ABT: Are commissioned officers held to the New physical fitness standards?

SDN Members don't see this ad. (About Ads)

I will be applying to medical school this year, and I have been thinking about applying for the HPSP. While researching each branch, I see that they have all adopted new PFT's. The Navy has the hardest, followed by the Air force. For the Navy, I need 51 push ups in two min. and be able to run 1.5 miles in 11:00 min. For the Air force, I need 47 push ups in one minute, and a 11:57 1.5 mile. These are the two branches im interested in, however, I can't run anywhere near that fast. Im hoping commissioned officers have it a little easier. I have searched the web for info but can't find any. For those of you who have done the HPSP recently, what did you need to pass PFT.

Im also a little fuzzy on when basic and MEPS actually happen? Does MEPS happen before or after you recieve the scholarship? If I was lucky enough to get the scholarship this year, could I do basic and Meps next summer before school starts to give myself time to get in better shape?

Yes, you are held to the same fitness standards as everyone else, as you should be. Believe it or not, they aren't that hard.

MEPS occurs before the scholarship money comes (after notification of "getting" the "scholarship") and is used to determine whether you are medically qualified for service. Not sure about what you are asking at the end. You tend to get the scholarship the year you are going to attend (you don't get a one year deferral). MEPS has to occur before receiving money. Your officer course (which is not basic) ideally happens before your first year, but this isn't always the case based on scheduling issues.

Originally Posted by J-Rad

Yes, you are held to the same fitness standards as everyone else, as you should be. Believe it or not, they aren't that hard.

MEPS occurs before the scholarship money comes (after notification of "getting" the "scholarship") and is used to determine whether you are medically qualified for service. Not sure about what you are asking at the end. You tend to get the scholarship the year you are going to attend (you don't get a one year deferral). MEPS has to occur before receiving money. Your officer course (which is not basic) ideally happens before your first year, but this isn't always the case based on scheduling issues.

Agreed...the fitness standards are very manageable. I don't know anyone who was in better shape after first year. The people who showed up as fitness buffs seemed to do a decent job staying in shape, for the most part everyone else kinda falls apart. So don't count on first year to be the year you get your act together as far as fitness goea.

From what I have seen most people go to MEPS as part of their scholarship application, you must physically qualify to even be offered the scholarship ( there is no PFT at MEPS).

If you really want it, start now. Start running intervals on a track and doing push ups/sit ups. You can find training calendars online to pass PFTs.

Originally Posted by Lui Kang

I will be applying to medical school this year, and I have been thinking about applying for the HPSP. While researching each branch, I see that they have all adopted new PFT's. The Navy has the hardest, followed by the Air force. For the Navy, I need 51 push ups in two min. and be able to run 1.5 miles in 11:00 min. For the Air force, I need 47 push ups in one minute, and a 11:57 1.5 mile. These are the two branches im interested in, however, I can't run anywhere near that fast. Im hoping commissioned officers have it a little easier. I have searched the web for info but can't find any. For those of you who have done the HPSP recently, what did you need to pass PFT.

Im also a little fuzzy on when basic and MEPS actually happen? Does MEPS happen before or after you recieve the scholarship? If I was lucky enough to get the scholarship this year, could I do basic and Meps next summer before school starts to give myself time to get in better shape?

MEPS happens before. This is where you do your physical exam. You will not get the scholarship until you are found physically qualified.

As to the Navy PFT scores, I think you are looking in the wrong place.

Most of us don't start medical school until we are in our 20's. So, if you went to Navy Knife and Fork school prior to starting med school you would likely be 21-23. Passing scores for the Navy (Males) would be 46 sit-ups, 37 pushups and 1.5 mile run in 13:45. You appear to be looking at the 17-19 year old range. There is no real advantage to maxing out the PFT other than the usual setting a good example.

Originally Posted by NavyFP

MEPS happens before. This is where you do your physical exam. You will not get the scholarship until you are found physically qualified.

As to the Navy PFT scores, I think you are looking in the wrong place.

Most of us don't start medical school until we are in our 20's. So, if you went to Navy Knife and Fork school prior to starting med school you would likely be 21-23. Passing scores for the Navy (Males) would be 46 sit-ups, 37 pushups and 1.5 mile run in 13:45. You appear to be looking at the 17-19 year old range. There is no real advantage to maxing out the PFT other than the usual setting a good example.

You are right. I was looking online for PFT standards for the different branches and kept getting conflicting info, out of date info, and info from people who didnt know what they were talking about. Looking in all the wrong places. I searched the official websites for the 3 branches and found out I will need closer to a 13:30 1.5 mile for my age group (im 24). That time is very doable for me. I'm not worried about push ups, sit ups or waist size. I will talk to a recuiter soon and see about getting the ap started early. Im a URM with 3.45 GPA and 28 MCAT, hopefully, im at least somewhat competitive.

No slack for officers. On the Navy side, PFT pass/fail goes on your FITREP. If you have 3 failures in 4 tries, you are (theoretically) out.

Originally Posted by BOHICA-FIGMO

No slack for officers. On the Navy side, PFT pass/fail goes on your FITREP. If you have 3 failures in 4 tries, you are (theoretically) out.

bolded. =D

The numbers are easy to get as a 26 year old medical grad (assuming you are going straight through high school, college, medical school). This thing more often than not people have issues with is passing the BCA.

According to the new instruction if you are waived from the cardio portion of the PRT two consecutive times, you need to be evaluated for a medical board. This is new as of last PRT cycle. I also believe if you are waived from any two components it puts you in this category as well. This "new" rule enforcement varies from command to command. I have waived chiefs with 19 years of service more than twice in a row and their respective commands could care less. Waiving a fatty, good for nothing PO3 twice in a row may attract more attention by a command.

The PRT process and its associated forms have become so convoluted. For example, if you take cholesterol medications but can easily pass the PRT and the BCA, you need to have your PARFQ signed off every single cycle. The forms are confusing and very contradictory to the instruction as written. This may not be an issue for a lot of the attendings on the boards, but those of us signing hundreds of these things twice a year it is a real pain.

At my base alone I can think of about 50 individuals (among the hundreds I screen for the PRT) that would into this category of being considered for a medical board. This should attract the attention of some attendings considering most of their issues are orthopedic in nature and a board requires atleast some form of specialty narrative summary. In short, the PRT process is broken and expect it to change again soon. This is what happens when carrier COs drop dead running 1.5 miles.

Originally Posted by ravager135

The numbers are easy to get as a 26 year old medical grad (assuming you are going straight through high school, college, medical school). This thing more often than not people have issues with is passing the BCA.

According to the new instruction if you are waived from the cardio portion of the PRT two consecutive times, you need to be evaluated for a medical board. This is new as of last PRT cycle. I also believe if you are waived from any two components it puts you in this category as well. This "new" rule enforcement varies from command to command. I have waived chiefs with 19 years of service more than twice in a row and their respective commands could care less. Waiving a fatty, good for nothing PO3 twice in a row may attract more attention by a command.

The PRT process and its associated forms have become so convoluted. For example, if you take cholesterol medications but can easily pass the PRT and the BCA, you need to have your PARFQ signed off every single cycle. The forms are confusing and very contradictory to the instruction as written. This may not be an issue for a lot of the attendings on the boards, but those of us signing hundreds of these things twice a year it is a real pain.

At my base alone I can think of about 50 individuals (among the hundreds I screen for the PRT) that would into this category of being considered for a medical board. This should attract the attention of some attendings considering most of their issues are orthopedic in nature and a board requires atleast some form of specialty narrative summary. In short, the PRT process is broken and expect it to change again soon. This is what happens when carrier COs drop dead running 1.5 miles.

Sorry, gonna hijack this thread for a PSA, especially for our Army and Air Force brethren.

BCA can only be waived for an uncontrolled metabolic disorder. Simply not being able to exercise does not allow you to be fat. Push back from the table. I mention this because I had a Navy enlisted person who had a controlled thyroid condition. She saw an Army provider who tried to put her on a permanent profile to waive the BCA because she had hypothyroidism. The hypothyroidism was well controlled for multiple years and not the cause of her broad beam.

A few things to clarify for Navy:

1. You will still need to fulfill your obligation even if you fall into the multiple PRT failure category. But there seems to be no mercy anymore for people with 19.5 years in are getting ADSEPed--at least with enlisted. Have not seen this happen to an MD yet.

2. PARFQs/PRT Paperwork is stupid and changes every year. However, you DO NOT need to have a physician sign off/medical screening if you check YES for the same question every cycle. You only need it signed off the first time you check YES. Might want to look into this, as it will save you some paperwork and hassel if you are either the physician or the patient. I do not have the NAVMED doc in front of me, but I am pretty sure this is Navy-wide and not something my command just likes to do because my command likes to do it that way.

3. Even if you are waived for two separate events for different medical complaints this too can go towards a PEB. For instance, if you sprain an ankle and don't run in the spring, and then pull an ab and don't do sit ups in the fall, this *should* trigger the process as well. Again, you will still probably be found fit for full and finish your committment.

4. They can threaten you and say you are not getting your bonus if you don't pass. Unclear if this is just a threat or if there is grounds for this and it is inconsistent.

5. You are non-deployable if you fail 3 PRTs in 5 years and/or POMI/your COC can decide to make up a different rule depending upon their mood.

6. If you fail the BCA, you don't even take the PRT portion anymore. It use to be that CO's were allowed to still pass people who failed the weigh-in but got a certain score on the PRT, or they could add a few points on the body fat.

7. Scoring has changed over the last year, so make sure you look at the table that DOES NOT include things like "high" "medium" and "low." This does not exist anymore.

8. Some commands will give you a day of special lib if you get an "outstanding" but residents often can't use this.

9. If you are on a medication where you are out of standards, *sometimes* you can get a waiver for that PRT, but you probably won't be in the navy much longer...and its got to be a medication with a clear link to weight gain. Antipsychotics or steroids might cut it, but just taking a medication might not.

10. Even if its in writing its not always enforced.

11. The BCA/PRT is more a pain in the arse then anything else.

12. NEVER become an ACFL

13. Technically you are suppose to be alloted 3 hours per week for PT during work hours, but this never happens unless you are in FEP, and even then it doesn't always happen.

14. I just felt like writing a long winded entry that im sure no one will read.

15. Five-fingers are authorized, but you must wear them with socks. If you show up in non-running shoes (ie, soccer shoes), they might send you home. Every PRT ive shown up in mismatched sneakers (same style, but different color) and mismatched, flourescent colored socks and they have never told me to leave, but have commented on my choice of footwear. You cannot run it barefoot, but I dare you to try.

Originally Posted by NavyFP

Sorry, gonna hijack this thread for a PSA, especially for our Army and Air Force brethren.

BCA can only be waived for an uncontrolled metabolic disorder. Simply not being able to exercise does not allow you to be fat. Push back from the table. I mention this because I had a Navy enlisted person who had a controlled thyroid condition. She saw an Army provider who tried to put her on a permanent profile to waive the BCA because she had hypothyroidism. The hypothyroidism was well controlled for multiple years and not the cause of her broad beam.

Spot on.

Originally Posted by SuperSoccer19

A few things to clarify for Navy:

14. I just felt like writing a long winded entry that im sure no one will read.

I read it.

^^^^ Lol me too.


So, I'm in the process of scheduling my MEPS, which will probably be in late June or July. It's my understanding that PRT doesn't occur at MEPS, is this correct? If so, when is PRT? I can do the 1.5 mile and sit ups no problem, but the pushups are dicey - I can do what I need, but it's definitely a struggle.

Right now I'm 5 or 2 (I'm halfway between an inch... lol) pounds above BCA. Obviously I can lose 5 pounds by end of June, but what happens if I don't?

Been like, 9 years since I applied for HPSP, but OIS (now ODS) was the first time I had to take a PRT. If you fail it there you get pulled into the fake CO's office and lectured about it, but that was it--even the person who failed the swim test due to being afraid of water was allowed to pass. You then take a "mock" one when you report as an intern, but the real one counts the first cycle (fall) as an intern...unless something has changed. I think that gives you enough time, but its hard to focus on this as an intern.

I am the commander of an Army Basic Combat Training Company. Out of 250 new couch potatoes, over 98% pass the Army Physical Fitness Test within 6 weeks. If these kids can pass on 6 weeks of "easy" workouts that are designed to simply not to injure Trainees, it should not be an issue for someone with the discipline to make it through medical school to stick to a program and easily pass. The key is commitment. If you need a program, use this:

http://www.armyprt.com/downloads/tc-...training.shtml

The only equipment required is a pullup bar. This will prepare you for any branch's fitness test.

Originally Posted by MaxillofacialMN

^^^^ Lol me too.


So, I'm in the process of scheduling my MEPS, which will probably be in late June or July. It's my understanding that PRT doesn't occur at MEPS, is this correct? If so, when is PRT? I can do the 1.5 mile and sit ups no problem, but the pushups are dicey - I can do what I need, but it's definitely a struggle.

Right now I'm 5 or 2 (I'm halfway between an inch... lol) pounds above BCA. Obviously I can lose 5 pounds by end of June, but what happens if I don't?

Eat less. Exercise more. Stop whining.

Originally Posted by numberwunn

Eat less. Exercise more. Stop whining.

I forgot I was whining, whoops.

Originally Posted by MaxillofacialMN

^^^^ Lol me too.


So, I'm in the process of scheduling my MEPS, which will probably be in late June or July. It's my understanding that PRT doesn't occur at MEPS, is this correct? If so, when is PRT? I can do the 1.5 mile and sit ups no problem, but the pushups are dicey - I can do what I need, but it's definitely a struggle.

Right now I'm 5 or 2 (I'm halfway between an inch... lol) pounds above BCA. Obviously I can lose 5 pounds by end of June, but what happens if I don't?

PRT is done at basic, but doesn't really count until you are active duty. They will weigh you at MEPS though, and if you are over then you require a waiver and may get denied your scholarship.

Originally Posted by Charlie0318

PRT is done at basic, but doesn't really count until you are active duty. They will weigh you at MEPS though, and if you are over then you require a waiver and may get denied your scholarship.

Thank you!

Originally Posted by SuperSoccer19

15. Five-fingers are authorized, but you must wear them with socks. If you show up in non-running shoes (ie, soccer shoes), they might send you home. Every PRT ive shown up in mismatched sneakers (same style, but different color) and mismatched, flourescent colored socks and they have never told me to leave, but have commented on my choice of footwear. You cannot run it barefoot, but I dare you to try.

Is this true? I never wear socks with my fivefingers. I usually swim the PRT so I've never been corrected on the socks vs no socks.

Originally Posted by SirGecko

Is this true? I never wear socks with my fivefingers. I usually swim the PRT so I've never been corrected on the socks vs no socks.

I cannot pull up the NAVMED document on my home computer, but yes. The NAVMED document specifies that socks must be worn and you must wear running shoes. They make 5-finger socks to go in the shoes. I have never worn the socks either, but my 5-fingers smell like a**, so perhaps I should try.

Of note, I have shown up for the PRT in mismatched shoes and/or mismatched socks and no one made me leave. Once I did get a few eye rolls (one shoe was purple with flourescent green laces and the other was black with hot pink laces and one sock was hot orange and the other blue). At our ACFL meetings people liked to get on their high horse about how they would turn away people who were not in actual running shoes. Upon hearing this, I chose to wear indoor soccer shoes and no one questioned this. I was prepared to use an old ankle injury as an excuse for my footwear, but I didn't need to go that far.