For California Residency...MSSM or UCI?

[Mike341]

I am in at UCI and Mount Sinai and I'm a california resident who wishes to return to California for residency. I want to go away for Med school (new york city), but definately want to return for residency. Assuming my credentials will be identical both at Mssm and UCI, which would yield me a higher chance at a residency in California? I want to leave california for med school but not if i'm compromising my chances of coming back later. Do both give roughly equal chances? Any thoughts? Thanks.

[exmike]

you are almost always more likely to obtain a residency in the state you went to school in than obtaining one in a state other than the one you went to school in.

[CalBeE]

Originally posted by exmike
you are almost always more likely to obtain a residency in the state you went to school in than obtaining one in a state other than the one you went to school in.

Really? Is that only true at State-funded hospitals, or just all hospitals in general?

[TRUE]

exmike might be generally correct, but if you shine at both schools, you can get a residency wherever you want. If you don't do so well though, you're probably better off staying home.

[somekevinguy]

what about say duke vs ucsd? thyere both good schools but would you be at a disadavantage for a cali residency (more specifically, a ucsd residency) coming from duke vs ucsd?

[Mike341]

Are you guys considering the "residency location factor" when deciding on med schools?

[exmike]

facted was more right than me. if you do well, you'll go anywhere you want. certainly if I had the chance to stay in cali, i would jump on it in a second.. unless the hospital is losing its accredidation (re: Drew)

[VCMM414]

Originally posted by somekevinguy
what about say duke vs ucsd? thyere both good schools but would you be at a disadavantage for a cali residency (more specifically, a ucsd residency) coming from duke vs ucsd?

Well, if you insist on using UCSD as an example, then I think the advantage for obtaining a cali residency goes to UCSD. Especially a good Cali residency. Any differences in reputation between UCSD and Duke (not that much) is negated by the location advantage.

If it were UCI vs Duke, though, it might be harder to say for sure.

[Yogi Bear]

are there any other factors that may affect your desire to go to mt. sanai (i.e. religion?). if u'd like the ny environment,, then mssm might be best. being in the city, applying for residency will also be easier, as you'd have a greater selection of quality programs w/in a short distance.

[Mike341]

as far as I know, mt. sinai doesnt have a religious affiliation anymore...I prefer to get away from southern california as I've been there my whole life. I didnt realize till recently that location of med school was important to location of residency. Without considering the residency location factor, I would prefer to go to mt. sinai.


I was wondering from others...Are you considering medical school location in terms of residency location as a factor in deciding which med school to choose? If so, how important of a factor? Does it matter enough to be as important as other factors? Or are you not thinking that far ahead yet? I know this is a personalized question, but I would like to see what others think.

[spaz]

you will probly have a better chance of getting a cali residency by attending uci.

that said, it sounds like you want to get out of cali for a few years and if i were you, i'd choose mount sinai. mt sinai seems like a great school (i love their emphasis on community medicine/public health - if only they would interview me). i've been in socal all my life, and although i probly won't have the option of staying in CA, my main reasons for wanting to stay here are my boyfriend and the weather (i'm one of those who loves the season-less, boring cali sunshine). oh and there is the tuition factor too.

but yeah, i'm looking forward to getting out of cali for a while (knock on wood)

i'm not really factoring in residency location since i doubt that i will be accepted to a cali med school. you'll only do med school once so i think you should pick the school where you'll be happiest and get the most out of your education. do well at mt sinai, and do some rotations in cali and you should be fine.

good luck!

[Mike341]

thanks for the reply Spaz.

[TheFlash]

Originally posted by Mike341
I am in at UCI and Mount Sinai and I'm a california resident who wishes to return to California for residency. I want to go away for Med school (new york city), but definately want to return for residency. Assuming my credentials will be identical both at Mssm and UCI, which would yield me a higher chance at a residency in California? I want to leave california for med school but not if i'm compromising my chances of coming back later. Do both give roughly equal chances? Any thoughts? Thanks.

One of my friend's who recently interviewed at MSSM had a 4th year student interviewer who had just landed a spot at UCSF, the undisputed best Cali school, for residency. Bottom line is that you can get any residency you want if you do well in med school wherever you go, especially a top tier school like MSSM. However, if you're hell-bent on staying in Cali for residency, regardless of the caliber of program you match into, then UCI may be a better fit.

Just my 2%.

[Mike341]

Is there any way to look up a residency program's list of acceptances to see which med school's they selected from?

So its safe to assume that fighting for a competitive specialty back in Cali from a NY school is not something to count on. I wish I had known the importance of med school location with respect to the location of the residency. Is it because residency programs in Cali are more familiar with med schools in Cali? or because med school students in Cali rotate through these hospitals in Cali whereas their new york city counterparts may not?

[somekevinguy]

Originally posted by VCMM414
Well, if you insist on using UCSD as an example, then I think the advantage for obtaining a cali residency goes to UCSD. Especially a good Cali residency. Any differences in reputation between UCSD and Duke (not that much) is negated by the location advantage.

If it were UCI vs Duke, though, it might be harder to say for sure.

Really? That's interesting...woudl the same apply for say..harvard/hopkins (vs ucsd)....bc besides those two...Duke is right there at the top in terms of reputation....imho ..it seems like there are a few schools that transcend that location bias...

[Spitting Camel]

somekevinguy... have you decided which school you're going to yet?

[somekevinguy]

Originally posted by AlreadyInDebt
somekevinguy... have you decided which school you're going to yet?

I'm actually really torn and having a hard time deciding. Now in no way do I want to be the big jerk complaining about having to choose from acceptances or whatever but just quite honestly, I'm having a hard time choosing....I may start some thread if i figure out how without soudning obnoxious to get some input from fellow sdners but yeah...at this point...as a cali resident..im deciding between:

Duke
WashU (potential of a full ride)
UCSD
Baylor (full ride)
Michigan

I really like california and want to be here for residency and i love san diego, but i feel like i may be passing up a great opportunity by not atteding some of these other schools (particularly duke).

anyhow, any advice/input/comments about the schools would be greatly appreciated. thanks.

[jlee9531]

well at least in california...if you go to a school in cali then you will have a great chance at getting residency in cali....

with uc davis leading the way with 75% of their class ending up in cali for residency.

[Mike341]

Do you guys think a big reason why the cali schools have high yields to cali residency programs is because these cali students prefer the cali programs and rank them higher whereas east coast students for example rank their home institutions higher?
For example, someone from new york city may choose to attend a new york school med school and then rank higher east coast programs.

Just a thought

[pyroporphrin]

Is a very hard decision and one which should not be decided based on opinions at SDN. Many of the replies you are getting are probably from people that want to get into MSSM and are hoping for withdrawls. You should call UCD and MSSM, see what they say. That's just my opinion of course. Good luck

I do believe that if you are making this decision so hard is just because deep inside you know you'll never leave California.

[Jalby]

Originally posted by Mike341
Do you guys think a big reason why the cali schools have high yields to cali residency programs is because these cali students prefer the cali programs and rank them higher whereas east coast students for example rank their home institutions higher?
For example, someone from new york city may choose to attend a new york school med school and then rank higher east coast programs.

Just a thought

(this does not applay to some of the easy residencies like FP and Peds)

No. Having talked to a few residency directors at my school, the only real way to get a residency at my school is if you do a away rotation and do well, you come from USC, or you are at a top school. Otherwise, it is very hard to get a residency spot here unless you are stellar are your own school. So you can go to MSSM, but unless you are in the top 5% of the class, you could really kiss a competative Cali residency goodbye. Whereas if you went to UCI and was in the top 25% of the class, you are almost gaurunteed a competative residency in Cali. The Derm program here has 3 spots, and it recieved tons of aplications. 60 of those aplications were from the validictorians of thier school. (This is second hand information, not as good as the other info I normally have.)

[meanderson]

I'm not sure why cali residency spots are so desired. Top ranked programs exist in every region of the country. I don't want to live in cali, so it doesn't really concern me, but just curious.....

UCI vs. MSSM. The cost factor here hasn't been mentioned. Wouldn't there be an 80k+ or so difference in tuition costs? Maybe MSSM has the better national reputation with Irvine having the better rep in california, but I think the huge cost difference trumps this. It's not like we are talking about Loma Linda vs. Hopkins.......

[meanderson]

Originally posted by meanderson
The cost factor here hasn't been mentioned. Wouldn't there be an 80k+ or so difference in tuition costs? [/B]

Ooops. I was thinking about the tuition difference when california actually had money in their state budget. Now it won't be nearly as large.

[Mike341]

Maybe its because more people from california apply to the california programs to begin with and therefore most of the spots proportionally are given to californians. The same goes with any region. All else being equal (board scores, grades, etc), would they rather have a student from lets say UCI than from MSSM?

Just like the fact that Geffen is 25% UCLA undergrads, not that they favor UCLA undergrads but that they get alot more ucla undergrad applicants that consider Geffen as their first choice. Make sense?

[uclacrewdude]

Originally posted by Mike341
Do you guys think a big reason why the cali schools have high yields to cali residency programs is because these cali students prefer the cali programs and rank them higher whereas east coast students for example rank their home institutions higher?
For example, someone from new york city may choose to attend a new york school med school and then rank higher east coast programs.

Just a thought

people just want to live in california. cali people wanna stay, many outsiders wanna stay, and people who never been wanna go. part of it is just a glut of people wanting to be in cali.

[lizzylu]

Hi Mike,

Here's another point of view...
Cali (whether they outwardly state it or not) tends to favor Cali folks. and not just those who went here for school, but those who grew up here and who's parents pay taxes here.

Now I know things become more of a level playing field when it comes to residency, but I still think it matters. When interviewing in cali for residency, if you've lived here for 22-odd years and only been out of the state for medical school (and a reputable one at that) I don't think they'll hold it against you in any way.

However, w/ that said. You'll have an in-state tuition at Cali versus an out-of state in NYC. That's huge. Maybe not for everyone, but w/ two equally ranked schools, I'd go for the cheaper loans. You know NYC is great, but a library is a library is a library. and that's where we'll all be for the next four years.

good luck w/ the decision, let us know.

[Jalby]

Originally posted by meanderson
I'm not sure why cali residency spots are so desired. Top ranked programs exist in every region of the country. I don't want to live in cali, so it doesn't really concern me, but just curious.....

UCI vs. MSSM. The cost factor here hasn't been mentioned. Wouldn't there be an 80k+ or so difference in tuition costs? Maybe MSSM has the better national reputation with Irvine having the better rep in california, but I think the huge cost difference trumps this. It's not like we are talking about Loma Linda vs. Hopkins.......

It's because of the weather probably that everybody wants to be here. It's supposed to be 82 today. Also, the UC's tuitions are going to be quite higher next year, so the difference might only be 40-50K. And I would definately say that UCI's rep in Cali is better than MSSM.

[VCMM414]

Originally posted by Jalby
And I would definately say that UCI's rep in Cali is better than MSSM.

Depends on who you are talking about. If you are referring to non-healthcare professionals then you are right, but then again UCI is probably better known in Cali than some schools (particularly southern ones like Duke/Vandy/Emory/Baylor). Doesn't mean UCI is necessarily better... it's just a name-recognition thing.

OTOH, if you are talking about PDs and physicians, I would think (hope) that they've heard of MSSM, or Duke, or Baylor.

Still, having said all that, it's still easier to get a Cali residency coming from a Cali school

[VCMM414]

Originally posted by somekevinguy
Really? That's interesting...woudl the same apply for say..harvard/hopkins (vs ucsd)....bc besides those two...Duke is right there at the top in terms of reputation....imho ..it seems like there are a few schools that transcend that location bias...

Yea Harvard/Hopkins vs UCSD is kinda hard to judge. I still don't think the SD student would be at any disadvantage though when going for a Cali residency. Again, it's a nationally well-known school, albeit not "top 10," so it really has a lot going for it especially in California. Harvard/Hopkins is, well, Harvard/Hopkins. They'll get their share of competitive residencies without a doubt.

Don't get me wrong, Duke is a great school. It's just that coming out of UCSD you basically will get a Cali residency if you want one (especially if you are doing slightly less competitive residencies like IM, Peds, etc.), but it's not quite as automatic if you are from Duke.

All IMO, of course.

[Jalby]

Originally posted by VCMM414
Depends on who you are talking about. If you are referring to non-healthcare professionals then you are right, but then again UCI is probably better known in Cali than some schools (particularly southern ones like Duke/Vandy/Emory/Baylor). Doesn't mean UCI is necessarily better... it's just a name-recognition thing.

OTOH, if you are talking about PDs and physicians, I would think (hope) that they've heard of MSSM, or Duke, or Baylor.

Still, having said all that, it's still easier to get a Cali residency coming from a Cali school

I know it's anectdodle, and I hate it when people use anectdodle stuff. Over in the Keck thread there are people who didn't get in so they are whining about us only accepting superstars. But my point: I never heard of MSSM until applying to med school. I had heard of UCI.

[carrigallen]

UCI. No ifs, ands, or buts.

I've noticed most of the people from the east coast who "manage" to get into residency in cali are doing primary care residencies for kaiser permanente or other non academic programs. And they feel they are lucky for this. It will be expensive/difficult to interviews & do rotations in california. your lor's will have strength regionally, but the further you go from your home school, their strength decreases slowly.

I'm not saying its impossible, I'm just putting forward my feelings.