22 MCAT, 3.8 sGPA, 3.5 Overall GPA and URM

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lobotomizeMe

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URM-African American 22 MCAT, 3.8 sGPA, 3.5 Overall GPA and URM

MCAT score is bad-I know-but I just can't seem to do well on it. Maybe test anxiety? I've never done well on standardized testing. I do well in science courses (3.82 sGPA), but I do not do well in Math courses (hence the 3.5 Overall)


EC's: Worked EMT-B for 3 years
1000+ Hours volunteering in free clinic (since high school)
2 medically related papers published (my name is first on one of them).
1 DO Shadowing (uncle-may get an LOR from him): 400+ Hours
1 MD shadowing: 60+ Hours
^I love medicine and I am directly involved in medicine.


Q1: What are my chances as a URM?
Q2: Are my EC's adequate? I don't have too much diversity of EC's but I contribute a lot of time to the ones that I have access to (like the free clinic).

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URM-African American 22 MCAT, 3.8 sGPA, 3.5 Overall GPA and URM

MCAT score is bad-I know-but I just can't seem to do well on it. Maybe test anxiety? I've never done well on standardized testing. I do well in science courses (3.82 sGPA), but I do not do well in Math courses (hence the 3.5 Overall)


EC's: Worked EMT-B for 3 years
1000+ Hours volunteering in free clinic (since high school)
2 medically related papers published (my name is first on one of them).
1 DO Shadowing (uncle-may get an LOR from him): 400+ Hours
1 MD shadowing: 60+ Hours
^I love medicine and I am directly involved in medicine.


Q1: What are my chances as a URM?
Q2: Are my EC's adequate? I don't have too much diversity of EC's but I contribute a lot of time to the ones that I have access to (like the free clinic).

https://www.aamc.org/download/157594/data/table25-b-mcatgpa-grid-black.pdf

Looks like you have a 43.8% chance. If you could get that MCAT up a bit, it would help a lot--just look at the data: for example, if you could just get your score to a 24-26, your chances would jump to 75%. Good luck
 
URM-African American 22 MCAT, 3.8 sGPA, 3.5 Overall GPA and URM

MCAT score is bad-I know-but I just can't seem to do well on it. Maybe test anxiety? I've never done well on standardized testing. I do well in science courses (3.82 sGPA), but I do not do well in Math courses (hence the 3.5 Overall)


EC's: Worked EMT-B for 3 years
1000+ Hours volunteering in free clinic (since high school)
2 medically related papers published (my name is first on one of them).
1 DO Shadowing (uncle-may get an LOR from him): 400+ Hours
1 MD shadowing: 60+ Hours
^I love medicine and I am directly involved in medicine.


Q1: What are my chances as a URM?
Q2: Are my EC's adequate? I don't have too much diversity of EC's but I contribute a lot of time to the ones that I have access to (like the free clinic).

Have you taken the mcat more than once? Your ECs are ok, but volunteering outside a clinic or hospital is often desirable. Are your papers research based?
 
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You need more volunteering and your MCAT will keep you out of every school. Being a URM doesn't help that much. What were your section sub scores? You need to retake it before you apply or you are wasting your money
 
1. Don't get an LOR from your uncle.
2. Math courses count for your sGPA I think.. (Biology, Math, Chemistry, Physics)
 
how on earth do you do so well in your science classes but then produce the worst score I've ever seen someone admit on an exam that covers only general, basic sciences?
 
You need more volunteering and your MCAT will keep you out of every school. Being a URM doesn't help that much. What were your section sub scores? You need to retake it before you apply or you are wasting your money

Being a URM is the only silver lining to be taken here and it will most certainly help (see linked spreadsheet).

OP, I can tell you though that even if you are able to get in, if a 22 is the best you can pull on the MCAT, med school is gonna be VERY hard for you. Your science GPA is legit, don't get me wrong, but for whatever reason, you are awful at standardized tests. If you really prep for the MCAT, i.e., take a class and dedicate 3-4 months on it and get a score in the 28-32 range, you will have a real strong chance at getting in, as well as proving to yourself that you will do well once in. WIth whatever you choose, I hope it works out, and good luck !:)
 
Exactly. Schools are hesitant to take someone with a 22 because they want you to be able to pass board exams. "Being bad at standardized tests" doesn't cut it because in medicine that is all you do
 
i think you are pretty much good for all DO schools.
22 might get you a seat in your state MD school or somewhere else(Howard..etc0
Get around 28+ with URM, you are pretty much in for most schools...even have a shot at those top ones.
 
BUMP! :D

I think this is a good thread because it reveals how much sdn Glorifies URM's into thinking that they will have a chance.

A 22 MCAT. OP, please retake it! Study for it. If you have given up, then maybe the career isn't for you.

Everyone else, Do you think the OP has a chance at DO schools? :eek:
 
I absolutely think he should retake. With that GPA, and being an URM, a solid MCAT will give him tons of options.
 
1. Don't get an LOR from your uncle.
2. Math courses count for your sGPA I think.. (Biology, Math, Chemistry, Physics)

Math courses count toward sGPA for AMCAS but not AACOMAS. I don't know why...
 
I think your URM status will really give you a push you need to get into a decent MD school! Don't have to consider DO too heavily at this point. Good luck!!!
 
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I have 2 points that have been mentioned on this thread that I want to reiterate.

1. Retake the darn MCAT. A 22? Really? Like someone above said, medicine is all about taking standardized exams to test your progress and knowledge. Despite your URM status, I believe that at least a 28+ is necessary for you to even consider applying.

2. You can still apply DO.. However, you will be cutting it close. I was browsing certain class profiles a while back for medical schools and one of the pieces of information present was the mcat score. I would typically see ranges (for DO programs) that started from 19 and ended up at 37 to 40. It is very unlikely that you may be the exception.

Look at number 1. Good luck.
 
Retake the MCAT... I wouldn't feel comfortable with any *human being* being my doctor with a 22 MCAT... Sorry for being harsh, but I suggest you work on your study habits or something (too much Facebook/Youtube?). But you may get in, and this is just one test. Good luck!
 
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I agree. I don't want someone who struggled in undergrad to be my doc, either. But we're talking about doctors for medically indigent/underserved patients, not for us or the general population.

So many pre-meds apply to medical school thinking they will be judged based on their accomplishments. This mindset demonstrates a certain sophomoric naivete and a troubling lack of cultural competence. Getting into medical school is not about your merits.
You can not be serious!
 
I agree. I don't want someone who struggled in undergrad to be my doc, either. But we're talking about doctors for medically indigent/underserved patients, not for us or the general population.

So many pre-meds apply to medical school thinking they will be judged based on their accomplishments. This mindset demonstrates a certain sophomoric naivete and a troubling lack of cultural competence. Getting into medical school is not about your merits.

Hmm..

Sounds like you're talking to yourself with that bolded part there..
 
I agree. I don't want someone who struggled in undergrad to be my doc, either. But we're talking about doctors for medically indigent/underserved patients, not for us or the general population.

So many pre-meds apply to medical school thinking they will be judged based on their accomplishments. This mindset demonstrates a certain sophomoric naivete and a troubling lack of cultural competence. Getting into medical school is not about your merits.

Yes I agree. While such a person would not even be fit as a veterinarian in an upper class white suburb such as the ones you and I live in, such dangerously sub-par physicians are fine for the plebeian scum that inhabit backwoods rural areas and inner cities. After all, there's so many 99%ers out there that no one's going to miss a few dead ones...or even a few hundred dozen lol! I mean, if my maid were to drop dead tomorrow I'm sure I could hire another one by the evening, they're easily replaceable.



No, but seriously though, you're a ****.

Also, I don't see any correlation between how you do in undergrad/on your MCAT and your performance as a doctor...what I do see is a correlation between how well you do in med school and your STEP exams and your performance as a doctor. While undergrad GPA and MCAT scores are correlated with med school performance and STEP 1 scores, it's hardly a perfect correlation, and trying to leap from undergrad performance to physician performance is like looking at a 2nd graders report card and saying "OMG you got a 'U' in science class, you're going to be a terrible doctor!"
 
I agree. I don't want someone who struggled in undergrad to be my doc, either. But we're talking about doctors for medically indigent/underserved patients, not for us or the general population.

So many pre-meds apply to medical school thinking they will be judged based on their accomplishments. This mindset demonstrates a certain sophomoric naivete and a troubling lack of cultural competence. Getting into medical school is not about your merits.

There are ways to make people aware of others' cultures. For any human being, even not you, a person who deals with life or death should be strong academically (we shouldn't keep lowering standards, seriously). What's culture going to do when academics aren't good enough? Why is culture also based on race??? Really, what if a person who was born Caucasian grew up in a predominately African-American culture and feels as one with this culture. Why shouldn't he be treated specially instead? I'm sure those who knew him for his whole life, for example, would interact well and feel comfortable with him (unless he or his patients are a little bit.. "showing preference for a certain ethnicity"), and he'd know the proper approach. Why should an African-American who grew up in Beverly Hills with barely any African-Americans around him get treated as a URM? It should be based on CULTURE to even be effective. It's just shallow right now.

Yes I agree. While such a person would not even be fit as a veterinarian in an upper class white suburb such as the ones you and I live in, such dangerously sub-par physicians are fine for the plebeian scum that inhabit backwoods rural areas and inner cities. After all, there's so many 99%ers out there that no one's going to miss a few dead ones...or even a few hundred dozen lol! I mean, if my maid were to drop dead tomorrow I'm sure I could hire another one by the evening, they're easily replaceable.!"

I believe what Laura S intended to say is that there has to be enough doctors who are experienced in that culture, so that underrepresented areas get enough healthcare services. Thus, doctors must be drawn from that applicant pool even if the average MCAT score is unfortunately low.
I, personally, agree on the condition of a safe MCAT score, but I think finding the culturally-experienced doctor should be based on his/her culture, not ethnicity (which may have no benefits for anybody, unless the doctors or patients have a preference for a certain race, just like almost everyone else actually does). Nevertheless, although I don't fully agree with the principle, it is a phenomenon common in every race, so healthcare has to be provided to everyone, no matter what.

It seems that the fixed racial diversity in physicians (even at the risk of a very low MCAT score, e.g. 22, compare this with that) is based on irrelevant politics, actually increases the risk on you and your family's lives, and maintains segregation, inequality, and racism (, and bitterness between races). When saving lives through complex medicine, racial diversity should not trump cultural diversity and competence. It's cultural diversity (where you lived, your background; e.g. an AA who grew up in a white community, versus a white person who grew up in an AA community) that's needed, not racial.

I expect this might lead to controversy and a potential "flame-war"... *Just put on my hazmat suit*
 
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Laura, I'm not talking about 3.9. I'm talking about having the minimum responsible academic capacity. You can't go with that attitude for a 2.0 GPA 15 MCAT, and let someone like that possibly harm/kill more people, waste school space by dropping out or not passing standardized exams later, a space which another more competent person, possibly from the same background could have used to benefit the same under-privileged people).
Please reread my post, which I spent a lot of time writing it clearly so people won't misread it, as you seem to have done. I said the white guy would return to his african-american home. Why won't an African American enjoy luxury in Beverly Hills as a plastic-surgeon? That applies to everyone.

Race matters because unfortunately, the majority of the population is racist, and so they may be visiting doctors of their own race. That should be changed first. But I wouldn't be comfortable at all with getting incompetent doctors into the field if they may be a hazard (even though I think 20 is the real minimum).
 
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Again, pre-meds. :rolleyes:

The goal of medical schools (well, most of them, anyway) is not to accept the smartest (measured by proxy using GPA and MCAT - let's not get into an intelligence debate here) kids out there. If that were the case, all the 3.9/40 candidates would get accepted, when in fact we know many of them do not.

The goal of medical schools is to generate physicians who will provide medical care to those who need it. Yes, the white dude with a 3.97/40 and multiple publications in high-impact journals would probably make a brilliant plastic surgeon in NYC. However, what about poor rural areas? What about inner cities? Who's going to practice there? Is your school's average MCAT score more important than rural and minority patients?

It took me a while to change my mindset so it was patient oriented and not pre-med pride oriented. There is evidence showing black doctors, by and large, see far more black patients. Ditto for other minority doctors. Docs from rural areas are more likely to practice in a rural area. With the goal of churning out doctors who will help address medical underservedness, you see why it is thusly critical to have a diverse medical student body that has students who are from rural areas and/or are URMs.

Because race matters, you then must accept the hardest thing: the admissions process is not solely merit based. There are factors you cannot control. That's just the way it is.

Can you provide that data? There's been a lot of that floating around on SDN lately and I've never seen anything that even remotely supports your claim.
 
Laura, I'm not talking about 3.9. I'm talking about having the minimum responsible academic capacity. You can't go with that attitude for a 2.0 GPA 15 MCAT, and let them kill people (or waste school space by dropping out or not passing standardized exams later, a space which another more competent person, possibly from the same background could have used to benefit the same under-privileged people).
Please reread my post, which I spent a lot of time writing it clearly so people won't misread it, as you seem to have done. I said the white guy would return to his african-american home. Why won't an African American enjoy luxury in Beverly Hills as a plastic-surgeon? That applies to everyone.

You must be new here. People on SDN read what they want to read. It's pointless trying to come up with a clear and concise post because someone will always misinterpret it and then go ahead and misrepresent what you wrote.
 
At least this thread didn't get hijacked...

/eyeroll
 
Again, pre-meds. :rolleyes:

The goal of medical schools (well, most of them, anyway) is not to accept the smartest (measured by proxy using GPA and MCAT - let's not get into an intelligence debate here) kids out there. If that were the case, all the 3.9/40 candidates would get accepted, when in fact we know many of them do not.

The goal of medical schools is to generate physicians who will provide medical care to those who need it. Yes, the white dude with a 3.97/40 and multiple publications in high-impact journals would probably make a brilliant plastic surgeon in NYC. However, what about poor rural areas? What about inner cities? Who's going to practice there? Is your school's average MCAT score more important than rural and minority patients?

It took me a while to change my mindset so it was patient oriented and not pre-med pride oriented. There is evidence showing black doctors, by and large, see far more black patients. Ditto for other minority doctors. Docs from rural areas are more likely to practice in a rural area. With the goal of churning out doctors who will help address medical underservedness, you see why it is thusly critical to have a diverse medical student body that has students who are from rural areas and/or are URMs.

Because race matters, you then must accept the hardest thing: the admissions process is not solely merit based. There are factors you cannot control. That's just the way it is.
If you read above, people weren't objecting to the idea that med schools should accept minority students with the goal in mind of increasing underserved populations' access to healthcare. They were objecting to the part where you said that while you wouldn't be comfortable being seen by a doctor who had poor academics, it's okay for certain segments of the population to be seen by that same doctor, the implication there being that because they're poor/minority they shouldn't have the same expectation of quality care/competence.

Now as someone else pointed out to me above, your actual intention with that sentence may have been different, but you definitely chose the worst possible wording to use if that's the case.
 
URM-African American 22 MCAT, 3.8 sGPA, 3.5 Overall GPA and URM

MCAT score is bad-I know-but I just can't seem to do well on it. Maybe test anxiety? I've never done well on standardized testing. I do well in science courses (3.82 sGPA), but I do not do well in Math courses (hence the 3.5 Overall)


EC's: Worked EMT-B for 3 years
1000+ Hours volunteering in free clinic (since high school)
2 medically related papers published (my name is first on one of them).
1 DO Shadowing (uncle-may get an LOR from him): 400+ Hours
1 MD shadowing: 60+ Hours
^I love medicine and I am directly involved in medicine.


Q1: What are my chances as a URM?
Q2: Are my EC's adequate? I don't have too much diversity of EC's but I contribute a lot of time to the ones that I have access to (like the free clinic).
Did you get in?
 
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