UIW Rosenberg SCHOOL OF OPTOMETRY

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What are the Pro's and Con's of attending and graduating from UIW Rosenberg School of Optometry in San Antonio, TX?

I'm not sure how lifestyle would be in good old San Antonio, TX and what I would expect through the curriculum the school provides and it being pre-accredited.

Originally Posted by OATAcer

Rosenberg School of Optometry.

Pro's and Con's?

Originally Posted by OATAcer

What are the Pro's and Con's of attending and graduating from UIW Rosenberg School of Optometry in San Antonio, TX?

You didn't like the answers the first time, so you start a nearly identical thread??

I am now convinced you are either completely incompetent of finding answers to ANYTHING on your own, or you're a troll. My guess is the latter.

Originally Posted by Obadaden

You didn't like the answers the first time, so you start a nearly identical thread??

I am now convinced you are either completely incompetent of finding answers to ANYTHING on your own, or you're a troll. My guess is the latter.

Not trolling. Just want a detailed answer. Thank you for your time.

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Originally Posted by OATAcer

What are the Pro's and Con's of attending and graduating from UIW Rosenberg School of Optometry in San Antonio, TX?

I'm not sure how lifestyle would be in good old San Antonio, TX and what I would expect through the curriculum the school provides and it being pre-accredited.

Not sure what you're expecting to get that was different than last time.

Pros: They'll take you if you can hold a pen and sign the student loan forms. They might even take you if you can't...so that's a plus.

Cons: You'll be graduating from a school whose very existence makes most practicing ODs' blood boil. You'll be attending a school that does not have accreditation. You'll be attending a school that probably has very weak externships since those take years to solidify. You'll be attending a program that will charge you close to 200K for a degree that will likely not provide you with the means to pay back your loans in a respectable fashion. You're going to get spewed out into an industry that doesn't want or need you, so you'll most likely be diverted into the optometry garbage bin; commercial. You'll be yet another lemming that jumps off the cliff, with high hopes, but only one likely outcome.

Other than that, it's all good. I'm aware this is not rosy stuff....but it's reality. If you don't like it, I'd take a serious look at the career you've chosen. Please don't bother with the smart comebacks, they don't change reality. You'll have to face the music one day, and if it's optometry you choose, Rosenberg or anywhere else, you're likely going to be hearing nothing but Yanni at full volume.

What do I know, though...I'm an optometrist, not a pre-optometry student.

Originally Posted by Jason K

Not sure what you're expecting to get that was different than last time.

Pros: They'll take you if you can hold a pen and sign the student loan forms. They might even take you if you can't...so that's a plus.

Cons: You'll be graduating from a school whose very existence makes most practicing ODs' blood boil. You'll be attending a school that does not have accreditation. You'll be attending a school that probably has very weak externships since those take years to solidify. You'll be attending a program that will charge you close to 200K for a degree that will likely not provide you with the means to pay back your loans in a respectable fashion. You're going to get spewed out into an industry that doesn't want or need you, so you'll most likely be diverted into the optometry garbage bin; commercial. You'll be yet another lemming that jumps off the cliff, with high hopes, but only one likely outcome.

Other than that, it's all good. I'm aware this is not rosy stuff....but it's reality. If you don't like it, I'd take a serious look at the career you've chosen. Please don't bother with the smart comebacks, they don't change reality. You'll have to face the music one day, and if it's optometry you choose, Rosenberg or anywhere else, you're likely going to be hearing nothing but Yanni at full volume.

What do I know, though...I'm an optometrist, not a pre-optometry student.

Thanks Doctor. Which optometry school did you attend? You put down Optometry as if you hate it. Are you depressed? I wish you the best.

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Originally Posted by OATAcer

Thanks Doctor. Which optometry school did you attend? You put down Optometry as if you hate it. Are you depressed? I wish you the best.

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I don't hate optometry and I'm certainly not depressed. It irritates me to no end when you people say that anyone who points out the shortcomings of optometry's future due to the changes that are taking place is "bashing" optometry.

You're an oncologist and you have a patient with stage 4 small cell carcinoma. You tell him "Sir, I"m so sorry, but your organs are failing, the cancer has spread to many different parts of your body, and we can't fight it anymore. As we've discussed before, it's time to get things in order since you don't have much time."

Now, I ask you, are you "bashing" that patient. Are you hateful of that patient? Are you a terrible doctor for telling him the truth? Should you be in the room saying "Oh, no worries, chief, you're gonna be just fine. That cancer will just buff right out and you'll be out shooting hoops in no time." Are you going to speak with his family members and tell them "Heeeeeeeey there! Lookin' good folks, he's gonna pull through with no troubles whatsoever, maybe a little recovery and that's it." Would that be the noble approach?

Optometry is the cancer patient. Commercial optometry, insurance cuts, and oversupply is the cancer, and you are a "cell" in that cancer patient's body.

I do not, and have never, hated optometry. What I do "hate" is what has happened to it and what is continuing to happen to it. If you want to make optometry into something that suits your desires, feel free, but you'll be in the pool soon and the water is nice and cold. Actually, there's not much water left since there's so many of us in it - we take up all the space. You'll just be rubbing elbows with a bunch of people who are already nice and warm from each other's body heat. Too bad, you'll be made to stand next to the pool, though. Enjoy the view from the outside.

I agree with OATacer....you Jason K are the biggest troll i've ever seen. wtf is your problem - are you mad yourself that you picked optometry as a career? Honestly everyone wants to know your deal is?

Originally Posted by itsallgood19

I agree with OATacer....you Jason K are the biggest troll i've ever seen. wtf is your problem - are you mad yourself that you picked optometry as a career? Honestly everyone wants to know your deal is?

Are you really that slow? You actually wonder if I regret my decision to enter optometry? Can you read?

If you want to know "what my deal is...," don't worry, you'll know soon enough. Just keep telling yourself that things will be just as you wish and things will be just fine. Until they're not and then you'll be saying "Damn, I really wish I'd listened to those ODs who told me that optometry's future was dried up." Oh well, I guess I'll just keep paying my 1500/month for the rest of my career so I can work at Walmart.

This thread was created so that I can get answers about UIW Rosenberg School Of Optometry. Please go and argue elsewhere. Your spamming for no reason. Forum administrators take care of this. Thank you. Have a wonderful week.

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Originally Posted by OATAcer

This thread was created so that I can get answers about UIW Rosenberg School Of Optometry. Please go and argue elsewhere. Your spamming for no reason. Forum administrators take care of this. Thank you. Have a wonderful week.

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You asked a question.....again. I answered it.

Just because you don't like an answer, doesn't qualify it as "spam." In the future, you should avoid asking questions to which you will only accept your version of an answer.

Originally Posted by Jason K

What do I know, though...I'm an optometrist, not a pre-optometry student.

If you are already a doctor don't you have better things to do than to lurk around on pre-optometry forums?

Originally Posted by 123eyez

If you are already a doctor don't you have better things to do than to lurk around on pre-optometry forums?

There are plenty of doctors on here - try again.

You know who doesn't have time to post on here? New grads. Most of them are too busy working 4+ PT IC jobs, 6 days per week, nights, and weekends to pay their massive debt load.

When you are "already a doctor" and you finally realize the bottomless pit you've jumped into, maybe you'll find the time as well.

Originally Posted by Jason K

You know who doesn't have time to post on here? New grads. Most of them are too busy working 4+ PT IC jobs, 6 days per week, nights, and weekends to pay their massive debt load.

Glad I won't be one of them. All you need is great networking skills!

Originally Posted by 123eyez

Glad I won't be one of them. All you need is great networking skills!

Yes.....surely that's all you need.

Rosenberg sent me an interview invitation BEFORE i even sent in my supplemental or OAT scores if that gives you an idea of how desperate they are...I'd chose Western over Rosenberg, at least it's in Southern California 8)

Originally Posted by 123eyez

If you are already a doctor don't you have better things to do than to lurk around on pre-optometry forums?

As they say in the military, "Roger that."

Originally Posted by janedoe88

Rosenberg sent me an interview invitation BEFORE i even sent in my supplemental or OAT scores if that gives you an idea of how desperate they are...I'd chose Western over Rosenberg, at least it's in Southern California 8)

Wow! You must have had an exceptionally high GPA and a strong application. Yes, I like Western too, and thinking about that school. I wonder why RSO is so desperate?

Originally Posted by OATAcer

I wonder why RSO is so desperate?

Seriously? You wonder why they're so desperate? Dude, you've got a lot to learn....

Originally Posted by Jason K

Seriously? You wonder why they're so desperate? Dude, you've got a lot to learn....

I had a quick question regarding the future of optometrists. What would you say to someone currently in optometry school, any words of advice? I realize you like to describe the profession as a "burning building", however what would you say to someone in this building? Is there a silver-lining to what is happening in the industry?

Thank you for your input on this forum. It's nice to know what I am really getting myself into.

Originally Posted by thericeman

I had a quick question regarding the future of optometrists. What would you say to someone currently in optometry school, any words of advice? I realize you like to describe the profession as a "burning building", however what would you say to someone in this building? Is there a silver-lining to what is happening in the industry?

Thank you for your input on this forum. It's nice to know what I am really getting myself into.

I wish I could tell you there was some hidden silver lining, but there isn't. Optometry is not the problem. Many pre-ops like to lull themselves into a false sense of security by stating that I'm "bashing optometry." I'm not bashing optometry - it's a profession that provides a wonderful service to society. It's also a profession, unfortunately, that grossly overtrains most of its new additions right now. ODs are trained to provide a far higher level of service than they were 20 years ago, and yet, as time goes on, we're sending more and more new grads into positions which could be held by refractive techs. There's a separation between the integrity of the profession and its practitioners, and what's happening to the profession as a whole. Those are two separate things.

The problem is the absent leadership that has allowed for the profession to be overtaken by outside forces. Other professions, facing some of the same forces, have not been so impotent in their abilities to protect themselves. Optometry has stood by and let it happen.

As I've said before, the difficulty for you guys is that you "see" an optometry that is very different from the one you will be getting. You read articles/interviews like the one posted currently from Dr. Geist and think that you will have the same experience, or at least opportunity, that they had. You talk to and visit with older, established ODs with high-volume, successful practices and think you can produce the same after graduation. The reality is that older ODs entered optometry at a time when it had not yet been overrun by commercial forces, it was not saturated to the point that the new grads were being forced to work in multiple PT, "doc-in-the-box" type settings, and a time when our services were still valued by the public.

Optometry, like it or not, is going totally commercial, just like pharmacy. It's not pleasant, but it's the only possible outcome given the circumstances. If you have your heart set on a successful private practice career, I'd really dig a little deeper into the profession and its future before you make a decision.

"It's also a profession, unfortunately, that grossly overtrains most of its new additions right now. ODs are trained to provide a far higher level of service than they were 20 years ago, and yet, as time goes on, we're sending more and more new grads into positions which could be held by refractive techs."

Truth is that there is just not enough pathology out there is. Most people will only need glasses and cataract surgery when they get really old which we don't do. Eyes stay generally healthy and don't need three professions trying to take care of it. Private practices that I have shadowed are not treating anything complex, 90% are simple refraction. Public perceives refraction as "whatever" and have no problem going to their local mall for it. So if our patients are willing to go to Walmart and Costco for exams guess where the jobs will be? This profession is the perfect fit for retail setting, OD does a quick procedure the patient then buys cheap glasses or contacts from the store.

Originally Posted by OATAcer

This thread was created so that I can get answers about UIW Rosenberg School Of Optometry. Please go and argue elsewhere. Your spamming for no reason. Forum administrators take care of this. Thank you. Have a wonderful week.

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Is RSO your only option?

Originally Posted by OATAcer

Wow! You must have had an exceptionally high GPA and a strong application. Yes, I like Western too, and thinking about that school. I wonder why RSO is so desperate?

my stats aren't even that great lol that's just how desperate RSO is, the admissions staff that called me practically begged me to come in for an interview, even though I told her I haven't submitted the supplemental. It could be that it's a catholic school so the religious thing might turn people off.
Also, I guess it's like why would anyone go to RSO when they could get into Western. I have a feeling that once Western is accredited, it's going to become very difficult to get accepted because there is a VERY large majority of California students that want to stay in California (because California is amazing).

Originally Posted by CL Doc

Is RSO your only option?

No. I am thinking about other schools. Waiting to see how well I do on the OAT.

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Originally Posted by janedoe88

my stats aren't even that great lol that's just how desperate RSO is, the admissions staff that called me practically begged me to come in for an interview, even though I told her I haven't submitted the supplemental. It could be that it's a catholic school so the religious thing might turn people off.
Also, I guess it's like why would anyone go to RSO when they could get into Western. I have a feeling that once Western is accredited, it's going to become very difficult to get accepted because there is a VERY large majority of California students that want to stay in California (because California is amazing).

Yes, I see the school being a religious school throwing many applicants off as far as interest. Like Berkeley they have more requirements needed to apply and since its a research school, students don't seek into it. I think western, Rosenberg, mcphs are good non-accredited schools based off who there faculty is and how sucessfull other programs are, but Midwestern university is not all that, faculty leave the school. So are you going to western?

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Originally Posted by OATAcer

Yes, I see the school being a religious school throwing many applicants off as far as interest. Like Berkeley they have more requirements needed to apply and since its a research school, students don't seek into it. I think western, Rosenberg, mcphs are good non-accredited schools based off who there faculty is and how sucessfull other programs are, but Midwestern university is not all that, faculty leave the school. So are you going to western?

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Western is the only non-accredited school I would actually consider, MCPHS and Rosenberg are a joke. good luck!

Originally Posted by janedoe88

Western is the only non-accredited school I would actually consider, MCPHS and Rosenberg are a joke. good luck!

Why do you say that they are jokes?

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Originally Posted by OATAcer

Why do you say that they are jokes?

Diploma mills.

Regardless of which school you end up attending, it is a very competitive job market.

New grads from unaccredited schools will even have a harder time finding a job.

Originally Posted by OATAcer

Why do you say that they are jokes?

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because they take everyone, whereas I know some people in my interview group at Western were rejected.

Realistically speaking, Rso obviously doesnt accept everyone. They have half the seats that western does. The fact is that both schools are not fully accredited and can only be so after the first class graduates next year. I have been to both schools, western talked a lot about new equipment blah blah blah. Spoke to some people from 3rd year that I knew through friends and they were pretty confident about accredidation. These guys werent the usual pre selected tour guides so they werent as biased and were pretty straight up about things. The 3rd year students at both schools will be taking boards soon so that will give is a better picture. They charge about 30k in tuition and I doubt either school wants their business to get shut down so im sure they are working hard to get accredited although its not up to them in the end. It seems like new schools are gonna keep popping up, one in virginia, one is nevada, boston, and I think another one so eventually western and rso will not be the focus when people talk
about new schools. If you can somehow limit your debt and not bs yourself then maybe optometry is right for you. Jason K seems pretty negative sometimes and who knows what his true motives are but he brings up some points to think about and other optometrists concur with him. Maybe its all a big conspiracy and these guys come on here to prevent a fraction of people from going into the field but i doubt that. Personally i think theres a lot of hype about optometry being a great profession and people
go in thinking theyre gonna get rich quick working easy hours but thats simply not true. Schools are out to make money and theyre doing a good job of it. Dont get into this unless youve considered all the information, done your own research, made a smart plan for the future and to manage debt, and you have a real interest in doing this possibly forever. Same optometrist works part time at two local wal marts where im at. Im not trying to add to the perceived negativity. Oatacer you can pm me if u want more detailed info about both schools. Im gonna add my feedback to the interview section. I owe it to this site since it helped me quite a bit in all my interviews.

Originally Posted by Shnurek

Diploma mills.

What do you mean? Sorry didn't understand.

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Originally Posted by blazenmadison

Regardless of which school you end up attending, it is a very competitive job market.

New grads from unaccredited schools will even have a harder time finding a job.

Well if the unaccredited schools get accredited next 2013, then by the time I graduate in 2016, I will graduate from a accredited school. Right?

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Originally Posted by janedoe88

because they take everyone, whereas I know some people in my interview group at Western were rejected.

They do not take everyone. Have you seen the 2010-2011 OptomCAS report? 569 applied to RSO AND 172 were invited for an interview, 397 flat out denied and out of the 172 interviewed they accepted 64 students.

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Originally Posted by balltc

Realistically speaking, Rso obviously doesnt accept everyone. They have half the seats that western does. The fact is that both schools are not fully accredited and can only be so after the first class graduates next year. I have been to both schools, western talked a lot about new equipment blah blah blah. Spoke to some people from 3rd year that I knew through friends and they were pretty confident about accredidation. These guys werent the usual pre selected tour guides so they werent as biased and were pretty straight up about things. The 3rd year students at both schools will be taking boards soon so that will give is a better picture. They charge about 30k in tuition and I doubt either school wants their business to get shut down so im sure they are working hard to get accredited although its not up to them in the end. It seems like new schools are gonna keep popping up, one in virginia, one is nevada, boston, and I think another one so eventually western and rso will not be the focus when people talk
about new schools. If you can somehow limit your debt and not bs yourself then maybe optometry is right for you. Jason K seems pretty negative sometimes and who knows what his true motives are but he brings up some points to think about and other optometrists concur with him. Maybe its all a big conspiracy and these guys come on here to prevent a fraction of people from going into the field but i doubt that. Personally i think theres a lot of hype about optometry being a great profession and people
go in thinking theyre gonna get rich quick working easy hours but thats simply not true. Schools are out to make money and theyre doing a good job of it. Dont get into this unless youve considered all the information, done your own research, made a smart plan for the future and to manage debt, and you have a real interest in doing this possibly forever. Same optometrist works part time at two local wal marts where im at. Im not trying to add to the perceived negativity. Oatacer you can pm me if u want more detailed info about both schools. Im gonna add my feedback to the interview section. I owe it to this site since it helped me quite a bit in all my interviews.

Where is the interview section?

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Originally Posted by OATAcer

They do not take everyone. Have you seen the 2010-2011 OptomCAS report? 569 applied to RSO AND 172 were invited for an interview, 397 flat out denied and out of the 172 interviewed they accepted 64 students.

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well my advice was Western > RSO > New England

Originally Posted by janedoe88

well my advice was Western > RSO > New England

I agree. Do you mean new England college of optometry or mcphs?

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lol this is my second post and you being a "senior member" are asking me how to find interview feedback? go to articles and interviews then select interview feedback under the optometry section. good luck.

Originally Posted by OATAcer

I agree. Do you mean new England college of optometry or mcphs?

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Western > RSO > MCPHS

did you get accepted to Western?

Originally Posted by janedoe88

Western > RSO > MCPHS

did you get accepted to Western?

Haven't applied yet.

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Originally Posted by OATAcer

They do not take everyone. Have you seen the 2010-2011 OptomCAS report? 569 applied to RSO AND 172 were invited for an interview, 397 flat out denied and out of the 172 interviewed they accepted 64 students.

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This stat doesn't means that 89% of applicants are being rejected by RSO.
Most are just choosing not to complete the application process.

Forget about going off to school. Soon you will be able to do it right from your home through correspondance courses. Check this out. It's coming back again:

http://books.google.com/books?id=H9w...etrist&f=false

I plan to re-open the Monroe College of Optometry (from 1939 near bottom of page). You send me a check for $50,000 and I will send you a "How To Refract" DVD and a Diploma I made on my computer. That's all you really need.

P.S. Just because you don't like what you hear/read, doesn't make it less truthful. We know your parents coddled you all through your life but in the real world, facts mean something. And the fact it, there is a massive oversupply of optometrists right now and into the foreseeable future. And many future grads will be hard pressed to find meaning full-time work.

So don't hate the messengers. Hate the message and demand to see every one of your professors successful private practices. After all, they will be teaching you. Don't you think they should have to prove some form of practice success before telling you how to do it? Fact is (again this inconvienent word 'fact' gets in the way)--- Probably 90% of your faculty have never had a real optometry job outside of Walmart. Check it out. At my school, it wasn't unusual to have students that graduated 1 year ahead of you on the faculty. They just graduate and fill out an application to teach at an optometry school. You really think they know ANYTHING about optometry?

Originally Posted by optsuker

This stat doesn't means that 89% of applicants are being rejected by RSO.
Most are just choosing not to complete the application process.

exactly, like I applied but never went for the interview. Also on my ranking I would say:

Western > RSO > Midwestern > MCPHS

cause at least Midwestern has a couple years on MCPHS that just opened its doors this year (and late this year i might add)

Originally Posted by janedoe88

exactly, like I applied but never went for the interview. Also on my ranking I would say:

Western > RSO > Midwestern > MCPHS

cause at least Midwestern has a couple years on MCPHS that just opened its doors this year (and late this year i might add)

Who cares if its accredited or not. By the time we graduate it will be. And if its not accredited, you still pass boards and are licensed to practice. Then go for residency to gain more clinical hours on the area of optometry you love. Schools have to start somewhere. SUNY and Berkeley were once unaccredited. Its all about going where you love and networking in that state.

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Originally Posted by OATAcer

Who cares if its accredited or not. By the time we graduate it will be. And if its not accredited, you still pass boards and are licensed to practice. Then go for residency to gain more clinical hours on the area of optometry you love. Schools have to start somewhere. SUNY and Berkeley were once unaccredited. Its all about going where you love and networking in that state.

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except that you'd be the FIRST class at New England so you'd have virtually NO alumni or advice on externships.

Originally Posted by janedoe88

except that you'd be the FIRST class at New England so you'd have virtually NO alumni or advice on externships.

Its not new England. Its mcphs. New England is way better optometry school than mcphs. And that doesn't matter because you can always get advice from other docs around your area. Its all about doing well on boards and finding a job.

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Originally Posted by OATAcer

And if its not accredited, you still pass boards and are licensed to practice.

Wrong, wrong, wrong. Again, you're making assumptions to suit your wishes. If you graduate from an unaccredited program, you will have an O.D., but you cannot be licensed to practice - anywhere, until the program is accredited.

Originally Posted by OATAcer

Its not new England. Its mcphs. New England is way better optometry school than mcphs. And that doesn't matter because you can always get advice from other docs around your area. Its all about doing well on boards and finding a job.

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I can call MCPHS "new england" because it is still in New England. As far as "advice from other docs" this is complete BS, you will need alumni, don't be the first class.

Originally Posted by Jason K

Wrong, wrong, wrong. Again, you're making assumptions to suit your wishes. If you graduate from an unaccredited program, you will have an O.D., but you cannot be licensed to practice - anywhere, until the program is accredited.

Thanks for the clarification.

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If you are invited for an interview your application is complete. If they invited 172 for interviews out of 569 and accepted 64 that means there was no shortage of people to choose from. To assume that most people decided not to interview is pure speculation. Some people who arent serious about going there still interview as a backup. There is no shortage of people trying to get into optometry school using any channel they can so these newer schools can afford to be selective and still fill up their classes. With all these new schools you do have to ask about the externship sites and residency opportunities. Im sure MCPHS will be lacking in those areas at first. Even at western and rso they had issues with the first few classes as far as curriculum because they kept tweaking things and some faculty came and left as well. Bottom line do your research and know what you're getting into otherwise you're in for an unpleasant surprise.