Your opinion of USC dental school?

[preden]

Anybody who is going to USC dental school, can you give me your personal opinion about the school?

Thank you...

[xhamburgersamx]

Originally Posted by preden

Anybody who is going to USC dental school, can you give me your personal opinion about the school?

Thank you...

not a bad school if you can afford it.

A lot of good and new changes happening at this school.

[mike3kgt]

Originally Posted by preden

Anybody who is going to USC dental school, can you give me your personal opinion about the school?

Thank you...

I noticed the previous posts may not have been actual dental students. Many pre-dent's only know how to say one thing, "it's a GREAT school" According to what information? Friend of a friend? Somebody you spoke with?

Make sure you ask the students who are there NOW, especially the juniors and seniors. Try to find recent grads also. They are your best resource.

USC has a time-honored reputation stemming back from the 60's and 70's with it's gold era and when some outstanding research and skilled clinicians were coming out. Now I do know USC has had some issues in the recent past (2006-2008) with timely graduation rate and PBL criticism... any students with to comment on how it is currently?

[jay47]

Originally Posted by xhamburgersamx

not a bad school if you can afford it.

A lot of good and new changes happening at this school.

What makes it a "not a bad school"? Just wondering because I think unless you have been there as a student, it would be difficult to comment accurately.

[xhamburgersamx]

Here's the thing: You ask any class of 2010 student and they will have very negative things to say about what happened to them in 2006 when they were D1. Do the same problems exists? Yes and No. What the D1's are going through right now might change by the time the OP (pre-dent) gets into USC.

The only way to judge a school is by their historical value and prestige. USC will always been known as one of the best schools despite what is going on currently /w their curriculum. Poll 10,000 people and ask which school they think is better, USC or NOVA. I'm not bashing NOVA but USC will always be known as a good school.

[mike3kgt]

Originally Posted by xhamburgersamx

Here's the thing: You ask any class of 2010 student and they will have very negative things to say about what happened to them in 2006 when they were D1. Do the same problems exists? Yes and No. What the D1's are going through right now might change by the time the OP (pre-dent) gets into USC.

The only way to judge a school is by their historical value and prestige. USC will always been known as one of the best schools despite what is going on currently /w their curriculum. Poll 10,000 people and ask which school they think is better, USC or NOVA. I'm not bashing NOVA but USC will always be known as a good school.

No-one will argue the reputation that USC has from years past. I have seen personally and worked with many old-time USC grads... their work was exceptional.

How good, however, will reputation be if you are not graduating on time and having to spend an additional 40k in tuition because you didn't finish your requirements? How good is your school's reputation if you start practicing and don't know what to do?

Very similar problems were at Nova, but you should bring your comments back online when you are a D4 and they may be different. When I was a D1, I thought about Nova much differently than I do as a "recent" grad. I always thought that those upperclasspeople were "lazy" or "couldn't get their stuff done." As a D1, I thought the most important thing in the world was how great the simlab looked and how cool the anatomy lab was. Boy did I see differently as a D4.

My experiences with USC grads were from 2007-2009 graduating classes. They were well trained but boy the stories I have heard...

My eyes opened up and realized that very few places are people extremely happy with what they had to go through in dental school. Well, then again, most everybody I have spoken with about UOP have nothing but great things to say, but that's the only one .

[GonnaDoIt]

Originally Posted by xhamburgersamx

The only way to judge a school is by their historical value and prestige.

Maybe to 5% of dentists who graduated from a "historical" and "prestigious" school, but otherwise this is simply not true. Nevermind board passing rates, clinic hours, and graduation rates? I attend Loma Linda University, a school that is considered both "historical" and "prestigious" by many people in the dental world, but if we were going through all the administrative and clinic-related problems that recent graduates at USC have gone through, I would be the first to tell you that it is just not a good school right now. Having grown up and worked in the dental field in Southern Cal, I like USC and their graduates do just fine. They get liscensed to do dental work, which is the goal. But to say the school is in the same shape it was 5 years ago, let alone 40 years ago, based on "prestige" alone is absurd. I, and many USC alumni who I have talked to, would not really even venture to call it "good" right now, as dental schools go. One thing I know for sure (at least I hope) is that USC is going to fix its problems and be back to where it used to be. Even the board of the dental school knew it was not in a good place, which is why they got rid of Slavkin and decided to move on from there.

[Daurang]

You predents need to grow up and let go the 'prestige' thing. Save your money and just go to the CHEAPEST dental school that will accept you. No patient will ever nor can ever judge your skills by your school. Maybe one in 5000 will ask you for the sake of conversation.

[Oracle DMD]

Originally Posted by Daurang

You predents need to grow up and let go the 'prestige' thing. Save your money and just go to the CHEAPEST dental school that will accept you. No patient will ever nor can ever judge your skills by your school. Maybe one in 5000 will ask you for the sake of conversation.

[reapply2007]

USC the home of the boston crab-what's to hate?

[xhamburgersamx]

Originally Posted by Daurang

You predents need to grow up and let go the 'prestige' thing. Save your money and just go to the CHEAPEST dental school that will accept you. No patient will ever nor can ever judge your skills by your school. Maybe one in 5000 will ask you for the sake of conversation.

most people go to usc because that is their only acceptance

[aphistis]

Originally Posted by xhamburgersamx

The only way to judge a school is by their historical value and prestige....USC will always be known as a good school...

...irrespective of whether or not it actually is.

[QCkid]

I Graduated from USC in 08. It was hard to graduate on time because it is clinically (or was, I cant speak about the current situation) a difficult program. All of my buddies were able to go straight out and do their own thing. One is in a high end cosmetics practice, Out of the 17 or 18 guys that Im talking about, I think only one is working as an associate. They all seem to be doing pretty well.

[xhamburgersamx]

Originally Posted by QCkid

I Graduated from USC in 08. It was hard to graduate on time because it is clinically (or was, I cant speak about the current situation) a difficult program. All of my buddies were able to go straight out and do their own thing. One is in a high end cosmetics practice, Out of the 17 or 18 guys that Im talking about, I think only one is working as an associate. They all seem to be doing pretty well.

The clinical requirements have been changed for class of 2012

[cgood]

I'm a D1 at USC and I love it. There have been so many changes that the next four years should breeze by. Don't get me wrong we are already working our butts off. We were in the SIM lab the second day or orientation playing with our high speed pieces. We also have started tooth morphology and have been working on wax build ups and wax tooth carvings in the SIM lab. How many other first years are already in the SIM lab? Few to none as far as I know.

All the upperclassmen are super friendly and PBL is fun and EFFECTIVE. I learned way more my first week than I would have in a lecture. Sure it requires some research and will power but hey it's how the real world functions. No one will be there to spoon feed us when we are on our own.

And we do have lectures too. They supplement our PBL sessions and we also have a tooth morphology lecture. All in all I'm very happy with my decision to come here. SDN will soon hear about how great SC is and that sure it's not perfect but all the major problems are in the past. I feel fortunate to be part of this university at this point in time.

[Oracle DMD]

Originally Posted by cgood

I'm a D1 at USC and I love it. There have been so many changes that the next four years should breeze by. Don't get me wrong we are already working our butts off. We were in the SIM lab the second day or orientation playing with our high speed pieces. We also have started tooth morphology and have been working on wax build ups and wax tooth carvings in the SIM lab. How many other first years are already in the SIM lab? Few to none as far as I know.

All the upperclassmen are super friendly and PBL is fun and EFFECTIVE. I learned way more my first week than I would have in a lecture. Sure it requires some research and will power but hey it's how the real world functions. No one will be there to spoon feed us when we are on our own.

And we do have lectures too. They supplement our PBL sessions and we also have a tooth morphology lecture. All in all I'm very happy with my decision to come here. SDN will soon hear about how great SC is and that sure it's not perfect but all the major problems are in the past. I feel fortunate to be part of this university at this point in time.

i would imagine all D1's get into simlab early 1st year....i don't know who isn't. PBL can be effective but many people don't like it still. the USC problems weren't about their PBL as much as it was about the structure of their clinical side, or at least that is how i understood it. people not grauating on time had nothing to do w/ PBL and everything to do with clinical requirements meeting chairtime meeting clinical administration. anybody know the details about that? recent grads?

[cgood]

Originally Posted by Oracle DMD

i would imagine all D1's get into simlab early 1st year....i don't know who isn't. PBL can be effective but many people don't like it still. the USC problems weren't about their PBL as much as it was about the structure of their clinical side, or at least that is how i understood it. people not grauating on time had nothing to do w/ PBL and everything to do with clinical requirements meeting chairtime meeting clinical administration. anybody know the details about that? recent grads?

I guess I can only speak for SC then because we didn't used to get in to SIM lab until Summer and now we are in in early fall. Grad rates are well over 90% and pretty much anyone who isn't graduating on time had some extenuating circumstance of their own that was not the Univeristy's fault. Remember this is dental school and if you are not proactive and not on top of your work it is easy to fall behind. They have completely revamped out clinical requirements and how you schedule chair time. From all the upperclassmen I've talk to, most are on track to graduate early. There definitely were problems a couple of years ago, but I feel the administration has done a great job listening, addressing and now fixing those concerns. Again this is my opinion.

[xhamburgersamx]

Originally Posted by Oracle DMD

i would imagine all D1's get into simlab early 1st year....i don't know who isn't. PBL can be effective but many people don't like it still. the USC problems weren't about their PBL as much as it was about the structure of their clinical side, or at least that is how i understood it. people not grauating on time had nothing to do w/ PBL and everything to do with clinical requirements meeting chairtime meeting clinical administration. anybody know the details about that? recent grads?

Pretty much what was going on was that chair reservations were on a first come first serve basis. You were able to schedule chairs at 7:30AM on the computer at school so whoever had the faster computer and/or clicked faster was able to get their chair faster (you can remote access Axium at home now). Another problem that arose was that USC sectioned off portions of the clinic for specific treatments (i.e. 32 chairs were set off for operative). Sometimes there would be 15 empty chairs of perio while all 32 operative chairs were full /w a waitlist going on. I'm not entirely sure if they changed this but the new seniors are all doing really well. I know a few that are only a few requirements short of graduating right now. Also there were just too many clilnical requirements for crown and RCT when it was very hard to get their patients in the first place. Most of the time, patients need just full extraction and RPD's or full immediate dentures.

When it comes to getting the right patients, it's often difficult to get exactly the right treatments you need to fulfill requirements. Your group practice director usually tries to help but if there really no patients then you can't work on stuff. Also if you slack and only show up for morning clinic and take the rest of the day off, you will for sure fall behind.

[gabeUSCDDS]

What can I say about SC.....that it kicked my ass for 4 years; it was a miserable time. I was tested every single day and was on remediation for operative during preclinical. Mainly due to my poor handskills. Is it a good school? If I you asked me that 2 years ago I would've said its the worst based on the fact that I hated SC for all the pain they had me go through. Clinic is challenging and basically you must be working everyday and being productive to get out on time. Clinical competencies are challenging but in my opinion, more manageable than pre-clinical tpxs; still hard though!!

Do I think SC is a good choice? Definitely if you want to be a great clinician and be better prepared for the WREB. Do I recommend SC? I do, it will be a challeging experience but in the end it will make you an excellent dentist and don't worry about graduation! They've taken care of that. My class graduated 95% on time. The people who didn't (including me) graduated a month or two afterwards; they did not graduated on time due to personal situations beyond their control.

[Hysteria24]

It's nice to see honest posts from people who have recently gone through all 4 years like the one above. Thanks for chiming in Gabe.

[youngmc27]

I am a third year dental student here at USC, and I love it. We are just getting going regularly now in clinic and it is challanging but great. If you work hard and are organized and prepared USC is a great school, but at the sametime if you are not as motivated or hard working maybe PBL and USC are not for you. I know that USC requires a lot and it is difficult but you will be a great dentist when you are finished. I am so happy that I chose USC over others. At the sametime I hate that it costs so much but again that was my choice.

[blumnday99]

Originally Posted by youngmc27

I am a third year dental student here at USC, and I love it. We are just getting going regularly now in clinic and it is challanging but great. If you work hard and are organized and prepared USC is a great school, but at the sametime if you are not as motivated or hard working maybe PBL and USC are not for you. I know that USC requires a lot and it is difficult but you will be a great dentist when you are finished. I am so happy that I chose USC over others. At the sametime I hate that it costs so much but again that was my choice.

Are they switching back to a traditional program?

[blumnday99]

Originally Posted by xhamburgersamx

Pretty much what was going on was that chair reservations were on a first come first serve basis. You were able to schedule chairs at 7:30AM on the computer at school so whoever had the faster computer and/or clicked faster was able to get their chair faster (you can remote access Axium at home now). Another problem that arose was that USC sectioned off portions of the clinic for specific treatments (i.e. 32 chairs were set off for operative). Sometimes there would be 15 empty chairs of perio while all 32 operative chairs were full /w a waitlist going on. I'm not entirely sure if they changed this but the new seniors are all doing really well. I know a few that are only a few requirements short of graduating right now. Also there were just too many clilnical requirements for crown and RCT when it was very hard to get their patients in the first place. Most of the time, patients need just full extraction and RPD's or full immediate dentures.

When it comes to getting the right patients, it's often difficult to get exactly the right treatments you need to fulfill requirements. Your group practice director usually tries to help but if there really no patients then you can't work on stuff. Also if you slack and only show up for morning clinic and take the rest of the day off, you will for sure fall behind.

I also graduated in 2009 (on time). I don't believe that USC's clinical requirement (especially for fixed units and endo) were too high, however, I do think the patient pool in the area is limited. It's true that group directors are supposed to help you find patients, however, some group directors were better at doing this than others. The difficulty of USC exams made the grading on the WREBs seem very easy. In hindsight, the most difficult and stressful part of the licensure exam was screening and finding patients (and backups).

[gabeUSCDDS]

Originally Posted by blumnday99

I also graduated in 2009 (on time). I don't believe that USC's clinical requirement (especially for fixed units and endo) were too high, however, I do think the patient pool in the area is limited. It's true that group directors are supposed to help you find patients, however, some group directors were better at doing this than others. The difficulty of USC exams made the grading on the WREBs seem very easy. In hindsight, the most difficult and stressful part of the licensure exam was screening and finding patients (and backups).

Totally, the only problem I had in WREBs was finding patients, I had no backups so was relying on what I had which I thought were dead-on lesions. Gladly, everything turn out fine. Pre-Clinic was a little harder for me since I was in fixed prost remedial for such a long time (1.5 years) it was crazy, I was almost at the verge of being pushed back to class of 2010!!!! So the moral of the story is: USC is challenging, once you finish the program the WREB will be cake. And if your handskills suck, persisitence is the key to accomplish graduation, if I did it ANYBODY can do it for sure

[Oracle DMD]

Originally Posted by gabeUSCDDS

Totally, the only problem I had in WREBs was finding patients, I had no backups so was relying on what I had which I thought were dead-on lesions. Gladly, everything turn out fine. Pre-Clinic was a little harder for me since I was in fixed prost remedial for such a long time (1.5 years) it was crazy, I was almost at the verge of being pushed back to class of 2010!!!! So the moral of the story is: USC is challenging, once you finish the program the WREB will be cake. And if your handskills suck, persisitence is the key to accomplish graduation, if I did it ANYBODY can do it for sure

where were all these USC alums to defend the program over the past few years?

[blumnday99]

Originally Posted by Oracle DMD

where were all these USC alums to defend the program over the past few years?

I have a feeling that many of the alums from the previous classes were very unhappy with the way the clinical floor was run. Dr. Abelson took over when my class was starting full time on the clinic floor and made several changes which allowed for better utilization of clinic time....all though it isn't perfect now (especially with trying to get patient's perio treatment completed), it is greatly improved.

[Oracle DMD]

Originally Posted by blumnday99

I have a feeling that many of the alums from the previous classes were very unhappy with the way the clinical floor was run. Dr. Abelson took over when my class was starting full time on the clinic floor and made several changes which allowed for better utilization of clinic time....all though it isn't perfect now (especially with trying to get patient's perio treatment completed), it is greatly improved.

can you expand on the current system that the clinic is running under as opposed to what was causing trouble in years past? and what is making completing perio is difficult?

[blumnday99]

Originally Posted by Oracle DMD

can you expand on the current system that the clinic is running under as opposed to what was causing trouble in years past? and what is making completing perio is difficult?

A lot of the previous problems were due to our competency exams. There was usually only 1 section (8 chairs) open in either morning or afternoon sessions. There were about 20 exams that had to be taken for graduation (these included composite, fixed, amalgam, etc...). A lot of the students felt comfortable enough and had appropriate cases for exams at the same time. There were usually too many students for exam chairs...especially towards graduation. During my clinic time, Dr. Abelson opened up more chairs....there were at least 16 chairs per day as well as "overflow" sections with other faculty if the first 16 were full. I never had a problem finding a comp chair when I wanted to take an exam. People were still running into problems when they "had" to take an exam with a certain instructor. If you were open to taking exams with almost any instructor, you could find a chair.

I believe that the perio department is just short staffed. There are usually 24 chairs of perio per session. Almost all of our patients have to go through 4 quads of S/RP BEFORE receiving any kind of definitive restorative treatment. Most students can only complete 1 quad of S/RP per session.....which means you'd need at least 4 appointments for each patient before you can start your restorative treatment. There are approximately 160 or so students (including ASPIDs) in each class x 4 quads per patient x your patient base = not enough perio chairs for everyone. In addition, at least on session a week was blocked off for sophomore perio block. Dr. Abelson tried to open up an extra session or two a week, but I don't think there was enough perio faculty to cover any more sessions.

I think a lot of students also had trouble finding patients / passing their senior perio S/RP exams. The perio faculty graded quite hard and I knew several people that had to take it two or three times before they passed - but it did make the WREB perio portion super easy (especially with a cavitron)...I finished my quad in about an hour and a half.

[xhamburgersamx]

Originally Posted by blumnday99

A lot of the previous problems were due to our competency exams. There was usually only 1 section (8 chairs) open in either morning or afternoon sessions. There were about 20 exams that had to be taken for graduation (these included composite, fixed, amalgam, etc...). A lot of the students felt comfortable enough and had appropriate cases for exams at the same time. There were usually too many students for exam chairs...especially towards graduation. During my clinic time, Dr. Abelson opened up more chairs....there were at least 16 chairs per day as well as "overflow" sections with other faculty if the first 16 were full. I never had a problem finding a comp chair when I wanted to take an exam. People were still running into problems when they "had" to take an exam with a certain instructor. If you were open to taking exams with almost any instructor, you could find a chair.

I believe that the perio department is just short staffed. There are usually 24 chairs of perio per session. Almost all of our patients have to go through 4 quads of S/RP BEFORE receiving any kind of definitive restorative treatment. Most students can only complete 1 quad of S/RP per session.....which means you'd need at least 4 appointments for each patient before you can start your restorative treatment. There are approximately 160 or so students (including ASPIDs) in each class x 4 quads per patient x your patient base = not enough perio chairs for everyone. In addition, at least on session a week was blocked off for sophomore perio block. Dr. Abelson tried to open up an extra session or two a week, but I don't think there was enough perio faculty to cover any more sessions.

I think a lot of students also had trouble finding patients / passing their senior perio S/RP exams. The perio faculty graded quite hard and I knew several people that had to take it two or three times before they passed - but it did make the WREB perio portion super easy (especially with a cavitron)...I finished my quad in about an hour and a half.

Is it because USC has a hygiene program with many of their instructors in the perio dept? A lot of upperclassmen I know just hate doing perio as well and are pretty bad at it as well.

[armorshell]

Only 1 quad per session? How long are the sessions? Is that are you're "allowed" to do?

[blumnday99]

Originally Posted by xhamburgersamx

Is it because USC has a hygiene program with many of their instructors in the perio dept? A lot of upperclassmen I know just hate doing perio as well and are pretty bad at it as well.

I think the hygiene department usually only has 1 periodontist and 1 hygienist on the first floor every day. I think they just need more perio chairs and need to hire more faculty for coverage.

Originally Posted by armorshell

Only 1 quad per session? How long are the sessions? Is that are you're "allowed" to do?

Usually that's all we're "allowed" to do. A lot of the quads are heavy and perio faculty are quite meticulous. As an inexperienced student, you may not have the same tactile feel to detect subgingival calculus and usually have to go back over an area several times before the faculty will let you proceed.

[jay47]

Originally Posted by blumnday99

A lot of the previous problems were due to our competency exams. There was usually only 1 section (8 chairs) open in either morning or afternoon sessions. There were about 20 exams that had to be taken for graduation (these included composite, fixed, amalgam, etc...). A lot of the students felt comfortable enough and had appropriate cases for exams at the same time. There were usually too many students for exam chairs...especially towards graduation. During my clinic time, Dr. Abelson opened up more chairs....there were at least 16 chairs per day as well as "overflow" sections with other faculty if the first 16 were full. I never had a problem finding a comp chair when I wanted to take an exam. People were still running into problems when they "had" to take an exam with a certain instructor. If you were open to taking exams with almost any instructor, you could find a chair.

I believe that the perio department is just short staffed. There are usually 24 chairs of perio per session. Almost all of our patients have to go through 4 quads of S/RP BEFORE receiving any kind of definitive restorative treatment. Most students can only complete 1 quad of S/RP per session.....which means you'd need at least 4 appointments for each patient before you can start your restorative treatment. There are approximately 160 or so students (including ASPIDs) in each class x 4 quads per patient x your patient base = not enough perio chairs for everyone. In addition, at least on session a week was blocked off for sophomore perio block. Dr. Abelson tried to open up an extra session or two a week, but I don't think there was enough perio faculty to cover any more sessions.

I think a lot of students also had trouble finding patients / passing their senior perio S/RP exams. The perio faculty graded quite hard and I knew several people that had to take it two or three times before they passed - but it did make the WREB perio portion super easy (especially with a cavitron)...I finished my quad in about an hour and a half.

This post makes me laugh. Our physiology professor says that we aren't "trained" professionals until we can use lots of big acronyms and words that no one else knows.