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Great article for those who plan on dropping some benjamins on "prime" meat:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/larryolm...kobe-beef-lie/

I have been wanting to test this Kobe beef but i guess i'll hold back until i visit Japan some day.

This is hilarious and not at all surprising. A few years ago when "Black Angus" beef was all the rage, I recall reading that in order for a burger to be advertised as "Black Angus," its beef was required to contain at least 3% beef from actual Black Angus cows. What a load. I guess that's one more reason to get a little closer to the actual sources of our food. It makes me wonder what I'm really eating when I see "Marin Sun Farms," or "Mary's Chicken" on the menu at restaurants here in town. We're supposed to associate those titles with being organic, free-range, and hormone-free, yadda, yadda, yadda...

For the hell of it, and because a friend suggested it, we bought 1/4 of a large hoofed animal from a local ranch last year. Took a few weeks for it to get processed but before long we had a freezer full of steaks and ground beef and other cuts. It's pretty yummy. It was worth the hassle and the up front cost.

I don't think I'll ever buy beef in a grocery store again.

Originally Posted by pgg

For the hell of it, and because a friend suggested it, we bought 1/4 of a large hoofed animal from a local ranch last year. Took a few weeks for it to get processed but before long we had a freezer full of steaks and ground beef and other cuts. It's pretty yummy. It was worth the hassle and the up front cost.

I don't think I'll ever buy beef in a grocery store again.

Twice in the past 5 years, I have purchased 1/4 bison for friends in Wyoming, from a ranch in Nebraska. That's about 125lbs of meat.

One winter, it was so much, they filled their freezer, and, being Wyoming, put more in two coolers and just stashed them out in a snowbank.

I would go toe to toe with anybody at all on this forum, or any other, as far as steak goes. My regular at Morton's is 24 oz porterhouse x 2 (because they can't grill the double porterhouse effectively). I am an avowed carnivore.

Originally Posted by cchoukal

This is hilarious and not at all surprising. A few years ago when "Black Angus" beef was all the rage, I recall reading that in order for a burger to be advertised as "Black Angus," its beef was required to contain at least 3% beef from actual Black Angus cows. What a load. I guess that's one more reason to get a little closer to the actual sources of our food. It makes me wonder what I'm really eating when I see "Marin Sun Farms," or "Mary's Chicken" on the menu at restaurants here in town. We're supposed to associate those titles with being organic, free-range, and hormone-free, yadda, yadda, yadda...

Angus is a good example of the effect of advertizing. There wasn't a taste test where angus beef was superior or anything. Angus ranchers decided to build a brand based on nothing and now people assume it's better than 1/16 brahman 40%hereford 1/16 shorthorn etc. or whatever meat is nearby on the shelf.

Raise your own.

- pod

Originally Posted by periopdoc

Raise your own.

Someday ...

My brother has chickens in his suburban back yard. After eating some of the eggs he gets to eat every day, we were ready to put a chicken coop in our own own back yard. But it turns out that town ordinances prohibit it, which was surprising to me given it's a small ag town. The only thing this place has besides fields and orchards and cows are FA-18s.

Originally Posted by periopdoc

Raise your own.

- pod

And raise them to 3yo.
And finish on grass.
And dry age the meat.
Yum

Originally Posted by pgg

Someday ...

My brother has chickens in his suburban back yard. After eating some of the eggs he gets to eat every day, we were ready to put a chicken coop in our own own back yard. But it turns out that town ordinances prohibit it, which was surprising to me given it's a small ag town. The only thing this place has besides fields and orchards and cows are FA-18s.

The weekly newspaper from suburban Buffalo NY (i.e., not in the city) has stories about the town board meeting every month, and giving variances for up to 6 chickens within the town limits.

Could you petition the town for a variance?

My family raises a mongrel mix of Brahma, Angus, Cattleman and Limousin in South Texas that we are quite proud of. Grass-fed, except in years of bad drought.

Originally Posted by Apollyon

Twice in the past 5 years, I have purchased 1/4 bison for friends in Wyoming, from a ranch in Nebraska. That's about 125lbs of meat.

One winter, it was so much, they filled their freezer, and, being Wyoming, put more in two coolers and just stashed them out in a snowbank.

I would go toe to toe with anybody at all on this forum, or any other, as far as steak goes. My regular at Morton's is 24 oz porterhouse x 2 (because they can't grill the double porterhouse effectively). I am an avowed carnivore.

Wow, that's putting away some meat..... I've got to slightly disagree on your cut though. I'm a ribeye guy, porters are a relatively close #2.

The local supermarket in my home town carries american kobe beef. You can really tell the difference in the marbling even when comparing to their USDA Prime. I bought a NY Strip once, it tasted just like a Fillet, although very pricy it was very delicious.

Originally Posted by Apollyon

The weekly newspaper from suburban Buffalo NY (i.e., not in the city) has stories about the town board meeting every month, and giving variances for up to 6 chickens within the town limits.

Could you petition the town for a variance?

Or just get them to change the ordinance--raising your own poultry is the hot new thing. The large city where I live just changed the law to allow people to raise up to a certain number of birds (not sure of the details; my apartment complex would probably frown on it).

Originally Posted by RussianJoo

The local supermarket in my home town carries american kobe beef. You can really tell the difference in the marbling even when comparing to their USDA Prime. I bought a NY Strip once, it tasted just like a Fillet, although very pricy it was very delicious.

Or, if you believe the article, what they carry is actually just American Beef, as the term Kobe signifies something that cannot be produced or sold here.

Originally Posted by GypsySongman

And raise them to 3yo.
And finish on grass.
And dry age the meat.
Yum

Finish on grass or start on grass then finish on corn?

- pod

Originally Posted by Per4mer8

Wow, that's putting away some meat..... I've got to slightly disagree on your cut though. I'm a ribeye guy, porters are a relatively close #2.

The ribeye comes into play when the PH is unavailable. Nothing else, though - not big enough!

Originally Posted by pgg

After eating some of the eggs he gets to eat every day, we were ready to put a chicken coop in our own own back yard. But it turns out that town ordinances prohibit it...

That sounds highly unconstitutional. ;-)

I'm not that big into red meat. Take it or leave it. From 1997 to 2002 I didn't eat one
Piece of red meat. And never craved it. I should go back to that.
D712

Originally Posted by doctor712

That sounds highly unconstitutional. ;-)

I'm not that big into red meat. Take it or leave it. From 1997 to 2002 I didn't eat one
Piece of red meat. And never craved it. I should go back to that.
D712

Its official you belong in Hollywood.

Originally Posted by Apollyon

The weekly newspaper from suburban Buffalo NY (i.e., not in the city) has stories about the town board meeting every month, and giving variances for up to 6 chickens within the town limits.

Could you petition the town for a variance?

It's actually not prohibited 100% - just that the regulation requires the chickens to be a certain distance from property lines and structures. For us, that would put them in our pool, or close enough that I wouldn't want to use the pool.

Originally Posted by periopdoc

Finish on grass or start on grass then finish on corn?

- pod

start and finish on grass. It's not what we usually do, but it is what tastes the best.

I don't love Ribeyes, too much gristle. Give me tenderloin/filet/porterhouse/t-bone.

Originally Posted by cchoukal

Or, if you believe the article, what they carry is actually just American Beef, as the term Kobe signifies something that cannot be produced or sold here.

yes i know that it's just american beef, and the supermarket isn't trying to fool anyone. To me it's the level of marbling. I know that this meat doesn't come from japan, and it doesn't pretend to. but the level of marbling was clearly a cut above the rest. And lets face it marbling is what separates USDA Choice from USDA Prime and that's what gives the flavor and texture. So I think in the US the term "kobe" is starting to mean more marbling than prime, which is false advertising but if it tastes better than a prime steak then I don't really care.

Originally Posted by Per4mer8

Wow, that's putting away some meat..... I've got to slightly disagree on your cut though. I'm a ribeye guy, porters are a relatively close #2.

I used to go all PH all the time... until I discovered the fatty pleasures of ribeye. I'll do a poor-man's sous vide by salting and peppering (heavy on the freshly cracked poivre) a nice 1.5-2 inch thick steak and dropping it in a ziplock bag. Bathe it in 140 degree water for an hour or so, and that basically heats the meat to 120 degrees or so. A few more minutes on the grill and it's a perfect 132 and medium rare all the way through. For extra credit sometimes I'll melt some good stilton cheese over the top under the broiler. Good God...

I've been drooling over placing an order for one of these from Snake River Farms..
http://store.snakeriverfarms.com/ame...-ribeye-roast/

I've heard Niman Ranch has good beef too..
http://store.nimanranch.com/c-21-ribeyes.aspx

If u had to taste test grass fed or corn fed beef, could u actually taste the difference!?!? Man I have to get my palate looked at. ENT please.

D712

Originally Posted by doctor712

If u had to taste test grass fed or corn fed beef, could u actually taste the difference!?!? Man I have to get my palate looked at. ENT please.

D712

Do a taste test and report back to us.

That can be arranged.

For the record, my favorite steak sauce (that goes equally well on tomatoes or salads which is what it was first used for)

PETER LUGERS' OLD FASHIONED STEAK HOUSE SAUCE

http://www.peterluger.com/petlugsauc.cfm

Man. That's good stuff.

D712

SDN beef tasting party?

Sitting here as the clock turns past hour 7 of this c-section, and past hour 24 since I actually ate anything, I could sure use a good steak about now.


- pod

I am partial to the NY strip or the porterhouse myself.

- pod

Originally Posted by periopdoc

SDN beef tasting party?

Sitting here as the clock turns past hour 7 of this c-section, and past hour 24 since I actually ate anything, I could sure use a good steak about now.


- pod

POD,

Why would a C-section take 7 hours? Or is it a labor that you know will goto C-section after 7 hours?

D712

When it turns into a GA hyst.

- pod

The Butcher Block: T-Bones and Porterhouses

- pod

Originally Posted by doctor712

If u had to taste test grass fed or corn fed beef, could u actually taste the difference!?!? Man I have to get my palate looked at. ENT please.

D712

Taste a few and you will know the difference. Grass fed is usually leaner to begin with, and often with a stronger, "beefier" taste. I usually go for grass fed when available, but what's available (even in "good" steakhouses) is highly variable. Good corn fed beef has a bit less variability. A good corn fed piece of beef from Luger's won't taste much different from that of any other great steakhouse.

I'd have to cook em equally, at same time, and taste. Have never even thought of asking a chef/waiter if beef was corn or grass fed...

Trip to Whole Foods here we go...

D712

Originally Posted by periopdoc

When it turns into a GA hyst.

- pod

roger that!

Originally Posted by doctor712

I'd have to cook em equally, at same time, and taste. Have never even thought of asking a chef/waiter if beef was corn or grass fed...

Trip to Whole Foods here we go...

D712

Around these parts, cuts are often labeled as grass-fed and by farm. It's sort of a branding thing; people expect or associate certain qualities with the various farm names. If you go to even a half-way decent restaurant here in the city, the beef is going to be grass-fed and from a farm within 100 miles of the city. The same is true for pork and chicken; there are a few places whose farm names have become brands. If it's not clear where it came from, I often do ask.

I don't know if grass-fed necessarily tastes any better (I don't eat a ton of steak (rib-eye, when I do)), but it's been declared that grass-fed cows harbor less e. coli. The bigger thing for me is that supporting grass-fed is more likely to put money in the pockets of farmers who raise cows on an actual prairie and not on some dusty, overcrowded corporate feed lot. I've come to learn that some seemingly pro-social farm brands actually have their animals slaughtered and processed at big, national, corporate houses, even if they were raised in a more humane way or whatever, so it's hard to know for sure how the cows are raised and treated.

I feel the same way about organic stuff. I don't believe it's any healthier, but buying it means I'm supporting an industry that doesn't spray toxic pesticides all over their Mexican migrant work force and who might be 5% more careful with the land they use.

And I believe Niman was sold to a multinational conglomerate...

Grass fed have more terroir. This can be a good or a bad thing. Corn fed is more predictable, and uniform.

- pod

Originally Posted by cchoukal

I feel the same way about organic stuff. I don't believe it's any healthier, but buying it means I'm supporting an industry that doesn't spray toxic pesticides all over their Mexican migrant work force and who might be 5% more careful with the land they use.

I buy organic milk because I think it tastes better. They tell me that's because it's pasteurized differently. $7/gallon is kind of steep, but I guess it's not too crazy in the context of "natural artesian" bottle water imported from the islands of Fiji 1 liter at a time.

There's a peach orchard a few blocks from us that claims organic practices. Almost time to start going to the farmer's market every week again.

Last year we subscribed to a local home delivery service - every week they'd drop off a box of stuff grown locally, whatever's in season. We'd get some things (like tomatoes) all season but other times different fruits and vegetables. Probabably 2-3x as expensive as buying stuff at the stores, but most of the money went straight to the farmers and it was goooooood stuff.

Originally Posted by doctor712

That can be arranged.

For the record, my favorite steak sauce (that goes equally well on tomatoes or salads which is what it was first used for)

PETER LUGERS' OLD FASHIONED STEAK HOUSE SAUCE

http://www.peterluger.com/petlugsauc.cfm

Man. That's good stuff.

D712

A good steak requires no steak sauce. Actually it's a travesty to use it. (Unless you're eating a $9 sirloin or something)

Originally Posted by Per4mer8

A good steak requires no steak sauce. Actually it's a travesty to use it. (Unless you're eating a $9 sirloin or something)

At home it goes on every steak. At a restaurant, whatever or however the chef serves it.
10$ prime rib or 35$ filet.

D712

Originally Posted by pgg

I buy organic milk because I think it tastes better. They tell me that's because it's pasteurized differently. $7/gallon is kind of steep, but I guess it's not too crazy in the context of "natural artesian" bottle water imported from the islands of Fiji 1 liter at a time.

There's a peach orchard a few blocks from us that claims organic practices. Almost time to start going to the farmer's market every week again.

Last year we subscribed to a local home delivery service - every week they'd drop off a box of stuff grown locally, whatever's in season. We'd get some things (like tomatoes) all season but other times different fruits and vegetables. Probabably 2-3x as expensive as buying stuff at the stores, but most of the money went straight to the farmers and it was goooooood stuff.

Those services are so common here in the city, even the VA has one! It's too much for me to go through in a given week, but the people that do it say the quality is really high. I was doing organic milk for awhile (and admit that of all the organic things I've tried, this was one of the only things that I thought did taste better), but I'm basically almond-milk-only now. Leaves room for more cheese.

Originally Posted by cchoukal

The bigger thing for me is that supporting grass-fed is more likely to put money in the pockets of farmers who raise cows on an actual prairie and not on some dusty, overcrowded corporate feed lot....
I feel the same way about organic stuff. I don't believe it's any healthier, but buying it means I'm supporting an industry that doesn't spray toxic pesticides all over their Mexican migrant work force and who might be 5% more careful with the land they use.

Originally Posted by pgg

"natural artesian" bottle water imported from the islands of Fiji 1 liter at a time.

There's a peach orchard a few blocks from us that claims organic practices. Almost time to start going to the farmer's market every week again.

Do you buy the Fiji water? There are so many other good tasting waters that cost less than Fiji. Of course I'm blanking on them all now.
And probably have less PPM of the bad stuff if that matters to you.

I could not POSSIBLY eat enough peaches in my life. I am always on the search for good peaches and even better persimmons (both Fuyu and Hachiya). Some are steak sauce snobs, I'm a TOTAL persimmon snob.

Originally Posted by cchoukal

but I'm basically almond-milk-only now. Leaves room for more cheese.

Almond milk leaves room for cheese, why? Less cals and fat than say 2%? I've tried soy, meh. I've tried almond, too flavorful. I like Rice Milk. Anyone try or like Spelt bread? I've yet to try it, always wondered the draw or benefit...?

D712

Originally Posted by doctor712

Do you buy the Fiji water?

I generally don't buy bottled water, unless I'm at some event and have no options. I don't know where the Fiji came from, I was just reading the label on one here yesterday, and marvelling at the marketing genius that could make shipping water, in 1 L bottles, from Fiji to the United States, somehow profitable.

The tap water (groundwater) here tastes pretty bad. I've never been real picky, but ... it's bad. Our fridge filters it and does a good job.

Originally Posted by doctor712

I could not POSSIBLY eat enough peaches in my life. I am always on the search for good peaches and even better persimmons (both Fuyu and Hachiya). Some are steak sauce snobs, I'm a TOTAL persimmon snob.

D712

Man, that bullet was awfully close, whizzed right by my ear. My great grandfather had a Cattle Ranch, everyone in my family has a spare freezer in the garage full of family raised beef, all cuts. If my grandfather caught or heard of anyone using streak sauce you missed that years delivery...... If he ever SAW you with steak sauce he'd probably shiv you with a T-bone. I stand by my assertion, if you eat a half-way decent cut and cook it well it is a shame to ruin it with steak sauce.

Originally Posted by pgg

I buy organic milk because I think it tastes better. They tell me that's because it's pasteurized differently. $7/gallon is kind of steep,

The supply of oganic milk is spotty so it generally has to travel farther to reach retail. So it's pasteurized by a method called ultrahigh temperature (UHT) processing, in which the milk is heated to 280 degrees Fahrenheit for 2-4 second. This kills any bacteria. In contrast, standard pasteurization involves heating to 145-160F. This doesn't kill all the bacteria, just enough to prevent food-born illness. That's why organic milk has a longer expiration date and can be stored unrefrigerated. UHT also destroys a very slight amount of B vitamins.

UHT alters the flavor because it caramelizes some of the lactose. A lot of American don't like the taste of UHT milk, although it's the common method for all European milk. But if you like the taste, you can buy UHT non-organic milk and save some money. Parmalet is one brand.

Originally Posted by doctor712

At home it goes on every steak. At a restaurant, whatever or however the chef serves it.
10$ prime rib or 35$ filet.

D712

I am the exact opposite. I only use steak sauce in a restaurant to cover up bad meat. At home I only buy good meat and I prepare it right. I have even converted my wife, a previous die-hard A1 user.

- pod

Originally Posted by Per4mer8

A good steak requires no steak sauce. Actually it's a travesty to use it. (Unless you're eating a $9 sirloin or something)

True. True.

Originally Posted by periopdoc

I am the exact opposite. I only use steak sauce in a restaurant to cover up bad meat. At home I only buy good meat and I prepare it right. I have even converted my wife, a previous die-hard A1 user.

- pod

I love em all (sauces). A1, Heinz, Lugers, Bubbas, I try as many as I can. I don't go to steakhouses that much, especially Morton's and the like, but when I go the chef does it up right usually and I wouldn't ask for A1 or Worscteshire at Mortons... :roll eyes:
Only because they probably would't even have any. I don't order steak anywhere I don't think it's something special.

There is a KILLER place in LA (Sherman Oaks to be precise). Boneyard Bistro. One of the southern style steak joints I've ever been to. Cozy, overpriced and snobby. Fits right in in LA.

Another killer - AMAZING HOLE IN THE WALL - steak joint in LA, Burbank to be exact "Gary Brics Ramp." It's under a ramp to the 5 Freeway, a dive of unmanageable proportions (though it's been redone recently). No snob, no attitude, fell out of 1965, and has the BEST Filet Mignons, for 12$ at lunch as I recall.

Any of you peeps work in the Valley, I'm sure you miss the old Smokehouse across from Warner Bros lot. You can't get that kind of atmosphere much anymore.

D712

Japan spoiled me forever as far as steak goes.

We were walking around in Kyoto looking for a place to get real Kobe or Ohmi beef and saw a sign on a restaurant similar to this:


Don't think there's a single place in America that has records of the lineage of the cow you're about to eat up to the great-grandparents, including the cow's noseprint for good measure.

When the meat looks something like this:

you pretty much die and go to heaven right on the spot.

Nothing before or since comes close to the beef in Japan. I want to go back. Now!

Originally Posted by Hawaiian Bruin

Japan spoiled me forever as far as steak goes.

We were walking around in Kyoto looking for a place to get real Kobe or Ohmi beef and saw a sign on a restaurant similar to this:


Don't think there's a single place in America that has records of the lineage of the cow you're about to eat up to the great-grandparents, including the cow's noseprint for good measure.

When the meat looks something like this:

you pretty much die and go to heaven right on the spot.

Nothing before or since comes close to the beef in Japan. I want to go back. Now!

Wow. I've always wanted to visit Japan. This might help move it up the list.