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nice...I remember reading something on the internet like that too. this "autonomy" seem to be a future trend in pharmacy and all health care professional in general. "specialization", "autonomy" and "collaboration" are the future trend in healthcare. Who know in the future pharmacists might be able to establish their own little clinic at the drugstore like NP? CVS pharmacy will become CVS clinic/pharmacy. They don't have to hire NP at some CVS anymore.!!
That's good for patient too so they can get their medication right there for minor illness!!!
I guess part of the problem is that pharmacists don't get a lot of training in diagnosing compared to nurses and doctors. In a lot of other countries, pharmacists have the power to prescribe and it seems the U.S. is moving towards that trend too; however, the types of medications that they can prescribe is the problem that has to be dealt with.
Nurses aren't good with diagnosis either. In fact, they are not trained to diagnose patients. I guess the more appropriate term would be "assess" patients, such as if he has a temperature, edema, bleeding, fever, etc...But a nurse won't be able to diagnose patient to conclude he has hypovolemic hyponatremia, etc...that's the medical job. Even medical doctors diagnose wrong a lot of times, too.
Yeah and the solution to that is to let people script who have EVEN LESS training at diagnosis than MDs and NPs.
Nurses aren't good with diagnosis either. In fact, they are not trained to diagnose patients.
Not sure if I should post this in Pre-pharmacy or Pharmacy, but I'll start here. Maybe I am just an idiot, but did anyone else in here know that in certain states, registered pharmacists (R.Ph) have the capability of PRESCRIBING certain medications, not just filling prescriptions? Only 6 states as of Dec 12 2007 allow this, but I thought it was worthy of mention to anyone else that may have been in the dark about this. Maybe those of you that live in one of these states know about this, though.
States that allow certain medication prescribing by pharmacists include North Carolina, New Mexico, Montana, and Washington state (those allow Schedule 2-5) and then it said North Dakota " 3, 3N, 4 & 5 PRESCRIBE ONLY" and California "2, 2N, 3, 3N, 4 & 5 PRESCRIBE ONLY" so I'm not sure if that means you can't fill what you prescribe, or what. Anyone who has insight on this, I would love to know more. Also, say a pharmacist who works in North Carolina and obviously has their license from there prescribes a drug to a person who happens to not fill it at that same pharmacy, but perhaps goes over the border to Tennessee or Virginia if they are close by, and "cashes it in" there. Can that state legally fill it, or just North Carolina pharmacies? So many questions can come from this!!!! You all on here seem to be good debaters so I'd like to hear some input on this issue.
Here is the link for those who want to check out what I'm preaching lol
http://www.deadiversion.usdoj.gov/drugreg/practioners/index.html
They can prescribe if they graduate from medical school and pass all three steps of the licensing exams.
Otherwise, they dispense.
Yes, the main thing we do is to "assess". However, the ability to assess patient at bed-side are also helpful to recognize symptoms and sign of the illness. But how come nurse practitioner earned "some" prescriptive authority without the supervision from MD but pharmacists don't. Is it because of higher lobbying power due to higher numbers? I assume that specialty NP also have some specialized knowledge about diagnosis from the training at school.
if you think about it:
pharmacist spend most all of their education learning everything about drugs...but don't prescribe them
doctors spend most all of their education learning everything about assessing/ (prescribing) what is wrong with patients..but spend much less time learning a lot about drugs
I think pharmacists should be able to prescribe medication for minor things like birth control, pain medication, cough syrups, etc.
It doesn't take much brains to diagnose a sore throat. That way, instead of going to the doctor, waiting a few hours, the patient can go to the pharmacist, get some Tussionex and get their throat swabbed, anyone who has taken Microbiology is capable of running cultures.
Identifying the microbe isn't that hard, then after running a Blood Agar culture, you can tell what kind of hemolysis is going on and prescribe the appropriate antibiotic.
Minor things like that, pharmacists should be able to do.
.
I completely agree...I think that simple diagnosing such as that which is learned during undergrad is a great example!!! so there is no reason why we should not be able to do simple things such as colds and such
However, I'm against prescribing antibiotics unless the patient is in SERIOUS trouble. Otherwise, you are just encouraging the pathogens to get resistant to antibiotics.
Just treat the pain and fever so that the person can function.
The body's police department and SWAT team can take care of the body's criminals and terrorists. If you keep calling in the Navy Seals and the bloody SAS(antibiotics and vaccines), eventually the terrorists will catch on and be unstoppable.
However, I'm against prescribing antibiotics unless the patient is in SERIOUS trouble. Otherwise, you are just encouraging the pathogens to get resistant to antibiotics.
Just treat the pain and fever so that the person can function.
The body's police department and SWAT team can take care of the body's criminals and terrorists. If you keep calling in the Navy Seals and the bloody SAS(antibiotics and vaccines), eventually the terrorists will catch on and be unstoppable.
as a student in one of the more progressive states on this movement I have a little input.
There is actually a bill in congress right now to get pharmacists recognized by medicare as medical practitioners so we can bill for our services.
Here in NM where we have a Pharmacist Clinician license you can prescribe under a set protocol between yourself and a physician.
99% of these Pharmacist Clinicians are not out to diagnose - although it does occur in rural areas where the pharmacist is more accessible than a physician (remember, this is New Mexico, it is not uncommon to be 4+ hours from a "town" containing a WalMart or the like. I still have trouble fathoming just how effing rural it is here).
More than anything else this is for disease state management. Patient is already diagnosed with CHF or diabetes. Due to the shortage of primary care physicians in this country pharmacists have been able to step up to close the gap on disease state management. It would be a waste to have a cardiologist managing every single run of the mill CHF patient. Patient is already diagnosed by a physician. Patient sees pharmacist in a clinic setting every couple weeks and is assessed for medications efficacy - according to a set protocol between the pharmacist and the physician the pharmacist adjusts medications accordingly. This could be maximizing a Beta-Blocker dose in a CHF patient or changing an ACE to an ARB due to side effects. It all depends on the particular protocol and practice agreement.
Many physicians who aren't familiar with the practice seem to think that pharmacists will be out willy nilly throwing drugs at people diagnosing zebras - this is not the case, and physicians who work directly in these settings are super appreciative of the pharmacist input.
I agree..but if you could eliminate the trip to the drs office for some things that would be great.
Thats the purpose of the pharmacist being able to prescribe. The idea is not so that they can go penning around the serious drugs (serious in terms of their effects/uses) but so that they can prescribe things that solve minor problems but are still stronger than OTC.
For example, someone comes in with a stronger than usual itch and needs topical hydrocortisone. Rather than giving the person the low strength OTC, the pharmacist would prescribe a slightly stronger than OTC; saving the person from going to the doctor to get the prescription.
At no point do I think the pharmacist should be prescribing antidepressants etc. unless they're "babied" with a physician.
Also... Mets are going down this year, buddy.
Not sure if I should post this in Pre-pharmacy or Pharmacy, but I'll start here. Maybe I am just an idiot, but did anyone else in here know that in certain states, registered pharmacists (R.Ph) have the capability of PRESCRIBING certain medications, not just filling prescriptions? Only 6 states as of Dec 12 2007 allow this, but I thought it was worthy of mention to anyone else that may have been in the dark about this. Maybe those of you that live in one of these states know about this, though.
States that allow certain medication prescribing by pharmacists include North Carolina, New Mexico, Montana, and Washington state (those allow Schedule 2-5) and then it said North Dakota " 3, 3N, 4 & 5 PRESCRIBE ONLY" and California "2, 2N, 3, 3N, 4 & 5 PRESCRIBE ONLY" so I'm not sure if that means you can't fill what you prescribe, or what. Anyone who has insight on this, I would love to know more. Also, say a pharmacist who works in North Carolina and obviously has their license from there prescribes a drug to a person who happens to not fill it at that same pharmacy, but perhaps goes over the border to Tennessee or Virginia if they are close by, and "cashes it in" there. Can that state legally fill it, or just North Carolina pharmacies? So many questions can come from this!!!! You all on here seem to be good debaters so I'd like to hear some input on this issue.
Here is the link for those who want to check out what I'm preaching lol
http://www.deadiversion.usdoj.gov/drugreg/practioners/index.html
I am definitely for pharmacists being able to write for lab tests to monitor medications. But medications... I'm all for expansion of professional responsibilities, but I'd be less comfortable with that.
Nurses aren't good with diagnosis either. In fact, they are not trained to diagnose patients. I guess the more appropriate term would be "assess" patients, such as if he has a temperature, edema, bleeding, fever, etc...But a nurse won't be able to diagnose patient to conclude he has hypovolemic hyponatremia, etc...that's the medical job. Even medical doctors diagnose wrong a lot of times, too.
Although pharmacists are not trained to diagnose, they should be able to prescribe medications, including medications for serious illnesses, not just minor ones. After all, they are the drug experts, not MDs. Once the physician has made a diagnosis, the pharmacist should take over in recommending (prescribing) the proper drug treatment. According to Pharmacy Times, this is coming:
IT'S COMING: PHARMACISTS
PRESCRIBING DRUGS
A new report indicates that pharmacists will expand
their role to prescribing medications in at least 6
states in 5 years, according to report author
Kalorama Information.
The state of Florida allows some prescribing off an
approved list, and many states allow prescription
choice from a physician diagnosis. The cost of
copays and time spent on physician visits will
increase the need for drug decisions to be made at
the pharmacist level.
The report, Prescribing Pharmacists, a Decision
Maker Emerges, details how pharmacists already
have a tremendous impact on drug revenues, and
companies that do not incorporate a marketing
strategy involving pharmacists will lose advantage in
the coming years. The analysis indicates that pharmacists are moving from their role of
dispensing medication based on physician instructions, to prescribing based on physician
diagnosis, to independent prescribing in some limited situations.