Where are the top tier EM residencies?

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jane2

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I'd appreciate any information anyone could offer about which are the top / 2nd / 3rd tier residencies in this specialty. Many thanks.
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Uh Oh - I feel badness coming...

Check the freqeuently asked questions sticky. Do a search. This has been discussed ad nauseum on the forum and there has never been any clear consensus. The top tier programs are the ones you will rank the highest.
 
the answer to this question is incredibly unrewarding. There is no agreed upon rankings (except In'N'Out in California), however I think on FAQ page or on a thread about 6 months ago there was sort of an arbitrary listing of some of the better programs. Sorry there isn't a better answer, but there isn't, so don't rack your brain and search the internet for hours, you won't find anything.
 
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IMO Location, Location, Location..

My semi-unbiased list of *some* of the more competetive programs, so not necessarily the best..

U of C, Christ, Indy, Carolinas, Cincy, UCLA-Harbor, Arizona (I gotta put that one in there), Vandy, and a bunch of others. I just thought this might get you a head start.

FWIW look at some of the older threads and see the comments people put down.

The bottom line is this you have to answer some Qs for yourself, Academic vs community, What special programs/interests do you have and who has them, for example I like Peds and Wash U and UCLA Harbor had the BEST Peds BY FAR IMO when I interviewed. You also have to think about where you want to live. My fav program when I interviewed was prob Wash U but because of the wife it was #6 or 7 on my list.

Hope this helps.. Though I am guessing it doesnt!
 
Let me also say some programs are competetive just because of location, for example NYC has so many programs not too many of them are SUPER competetive, but that doesnt mean they arent great.

other top tier progs Denver, OHSU, Texas Tech (for BKN), Emory (I could seriously go on for a while), I think Ill stop now and pad elsewhere.
 
I will answer this with, do a search, we just had this discussion. But to save you a little time....top tier is an individual quality. I interviewed/rotated at several top tier programs that I didn't really feel fit me, but everyone else says that they are top tier. Here's a short list of "historicallly" top tier programs, in no order, just as they come to mind.
Indiana, Cincy, Hennepin, Denver, Chrisitiana, anywhere in California is hard to get into unless you're from there. This is a very short list, there are so many incredible programs out there, but these are ones that show up on everyones list of historically strong programs.
 
Kbrown is pretty much right.. If you go to a "top" tier program and you dont fit you will be so miserable that I wouldnt even want to mention. You have to look at fit and geography. I felt like I fit at 8 of 9 places I interviewed.. Some of my friends didnt feel that way, they felt they only fit in at half of the places or fewer.
 
Okay, I will bite. After processing some thousand or more posts on this forum this year, I have come up with my personal list of programs that I believe are likely to be the most sought after, most applied to, favorites for people to talk about, etc.... This may end up being nothing about the actual training but about their "popularity" factor, but I bet if you did a search of the most commonly discussed programs talked about on SDN, it would include the following in no particular order:

Carolinas
Christiana
Cook County
U Chicago
Indiana U
Vanderbilt
Denver
Cincinnati
Hennepin
UC's (not real familiar with Cali but I keep hearing them come up)

Then there are the ones I came across that I feel undoubtedly deserve to be mentioned in the same crowd because of unique features but they are lesser known programs due to location mostly.

U Pitt
U Illinois Peoria
Christ Advocate (arguably the true best program in Chicago)
Metrohealth/ Case Western
Texas Tech- El Paso (talk about 3rd world pathology being a nine iron shot from the border, and the border being a dried up creek)
Scott and White
U Iowa (new program headed for greatness...anyone who gets in now will be part of something HUGE in the future)
OHSU
Palmetto
Maryland (gets overshadowed by Hopkins..but not sure why)
UVa- Charlotsville is a great town and a huge medical center
Geisinger- truly a great program limited by its geography
Mayo- truly any program at Mayo is top knotch...gets overshadowed by Hennepin and Regions, but anyone who interviewed here knows different!
Maricopa- not my cup of tea, but truly a great program
LSU-BR- somebody said it best...good old Chevy with a few dents in the bumper

All this is just my opinion and I am sure I left out many top programs. I'll reitterate what was told to me a long time ago...get in where you like the people and where you will be happy. You will get good training anywhere because of the accreditation standards.
 
The top tier program is the one you match at.


Who cares about "top-tier" anway, except for snob appeal. You get to say "my residency is better than your residency, etc."

All programs are "top tier" if you come away from residency boarded in Emergency Medicine.
 
Thanks very much for the replies. This is really helpful.
 
jane2 said:
Thanks very much for the replies. This is really helpful.
Click to expand...

I like University of Washington (Harborview is the only level 1 trauma centre for 5 states).

Highland Hospital / Alameda County Medical Center is great too.

Just my $0.02. :idea:
 
new_avatar said:
I like University of Washington (Harborview is the only level 1 trauma centre for 5 states).

Highland Hospital / Alameda County Medical Center is great too.

Just my $0.02. :idea:
Click to expand...
Highland ROCKS!!
 
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Out of curiosity, where do you guys think U Mass fits in terms of 'competitiveness'? I ask only because it sounds like a really cool program, but being located in Wortchester may hurt it...? Anyway, if anyone has any opinion on the matter, please post!
 
corpsmanUP - I would add Emory and DEFINATELY Wake Forest to that list... but as mentioned above you get two completely different things at each program... both of which are probably rewarding.
 
not sure if madigan is up and running but they rarely take civilians anyway... also, there are 2 additional level one trauma centers in portland, oregon about 3 hours south of seattle...just to correct new_avatar :rolleyes:
 
missdr said:
not sure if madigan is up and running but they rarely take civilians anyway... also, there are 2 additional level one trauma centers in portland, oregon about 3 hours south of seattle...just to correct new_avatar :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
UW/Madigan gossip (from an RN at UW, my former employer before med school): Madigan pulled out of the joint program. They used to split the residents, 4 civilian, 6 military. The Army wants to train more EM docs and isn't happy with Harborview (they use non-EM boarded docs to train in the ED). UW is going to miss the residents - they kept the ED running smoothly. UW wants to start its own program, not sure how it will go. Again, this is gossip from a 3AM phone call a few months ago... ;)
As to trauma centers: Harborview IS the only level one trauma center for 5 states: Washington, Wyoming, Alaska, Montana and Idaho (the WWAMI states). UW is the only medical school in those states, too. Oregon is on its own in the Pacific NW, it's not part of the deal. Sure, the Madigan residents are doing their trauma at Emmanuel in Portland (see Harborview comment above), but Oregon is happy to be alone... :rolleyes:
 
southerndoc said:
I would LOVE to live and practice in Seattle. If UW developed a program, I would seriously consider a faculty position there if I was offered one. Perhaps I could be involved with the Medic One system as well. Seattle is an awesome city.
Click to expand...
For all of its problems, UW is a great place. Sure, they are in the news every few weeks for some problem, but Seattle has so few newsworthy issues that minor stuff makes big news. The Medic One system is run out of Harborview, UW's sister hospital. I'm sure you could be involved in both.
On of the ED attendings regularly gets the "best faculty" vote from the med students. The pathology is great, half the patients have a history of transplant or VP shunt or something interesting. And no real trauma, except for the frat boys that get shot and their friends drive them to the ED (no joke - they didn't know they had been shot until the triage nurse told them. Good times).
I have 3 more years of school and I hope they get the program fixed by then. Vegas is fun but I miss Seattle. ;)
 
Gregg said:
As to trauma centers: Harborview IS the only level one trauma center for 5 states: Washington, Wyoming, Alaska, Montana and Idaho (the WWAMI states). UW is the only medical school in those states, too.
Click to expand...

I understand about UW being the only medical school for those five states, but does the distinction of being the only trauma center for five states actually mean anything? If someone is involved in some serious trauma in Alaska, what happens to them? I can't imagine they get sent to Seattle! Do they just go to the local level two trauma center? Or if they're in southern Wyoming, say, wouldn't it be faster to send them to Denver?
 
lingonberry said:
I If someone is involved in some serious trauma in Alaska, what happens to them? I can't imagine they get sent to Seattle!
Click to expand...

Well, they die.

edit: bad bkn!
 
BKN said:
Well, they die.

edit: bad bkn!
Click to expand...


an entire generation ahead of me and still you have not learned to bite your tongue.... JK :laugh:

There truly is no hope for me is there? No hope at all :oops:
 
lingonberry said:
I understand about UW being the only medical school for those five states, but does the distinction of being the only trauma center for five states actually mean anything? If someone is involved in some serious trauma in Alaska, what happens to them? I can't imagine they get sent to Seattle! Do they just go to the local level two trauma center? Or if they're in southern Wyoming, say, wouldn't it be faster to send them to Denver?
Click to expand...

Well, at Mayo we routinely get trauma patients transferred from Eastern Montana. Not a short flight at all considering we are on the eastern edge of Minnesota. If there are no centers then transfers can be quite long...

- H
 
Whoa. I almost asked, "but what about South Dakota?" :laugh:
 
FoughtFyr said:
Well, at Mayo we routinely get trauma patients transferred from Eastern Montana. Not a short flight at all considering we are on the eastern edge of Minnesota. If there are no centers then transfers can be quite long...

- H
Click to expand...

Salt Lake will get a lot of the trauma from Wyoming, Idaho, Montana, W.Colorado etc, it all depends on geography as well as availibility of fixed wing aircraft/pilots/flight nurses. Also, a trauma w/major burns may choose a city over another that has a great burn center (or hypothermia, or family location as well).
 
lingonberry said:
I understand about UW being the only medical school for those five states, but does the distinction of being the only trauma center for five states actually mean anything? If someone is involved in some serious trauma in Alaska, what happens to them? I can't imagine they get sent to Seattle! Do they just go to the local level two trauma center? Or if they're in southern Wyoming, say, wouldn't it be faster to send them to Denver?
Click to expand...
Honestly, most of it is a political game. Some of the hospitals in the Seattle area want to upgrade trauma levels, but Harborview blocks them from doing so. They use a "we need X# of patients a year to maintain competence" and it always works. The reason there are no other level 1s around is lack of #s of cases. The combined population of the 5 states is about 9 million, with almost 6 million is Washington alone. Greater Seattle has a bigger population than Alaska, Montana and Wyoming combined.
The whole WWAMI thing is actually more applicable to the medical school and tertiary care than trauma.
Airlift NW (yet another UW run operation) does quite a business shuttling patients from Alaska to Seattle. They get stabilized in AK and then flown down to Seattle for treatment/followup, especially burns and rehab. Plus, Seattle is closer to parts of AK than Anchorage. As to Montana, Idaho and Wyoming, I'm sure their level 2 trauma centers can handle most anything, but stuff still finds its way to Harborview. Or Denver. ;)

Oh, for those considering relocating to Seattle, I'll do my civic duty: It rains all the time. :p
 
BKN said:
Well, they die.

edit: bad bkn!
Click to expand...

Ha ha ha, go ahead and mock me, but it is a perfectly sensible question. For example, how am I supposed to know that they send those Alaska patients to Seattle, and not to say, Vladivostok? It's practically just as close for some of them.

Hmmm, does anyone know if they have a trauma center there? I wonder how their residency program rates??
 
From southwest Idaho, we stabilize at our level 2 trauma center. If it is a severe burn, then we typically fly them down to SLC. The only patients I have flown to Seattle or Portland are VA patients transferring for cardiac surgery. Never to Harborview yet. When I did some clinical rotations at U. of Utah's burn unit, they said that a good 50-60% of their business is from SW Idaho. Apparently we know how to have a good time...
 
corpsmanUP said:
Okay, I will bite. After processing some thousand or more posts on this forum this year, I have come up with my personal list of programs that I believe are likely to be the most sought after, most applied to, favorites for people to talk about, etc.... This may end up being nothing about the actual training but about their "popularity" factor, but I bet if you did a search of the most commonly discussed programs talked about on SDN, it would include the following in no particular order:

Carolinas
Christiana
Cook County
U Chicago
Indiana U
Vanderbilt
Denver
Cincinnati
Hennepin
UC's (not real familiar with Cali but I keep hearing them come up)

Then there are the ones I came across that I feel undoubtedly deserve to be mentioned in the same crowd because of unique features but they are lesser known programs due to location mostly.

U Pitt
U Illinois Peoria
Christ Advocate (arguably the true best program in Chicago)
Metrohealth/ Case Western
Texas Tech- El Paso (talk about 3rd world pathology being a nine iron shot from the border, and the border being a dried up creek)
Scott and White
U Iowa (new program headed for greatness...anyone who gets in now will be part of something HUGE in the future)
OHSU
Palmetto
Maryland (gets overshadowed by Hopkins..but not sure why)
UVa- Charlotsville is a great town and a huge medical center
Geisinger- truly a great program limited by its geography
Mayo- truly any program at Mayo is top knotch...gets overshadowed by Hennepin and Regions, but anyone who interviewed here knows different!
Maricopa- not my cup of tea, but truly a great program
LSU-BR- somebody said it best...good old Chevy with a few dents in the bumper

All this is just my opinion and I am sure I left out many top programs. I'll reitterate what was told to me a long time ago...get in where you like the people and where you will be happy. You will get good training anywhere because of the accreditation standards.
Click to expand...

I support what other posters have said about there has never been a clear consensus on this list. And I love it that way. I would also caution you against taking any list (for example, the one above) as verbatim as the "best of the best" when it comes from someone who has just come off the interview trail (No offence, corpsman). To sum it up, onc eyou're in residency you'll realize a lot of the things you emphasized as important are not, and many things you didn't even consider, have become so. In other words, talk to as many people in the program as you can, the more senior they are the better.
 
Also are the residents happy, and do they feel challenged. I will say I met a guy from my school at some point (dont want to name the program) and he tells me how he loves residency and how great things are.. The next sentence "it is even easier than 3rd yr" at that point I was like... hmm ill suffer for a few yrs hopefully with people I like who challenge me because if I am not challenged I am scared to think of the type of doctor I would become.

Def take the lists with a grain of salt.. You obviously need to figure out what DOES matter to you, then look for programs that are big in that area.
 
quideam said:
Out of curiosity, where do you guys think U Mass fits in terms of 'competitiveness'? I ask only because it sounds like a really cool program, but being located in Wortchester may hurt it...? Anyway, if anyone has any opinion on the matter, please post!
Click to expand...

I don't know about competitiveness, but I do know that I've talked to some seriously miserable residents there. One more confirmation that competitiveness isn't everything. Better to find a program that works for you.
 
I'm not trying to jump down the OP's throat here, as most of us wondered the same thing when we were first considering where to apply, but the whole idea of selecting a program on prestige or "competitiveness" is completely back-asswards, and here are a few reasons why.

1) Quality of training is what is of the greatest true importance in a residency, and thanks to the RRC QoT is rather uniform in EM. Thus, competitiveness is moot.

2) Sites like SDN & Scutwork are dominated (ie, the majority of contributions are) by the younger players in EM, so lists compiled from those sources reflect the opinions of people who have little to no first hand experience in EM. These people thus don't know what is really of importance in their training & are thus in poor standing to actually evaluate programs.

3) The programs that are prestigious (warranted or not) are often (perhaps usually) not too well known outside the world of EM. Prestige is of little value for anything other than impressing people. One likely knows a lot more people outside of EM than within it, and when one tells Aunt Minnie that he matched at Indy, Carolinas, wherever, she is likely to say something like - "Oh that's too bad. You were always such a good student. I thought for sure you'd go somewhere like Harvard." So presitige in the smaller group that is somewhat in the know will likely meet with mild disdain in the larger group that possibly has a greater impact on your sense of self worth. This year Johns Hopkins didn't fill. What does that mean? When a program doesn't fill, people will label it as weak, or uncompetitive for years to come. However, Hopkins basically invented modern medical education in the US & set the standard for the rest of the world. There is an example of a program that might really impress Aunt Minnie, but that many SDNer's would turn their noses up at -next year anyway - and both parties are probably not quite getting it. In summary, one man's trash is another's treasure, so consensus is not only difficult to acheive - it's not worth a whole lot either.

what I mean to say is, I can piss father than willynilly
 
WilcoWorld said:
I'm not trying to jump down the OP's throat here, as most of us wondered the same thing when we were first considering where to apply, but the whole idea of selecting a program on prestige or "competitiveness" is completely back-asswards, and here are a few reasons why.

2) Sites like SDN & Scutwork are dominated (ie, the majority of contributions are) by the younger players in EM, so lists compiled from those sources reflect the opinions of people who have little to no first hand experience in EM. These people thus don't know what is really of importance in their training & are thus in poor standing to actually evaluate programs.
Click to expand...

And the senior players aren't going to give you their opinion unless in a dark room, alone, with deniability. We've got to live with each other.;)
 
WilcoWorld said:
I'm not trying to jump down the OP's throat here, as most of us wondered the same thing when we were first considering where to apply, but the whole idea of selecting a program on prestige or "competitiveness" is completely back-asswards, and here are a few reasons why.

1) Quality of training is what is of the greatest true importance in a residency, and thanks to the RRC QoT is rather uniform in EM. Thus, competitiveness is moot.

2) Sites like SDN & Scutwork are dominated (ie, the majority of contributions are) by the younger players in EM, so lists compiled from those sources reflect the opinions of people who have little to no first hand experience in EM. These people thus don't know what is really of importance in their training & are thus in poor standing to actually evaluate programs.

3) The programs that are prestigious (warranted or not) are often (perhaps usually) not too well known outside the world of EM. Prestige is of little value for anything other than impressing people. One likely knows a lot more people outside of EM than within it, and when one tells Aunt Minnie that he matched at Indy, Carolinas, wherever, she is likely to say something like - "Oh that's too bad. You were always such a good student. I thought for sure you'd go somewhere like Harvard." So presitige in the smaller group that is somewhat in the know will likely meet with mild disdain in the larger group that possibly has a greater impact on your sense of self worth. This year Johns Hopkins didn't fill. What does that mean? When a program doesn't fill, people will label it as weak, or uncompetitive for years to come. However, Hopkins basically invented modern medical education in the US & set the standard for the rest of the world. There is an example of a program that might really impress Aunt Minnie, but that many SDNer's would turn their noses up at -next year anyway - and both parties are probably not quite getting it. In summary, one man's trash is another's treasure, so consensus is not only difficult to acheive - it's not worth a whole lot either.

what I mean to say is, I can piss father than willynilly
Click to expand...

Outstanding post, this should be sticky'd...
 
On Thursday I will know both what the best EM program in the country is as well as the answer to the long lost "which residents are the hottest" thread.

I dont know if I will be able to respond on Thursday but at least I will know!
 
A_Dull_Boy said:
I don't know about competitiveness, but I do know that I've talked to some seriously miserable residents there. One more confirmation that competitiveness isn't everything. Better to find a program that works for you.
Click to expand...
Would you be able to elaborate on why they were misearable? Btw, I was only asking about the competitiveness because i really like the program, and would actually prefer for it to be less competitive :p.
 
WilcoWorld said:
I'm not trying to jump down the OP's throat here, as most of us wondered the same thing when we were first considering where to apply, but the whole idea of selecting a program on prestige or "competitiveness" is completely back-asswards, and here are a few reasons why.

1) Quality of training is what is of the greatest true importance in a residency, and thanks to the RRC QoT is rather uniform in EM. Thus, competitiveness is moot.

2) Sites like SDN & Scutwork are dominated (ie, the majority of contributions are) by the younger players in EM, so lists compiled from those sources reflect the opinions of people who have little to no first hand experience in EM. These people thus don't know what is really of importance in their training & are thus in poor standing to actually evaluate programs.

3) The programs that are prestigious (warranted or not) are often (perhaps usually) not too well known outside the world of EM. Prestige is of little value for anything other than impressing people. One likely knows a lot more people outside of EM than within it, and when one tells Aunt Minnie that he matched at Indy, Carolinas, wherever, she is likely to say something like - "Oh that's too bad. You were always such a good student. I thought for sure you'd go somewhere like Harvard." So presitige in the smaller group that is somewhat in the know will likely meet with mild disdain in the larger group that possibly has a greater impact on your sense of self worth. This year Johns Hopkins didn't fill. What does that mean? When a program doesn't fill, people will label it as weak, or uncompetitive for years to come. However, Hopkins basically invented modern medical education in the US & set the standard for the rest of the world. There is an example of a program that might really impress Aunt Minnie, but that many SDNer's would turn their noses up at -next year anyway - and both parties are probably not quite getting it. In summary, one man's trash is another's treasure, so consensus is not only difficult to acheive - it's not worth a whole lot either.

what I mean to say is, I can piss father than willynilly
Click to expand...

Best post I've read in quite some time.
 
1) Quality of training is what is of the greatest true importance in a residency, and thanks to the RRC QoT is rather uniform in EM. Thus, competitiveness is moot.


3) The programs that are prestigious (warranted or not) are often (perhaps usually) not too well known outside the world of EM. Prestige is of little value for anything other than impressing people. One likely knows a lot more people outside of EM than within it, and when one tells Aunt Minnie that he matched at Indy, Carolinas, wherever, she is likely to say something like - "Oh that's too bad. You were always such a good student. I thought for sure you'd go somewhere like Harvard." So presitige in the smaller group that is somewhat in the know will likely meet with mild disdain in the larger group that possibly has a greater impact on your sense of self worth. This year Johns Hopkins didn't fill. What does that mean? When a program doesn't fill, people will label it as weak, or uncompetitive for years to come. However, Hopkins basically invented modern medical education in the US & set the standard for the rest of the world. There is an example of a program that might really impress Aunt Minnie, but that many SDNer's would turn their noses up at -next year anyway - and both parties are probably not quite getting it. In summary, one man's trash is another's treasure, so consensus is not only difficult to acheive - it's not worth a whole lot either.
Click to expand...


You F$@#ing said it! :horns: You hit the nail on the head, baby! I think i'm gonna watch that great inspirational movie "Rudy" now, have a beer and be carried off the field! :luck: Peksi....over 1,000,000 patient visits of clinical exposure in EM and still counting!!!!


Paul
 
lingonberry said:
I understand about UW being the only medical school for those five states, but does the distinction of being the only trauma center for five states actually mean anything? If someone is involved in some serious trauma in Alaska, what happens to them? I can't imagine they get sent to Seattle! Do they just go to the local level two trauma center? Or if they're in southern Wyoming, say, wouldn't it be faster to send them to Denver?
Click to expand...

Yeah, from my experience in EMS and now medical school if people get transferred (after being stabilized at a level II trauma center) they go to the closest level 1 trauma center whether that be in Denver, Salt Lake, or Seattle. Usually, people are not even transferred and just cared for at level II trauma centers.
 
FoughtFyr said:
Well, at Mayo we routinely get trauma patients transferred from Eastern Montana. Not a short flight at all considering we are on the eastern edge of Minnesota. If there are no centers then transfers can be quite long...

- H
Click to expand...

So there's nothing in the Dakotas? Not in Fargo? Then doesn't that make UW the only level one trauma center for at least 7 states?
 
lingonberry said:
So there's nothing in the Dakotas? Not in Fargo? Then doesn't that make UW the only level one trauma center for at least 7 states?
Click to expand...
UW contracts medical education for 5 states and operates Harborview, the only level 1 in the 5-state region. I'm sure the Dakotas have something worked out w/ Mayo and maybe some others. But, as others have shown very well, the fact that the only level 1 is in Seattle doesn't mean all the level 1 patients go there.
BTW - occasionally, British Columbia sends trauma and critical care patients down to Seattle, too when their thinly-stretched hospitals are at capacity. We've imported their nurses and docs, now we're getting their patients, too! ;)
 
EctopicFetus said:
On Thursday I will know both what the best EM program in the country is as well as the answer to the long lost "which residents are the hottest" thread.

I dont know if I will be able to respond on Thursday but at least I will know!
Click to expand...

Damn you, EF, you beat me to it! I clicked on this thread specifically to write that. Problem is, we'll have an argument b/c I've seen your list and you're definitely NOT going to the best or hottest program (since we didn't rank any of the same places and clearly it is I who will be joining the best/hottest EMers out there).

Just kiddin--nothin but love for ya, baby. Good luck tomorrow. :thumbup:
 
Hawkeye clearly you havent seen me, I have the body of David, the mind of DaVinci, and the strength of Apollo!

Kidding man! Obviously there is no "right answer", but I feel like Ill know anyhow. Of course I will let you and the others continue to believe what you like while I will have the answer!

Best of luck tomorrow Hawkeye and everyone else!
 
Gregg said:
UW/Madigan gossip (from an RN at UW, my former employer before med school): Madigan pulled out of the joint program. They used to split the residents, 4 civilian, 6 military. The Army wants to train more EM docs and isn't happy with Harborview (they use non-EM boarded docs to train in the ED). UW is going to miss the residents - they kept the ED running smoothly. UW wants to start its own program, not sure how it will go. Again, this is gossip from a 3AM phone call a few months ago...
Click to expand...

Just to clarify. The Madigan program is still going strong (and accredited). This year 12 people matched to the program, all military. There are still several civilians in the program from past years (8 in total after this years class graduates) and we are still rotating at UW while the civilian residents are in the program. The Harborview issue was not just an Army issue, but an issue of accreditation. The program was at risk because there were no board certified EM docs to supervise at Harborview. That may be changing in the future, but for now we do our trauma at Legacy Emmanuel in Portland.

Also, it doesn't rain every day. I saw the sun 2 month ago... :)
 
quideam said:
Would you be able to elaborate on why they were misearable? Btw, I was only asking about the competitiveness because i really like the program, and would actually prefer for it to be less competitive :p.
Click to expand...

Sorry it has taken me so long to get back...

I don't remember the schedule exactly, so if anyone knows feel free to jump in, but its like 21 or 22 12's (I know this isn't a big deal for some of you superpeople) and some of the interns felt like they were asked to manage cases well beyond their training. They were a bit, um, overextended.

I'm sure it's a great program for many, but it may not have been the best choice for some, so as has been stated very well by others, go with a program that best suits your needs/goals.
 
Does anybody feel strongly about Med College of Wisconsin in Milwaukee? I was totally blown away when I visited. They have been around since 1978, excellent and innovative curriculum, wonderful PD, young(er) and enthusiastic faculty, friendly residents, etc. I am very pleased to be headed there this summer. People should check it out, especially if you like the midwest. :thumbup: I think this emphasizes that the whole residency application process is about finding the best fit for you. It can even be a fun process, too!
 
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