Salaries for DO vs. MD

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Originally Posted by SpecterGT260

and to the underlined: this is not always true. The PRACTICE makes money based on reimbursement. but there are plenty of physicians out there with flat rate contracts. It all depends on what you sign up for.

Yes, I know that. The point, however, is that the practice determines your salary as a share of the reimbursements you are EXPECTED to bring in.

Originally Posted by SoulinNeed

Yes, I know that. The point, however, is that the practice determines your salary as a share of the reimbursements you are EXPECTED to bring in.

it isnt really worth splitting hairs.... You say this, I say it is more a function of what gets negotiated. At that level it is just like any other job, job interview, and acceptance process. Offers, counter offers, and salary negotiation until both sides sign the papers. practices are interesting in making money OFF OF you, not making money FOR you. So they want to pay you as little as possible to keep you happy while collecting the rest. This is just standard business process. A give and take between how low can we go before this guy heads off to greener pastures.

Originally Posted by SoulinNeed

That has little to do with being a DO or MD. Secondly, Physician salary is ultimately determined by insurance reimbursement rates.

Ya but you forget about groups subsidizing with the hospitals

Private practice DO Physicians in the fields below could possible incorporate OMM into their practice and quite possible increase their earning potential when it comes to billing as compared to their MD counterparts who practice the same specialty.

fields where OMM is applicable on an outpatient basis in private practice: FM, IM, Peds, Neuro, PMR,

There's a thread on the Pre-osteo forum a while back that discusses this.

does OMM bill out at similar rates to other procedures? There are only so many hours in the day (~24 according to a bumper sticker I saw concerning beers in a case) and only so many pt visits one could have. Yes, you could potentially perform services an MD could not, but if the common practices have a higher yield it does not make sense to say that a "supplement" (which can only replace other productivity) would increase salary.

"supplement" procedures don't necessarily eat into the time you spend with other patients. I would speak to some of the attendings on here who incorporate OMM into their practice as I am unsure on how this is done.

Originally Posted by SpecterGT260

does OMM bill out at similar rates to other procedures? There are only so many hours in the day (~24 according to a bumper sticker I saw concerning beers in a case) and only so many pt visits one could have. Yes, you could potentially perform services an MD could not, but if the common practices have a higher yield it does not make sense to say that a "supplement" (which can only replace other productivity) would increase salary.

It really depends on what state you are in.

When I had full body OMM (6+ regions) done on myself in Fairbanks my bill was around $500
The same in Texas was around $300.

I don't do OMM on every patient because it's not warranted. However, it is quick and easy to do if you learn it well. I had a man come in with a Migraine yesterday. It took longer for the nurse to get the imitrex injection ready than it did for me to adjust his neck and upper back. His headache was essentially gone by the time he left the office.

I can do HVLA and do the main 4 regions. Cspine, Tspine, Lspine and Sacrum in about 3 minutes. You can do stretching on an older person while you are tallking with them and bill for it. Medicare pays for OMT.

You bill per every 2 regions treated. I think each clinic has it's own fee schedule. The average I've seen is around $50 for 2.

Originally Posted by cabinbuilder

It really depends on what state you are in.

When I had full body OMM (6+ regions) done on myself in Fairbanks my bill was around $500
The same in Texas was around $300.

I don't do OMM on every patient because it's not warranted. However, it is quick and easy to do if you learn it well. I had a man come in with a Migraine yesterday. It took longer for the nurse to get the imitrex injection ready than it did for me to adjust his next and upper back. His headache was essentially gone by the time he left the office.

I can do HVLA and do the main 4 regions. Cspine, Tspine, Lspine and Sacrum in about 3 minutes. You can do stretching on an older person while you are tallking with them and bill for it. Medicare pays for OMT.

You bill per every 2 regions treated. I think each clinic has it's own fee schedule. The average I've seen is around $50 for 2.

merci

I wonder if dentists have these ridiculous questions (DMD vs DDS income), or pharmacists (PhD vs PharmD...).

Originally Posted by DOWay

I wonder if dentists have these ridiculous questions (DMD vs DDS income), or pharmacists (PhD vs PharmD...).

In general, pre-pharm and pre-dental students don't have quite as large a stick up their asses as the average prestige-whore pre-med. P < 0.05

Originally Posted by DOWay

I wonder if dentists have these ridiculous questions (DMD vs DDS income), or pharmacists (PhD vs PharmD...).

PhD in pharmacy? They wouldn't be practicing. You need a PharmD to practice.

Originally Posted by lacrosse87

In general, pre-pharm and pre-dental students don't have quite as large a stick up their asses as the average prestige-whore pre-med. P < 0.05

The degree doesn't matter, what does is what you bill for and patient mix. An FP, who does few procedures and has mostly "self-pay"/medicaid will not make nearly as much as an ortho who does patients who are insured by top insurers and can crank in the OR and works long hours. The other thing that determines salary is how you run your practice. By being lean and mean, few techs/nurses, making extensive use of physician extenders, offshoring the back office and the like.

Originally Posted by FutureCTDoc

The degree doesn't matter, what does is what you bill for and patient mix. An FP, who does few procedures and has mostly "self-pay"/medicaid will not make nearly as much as an ortho who does patients who are insured by top insurers and can crank in the OR and works long hours. The other thing that determines salary is how you run your practice. By being lean and mean, few techs/nurses, making extensive use of physician extenders, offshoring the back office and the like.

In my limited experience, this is true. Successful docs will embrace NPs, not lose sleep over "encroachment" and cling to their beloved pathophysiology.

Originally Posted by Alpha Q Raw

In my limited experience, this is true. Successful docs will embrace NPs, not lose sleep over "encroachment" and cling to their beloved pathophysiology.

Or PAs or DPTs (For ortho) or ODs (Ophtho). The smart thing is to make intelligent use of them and recognize they will work for a lot less.

Originally Posted by FutureCTDoc

Or PAs or DPTs (For ortho) or ODs (Ophtho). The smart thing is to make intelligent use of them and recognize they will work for a lot less.

Is true. And when DNPs demand equal pay (they're already doing this btw) as MDs/DOs, the joke will be on them. It a Toyota and a Lexus cost the same, you go with the Lexus, 100% of the time.

Originally Posted by FutureCTDoc

Or PAs or DPTs (For ortho) or ODs (Ophtho). The smart thing is to make intelligent use of them and recognize they will work for a lot less.

Where I work, both the Ophtho's AND the Optom's use ophthalmic technicians

Originally Posted by lacrosse87

Where I work, both the Ophtho's AND the Optom's use ophthalmic technicians

Ophthalmic techs are not physician extenders though, they are skilled, but at the same time they are techs and unlike PAs and NPs they don't have the training to be semi-autonomous, mid-level providers.

Originally Posted by FutureCTDoc

Ophthalmic techs are not physician extenders though, they are skilled, but at the same time they are techs and unlike PAs and NPs they don't have the training to be semi-autonomous, mid-level providers.

Just pointing out that where I work, Ophtho's aren't using Optom's. They're using techs. And that even the Optom's are using techs (leaving them with pretty much only the fundus exam and contact lens fitting since we even do the refractions for the Optom's)

Originally Posted by lacrosse87

Just pointing out that where I work, Ophtho's aren't using Optom's. They're using techs. And that even the Optom's are using techs (leaving them with pretty much only the fundus exam and contact lens fitting since we even do the refractions for the Optom's)

Same thing with the ophtho I shadowed. He used techs... while making fun of how stupid optoms are because they always asked him for a consult over the dumbest things. Good times...

Why is money the most scared topic. People wanna know and they have the right to.

Originally Posted by 6262

Why is money the most scared topic. People wanna know and they have the right to.

Most scared? Do you mean sacred? It isnt the fact that the money subject hits a nerve its the fact that the difference in pay between an MD and DO can be found with a quick search. Threads like this one (which dates back to 2005) derail soon into the thread and eventually die out....if you want to know about salary search the web, SDN or find a doctor not a bunch of premeds who make 0-12000 a year on average.

Originally Posted by 6262

Why is money the most scared topic. People wanna know and they have the right to.

You're the one that went and dug up a 3 month old thread about money.

Originally Posted by MedPR

You're the one that went and dug up a 3 month old thread about money.

Exactly my thoughts, only for us to once again answer the question that DO=MD in terms of salary because they are both physicians. Sheesh, maybe VR won't be the stronger area for some of these folks. Com'on people at least read through the threads before reviving dead threads.

Ok here's my other thoughts....
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