Lake Erie (LECOM) Discussion Thread 2012 - 2013

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New Year, New Thread!!! Discuss away!!!

I don't know much about this school but I hear mixed reviews. Any current Med students care to talk about it and how life is in Erie, PA?

I will be applying here.

Applying here as well

Originally Posted by WorldChanger36

I don't know much about this school but I hear mixed reviews. Any current Med students care to talk about it and how life is in Erie, PA?

I will be applying here.

Curious as well.

Originally Posted by WorldChanger36

I don't know much about this school but I hear mixed reviews. Any current Med students care to talk about it and how life is in Erie, PA?

I will be applying here.

Don't choose the LDP pathway unless you're 100% sure that you're okay with sitting in a lecture hall for upwards of forty-hours some weeks AND that those forty-hours will be beneficial to your learning. ISP and PBL are definitely the way to go. The physiology instruction is terrible--BRS will be your friend. The microbiology instruction is superb. Dress code is annoying for guys, not really a problem for girls who have more options that aren't as strictly enforced (especially the pharm girls, they tend to dress a bit skanky.) Fly under the radar and you'll never have to deal with the administration who only really care about the school's best interests, not the students'. Tuition is dirt cheap. The gym is amazing. Very little interest in research. The coffee at the cafeteria and student center sucks. No water, coffee, or food anywhere in the building except the lecture hall. Sucks for LDP students stuck in lecture all day. It's supposedly for "cleanliness", but I think it's just to get us to spend more money in the cafeteria (what's dangerous about a bottle of water?!) Rotations always end up being a disaster. More thirteens were added this year (hospitals where you can do all of your core rotations in a single place), but also a lot of students had rotations dropped "mysteriously" and were then forced into rotations at a new hospital in New York.

Erie is a big, small town. Not a whole lot to do aside from the peninsula/beaches on the lake, a few minor sports teams (NBA D-league, farm team for the Detroit Tigers, CHL hockey team), and the bars downtown. Winters can be absolutely miserable (not blizzard type snow, at least not all the time--just constant snow every single day for weeks on end up through March or April usually.) About two hours from Buffalo (good mall), Cleveland (Rock and Roll Hall of Fame), and Pittsburgh--but honestly not much time to go to any of them--convenient for flying out though to go home though (Erie airport flights are mainly prop planes that are scary as all get out, I think the Detroit connection is the only jet flight.) Cost of living is dirt cheap, except for the apartments right next to the school--the developers know they can charge a fortune and still have tenants and a waiting list.

That's all I can think of right now. Sorry if it's a little incoherent.

Originally Posted by Slane

Don't choose the LDP pathway unless you're 100% sure that you're okay with sitting in a lecture hall for upwards of forty-hours some weeks AND that those forty-hours will be beneficial to your learning. ISP and PBL are definitely the way to go. The physiology instruction is terrible--BRS will be your friend. The microbiology instruction is superb. Dress code is annoying for guys, not really a problem for girls who have more options that aren't as strictly enforced (especially the pharm girls, they tend to dress a bit skanky.) Fly under the radar and you'll never have to deal with the administration who only really care about the school's best interests, not the students'. Tuition is dirt cheap. The gym is amazing. Very little interest in research. The coffee at the cafeteria and student center sucks. No water, coffee, or food anywhere in the building except the lecture hall. Sucks for LDP students stuck in lecture all day. It's supposedly for "cleanliness", but I think it's just to get us to spend more money in the cafeteria (what's dangerous about a bottle of water?!) Rotations always end up being a disaster. More thirteens were added this year (hospitals where you can do all of your core rotations in a single place), but also a lot of students had rotations dropped "mysteriously" and were then forced into rotations at a new hospital in New York.

Erie is a big, small town. Not a whole lot to do aside from the peninsula/beaches on the lake, a few minor sports teams (NBA D-league, farm team for the Detroit Tigers, CHL hockey team), and the bars downtown. Winters can be absolutely miserable (not blizzard type snow, at least not all the time--just constant snow every single day for weeks on end up through March or April usually.) About two hours from Buffalo (good mall), Cleveland (Rock and Roll Hall of Fame), and Pittsburgh--but honestly not much time to go to any of them--convenient for flying out though to go home though (Erie airport flights are mainly prop planes that are scary as all get out, I think the Detroit connection is the only jet flight.) Cost of living is dirt cheap, except for the apartments right next to the school--the developers know they can charge a fortune and still have tenants and a waiting list.

That's all I can think of right now. Sorry if it's a little incoherent.

Wow so you get to pick your pathway? That is good to know.... So what is the difference between ISP and PBL? I know PBL is problem based learning but what is ISP?

Thanks for all the info so far by the way...

Originally Posted by WorldChanger36

Wow so you get to pick your pathway? That is good to know.... So what is the difference between ISP and PBL? I know PBL is problem based learning but what is ISP?

Thanks for all the info so far by the way...

Guess it's DSP (directed-study) now and not ISP (independent-study), and yeah, you get to rank your preference of pathways when you interview. With DSP (after anatomy/embryo/histo that everyone takes together), you get "modules" to guide your studying. Modules are basically lists of questions/objectives that you should be able to answer for every chapter of assigned reading. It's really not difficult at all to knock through all of them for an exam in two or three days and then have two or three days to review them (I was PCSP last year, and we used the ISP modules.) You'll also have some meetings on campus with the faculty for Q&A on the objectives, microbiology labs, stuff like that. Exams are pretty much weekly for most systems.

PBL you have groups that you go through clinical cases with each week and then you also have time to read and learn the material on your own as well. You learn the basic sciences in a more clinically-relevant way. Exams are every couple of weeks and are pretty intense from what I've heard. Seems to be the consensus though that just about everyone in PBL loves it.

I'm getting my app in order and I have an issue with LORs. I am a nontrad a my last science class was some time back. I've been in the working force for som,e years now..
I can get 1 science LOR, job LOR, 1 non-science LOR and maybe another LOR from a postdoc i worked with.
LECOM requires 2 science LOR's i only have one. Is that 2 letter minimum enforced without attenuation due to circumstances?

Originally Posted by TXKnight

I'm getting my app in order and I have an issue with LORs. I am a nontrad a my last science class was some time back. I've been in the working force for som,e years now..
I can get 1 science LOR, job LOR, 1 non-science LOR and maybe another LOR from a postdoc i worked with.
LECOM requires 2 science LOR's i only have one. Is that 2 letter minimum enforced without attenuation due to circumstances?

From what I have seen most DO school give leaway when it come to some letters but I recommend that you email or call them and make sure. Good luck.

Thank you! I'll give them a call and all other DO and MD schools in applying to.

Anyone know how a 3.74sci, 3.76cum, 25Q MCAT would do when applying to LECOM? I plan on applying to both Erie and Bradenton.

Originally Posted by tjtra28

Anyone know how a 3.74sci, 3.76cum, 25Q MCAT would do when applying to LECOM? I plan on applying to both Erie and Bradenton.

What's the breakdown of your 25? If it's a 15 and two 5's then probably not. Also, elabotate on your clinical stats.

From what I've read while lurking (and now posting) on the D.O. fourm is that they seem to be heavy on sGPA, clinical experience (hence the letter req), and MCAT...feel free to correct if any one know's better.

Originally Posted by tjtra28

Anyone know how a 3.74sci, 3.76cum, 25Q MCAT would do when applying to LECOM? I plan on applying to both Erie and Bradenton.

I got in with a 25O (ten verbal, eight bio, seven phys) and a 3.5ish sciGPA. I had extremely strong EC's though (hundreds of shadowing hours, EMT, tons of volunteering hours, mission trips, et cetera.) Apply early and I'd say you have a shot.

Originally Posted by Slane

Don't choose the LDP pathway unless you're 100% sure that you're okay with sitting in a lecture hall for upwards of forty-hours some weeks AND that those forty-hours will be beneficial to your learning. ISP and PBL are definitely the way to go. The physiology instruction is terrible--BRS will be your friend. The microbiology instruction is superb. Dress code is annoying for guys, not really a problem for girls who have more options that aren't as strictly enforced (especially the pharm girls, they tend to dress a bit skanky.) Fly under the radar and you'll never have to deal with the administration who only really care about the school's best interests, not the students'. Tuition is dirt cheap. The gym is amazing. Very little interest in research. The coffee at the cafeteria and student center sucks. No water, coffee, or food anywhere in the building except the lecture hall. Sucks for LDP students stuck in lecture all day. It's supposedly for "cleanliness", but I think it's just to get us to spend more money in the cafeteria (what's dangerous about a bottle of water?!) Rotations always end up being a disaster. More thirteens were added this year (hospitals where you can do all of your core rotations in a single place), but also a lot of students had rotations dropped "mysteriously" and were then forced into rotations at a new hospital in New York.

Erie is a big, small town. Not a whole lot to do aside from the peninsula/beaches on the lake, a few minor sports teams (NBA D-league, farm team for the Detroit Tigers, CHL hockey team), and the bars downtown. Winters can be absolutely miserable (not blizzard type snow, at least not all the time--just constant snow every single day for weeks on end up through March or April usually.) About two hours from Buffalo (good mall), Cleveland (Rock and Roll Hall of Fame), and Pittsburgh--but honestly not much time to go to any of them--convenient for flying out though to go home though (Erie airport flights are mainly prop planes that are scary as all get out, I think the Detroit connection is the only jet flight.) Cost of living is dirt cheap, except for the apartments right next to the school--the developers know they can charge a fortune and still have tenants and a waiting list.

That's all I can think of right now. Sorry if it's a little incoherent.

So you can have coffee/water in the lecture hall?? I heard that was not the case but it would be fantastic as I have a caffeine addiction...

Originally Posted by cel2016

So you can have coffee/water in the lecture hall?? I heard that was not the case but it would be fantastic as I have a caffeine addiction...

Oops, that was supposed to say cafeteria only. I'm in board-studying mode. Not really mentally composed by any means haha.

Originally Posted by Slane

Oops, that was supposed to say cafeteria only. I'm in board-studying mode. Not really mentally composed by any means haha.

Crap, I was afraid of that.

But good luck on your boards!

Originally Posted by tjtra28

Anyone know how a 3.74sci, 3.76cum, 25Q MCAT would do when applying to LECOM? I plan on applying to both Erie and Bradenton.

According to the underdog thread LECOM's average MCAT was a 26. So a 25 is right around their average.

Also your GPA is above their average, so you'd actually be an above average student stat wise.

My stats:

3.6 cGPA, 3.4ish sGPA, 28Q (10 on verbal and bio, 8 on physics), strong extracurriculars, graduate of an Honors college.

I was directly accepted to Erie after their final day of interviews and have been on the waitlist at Bradenton for about 2 months.

I know I am probably taing away study time from you, so I will make this super quick.

I know you cannot consume any food/drink outside of cafeteria (minus the water fountains outside the restrooms that I saw at my interview), but can you hold a sealed, bottled beverage (mainly water) in your bag and never use it in lecture halls? And just pull it out in the hallway by the water fountains? I am from an area that is below sea level, and I know it is important to stay hydrated when adjusting to higher altitudes.

Originally Posted by Night Hawk

What's the breakdown of your 25? If it's a 15 and two 5's then probably not. Also, elabotate on your clinical stats.

From what I've read while lurking (and now posting) on the D.O. fourm is that they seem to be heavy on sGPA, clinical experience (hence the letter req), and MCAT...feel free to correct if any one know's better.

My breakdown is a 9V 8B 8P Q. And to restate, a 3.76 sGPA, 3.74cGPA. As far as clinical experience goes I volunteered at the DMC Sinai-Grace Hospital for a couple months, shadowed a couple docs and osteopathic PA, volunteering for 6+ months in hospice, and I work in the student health center pharmacy. I also have some more volunteer hours with alternative spring break in Washington D.C., other various community service, and leadership experience on my hall government executive board. I wrote a really good personal statement for my primary and have a unique/disadvantaged background. Those are the things I have going for me but I sincerely fear that it's just not enough. Should I start considering Caribbean?

Is LECOM OOS friendly? I'm really interested in this school and for OOS the tuition is incredibly reasonable.

I'll be applying with a 3.9 cGPA - 3.8 sGPA and a 25T. Will I have a shot?

You mentioned a dress code, what do they have us wear khakis and white polos like middle school?

Originally Posted by WhopperInTheCar

You mentioned a dress code, what do they have us wear khakis and white polos like middle school?

Professional dress everyday. Guys wear suits and ties and girls wear skirts or dress pants - things like that. During school hours too (if you're in the library during school hours during the week you have to be dressed up there, as well).

Dressing professional is nice, but I bet it gets tiring after sometime. I cannot imagine sitting in the library for hours in a suit. Do the other LECOM branches enforce the same dress code?

Originally Posted by WhopperInTheCar

Dressing professional is nice, but I bet it gets tiring after sometime. I cannot imagine sitting in the library for hours in a suit. Do the other LECOM branches enforce the same dress code?

As far as I know, yes. The dress code isn't a suit though. Just a shirt and tie. Dressing up everyday really isn't that bad once you get in the habit.

Originally Posted by Loudster

As far as I know, yes. The dress code isn't a suit though. Just a shirt and tie. Dressing up everyday really isn't that bad once you get in the habit.

My bad i meant to say shirt and tie***

Girls have a lot of wiggle room with the dress code as well. I know quite a few that get away with dressy-looking sweats or leggings and a t-shirt or sweater. Unfortunately, guys don't have any wiggle room with the shirt/tie rule, although you can get away with rolled-up sleeves and a loose collar/tie. Shoes seem to be a pretty loosely monitored area too. I see lots of people wearing All-Stars and other sneakers, and I wear TOMS classics all the time without any issues.

And as for water bottles, most people carry them with them and sneak water. Be warned though, if security sees you on any one of the hundreds of CCTV cameras drinking outside the cafeteria (even water), they'll make your life miserable for it. Same thing for wearing a hat (even a winter hat in the winter) or sunglasses and being drastically out of dress code during weekday school hours (dress code ceases to apply at 5:30PM weekdays and all-day weekends.)

This is one of my top choices and I will be applying this cycle, but I take the mcat on July 6th. I have a cumulative GPA of 3.45, and I'm honestly not very optimistic about the mcat. Hoping I have a chance!

AACOMAS primary away.... ( 6/6)
Best of luck to everyone.

Originally Posted by WorldChanger36

AACOMAS primary away.... ( 6/6)
Best of luck to everyone.

Congratz on your MCAT score! I will trade you two points in physical science for two points in verbal, deal?

Originally Posted by Night Hawk

Congratz on your MCAT score! I will trade you two points in physical science for two points in verbal, deal?

Sounds like a fair trade.... Yeah consitering I had a 23M on the first one and a 26N on the second one getting a 32 Q was kind of like the AAMC telling me that I have paid my dues here is your score now go away.... That verbal score made no sense to me at all....

Originally Posted by WorldChanger36

Sounds like a fair trade.... Yeah consitering I had a 23M on the first one and a 26N on the second one getting a 32 Q was kind of like the AAMC telling me that I have paid my dues here is your score now go away.... That verbal score made no sense to me at all....

Lol, I hear ya! If you got accepted everywhere you applied (DO at least) what school would you pick?

Originally Posted by Night Hawk

Lol, I hear ya! If you got accepted everywhere you applied (DO at least) what school would you pick?

As it stands right now PCOM phily would have to be tops. I mean after I get a good look around at the places I will be able to make a better choice but PCOM.

I would think there wouldn't be any CCTV cameras in the restrooms, so couldn't a student drink inside the restroom? (Sounds weird, but at least you wouldn't get into trouble.)

Originally Posted by allstargurl522

I would think there wouldn't be any CCTV cameras in the restrooms, so couldn't a student drink inside the restroom? (Sounds weird, but at least you wouldn't get into trouble.)

Theoretically, yes, you could eat/drink in the restrooms, but at that point, you might as well just walk to the cafeteria and not look like a weirdo.

Originally Posted by Slane

Theoretically, yes, you could eat/drink in the restrooms, but at that point, you might as well just walk to the cafeteria and not look like a weirdo.

+1 ...Seriously don't be a creeper....

What actually happens when you're caught drinking water by the security?

This dress code/no food is reminding me of my high school...and the worst thing that happened was just a caution every time. It's not like they would kick you out...would they?

Originally Posted by Quester

What actually happens when you're caught drinking water by the security?

This dress code/no food is reminding me of my high school...and the worst thing that happened was just a caution every time. It's not like they would kick you out...would they?

For dress code, they'll make you leave the premises until you're dressed appropriately. There are days when they'll sit at the entrance and make people turn right back around and leave, even if there's an exam about to start. There's no love for dress code violations.

For food/drink, they'll warn you and make you get rid of it (like, they'll actually watch you throw it away and not just trust you to do it.) Become a repeat offender, and you'll get tipped off to the administration for disciplinary action. That's one radar you *DON'T* want to get on. At LECOM, it's best if either the administration doesn't know who you are or knows who you are for the right reasons (SGA, class boards, clubs, et cetera.)

Originally Posted by Slane

For dress code, they'll make you leave the premises until you're dressed appropriately. There are days when they'll sit at the entrance and make people turn right back around and leave, even if there's an exam about to start. There's no love for dress code violations.

For food/drink, they'll warn you and make you get rid of it (like, they'll actually watch you throw it away and not just trust you to do it.) Become a repeat offender, and you'll get tipped off to the administration for disciplinary action. That's one radar you *DON'T* want to get on. At LECOM, it's best if either the administration doesn't know who you are or knows who you are for the right reasons (SGA, class boards, clubs, et cetera.)

If I wasn't a florida resident I wouldn't have wasted my $64...

Originally Posted by Slane

For dress code, they'll make you leave the premises until you're dressed appropriately. There are days when they'll sit at the entrance and make people turn right back around and leave, even if there's an exam about to start. There's no love for dress code violations.

For food/drink, they'll warn you and make you get rid of it (like, they'll actually watch you throw it away and not just trust you to do it.) Become a repeat offender, and you'll get tipped off to the administration for disciplinary action. That's one radar you *DON'T* want to get on. At LECOM, it's best if either the administration doesn't know who you are or knows who you are for the right reasons (SGA, class boards, clubs, et cetera.)

Oh snap. These are the security people that watch you like a hawk?

Originally Posted by Night Hawk

If I wasn't a florida resident I wouldn't have wasted my $64...

Originally Posted by Quester

Oh snap. These are the security people that watch you like a hawk?

Oh come on guys, they have an image to protect. Geez... The Uniform code is the least of your worries, the price tag is a bit more of a concern.... Should just dress in money for what some of these programs cost.

Originally Posted by WorldChanger36

Oh come on guys, they have an image to protect. Geez... The Uniform code is the least of your worries, the price tag is a bit more of a concern.... Should just dress in money for what some of these programs cost.

haha, dress code is fine. It's just the fact that there are people watching to see if you make any mistakes...

Originally Posted by Quester

haha, dress code is fine. It's just the fact that there are people watching to see if you make any mistakes...

Well it gives them a purpose and justifies why the tuition is soooo high. Apparently fashion police are very expensive, especially if they are trained ninjas....

Maybe we should look futher into this....

http://askaninja.com/

Originally Posted by WorldChanger36

Oh come on guys, they have an image to protect. Geez... The Uniform code is the least of your worries, the price tag is a bit more of a concern.... Should just dress in money for what some of these programs cost.

LECOM-b is one of the least expensive medical schools that I have seen. It is even cheaper than in-state tuition at OHSU in Oregon. Maybe it has something to do with the prosection vs. dissection.

With the money that you save in tuition, you can buy a whole lot of shirts and ties to dress up in. It is not like you are not going to wear nice clothes once you graduate and are a doctor. Not all doctors get to wear scrubs all day long.

dsoz

Pretty presumptuous though to think everyone likes fancy clothes. There are those of us who would gladly spend all day in a t shirt and loose under armor shorts. I personally find myself infinitely more productive when I am not stuffed into a tie.

The tuition argument doesn't hold water. I've had one suit since 2003 when I was in high school. Kept it in good condition and have worn it very few times. Have had to pay or everything myself so between food and fancy clothes I picked staying alive vs looking cool on a Friday evening. If finances pushes one towards lecom then one cannot make the case that one is saving money compared to other schools. Of course one is saving money but if 25k is a huge burden as it is for me, money for a new wardrobe is hard to come by. I have won 3 teacher of the year awards at the university level and insist on teaching in shorts and a t shirt as I find it most conducive to setting a comfortable environment for students even though I have been reprimanded a few times. sure, at lecom I won't be allowed to enter the building so I'll have to comply. But those who are already living close to the poverty line are not saving money by going to lecom. It's the same as saying (for someone who makes $16k/year like me) buying a BMW 760li is a great choice as opposed to a Ferrari Enzo bc I can save $200k. For someone who can't afford a car to begin with, kinda silly to make the saving claim.

Originally Posted by crappyjones123

Pretty presumptuous though to think everyone likes fancy clothes. There are those of us who would gladly spend all day in a t shirt and loose under armor shorts. I personally find myself infinitely more productive when I am not stuffed into a tie.

The tuition argument doesn't hold water. I've had one suit since 2003 when I was in high school. Kept it in good condition and have worn it very few times. Have had to pay or everything myself so between food and fancy clothes I picked staying alive vs looking cool on a Friday evening. If finances pushes one towards lecom then one cannot make the case that one is saving money compared to other schools. Of course one is saving money but if 25k is a huge burden as it is for me, money for a new wardrobe is hard to come by. I have won 3 teacher of the year awards at the university level and insist on teaching in shorts and a t shirt as I find it most conducive to setting a comfortable environment for students even though I have been reprimanded a few times. sure, at lecom I won't be allowed to enter the building so I'll have to comply. But those who are already living close to the poverty line are not saving money by going to lecom. It's the same as saying (for someone who makes $16k/year like me) buying a BMW 760li is a great choice as opposed to a Ferrari Enzo bc I can save $200k. For someone who can't afford a car to begin with, kinda silly to make the saving claim.

What???!!! This doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Saving many thousands per year by going to a less expensive school WILL necessarily leave you more money for other things...be it a wardrobe or whatever.

Ok. I don't know how to make this simpler.

Person x has $970 in bank account and an annual salary of $15750. He doesn't fancy taking more loans out at 7.8% interest than is absolutely necessary. He takes out loans to cover tuition/living expenses.

Where is the savings you speak of?

Would I take out loans to go to a school where tuition is higher? Sure. But because there is a differential, doesn't mean I am saving the money. Spending money on something not absolutely necessary, by definition, is a luxury. I hate to bring out the independent living card but those who don't follow my logic - have any of you had to pay for yourself entirely in addition to having ~$90k in loans from undergrad all getting larger at 6.4% interest? And I mean food, clothes, tuition, phone bill, car bill, gas, various insurances, rent etc? everything. No help from mommy or daddy?

Sure the real world requires a certain dress code but is being pedantic about a dress code or having water in a classroom going to make anyone a better physician? Somehow I doubt that. I might in fact learn more if I were just let alone and allowed to be in the best possible frame of mind to learn as opposed to bitching about having to wear a tie to lectures that run the entire day.

If you don't NEED a new pair of shoes and you get a pair for $150(money you don't have) that normally costs $300 you still spent $150 of money you don't have. Is it an amazing deal? Hell yeah. But it won't look like savings to someone who couldn't afford it in first place.

Originally Posted by dsoz

LECOM-b is one of the least expensive medical schools that I have seen. It is even cheaper than in-state tuition at OHSU in Oregon. Maybe it has something to do with the prosection vs. dissection.

With the money that you save in tuition, you can buy a whole lot of shirts and ties to dress up in. It is not like you are not going to wear nice clothes once you graduate and are a doctor. Not all doctors get to wear scrubs all day long.

dsoz

In his defense, he did say some schools, not specifically lecom-b but you're right, I'd definitely have a field day with an extra 10k!

Originally Posted by WorldChanger36

Well it gives them a purpose and justifies why the tuition is soooo high. Apparently fashion police are very expensive, especially if they are trained ninjas....

Maybe we should look futher into this....

http://askaninja.com/

Awesome website!

I agree an extra 10k would be excellent.

I still ask - how many people that attend lecom b take out the equivalent in loans that a 45k/year school student would take out? That's the only way I can see having a savings of 10k.

Scares me to think that there is someone in med school who is taking out 45k in loans to attend a 23k school just to have "savings."

I really am not trying to troll here but coming from a math/finance background I would love it if someone could give me an argument for how I don't make sense or that the opposition does.

Originally Posted by dsoz

LECOM-b is one of the least expensive medical schools that I have seen. It is even cheaper than in-state tuition at OHSU in Oregon. Maybe it has something to do with the prosection vs. dissection.

With the money that you save in tuition, you can buy a whole lot of shirts and ties to dress up in. It is not like you are not going to wear nice clothes once you graduate and are a doctor. Not all doctors get to wear scrubs all day long.

dsoz

Ha... I am not comparing medical school prices I am just making a blanket statement...