"white African American" getting in trouble?

Any incidence where people who define themselves as African American due to a known African Descent or being from continental Africa like Egypt. I am Egyptian and I am 100% sure that I have sub-Saharan African ancestry. Just because Egypt is politically affiliated with the middle east does not mean that they are ethnically Arab. Are there any incidences where people got DENIED medical school due to this or had their doctor licence taken away other than the dude from Mozambique.

Please post a source if possible.

Don't tell me what I should do or what you would do, I want to know what will happen if I do.

Please be nice, If you don't have anything nice to say, leave this forum. I do not want criticism, I want answers.

(people in SDN can be vultures sometimes )

Please be nice, If you don't have anything nice to say, leave this forum. I do not want criticism, I want answers.

I am currently leaving this forum.

Originally Posted by mclinkin94

Any incidence where people who define themselves as African American due to a known African Descent or being from continental Africa like Egypt. I am Egyptian and I am 100% sure that I have sub-Saharan African ancestry. Just because Egypt is politically affiliated with the middle east does not mean that they are ethnically Arab. Are there any incidences where people got DENIED medical school due to this or had their doctor licence taken away other than the dude from Mozambique.

Please post a source if possible.

Don't tell me what I should do or what you would do, I want to know what will happen if I do.

Please be nice, If you don't have anything nice to say, leave this forum. I do not want criticism, I want answers.

(people in SDN can be vultures sometimes )

I see no good reason to classify yourself as an African-American. It can only hurt you. I personally think you are white (just like people from the Middle East are considered white).

do YOU identify yourself as African American?

if yes, say you're African American
if no, say you're Caucasian or Other
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caucasian_race)

it's really that simple.

Hay man, if you ain't black, den you on crack. You not teh URMz! You teh Arabz!

On a serious note, did you not begin a separate thread for this a few days ago? I believe you got your answer.

Originally Posted by Shalashaska

Hay man, if you ain't black, den you on crack. You not teh URMz! You teh Arabz!

On a serious note, did you not begin a separate thread for this a few days ago? I believe you got your answer.

Including this thread, OP has posted the same question in various forms at least four times in a minimum of three different threads. The guy just won't quit. I've never seen a man so determined to be black since the release of 8 Mile.

As a fellow Egyptian, I was intrigued by this post. I would say however that listing yourself as african american will likely harm you more than help you. Would you lose your license, probably not? Would people frown upon it during an interview? Probably.

Didn't you start this discussion before?

Dude, you aren't black.

I will boil things down for you:

Med schools are only being PC when they say "African American" on AMCAS... the schools want black students (i.e. physicians that will look like their patient population). They aren't looking for merely "people originating from Africa" (at least to the degree of experiencing the fabled URM-advantage).

It has everything to do with your skin color. If it was simply "oh, I am from a underrepresented location in US med schools, I get teh help?" then there would be people from Iceland and Siberia bragging on here about it.

BLACK!

You will be lol'ed at.

Originally Posted by Blais

Didn't you start this discussion before?

Dude, you aren't black.

I will boil things down for you:

Med schools are only being PC when they say "African American" on AMCAS... the schools want black students (i.e. physicians that will look like their patient population). They aren't looking for merely "people originating from Africa" (at least to the degree of experiencing the fabled URM-advantage).

It has everything to do with your skin color. If it was simply "oh, I am from a underrepresented location in US med schools, I get teh help?" then there would be people from Iceland and Siberia bragging on here about it.

BLACK!

You will be lol'ed at.

one of the funniest, but probably one of the most honest post i read LOL

Originally Posted by Blais

Didn't you start this discussion before?

Dude, you aren't black.

I will boil things down for you:

Med schools are only being PC when they say "African American" on AMCAS... the schools want black students (i.e. physicians that will look like their patient population). They aren't looking for merely "people originating from Africa" (at least to the degree of experiencing the fabled URM-advantage).

It has everything to do with your skin color. If it was simply "oh, I am from a underrepresented location in US med schools, I get teh help?" then there would be people from Iceland and Siberia bragging on here about it.

BLACK!

You will be lol'ed at.

Lol, I love this.

But I think it's not a question of "will checking African American work
, rather, it's a question of "should you do it."

Originally Posted by Blais

Didn't you start this discussion before?

Dude, you aren't black.

I will boil things down for you:

Med schools are only being PC when they say "African American" on AMCAS... the schools want black students (i.e. physicians that will look like their patient population). They aren't looking for merely "people originating from Africa" (at least to the degree of experiencing the fabled URM-advantage).

It has everything to do with your skin color. If it was simply "oh, I am from a underrepresented location in US med schools, I get teh help?" then there would be people from Iceland and Siberia bragging on here about it.

BLACK!

You will be lol'ed at.

Baaaaaasically.

Originally Posted by me1234

As a fellow Egyptian, I was intrigued by this post. I would say however that listing yourself as african american will likely harm you more than help you. Would you lose your license, probably not? Would people frown upon it during an interview? Probably.

As an Egyptian myself, I am intrigued by your post. You cannot say that you are Arab and you cannot say that you are African, So therefore you could say both. I do not think there is anything wrong with how I call myself.

Originally Posted by mclinkin94

Any incidence where people who define themselves as African American due to a known African Descent or being from continental Africa like Egypt. I am Egyptian and I am 100% sure that I have sub-Saharan African ancestry. Just because Egypt is politically affiliated with the middle east does not mean that they are ethnically Arab. Are there any incidences where people got DENIED medical school due to this or had their doctor licence taken away other than the dude from Mozambique.

Please post a source if possible.

Don't tell me what I should do or what you would do, I want to know what will happen if I do.

Please be nice, If you don't have anything nice to say, leave this forum. I do not want criticism, I want answers.

(people in SDN can be vultures sometimes )

I find it intriguing how in your other thread you decided to not check the African box because it's unethical, yet now you're asking whether or not you will get in trouble if you do it.

Even if no one has heard of someone who was directly denied admissions because of a similar situation, I would still not risk it and check this box, then appear for an interview only for the committee to find that you're Egyptian. While it's true you can argue Egyptians are not Ethnically Arab, they are not ethnically Africans either.

You can still claim a disadvantaged status and you can explain why you think you're disadvantaged, The Adcom is not stupid, they know that Caucasian includes those from the Middle East AND from North Africa.

Originally Posted by light warrior

I find it intriguing how in your other thread you decided to not check the African box because it's unethical, yet now you're asking whether or not you will get in trouble if you do it.

Even if no one has heard of someone who was directly denied admissions because of a similar situation, I would still not risk it and check this box, then appear for an interview only for the committee to find that you're Egyptian. While it's true you can argue Egyptians are not Ethnically Arab, they are not ethnically Africans either.

You can still claim a disadvantaged status and you can explain why you think you're disadvantaged, The Adcom is not stupid, they know that Caucasian includes those from the Middle East AND from North Africa.

On the bolded part of your answer, I want to add that I keep alternating between this decision. who is to deny my race? This IS me. even in the aamc website they have stats for people who picked black or African American.

I also said NOT To post things due to arrogance or jealousy because you do not have this advantage. I wanted a case in which someone was denied and all i got was criticism. I find it racist that you think I am Caucasian.

Originally Posted by mclinkin94

On the bolded part of your answer, I want to add that I keep alternating between this decision. who is to deny my race? This IS me. even in the aamc website they have stats for people who picked black or African American.

I also said NOT To post things due to arrogance or jealousy because you do not have this advantage. I wanted a case in which someone was denied and all i got was criticism. I find it racist that you think I am Caucasian.

Somebody call the WAAAAAAAMbulance

Originally Posted by Blais

Didn't you start this discussion before?

Dude, you aren't black.

I will boil things down for you:

Med schools are only being PC when they say "African American" on AMCAS... the schools want black students (i.e. physicians that will look like their patient population). They aren't looking for merely "people originating from Africa" (at least to the degree of experiencing the fabled URM-advantage).

It has everything to do with your skin color. If it was simply "oh, I am from a underrepresented location in US med schools, I get teh help?" then there would be people from Iceland and Siberia bragging on here about it.

BLACK!

You will be lol'ed at.

This x100000

Originally Posted by mclinkin94

On the bolded part of your answer, I want to add that I keep alternating between this decision. who is to deny my race? This IS me. even in the aamc website they have stats for people who picked black or African American.

I also said NOT To post things due to arrogance or jealousy because you do not have this advantage. I wanted a case in which someone was denied and all i got was criticism. I find it racist that you think I am Caucasian.

Um, YOU said in your other thread that you were a Caucasian male. YOU SAID THAT. If you identify as a Caucasian male, you should click the Caucasian box. Enough said. You are clearly trying as hard as you can to get an advantage that was intended for a different group of people who actually ARE underrepresented in medicine.

Originally Posted by mclinkin94

On the bolded part of your answer, I want to add that I keep alternating between this decision. who is to deny my race? This IS me. even in the aamc website they have stats for people who picked black or African American.

I also said NOT To post things due to arrogance or jealousy because you do not have this advantage. I wanted a case in which someone was denied and all i got was criticism. I find it racist that you think I am Caucasian.

I find it racist that you played the race card. You are also racist against all the other races that the racial URM classification was intended for. Your racism is disturbing, and someone as racist as you are should leave this forum, as this is not a racist forum.

Originally Posted by theseeker4

I find it racist that you played the race card. You are also racist against all the other races that the racial URM classification was intended for. Your racism is disturbing, and someone as racist as you are should leave this forum, as this is not a racist forum.

I find it racist that you say that.

Originally Posted by mclinkin94

On the bolded part of your answer, I want to add that I keep alternating between this decision. who is to deny my race? This IS me. even in the aamc website they have stats for people who picked black or African American.

I also said NOT To post things due to arrogance or jealousy because you do not have this advantage. I wanted a case in which someone was denied and all i got was criticism. I find it racist that you think I am Caucasian.

I can say I'm a Native American since I was born in America, but that doesn't make it so. Who is to deny your race? The US Census.

You were told in the other thread by LizzyM not to do it, and that adcoms would see right through it. That's all you should need. You seemingly made your peace with it, then apparently decided that you still wanted to game the system, so here we are.

Thinking you're Caucasian isn't racist in the least. The only offensive thing here is you playing the race card.

Maybe you can write about how AMCAS awakened something inside you to make you identify with black culture, which you seemingly hadn't felt in your previous 21-or-so years on this planet. That would make you a much more unique applicant than simply checking "Black."

I'm all for using every advantage available to you, but this is a boldfaced lie, and you deserve rejections everywhere you apply if you choose to use it.

Originally Posted by Druggernaut

I can say I'm a Native American since I was born in America, but that doesn't make it so. Who is to deny your race? The US Census.

You were told in the other thread by LizzyM not to do it, and that adcoms would see right through it. That's all you should need. You seemingly made your peace with it, then apparently decided that you still wanted to game the system, so here we are.

Thinking you're Caucasian isn't racist in the least. The only offensive thing here is you playing the race card.

Maybe you can write about how AMCAS awakened something inside you to make you identify with black culture, which you seemingly hadn't felt in your previous 21-or-so years on this planet. That would make you a much more unique applicant than simply checking "Black."

I'm all for using every advantage available to you, but this is a boldfaced lie, and you deserve rejections everywhere you apply if you choose to use it.

Bold: I guess that makes sense and It would be wise to explain myself before interview.

Underline: I disagree, I am African-American by definition not only because I originate from continental Africa but also because of the 1/16 rule. there is no doubt that I do not have sub-Saharan African ancestry mixed in with Egyptian. Did you forget that most Egyptians are mixed race and within those mixes-sub-Saharan ancestry exists. Do you think this is an acceptable explanation to adcom? I feel like it makes the most logical sense.

Originally Posted by mclinkin94

On the bolded part of your answer, I want to add that I keep alternating between this decision. who is to deny my race? This IS me. even in the aamc website they have stats for people who picked black or African American.

I also said NOT To post things due to arrogance or jealousy because you do not have this advantage. I wanted a case in which someone was denied and all i got was criticism. I find it racist that you think I am Caucasian.

I think you are the jealous one.

Lol. You got your answer on literally three previous posts. Literally. Discrete, serious, simple, common sense, straight forward answers, from the cream of the crop here on SDN. Are you calling us stupid? Because when someone asks me something 4 times, I take it as an insult. I am not stupid. We heard you the first three times. We answered you the first three times. Going by this, and your hopeful, optimistic, aggressive, and blind attitude, I think that you are in denial. Some serious denial. Perhaps a little neurotic too. I wouldn't write this on one post, or two, (even though you made three within ONE hour, and then preached about morality), because I would find this post offensive. However, given your CLEAR and OBVIOUS condition, this post is fully appropriate and inoffensive. Think of it as a wake up call.

one of the best answers I got so far. Thank you very much. It is just difficult for me to identify a race, people here in SDN don't understand. I wish to identify with a race in which I could get an advantage with. I am as Caucasian as I am African-American, therefore picking one of which will not be harmful. I have revealed my MCAT (33) and my GPA (3.4+). what do you think I should do? I want an M.D. School.

Qualities of a true parasite, or simply, an immoral and unethical being. Wtf did you go through that people in Harlem go through? Did your great grandma get raped by her white masters?

Originally Posted by mclinkin94

I decided that it is unethical (especially) for a future doctor to cheat the system and use semi-true URM status to help get into medical school. I do not deserve to be a doctor and I would not be able to live with myself if I did that. A doctor should be an ethical person. I thank everyone for their response, but I do feel that some answers in this thread were as a result of jealousy rather than truth. In reality, I can get away with such an act-because if I don't I think a couple lawsuits are at hand. People here are very sensitive to discrimination and I definitely could get away with it-but I refuse to become a doctor or even call myself worthy of a medical profession If I did such an act. An morally bankrupt physician is no good person.

Not only are you clearly an unethical parasite (mods shouldn't disagree with this, since it is not an insult, but merely a fact), but you are a hypocritical troll (refer to when I said you made 3 previous posts before, and got replies from everyone who addressed your question directly).

Underline: I disagree, I am African-American by definition not only because I originate from continental Africa but also because of the 1/16 rule. there is no doubt that I do not have sub-Saharan African ancestry mixed in with Egyptian. Did you forget that most Egyptians are mixed race and within those mixes-sub-Saharan ancestry exists. Do you think this is an acceptable explanation to adcom? I feel like it makes the most logical sense.

Oh dear...... oh dear, do you think I can get away with it? oh dear.. hmm.. hmm... how can I cheat the system. ****. I am trying so hard to justify this. ughhhh.. uhhhh.... uhhh.... I wonder if I can get away with it. Maybe if I rationally explain it my palms won't sweat so much.. uhhh....oh god oh god oh god..

Thank you for your answer, however, I feel as if there is a flaw in it.

1. He did not get accepted to that specific school and his application was probably not competitive to receive any other interviews. So don't try to incorporate the fact that he didn't receive other interviews because he he picked African American.

2. I'm sure if the kid mentioned in his supplemental writing how he identifies with African American and why the interview would have went well.

3. I feel that you made this story up to discourage me because the odds of this happening to an EGYPTIAN with the same exact story as me is very slim and the kid could call up the interviewers and explain himself. I do not know why you feel the need to make this up to discourage me. Also: how did they know he was Egyptian if they never did the interview? And If he did the interview, adcom would have asked him about it. I'm sure if there were at least supplements to the application the adcom would understand as to why. You also realize that such acts of discrimination is illegal and can lead to lawsuits-adcoms won't risk that. If they denied him just because of the fact that he picked African American and he considers himself African American, that kid can sue.

CAN WE PLEASE, get a psych physician on here to diagnose this guy. Did I say in-denial already? Dude, you think people are conspiring against you? Making stories up? In CASE they are NOT making stories up, you already have a bunch of reasons lined up for why their non-made-up story is not true already. Riiiiiiight. The world is out to get you. You are the last black person alive, so we are all jealous of your URM status. That must be it.


To end this post constructively, anyone that goes through my previous posts will understand that I am always extremely supportive, kind, and courteous. I always wish people luck, and I wish them utmost success. I am doing the same for you. Sometimes you need to get slapped in the face to wake up into reality. I am saving your butt by preventing you from check marking off that idiotic little box. Then again, judging by your mental condition, maybe you should learn the hard way and loose a year.

Do you really think adcoms take just any "black" person? "Oh hey, he is black. Decent grades. I'll take em over the white guy who has a .5 higher GPA than him". NO. This **** does not happen. The URMs that get acceptances actually get them for legitimate reasons (albeit under lower cut-offs). They are URMs because they are DISADVANTAGED. Their mom was kicked off the bus because she wasn't white. Their grandma never went to school and became a lunch lady because her mom was a slave. Their great grandma who was a slave got raped, beaten, and abused by the KKK. Now the current generation kid grew up in a disadvantaged socioeconomic setting, and had to go through utter **** to get a semi-decent education. I guarantee you that another "brotha" from the Upper East Side will not get the same treatment as the URM I just described. It DOES matter where you come from and what your roots are. That's why they conduct interviews, to understand your history, and learn how you overcame obstacles. Checking off URM does not open any doors what-so-ever. Even if you were black, but didn't endure the crap that other black people endured, I promise you, you would not get the same level of "advantage" as you think you would. How do we apply that to this case? Well in this case you would look like a total douche. Not only are you not black, but your family doesn't have a history of slaves either. If you do... that doesn't apply to the US government, because these are US med schools, and these "URM" things exist to amend the mistakes made by the US government. Not some African dictatorship that existed a hundred years ago. Draw your own conclusions. Oh wait.... you'll probably think this is a conspiracy and will try very hard to circumvent my fallacious logic. What's the point.

Originally Posted by Thego2guy

Do you really think adcoms take just any "black" person? "Oh hey, he is black. Decent grades. I'll take em over the white guy who has a .5 higher GPA than him". NO. This **** does not happen. The URMs that get acceptances actually get them for legitimate reasons (albeit under lower cut-offs). They are URMs because they are DISADVANTAGED. Their mom was kicked off the bus because she wasn't white. Their grandma never went to school and became a lunch lady because her mom was a slave. Their great grandma who was a slave got raped, beaten, and abused by the KKK. Now the current generation kid grew up in a disadvantaged socioeconomic setting, and had to go through utter **** to get a semi-decent education. I guarantee you that another "brotha" from the Upper East Side will not get the same treatment as the URM I just described. It DOES matter where you come from and what your roots are. That's why they conduct interviews, to understand your history, and learn how you overcame obstacles. Checking off URM does not open any doors what-so-ever. Even if you were black, but didn't endure the crap that other black people endured, I promise you, you would not get the same level of "advantage" as you think you would. How do we apply that to this case? Well in this case you would look like a total douche. Not only are you not black, but your family doesn't have a history of slaves either. If you do... that doesn't apply to the US government, because these are US med schools, and these "URM" things exist to amend the mistakes made by the US government. Not some African dictatorship that existed a hundred years ago. Draw your own conclusions. Oh wait.... you'll probably think this is a conspiracy and will try very hard to circumvent my fallacious logic. What's the point.

I've particularly bolded the sentence I wanted to address, but this applies to the whole quote.

The URM status isn't really to help disadvantaged applicants get in. It's more to create diversity within the medical field.

Otherwise, URM would be one of the worst indicators of a "disadvantaged" background. They have your socioeconomic background already. Why not use that? There are tons and tons of disadvantaged whites and disadvantaged ORM's.

The key word is diversity and apparently healthcare, though I disagree with the benefits that URM status actually brings.

Originally Posted by Aerus

I've particularly bolded the sentence I wanted to address, but this applies to the whole quote.

The URM status isn't really to help disadvantaged applicants get in. It's more to create diversity within the medical field.

Otherwise, URM would be one of the worst indicators of a "disadvantaged" background. They have your socioeconomic background already. Why not use that? There are tons and tons of disadvantaged whites and disadvantaged ORM's.

The key word is diversity and apparently healthcare, though I disagree with the benefits that URM status actually brings.

I agree, however what I mentioned in that paragraph was in respect to an applicant who offers the same color to the class spectrum but went through hell and back, and comes from a crappy background. The "black egyptian" here is surely going to be considered less "URM" and more of just as some "minority". (if he gets that far). Rich kids with fat pockets are not underrepresented. Minorities are underrepresented, and so are poor people. So poor minorities (or not necessarily poor, but the ones who come from such backgrounds) pose the most affinity to med schools.

What you said is true, but it is very superficial. "Diversity" carries much more than just that, and it can be broken down into many different things.

Some of you have serious issues. Stop being judgemental pricks and answer his question...

OP, if you identify yourself as AA then check the box. In saying this, I would be prepared to answer any skepticism during an interview if you aren't black. It could be interpreted by adcoms as trying to get an "unfair" advantage (even though technically you aren't lying).

If I were you I would save my self from the potential awkwardness and just check white (it sounds like you look Caucasian/middle eastern). But again I don't know anything about you nor do I know what you look like...

Originally Posted by Thego2guy

I think you are the jealous one.

Lol. You got your answer on literally three previous posts. Literally. Discrete, serious, simple, common sense, straight forward answers, from the cream of the crop here on SDN. Are you calling us stupid? Because when someone asks me something 4 times, I take it as an insult. I am not stupid. We heard you the first three times. We answered you the first three times. Going by this, and your hopeful, optimistic, aggressive, and blind attitude, I think that you are in denial. Some serious denial. Perhaps a little neurotic too. I wouldn't write this on one post, or two, (even though you made three within ONE hour, and then preached about morality), because I would find this post offensive. However, given your CLEAR and OBVIOUS condition, this post is fully appropriate and inoffensive. Think of it as a wake up call.



Qualities of a true parasite, or simply, an immoral and unethical being. Wtf did you go through that people in Harlem go through? Did your great grandma get raped by her white masters?



Not only are you clearly an unethical parasite (mods shouldn't disagree with this, since it is not an insult, but merely a fact), but you are a hypocritical troll (refer to when I said you made 3 previous posts before, and got replies from everyone who addressed your question directly).



Oh dear...... oh dear, do you think I can get away with it? oh dear.. hmm.. hmm... how can I cheat the system. ****. I am trying so hard to justify this. ughhhh.. uhhhh.... uhhh.... I wonder if I can get away with it. Maybe if I rationally explain it my palms won't sweat so much.. uhhh....oh god oh god oh god..



CAN WE PLEASE, get a psych physician on here to diagnose this guy. Did I say in-denial already? Dude, you think people are conspiring against you? Making stories up? In CASE they are NOT making stories up, you already have a bunch of reasons lined up for why their non-made-up story is not true already. Riiiiiiight. The world is out to get you. You are the last black person alive, so we are all jealous of your URM status. That must be it.


To end this post constructively, anyone that goes through my previous posts will understand that I am always extremely supportive, kind, and courteous. I always wish people luck, and I wish them utmost success. I am doing the same for you. Sometimes you need to get slapped in the face to wake up into reality. I am saving your butt by preventing you from check marking off that idiotic little box. Then again, judging by your mental condition, maybe you should learn the hard way and loose a year.

Do you really think adcoms take just any "black" person? "Oh hey, he is black. Decent grades. I'll take em over the white guy who has a .5 higher GPA than him". NO. This **** does not happen. The URMs that get acceptances actually get them for legitimate reasons (albeit under lower cut-offs). They are URMs because they are DISADVANTAGED. Their mom was kicked off the bus because she wasn't white. Their grandma never went to school and became a lunch lady because her mom was a slave. Their great grandma who was a slave got raped, beaten, and abused by the KKK. Now the current generation kid grew up in a disadvantaged socioeconomic setting, and had to go through utter **** to get a semi-decent education. I guarantee you that another "brotha" from the Upper East Side will not get the same treatment as the URM I just described. It DOES matter where you come from and what your roots are. That's why they conduct interviews, to understand your history, and learn how you overcame obstacles. Checking off URM does not open any doors what-so-ever. Even if you were black, but didn't endure the crap that other black people endured, I promise you, you would not get the same level of "advantage" as you think you would. How do we apply that to this case? Well in this case you would look like a total douche. Not only are you not black, but your family doesn't have a history of slaves either. If you do... that doesn't apply to the US government, because these are US med schools, and these "URM" things exist to amend the mistakes made by the US government. Not some African dictatorship that existed a hundred years ago. Draw your own conclusions. Oh wait.... you'll probably think this is a conspiracy and will try very hard to circumvent my fallacious logic. What's the point.

I have selected that I am African American. End of story. Egypt is in Africa, I am African. No need for further debate.

Originally Posted by mclinkin94

Any incidence where people who define themselves as African American due to a known African Descent or being from continental Africa like Egypt. I am Egyptian and I am 100% sure that I have sub-Saharan African ancestry. Just because Egypt is politically affiliated with the middle east does not mean that they are ethnically Arab. Are there any incidences where people got DENIED medical school due to this or had their doctor licence taken away other than the dude from Mozambique.

Please post a source if possible.

Don't tell me what I should do or what you would do, I want to know what will happen if I do.

Please be nice, If you don't have anything nice to say, leave this forum. I do not want criticism, I want answers.

(people in SDN can be vultures sometimes )

Yes, there have been cases where students who listed themselves as African American, for the reasons you described, have been accused of academic dishonesty. I remember reading about one case where a white student from Africa was not only denied an acceptance, he was accused of academic dishonesty at his home institution.

Being denied an acceptance is harder to prove, but I would guess more common. Remember your application only gets you an interview... with someone who is looking at your application. If someone showed up in my office with 'african American' marked on his application and snowy white features I would reject him out of hand.

Originally Posted by Perrotfish

Yes, there have been cases where students who listed themselves as African American, for the reasons you described, have been accused of academic dishonesty. I remember reading about one case where a white student from Africa was not only denied an acceptance, he was accused of academic dishonesty at his home institution.

Being denied an acceptance is harder to prove, but I would guess more common. Remember your application only gets you an interview... with someone who is looking at your application. If someone showed up in my office with 'african American' marked on his application and snowy white features I would reject him out of hand.

I think you have misinterpreted the definition of Academic dishonesty (i.e. cheating, plagiarism). I know a guy in the news who did the same thing and filed a lawsuit against the medical school about this discrimination and won.

One of my classmates did this (Egyptian, self-designated as African-American), and got a 50% scholarship. I heard this right from the individual.

Originally Posted by TheProwler

One of my classmates did this (Egyptian, self-designated as African-American), and got a 50% scholarship. I heard this right from the individual.

were they from south egypt/northern sudan region? There are black egyptians. I think they are called Nubians...

I'm trying to picture showing up at your interview at Howard/Morehouse/Meharry and seeing the look on their faces as they double-check your application against your face.

Originally Posted by Neurosis

were they from south egypt/northern sudan region? There are black egyptians. I think they are called Nubians...

Nope.

OP, I think the point that you are missing in all of your threads is that your perceived advantage of designating yourself African-American is not an advantage. Sure, you have every 'right' to check the AA box, given that those WORDS are the best description of you. But, you personally do not have the community attachments, historical repression, and systematic societal disadvantage of those considered to be part of the African-American community. So, when it is discovered that you don't have those ties, you'll either get the "oh, well, he is African and American so we'll give him the benefit of the doubt and not hold it against him" or you'll get the "hmm, I think this guy is trying to play the system". It's not like medical schools have a quota of spots that need to be filled with people who check AA, so nobody's going to say "Oh, well, he checked the box, so I guess he'll do"

Originally Posted by galaxyx

It's not like medical schools have a quota of spots that need to be filled with people who check AA, so nobody's going to say "Oh, well, he checked the box, so I guess he'll do"

Actually.... they do. The LCME has vague directives to increase diversity in medical school classes.
http://www.marshallparthenon.com/med...6#.T6CsXZ9Yt2A
(School newspaper)
http://www.wsaz.com/news/headlines/M...125427358.html

Originally Posted by galaxyx

OP, I think the point that you are missing in all of your threads is that your perceived advantage of designating yourself African-American is not an advantage. Sure, you have every 'right' to check the AA box, given that those WORDS are the best description of you. But, you personally do not have the community attachments, historical repression, and systematic societal disadvantage of those considered to be part of the African-American community. So, when it is discovered that you don't have those ties, you'll either get the "oh, well, he is African and American so we'll give him the benefit of the doubt and not hold it against him" or you'll get the "hmm, I think this guy is trying to play the system". It's not like medical schools have a quota of spots that need to be filled with people who check AA, so nobody's going to say "Oh, well, he checked the box, so I guess he'll do"

This guy (or girl) is right OP. So what if you are a black Egyptian, when was the last time you actually did something for the black community?

Now, I know I shouldn't be saying this, but heck, there is a way for you to feign that you care about the African population. One of the people I knew who used his "supposed" African heritage did it this way...

Do you have family members in Egypt? Well he had family in Eritrea. He took advantage of this. The summer before he applied to college he went to Eritrea and spent a few weeks with his family member. He took lots of pictures of him "helping" little kids to read and learn how to play soccer. He "built" a water supply for the community. He did the same thing before medical school. Except this time he spent a whole "six months" there. He helped "build" a make shift clinic and collected all the supplies needed for the clinic. He set up a "nonprofit" organization with his family members there as the "home country contacts". Everything was complete garbage, but guess what: he attended a top 5 undergrad and is currently sitting at a top 6 medical school with a 28 on his MCAT.

It's not fair and I hope someday he really does get punished for his actions (the Lord does act in mysterious ways sometimes). The adcoms failed to see through his story and he took well advantage of Affirmitive Action. You can go ahead and do the same. I just laid out a perfect plan for you, do something similar and you are guaranteed acceptance to a top 10 medical school. Only thing is that you will have to live with it your entire life (if you are anything like my friend, this shouldn't be a problem though as he doesn't have a conscious).

Originally Posted by TheProwler

One of my classmates did this (Egyptian, self-designated as African-American), and got a 50% scholarship. I heard this right from the individual.

Yes, OP, as I told you in another thread. Check off that you are African American. Don't be stupid about this. Anything that you can work to your advantage is fair game. I know a number of people who have gamed the system just as the person above did. If you can pass for black, then be black.

Also, stop making threads about every little thing that comes to your head please.

Originally Posted by Knocked Up

Yes, OP, as I told you in another thread. Check off that you are African American. Don't be stupid about this. Anything that you can work to your advantage is fair game. I know a number of people who have gamed the system just as the person above did. If you can pass for black, then be black.

Also, stop making threads about every little thing that comes to your head please.

Um. Is this for real? or is my sarcasm radar broken?

You do know that some schools ask for a photograph along with your secondary, right?

The worse that can happen is that someone will look at your application and decide to judge you as they would judge a non-URM. If you can rise to the top of the heap as a non-URM, listing yourself as "African-American" won't hurt. If you are sub-par in comparison to the top 40% of non-URM applicants, listing yourself as "African-American" will not help.

I'd call myself african-american. I don't think it can hurt you, I actually think it will help you. Egypt is in Africa.

A poster above mentioned that medical schools want black people, not "african americans" per se. While I agree with that assessment, it is not what they ask for on the application, and so if I were the OP I would label myself AA, as you are indeed AA.

Originally Posted by LizzyM

You do know that some schools ask for a photograph along with your secondary, right?

The worse that can happen is that someone will look at your application and decide to judge you as they would judge a non-URM. If you can rise to the top of the heap as a non-URM, listing yourself as "African-American" won't hurt. If you are sub-par in comparison to the top 40% of non-URM applicants, listing yourself as "African-American" will not help.

one of the best answers I got so far. Thank you very much. It is just difficult for me to identify a race, people here in SDN don't understand. I wish to identify with a race in which I could get an advantage with. I am as Caucasian as I am African-American, therefore picking one of which will not be harmful. I have revealed my MCAT (33) and my GPA (3.4+). what do you think I should do? I want an M.D. School.

Originally Posted by Knocked Up

Yes, OP, as I told you in another thread. Check off that you are African American. Don't be stupid about this. Anything that you can work to your advantage is fair game. I know a number of people who have gamed the system just as the person above did. If you can pass for black, then be black.

Also, stop making threads about every little thing that comes to your head please.

100% agreement with you

You're not black, dude. If you don't believe me go and try saying n-word around bunch of black people and see what happens.

Originally Posted by SunsFun

You're not black, dude. If you don't believe me go and try saying n-word around bunch of black people and see what happens.

Oh yeah, that's definitely a black thing. We all say it all the time to each other.

Originally Posted by SunsFun

You're not black, dude. If you don't believe me go and try saying n-word around bunch of black people and see what happens.

They'll make him their king. They'll respect him.

Cookies for everyone who gets the reference.

Edit: By the way, mclinkin94 is African-American. He is American, and he has ancestors from east Africa like every other modern human. Stop being so nit-picky on the definition y'all.

Someone I know is Egyptian and put down that they were African American on AMCAS. He looks caucasian.One of the first questions he got asked at every interview was How did his experience in and contribution to the African American community effect who he is today? Apparently didn't have a good answer as he got rejected from all 4 places he interviewed.

If you can answer that question then go ahead and list yourself as African American.

Edit: By the way, mclinkin94 is African-American. He is American, and he has ancestors from east Africa like every other modern human. Stop being so nit-picky on the definition y'all.[/QUOTE]

My dad is Indian and my mom is from the US. Therefore am I an American Indian?

Originally Posted by waterpolo480586

Edit: By the way, mclinkin94 is African-American. He is American, and he has ancestors from east Africa like every other modern human. Stop being so nit-picky on the definition y'all.

My dad is Indian and my mom is from the US. Therefore am I an American Indian?[/QUOTE]

Difference between you and I:

I am 100% sure I have Sub-Saharan African ancestry as a mixed Egyptian and also because I am from continental Africa. Just because Egypt is Politacally affiliated with the mid-east does NOT mean I am middle eastern. Go back to 6th grade history and relearn the subject.

Here is how it is going to go:

Committee member: How did your experience in and contribution to the African American community effect who you are today?

mclinkin94: DERP

Committee member:

mclinkin94: but, but I am African-American by definition not only because I originate from continental Africa but also because of the 1/16 rule. there is no doubt that I do not have sub-Saharan African ancestry mixed in with Egyptian.

Committee member:

Ok well this is anecdotal evidence but it might answer your question:

A few days ago an adviser at the health professions office was telling me about an EGYPTIAN from my undergrad who had classified himself as African American on AMCAS. He had an interview at one of the state medical schools. After the interview the admissions office called the health professions office and asked why the kid was listed as African American. The office had no real answer because the individual probably did not tell the office he was going to list himself as such. Apparently, and this is all according to the adviser mind you, the kid did not receive any other interviews and was not admitted during that application cycle.

Take from this what you will.

If you honestly, truly felt you were African American and identified with the culture then you wouldn't be having such a dilemma. You have identified yourself as Caucasian previously but even that aside your hesitancy to put it shows you must know to some extent it's not an accurate representation of who you are. Check other and put Egyptian, and then put that you're economically disadvantaged. If you put African American and show up and do not fit because of your features, you will regret it. I once heard of a guy who was Caucasian with a little bit of Mexican, put he was Mexican American and was told to leave the interview for being dishonest.

Just check other and type in Egyptian.