Pay mortgage with student loans???

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I have to make a decision soon. I can rent a condo near my school for 1,200 per month plus utilities. I also have the option of purchasing the condo, and the mortgage payment would only be 750 dollars per month.

I have enough saved up to cover the down payment if I decide to purchase. The condo is in very god shape, and I would of course get an inspection before purchasing. It is also in a pretty nice area to rent out int he event that I match into a far-away residency down the road. I just have a few questions if anyone is knowledgeable.

1) Is this legal?

2) Is anything about this glaringly stupid that I am not considering yet?

3) Does this make sense? I figure I would be taking the loan out to pay rent, and with interest rates on 30 yr fixeds so low, I might as well use the rent money as an investment and get something tangible out of the money I spend. Also, it would be cheaper.

4) Any last thoughts or comments? Thanks a lot for your time.

1.) I'm not sure but probably not.

2.) Yes. You are neglecting how expensive (and time consuming) it is to own a home vs. renting. Also, if you end up doing residency away from where you're currently at, being a landlord during residency will most likely prove to be a bad idea and costly.

3.) It looks cheaper at first glance but you'd have to own the home for probably ~5 years before you started to break even and that's assuming you don't come upon any major repairs. There's a pretty good NY Times rent vs. own calculator that could be useful to you.

4.) Don't use loan money to pay for another loan.
4a.) You'd probably also need a cosigner as I doubt too many mortgage companies would be jumping at the opportunity to offer somebody a loan without a source of income (besides loans).

Originally Posted by CNein001

I have to make a decision soon. I can rent a condo near my school for 1,200 per month plus utilities. I also have the option of purchasing the condo, and the mortgage payment would only be 750 dollars per month.

I have enough saved up to cover the down payment if I decide to purchase. The condo is in very god shape, and I would of course get an inspection before purchasing. It is also in a pretty nice area to rent out int he event that I match into a far-away residency down the road. I just have a few questions if anyone is knowledgeable.

1) Is this legal?

2) Is anything about this glaringly stupid that I am not considering yet?

3) Does this make sense? I figure I would be taking the loan out to pay rent, and with interest rates on 30 yr fixeds so low, I might as well use the rent money as an investment and get something tangible out of the money I spend. Also, it would be cheaper.

4) Any last thoughts or comments? Thanks a lot for your time.

1) Using funding from student loans to make a mortgage payment? Of course

2) Few issues--

a. Getting a mortgage. Succinctly put, with no income, it's not easy. You might have a tough time getting a bank to loan you money.
b. You have other costs: taxes, HOA dues, insurance, maintenance that were covered in your rent. As an owner, you are responsible for all of it.These can be sizeable.
c. What sort of down payment are you going to put? If it's less than 20%, most of those rates would not be possible (maybe with FHA support).

3) Most of your payments for the first several years of your loans will go to pay interest (and not towards principal), which is the cost of "renting money." Plus, if you are in med school, you don't have an income and won't recieve any tax benefits. Hence, the only gain you will have will be appreciation and maybe some small amount of equity (honestly, your home is a pretty poor investment).

Med student have done this in the past. For some it works out well. Just be careful.

Many students in my class own/bought their home, as do I; but most of them are also married. I dont know why that is. I own a single family home, my dad cosigned for me. I also rent out my extra rooms. It is legal to pay mortgage, why wouldnt it be? Its a living expense.

My questions to you are, do you have the down payment?

What are HOA fees? Insurance? Property tax?

With the house prices down so low, its not a bad time to buy with the intent to keep long term.

No legal issues regarding using loan money to pay mortgage. This might be a good move for you, but obviously needs a little more due diligence before signing.

Since the rent represents a greater than 50% increase in payment over the mortgage, I would want to figure out what the catch is. My suspicion is that there are additional fees like others have noted. The mortgage will still be less than rent, just not as much less as it seems right now. If there really is no catch and you can get the loan, buying would be a smart choice IMO. It would save you $20k in rent payments over the 4 years of med school alone, but you would be assuming a little additional risk. A lot depends on your market, location, etc. Condos are often harder to sell than single family homes. If you are in a great location for your school, you can probably keep renting it to med students after you leave.

Originally Posted by operaman

No legal issues regarding using loan money to pay mortgage. This might be a good move for you, but obviously needs a little more due diligence before signing.

Since the rent represents a greater than 50% increase in payment over the mortgage, I would want to figure out what the catch is. My suspicion is that there are additional fees like others have noted. The mortgage will still be less than rent, just not as much less as it seems right now. If there really is no catch and you can get the loan, buying would be a smart choice IMO. It would save you $20k in rent payments over the 4 years of med school alone, but you would be assuming a little additional risk. A lot depends on your market, location, etc. Condos are often harder to sell than single family homes. If you are in a great location for your school, you can probably keep renting it to med students after you leave.

You are right about the additional fees. However, the mortgage cost is determined by the amout borrowed and the interest rate (mostly). Rents are priced by market demand (and a few other factors). So if the OP buys a houst for $200k and puts 40 down, his payment will be different than if he were to put $150K down.

If owning costs less than renting, then I would go for it (really, paying mortgage interest, HOA dues, taxes vs. rent is just about the same). Just don't go into the purchase expecting huge returns on your down payment.

Don't live above your head. Too many people want the nice apartment/house/condo like they grew up in. Why not rent a cheaper place with a couple of roommates? Over 4 years of medical school you are looking at $43,200 in savings, if you pay $300/month versus $1200/month, not to mention the interest savings and peace of mind paying off your loans sooner. Grad students make much better roommates than undergrads. There will be plenty of time later in life to spend more money, and you will have more of it to spend.

Don't even bother looking into this. You will not get a good mortgage - or ANY mortgage - if you do not have an income.

Originally Posted by CNein001

Any last thoughts or comments? Thanks a lot for your time.

1. People tend to grossly underestimate the costs of home ownership.The apparent $450 gap between renting and buying will evaporate pretty quickly. And since you'll be living off loans the interest deduction will have no short term benefit to you.

2. Do you really want to be both a resident and a long-distance landlord in four years? The answer is no.

3. It sounds like this purchase would blow your savings. Never a wise idea. Say you buy it and the hot water heater dies. You're screwed.

4. Getting a mortgage as a medical student isn't going to be easy. Why not just keep your savings, relax, find a couple of roommates, and enjoy your continued lack of responsibility?

There are a lot of additional costs to owning a home.

1. If you put down less than 20% as a down payment, you have to pay PMI (private mortgage insurance)
2. Homeowner's insurance (different than pmi) is expensive.
3. If you live in a state that collects property tax, you've got that to deal with as well.
4. Upkeep costs, especially of you rent to college kids, can easily make you miserable. You wouldn't believe how much it costs to pay someone to patch drywall or fix a pipe. If you're in med school you're not going to want to do these things yourself.

If you're married with kids, it can make a lot of sense to buy a nice home. I wouldn't put myself through the hassle as a single person just to save a couple hundred a month.

I had a similar situation when I was in undergrad (note this is during the early days of the real estate boom).

Rents around my college were around $2400/month for a 2 br (a decent 2br. There were some dumpy, small, places that went for $1800/month). Condo prices, for a few reasons, hadn't really caught up to that point yet (I think I paid 270K for a pretty nice 2BR). Hence, it made sense for me to buy becuase there was such a significant discrepeancy between the PURCHASE PRICE of the property (not the mortgage cost) and the local rents. I also rented out the other bedroom (for 1100/month), so the deal turned out ok. For a single person, in college (or medical school), buying a condo really is not worth it for the most part (IMO). Leases for property, for the most part, are pretty convinient. At the end of a few months (or at most a year), you can walk away, few questions asked. Not so easy with an owned property.

Really, with a mortgage, you are still paying rent--you are renting capital instead of the condo/house/apartment.

If you are interested, Robert Shiller goes into some interesting arguements about the economic pros and cons of homeownership. His Irrational Exuberance (the new edition)is pretty good.

Originally Posted by Impromptu

Don't live above your head. Too many people want the nice apartment/house/condo like they grew up in. Why not rent a cheaper place with a couple of roommates? Over 4 years of medical school you are looking at $43,200 in savings, if you pay $300/month versus $1200/month, not to mention the interest savings and peace of mind paying off your loans sooner. Grad students make much better roommates than undergrads. There will be plenty of time later in life to spend more money, and you will have more of it to spend.

That's a big difference in rent...and likely a huge change in lifestyle/living situation. Might not be worth it. There needs to be a happy medium somewhere.

your student loans incorporate cost of living. how is paying rent any diffferent than paying mortgage?

Originally Posted by SpecterGT260

your student loans incorporate cost of living. how is paying rent any diffferent than paying mortgage?

Seriously? The fact that the rent isn't a monthly payment toward a six figure liability.

I honestly don't think you could get any loan/mortgage if your only "income" were from student loans. You could falsify your application (a crime) or have a co-signer, which is a valid option for some people. However, at that point, your co-signer's income becomes your income for the purpose of the loan.

Most importantly, like Gut Shot said, most people grossly underestimate the cost of owning a home. I posted this in a thread a few months ago, and it's pretty relevant now:

Originally Posted by TheProwler

If you don't have a family, or you aren't quite sure that you'll be staying in the house after residency, then I think buying a house is a pretty bad option for a resident.

If you think that you're "throwing money away by renting," then I strongly encourage you to add up all of the following, based on actual quotes for the property you're considering:

1. Mortgage interest
2. Private mortgage insurance (PMI)
3. Homeowner's insurance (much more expensive than renter's insurance)
4. Property taxes
5. Closing costs (look how much is rolled into this - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closing_costs )
6. Realtor's commission when you sell the house
7. Basic upkeep of the property (landscaping, snow removal, replacing a window/sink/toilet)

And then remember that your furnace could implode, your basement could flood, or your roof could leak. I love owning a house, but the $2000 to repair my roof last fall? Yeah, that was a painful bite.

Most new homeowners don't realize that maybe $200 of your entire mortgage payment is actually going toward your principal, and it will remain that way for several years (i.e., the duration of your residency). You will accumulate almost no equity unless you upgrade the property, which takes time and effort, which is limited during residency. Right now, I'm "throwing away" over $800/month in PMI, mortgage interest, property taxes, and homeowner's insurance. It's even more when you add in all my maintenance costs.

I have a house, but I got the $8000 first-time home buyer's credit, I have a family, I enjoy landscaping and basic home upgrades/maintenance, and my wife wanted a place that was "our own."

The break-even point for me to buy a home versus renting happened at 5 years, and that was only with the $8000 credit. Without it, it probably would have taken 7-8 years, and that's assuming that home values remain stable and don't decline further. Four years of med school? Not going to recoup your losses in the majority of situations.

Originally Posted by TheProwler

Seriously? The fact that the rent isn't a monthly payment toward a six figure liability.

I honestly don't think you could get any loan/mortgage if your only "income" were from student loans. You could falsify your application (a crime) or have a co-signer, which is a valid option for some people. However, at that point, your co-signer's income becomes your income for the purpose of the loan.

Most importantly, like Gut Shot said, most people grossly underestimate the cost of owning a home. I posted this in a thread a few months ago, and it's pretty relevant now:



The break-even point for me to buy a home versus renting happened at 5 years, and that was only with the $8000 credit. Without it, it probably would have taken 7-8 years, and that's assuming that home values remain stable and don't decline further. Four years of med school? Not going to recoup your losses in the majority of situations.

sorry, i knew I should have quoted....

My comment was in regards to the person who said it is probably not legal.
in that regard, how is it any different than paying rent? It is not. Also I am paying a mortgage on a condo

Originally Posted by CNein001

I have to make a decision soon. I can rent a condo near my school for 1,200 per month plus utilities. I also have the option of purchasing the condo, and the mortgage payment would only be 750 dollars per month.

I have enough saved up to cover the down payment if I decide to purchase. The condo is in very god shape, and I would of course get an inspection before purchasing. It is also in a pretty nice area to rent out int he event that I match into a far-away residency down the road. I just have a few questions if anyone is knowledgeable.

1) Is this legal?

2) Is anything about this glaringly stupid that I am not considering yet?

3) Does this make sense? I figure I would be taking the loan out to pay rent, and with interest rates on 30 yr fixeds so low, I might as well use the rent money as an investment and get something tangible out of the money I spend. Also, it would be cheaper.

4) Any last thoughts or comments? Thanks a lot for your time.

I would recommend renting for several reasons (coming from someone who owns a house):

1. Owning is almost always going to be more expensive. Things like property taxes and homeowners insurance (not to mention being responsible for anything that goes wrong) add up really fast.

2. The housing market is still going down (in my area and I think it most places also). My wife and I have owned our house for 3 years, and it has done down in value every year since we bought it. We are not upside-down on our mortgage (never will be, because we bought a bank repo house and have been remodeling it), but I know several friends who are.

3. Even if your housing market is stable, you might still end up selling it at a loss (after you add in things like your property taxes and the closing costs of selling it), unless you are able to do residency in the same location and will be able to live there for a long time.

I bought a house first year of med school with my wife, so here's my approach to it:

Originally Posted by BigRedDeal

Many students in my class own/bought their home, as do I; but most of them are also married. I dont know why that is.

It's probably so that their spouse can be the one getting the loan. Having no income does not make for a good interest rate on a loan. The mortgage on my house is in my wife's name (who has a job with positive income), but the title is in both of our names so I have some ownership of it when I start making a paycheck as well.

Originally Posted by ucladoc2b

If owning costs less than renting, then I would go for it (really, paying mortgage interest, HOA dues, taxes vs. rent is just about the same). Just don't go into the purchase expecting huge returns on your down payment.

We looked at condos as well, and often the hidden cost is the "condo community fee." This is a monthly fee to cover grounds keeping and other communal costs. Suppose your neighbor's water pipe leaks into your condo. It doesn't bother him, so he won't fix it, but it's ruining your living room. Condo fees are the things that pay for this kind of stuff. We saw one place that had $250 a month for the fee, so make sure you know all the hidden costs of ownership.

Originally Posted by AvidAvatar

Don't even bother looking into this. You will not get a good mortgage - or ANY mortgage - if you do not have an income.

Again, a spouse with a job or parent willing to co-sign is essential here.

As far as the legality of using a loan to pay off a mortgage, it's not a problem as far as the monthly payments are concerned. The down payment is a different case though. You have to sign something saying that the money you're putting down is not something that must be repaid to anyone. Now many, many people get an interest-free loan from their parents they use for the down payment and un-officially pay it back later, but that's technically illegal. It's also off the books so no one finds out about it. Sallie Mae, on the other hand, is a bit more on-the-books so make sure any down payment funds are on the up and up.

In the end, it was worth it for my wife and me. If we'd waited any longer into med school it wouldn't be worth it, but getting 4 years (at least) out of a house was enough. If I match here for residency it's good to know we can just keep living here and building equity. My "half" of the the mortgage is also less than most of my classmate's rent, so I chalk that up as a win. Just always have an emergency fund because A/Cs only break when it's 104 degrees outside and heaters only break when it's -7 degrees out.

I wouldn't take a mortgage even if I had a doctor's income.

There's no guarantee that your house will appreciate in value. In fact, it may even fall in value -- and you'd lose money.

You should just rent until you can buy outright. Or just never buy. Renting gives you freedom to leave and gives you cash liquidity. Happiness is about freedom and liquidity. Renting = more happiness.

Originally Posted by SpecterGT260

sorry, i knew I should have quoted....

My comment was in regards to the person who said it is probably not legal.
in that regard, how is it any different than paying rent? It is not. Also I am paying a mortgage on a condo

The lender on the student loan doesn't care, but I guarantee you that the mortgage lender cares. If that's your only source of income, and you don't have very large tracts of land as assets, then you almost certainly wouldn't qualify for a mortgage.

This is also critical:

Originally Posted by LossForWords

IAs far as the legality of using a loan to pay off a mortgage, it's not a problem as far as the monthly payments are concerned. The down payment is a different case though. You have to sign something saying that the money you're putting down is not something that must be repaid to anyone. Now many, many people get an interest-free loan from their parents they use for the down payment and un-officially pay it back later, but that's technically illegal. It's also off the books so no one finds out about it. Sallie Mae, on the other hand, is a bit more on-the-books so make sure any down payment funds are on the up and up.

Originally Posted by TheProwler

The lender on the student loan doesn't care, but I guarantee you that the mortgage lender cares. If that's your only source of income, and you don't have very large tracts of land as assets, then you almost certainly wouldn't qualify for a mortgage.

This is also critical:

You're arguing a point that wasn't made.. I said simply this: it is not illegal

Also... in case you missed it. Zoidberg.. err.... specter! Homeowner! You don't need to cite the ins and outs to me

Originally Posted by Asp

I wouldn't take a mortgage even if I had a doctor's income.

There's no guarantee that your house will appreciate in value. In fact, it may even fall in value -- and you'd lose money.

You should just rent until you can buy outright. Or just never buy. Renting gives you freedom to leave and gives you cash liquidity. Happiness is about freedom and liquidity. Renting = more happiness.

From a financial perspective, I'll disagree with you.

All assets can go up in value. All assets can go down in value. There is volatility in everything. Financially, your aim is to have your money exceed the rate of inflation. If this doesn't happen, even though your balance is the same, its purchasing power has declined significantly, and you have lost money. Hence, the need to put your money somwhere besides a shoebox (or a low yield savings account).

However, putting so much personal net worth into a single asset, a personal residence, is not a good financial move for a number of reasons. The return on a personal residence is so low (and in many ways costs a ton of money). In addition, by making such a huge purchase, you'll likely compromise your personal cash liquidity this way.

Also, when you go to sell, you'll still need a place to live. So unless you plan to a)significantly downsize, b) move to a way cheaper area, c) go back to being a renter, you'll have to buy another house, which will cost about the same amount as the house you just sold if your needs are still the same. Hence, economically, you did not improve your situation at all.

Even people with a considerable amout of money will still have a mortgage.

Originally Posted by LossForWords

We looked at condos as well, and often the hidden cost is the "condo community fee." This is a monthly fee to cover grounds keeping and other communal costs. Suppose your neighbor's water pipe leaks into your condo. It doesn't bother him, so he won't fix it, but it's ruining your living room. Condo fees are the things that pay for this kind of stuff. We saw one place that had $250 a month for the fee, so make sure you know all the hidden costs of ownership.

Gotta love HOA dues. And, for a condo, $250 isn't bad. If the building is large/facncy with a ton of staff (or has significant debt of its own), you'll end up paying a ton more.

Originally Posted by ucladoc2b

All assets can go up in value. All assets can go down in value. There is volatility in everything. Financially, your aim is to have your money exceed the rate of inflation. If this doesn't happen, even though your balance is the same, its purchasing power has declined significantly, and you have lost money. Hence, the need to put your money somwhere besides a shoebox (or a low yield savings account).

Don't disagree with you.. what are the theoretical underpinnings of homes going up in real value over time anyway? If home prices are determined by supply/demand, even with fixed supply, demand isn't going up much..

http://newamericamedia.org/2011/07/t...ship-rates.php

As you can see there were good economic reasons for home values to go up in 1995-2005. We are past the peak for home ownership. It may trend upward again. It may not - probably not, because the white market is pretty much saturated. You try to recruit more homeowners and you're going into the subprime segment of the population - everyone knows the story there. Definition of a risky investment.

Originally Posted by Asp

Don't disagree with you.. what are the theoretical underpinnings of homes going up in real value over time anyway? If home prices are determined by supply/demand, even with fixed supply, demand isn't going up much..

http://newamericamedia.org/2011/07/t...ship-rates.php

As you can see there were good economic reasons for home values to go up in 1995-2005. We are past the peak for home ownership. It may trend upward again. It may not - probably not, because the white market is pretty much saturated. You try to recruit more homeowners and you're going into the subprime segment of the population - everyone knows the story there. Definition of a risky investment.

You are right...supply and demand dictate the prices of real estate. However, there are so many factors that influence that ratio (interest rates, economic growth of an area, employment, inflation, and so on) that draing a conclusion at this point is difficult. Real estate will come back eventually, albeit on a regional level. But who knows exactly when.

As long as the population is expanding, there will be demand for housing, which will drive prices (some areas more than others). The rate of homeownership is not the measure at which I would look to make that judgement. I would look more at GDP, per capita GDP, population growth, employment on a regioal basis as your more accurate predictors of future home price appreciation (if these don't increase, the US is in pretty big trouble).

Originally Posted by operaman

If you are in a great location for your school, you can probably keep renting it to med students after you leave.

I would do this after I leave. I have seen some listings being offered by former med students to incoming students at my school.

Consider taking on a roommate to ensure that you can cover the loan payments.

Actually I went to Med school in a nice area, so about 20% of my classmates "bought" a condo or a home. "Bought" because their parents put the money down, and now they're paying rent. Most of them have friends or classmates rooming with them paying a reduced fee as well. So it makes good sense if you have that kind of relationship and that kind of parents.

Don't buy a house. The difference between rent and mortgage will quickly be eaten by repairs, property taxes, condo fees. Selling a condo can be very difficult, even more so than selling a house. You know you're going to want/need to be mobile in the next several years. Being a landlord also really sucks.