This person is dumb as hell, but they still get to grade me. (yay)

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Originally Posted by Lolscan

I am glad you brought up those other studies. Should I pick them apart too? Because I can certainly bash on them all day to prove MY point.

You certainly could, but you would unintentionally prove my point instead. My point is that anyone with a little knowledge of the literature can find some BS studies to support his/her bias....and then selectively ignore literature that argues against that bias.

In my chosen field, we say that a surgeon uses a the literature much like a drunk uses a lamp post: more for support than illumination.

I believe that discrimination is very prevalent in medicine. However, I don't think that Asian-Americans are getting the worst of it. There is discrimination against foreign doctors with English as a second language, there is discrimination against DOs and IMGs, and there is discrimination against women. Most of us whities are afraid to be openly discriminatory against Asians because we assume you all know karate.

As for grades, I believe that strong students of all races and backgrounds consistently get good evaluations and good grades. My AOA class certainly wasn't full of quarterbacks and homecoming queens.

I've already mentioned in my previous post how I think students cope with disappointment, and I think this coping mechanism is more prevalent than racism and unfair grading.

Anyway, I'm getting too old and boring to get into big SDN arguments. Five or six years ago I would have loved it, but now it seems exhausting. Please don't have hard feelings about me using you to illustrate my points. It's okay to be upset about the subjectivity of third-year grading....but I don't think anyone has suggested a better method so far, and I certainly don't think grades should be based entirely on a multiple-choice test.

Honestly, does it really matter....?

Originally Posted by SLUser11

You certainly could, but you would unintentionally prove my point instead. My point is that anyone with a little knowledge of the literature can find some BS studies to support his/her bias....and then selectively ignore literature that argues against that bias.

In my chosen field, we say that a surgeon uses a the literature much like a drunk uses a lamp post: more for support than illumination.

I believe that discrimination is very prevalent in medicine. However, I don't think that Asian-Americans are getting the worst of it. There is discrimination against foreign doctors with English as a second language, there is discrimination against DOs and IMGs, and there is discrimination against women. Most of us whities are afraid to be openly discriminatory against Asians because we assume you all know karate.

As for grades, I believe that strong students of all races and backgrounds consistently get good evaluations and good grades. My AOA class certainly wasn't full of quarterbacks and homecoming queens.

I've already mentioned in my previous post how I think students cope with disappointment, and I think this coping mechanism is more prevalent than racism and unfair grading.

Anyway, I'm getting too old and boring to get into big SDN arguments. Five or six years ago I would have loved it, but now it seems exhausting. Please don't have hard feelings about me using you to illustrate my points. It's okay to be upset about the subjectivity of third-year grading....but I don't think anyone has suggested a better method so far, and I certainly don't think grades should be based entirely on a multiple-choice test.

No hard feelings definitely and I don't expect you to understand the whole scope of asian american experiences. I could give you a whole lecture on asian american issues in the work environment that leads to bias. Anyway you can believe that the study is crap and I could give you another 30 reasons why it is valid. But in the end you are tired and I gotta study. Again, I would be great to have a discussion.

Just as an aside, I do find that surgery is one of the more objective fields since you tend to value hard work and dependability more so than fluff.

Originally Posted by Lolscan

No hard feelings definitely and I don't expect you to understand the whole scope of asian american experiences. I could give you a whole lecture on asian american issues in the work environment that leads to bias. Anyway you can believe that the study is crap and I could give you another 30 reasons why it is valid. But in the end you are tired and I gotta study. Again, I would be great to have a discussion.

Just as an aside, I do find that surgery is one of the more objective fields since you tend to value hard work and dependability more so than fluff.

That's completely contrary to my experience with surgery and with many others - just as with ANY field of medicine a good portion of it does involve flattery and sucking up, unfortunately.

Originally Posted by Lolscan

Ugh learn to use google. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2574397/

Yes, because saying "that study by APAMSA" really narrowed it down.

I am glad you have nothing better to do than waste your time going through my post history. FYI again, I never said I would have gotten AOA if I were white. My post was about, has anyone else gotten **** because they couldn't not be physically recognized (which is a bare minimum for being evaluation IMO). If you aren't asian, then you would never understand the feeling and anger associated with being deindividualized and perceived as a perpetual foreigner. I don't expect you grasp anything associated with those posts. And yes racism exists and white privilege is awesome.

lol

Originally Posted by Lolscan

But honestly there are problems with every single study but it does not mean that the conclusions aren't valid whatsoever.

That's exactly what it means. At best, the conclusion you can draw is that you need a better study.