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What is the point in going to pharmacy school if you end up 200k in debt!!?? Both schools near me are so expensive it is a little frightening to have that kind of debt. Is it worth it?

It's worth it for me because it's what I want to do. I'd rather be in debt in a profession that I enjoy than choose a job solely based on debt and being miserable. It will eventually be paid off

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=912165
^^ Same mentality although they're all Pre-Dental.

Originally Posted by ginaw623

What is the point in going to pharmacy school if you end up 200k in debt!!?? Both schools near me are so expensive it is a little frightening to have that kind of debt. Is it worth it?

I wouldn't do it if I was ending up 200k in debt...it probably wouldn't pencil out finance wise (or even in any other sense) for me at that point. I'll be a bit over 100k, which is more than enough to scare me.

I went into pharmacy because I like pharmacists generally, I like the job, and I was looking for more safety and security. That last one isn't panning out so well now, unfortunately!

I agree with what RxMPLS said as well. I think most schools that I am applying to are about 30k a year.

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by trangalang

I agree with what RxMPLS said as well. I think most schools that I am applying to are about 30k a year.

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk

did you add your living expense in that 30k?

If money is your sole reason or hindrance in to the profession then please do not enter pharmacy. My profession doesn't need ignorant person. You need to have a passion for patient care rather than monetary desires.

Originally Posted by GetYoEducation

If money is your sole reason or hindrance in to the profession then please do not enter pharmacy. My profession doesn't need ignorant person. You need to have a passion for patient care rather than monetary desires.

You can have passion for patients and not want to be in this profession. Who wants to be 200k in debt to help people? There are many career choices where such drastic measures don't have to be taken.

Personally if I had to take out more than 100k in loans I wouldn't be in pharmacy school. Debt scares me more than it scares some people out there.

Originally Posted by ginaw623

Is it worth it?

Hell no. I can buy a nice beach house with 200K. Please don't be so foolish.

There are jobs that pay much more than pharmacy and do NOT require any student loans...please be smart and choose those.

If you really want to help people, volunteer. No debt that way either.

Originally Posted by seaswim

If you really want to help people, volunteer. No debt that way either.

Best reply ever. So true, so very true...

Originally Posted by GetYoEducation

If money is your sole reason or hindrance in to the profession then please do not enter pharmacy. My profession doesn't need ignorant person. You need to have a passion for patient care rather than monetary desires.

I dont think he understands how high interest rates are going and not everyone has a cosigner/high credit score. Would you still have passion for patient care if you have to take out a 41k loan every year at an interest rate of 8.25%? I dont think so...

Originally Posted by pharmaguide

Best reply ever. So true, so very true...

Originally Posted by Rx MPLS

I wouldn't do it if I was ending up 200k in debt. I'll be a bit over 100k, which is more than enough to scare me.

I wouldn't do it either if I was ending up 200k in debt. Thankfully, when I graduate I will have a debt that is not in the 6 figure range. Otherwise...

PSLF/IBR is why I allowed my student loan debt to surpass $200k. Not worried about it at all.

Originally Posted by seaswim

If you really want to help people, volunteer. No debt that way either.

and if you volunteer long enough.. you will realize that there are only so much you can do as a volunteer.

http://youtu.be/1Y6kTsBNH78

This guy paid off $101K in 7 months and he didn't make 6 figures after taxes. So I guess it depends on your definition of worth.

Originally Posted by beargirl200308

http://youtu.be/1Y6kTsBNH78

This guy paid off $101K in 7 months and he didn't make 6 figures after taxes. So I guess it depends on your definition of worth.

He must have gotten help from his parents or some other people. Otherwise it could be mathematically IMPOSSIBLE to pay off $101K in 7 months.

You would be hard pressed to pay $101K in 7 months making six figures much less without six figures...just use some math here.

To the person who called me ignorant: I think that being a young student and pre-planning for debt and financial constraints is just the opposite of ignorance. Not many 20-something year olds take these things into consideration when taking on astronomical debt for school. Thanks for your input though it was very helpful

Originally Posted by SHC1984

He must have gotten help from his parents or some other people. Otherwise it could be mathematically IMPOSSIBLE to pay off $101K in 7 months.

You would be hard pressed to pay $101K in 7 months making six figures much less without six figures...just use some math here.

He didn't as far as I can tell. The way he did it was he rented out rooms in his house, getting two extra jobs on the side, selling any and everything he had, and not spending a whole lot of money. Mathematically speaking it can work, but you just have to be disciplined and stick to a budget.

http://nomoreharvarddebt.com/ He blogged about the experience.

Originally Posted by beargirl200308

He didn't as far as I can tell. The way he did it was he rented out rooms in his house, getting two extra jobs on the side, selling any and everything he had, and not spending a whole lot of money. Mathematically speaking it can work, but you just have to be disciplined and stick to a budget.

http://nomoreharvarddebt.com/ He blogged about the experience.

Interesting...so the stuff he sold must be very valuble and he must have gotten a good amount from that and renting rooms out makes sense too.

Cool. But I hate roommates so I can't do that!

I will owe around 90K to 100K when I finish pharmacy school...so I am kinda scared myself....*sigh*...

Originally Posted by beargirl200308

He didn't as far as I can tell. The way he did it was he rented out rooms in his house, getting two extra jobs on the side, selling any and everything he had, and not spending a whole lot of money. Mathematically speaking it can work, but you just have to be disciplined and stick to a budget.

http://nomoreharvarddebt.com/ He blogged about the experience.

So, he did get help from others in the form of buying off his debt, correct?

Originally Posted by beargirl200308

He didn't as far as I can tell. The way he did it was he rented out rooms in his house, getting two extra jobs on the side, selling any and everything he had, and not spending a whole lot of money. Mathematically speaking it can work, but you just have to be disciplined and stick to a budget.

http://nomoreharvarddebt.com/ He blogged about the experience.

eh, what's the point, it's just money. i'd rather do other things than let the sole focus of my existence for that length of time be to pay down debt. Debt is not that important to me that it requires that level of effort/tenacity/sacrifice.

I don't love debt by any means, but I'm not averse to it like some folks are. I consider debt to be leverage which can be constructive at times.

Ok, so I have been reading a lot of threads about debt and the doom and gloom of Pharmacy. Here is my $.02 worth.... When I graduate from Pharm school I will be 48yrs old and have over $200K in debt. That is not scarry....what is scarry, is the responsibility you will have in your hands as a medical professional. In my life I have worked many years as a Paramedic on an ambulance, in an E.R., and other jobs with similar responsibilities. Medical care is a profession to be taken seriously and enter only if you are ready to commit to that.

School loans are no different than car loans, house notes, etc. They are a bill that must be paid. Yes, I know they can be quite large but so is the pay. Most people on SDN and entering this profession are <30yrs old. Remember, your career as a 30ish yr old Pharmacist can give 40+ years of income. Do not let your debt define your passion. As long as you do not have to live in a million dollar mansion and drive a $100K car, you will be quite comfortable even with this debt. After all, it is like having a second house note.

I am not trying to chastise anyone but rather to put money into perspective. Realistically, we all want to help people but money is a major consideration at all levels. Most of us like to eat every day and live where the rain doesn't fall on our heads when we sleep.

Just please understand, money is only paper. The lives you touch are much more important. If you value this calling, the money will be well spent.

Originally Posted by bsggsb

Ok, so I have been reading a lot of threads about debt and the doom and gloom of Pharmacy. Here is my $.02 worth.... When I graduate from Pharm school I will be 48yrs old and have over $200K in debt. That is not scarry....what is scarry, is the responsibility you will have in your hands as a medical professional. In my life I have worked many years as a Paramedic on an ambulance, in an E.R., and other jobs with similar responsibilities. Medical care is a profession to be taken seriously and enter only if you are ready to commit to that.

School loans are no different than car loans, house notes, etc. They are a bill that must be paid. Yes, I know they can be quite large but so is the pay. Most people on SDN and entering this profession are <30yrs old. Remember, your career as a 30ish yr old Pharmacist can give 40+ years of income. Do not let your debt define your passion. As long as you do not have to live in a million dollar mansion and drive a $100K car, you will be quite comfortable even with this debt. After all, it is like having a second house note.

I am not trying to chastise anyone but rather to put money into perspective. Realistically, we all want to help people but money is a major consideration at all levels. Most of us like to eat every day and live where the rain doesn't fall on our heads when we sleep.

Just please understand, money is only paper. The lives you touch are much more important. If you value this calling, the money will be well spent.

I agree with you on the amount of money that pharmacists make. In my mind, once your at the middle-class level where you don't have to deal with the headaches of bills piling up, anything above that is icing on the cake: nice to have, but shouldn't be the primary source of one's contentment.

Yes, I understand that the 'standard' middle class pay would get a big chunk taken out because of loan repayments, but pharmacists generally make more to begin with. Take their average salary range of roughly $90,000-$110,000: Given a loan payment of ~$1,500 a month, or ~$18,000 a year, and you are still left with around $70,000 a year, which in most parts of the country (why, Cali, why...) is a nice chunk of change.

From browsing these forums though, it seems that an equal (or greater) problem is job security. Being $200,000 in debt with a stable well-paying job is one thing, but being $200,000 in debt while holding down a few part-time jobs is all the more stressful.

Originally Posted by bsggsb

Ok, so I have been reading a lot of threads about debt and the doom and gloom of Pharmacy. Here is my $.02 worth.... When I graduate from Pharm school I will be 48yrs old and have over $200K in debt. That is not scarry....what is scarry, is the responsibility you will have in your hands as a medical professional. In my life I have worked many years as a Paramedic on an ambulance, in an E.R., and other jobs with similar responsibilities. Medical care is a profession to be taken seriously and enter only if you are ready to commit to that.

School loans are no different than car loans, house notes, etc. They are a bill that must be paid. Yes, I know they can be quite large but so is the pay. Most people on SDN and entering this profession are <30yrs old. Remember, your career as a 30ish yr old Pharmacist can give 40+ years of income. Do not let your debt define your passion. As long as you do not have to live in a million dollar mansion and drive a $100K car, you will be quite comfortable even with this debt. After all, it is like having a second house note.

I am not trying to chastise anyone but rather to put money into perspective. Realistically, we all want to help people but money is a major consideration at all levels. Most of us like to eat every day and live where the rain doesn't fall on our heads when we sleep.

Just please understand, money is only paper. The lives you touch are much more important. If you value this calling, the money will be well spent.

You have a great outlook. I, like many here, are natural pessimists. It's refreshing to see somebody from time to time who isn't looking at pharmacy through rose-colored glasses, but also doesn't share my pessimistic viewpoint. Thanks.

Originally Posted by bsggsb

Just please understand, money is only paper. The lives you touch are much more important. If you value this calling, the money will be well spent.

True, money is only paper and touching lives is great....BUT, people not thinking like economists and weighing the opportunity costs and renumeration are fools...and a fool and his/her money are soon parted.

If the calculation switched such that you'd have to go $300k in debt to make $75k/yr...only a fool would make that kind of investment. You can help people and do all that feel good stuff with a better ROI in a different field.

Originally Posted by confettiflyer

eh, what's the point, it's just money.....

Originally Posted by confettiflyer

True, money is only paper and touching lives is great....BUT, people not thinking like economists and weighing the opportunity costs and renumeration are fools...and a fool and his/her money are soon parted.

If the calculation switched such that you'd have to go $300k in debt to make $75k/yr...only a fool would make that kind of investment. You can help people and do all that feel good stuff with a better ROI in a different field.

For a second, I wondered what had happened to the confetti we all know and love.

Originally Posted by bsggsb

Ok, so I have been reading a lot of threads about debt and the doom and gloom of Pharmacy. Here is my $.02 worth.... When I graduate from Pharm school I will be 48yrs old and have over $200K in debt. That is not scarry....what is scarry, is the responsibility you will have in your hands as a medical professional. In my life I have worked many years as a Paramedic on an ambulance, in an E.R., and other jobs with similar responsibilities. Medical care is a profession to be taken seriously and enter only if you are ready to commit to that.

School loans are no different than car loans, house notes, etc. They are a bill that must be paid. Yes, I know they can be quite large but so is the pay. Most people on SDN and entering this profession are <30yrs old. Remember, your career as a 30ish yr old Pharmacist can give 40+ years of income. Do not let your debt define your passion. As long as you do not have to live in a million dollar mansion and drive a $100K car, you will be quite comfortable even with this debt. After all, it is like having a second house note.

I am not trying to chastise anyone but rather to put money into perspective. Realistically, we all want to help people but money is a major consideration at all levels. Most of us like to eat every day and live where the rain doesn't fall on our heads when we sleep.

Just please understand, money is only paper. The lives you touch are much more important. If you value this calling, the money will be well spent.

Sorry, I have to be honest here. You are doing others a disservice by suggesting that 200k is a remotely reasonable price for a profession with a dwindling future.

200k is a downright scam. Take note that the price is NOT determined by the cost or the value.

Price is determined by what people are willing to pay.

As long as people are deluded into believing pharmacy is some sort of "dream job", as long as they think that a loan for school is comparable to a mortgage, as long as they think the amount of money they pay is a test of their "commitment", they will continue to be exploited for it.

We live in a time where the cost of everything is going up while the purchasing power of the dollar is on a decline, job opportunities are becoming more scarce and someone is trying to sell you something around every corner.

The world is changing but most of society remains oblivious. Those who have the foresight to see this change will prosper over those who follow the herd into the slaughterhouse.

$200k is $200k except when it's $200k and you only pay half

Originally Posted by owlegrad

For a second, I wondered what had happened to the confetti we all know and love.

hey why don't you go play hide and go f*ck yourself.

oh my bad i confused you with one of the pharmacy flower people

Originally Posted by Osiris

Sorry, I have to be honest here. You are doing others a disservice by suggesting that 200k is a remotely reasonable price for a profession with a dwindling future.

200k is a downright scam. Take note that the price is NOT determined by the cost or the value.

Price is determined by what people are willing to pay.

As long as people are deluded into believing pharmacy is some sort of "dream job", as long as they think that a loan for school is comparable to a mortgage, as long as they think the amount of money they pay is a test of their "commitment", they will continue to be exploited for it.

We live in a time where the cost of everything is going up while the purchasing power of the dollar is on a decline, job opportunities are becoming more scarce and someone is trying to sell you something around every corner.

The world is changing but most of society remains oblivious. Those who have the foresight to see this change will prosper over those who follow the herd into the slaughterhouse.

then what is a good number? < 120k ?

A really good business guy told me you should never take out more than you will be able to make in 1 year. If a pharmacist make 200K a year than 200K would be the MAX. But since Pharmacist only make about 100k to 110K a yr than I would not go over 100K unless you don't mind getting rip off.

I mean would you pay 10,000 over kelly blue book value for a car? Of course NOT! So you shouldn't take out more than you make in 1 year of student loans. It just won't benefit you at all if you do.

Originally Posted by SHC1984

A really good business guy told me you should never take out more than you will be able to make in 1 year. If a pharmacist make 200K a year than 200K would be the MAX. But since Pharmacist only make about 100k to 110K a yr than I would not go over 100K unless you don't mind getting rip off.

I mean would you pay 10,000 over kelly blue book value for a car? Of course NOT! So you shouldn't take out more than you make in 1 year of student loans. It just won't benefit you at all if you do.

Agreed.

I have always been passionate about pharmacy and would love to be a pharmacist, but I am NOT going to buy myself a degree. All of these schools are taking advantage of students and students are taking advantage of loans so they can take advantage of the opportunity to be a "professional". It's a maddening cycle if you ask me.

Originally Posted by SHC1984

A really good business guy told me you should never take out more than you will be able to make in 1 year. If a pharmacist make 200K a year than 200K would be the MAX. But since Pharmacist only make about 100k to 110K a yr than I would not go over 100K unless you don't mind getting rip off.

I mean would you pay 10,000 over kelly blue book value for a car? Of course NOT! So you shouldn't take out more than you make in 1 year of student loans. It just won't benefit you at all if you do.

Agreed. 1yr salary should be your guide, so your degree should cost no more than $120k to obtain.

Living expenses are another story, I argue those don't count since you'd be spending them regardless of what you're doing, but adding those to your student loan pile is a grey area.

For the record I did that and owe >200k cumulative (undergrad + rx school), but under pslf/ibr I will end up paying <$100k of that, so my #'s work.

Originally Posted by confettiflyer

Agreed. 1yr salary should be your guide, so your degree should cost no more than $120k to obtain.

Living expenses are another story, I argue those don't count since you'd be spending them regardless of what you're doing, but adding those to your student loan pile is a grey area.

For the record I did that and owe >200k cumulative (undergrad + rx school), but under pslf/ibr I will end up paying <$100k of that, so my #'s work.

So the people that owe 200K+ is adding in their undergrad college too?

I am sooooo GLAD I went to a public university! I am also very lucky that all the public colleges in North Carolina are so cheap that I was able to get out debt free! North Carolina public colleges tuition is only 3K to 5K. Even UNC is so cheap like 5K a year only...most people can get out debt free cause its so reasonable! I also got accepted into better private schools like Wake Forest and Emory, but didn't go b/c I didn't want to take out any loans at all. I am glad I made that choice.

For pharmacy school I got lucky that 1) I live with my aunt and uncle for free and they paid for my living expenses too...I really owe them some money when I start making six figures. and 2) my pharmacy school offers some merit base scholarships like 5K to 7K a year for good grades.

So I was able to get out of pharmacy school with less than 100K debt!

So I was lucky in several ways...but if I wasn't then I don't know what I would do.

One thing I am happy about is this....if I can't find a job when I graduate...I can set my 90K loans on income base repayment...if I am really that unlucky and can't find anything then I'll set it on income base repayment and pay the min..if I only make 30K then my min will be very low! Either way I will survive! It will suck making only 30K a year but that's life.

My real goal is to get a six figure job when I graduate and pay off that 90K ASAP!!!! But if that can't happen then it's life and I'll suck it up and move on.

When do you start your residency? When are you moving to CA?