Army National Guard's new Med student program details.

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Originally Posted by notdeadyet

I'm at BOLC now and this was raised with a high ranking National Guard rep discussing Guard AMEDD recruitment programs. ASR was not on her radar and didn't appear to be particularly well thought of. The rep did not know of any plans to resurrect ASR and said if it ever was in the future, you can rest assured that they would require an obligation phase after the monies phase, like MDSSP or STRAP. The idea of having such a huge payment that could have individuals finish their obligation before becoming board certified seemed to be unpopular.

So current word from as close to the horses mouth as I'm going to get seems to be that ASR is not going to be coming back at any point soon enough to be of interest to most reading this board, and if it ever did, it would likely have a payout phase followed by a 2:1 (or more) obligation paid out post-med school or residency.

Latest funds seem to be paid (wisely, in my opinion) toward boad-certified physician recruitment, rather than focusing on med students or even residents.

Looks like I missed the train. With that being said, I am still strongly considering enlisting. Is ARNG still the best show in town despite the loss of ASR?

Originally Posted by Jebel

Looks like I missed the train. With that being said, I am still strongly considering enlisting. Is ARNG still the best show in town despite the loss of ASR?

Best is highly subjective. To me the Guard and FAP are the two best options. The higher financial rewards of the other programs don't justify losing my freedom to choose a residency and committing to four years in the active duty military almost a decade before I start paying off that commitment. To people who place early and sustained financial security at the top of their priorities, USUHS is probably the best option.

So the question is what you value and want most out of your commitment to the military...

I spoke with the head of TXARNG recruiting and he told me last month that ASR would not be coming back. He did say that they were "developing" a new program that would be similar but he didn't have any specifics so he didn't want to sell me on a rumor...

I've been doing paperwork for about 6 months, now that ASR is gone, I'm trying to decide what to do...my current thoughts are to commission as a medical student and then just take drill pay for 2 years and then take MDSSP for my 3rd and 4th years of med school and then the 4 years I owe for MDSSP would be paid back concurrently with my 4 years left in the contract - I would just take drill pay throughout the remainder of my contract - I don't want to do any other programs that require an additional committment, If I stay in the guard at the end of my contract, I want it to be my decision. I started school this August, so I'm eager to just get commissioned so the clock will start counting down. I think this is the best option right now unless you don't mind making a longer commitment...

I do have a question though - for those of you who just started residency - how do you think having a commitment to the National Guard played into your interview process? I heard some people think its an honorable thing to have on your CV and then I heard some people don't want to offer you a residency position if you still have an outstanding commitment....just curious what you guys who have already went through this thought of it...

Considering that my program director just learned that I was in the Guard from an unrelated conversation about me with someone else, I don't think it played into the decision at all. And I mentioned it in my ERAS app.

Here is my 2 cents now that ASR sounds completely dead. I am not surprised AT ALL that recent BOLC attendees have been told that NGB is realizing that recruiting med students to 8 year commitments when they have no fewer than 7 years before they are "fully operational" is not the best policy. As prior enlisted, I expressed my extreme skepticism in the program initially, for this very reason, i.e. "What are they getting out of this? What is the catch?" The only reason I signed up when I did was because of ASR. Prior to its inception, my plan was to finish fellowship and then join. I still think this is the best option, and even more so now.

Can someone give me contact information for Ohio ASR recruiter?

Thanks

Originally Posted by joflockhart

Can someone give me contact information for Ohio ASR recruiter?

ASR is done. They are no longer taking applications.

If you're interested in MDSSP, do a search on this thread and you can find more information on that program (the only other program geared towards medical students). It's $2k/month with a 2:1 commitment (you owe two years drilling status for every year of benefits, payback starting immediately after medical school).

If no one's able to provide you with a name and contact info for someone in Ohio, try googling Ohio National Guard AMEDD or (quickest route) calling 800-Go-Guard. Links you'll find onlline tend to be old and folks in AMEDD recruiting get shuffled fast.

Has anyone been having pay issues for the new 2010-2011 fiscal year? I have been told that I am renewed for another year of ASR but haven't been paid for the month of October. Anyone else having this problem?

I haven't been paid for October, but I was in BOLC, which I understand really screws up your pay schedule. I should get a big check next pay period.

Were your orders cut on time?

The ASR coordinator has said that I've been renewed for the new fiscal year. But I haven't seen any orders or pay.

I'd ask for a copy of your orders ASAP. Your orders should have been cut 6-8 weeks ago. If it slipped through the cracks, pay would get delayed.

The problem is most likely that your state hasn't cut your new orders. Once they do get them cut it will take about 10-14 days for you to get your first pay check.

This happened to me. I didn't get my new orders until around 10-12. I got the check I usually get on 10-16 on 10-27.

I was one of those lucky ones recruited under the premise of ASR with no word of it being canned. Signed in Feb 2010, with 3 other classmates just starting on ASR. Me and another guy signed in Feb and was told board was meeting next month for us. Delay, delay, delay, told we'd start Oct 1. Given, we're already drilling and commissioned officers now. While at BOLC this summer, last day there, got an email from our state recruiter saying ASR was cut.

Absolutely blows and still bitter about this whole thing.

Right now, just drilling and getting whatever money I can to offset out-of-state tuition. Will take MDSSP next yr (3rd and 4th), unless something else comes along, then pay back before my MSO from commissiong ends. Then I'll have some time to figure out if I still hate these people.

Originally Posted by veejl

I was one of those lucky ones recruited under the premise of ASR with no word of it being canned. Signed in Feb 2010, with 3 other classmates just starting on ASR. Me and another guy signed in Feb and was told board was meeting next month for us. Delay, delay, delay, told we'd start Oct 1. Given, we're already drilling and commissioned officers now. While at BOLC this summer, last day there, got an email from our state recruiter saying ASR was cut.

Absolutely blows and still bitter about this whole thing.

Right now, just drilling and getting whatever money I can to offset out-of-state tuition. Will take MDSSP next yr (3rd and 4th), unless something else comes along, then pay back before my MSO from commissiong ends. Then I'll have some time to figure out if I still hate these people.

I can totally understand how you would be bitter, and it sucks that your situation has gone the way that it has. Take my word for it though, the administrative side of it you will almost always hate. I've also found that the administrative side of it is much worse in the National Guard than on the Active Duty side, because you have nowhere to send these people when they're clearly incompetent or negligent. In my old unit, if you were incompetent you didn't last long. Ultimately, it's the people that you work with and the job that you sometimes actually get to do, if you're lucky, that might keep you coming back. It's very much a love/hate relationship with everybody I know that has stayed in the military for awhile.

Good luck to you.

Originally Posted by veejl

I was one of those lucky ones recruited under the premise of ASR with no word of it being canned. Signed in Feb 2010, with 3 other classmates just starting on ASR.

Boy, that sucks. I'm sorry to hear about that. Word was already out by then that there would be no more slots after the 01 JAN 2010 start.

The message for everyone out there is that you DO NOT sign ANY contract on a handshake. Unless you have a contract in front of you to sign up for certain programs or benefits (like ASR), DO NOT sign if it's a deal-breaker. True for the military, true for a car, true for an apartment, true for a job.

Originally Posted by veejl

Me and another guy signed in Feb and was told board was meeting next month for us. Delay, delay, delay, told we'd start Oct 1.

By February, there were no ASR slots to get. And they DEFINITELY should not have told you that you'd start ASR by 01 OCT 2010. The policy memo that we've seen specifically states that ASR was designed to be a three year program ending at the end of FY 2010, so there was never any indication that ASR would be signing new people for 01 OCT 2010. That was never the plan.

Originally Posted by veejl

Right now, just drilling and getting whatever money I can to offset out-of-state tuition. Will take MDSSP next yr (3rd and 4th), unless something else comes along, then pay back before my MSO from commissiong ends.

If you went to BOLC this summer, you went to the breakout session for Guardsmen, right? In my group, we specifically asked about new programs coming down the pike, and they indicated that there was nothing new in the works for medical students. They seem to be focusing on recruiting board certified physicians, and I don't expect that to change.

But keep checking this board. One thing you'll notice if you got through the three years of this thread is that folks post LOTS of rumors and they all tend to be positive (e.g.: ASR is coming back! ASR is going to be extended! Etc.) and there's been no buzz about another med student program. If anyone gets a whiff (and ASRs will be the first, as we're best positioned to recruit medical students) you can rest assured someone will mention it here.

Good luck to you...

Based on what I've in the thread, my understading the ASR program no longer exists. Now is it just for medical students or PA's as well. Does anyone have any info on any military programs for PA's thanks.

ASR is completely dead. According to 2 recruiters, not coming back.

For med students, only incentive is MDSSP at this point. Aside from FTA, State TA, and GI Bill.

For PA students, I don't think there is any incentives other than FTA/State TA/GI Bill. I believe MDSSP is only for med students.

Anyone got a contact for an AMEDD Recruiter in South Carolina? Got a friend interested in upping over there.

Originally Posted by tylerh87

Anyone got a contact for an AMEDD Recruiter in South Carolina? Got a friend interested in upping over there.

Since you're getting no love, try 1-800-Go-Guard. They should be able to help.

Since i'll be starting residency next year the thought of paying back loans is starting to creep into the back of my mind. Most likely doing a 4 year EM program and i'm considering taking STRAP and the loan repayment options during residency since my ASR cash will stop. Just wanted to see if anyone else in the ASR program is considering taking these options too.

The pros for me would be leaving residency debt free - currently owe right at $200k.

Cons: I can be deployed q12-18 months for 90 days at a time until my obligation is fulfilled.

I was thinking of taking STRAP, but mostly because I could buy a kick-ass boat with an extra 2K/mo coming in.

There are probably all kinds of implications I am not thinking of, but don't be in such a hurry to shackle yourself to additional obligation just to avoid $200K. That just doesn't seem like a lot to me. Particularly for you, who will likely end up being a hospital employee. Why? Lots of hospitals will sweeten your initial contract with loan repayment options which don't involve 90(ish) day deployments. In my neck of the woods, this amount is essentially a mortgage, which you have 30 yrs to pay off, all the while making much less than an attending's wages. I think you'll be fine.

Originally Posted by coldhardsteel

Since i'll be starting residency next year the thought of paying back loans is starting to creep into the back of my mind. Most likely doing a 4 year EM program and i'm considering taking STRAP and the loan repayment options during residency since my ASR cash will stop. Just wanted to see if anyone else in the ASR program is considering taking these options too.

The pros for me would be leaving residency debt free - currently owe right at $200k.

Cons: I can be deployed q12-18 months for 90 days at a time until my obligation is fulfilled.

I plan to take MDSSP to finish off my time in medical school. I doubt I'll be doing STRAP though since you can get a significant chunk of loan repayment for a 3 year commitment.

One of the bigger perks, to me, of joining the Guard in medical school was getting the initial commitment out of the way so that I could stick to shorter term commitments when deployment becomes a real concern. I don't think $100k would convince me to give that up and commit for 8 years...

Originally Posted by coldhardsteel

Since i'll be starting residency next year the thought of paying back loans is starting to creep into the back of my mind. Most likely doing a 4 year EM program and i'm considering taking STRAP and the loan repayment options during residency since my ASR cash will stop.

Have you sat down and worked a spreadsheet yet? Just curious how it works out.

4 years STRAP = 8 years deployable. At a tempo of every 18 months, say, you'll be gone from work 4 months (keeping in mind the 90 days is how long you're overseas; there's an additional 30 days for pre/post mobilization). If you're earning $150K/year as a military ED guy vs $250K/year as a civilian ED guy, you lose $33K each deployment. Figuring on 5 deployments, that comes to $165,000, which is a heck of a lot more than the $96K you'd get off STRAP. This says nothing of the professional limitations that might come with getting a job at a smaller ED that can't easily accommodate someone who deploys every year.

Those numbers are voodoo actually, due to things like interest and tax implications. We also don't know the deployment tempo in 4 years could be more or could be less (I'm thinking the latter). Of course, there's no guarantee that they won't go back to the 1 year deployments in the future, which blows everything out of the water.

Just tossing out some ideas. STRAP is a long commitment. If you're enjoying the Guard and want to stay in anyway, it's a great thing. Committing 8 years of potential havoc to the beginning of your professional life just for short-term money at the expense of long-term money is probably a good recipe for unhappiness.

i know ASR is dead...but does anyone have the contact info for an AMEDD recruiter in both New Jersey and/or New York?

Looking for amedd recruiter for eastern kentucky. I have contcted severel regular recruiters and a couple that were supposedly the " right ones to talk to" and can not get a response. Also is there anyone here with information for the medical detachment in pikeville ky? thanks.

Looking for a recruiter for South Carolina. PM me.

Hello everyone,

Is there any one from Army national guard in Arizona? I would like to know more information about ARNG in Arizona as I will start med school in August in AZ.

Thank you

1

New post-9/11 G.I. Bill might expand coverage to Title 32.

http://military-education.military.c...t-act-of-2010/



There's a good chance there will be something keeping ASR from qualifying, but if there isn't ASR will probably become the greatest deal in military history...

New post-9/11 G.I. Bill might expand coverage to Title 32.

Oh my God. And retroactive? Oh my God.

Originally Posted by TheWholeTooth

Oh my God. And retroactive? Oh my God.

Yea, seriously. If ASR was covered, it would probably become the single greatest deal ever offered by the military...

I did OBLC in July, and just last week I *finally* got my NOBE, which I'm going to take over to the student vet services office the first week of January. Would they be the ones to ask about this? (My state OSM is a real tool.)

Originally Posted by DeadCactus

Yea, seriously. If ASR was covered, it would probably become the single greatest deal ever offered by the military...

Keep in mind that if it passes and if it's retroactive and if ASR is included, we'd only be eligible for a partial tuition waiver. You'd get a % based on how many years of service you had when eligibility started and it would be a refund of that % of your state's undergrad tuition. We would not be eligible for BAH (the big post-9/11 payment) since we already receive it as ASRs.

We'll see. Depending on your state, the MGIB might be a better deal.

Originally Posted by notdeadyet

Keep in mind that if it passes and if it's retroactive and if ASR is included, we'd only be eligible for a partial tuition waiver. You'd get a % based on how many years of service you had when eligibility started and it would be a refund of that % of your state's undergrad tuition. We would not be eligible for BAH (the big post-9/11 payment) since we already receive it as ASRs.

We'll see. Depending on your state, the MGIB might be a better deal.

I would think that if you started claiming benefits after your three years of ASR ended, you'd still get BAH. Seems like a good way to boost residency pay...

Originally Posted by DeadCactus

I would think that if you started claiming benefits after your three years of ASR ended, you'd still get BAH. Seems like a good way to boost residency pay...

Have we gotten confirmation of folks using the BAH portion of the post-9/11 GI Bill for medical residency?

Originally Posted by notdeadyet

Have we gotten confirmation of folks using the BAH portion of the post-9/11 GI Bill for medical residency?

I thought I'd read about people doing so a few times on this forum, but I'm admittedly not certain...

I'm not sure who has kids and has looked into this but my real interest is in letting my 10 year old use the bill to go to college. Last I read it seemed like it said the plan was intended to be able to be passed to a dependent but the rules for how it would work and the eligibility period were still up in the air.

Anyone know?

Originally Posted by EMH

I'm not sure who has kids and has looked into this but my real interest is in letting my 10 year old use the bill to go to college. Last I read it seemed like it said the plan was intended to be able to be passed to a dependent but the rules for how it would work and the eligibility period were still up in the air.

Two types of eligibility need to be met: yours and your kids.

For you, you need to have served 10 years, or you can elect into the program after 6 years if you sign a commitment for 4 more years.

For your kids, they can't access it until they're 18 years of age or have graduated high school. They are only eligible for use of the benefits up until they are 26 years of age. They originally talked about them only being able to use the benefits within 15 years of your date of separation, but this was dropped as a requirement for kids (but kept as a requirement if your spouse wants to access the program).

Make sense?

Originally Posted by notdeadyet

Make sense?

Thanks, you always seem to have the info I need.

Anyone have contact info, an email address preferably, for the AMEDD recruiter in the state of Wisconsin? Thanks.

Not Dead Yet, EMH, and Dead Cactus: Were you guys at OBLC in July? And if so, who were you? (PM me if that works better)

Originally Posted by EMH

Thanks, you always seem to have the info I need.

Were only this true in medical school...

Originally Posted by SFGuy2011

Anyone have contact info, an email address preferably, for the AMEDD recruiter in the state of Wisconsin? Thanks.

If you don't have an inside track, you should do 1-800-Go-Guard. They can put you in touch with a current state AMEDD recruiter. Folks in those roles tend to change quickly, so googling is usually a waste of effort.

Originally Posted by TheWholeTooth

Not Dead Yet, EMH, and Dead Cactus: Were you guys at OBLC in July?

Nope.

Originally Posted by TheWholeTooth

Not Dead Yet, EMH, and Dead Cactus: Were you guys at OBLC in July? And if so, who were you? (PM me if that works better)

I went in November since I didn't want to sweat the whole time I was there. A medical student from my state was there though. He said it was the hottest July in recent history in Texas.

I went in November since I didn't want to sweat the whole time I was there.

Yeah. It was hideous. Anyway, just curious to put real-life people together with their online personas. (Personae?)

I was there in July. I seem remember both of us trying to keep a decent play-by-play going on SDN as a reference for others. PM sent with a little more detail...

So if I understand correctly, ARNG physicians are on duty part-time, so are they commonly doing part-time practices or locums? Can some one really land a full time job when the potential employer knows they might get called away at a moment's notice?

Does anyone know if Guard is reimbursing for Step exams, particularly Step 3? Seem to remember an email regarding this, but can't seem to find it now. Just learned that my program doesn't.

Originally Posted by Mr. Freeze

Does anyone know if Guard is reimbursing for Step exams, particularly Step 3? Seem to remember an email regarding this, but can't seem to find it now. Just learned that my program doesn't.

Yes, there is an NGB program to reimburse for the test cost only. I applied last year but never was able to actually reach someone by phone or e-mail who could help. So I think my application never reached where it was susposed to go. Anyone else have any luck with this?

PM me your e-mail if you want me to forward you the e-mail.

Originally Posted by Ascultator

So if I understand correctly, ARNG physicians are on duty part-time, so are they commonly doing part-time practices or locums? Can some one really land a full time job when the potential employer knows they might get called away at a moment's notice?

ARNG service is going to interfere with work in two ways.

1) You have an obligation to train a certain number of days a year and will need an employer to arrange your schedule around those days. That's easy enough, though probably a bit damaging to vacation time and/or your say in the rest of your work schedule.

2) Deployments where you will be gone for months at a time. This is obviously the more difficult issue. I can't speak from experience, but I have to imagine it makes opening your own practice or being one of a very small number of partners all but impossible. Certain specialties are probably better suited for being gone months at a time: e.g. emergency medicine, anesthesiology, hospitalist, etc.

Originally Posted by notdeadyet

No. Sorry if I gave that impression.

If you do 4 years of MDSSP + 4 years of STRAP (for a 4 year residency), you will owe 12 years obligation, starting immediately after residency.

If you decide to take HPLRP, you'd do so as an R3/R4/Attending1. You do not incur additional obligation with R3-Attending1, but you don't pay back any obligation either. So you still have 12 years to pay back from MDSSP and STRAP, but your pay back would start as an Attending2. Make sense?

Question about HPLRP with STRAP:

Can you take HPLR once you are done with residency if you do STRAP? My understanding based on 11(d) on page 11 from "Implementation Guidance for ARNG AMEDD Officer Incentive Programs for FY 10-11" is that you can take it during residency, but not after. In the example used on the page, you actually end up adding an additional year onto the payback because you have to extend STRAP by 3 months and 12 days in order to get your payout (which is 1 year after signing on for HPLR).

Am I missing something?

https://g1arng.army.pentagon.mil/HRC...FY%2010-11.pdf