew I needed serious review. I took the kaplan class to ensure that I blocked out sufficient time. You may not need the formal structure, but it worked for me, with the exception of the writing sample. 41L. Yes, L. I'm at a loss to explain it. The one interviewer who mentioned it laughed and said that no one ever looked at that score, anyway.

ECs: I have an established career as a research scientist. Because I was switching careers, I wanted to make sure I knew what I was getting into. I shadowed a physician and I also volunteered at a cancer treatment center, trying to get as much patient contact as possible. From my interviews, I can tell this was important to the adcoms. I have, over the years, volunteered to judge science fairs and talk at career days in local schools and have also volunteered time for Habitat for Humanity. The service component is more important to some schools than to others.

Applications: Stupidly, I applied to only 7 schools, all but one in my immediate vicinity. Even more stupidly, I applied late. I submitted to AMCAS in mid-October and finished each of my secondaries with only days to go before the deadline. DON'T DO THIS. You needlessly hamstring yourself, putting you in a bigger pool for fewer slots. I haven't heard diddly from 2 schools. I was fortunate to get interviews at the other 5 and have just completed my last one. I have an acceptance from one school and am waiting to hear from the rest.

PS: I found this to be one of the hardest parts of the process because it involves talking about very personal things. My reflexive response was, " I like medicine and I think I'll be good at it. Who are you to ask me to bare my soul?" I had a friend (who advises undergrad pre-meds) look at my statement and all her suggestions prompted me to rewrite so that my motivation and passion were evident. As you can tell from this section, I'm still not overly happy about personal exposure.

LORs: Choose people who know you well. I had 5 letters, from my grad and post-doc PI's, my current lab head, a scientific colleague, and the volunteer coordinator at the center where I spent 6 months volunteering. I didn't necessarily include all 5 letters in each application. Interfolio makes life easier for you and your recommenders.

Interviews: Surprisingly, I found them to be fun. I've had interesting conversations at each school and never felt uncomfortably scrutinized. Over the whole process, I got only 3 "interview questions" that were clearly pre-chosen. For the most part, I felt like they were trying to make sure that a) you weren't deranged and b) the physical you matched up with the you represented in your application.

Good luck to all!
 
Great post, new_doc, and congrats on your acceptance. :D

EGee, 30 is a very good MCAT score, especially if your section scores are distributed fairly evenly. In other words, it's better to have three tens over having two twelves and one six. My question for you would be how long ago did you take the prereqs, and have you taken any recent science coursework? If it's been a while, you may want to take a few upper level courses to kind of get your feet wet and show the adcoms that you are still up to speed on your sciences. As for your law grades, how "not as strong" are we talking here? If you have all Bs or better, I wouldn't worry too much. But if you have lower grades, you'll probably need to explain this. And in that case, I think it would be even more important for you to take some upper level science coursework and ace it. Hope these ideas help, and best of luck. :)
 
Well i have taken the prereqs 3 years ago now, though i took organic, genetics and cell bio last year and this year, to sort of get back into it plus admissions recommended i take them, plus i was looking to raise my average, and aced them all .

As for my law grades, my average is at B-. I assume i'd have to explain that, which isnt that big of a worry to me, however my only concern is the weight that that would carry for the pre-interview selection.

are MCAT and science grades trumping total gpa in an unrelated domain? OR is it more of "whatever you're in, thats the rule" approach.

Worst case senario i wouldnt mind getting into pre-med if the alternate is a a no for med. i mean premed are all science courses which i wouldnt have trouble dealing with, but its reserved for CEGEP students and i'll already have a degree. sometimes i feel like i may have made a mistake by going into law, though it did teach me alot as well...
 
I think one of the biggest obstacles to overcome as a non-trad is just to keep going. I don't know about everyone else, but I fell on my face a number of times and getting back on track was very hard after getting some harsh test grades and feeling so confused as a post-bacc. I was a theater major as an undergrad, so the science was all so new to me. If you just keep going and pushing through the seemingly endless amount of work, you can still make it. I'm deffinately not perfect, but I was just admitted to medical school, so you don't have to be perfect, you just have to learn to adapt. Do whatever it takes to understand your mistakes QUICKLY and efficiently, and keep going even when it feels hopeless, as it sometimes will.

Good luck to all the disabled non-trads out there too - It can be done. I know there aren't a lot of resources out there, so as a disabled non-trad, I'm happy to answer any questions.

Good luck to all!
 
Question: how should i go about getting some help for some chinese medical care facilities in the rural area?
i visited some places last summer, and one hospital literally had.
one doctor who has been a temp for 30 years, one themometer, one thing to measure blood pressure, hmm.. a broken frig.. i think that's it.
and a cow lives in the courtyard.


I am a current allopathic medical student who started med school at age 31. I applied at age 30 to 22 medical schools. Of those, I received 21 secondaries, was invited on 19 interviews, attended 17 of them, and received 12 acceptances, six with full scholarships.

I'll start by saying that my general philosophy is that there are two broad categories that you must consider as you go through the app process. The obvious one that we spend a lot of time discussing in this forum and elsewhere on SDN is how to improve your weak areas. That is certainly a major component of improving your competitiveness as an applicant. But one equally important aspect to being a successful applicant that we don't discuss nearly as often is that you must also highlight your strengths. Do not underestimate the importance of doing this: medical schools are not charities, and they are looking for people who are successful. You must show them that you are successful, as well as that you have the potential to continue being successful in med school and beyond.

I would say that there are six areas where medical school applicants must strive to distinguish themselves, whether they are trads or non-trads. These include the obvious ones like GPA and MCAT, but also ECs, essays, LORs, and interviewing skills. I will go through each one and give some examples from my own application saga.

GPA: This is a big area of weakness for a lot of non-trads because many of us have subpar UG GPAs for allopathic medical schools, and I am no different. I had an especially sticky problem in this respect because I had no UG GPA at all. I took all of my UG coursework (including the pre-med pre-reqs) P/F, and I have no credit hours or grades. AMCAS calculated my UG GPA as zero. As you can imagine, this caused me significant problems at several schools. I was able to overcome this problem in several ways. One was that I scored very high on the MCAT. A second was that I had graduate grades and GPAs for my MS and PhD. The third was that I copied my narrative evaluations from college and sent copies of them to all 22 schools along with a cover letter explaining how my college worked, as well as that it was accredited! This was amazingly expensive and time-consuming, but I believe that it helped considerably. When I went for pre-app counseling, one admissions office suggested that I consider taking a year of post-bac classes at the UG level in order to establish an UG GPA and prove that I could still handle the work. I elected not to do this since I was in grad school for my PhD at the time. My decision to not follow this advice may have hurt me at a few of the schools, particularly the ones that rejected me with no interview. In my applications and interviews, I stressed that my graduate record and MCAT scores both "proved" that I was capable and ready to handle medical school coursework.

MCAT: This was an area of immense strength for me. I scored a 43S on the MCAT in August 2004, and I have posted extensively about how to study for the MCAT on SDN over the past two years. You can find most of my MCAT advice in the MCAT forum and Study Questions subforum if you are interested. The MCAT score was not an area that I particularly had to do much explaining about on applications or at interviews; it basically spoke for itself.

Essays: This is another crucial aspect of your application. Both your PS and your secondary essays are read by the adcoms, and at most schools, by your interviewers. In general, your PS should answer the questions of why you want to go to med school, and what experiences you've had to back this assertion up. Initially, my PS was not very appropriate for a medical school application. I got a lot of feedback from some SDNers (thanks again, njb!) and the preadmissions counseling sessions about this. I decided to follow their advice, and I rewrote my PS from scratch along much more conventional lines. It wasn't nearly as entertaining to read, but it was a lot more appropriate. I think that this was one area where the pre-admissions counseling I received both at the med schools and from some SDNers helped me improve my app tremendously. I do not think I would have been as successful of an applicant if I had obstinately stuck with my first essay. In general, I advise all of you to ask others in the know (med students, admissions counselors, etc.) to read your essays. If everyone keeps making the same criticism, you probably should seriously consider taking their advice.

LORs: These are not directly in your control, but what *is* in your control is to carefully chose whom you are going to ask for letters, and to get the proper letters. Most schools require three LORs but will permit you to submit up to six. I usually sent four, but I had five total. I got letters from my PI for my PhD, my PI on the clinical trial where I volunteered, my manager at Kaplan, one of my PhD committee members, and one peer. (My state schools require peer letters. I asked a former UG student of mine who was an M1 at the time to write the peer letter for me.) Second, I advise you all to use interfolio ( www.interfolio.com ) or another online clearinghouse for your LORs. This makes both your life and the life of your recommenders MUCH easier. It costs a little more, but I think it was completely worth it in terms of the decreased stress associated with submitting LORs to the schools. Third, many schools want letters from non-science faculty. This was not possible in my case, because my UG Spanish professor had retired some time in the past ten years since I left the college. I asked those schools for permission to substitute the employer letter instead, and they all agreed to this. I advise you non-trads who have been out of school for a long time to ask your schools for permission to substitute employer letters too. It will make your life a lot easier. Also, when you ask people to write your letters, impress upon them that these letters must be strong, and they must attest to your abilities to succeed in medical school. The best LORs cite specific examples of things you have done to show that you possess characteristics like responsibility, a good work ethic, honesty, etc. Give the person a copy of your transcript and your CV to use in crafting the letter. Finally, it goes without saying that you should send thank you notes to everyone who writes you a LOR.

ECs: This was another area where I was kind of lopsided and did not have a very good appreciation of my strengths and weaknesses before I went for the preadmissions counseling. It was obvious to us all that my research background was one of my strengths. I was also extensively involved as a volunteer for BBBS, doing science demonstrations for inner-city elementary school kids, working on the MCAT subforum here on SDN, and volunteering as a co-investigator and project manager of the clinical trial. I thought that should be enough. However, what I learned from the counseling is that many medical schools would like to see RECENT CLINICAL volunteering. I was advised to volunteer in a hospital or clinic on top of these other things. I decided to take this advice, and I began volunteering in a hospital surgery waiting room. At the time, I was in my last year of grad school, and the only time I could do it was from 6-8 AM. This was incredibly painful. Every week, I would turn off the alarm clock at 5 AM and wish I could go back to sleep, but then I would ask myself: Q, would you rather get two more hours of sleep, or do you want to go to med school? And then I would get my butt out of bed and go volunteer. That I did this was TREMENDOUSLY important. I got asked about it at a third to a half of my interviews, even at several heavily research-intensive schools. What makes this all the more incredible is that I would not have even known about this weakness of mine, let alone taken steps to correct it, had I not gotten the preadmissions counseling.

One other thing I came to discover is that I had a "hidden" strength that I hadn't ever really considered before, and that was as an educator. Look again at my list of volunteering ECs, and you will see that nearly all of them involve teaching of some kind. I had also won two major teaching awards, and I was employed as an instructor for Kaplan and at my university. I didn't come to appreciate how important a strong teaching background is to the medical schools until after I had the preadmissions counseling. Now that I am in medical school, I appreciate the importance of it even more. Doctors spend their entire working lives teaching people: their patients, their colleagues, and themselves. Thus, medical schools are extremely interested in applicants with a teaching background. I wound up making this personal strength one of the central themes of my PS and discussing it extensively at my interviews. Again, I doubt I would have thought to do this had I not gone for preadmissions counseling.

Interviews: Once you have reached this point, the acceptance is still not in the bag. It is essential that you practice expressing the points you made in your PS in a clear, concise, and engaging way. It is also essential that you can articulate why you want to attend each school where you interview. I did several things to prepare for interviews. First of all, I studied extensively for every interview. I would estimate that it took me about 2-3 hours EACH to prepare for them. What was I doing for that long? Reading the school's entire website and making notes of interesting features or questions I had about the school. (Sometimes I even knew more about the features of the curriculum than my interviewer did.) Going through the interview feedback from that school on SDN. (There were several schools where I got asked the exact same questions I had already seen on SDN.) Re-reading my apps and making sure I could explain my UG thesis research from 12 years ago. (I actually did get asked about it at one school, and the interviewer was d*** impressed that I could rattle off the entire title of my UG thesis!) Engaging in mock interviews. This is key. Some of my fellow Kaplan instructors were home from med school for the summer, and I got a few of them to mock interview me. They were so combative and tough on me that every real interview I had was a cinch in comparison. They accused me of being arrogant because of my MCAT score, or claimed I was using their school as a safety school, or demanded that I "prove" that I had sufficient social skills to be a doctor, etc. It really made me think about how I presented myself and made me aware of how careful I had to be about what impression I was giving off to the interviewers.

Some other tips: I also got help with my essays and interviewing skills from the Office of Diversity at one of my state schools. This may sound strange, but it really isn't when you consider that diversity is a broad term that encompasses much, much more than just race and ethnicity. If you are a non-trad, you will add diversity to your class based on that reason alone. Second, I called every single school before I applied, explained my grade situation, and asked whether I should realistically apply there. A couple of schools discouraged me from applying. One actually outright told me no, that I almost certainly would not be accepted there. I decided not to apply to any school that was not encouraging, with the exception of the one school that rejected me presecondary. ;)

I hope that this post has been helpful, and if anyone has any further questions, feel free to post them or PM me. Best of luck to the current applicants. :)
 
Questions for the successful non-trads:

1. What were your UG degrees in? I'm hearing things like "major in what you're interested and will do well in". I'm a bio major now, but I'm considering a change to something like anthro. In my case because of working full time along with school, pulling off a biology degree may not be the best course of action. I'm just wondering if having the bio major is greatly helpfull once you're in med school.

2. For those of you already working in health care, did you volunteer outside of health care as well? And how did you all spin your prior experience in health care to show that you wanted to be a Dr instead of an RN, PA, PT, etc?

Great thread. Can we sticky it?
 
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The only thing that I have to add is that I had many poster presentations & publications, which is becoming increasingly important for some medical schools.


This was one thing that really stood out & everyone asked me about.


It may be worth it for non-trads to try and gain some research experience if they can find the time!
 
Questions for the successful non-trads:

1. What were your UG degrees in? I'm hearing things like "major in what you're interested and will do well in". I'm a bio major now, but I'm considering a change to something like anthro. In my case because of working full time along with school, pulling off a biology degree may not be the best course of action. I'm just wondering if having the bio major is greatly helpfull once you're in med school.

2. For those of you already working in health care, did you volunteer outside of health care as well? And how did you all spin your prior experience in health care to show that you wanted to be a Dr instead of an RN, PA, PT, etc?

Okay - I went to music school. My degree is officially a bachelor of music. It's a blessing that I didn't have any science classes until 4 years ago when I started this whole thing.

If I had taken science courses as an undergrad, my grades would have been terrible and I would have been miserable. They would have been that way because (a) one track mind. my days & nights were filled with rehearsals, concerts, gigs, etc. - there was no time to study, and no time to take lab classes (conflicts in schedule); (b) the university was so full of uptight, competitive pre meds that I would have hated them all and they would have buried me anyway and (c) as an undergrad, I believed that I stunk at science classes and I thought I'd hate them. Bottom line, major in something you really LIKE.

When I started on this journey, I got a job in clinical research. This is a reasonable way for people to get paid, AND get some patient experience without HAVING to volunteer. However, I volunteered and shadowed too.
Why? It is our job to show that we have really spent time finding out what it's like and if it is a good fit for us. I shadowed surgeons in the OR, and in clinic, I shadowed 3 other doctors, plus a lab research doctor, an NP, a PT, a podiatrist.... It is also something we owe OURSELVES to find out (it's just not about 'how you spin it', sorry!) When you yourself know why not PT, NP, dentistry, etc., it's a breeze explaining it to anyone who asks, any way they ask it.


It may be worth it for non-trads to try and gain some research experience if they can find the time!

This is a good way to solve some problems non-trads run into. How to find time to work, get healthcare experience, volunteer, shadow, etc.... You can get some clinical research positions that offer a fair amount of patient contact, and sometimes offer publishing opportunities. But it is a myth to think that you must have your name on a paper. Only at a few of the institutions that have a strong, strong research focus will having your name published be a big deal. Research EXPERIENCE is far more important than publishing.
 
Questions for the successful non-trads:

1. What were your UG degrees in? I'm hearing things like "major in what you're interested and will do well in". I'm a bio major now, but I'm considering a change to something like anthro. In my case because of working full time along with school, pulling off a biology degree may not be the best course of action. I'm just wondering if having the bio major is greatly helpfull once you're in med school.

2. For those of you already working in health care, did you volunteer outside of health care as well? And how did you all spin your prior experience in health care to show that you wanted to be a Dr instead of an RN, PA, PT, etc?

Great thread. Can we sticky it?
1) I was a double major in natural sciences and Spanish. If you want to major in anthro, go for it. You don't need a bio degree to do well on the MCAT or to do well in med school. I'd guess at least half my class does not have bio degrees, including yours truly.

2) I don't think this applies to me.

I'll sticky it for now, and the forum mods can take it down later if they want. :)
 
Q, I have a question about the full scholarships you mentioned in the introductory post. Did you have to apply specifically for them or were they offered to you by the school based on your academic record and high MCAT score?
 
Q, I have a question about the full scholarships you mentioned in the introductory post. Did you have to apply specifically for them or were they offered to you by the school based on your academic record and high MCAT score?
It depends on the school. Some award scholarships automatically when they accept you. Some award them automatically when they give out financial aid packages in the spring. Some have an application process where you have to be invited to apply for scholarships, and at least one (Wash U) actually requires you to return to the school for a second interview just for the scholarship.
 
I've read a lot of posts talking about the mass of nervous kids in black suits waiting for their interview. What do you think about a nice CK grey pinstripe suit?

ps- I can't believe this is what I'm asking in my first post either!
 
I've read a lot of posts talking about the mass of nervous kids in black suits waiting for their interview. What do you think about a nice CK grey pinstripe suit?

ps- I can't believe this is what I'm asking in my first post either!
I think as long as you look professional, that's the key thing. It doesn't matter what color your suit is if you look professional. Personally, I think it is best to not use your clothes to make yourself stand out. I know in my case, I was already such a bizarre applicant that I decided to dress very conservatively at interviews (meaning in a black suit). Yeah, it's boring, but medicine is a conservative profession. I figure that I'd rather be boring and get accepted than let it all hang out on my interview day. :p

Good luck with your interviews. :)
 
I've read a lot of posts talking about the mass of nervous kids in black suits waiting for their interview. What do you think about a nice CK grey pinstripe suit?

ps- I can't believe this is what I'm asking in my first post either!

I saw a few nice grey pinstripe suits at my last interview, so it isn't like you will 'stick out' or anything. If I had been able to find one, that's what I would have worn. On the trail there have been very few variations on black, though, (Navy, navy pinstripe, grey, charcoal... ONE person wore brown... one person actually wore a magenta sweater & grey or black skirt!)
and I think it is nice if you can find something you look great in, that isn't black. The reason is that I do think interviewers get very tired of it.

It won't determine anything about your acceptance, though, so if you find a great black suit, go with that!
 
I've read a lot of posts talking about the mass of nervous kids in black suits waiting for their interview. What do you think about a nice CK grey pinstripe suit?

ps- I can't believe this is what I'm asking in my first post either!
I decided not to go crazy with the color of my suit (it was black) but it was a very modern cut (long jacket with no lapels) and had a bright green turtleneck shell underneath. I actually got complements from a few fellow interviewees and a few interviewers. The most important thing is that you wear comfortable shoes and try to match the suit with the area.

For instance, I interviewed at Houston on Aug 2nd and I was glad that shell had no sleeves because it was 104 outside. :eek:
 
Questions for the successful non-trads:

1. What were your UG degrees in? I'm hearing things like "major in what you're interested and will do well in". I'm a bio major now, but I'm considering a change to something like anthro. In my case because of working full time along with school, pulling off a biology degree may not be the best course of action. I'm just wondering if having the bio major is greatly helpfull once you're in med school.
I got a double in Psyc/English with a minor in Religious Studies (I like to say I majored in flakiness). I did cross cultural work before I started this insane process. If anything, I think working in a field like that helped me learn how to relate to people on their terms and make them feel comfortable and accepted. From everything I've read on these forums (and the answers to a few PMs I've sent) I think liberal arts and science majors even out within the first few weeks (days?) of med school.

I might be biased though - I think Anth is a badass major and you should go for it.
 
I think people have covered the basics really well here. I'll point out a couple of things that I'd have done "had I known then what I know now."

1) Do the post-bac full-time in a certificated program, look for one with linkage agreements. This can save a lot of time, and as an older student I'm working against time. I did my BCPM part time at a state uni over the course of two and some years, and it ended up costing me almost as much as if I'd done one of the private school programs. Also, I think my GPA would have been higher if I'd been studying full-time and intensively.

2) Take more MCAT tests. I took 3 of the online tests from AMCAS, and felt pretty confident. I ended up with 9+ in each category, so my score was fine. I would've been more competitive with higher scores, though.

3) The photo I submitted with my secondary applications was my passport photo. I don't know if this made a difference, but the only interview I got was at the school that didn't ask for a photo. My passport photo had me with a bit of a beard, earrings, and casual shirt. Like I said, I don't know how much difference it made, but I ought to have taken a photo wearing a suit and all clean-shaven.

4) Taken the April rather than August MCAT. I felt soooo far behind, and I wasn't the 3.9 gpa, 43 MCAT applicant whose numbers would bump them up to the top of the pile.
 
I am 36 and have just been accepted for August. Yay! The one thing I wish I had done differently is that I wish I had taken the April MCAT instead of August. I scored 39 after studying for three weeks and I think I could have done better both on the MCAT and overall in the application process (applied to 10 schools, 4 interviews, 2 acceptances, waiting on one decision) had I applied for 2007-2008 instead. I felt my biomedical clock ticking (and I couldn't face another year at home with my kids), though, and things have worked out fine in the end.
As for interview suits, I got into the one place where I wore sneakers instead of dress shoes, even for the actual interview (Black pants suit, black and hot pink sneakers). I also got into a school where I wore a blue dress and matching patterned jacket to the interview (dress shoes this time). I guess I just tried to look decent and figured my outstanding personality and interesting topics of conversation would keep them from looking at my feet (or caring, if they did).
I do feel that schools discriminate against non-traditional applicants, but that it doesn't pose an insurmountable obstacle, and some schools actually see our diverse experience and maturity as an asset.

So,... Go for it!
 
Wow Q.
Incredible post. You really covered it all! Thank you.

I second that, your post was incredibly, incredibly, helpful. you don't understand how much it made me realize what I need to work on the rest of my undergraduate years...even though that makes me sound like the traditional applicant, i'm planning to take a year off and such or do a master's program before applying!

Also, when studying becomes disillusional and disenchanting, posts like yours, and coming to SDN in general, help me revitalize myself and realize my true intentions for studying :)

Thanks again, really! :cool::D:)
 
I went to an Ivy for undergrad where I had a 2.7 majoring in history. I did none of the premeds. I spent my free time working to pay for that place. After that, I went to law school, which I don't recommend at all. Too many lawyers, too few jobs. However, what I did discover is that I absolutely love health care work. I spent my free time suing insurance companies to make sure that they actually pay when they are supposed to. Also, I did my premed courses while I was in law school and got a 4.0. My law GPA is a 3.0 which is pretty much exactly in the middle of my class. I will be graduating very soon and will be taking the MCAT in August, and I will be volunteering this summer in a hospital and taking some more advanced bio courses to keep bringin up my undergrad GPA.

Considering I still have to take my MCAT, do you guys think that I have a chance at allopathic schools?
 
I went to an Ivy for undergrad where I had a 2.7 majoring in history. I did none of the premeds. I spent my free time working to pay for that place. After that, I went to law school, which I don't recommend at all. Too many lawyers, too few jobs. However, what I did discover is that I absolutely love health care work. I spent my free time suing insurance companies to make sure that they actually pay when they are supposed to. Also, I did my premed courses while I was in law school and got a 4.0. My law GPA is a 3.0 which is pretty much exactly in the middle of my class. I will be graduating very soon and will be taking the MCAT in August, and I will be volunteering this summer in a hospital and taking some more advanced bio courses to keep bringin up my undergrad GPA.

Considering I still have to take my MCAT, do you guys think that I have a chance at allopathic schools?
With your low GPA, I don't think anyone can provide a meaningful answer without an MCAT score. Sorry. There's always a chance, it's more a matter of how much of a chance.
 
Hey Q,

Thank you so much for all your advice and positivity. I had a pretty bad GPA as an undergrad, and I am also non trad. I have been redeeming myself throughout the past couple of years by getting a Master's Degree in psychology with an emphasis in neuropsychopharmacology, taking post bac sciences, and a lot of basic and clinical research experience as well. I am 27 and plan on applying to Med school within the next year. I have been studying for the MCAT and hope to do well on the test. Also, I am in the process of finalizing my Graduate thesis and subsequently publishing it in a journal with my committe members as co-authors. Your story is very inspiring and I am glad I am not alone out there.

Thanks again and best of luck with all your endeavors!
 
Hey Q,

Thank you so much for all your advice and positivity. I had a pretty bad GPA as an undergrad, and I am also non trad. I have been redeeming myself throughout the past couple of years by getting a Master's Degree in psychology with an emphasis in neuropsychopharmacology, taking post bac sciences, and a lot of basic and clinical research experience as well. I am 27 and plan on applying to Med school within the next year. I have been studying for the MCAT and hope to do well on the test. Also, I am in the process of finalizing my Graduate thesis and subsequently publishing it in a journal with my committe members as co-authors. Your story is very inspiring and I am glad I am not alone out there.

Thanks again and best of luck with all your endeavors!
When you get into med school, come back and post your story for future students. :luck: to you. :)
 
Hello Everyone!
Thank you Q and everyone who gave your advice when applying.
I'm a non traditional student applying to med school for Fall 2009.

My questions for accepted non traditional medical students are:
1.) What study strategies did you use when preparing for the MCAT?
2.) What did you write about in your personal statement?

Many Thanks!
 
Hello Everyone!
Thank you Q and everyone who gave your advice when applying.
I'm a non traditional student applying to med school for Fall 2009.

My questions for accepted non traditional medical students are:
1.) What study strategies did you use when preparing for the MCAT?
2.) What did you write about in your personal statement?

Many Thanks!
Your personal statement should explain why you want to go to med school, and what you've done to "prove" that you know what you're talking about. Keep it positive, and don't apologize for mistakes in your past.

As for the MCAT, check out this thread: http://more.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=46880 We have been collecting advice from people who scored well for five years now. There's no huge difference in prepping as a nontrad versus as a trad, except that you may need to spend longer reviewing some of the science concepts if you've been out of school for a while. Best of :luck: to you. :)
 
Your personal statement should explain why you want to go to med school, and what you've done to "prove" that you know what you're talking about. Keep it positive, and don't apologize for mistakes in your past.

As for the MCAT, check out this thread: http://more.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=46880 We have been collecting advice from people who scored well for five years now. There's no huge difference in prepping as a nontrad versus as a trad, except that you may need to spend longer reviewing some of the science concepts if you've been out of school for a while. Best of :luck: to you. :)

Thanks Q! You're Great! :)
 
Hi Everyone,
I have spent the last 7 years working in a research laboratory and I have not taken any classes. I was a Bio Major/Marine Science Minor in my UG years and now I would like to go to Med School. I am going to be shadowing a prominent oncologist this week and I have some decent volunteer experience. I am going to take MCAT on July 13 - and I have been on several publications and wrote a book chapter for a biomedical book.

problems/questions...Do I need to take any classes?? I did not have to take physics because I took some hardcore chemical oceanography classes that exepted me from taking gen physics in college. I wanted to take a post bacc course in health sciences/premed but all the colleges emphasize that this premed post bacc is ONLY FOR PEOPLE WHO DID NOT MAJOR IN BIO
So what else do I need? Shadowing, clinical volunteering MCAT scores and what else will make me a good candidate?
Any information you can give me will rock my world.
Thanks for reading!
 
I feel like most of the basics have been covered here so I'll just add some tips for anyone that is in the same situation I was.

I had a 2.89 out of UG. To make matters worse I had a honor code violation on record as well (stupid citing violation). Many people told me that it is impossible to get into medical school with something like that on you record. It was extremely disheartening, but I knew that this it what I wanted to do with my life so I decided to give it my best shot and got a 4.0 over 36 credits at Rutgers as well as a 35Q on the MCAT. This raised my UG overall gpa to a 3.13 and BCPM to a 3.5. I decided to address the honor code violation as a learning experience (which it was) and to show how it had taught me valuable lessons both in my academic life and personal life. To my surprise, I was offered 6 interviews (2 allo, 4 osteo) and the incident was not brought up a single time. I believe that if I had dwelled on this problem in my PS and in secondaries that it would have been a much bigger deal; instead I placed it firmly in my past and did not have a problem with it at all.

I know that most people do not face this same situation, but I believe that if I can do it, then most people can as well.

Hi Hopster Just wondering if you wish to disclose the 6 schools that granted you interviews... I know it's private but if you do.. much appreciated. Numbers wise we're pretty close <g>
 
I went to an Ivy for undergrad where I had a 2.7 majoring in history. I did none of the premeds. I spent my free time working to pay for that place. After that, I went to law school, which I don't recommend at all. Too many lawyers, too few jobs. However, what I did discover is that I absolutely love health care work. I spent my free time suing insurance companies to make sure that they actually pay when they are supposed to. Also, I did my premed courses while I was in law school and got a 4.0. My law GPA is a 3.0 which is pretty much exactly in the middle of my class. I will be graduating very soon and will be taking the MCAT in August, and I will be volunteering this summer in a hospital and taking some more advanced bio courses to keep bringin up my undergrad GPA.

Considering I still have to take my MCAT, do you guys think that I have a chance at allopathic schools?

And a big second to that Big Guy <g> Oh and it wasn't there were too few jobs.. just too few that didn't' include your uncle's brother's sister's nephew talking to Judge Shmaels and putting in the good word so that the kid with the 2.0 could be granted a Us District Bankruptcy clerkship and the kid with the 3.4 would be stuck doing volunteer work at the Local transportation authority ... ROFL ... ah what a life that was. hehehe.
 
And a big second to that Big Guy <g> Oh and it wasn't there were too few jobs.. just too few that didn't' include your uncle's brother's sister's nephew talking to Judge Shmaels and putting in the good word so that the kid with the 2.0 could be granted a Us District Bankruptcy clerkship and the kid with the 3.4 would be stuck doing volunteer work at the Local transportation authority ... ROFL ... ah what a life that was. hehehe.

It's depressing, isn't it? I've been reading some law discussion boards recently to remind myself why I jumped ship. You come across all these people who are temping doing document review years after graduation. IMO, law school's just not a good investment for most people.

As for the post above about majors, I majored in history and don't think I've been at any real disadvantage. Yeah, there weren't any subjects that I went in knowing already, but that's not a huge deal. Major in what you like.
 
I went to an Ivy for undergrad where I had a 2.7 majoring in history. I did none of the premeds. I spent my free time working to pay for that place. After that, I went to law school, which I don't recommend at all. Too many lawyers, too few jobs. However, what I did discover is that I absolutely love health care work. I spent my free time suing insurance companies to make sure that they actually pay when they are supposed to. Also, I did my premed courses while I was in law school and got a 4.0. My law GPA is a 3.0 which is pretty much exactly in the middle of my class. I will be graduating very soon and will be taking the MCAT in August, and I will be volunteering this summer in a hospital and taking some more advanced bio courses to keep bringin up my undergrad GPA.

Considering I still have to take my MCAT, do you guys think that I have a chance at allopathic schools?

Assuming you score 30-32+ on the MCAT, i think you chances are better than most especially since you did so well in your med school pre-reqs. You're guaranteed not to make it if you don't apply.
 
Your personal statement should explain why you want to go to med school, and what you've done to "prove" that you know what you're talking about. Keep it positive, and don't apologize for mistakes in your past.

Q,
I have a good physician friend who served on adcoms at vandy and iowa editing my PS. He knows me and my situation--I had a low UG at a good school because I was stupid in my first two years, and a completely destroyed semester in grad school (the first one was very good, same load) because of the birth of our first child.

He said I absolutely needed to explain these things in my PS--is this different than "apologizing" as you said? I never apologized in that sense in my PS, I've just explained what happened and asserted how things are different now.

And...congrats to everyone accepted and thanks for all the advice!! :D
 
Q,
I have a good physician friend who served on adcoms at vandy and iowa editing my PS. He knows me and my situation--I had a low UG at a good school because I was stupid in my first two years, and a completely destroyed semester in grad school (the first one was very good, same load) because of the birth of our first child.

He said I absolutely needed to explain these things in my PS--is this different than "apologizing" as you said? I never apologized in that sense in my PS, I've just explained what happened and asserted how things are different now.

And...congrats to everyone accepted and thanks for all the advice!! :D

Furman,
i wouldn't say your approach is apologizing per se. however, you need to explain your situation with care and identify the circumstances that made your grades turn out the way they did in a tasteful way. A part of my PS focuses on the positive aspect of my hardships to explain my background and affirm my desire to become a physician despite the obstacles I have had to deal with in life.

Life doesnt deal the best cards out to everyone and some just have it tougher than others. Lord KNOWS that I prayed for things to be better for me but, hey, I dealt with my obstacles. How well you present your application to the adcom is dependent on what you learned from your experiences and how you formed your resolve to become a physician as a result of it.

Good luck!
 
Q,
I have a good physician friend who served on adcoms at vandy and iowa editing my PS. He knows me and my situation--I had a low UG at a good school because I was stupid in my first two years, and a completely destroyed semester in grad school (the first one was very good, same load) because of the birth of our first child.

He said I absolutely needed to explain these things in my PS--is this different than "apologizing" as you said? I never apologized in that sense in my PS, I've just explained what happened and asserted how things are different now.

And...congrats to everyone accepted and thanks for all the advice!! :D
What I'm saying is that you need to focus on the positive and the now, not the negative and the then. So when you spin this history of yours, talk about how together you've gotten your life NOW; emphasize that you're mentally and physically ready to go to medical school NOW; explain how much better you understand what's expected of you as a student in a rigorous academic program NOW. You can't undo the mistakes you've made, but you don't need to wallow in them either, and you can be a better physician in the long run if you've learned from them. You get the drift. ;)

Best of luck to you. :)
 
hey guys,
great one to start with..but...wat about foregin students,how they go about..non medical career options..is there anything for us...because in india...once we take up..medical in 11 and 12 we stop studying math and study only science...so gmat is out for me...i dont think so i am eligible...for that..is there anything else...that i can do other practicing medicine..people always talk about..mba,mph..but is it worth it...
i am actually interested in law after medicine..not forensic..may be corporate law..for insurance companies..can anyone help...
 
Is there any particular schools that love/appreciate non-trad students?
 
I am a new non-traditional applicant originally from Canada (thanks Trust) but currently going to grad school in the U.S. I've really enjoyed this thread (thanks for starting it Q) and am hoping for some of your valuable insight. Here's my story. I unfortunately am not one of the success stories - yet! I'm 30 years old, have always wanted to be a doctor. Applied as an eager and overconfident 3rd year UG with a 3.6 GPA, mediocre MCATs (but only some of our schools needed them), volunteer work, teaching experience, and ECs galore. I had no backup plan because I was so sure I would get in...and then I didn't. I was sure it was because of my MCATs, so the following year I applied to the ones that didn't require them, and still didn't get in. I was sure it was my grades, so I basically stopped trying...for awhile. I was burnt out at the time from not enjoying a single semester at school, because I spent all my time in the library, and the rejection did a number on me. So I wasn't ready to head back to school. I tried to convince myself that I would be happy having a "normal" life, with a regular job and a house. So after some travelling, that's what I did for awhile..and I was miserable. So 2 years ago, I decided to go for it - again. I quit my job, sold my house, and went back to UG to get an extra year of grades. Terrified, as it had now been some time since I had hit the books, I gave it 100%. I guess my ability to balance things, along with a little wisdom and perspective, gave me the edge I needed, and I did better than any of my previous years, and finished with a 3.85. While doing research last summer I studied for, and took my MCATs again, and scored a 31N (10's and 11's...not sure what happened with the WS...it went down while everything else went up, even though I had much more exposure to writing this time around than I did right out of UG). I also was accepted to a 1-year course-based master's program at a great school which I attended this year. I volunteered this year at a local hospital which I really enjoyed and I worked part-time throughout the school year doing some research. I applied to 12 schools, 7 in Canada and 5 in the U.S., thinking that this was my year. It turned out a little better than before (I received 1 interview). I'm currently on the waitlist but the class is almost full. While it's remains possible, it's not looking very likely.

While reading all the posts I've noticed one commonality - while most of you had one troublesome area, you all had at least one really strong area (MCATs, GPA, clinical, research). This is my concern. I don't feel like I have a particularly strong area. I have borderline grades/marks (3.7 or so), borderline MCATs, some current volunteer work, some teaching (tutoring math specifically), not much leadership experience, and some current ECs. I thought my essays were really genuine and unique, and I prepared extensively for the interview which I felt went pretty well. I guess I'm wondering what you think a borderline, non-traditional applicant can do for this application cycle to improve his/her chances? Also, is there anything I've mentioned that appears to stand out as a deal-breaker (ie perhaps my "coasting" years)? I also 2nd MFurfur's question - are there any schools that appreciate non-trads (and foreign applicants for that matter). I am primarily only eligible to apply to private schools....any thoughts on "easier" ones to get into?

Sorry for the lengthy post. Please let me know if my experiences can help to answer any of your questions as well. I'd love to put them to good use.
 
I've read most of this thread, and I don't recall seeing this mentioned, but if it has been, I apologize in advance.

1. Remember your past experiences don't have to be specifically medical to relate to medicine. For example, I was an insurance agent before I went back to school at 28. Now, selling auto, life, homeowners and business insurance doesn't specifically relate to medicine...or does it? Well, being a small business owner relates very well to private practice, and having an understanding of how insurance reimbursement/loss processing/risk management works has a ton to do with the realities of practicing medicine in the US at this moment. I just read a personal statement from another non-trad applicant who discussed skills he aquired working outside of the traditional path -- in many ways -- and who did a very good job of relating them back to the skills he will need as a doc ....this leads me to...

2. Think about the BIG picture. Medicine isn't just working in the clinic. The better you understand the complexities of the healthcare system, the stakeholders who are involved in healthcare, and the policies/political climate surrounding modern medicine, the better applicant you will be. In some ways this understanding is an untangible, but if you write clearly in your PS and/or secondaries about where you see yourself within a complex system, the more attractive you will be (in some places: where raw numbers are the ultimate deciding factor this may not be true).

3. Show maturity. You may have had terrible things happen in your life, but you have to talk about these events with a reflective, self-aware tone that shows you are thoughtful and able to learn from the events in your life. Being non-traditional is fine, as long as you can show you actually have something unique to contribute because you are non-traditional.

4. A minor point, but an important one. When you list your ECs on your app, make sure to use the explaination space to describe what you have done/why it is relevant/relate it to medicine. Don't just say you worked at Company Y doing job Z. Explain why working at Company Y doing job Z is relevant to your application to admission to medical school (see #1. above).

5. Remember that every time you check on your app or send in an update letter it is noted in your file. Make frequent, polite and friendly inquiries into your application and its status at the schools you are really interested in. You can even ask the admissions office staff how frequently they feel is appropriate for you to call. Always say thank you.

6. Send genuine handwritten thank you notes, to everyone who does anything for you. Including your student interviewers and the admissions office staff.

7. Remember that you never know whether the person you are talking with has any input into your application. While admissions office staff may not sit on the adcom, they are often the right hand to the Dean and if you make a negative impression on them it will be relayed. The administrators who you may dismiss as paper pushers have a lot more power than you think they might. Remember the anecdotal stories you have heard about job applicants not getting offers because they were kind to the CEO but a jerk to the parking attendant and the cafeteria staff. You never know who will be asked about your behavior and attitude toward them. Many people believe the measure of a person is how they treat people who aren't perceived as having power/influence.

Good luck!

____________________
____________________
DrPDot

~Happiness isn't a feeling to be captured; it's a decision to be made~~~
 
While reading all the posts I've noticed one commonality - while most of you had one troublesome area, you all had at least one really strong area (MCATs, GPA, clinical, research). This is my concern. I don't feel like I have a particularly strong area. I have borderline grades/marks (3.7 or so), borderline MCATs, some current volunteer work, some teaching (tutoring math specifically), not much leadership experience, and some current ECs. I thought my essays were really genuine and unique, and I prepared extensively for the interview which I felt went pretty well. I guess I'm wondering what you think a borderline, non-traditional applicant can do for this application cycle to improve his/her chances? Also, is there anything I've mentioned that appears to stand out as a deal-breaker (ie perhaps my "coasting" years)? I also 2nd MFurfur's question - are there any schools that appreciate non-trads (and foreign applicants for that matter). I am primarily only eligible to apply to private schools....any thoughts on "easier" ones to get into?
It doesn't sound to me like you're borderline, at least not because of your stats. Your MCAT and GPA are about average for allopathic *matriculants*, at least in the U.S. (I'm not sure about Canadian schools.) I think you probably need to apply more broadly. You should also see if you can get any of the schools that rejected you to give you some feedback on how to improve your app.

In answer to your and MFurfer's question, no, there are no schools that favor nontrads simply for being nontrads. There *are* some schools that explicitly encourage nontrads to apply. But that doesn't mean that you are more likely to be accepted to one of those schools; for many Americans anyway, you are usually most likely to be accepted by your state school. Again, I'm not sure how it works for Canadians; you might try contacting trustwomen, who I believe posted earlier in this thread and who was a successful Canadian nontrad applicant. Best of luck to you. :)

Great post, DrPDot; thanks for sharing it with us. I especially agree with your last point.
 
Q...thorough and gracious as always has done a great job. here are a few of my HUGE items to add/stress (rising MS2, matriculated at 30, applied to 27 schools, 22 secondaries, 4 interviews, 4 acceptances; both MD and DO in all categories):

1.) it's been said before, but can't be stressed enough. take the early MCAT and apply as soon as the AMCAS opens. i didn't and in a few cases i suffered. it's less of a big deal with AACOMAS (i applied to that in december and got into all DO schools i applied to.)

2.) DO NOT APPLY to schools you are not at least 95% sure you'd go to. because this happens: you get in. maybe only to that one you just threw on AMCAS because you heard they like people like you, even though you're pretty sure you'd hate something about it...don't apply somewhere like that just to get in, because if that's the only place you get in, you're screwed. you have to go, basically, and that would suck if you'd be miserable there. if you've gotten in somewhere, it's hard to re-apply and have anywhere look at you seriously if you've refused a spot ANYWHERE when acceptance rates overall are so low. that happened to me MD. it wasn't a bad school, it just wasn't right for me and i pretty much knew that when i applied. luckily a really good DO school that i liked took me.

3.) be aware of this: a lot of schools send automatic secondaries before even looking at you. and may not even look at you much after that. i had 18 MD secondaries, and one interview out of them. i called about a dozen of the other ones to ask why no interview, and they all told me that my numbers were too low and they didn't even read the rest of the application -- when i asked specifically about the numbers it was my 2.9 from undergrad being below a 3.0, nevermind the 3.9 i had in a "hard science" MS with thesis, nor the years as a research scientist, nor the 35S MCAT. the other thing i got from a few schools was that most of my BCMP classes were hovering just over 10 years old. one school said to re-take intro chemistry and re-apply...mind you, i was basically doing nuclear chemistry for my job. so, i wasted a lot of time and money on applications that never had a shot.

4.) people differ on the interview advice. i got in everywhere i interviewed, no wait list, and here's my two cents. don't stress it. really. show up, be well groomed but wear something you're comfortable and feel like yourself in, and just go with the flow. it's a two-way interview, remember...you are also checking them out. you may end up paying these people a TON of money, and on one level see the interview as your way to decide if you want to be their customer, as much as trying to convince them to take you. be confident but not cocky, and for god's sakes don't be obsequious or snively. most of all, be honest...most of all to who you are. you have to exist in the place for four long hard years, and if the you that's really you can't fly it's freak flag, you'll be unhappy. and med school is miserable enough without that added stress. if you're funny, be funny. if you're intense, be intense. etc.

5.) this is a tough one, and not really advice either way, just a bit of my story. my application showed a lot of me. and by that, i mean my beliefs and ideals and passions. and those things are...um...radical to say the least. i can't say this hurt me, but it might have. i don't really know if i'd had that 3.0 if my extreme views would have still done the trick. personally, even if they had, i don't care...again, the whole fitting where you go thing. but it's something to consider if you have very leftish views. med schools can be a bit stodgy.
 
noonday - It is good to catch up with you, and congrats.

To other readers - I had stats similar to noonday's, and I wrote out a lot of my "Secrets" in the Re-App FAQ. You can click on my signature to read it. A lot of the advice there is useful for any applicant in any stage of the process.
 
I started med school at 42 and am now in fourth year. To add to all the excellent advice above, my 5 cents' worth:

1. "Does my age matter?"
I believe that the over-40 applicant does fall into a different category. There are not many of us, so each of us sticks out. You need to demonstrate stamina, intellectual capability, and the desire and potential to stay in your new career for a long time. At the same time, there are more of us than you realize (my med school has about 3 per year, or about 2% of the class), so you are not unique and special just by virtue of your age.

2. "I have so much more experience than those youngsters!"
Yes, you have more experience than the 20 yo, but you are not being compared to them. You will always be compared to other applicants your own age or in a similar situation. Your application needs to compare favorably with theirs. If you are a nurse, a chiropractor, a stay-at-home parent, a firefighter, or a professional athlete, you will be compared with others with similar backgrounds.

3. "Do I really have to do all this crap?"
The application hoops you have to jump through can seem stupid, expensive, pointless, and time-consuming. For example, no one is going to exempt you from taking 2 English courses even if you worked as a professional writer for 10 years. You have to do each step, and do it to the very best of your ability. These are just the very beginning of the medical education process, and I often think they are the gatekeepers for the rest of medical education. Each next exam is more expensive and pointless. If you hate it now, be aware that it will get worse, but you will get used to it. If you naturally rebel against the system and resist all attempts to make you conform, medicine is probably not the field for you. If you really want to get into med school, I'd recommend the clinical volunteering, shadowing, prereqs, etc.. You also have to recognize that there are too many applicants for your individual strengths and unique skills to be noticed, if you have a sub-par GPA or MCAT. Be realistic about where you apply.

4. "I had a near-death experience, the brilliant Doctor X saved my life, and now I want to become a ______ (insert name of medical specialty) like Doctor X."
As an over-40, I did not get good advising from the premed advisors at my local state school. Their advice on prereqs was good, and they knew our state med school. They are excellent with typical undergrads, and very well-intentioned, but do not have enough experience with applicants with over 20 years' post-bacc experience. Their advice on my personal statement was really not at all helpful. They kept guiding me into the typical premed essay, instead of helping me identify and bring out my strengths. Now I know what I should have written about; at the time, I had no idea what to do to improve (and I am a good writer). I would especially counsel you to avoid group workshops with regular undergrads, because their peer feedback on your essay will generally be unhelpful. I did pay a nationally known professional premed advisor and again did not get very good feedback. Go to the old geezer med students if you can, like us.

5. "OK, but your advice doesn't really apply to my special and unique situation."
Older premeds are subject to the same Laws Of Med School Admission as everyone else. No matter how special we are, we do not get any special allowances. If you find yourself resisting this advice, ask yourself what it is that you really do not want to hear. No one is trying to ruin your dream. We are just telling you that you may need to work harder to achieve it, or it may take shape in a way that you did not imagine.
 
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