The **NEW & IMPROVED** official low gpa thread...

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Originally Posted by OBGYN2be

I've been a longtime lurker, but with my newly published MCAT score, I think it's time to get assessed. My cgpa is a 2.98 and my sgpa is a 2.62. I got a 31L and have been looking into some of the URM programs. Am I headed towards the right direction?

I think you need to take a good hard look at your sGPA and ask yourself if you have what it takes to pull out A's from this point forward. A 2.62 sGPA is pretty horrendous. Do you have the academic resilience to pull off killer grades in any future coursework?

I believe I do. I think my gpa is an accurate representation of undergrad career but not necessarily my academic capacity. I want to show that through SMPs.

Originally Posted by OBGYN2be

I've been a longtime lurker, but with my newly published MCAT score, I think it's time to get assessed. My cgpa is a 2.98 and my sgpa is a 2.62. I got a 31L and have been looking into some of the URM programs. Am I headed towards the right direction?

Science should be your strong point... What was the breakdown on your MCAT score?

11p/11v/9b

Originally Posted by OBGYN2be

I've been a longtime lurker, but with my newly published MCAT score, I think it's time to get assessed. My cgpa is a 2.98 and my sgpa is a 2.62. I got a 31L and have been looking into some of the URM programs. Am I headed towards the right direction?

Originally Posted by OBGYN2be

I believe I do. I think my gpa is an accurate representation of undergrad career but not necessarily my academic capacity. I want to show that through SMPs.

Originally Posted by OBGYN2be

11p/11v/9b

That MCAT score is great, and in your shoes I'd view it as "permission" to proceed. (We see a whole lot of "with my crap GPA and an imaginary 30+ WAMC?" around here...it's a relief to have a tangible good score to work with.)

But undergrad GPA is really important. Unlike the MCAT, which is a predictor of board scores, undergrad GPA predicts long term classroom capabilities. You need to show that you are capable of doing A work over years of hard science, which is what you'll find in med school. Showing med schools is important, obviously, but showing yourself is also critical. Getting into med school before you're ready to succeed would be a huge mistake.

I don't think you should be looking at SMPs. I think you should be looking at URM postbacs, particularly those that allow multiple years of coursework. Georgetown GEMS, Wake Forest, and the UCalif's have programs, and you can find an old list of more here, category 5. An URM postbac is going to give you a small class and strong support. I suggest you should contact some programs and see if they allow you to do the coursework equivalent of a 2nd bachelors (2 years).

If you're ready to get straight A's in a couple more years of coursework, and you are able to get into a supportive URM postbac this coming Fall, then you'd be set up to apply MD in June 2014 and you wouldn't need to take the MCAT again. You'll want to get going on URM postbac apps right away - deadlines are soon.

Best of luck to you.

Thanks for the recommendation. I really wanted to use my MCAT to show that I am capable. I never looked into the UCs so thanks for that rec. Unfortunately GEMS and Wake Forest are for previous applicants and I've yet to apply. I'll apply to the other programs an I'll keep u guys posted.

Originally Posted by TheWeeIceMan

Hi all. Just found this thread and I have to say it is really informative, so I'd like to contribute my story! I got my BS in engineering in 2010 and I've been doing an informal post-bacc at my local university, taking classes whenever I can afford them. I graduated with a cGPA of 3.4 and a sGPA of 3.25. Currently I'm at a cGPA of 3.5 and a sGPA of 3.4, which will hopefully be a 3.5 after the 2 classes I'm taking this spring. I'm taking the MCAT in 2 weeks and have been averaging a little over 32. I'm hoping to at least hit my average, but you can never be too sure until you get your scores back. I've been volunteering at a hospital the past 2 years, and should have about a year's worth of non-clinical volunteering by the time I apply. My other ECs include 8 years of work at a golf course, with two years as a supervisor, a lot of hours teaching golf to kids, and about 50 hours of shadowing. I'm planning on applying in June, as early as I possibly can. Does this seem like a solid plan, given my stats, or are more post-bac needed? I would really like to just go through this process once, if at all possible. Thanks, and good luck to all the others in this thread!

I'm going to shamelessly bump my old post here for the sake of closure. I just got my MCAT score back yesterday and got a 31O. I'm pretty disappointed in myself, but I've decided I'm going to have a go at this upcoming cycle. Not sure what else to do besides cross my fingers and hope, but if anyone has any further advice, I would love to hear it.

Originally Posted by TheWeeIceMan

I'm going to shamelessly bump my old post here for the sake of closure. I just got my MCAT score back yesterday and got a 31O. I'm pretty disappointed in myself, but I've decided I'm going to have a go at this upcoming cycle. Not sure what else to do besides cross my fingers and hope, but if anyone has any further advice, I would love to hear it.

Twins! I got not one but two 31O's.

What you could plan on is:
1. Apply early and broadly to well researched schools. That means submit on June 1. That means you need to not only read the MSAR that comes out in April, you need to review the admissions pages (read the FAQ!!!) at each med school you target. Have your LORs submitted to AMCAS in July. Pre-write your secondaries (you can find the essay prompts on SDN).
2. Think about an MCAT retake in maybe September.
3. If your MD apps don't get you accepted by maybe October, start SMP apps.
4. Pinch pennies.
5. If you're in California, forget the above. Get into a good SMP for Fall 2012 and don't apply MD until you finish the SMP and have a better MCAT.

Best of luck to you.

Originally Posted by DrMidlife

Twins! I got not one but two 31O's.

What you could plan on is:
1. Apply early and broadly to well researched schools. That means submit on June 1. That means you need to not only read the MSAR that comes out in April, you need to review the admissions pages (read the FAQ!!!) at each med school you target. Have your LORs submitted to AMCAS in July. Pre-write your secondaries (you can find the essay prompts on SDN).
2. Think about an MCAT retake in maybe September.
3. If your MD apps don't get you accepted by maybe October, start SMP apps.
4. Pinch pennies.
5. If you're in California, forget the above. Get into a good SMP for Fall 2012 and don't apply MD until you finish the SMP and have a better MCAT.

Best of luck to you.

Thanks for the response DrMidlife! I will definitely be applying early and broadly. Thankfully, I am not a California resident (Wisconsin, for the record). I do have money secured for applying this cycle to as many schools as necessary (maybe ~30?), but if I don't get in, all bets are off for the following cycle. At that point, even though I really want to persue medical school, I might consider trying to find an engineering job and re-visit med school after saving up some money.

Also, I just took a look through your MDapps and wanted to say congrats. I hope you are enjoying medical school.

Originally Posted by DrMidlife

Twins! I got not one but two 31O's.

What you could plan on is:
1. Apply early and broadly to well researched schools. That means submit on June 1. That means you need to not only read the MSAR that comes out in April, you need to review the admissions pages (read the FAQ!!!) at each med school you target. Have your LORs submitted to AMCAS in July. Pre-write your secondaries (you can find the essay prompts on SDN).
2. Think about an MCAT retake in maybe September.
3. If your MD apps don't get you accepted by maybe October, start SMP apps.
4. Pinch pennies.
5. If you're in California, forget the above. Get into a good SMP for Fall 2012 and don't apply MD until you finish the SMP and have a better MCAT.

Best of luck to you.

I forgot to address this in my last post. Regarding #2, would the MCAT retake be for the purpose of update letters to schools who have either not made a decision or who have waitlisted me, or are you referring to the following cycle? The reason I ask is because my searching around SDN has led me to the impression that taking the MCAT 3 times is a sort of a "no no", unless I could jump to the mid-30s. Would the benefit of a more balanced score (maybe +1 or 2 ) outweight the stigma of a 3rd attempt?

Originally Posted by TheWeeIceMan

I forgot to address this in my last post. Regarding #2, would the MCAT retake be for the purpose of update letters to schools who have either not made a decision or who have waitlisted me, or are you referring to the following cycle? The reason I ask is because my searching around SDN has led me to the impression that taking the MCAT 3 times is a sort of a "no no", unless I could jump to the mid-30s. Would the benefit of a more balanced score (maybe +1 or 2 ) outweight the stigma of a 3rd attempt?

If you don't get an MD acceptance, and you need to do an SMP, you'll want to also do anything and everything in your power to improve your app. A few more MCAT points is one of the few things (possibly) under your control.

31O is good for SMPs, but if you get a few more points ahead of SMP apps, that helps you have lots of SMPs to choose from.

Best of luck to you.

Originally Posted by DrMidlife

If you don't get an MD acceptance, and you need to do an SMP, you'll want to also do anything and everything in your power to improve your app. A few more MCAT points is one of the few things (possibly) under your control.

31O is good for SMPs, but if you get a few more points ahead of SMP apps, that helps you have lots of SMPs to choose from.

Best of luck to you.

Okay, that makes sense. Thanks again for the help DrMidlife.

Hi. I have a 2.98 GPA currently as a third-year. I know I definitely need to get my GPA above a 3.0 at least, but my question is what's the best way to do it?

1. Post-bacc?
2. SMP?
3. Staying at my university 1-2 more years (delaying gradation)?
4. Other option?

I'm currently thinking #3. I was thinking a minor in business, but that won't bring up my science GPA. I did poorly in general chemistry 2, organic chemistry and some upper-level biology courses like microbiology and human biology. Should I retake those at my current university or retake those at a post-bacc program?

I'd welcome any advice.

Originally Posted by Disaster

I'm currently thinking #3.

Yes, but think bigger. You need to do a multiple year strong performance in lots of hard sciences, to demonstrate to med schools and to yourself that you can handle the rigors of med school. Retaking some classes isn't that performance. A 2nd bachelors (or the addition of a 2nd major or a couple of minors) might be that performance.

What do you need to do to get straight A's, for a really long time, in really hard classes, mostly science? That's the big question I encourage you to prioritize.

Originally Posted by Disaster

I did poorly in general chemistry 2, organic chemistry and some upper-level biology courses like microbiology and human biology. Should I retake those at my current university or retake those at a post-bacc program?

Do whatever gets you a couple years of mostly A's in mostly hard science. Also: how about straight A's this semester? That would be a great first step.

Look at how you'll pay for all this. Student loans for 5th year and beyond are limited. Private loans are a disaster if you go on to med school - they'll grow out of control and you don't get any forbearance in residency.

Look at transferring to another school after June. Do you need to be in smaller classes? In a different town, closer or farther from your parents? Do you need to be at a school that offers more upper div science? Get apps done right away if so - deadlines are probably already here.

Best of luck to you.

Originally Posted by DrMidlife

Retaking some classes isn't that performance. A 2nd bachelors (or the addition of a 2nd major or a couple of minors) might be that performance.

What about a post-bacc? I've read that post-baccs can help people with low GPAs. With regard to a second major, could that be a non-science major? It's the biology and chemistry courses that I've made C's and B-'s in, but I've made A's in non-science classes. I'm worried that if I just take non-science classes to act as GPA boosters, admissions will notice a discrepancy between my sGPA and cGPA, and will figure I took courses just to "stuff" my cGPA. Is this a problem or a solution?

Originally Posted by DrMidlife

Look at how you'll pay for all this.

I'm blessed with very supportive parents who're financially stable. That being said, your point is duly noted; I don't want to throw money down the sink where I can help it.

Originally Posted by DrMidlife

What do you need to do to get straight A's, for a really long time, in really hard classes, mostly science? That's the big question I encourage you to prioritize.

This is a question that's puzzled me for some time. It's bizarre because my grades are all over the place. In non-science classes (e.g. classics and government), I made easy A's. In my labs, I made A's. Even in physics, which I abhor and consider myself unproficient in, the lowest grade I've made was a B+. It's the biology & chemistry courses that are killing me, with an average of C+. It's frustrating because I've changed study habits but can't score consistently. A learning specialist said I have exam anxiety, and a few professors have said that I just haven't found what it takes to "click" yet.

But that's a personal problem, and I didn't post here to mope. While I do hope that eventually I can do well in a chemistry class, my question is what's a good idea until I find what it takes to "click?"

For instance, how does retaking courses before graduation compare to taking them after graduation (post-bacc)? I've heard that it's more difficult to raise your GPA after graduation than before. But I've also heard that joining the workforce for a bit (so, after I've my degree) is not a bad idea. What are your thoughts?

Originally Posted by DrMidlife

Look at transferring to another school after June.

I'm that guy who studies for hours every day but still scores below average on the exams . I'm not the only one who has that problem, I imagine. But now that I'm about to be in my fourth year, and after having put in all my effort and know-how into improving my grades and still falling short, this is a question I'm starting to seriously consider.

Originally Posted by DrMidlife

Best of luck to you.

Thank you very much, and thank you for your thoughts . I'm just trying to weigh all my options.

Hey everyone,

I'm a Canadian applicant from BC so would like to ask a question about how US schools look at non-degree courses.

I graduated from my undergrad 2 years ago, pretty low GPA (3.4ish) and science GPA even lower. I'm going to a local university this summer as a "non-degree" student and am planning to take some prereqs (ie calculus, physics...and plan on killing them!!). Do I need to take a full course-load for US schools to consider it as part of my undergrad GPA, or do they accept one or two courses into that average?

Any help would be really appreciated!!

Thanks!

Hello, long time lurker and first time poster here I finally caved in and registered to gauge my chances at applying for a post-bacc program!

I have a ~2.75 in both cGPA and sGPA. I did relatively well early on in freshman/sophomore year, but personal problems (failed relationship, depression, passing away of a close relative, minor relapse into depression) hit my GPA hard. Much of the reason why I want to apply to a post-bacc program is to bring up the awful GPA and/or to prove that I can handle graduate-level coursework, and from what I gathered a post-bacc was one way to go about those goals.

I have a 27Q MCAT (8V, 9P, 10B), which I took shortly after I graduated after I found out that I needed an MCAT score to get into a program I was interested in. I know it's not an optimal score, as I didn't have time to prepare and the requirement caught me off guard at the time, but it was something that needed to be done and I did it. I definitely plan on retaking it whenever chance I can.

My extracurriculars are solid. I have some medical experience from volunteering at hospitals and the local fire department as part of first response, 200+ hours in each. I also have a lot of non-medical work experience, which helps I guess? (stuff like camp counselor, restaurant kitchen staff, tutor, etc.)

My recommendations are, surprisingly enough, solid as well. They all come from people who knew me pre- and post-depression, so they still hold me in a positive light. I consider myself fairly lucky in that regard, I guess :P

Let me know what you guys think, please, in regards to post-bacc or anything else for that matter! Many thanks in advance for all your help!

Hello everyone.. I've been reading the threads for some time now and appreciate all the insight you all share. I'm considering a career change into medicine. Currently, I work in investment management but am getting burned out and disinterested. I have always been interested in medicine and science but never pursued it. Prior to my work in finance I worked as a health care advocate, battling insurance companies on behalf of patients.

Based on what I've been reading here at the forums, I don't know if I have a realistic chance at a post bac or eve med school. I want to solicit some opinions here and see what people think.
A little about me.. dual major undergrad in economics and health policy. Ugpa 2.8. Crappy, I know. I wasn't ready for school.. but I did it. Grades trend strongly upwards.
I'm 1/4 of the way through an MBA program (while working full time). From what I've read, graduate GPA won't matter for admissions for med school, however, my GPA is currently a 3.8. I performed strongly on the GREs, particularly the quantitative section. I also have volunteered ~ 500 hours at The Hospital of the University of Pennsylvania.

Do I have any shot at a postbac program, specifically in or around philadelphia? Will postbac programs also consider graduate GPAs for admissions? Would it be better to do post bac on my own and not thru any official program? Thanks for your help!

Originally Posted by AlienJola

I have a ~2.75 in both cGPA and sGPA. I did relatively well early on in freshman/sophomore year, but personal problems (failed relationship, depression, passing away of a close relative, minor relapse into depression) hit my GPA hard. Much of the reason why I want to apply to a post-bacc program is to bring up the awful GPA and/or to prove that I can handle graduate-level coursework, and from what I gathered a post-bacc was one way to go about those goals.

I have a 27Q MCAT (8V, 9P, 10B), which I took shortly after I graduated after I found out that I needed an MCAT score to get into a program I was interested in. I know it's not an optimal score, as I didn't have time to prepare and the requirement caught me off guard at the time, but it was something that needed to be done and I did it. I definitely plan on retaking it whenever chance I can.

As you said, GPA needs some work. The problem is budging both when you've already completed at least 32 credit hours of sGPA courses and 120 credit hours of cGPA courses. Also, downward trend is no bueno. I'm going to guess you're going to want to do a year or two of solid upper lever science coursework. This will serve several purposes.
1. It will reteach you how to study and earn As. Make no mistake, there's no room for Bs from here on out.
2. It will show adcoms that you can handle upper level science coursework. This makes an even more compelling statement if you find ways to stay super busy while enrolled. I firmly believe that anyone can get an A in one or two classes if that's the only thing their doing. 8 credits + working + research + volunteering. . . now that makes a statement
3. While it's not a steadfast rule, there are programs with a hard cutoff at 3.0. You mention you have great LORs. That's awesome - too many people overlook the importance of solid recommendations. That said, if you don't meet the GPA/MCAT sliding scale cutoff they'll never get read, which is a bummer.

Oh, and on that note, as you said you're going to want to retake your MCAT. 27 is, to the best of my knowledge, below both the DO and MD average. Take as many months as necessary to set yourself up for success.

If you're looking for a program, I'd recommend something that provides flexibility while remaining affordable.

Originally Posted by mack123

Hello everyone.. I've been reading the threads for some time now and appreciate all the insight you all share. I'm considering a career change into medicine. Currently, I work in investment management but am getting burned out and disinterested. I have always been interested in medicine and science but never pursued it. Prior to my work in finance I worked as a health care advocate, battling insurance companies on behalf of patients.

Based on what I've been reading here at the forums, I don't know if I have a realistic chance at a post bac or eve med school. I want to solicit some opinions here and see what people think.
A little about me.. dual major undergrad in economics and health policy. Ugpa 2.8. Crappy, I know. I wasn't ready for school.. but I did it. Grades trend strongly upwards.
I'm 1/4 of the way through an MBA program (while working full time). From what I've read, graduate GPA won't matter for admissions for med school, however, my GPA is currently a 3.8. I performed strongly on the GREs, particularly the quantitative section. I also have volunteered ~ 500 hours at The Hospital of the University of Pennsylvania.

Do I have any shot at a postbac program, specifically in or around philadelphia? Will postbac programs also consider graduate GPAs for admissions? Would it be better to do post bac on my own and not thru any official program? Thanks for your help!

From what I've read around here, graduate GPA (outside of SMPs) are viewed as nice extracurricular activities. Good grades may not necessarily help you, but it certainly won't hurt you. The reason behind this is that they have no clue as to what type of grading policy your program has instituted. I know people who have waltzed through their MBA with a 3.9/4.0, while others have fought tooth and nail for a 3.0.

I'm not sure about your competitiveness for the Philly programs. Have you taken any undergraduate science classes? What was your sGPA in undergrad? All GPA numbers were calculated using the AMCAS calculator (google is your friend), right? Do you want a less-structured, do-it-yourself type program or a formal, highly structured one?

Originally Posted by Disaster

What about a post-bacc? I've read that post-baccs can help people with low GPAs.

"Post-bacc" is not a helpful term here - all it means is taking more classes after you have a bachelors. Doing a 2nd bachelors is a postbac. Doing Harvard Extension or Berkeley Extension is a postbac. Taking classes at a CC (not too many!) is a postbac. Big name formal structured premed programs like Bryn Mawr/Goucher/Scripps are postbacs (into which you can't get because your GPA is too low). Some people call SMPs postbacs (which makes no sense if there's a masters degree on the other side).

What you need is to find a school (or schools) that will let you take a TON of science coursework, where you have the opportunity to get a TON of A's. I suggest you need at least one more year of full time undergrad (all science) probably followed by an SMP, if you want to get into a US MD school. If you want to go to a DO school, look into the MS programs hosted at DO schools.

Originally Posted by Disaster

With regard to a second major, could that be a non-science major? It's the biology and chemistry courses that I've made C's and B-'s in, but I've made A's in non-science classes. I'm worried that if I just take non-science classes to act as GPA boosters, admissions will notice a discrepancy between my sGPA and cGPA, and will figure I took courses just to "stuff" my cGPA. Is this a problem or a solution?

If you want to go to law school, sure, do non-science. But if you want to go to med school, then you need to prove you can get a lot of A's in a very heavy load of hard science coursework over a long period of time.

Originally Posted by Disaster

While I do hope that eventually I can do well in a chemistry class, my question is what's a good idea until I find what it takes to "click?"

If you've got money to spend, you could get a chemistry grad student to work with you individually as if you're taking a class, but without affecting your GPA.

But come on. You're talking about med school and you're talking about having no clue how to get A's in science. If you want to figure this out, get serious. Make what you want what you need. Find the 19 year olds who get great grades on exams and interrogate them about exactly what, in detail, they do to get those great grades on exams. Go take a couple of lower level math/stats/science classes at a CC to get more practice. Spend all your spare time on khanacademy. Question everything in what happens to you during a test and tell yourself the truth. You are very simply not going to find a pill or a technique that removes this problem: you have to figure it out.

Originally Posted by Disaster

For instance, how does retaking courses before graduation compare to taking them after graduation (post-bacc)?

An MD/DO app calculates your cumulative undergrad GPA including postbac courses. It also breaks your undergrad GPA into fr/so/jr/sr/pb. It also divides all of these into science, non-science and overall. And then med schools can do whatever they want with those numbers. You'd need to look through some med school admissions website FAQs to see specific weightings.

Originally Posted by Disaster

I've heard that it's more difficult to raise your GPA after graduation than before.

OK, why would that be true? Is there something other than math going on in a GPA calc? No. Is there something magical about graduating that changes the math in a GPA calc? No. What's true is that a big pile of numbers that averages out to a 3 stays very close to a 3 as you throw 4's on that pile. If it took you 4 years to get a 3.0, and you do 4 more years at a 4.0, you'd end up with a 3.5. It's just math.

Originally Posted by Disaster

But I've also heard that joining the workforce for a bit (so, after I've my degree) is not a bad idea. What are your thoughts?

Getting a job and paying your own rent is a very good idea for anybody who wants to learn about responsibility and independence. Those things lead to maturity, and they lead to opportunities for leadership. Maturity, leadership, responsibility, and independence are great things for a doctor to have.

Best of luck to you.

Originally Posted by Caracci

I'm a Canadian applicant from BC so would like to ask a question about how US schools look at non-degree courses.

Every college course you ever take is considered in med school admissions. You're required to submit every transcript when you apply. Whether you get a degree or not isn't part of GPA calcs.

The instruction manual for AMCAS explains all of this quite well. https://www.aamc.org/students/applyi.../how_to_apply/

Best of luck to you.

Originally Posted by AlienJola

I have a ~2.75 in both cGPA and sGPA. I did relatively well early on in freshman/sophomore year, but personal problems (failed relationship, depression, passing away of a close relative, minor relapse into depression) hit my GPA hard. Much of the reason why I want to apply to a post-bacc program is to bring up the awful GPA and/or to prove that I can handle graduate-level coursework, and from what I gathered a post-bacc was one way to go about those goals.

Whatever you mean by "postbac program", what you need is a whole bunch of A's in a whole bunch of additional undergrad classes, mostly hard science.

From a 2.75, you need at least 2 more years (60+ semester hours) of undergrad, for two reasons. Reason #1: less than 2 years of work won't be enough to get you up over 3.0. If you don't get up over 3.0, you will have a much harder time getting med schools (or SMPs) to view you as viable. Reason #2: you need to show that you can do very well over multiple years of difficult coursework, because that's what med school is, and that's what med school admissions committees are looking for in applicants.

As you obsessively read the existing, thorough information in this forum, you'll see how thousands of people have attacked this exact problem. A 2nd bachelors is an option that gives you some federal loans, and registration priority, and other benefits like advising and clubs and such. Harvard Extension and Berkeley Extension and UT Dallas are examples of non-degree programs that offer some structure and tons of science. DO schools offer traditional grad study that gets people into med school.

The standard, predictable, reliable formula for getting into med school does not include steps for recovering from a low GPA. You have to be considerably more mature and resourceful than a squeaky-clean 21 year old who never did anything wrong.

You'll have to do the work to figure out how to pay for additional undergrad schooling. Avoid credit cards and avoid private loans, because these are unsustainable in med ed.

Best of luck to you.

Originally Posted by mack123

Prior to my work in finance I worked as a health care advocate, battling insurance companies on behalf of patients.

Love that EC.

Originally Posted by mack123

Based on what I've been reading here at the forums, I don't know if I have a realistic chance at a post bac or eve med school. I want to solicit some opinions here and see what people think.

You need to demonstrate that you can succeed under a heavy undergrad load of mostly science to get into med school. As in the above 3 posts, there are lots of ways to acquire that heavy undergrad load of mostly science.

Originally Posted by mack123

Grades trend strongly upwards.

Good. If you haven't taken any science, the good news is that your science GPA could be nice and high. The bad news is that the math & science you need to prepare for med school is likely much more difficult than any coursework you've ever seen, so getting A's isn't a given.

Originally Posted by mack123

I'm 1/4 of the way through an MBA program (while working full time). From what I've read, graduate GPA won't matter for admissions for med school, however, my GPA is currently a 3.8.

An MBA is completely non-predictive of medical school performance, and thus it has no bearing on the med school admissions impact of your undergrad GPA. If your MBA GPA was low, that would be a red flag.

If you're able to produce a demonstration of academic prowess in undergrad science, you will then get the opportunity to show how interesting you are (in addition to being a credible applicant) because you have a deep understanding of health policy/econ/biz. Keep up with current events by following NYT/WSJ health news.

Best of luck to you.

I have cgpa of 2.85, sgpa of 3.45 undergrad, and am currently in grad program in cellular biology. I did no science and got bad grades in all of those classes for the first 2.5 years undergrad. I knocked out all my pre reqs in the next 2.5 years, taking 3-4 science courses per semester with 2 upper level courses in there. I received B's and above in all of my science work. I took the Mcat 4 years ago and got 25o, and know I will do better 2nd time around. I'm doing research and taking hard sciences in grad school with >3.5gpa. Do I have a shot at D.O. Without retaking classes like french or theater crafts from 7+ years ago?

Originally Posted by mfas

I have cgpa of 2.85, sgpa of 3.45 undergrad, and am currently in grad program in cellular biology. I did no science and got bad grades in all of those classes for the first 2.5 years undergrad. I knocked out all my pre reqs in the next 2.5 years, taking 3-4 science courses per semester with 2 upper level courses in there. I received B's and above in all of my science work. I took the Mcat 4 years ago and got 25o, and know I will do better 2nd time around. I'm doing research and taking hard sciences in grad school with >3.5gpa. Do I have a shot at D.O. Without retaking classes like french or theater crafts from 7+ years ago?

Yeah, get that MCAT as high as you can and you might be okay. Definitely over 30 if you want confidence.

DMU has a hard 3.0 cutoff, so don't bother there. But other DO schools are going to look at your upward trend, your grad work, and your MCAT and take you seriously.

Best of luck to you.

Originally Posted by DrMidlife

Yeah, get that MCAT as high as you can and you might be okay. Definitely over 30 if you want confidence.

DMU has a hard 3.0 cutoff, so don't bother there. But other DO schools are going to look at your upward trend, your grad work, and your MCAT and take you seriously.

Best of luck to you.

Thank you.

I have wanted to hear something like this for a while and all the number lovers have said no! my position academically made sense that I look competitive barring all my early issues. I didn't think that retaking the non science courses killing my gpa made sense considering how old they are. I have began studying and will be ready to beast the mcat in june to hopefully be fully applied with these fresh scores in July.

Heres to hope.

This is the most interesting thread. All sorts of folks with all kinds of origins and outlooks. I flamed out of college my first time around ten years ago. I didn't even withdraw from my last semester. So, after recently finishing my undergrad degree, my cgpa is 3.17 and my sgpa is 3.31. On the AMCAS application, it looks like this for cgpa/sgpa by year:
Freshman: 1.15/1.29, Sophomore: 2.22/1.71, Junior: 4.00/4.00, Senior: 3.73/3.67

So, my grades tell the story that I am able to get the results when I have focus, so I'm not too worried about perception. What I am worried about is that my low gpa will make a school not want me so as to not hurt their statistics. My MCAT is a 38Q, taken almost 1 year ago. Will my high test score be enough to balance out my crap gpa? Thanks to anyone with thoughts on this.

Originally Posted by tyrionlannister

This is the most interesting thread. All sorts of folks with all kinds of origins and outlooks. I flamed out of college my first time around ten years ago. I didn't even withdraw from my last semester. So, after recently finishing my undergrad degree, my cgpa is 3.17 and my sgpa is 3.31. On the AMCAS application, it looks like this for cgpa/sgpa by year:
Freshman: 1.15/1.29, Sophomore: 2.22/1.71, Junior: 4.00/4.00, Senior: 3.73/3.67

So, my grades tell the story that I am able to get the results when I have focus, so I'm not too worried about perception. What I am worried about is that my low gpa will make a school not want me so as to not hurt their statistics. My MCAT is a 38Q, taken almost 1 year ago. Will my high test score be enough to balance out my crap gpa? Thanks to anyone with thoughts on this.

Do you always pay your debts?

All kidding aside I think if you apply broadly and early you stand a good chance of earning an acceptance.

Originally Posted by tyrionlannister

This is the most interesting thread. All sorts of folks with all kinds of origins and outlooks. I flamed out of college my first time around ten years ago. I didn't even withdraw from my last semester. So, after recently finishing my undergrad degree, my cgpa is 3.17 and my sgpa is 3.31. On the AMCAS application, it looks like this for cgpa/sgpa by year:
Freshman: 1.15/1.29, Sophomore: 2.22/1.71, Junior: 4.00/4.00, Senior: 3.73/3.67

So, my grades tell the story that I am able to get the results when I have focus, so I'm not too worried about perception. What I am worried about is that my low gpa will make a school not want me so as to not hurt their statistics. My MCAT is a 38Q, taken almost 1 year ago. Will my high test score be enough to balance out my crap gpa? Thanks to anyone with thoughts on this.

That's a great last 2 years, and I think your story will have folks rooting for you. Your MD app results will be hit or miss, because you have no control over what kind of eyeballs will review your app. I definitely think you should apply this June with the best app you can put together, so that you don't "lose" that 38Q.

See the reapplicant forum for great coverage of app mistakes to avoid. You can't control your GPA calc, but you can control lots of other things that sink the unprepared. If you don't have a ton of clinical exposure yet, start right away - like this afternoon.

Best of luck to you.

Originally Posted by DrMidlife

That's a great last 2 years, and I think your story will have folks rooting for you. Your MD app results will be hit or miss, because you have no control over what kind of eyeballs will review your app. I definitely think you should apply this June with the best app you can put together, so that you don't "lose" that 38Q.

See the reapplicant forum for great coverage of app mistakes to avoid. You can't control your GPA calc, but you can control lots of other things that sink the unprepared. If you don't have a ton of clinical exposure yet, start right away - like this afternoon.

Best of luck to you.

Thanks for the encouraging words. I've been a full-time clinical hemodialysis technician for 4 and 1/2 years, so I'm hoping that works in my favor as well.

Hey forum,

I was reviewing today my academic transcripts as I am preparing to begin this summer a DIY postbac. Having looked before at my transcript, I thought my cGPA was higher than it actually is--the mistake I made before was looking at my "institution GPA," which is a 3.45; however, when combined with my GPA from my first stint in college (10 years ago), my overall GPA is a meager 3.15 (yikes!); I also have 10 W's (mostly from my first go-around with college).

So, with that said, I am officially joining the Low GPA thread.

I just went today from feeling like I had a fighting chance to get into med school, to feeling rather like I now have no chance.

I need someone to douse me with reality.

I graduate in May, and planned to begin right thereafter with a postbac. Should I redirect myself now and save time and money, taking a different direction? Am I out of the running?

I've been told 7 W's is the absolute cutoff point.

Thanks for any feedback. I'm genuinely grateful.

--EDIT-- If my post should be moved to the WAMC thread, let me know. I'll remove my text and repost there. Thanks.

There are some schools that will screen your application out based on things like a <3.2gpa or a low MCAT, but there are also many great schools that don't engage in these screening practices. Your application as a whole tells a story about who you are, and some adcoms look for the (relatively common) situation where someone doesn't find their direction until a little later in life. If you can show them you have the ability with good recent grades in tough course loads and good MCAT scores, and if you can show them you have the will with clinical experience, then that's a story that's convincing. Withdraws from a decade ago don't matter if they obviously don't reflect who you are now.

Originally Posted by slp2doc

So, with that said, I am officially joining the Low GPA thread.

I just went today from feeling like I had a fighting chance to get into med school, to feeling rather like I now have no chance.

If you read this low GPA thread, you'll learn stuff about your chances. There have been vast hordes of 3.15's who asked WAMC and were answered in this thread. Many go on to med school after doing the work to recover.

Originally Posted by slp2doc

I graduate in May, and planned to begin right thereafter with a postbac. Should I redirect myself now and save time and money, taking a different direction? Am I out of the running?

If you're willing to quit, then quit. Otherwise, go after a GPA comeback like your career depends on it (because it does).

Originally Posted by slp2doc

I've been told 7 W's is the absolute cutoff point.

There's no "cutoff" for W's much less an absolute cutoff. I think I had 7 or 8. Don't get any more. Be able to explain what you learned & why it won't happen again (even though it was 10 years ago).

Best of luck to you.

Originally Posted by tyrionlannister

Withdraws from a decade ago don't matter if they obviously don't reflect who you are now.

Here's a fun story I like to tell about 20 year old grades and med school interviews.

I paid for a plane ticket and a hotel room and got all up in my suit and went to an interview. It was a normal interview day until a director on the admissions staff (somebody with an education degree who's never opened a chem textbook) sat me down to go through my transcripts, line by line. Anything lower than a B required an explanation. This was in 2007. My first college transcript is from 1984.

Do you think I can remember why I even registered to take that sign language class I dropped in 1984, much less why I dropped it? Correct, I do not.

This was at a DO school, by the way.

The above is just an anomalous anecdote so that people don't get the impression that nobody will care about an old W. Anecdote notwithstanding, when adcoms are going through 5000 apps, they are not absorbing the age of a college record until after they have thought "hey what's with all these W's?!?" Point being: have an answer to that question and provide as many fresh counterexamples as you can.

Best of luck to you.

Thanks for the info. I recalculated my GPA using AACOMAS and grade replacement, and I end up with a 2.85. A little better haha. I’m trying to come up with a plan of action for myself and I had some follow up questions.

As far as grade replacement for AACOMAS, my understanding is that the class has to be the same # of credits with a similar course description. Am I right in thinking that implies that the courses can be from different institutions? So, if I got a lousy grade in Spanish, I could retake it at a CC and use that grade instead for GPA calculation?

Also, is it preferable to take the science classes as a full course load as opposed to one or two per semester? I was thinking I may start with 1 or 2 at a time, and then switch to a full course load.


Here’s my tentative plan:
Stop wasting my time with MBA classes that I’m no longer interested in
Shadow a physician or two (DOs)
Take a couple courses at CC for grade replacement purposes
Find some clinical or hospital volunteering programs
Take a science class at local 4 year
If I do well, quit job
Take science classes full time.
Take MCATs and apply DO.

Any suggestions or comments? Thanks again

Originally Posted by mack123

As far as grade replacement for AACOMAS, my understanding is that the class has to be the same # of credits with a similar course description. Am I right in thinking that implies that the courses can be from different institutions? So, if I got a lousy grade in Spanish, I could retake it at a CC and use that grade instead for GPA calculation?

Yes, you can do retakes at a different school. When you apply, you designate what courses are repeats. The credits don't have to match exactly, nor do the course descriptions. Worst case, you get denied, and you make a polite beseeching phone call.

Originally Posted by mack123

Also, is it preferable to take the science classes as a full course load as opposed to one or two per semester? I was thinking I may start with 1 or 2 at a time, and then switch to a full course load.

Sure, figure out how to get A's, then get tons of 'em.

Originally Posted by mack123

Here’s my tentative plan:
Stop wasting my time with MBA classes that I’m no longer interested in
Shadow a physician or two (DOs)
Take a couple courses at CC for grade replacement purposes
Find some clinical or hospital volunteering programs
Take a science class at local 4 year
If I do well, quit job
Take science classes full time.
Take MCATs and apply DO.

Looks good. Move volunteering up to the front though. Volunteering should be a gateway to shadowing and to growing a mature comprehension of the job.

Best of luck to you.

Hey everyone, I'm planning to apply to post-bacs/SMPs, and I was wondering whether I would be able to get into the list of schools that I have with my stats, which are:


UCLA Biochemistry
GPA: 3.2
MCAT: (36R) 13P 13V 10B
State: CA

ECs:
2008 Summer Microbiology research at Academica Sinica Gov't lab in Taiwan
2008 physics paper co-authored, published and presented at WCECS in Berkeley
-Patent granted
2009 Summer Neuro research at Stanford
2010 Summer+Fall Clinical research on spinal fusion at Cedar Sinai
2010-2012 biochem/med research at UCLA (maybe publication)
2010-2012 On the referrals committee of a healthcare club that collaborates with the school of medicine and the school of nursing to provide free health screenings and promote health ed. to the poor areas of LA county.
2011 Co-founded nonprofit org for organ donors
2009-2011 UCLA hospital volunteering
2006-2012 Co-founder/president (2006-2007) of org that raises awareness and donations for crises in other countries (e.g. darfur). Sponsored by World Vision
2011-2012: member of an entrepreneurial fraternity


I haven't dared apply to med schools because of my low gpa, but after looking at the small class sizes for postbac/SMPs, I'm getting nervous that I wouldn't be able to get into one of them either. My list of schools I'm applying to are:

Boston University: rolling admissions until July 1, 2012
Georgetown University: May 15th, 2012
GeorgeSquared: June 15th, 2012
Cincinnati: June 1, 2012
EVMS (Virginia): April 1, 2012
Tufts Deadline: July 15, 2012
Temple University: May 15, 2012
USF IMS: March 2, 2012
Drexel IMS: applications accepted year-round
VCU: July 1, 2012
RFU: June 1, 2012
NYMC: July 1, 2012?
Toledo: May 1, 2012
UMDNJ Masters in Biomed Sciences: June 1, 2012
USC: June 15, 2012

--Non SMPs--
Loyola (Chicago): July 15, 2012 (May 15 soft deadline)
UPenn: July 15
UMich Physiology: April 30, 2012
Case Western Masters in Med Phys.******: June 1, 2012
Mt. Sinai: June 1, 2012
Columbia: June 15, 2012

I know I'm applying late, as I didn't really think seriously about post-bacs until recently...but do I have a chance? Or should I start preparing to do something for next year instead?

Hey guys, wanted some advice on what to do next.

I have a 3.3cgpa, ~3.0sgpa, and am planning to retake MCAT at the end of April after taking Kaplan this semester (I got a 30 the first time around self-studying, but I was hoping to compensate my low gpa by taking a course and doing better - 36 is realistic at this point).

Originally I was planning to just apply to med schools broadly in June, and apply concurrently to a post-bacc to boost my gpa and show productivity during the application cycle. However, after calculating some numbers, I think I would have to get solid As for the full year (I was planning on doing the Berkeley post-bacc) and it would still only bring my gpa up to ~3.48. A year of A-s would only raise it to a 3.37. I think I just have too many units as an undergrad already, and it's dampening chances of raising my gpa substantially within a year.

So I went back thinking about applying to SMPs (I know it's late, so as an aside - how late is too late??) Alsaire's list above is a great starting point for me (thank you!) and I'll await responses to his post. My PIs suggest doing a year of research + publications + more clinical hours to show direct contributions to the medical field, but while that may be great, those things do not compensate for my low sGPA or prove to adcoms that I can handle med school courses.

Any advice will be greatly appreciated. You guys are the best.

I would prefer entry into an allopathic medical school. Here are my demographics and my statistics.

In High School I was an A student

College:

Senior Biology Major
Math Minor
Entry Date: Fall 2007
Expected graduation date: Fall 2012 (I only took on average 12-13 hours a semester. I could not afford summer classes)
cumulative GPA: 2.7 (I worked very hard to pull this up from a 2.1)
last 60 hours thus far: 2.9gpa
I retook classes that I did poorly in. My grades went from Ds to A's and B+'s
Began college as an honors student, I left after my grades dropped because of mistakes.
Currently 1 Withdrawal on my record

Teaching Experience:
Teach Houston experience (offers teaching experience to students) Creating lesson plans
Citizen Schools - Citizen schools teacher (Creating lesson plans)
Tutor for the TAKS test
Multiple positions as a tutor

Major Community Service Experiences:
-Children's Defense Fund Freedom Schools (2 consecutive years thus far) - this also offered teaching experience and Social Work experience.
-My campus ministry (3 consecutive years thus far)- i serve as the campus liaison. I also plan programs and events for the ministry.
-A social sorority (3.5 years) - currently focusing on school
-Peer tutor for my scholarship program

Awards:
-Deans list twice in my academic career
-Houston Louis Stokes Minority Participation Scholar

Work Experience:
-I began working 2 jobs my second semester in college while joining a sorority.
I maintained working an average of 18 hours per week until the year of 2010. This is when I took on multiple jobs to assist myself and parents. I worked under a teaching internship, while working as a student assistant at a Children's Learning Center for 1 year. I also performed this while participating in my semester Undergraduate Research program. A year before this, I worked two jobs while participating in the Academic Associates program.
- Also worked multiple positions as an administrative secretary.
- Student Assistant at Child's learning center (3 years)
- currently studying to take pharmacy technician test


Research Experience:
-Academic Associates Program - A clinical research program with Baylor/Texas Children's Hospital
-Undergraduate Research - Participated in a semester long research project with my professor. I received a scholarship to do so.

Practice Mcat:
16/17 (this is without studying)
- I have not taken the real MCAT yet
- I plan to study during the summer to take it in the fall of this year

Backup plan until I get into medical school:

-Obtain a Masters in Health Administration
-While working as a Pharmacy Technician

Race/Ethnicity:
-This shouldn't matter, but if it does to some, i am black.

Questions:
-What are my chances of getting into medical school?
-What can I do to improve my application?

Hi guys so I was a straight A student in high school but I struggled in college. I go to a pretty hard Jesuit university and I am currently a senior. My gpa is a little above 3.0 and my MCAT weren't good. Major Biology/Pre-med and Math minor.

As far as extra curricular goes I think I've done pretty good:
-Co-Founded two student associations that have grown greatly since my freshmen year
-Part of a program that mentors freshmen in our college
-Participated in a volunteer "clean up" event every year
-I got a CNA certification during a summer which included clinical experience
-Researched with a professor for two years and I have received a scholarship for it.
-I have done many hours of shadowing doctors at the local hospital.

Im applying to one year masters programs to help me get into medical school. At this point I don't know what to do. How hard is it to get into a masters program? Do you guys have any other suggestions on what I should do.

Thanks!

When applying to masters programs held at DO schools (e.g. MA at Midwestern), do they calculate the cumulative GPA without grade replacement, or is the GPA calculated as per AACOMAS for admission into their masters program?

Originally Posted by BR0224

Hi guys so I was a straight A student in high school but I struggled in college. I go to a pretty hard Jesuit university and I am currently a senior. My gpa is a little above 3.0 and my MCAT weren't good. Major Biology/Pre-med and Math minor.

As far as extra curricular goes I think I've done pretty good:
-Co-Founded two student associations that have grown greatly since my freshmen year
-Part of a program that mentors freshmen in our college
-Participated in a volunteer "clean up" event every year
-I got a CNA certification during a summer which included clinical experience
-Researched with a professor for two years and I have received a scholarship for it.
-I have done many hours of shadowing doctors at the local hospital.

Im applying to one year masters programs to help me get into medical school. At this point I don't know what to do. How hard is it to get into a masters program? Do you guys have any other suggestions on what I should do.

Thanks!

Define "wasn't good". If you're struggling at a "hard" university now just wait until medical school. Does your GPA have any upward trend? What is your sGPA? Are you confident in your ability to get A's?

Originally Posted by maxillarysinus

I have a 3.3cgpa, ~3.0sgpa, and am planning to retake MCAT at the end of April after taking Kaplan this semester (I got a 30 the first time around self-studying, but I was hoping to compensate my low gpa by taking a course and doing better - 36 is realistic at this point).

High MCAT and a low GPA says that you're great at tests and bad at endurance. Gotta have endurance. Also, if somebody gives me a dime for every "I'm expecting a 35+" we get in this forum, I can buy you all dinner. The histograms for retakes are really depressing.

Recently there have been several anecdotes here about emphasis on the last 60 hours of coursework. So if your last couple of years were mostly A's, then you're in a better position than a straight through 3.3/3.0.

Originally Posted by maxillarysinus

Originally I was planning to just apply to med schools broadly in June, and apply concurrently to a post-bacc to boost my gpa and show productivity during the application cycle.

If you're in California and thinking about a UC, you can't apply with any half-finished assets. Too much competition. If you want to get into an UC you are likely 2-3 years from applying.

Originally Posted by maxillarysinus

However, after calculating some numbers, I think I would have to get solid As for the full year (I was planning on doing the Berkeley post-bacc) and it would still only bring my gpa up to ~3.48. A year of A-s would only raise it to a 3.37. I think I just have too many units as an undergrad already, and it's dampening chances of raising my gpa substantially within a year.

Yes, but think of the credibility you'd gain by showing a 3.7+ for a year of full time hard science.

Originally Posted by maxillarysinus

So I went back thinking about applying to SMPs (I know it's late, so as an aside - how late is too late??) Alsaire's list above is a great starting point for me (thank you!) and I'll await responses to his post.

I responded in the EVMS thread. There's no formula for what SMPs to choose. You have to do your homework to figure out which program will meet your needs. Alsaire has a 36 in the pocket, so he/she can take some risks that you can't.

Originally Posted by maxillarysinus

My PIs suggest doing a year of research + publications + more clinical hours to show direct contributions to the medical field, but while that may be great, those things do not compensate for my low sGPA or prove to adcoms that I can handle med school courses.

Of course your PI wants you to do more in his/her lab. You're cheap labor. You're right to question his/her input on this.

Again, if you want to get into UCs, it's a longer road, and you want to go through programs like Loyola/Gtown, and then you get a much cheaper outcome. If you will be fine with over $300k in med school debt (or you have a funding source), then focus on SMPs like EVMS/Cincy that have tight host-school intake.

Best of luck to you.

Originally Posted by premedgal89

I would prefer entry into an allopathic medical school. Here are my demographics and my statistics.

Hi. First, you'll have a wonderfully well rounded application. You've got leadership, responsibility, variety, community, the works. Great! And now, the only thing you should be focusing on is academics and MCAT. More extra-curriculars and other stuff will not help you.

If you are serious about medical school, you are a few years from being academically ready. (You're maybe 23? I wasn't ready until I was 38. It just takes as long as it takes.) If you get in somewhere before you have built academic skills and confidence, that would be horrible. The first two years of medical school are extremely difficult for 4.0 students; sub-3.0 students get crushed like bugs on a windshield.

Point being: take it slow, do it right, think long term.

Originally Posted by premedgal89

In High School I was an A student

Hold onto that for courage. Unfortunately, it won't help with med school admissions.

Originally Posted by premedgal89

College:

Senior Biology Major
Math Minor
Entry Date: Fall 2007
Expected graduation date: Fall 2012 (I only took on average 12-13 hours a semester. I could not afford summer classes)
cumulative GPA: 2.7 (I worked very hard to pull this up from a 2.1)

More courage points there - you know you're not a number.

Originally Posted by premedgal89

last 60 hours thus far: 2.9gpa
I retook classes that I did poorly in. My grades went from Ds to A's and B+'s

Is that 2.9 counting only the last 60 hours? If you got A's and B+'s you should have a 3.x.

Originally Posted by premedgal89

Began college as an honors student, I left after my grades dropped because of mistakes.

At your leisure, work on telling that story. What could you have done differently? What did you need to know that you didn't learn yet? Own what happened. Again, it helps with courage and motivation to keep going.

Originally Posted by premedgal89

Currently 1 Withdrawal on my record

Don't worry about it. Don't get any more W's.

Originally Posted by premedgal89

...EC list...

Great list. You don't need to do more. It won't help. The only thing you need to keep doing is clinical volunteering (such as 4 hrs/wk in an ER or similar).

Originally Posted by premedgal89

Practice Mcat:
16/17 (this is without studying)
- I have not taken the real MCAT yet
- I plan to study during the summer to take it in the fall of this year

I suggest you should wait on the MCAT until you have stronger academics. Your GPA says you haven't mastered the content yet. If your retakes in the prereqs were A's, and your English and Humanities grades are A's, then proceed.

Originally Posted by premedgal89

Backup plan until I get into medical school:

-Obtain a Masters in Health Administration
-While working as a Pharmacy Technician

The MHA won't help you get into med school. Not at all. If you are interested in the field, great, get the MHA for that reason. But don't harbor an illusion that doing well in an MHA program will counter your undergrad GPA.

If you can work as a pharm tech now, that's great, you should be able to land a part time gig.

Originally Posted by premedgal89

Race/Ethnicity:
-This shouldn't matter, but if it does to some, i am black.

It matters, because it gets you access to programs for underrepresented minorities. Take advantage of such opportunities to get mentoring and direct support for academic growth. For examples, see category 5 in this (old) list: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=640302

Originally Posted by premedgal89

Questions:
-What are my chances of getting into medical school?
-What can I do to improve my application?

You can get into medical school if you make good choices and don't quit...if you can start pulling straight A's in hard science for a long time.

I suggest making some calls to GEMS, WakeForest, maybe UTDallas. Talk to regular academic advisors as well as minority outreach. When the advice starts to be consistent, it starts to be helpful, so keep asking until you get there.

Best of luck to you.

Originally Posted by BR0224

Im applying to one year masters programs to help me get into medical school. At this point I don't know what to do. How hard is it to get into a masters program? Do you guys have any other suggestions on what I should do.

Get a strong MCAT before you start thinking about an SMP. You might need to do more undergrad before you can get a strong MCAT. These are the breaks.

In addition, don't use an SMP to figure out what's wrong academically. Figure that out in a lower risk, lower cost environment. You need to show a minimum of a year of full time mostly science at a 3.7+ to give yourself credibility as a medical school applicant. You can't do that cold in an SMP coming off 3.0-ish.

Best of luck to you.

Originally Posted by esotero

When applying to masters programs held at DO schools (e.g. MA at Midwestern), do they calculate the cumulative GPA without grade replacement, or is the GPA calculated as per AACOMAS for admission into their masters program?

The masters programs at DO schools are regular grad school, more or less. They're not particularly competitive.

Make it easy for the program to understand what you're after. If you make it clear that you are pursuing DO, and that you retook courses as part of an effort to improve your standing, then they'll know what to do with you. Most likely, the apps for these programs expect you to enter your GPA in a box somewhere, which may or may not get checked against your transcript(s).

Best of luck to you.

My MCAT score was a 24. That's the only time I have taken it so far. As far as going to medical school I am confident that I can work hard and get through it since it has been my life long dream. What mainly lowered my gpa was Organic Chemistry. Do you suggest taking that over?

Jumping into the low gpa thread for a WAMC/next steps query:

So I started post-bac classes in summer 2010 and have thus far finished 28 semester hours at a 3.7. My sGPA is currently sitting at 3.14 (raised from a 2.78) and my cGPA is sitting at 3.4. I have:
- a master's in public health
- plenty of research experience and 1 pub
- close to 180 hrs of volunteering (focused on integrative med...as I was directly interacting with patients, I thought it was clinical, apparently it was not)
- about 25 hours of physician shadowing
- 32S MCAT from 7/11 (11vr, 11ps, 10bs)

I applied (very late) this round and received one interview from my state school - that school subsequently rejected me and when I called to ask them why, they pointed to my lack of clinical experience (working on it) and suggested I take some Upper Div. Great! Except that my premed advisors tell me that sometimes they say what they can to just get you off the phone faster and that I'm in a "grey area" where I could either:

1) take the upper div classes (at Harvard Extension) and, with a minimum of 20 credits over the next year, raise my sGPA to a 3.35 (and cGPA to 3.46), OR
2) matriculate into a SMP (just received an unofficial acceptance into Gtown) and kick its ass.

The advisors believe I'd do well in the SMP given my MCAT and recent science performance, but still, I have my reservations about uprooting my life/leaving my support system (I know I'll have to sometime, and am totally willing to...for med school) and sinking that kind of $$ into a "grey area"

Anyways I'd really love to hear you all weigh in on my situation, since its causing me a LOT of anxiety at the moment! Thanks in advance!

Is that 2.9 counting only the last 60 hours? If you got A's and B+'s you should have a 3.x.[/QUOTE]

I got A's and B's in the classes that I retook. the 2.9 counts most of those classes, however I have received 4 C's along the way in other classes.