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thesauce

thesauce

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I was wondering how much advanced notice you get about each rotation schedule? I recently started my first rotation of internship and I got my schedule on Friday evening for my rotation starting on Monday.

Now, this wouldn't bother me so much except it was pretty counter-intuitive. I started on ambulatory medicine and my schedule is 1pm to 11pm daily. So it basically shot all of my evening activities for the month. I had planned these activities in advance thinking that ambulatory was basically 9-5 or something similar. I'm curious: are you guys able to plan any weekly activities at all or is that a thing of the past?
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We'll get our rotation schedule for the year 2 months before the year starts and get individual block call schedules ~2 months in advance. Generally the specifics of a rotation come the week before, like the department secretary will email a list of required conferences, clinic schedule, suggested readings, etc.
 
thesauce said:
I was wondering how much advanced notice you get about each rotation schedule? I recently started my first rotation of internship and I got my schedule on Friday evening for my rotation starting on Monday.

Now, this wouldn't bother me so much except it was pretty counter-intuitive. I started on ambulatory medicine and my schedule is 1pm to 11pm daily. So it basically shot all of my evening activities for the month. I had planned these activities in advance thinking that ambulatory was basically 9-5 or something similar. I'm curious: are you guys able to plan any weekly activities at all or is that a thing of the past?
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Sure, you can plan weekly activities. But it depends when you get your schedule, which will vary by program and may even vary by month.
 
Buzz Me said:
Sometimes you don't find out the call schedule for the rotation until the first day of the rotation...brutal.
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Agreed. We had an Administrative Chief Resident who did the schedules and while they would usually have a deadline for requests for days off, sometimes it wouldn't be met and the schedule wasn't provided until the last minute.

I agree with L2D - planning yoursocial life during residency is difficult at best. Bear in mind that even when not on call, you might not be going home on the hour like you seem to think you will be. Residency is not shift work and you're not punching a time clock. Remember when those residents sent you home at the end of the day as a student? They stayed behind doing work, even if it was after 5 pm and they weren't on call.

It will vary from program to program, rotation to rotation and census to census. YMMV.
 
thesauce said:
I started on ambulatory medicine and my schedule is 1pm to 11pm daily. So it basically shot all of my evening activities for the month. I had planned these activities in advance thinking that ambulatory was basically 9-5 or something similar. I'm curious: are you guys able to plan any weekly activities at all or is that a thing of the past?
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First rule of residency: your life belongs to your program until you finish. There were many times when I had to remind them (mostly the seniors) of the 30 hour and 1 day off in 7 rules. The only definite plans you can make is during vacation time when it's really your time.
 
thesauce said:
I was wondering how much advanced notice you get about each rotation schedule? I recently started my first rotation of internship and I got my schedule on Friday evening for my rotation starting on Monday.

Now, this wouldn't bother me so much except it was pretty counter-intuitive. I started on ambulatory medicine and my schedule is 1pm to 11pm daily. So it basically shot all of my evening activities for the month. I had planned these activities in advance thinking that ambulatory was basically 9-5 or something similar. I'm curious: are you guys able to plan any weekly activities at all or is that a thing of the past?
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that sounds like ur doing some form of nightfloat, not ambulatory? i don't think ambulatory patients come in that late do they? pretty interesting schedule. haven't heard of that before. at least you will get to sleep in and not have to wake up early!
 
turquoiseblue said:
that sounds like ur doing some form of nightfloat, not ambulatory? i don't think ambulatory patients come in that late do they? pretty interesting schedule. haven't heard of that before. at least you will get to sleep in and not have to wake up early!
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It's not NF. I only have to do one NF month and it has been accounted for already. I don't fully understand this ambulatory schedule.

I guess this is the crux of the issue. If there was ever a rotation where I felt safe planning something, it would be ambulatory. I wouldn't be so bold as to assume that I'd be getting off of a floor month at a particular time.

Sleeping in and hitting the gym before work will be nice, though.

Thanks for all of the replies!
 
Winged Scapula said:
Agreed. We had an Administrative Chief Resident who did the schedules and while they would usually have a deadline for requests for days off, sometimes it wouldn't be met and the schedule wasn't provided until the last minute.

I agree with L2D - planning yoursocial life during residency is difficult at best. Bear in mind that even when not on call, you might not be going home on the hour like you seem to think you will be. Residency is not shift work and you're not punching a time clock. Remember when those residents sent you home at the end of the day as a student? They stayed behind doing work, even if it was after 5 pm and they weren't on call.

It will vary from program to program, rotation to rotation and census to census. YMMV.
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Ha. No, I didn't think that. This isn't a floor month though-it's ambulatory. The clinic closes at some point so that's a big difference in my mind. Before planning anything, I spoke to last year's residents who said ambulatory was 8-5 and I gave myself a 2 hour buffer beyond that (I didn't plan anything before 7pm). Also, there's no call during ambulatory.

I wouldn't be planning a bunch of activities during a floor month.

Really, I'm just wondering 2 things:
1. How far in advance are you given your individual rotation schedule (hours, call, etc)?
2. Have you been able to plan any weekly activities during residency or is that simply a thing of the past?
 
thesauce said:
Ha. No, I didn't think that. This isn't a floor month though-it's ambulatory. The clinic closes at some point so that's a big difference in my mind. Before planning anything, I spoke to last year's residents who said ambulatory was 8-5 and I gave myself a 2 hour buffer beyond that (I didn't plan anything before 7pm). Also, there's no call during ambulatory.

I wouldn't be planning a bunch of activities during a floor month.

Really, I'm just wondering 2 things:
1. How far in advance are you given your individual rotation schedule (hours, call, etc)?
2. Have you been able to plan any weekly activities during residency or is that simply a thing of the past?
Click to expand...

1. Anywhere from 1 day to 2 weeks.
2. You can plan things but make sure the people you plan with know that when you say you'll try to be there by 7:30, that could mean 8:30, 10 or not at all.
 
thesauce said:
Ha. No, I didn't think that. This isn't a floor month though-it's ambulatory. The clinic closes at some point so that's a big difference in my mind. Before planning anything, I spoke to last year's residents who said ambulatory was 8-5 and I gave myself a 2 hour buffer beyond that (I didn't plan anything before 7pm). Also, there's no call during ambulatory.

I wouldn't be planning a bunch of activities during a floor month.

Really, I'm just wondering 2 things:
1. How far in advance are you given your individual rotation schedule (hours, call, etc)?
2. Have you been able to plan any weekly activities during residency or is that simply a thing of the past?
Click to expand...

I haven't even gotten my master schedule yet (suppose to on monday) but this year one administrative chief is in charge of the call schedule for all services and is trying to make said schedule FOR THE ENTIRE YEAR now too. It will be nice to know that I will be on call x day in April already, but it also made it hard to request specific days off that you don't know about (but there is always ability to trade).
 
i start next week and don't have any info on when i get the schedule. i'm assuming it will be at orientation, 3 days before start. i wish i knew what service i'll be on so i could be a little more prepared. so i guess it's not uncommon to have an early heads up. but my classmate at another program got his block schedule about 3 weeks before he starts
 
I start my first block Thursday. I haven't got my daily schedule yet. I do have my cross-cover call schedule through 8/1, and I have my block rotation schedule for the year. But I have no clue what my hours will be, what attending I'll be with, or which hospital I'll be at.

I tend to roll with the punches pretty well, tho. I'm sure I'll find out Wednesday where I should be when on Thursday.
 
I start orientation tomorrow and wards on Thursday and we still don't have the call schedule for the month. We didn't get our block schedules until last week. I'm really hoping this isn't a habit... not having the call schedule three days before the month starts really bites :(
 
WhoisJohnGalt, that baby in your avatar is adorable! Is he yours?
 
So I think this has always been one of my biggest annoyances about medicine, even as a med student (and I just finished my intern year). I understand that I am going to be working a ton, around 80 hrs a week, and this makes keeping a life tough. But at the very least, give me some kind of a schedule a reasonable amount of time in advance so that I can try and plan around it. Its really annoying to tell a good friend something like "hey man, I know your wedding is in like, 3 weeks and all, and I requested the weekend off, but i still dont know if I can come because our call schedule isnt done yet. 3rd and 4th year of med school we wouldnt know the schedule until literally the day of, although it was easier then to rearrange and stuff. As an intern, our chiefs would make the schedule for 3 months at a time, which was nice...but that meant that often the next three month block would be published a few days before hand, so there was still a month where you didnt know your schedule until the day before. Drives me nuts.
 
docdaname said:
So I think this has always been one of my biggest annoyances about medicine, even as a med student (and I just finished my intern year). I understand that I am going to be working a ton, around 80 hrs a week, and this makes keeping a life tough. But at the very least, give me some kind of a schedule a reasonable amount of time in advance so that I can try and plan around it. Its really annoying to tell a good friend something like "hey man, I know your wedding is in like, 3 weeks and all, and I requested the weekend off, but i still dont know if I can come because our call schedule isnt done yet. 3rd and 4th year of med school we wouldnt know the schedule until literally the day of, although it was easier then to rearrange and stuff. As an intern, our chiefs would make the schedule for 3 months at a time, which was nice...but that meant that often the next three month block would be published a few days before hand, so there was still a month where you didnt know your schedule until the day before. Drives me nuts.
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+1000000

That a bunch of people that are supposedly so "smart" can be so completely unorganized is absolutely infuriating to me.

At least now I know it's not an isolated problem. For all the crapola I hear about "professionalism", it would sure be nice to be afforded just a LITTLE bit in return.
 
MJB said:
+1000000

That a bunch of people that are supposedly so "smart" can be so completely unorganized is absolutely infuriating to me....
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It's not so much that they are unorganized or not smart, but rather that they have more on their plate than your schedule, and it's hardly a priority until it gets to the last minute. At many programs the schedule is made up by the chiefs or seniors. These folks are doing their 80 hour work week, studying for licensing boards/inservice exams, looking for fellowships, and doing this administrative stuff on top of all that. So you can see that until it gets to the point that everyone is screaming "where am I supposed to report to tomorrow", it really doesn't get to the top of the pile. Quieter services probably get stuff sooner, but busy ones are just going to have to deal with the fact that your schedule is not high on the radar of the person handling the list.

When we become chiefs I suspect most of us will be guilty of the same thing.
 
Law2Doc said:
It's not so much that they are unorganized or not smart, but rather that they have more on their plate than your schedule, and it's hardly a priority until it gets to the last minute. At many programs the schedule is made up by the chiefs or seniors. These folks are doing their 80 hour work week, studying for licensing boards/inservice exams, looking for fellowships, and doing this administrative stuff on top of all that. So you can see that until it gets to the point that everyone is screaming "where am I supposed to report to tomorrow", it really doesn't get to the top of the pile. Quieter services probably get stuff sooner, but busy ones are just going to have to deal with the fact that your schedule is not high on the radar of the person handling the list.

When we become chiefs I suspect most of us will be guilty of the same thing.
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Again, it's a matter of professionalism.
 
MJB said:
Again, it's a matter of professionalism.
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Agreed. L2D isn't selling me on the notion that the life of a chief is difficult, or more time consuming than an intern's. At least not from what I've seen for medicine.

Note: our chief's have a dedicated year ONLY to be a chief, not on top of PGY3 duties. They are classified as an attending.
 
Our chiefs generally get us our schedule 2-3 weeks before the month starts. They are senior residents, so they have a TON on their plate. The person who does our schedule at our community site is an attending and he gets it to us about 5 weeks prior. He doesn't have as much on his plate.
 
MJB said:
Again, it's a matter of professionalism.
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If you read this forum long enough, you'll see that L2D always comes down on the side of the establishment. If it's a medical student/lower level resident they are being unprofessional. If it's someone in a position of power, you'll see a response like the one above:rolleyes::rolleyes:
 
I have never gotten my schedule for the next rotation until a day or two before it actually starts. This has happened with every chief resident I've ever had, whether during internship, second year, and now third year. This means I usually find out what my next rotation is on the day before it starts, and what my calls will be like during that month on that same day.
 
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