Do you guys feel like this!

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Hey, i dont know how i got this idea but i was giving a thought abt it.

See many people think DPMs are lower than MD (its a fact! a huge majority of premeds do that), they just think that we pods are limited only to foot and ankle.

But see here's the thing, no one ever think how hard is the MD route. First of all with the american system of selection, u gotta have like extraordinary grades, MCAT of 28 or above, lots of volunteering, etc ,ect. And even if u get in MD school. Its not like as soon as u enter MD u will bcom a Cardio or Ortho or Patho. Ortho residency is considered a hard residency. u gotta have to have do electives, get great USMLE scores . over all its not a baby's game that once u enter MD u bcom a Ortho. and then even after doing MD, the whole ortho residency goes for 5 yrs (with fellowship) till u cud call urself the F & A specialist. So many times in MD schools, even ur grades are right, u still dont get accepted. so many external factors come into effect.

And here we are, Pods! cool people, applied today, got interview invite in 2-3 days, attended interview got accepted same day or some recieved news in a week, went to Pod school, studied wat we wanted to do (direct specialization), wrote the pod step-1 and step-2 exams.no worry abt scores, just Pass or Fail. Since there are many residency spots then canditates, most of us who wants to do a residency never has a trouble in finding any. We graduate and we bcom F & A specialist.

I know it sounds like iam trying to show Pods are lazy or not hard working but believe me iam just trying to show how easy and how satisfyingly we can achieve our dream in comparision to pre-meds who work so hard. and still we are on same step with them. but they just cant believe it.

Pre-meds deny it, meds deny it. but hey ! in general population we are the F & A specialist. it doenst matter to a common man if a guy is a pod or a ortho F & A. so far he is treating him (infact many think we are MDs ).we get hundreds of MRI referrals from Pods and all their patients are very satisfied with them and bottom line is they dont care (unless he is doing something really stupid on them like out of scope).

So i just wanted to ask u guys, do u feel proud and thank god that he gave us the wisdom to join Podiatry. (Only if u always wanted to do F & A ). I know not many pre-meds want to do F & A. but i have heard Pre-meds who wants to be Orthos doing F & A. and i do say them abt Podiatry. The problem with many pre-meds is that they assume things,. they just think as soon as they join MD school they will bcom Ortho or cardio. lol!

The whole MD superiority complex is largely limited to pre-med and beginning med students. Once they start rotating and they are constantly consulting, referring to, and interacting with DPM's, the complex disappears. We have had great relationships with MD's (particularly ortho and trauma) everywhere that I have been. And more importantly, I have worked with MD students at the teaching hospitals that I have been to. They are now aware of DPM's, their training, and their capabilities. After recently being called to the ER, I met an MD student rotating there. He stated, "I had no idea DPM's did this sort of thing". He does now!

Granted it is much more difficult to get into MD programs as compared to DPM. But I consider this to be a huge problem. The true issue is not that nearly half of the schools will admit basically anybody with a pulse, but that these same schools push students through the program regardless of their performance. They ultimately fail in the profession and become extremely bitter. These people are the ones responsible for the majority of the podiatry hate mail out there.

The key is honesty with yourself. Those that are successful in podiatric medicine would have been successful in any program (MD, DDS, rocket science etc). They chose podiatry. My concern is that there are unmotivated people out there who have done poorly academically and they see podiatry as some easy, magical way to make lots of money and become a doctor/surgeon. And for the most part, it ends up not being the case for these particular people.

Originally Posted by cool_vkb

Hey, i dont know how i got this idea but i was giving a thought abt it.

See many people think DPMs are lower than MD (its a fact! a huge majority of premeds do that), they just think that we pods are limited only to foot and ankle.

But see here's the thing, no one ever think how hard is the MD route. First of all with the american system of selection, u gotta have like extraordinary grades, MCAT of 28 or above, lots of volunteering, etc ,ect. And even if u get in MD school. Its not like as soon as u enter MD u will bcom a Cardio or Ortho or Patho. Ortho residency is considered a hard residency. u gotta have to have do electives, get great USMLE scores . over all its not a baby's game that once u enter MD u bcom a Ortho. and then even after doing MD, the whole ortho residency goes for 5 yrs (with fellowship) till u cud call urself the F & A specialist. So many times in MD schools, even ur grades are right, u still dont get accepted. so many external factors come into effect.

And here we are, Pods! cool people, applied today, got interview invite in 2-3 days, attended interview got accepted same day or some recieved news in a week, went to Pod school, studied wat we wanted to do (direct specialization), wrote the pod step-1 and step-2 exams.no worry abt scores, just Pass or Fail. Since there are many residency spots then canditates, most of us who wants to do a residency never has a trouble in finding any. We graduate and we bcom F & A specialist.

I know it sounds like iam trying to show Pods are lazy or not hard working but believe me iam just trying to show how easy and how satisfyingly we can achieve our dream in comparision to pre-meds who work so hard. and still we are on same step with them. but they just cant believe it.

Pre-meds deny it, meds deny it. but hey ! in general population we are the F & A specialist. it doenst matter to a common man if a guy is a pod or a ortho F & A. so far he is treating him (infact many think we are MDs ).we get hundreds of MRI referrals from Pods and all their patients are very satisfied with them and bottom line is they dont care (unless he is doing something really stupid on them like out of scope).

So i just wanted to ask u guys, do u feel proud and thank god that he gave us the wisdom to join Podiatry. (Only if u always wanted to do F & A ). I know not many pre-meds want to do F & A. but i have heard Pre-meds who wants to be Orthos doing F & A. and i do say them abt Podiatry. The problem with many pre-meds is that they assume things,. they just think as soon as they join MD school they will bcom Ortho or cardio. lol!

First of all, I don't really get the purpose of this post - but I don't know why you refer to pre-meds as your sources of "Expertise" because in reality when you rotate with MD and DO students you're not thought of as "less" or "inferior". On the contrary, we get treated as the same level of respect because we can demonstrate sound clinical knowledge in those situations.

Secondly, you make it seem as though graduating from Pod school and residency are easy tasks - even if our boards are pass/fail - they are by no means a walk in the park - and don't forget that we have to maintain a strong GPA, in many cases research and extracurricular as well just to land strong externships and residencies. Look cool, you're not in a position to assess the difficulty or level of our education until you actually start school. Just because you have an acceptance letter that does not put you in a position to make any assesment outside of the interview process. It is not "easy" to attain our dreams in podiatry as you say because it is alot of hard work - I don't understand how you can make such a comment when you haven't attended a single class! Please do some research before posting random thoughts next time.

Originally Posted by jonwill

The key is honesty with yourself. Those that are successful in podiatric medicine would have been successful in any program (MD, DDS, rocket science etc). They chose podiatry. My concern is that there are unmotivated people out there who have done poorly academically and they see podiatry as some easy, magical way to make lots of money and become a doctor/surgeon. And for the most part, it ends up not being the case for these particular people.

And that is part of the problem. I hope that this "new generation of DPMs" can change things. I commend some of the posters on this board that "get it". You must improve acceptance standards, require residencies, fellowships, etc. because I can tell you this, to get through medical school, internship, residency and fellowship you have no choice but to have some competency in your field because of the rigorous standards to even get to that point. Look, I've seen bad work by some orthopods, every one has their skeletons, but you can't tell me you think someone is going to consistently do good work if they were let in by lax admission standards and have little motivation to go out and get extra training.

Originally Posted by dawg44

And that is part of the problem. I hope that this "new generation of DPMs" can change things. I commend some of the posters on this board that "get it". You must improve acceptance standards, require residencies, fellowships, etc. because I can tell you this, to get through medical school, internship, residency and fellowship you have no choice but to have some competency in your field because of the rigorous standards to even get to that point. Look, I've seen bad work by some orthopods, every one has their skeletons, but you can't tell me you think someone is going to consistently do good work if they were let in by lax admission standards and have little motivation to go out and get extra training.

absolutely

Originally Posted by Podman

First of all, I don't really get the purpose of this post - but I don't know why you refer to pre-meds as your sources of "Expertise" because in reality when you rotate with MD and DO students you're not thought of as "less" or "inferior". On the contrary, we get treated as the same level of respect because we can demonstrate sound clinical knowledge in those situations.

Secondly, you make it seem as though graduating from Pod school and residency are easy tasks - even if our boards are pass/fail - they are by no means a walk in the park - and don't forget that we have to maintain a strong GPA, in many cases research and extracurricular as well just to land strong externships and residencies. Look cool, you're not in a position to assess the difficulty or level of our education until you actually start school. Just because you have an acceptance letter that does not put you in a position to make any assesment outside of the interview process. It is not "easy" to attain our dreams in podiatry as you say because it is alot of hard work - I don't understand how you can make such a comment when you haven't attended a single class! Please do some research before posting random thoughts next time.

See we are undergrads, the only people we talk or have discussion is with pre-meds. So for me, waht my undergrad pre-meds think is most important. my society revolves around them.

Regarding Hardwork. ofcourse Podiatry is hardwork and i never said it was easy but at the same time there isnt a heavy back to back compet ition going on. ofcourse there are some competitive residencies. i read on this forum only that there more number of residency seats than there are canditates. And PASS/FAIL eliminates the whole idea of competition. How do u think any one can judge if A is superior than B, even if A gets 90 and B gets 70, all they get is PASS. and if u r a true Podiatry student ofcourse u r gonna perform well. I always said, if u wanted to be a F & A specialist then only Pod is a good field instead of Medicine. May be as competition is increasing , things will change but right now its a pretty cool thing.

U always get me wrong.i was just trying to show how happy iam , i got in podiatry. i know u r a POD student, u deal with MD, DO students. iam a undergrad i deal with premeds. Some of them are very discouraging ,while some act as if there PODIATRY doesnt even exists. So my thinking and my ideas come based on that. There is a concept among premeds, when u ask any premed what r u gonna be "they will answer so happily a cardio, a neuro or a ortho". but the reality is these things are after MD school and one needs to be in their 90% grade level to get in. Where as we pods are so lucky. we get in wat we wanted to do. So we are specialists. and i still think rather than taking that painstaking journey of bcoming a F & A thru MD school (be it ortho route , or dermo route or internal medicine aspect of foot), its better someone does POD. For a pod who is a good average student its never hard to get a residency and to become a F & A specialist. where as this is not true in case of MD students. all who applied to ortho residencies never make into it. They have to choose something else. there is no place for average MD student in these residencies. they are simply extra competitive.

Now do you want DPM to become like that. Sure, it can be in next 10 yrs when more applicants are applying.

Originally Posted by Podman

Secondly, you make it seem as though graduating from Pod school and residency are easy tasks - even if our boards are pass/fail - they are by no means a walk in the park - and don't forget that we have to maintain a strong GPA, in many cases research and extracurricular as well just to land strong externships and residencies. Look cool, you're not in a position to assess the difficulty or level of our education until you actually start school. .

If you are student who always like F & A and enjoy it, then i dont see why trouble to graduate and get in a residency. A passing score is may be 70/100 or even 80/100. But if one passes he is in. Its not like 1000 people fighting for 50 seats and one has to get a 98/100.

Look cool, you're not in a position to assess the difficulty or level of our education until you actually start school. .

Ofcourse iam not, and i never said it is easy. u read in my post, i never said it is easy. all i said is tat its not a teeth to teeth competition. even if u dont agree its ok. but tats true. So far u passed u r boards and have some extracurricular u r good to go.

i always heard the only people who struggle in podiatry school are pre-meds or people who came as a backup option. A true Pre-pod always suceeds bcoz tats all he wanted to and iam sure he enjoys it.

Originally Posted by cool_vkb

See we are undergrads, the only people we talk or have discussion is with pre-meds. So for me, waht my undergrad pre-meds think is most important. my society revolves around them.

Regarding Hardwork. ofcourse Podiatry is hardwork and i never said it was easy but at the same time there isnt a heavy back to back compet ition going on. ofcourse there are some competitive residencies. i read on this forum only that there more number of residency seats than there are canditates. And PASS/FAIL eliminates the whole idea of competition. How do u think any one can judge if A is superior than B, even if A gets 90 and B gets 70, all they get is PASS. and if u r a true Podiatry student ofcourse u r gonna perform well. I always said, if u wanted to be a F & A specialist then only Pod is a good field instead of Medicine. May be as competition is increasing , things will change but right now its a pretty cool thing.

U always get me wrong.i was just trying to show how happy iam , i got in podiatry. i know u r a POD student, u deal with MD, DO students. iam a undergrad i deal with premeds. Some of them are very discouraging ,while some act as if there PODIATRY doesnt even exists. So my thinking and my ideas come based on that. There is a concept among premeds, when u ask any premed what r u gonna be "they will answer so happily a cardio, a neuro or a ortho". but the reality is these things are after MD school and one needs to be in their 90% grade level to get in. Where as we pods are so lucky. we get in wat we wanted to do. So we are specialists. and i still think rather than taking that painstaking journey of bcoming a F & A thru MD school (be it ortho route , or dermo route or internal medicine aspect of foot), its better someone does POD. For a pod who is a good average student its never hard to get a residency and to become a F & A specialist. where as this is not true in case of MD students. all who applied to ortho residencies never make into it. They have to choose something else. there is no place for average MD student in these residencies. they are simply extra competitive.

Now do you want DPM to become like that. Sure, it can be in next 10 yrs when more applicants are applying.

when you pass your boards first, then you can decide if they are competitive or not...yes our boards are pass/fail format but to get a decent externship you need to have passed your boards, established a strong GPA in pod school and demonstrated research/extracurriculars

Originally Posted by cool_vkb

If you are student who always like F & A and enjoy it, then i dont see why trouble to graduate and get in a residency. A passing score is may be 70/100 or even 80/100. But if one passes he is in. Its not like 1000 people fighting for 50 seats and one has to get a 98/100.

top programs have alot of competition - many top candidates across the country compete for spots in the top programs, so again please don't make any assumptions without prior knowledge.

Its great and dandy that you are looking forward to school but put some thought and research before you post man.

good luck

Cool -

as jon and podman said you have not even taken one class.

we all know it is not as competitive to get into pod school as MD school. why must you post it over and over again?

The key is not how hard it is to get in but how hard it is to be successful when you get out. And this depends on what you call successful. If you are happy chipping and clipping and makein 50-100 grand a year and still calling yourself doctor then great - call it easy and doable by just getting Bs and Cs and doing the minimal 2 year residency or not so great 3 year residency.

If you want to be a foot and ankle surgeon and be at the top of the field it is not just Bs and Cs and getting by. It is working for the A and more. Reading the research and learning how to be a physician.

There is a huge difference between those that are happy with pod and those that are not. Those that are not usually saw it as an easy way to be called Dr.

It is not easy.

Ask Shuberth, Gumann, McGlamery, Mandracchia, Armstrong... if it was easy. And they came out when there was 1 residency for 10 students or more.

About the number of residencies. Cool - you will graduate in 2011. This year there are about 339 students graduating to about 500 total residency spots including 2 year positions.

next year there will be 450ish students graduating to less residency spots because some close every year. And the numbers keep going up for graduating students. Class of 2009 has more than 500 so far.

And just because you are likely to get a residency does not mean that it will be the best residency. All 3 year programs are not alike.

best of luck to you Cool but do not think it will be an easy road or that a residency program is just waiting for you in 4 short years. It takes hard work.

Originally Posted by dawg44

And that is part of the problem. I hope that this "new generation of DPMs" can change things. I commend some of the posters on this board that "get it". You must improve acceptance standards, require residencies, fellowships, etc. because I can tell you this, to get through medical school, internship, residency and fellowship you have no choice but to have some competency in your field because of the rigorous standards to even get to that point. Look, I've seen bad work by some orthopods, every one has their skeletons, but you can't tell me you think someone is going to consistently do good work if they were let in by lax admission standards and have little motivation to go out and get extra training.

Sorry guys my bad! my knowledge was very poor in this matter. i appologize. But see here's the good the thing, if i hadnt posted what was on my mind then u guys wudnt have corrected me. Thank You! god bless u guys.

Thats why i love forums. iam addicted to it.

Originally Posted by cool_vkb

Hey, i dont know how i got this idea but i was giving a thought abt it.

See many people think DPMs are lower than MD (its a fact! a huge majority of premeds do that), they just think that we pods are limited only to foot and ankle.

But see here's the thing, no one ever think how hard is the MD route. First of all with the american system of selection, u gotta have like extraordinary grades, MCAT of 28 or above, lots of volunteering, etc ,ect. And even if u get in MD school. Its not like as soon as u enter MD u will bcom a Cardio or Ortho or Patho. Ortho residency is considered a hard residency. u gotta have to have do electives, get great USMLE scores . over all its not a baby's game that once u enter MD u bcom a Ortho. and then even after doing MD, the whole ortho residency goes for 5 yrs (with fellowship) till u cud call urself the F & A specialist. So many times in MD schools, even ur grades are right, u still dont get accepted. so many external factors come into effect.

And here we are, Pods! cool people, applied today, got interview invite in 2-3 days, attended interview got accepted same day or some recieved news in a week, went to Pod school, studied wat we wanted to do (direct specialization), wrote the pod step-1 and step-2 exams.no worry abt scores, just Pass or Fail. Since there are many residency spots then canditates, most of us who wants to do a residency never has a trouble in finding any. We graduate and we bcom F & A specialist.

I know it sounds like iam trying to show Pods are lazy or not hard working but believe me iam just trying to show how easy and how satisfyingly we can achieve our dream in comparision to pre-meds who work so hard. and still we are on same step with them. but they just cant believe it.

Pre-meds deny it, meds deny it. but hey ! in general population we are the F & A specialist. it doenst matter to a common man if a guy is a pod or a ortho F & A. so far he is treating him (infact many think we are MDs ).we get hundreds of MRI referrals from Pods and all their patients are very satisfied with them and bottom line is they dont care (unless he is doing something really stupid on them like out of scope).

So i just wanted to ask u guys, do u feel proud and thank god that he gave us the wisdom to join Podiatry. (Only if u always wanted to do F & A ). I know not many pre-meds want to do F & A. but i have heard Pre-meds who wants to be Orthos doing F & A. and i do say them abt Podiatry. The problem with many pre-meds is that they assume things,. they just think as soon as they join MD school they will bcom Ortho or cardio. lol!

Although getting into Podiatry school may be easy, completing the demanding curriculm is not. At Scholl we have some very smart students that have been top of their classes at top nationally known schools, and they still need to study constantly to get through our challenging course work. For example I have always considered myself as a top student however I am surprised to see how smart some of these people are in the Podiatric Medical Schools. Actually we have students who meet higher standards such as MCAT and GPA than most people at the RFU medical school.

You need to get good grades to get research opportunities, to be able to obtain a M.S. while getting your DPM, and to get into good residency programs. What everyone is saying to you is absolutely correct. I predict that the admission standards will be increasing significantly within the next couple years.

I don't consider Podiatry school an easy way to become a doctor and you will see this next fall when you come to Scholl. It will be a very rewarding but humbling experience to what you have previously thought about a Podiatric education. As soon as more MD's see how medically competent the graduates are, things will change. What Is really awesome is the Podiatric physicians out there that do research. Besides finding new techniques and cures for medical diseases they open up new doors for our future through evidence based medicine. For example, Diabetic research and Peripheral Artery Disease research. These people are doing things that DPM's have never done before. If you want to look into some of the amazing things that are going on in Podiatry I would encourage looking at what CLEAR is doing at Scholl.

As an undergraduate and future pod student. I honestly feel not enough people know about this field to begin with. As often people have asked me what i'm doing i tell them podiatry and all so often people get confused on what it is. Those that do know what it is think its connected through med schools or is a specialty after 4 years of MD school and not separate school and degree. Basically there's a lack of knowledge and not enough advertising power from the schools i'm pretty sure that aamcas had something to do with it. But all in all i feel it seems like a numbers game and it possibly is. Each year more and and more applicants are applying and from the trend about 100 additional people apply with only 8 schools to accomodate them. Already most schools are abandoning the Gre and the DAT and turning only towards the MCATS. This obviously is due to the rise in applicants. I too feel that in a few years there will be tremendous competition and through sources like SDN more and more students are learning about this field, and will create more rigid competition. Also keep in mind that not everyone is willing to put 6 or 7 years of their lives studying It definitely requires a lot of man power and energy to become a great podiatrist, and not everyone is up to it.