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- Jun 14, 2016
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Not sure which forum this best belongs in, but I'll try posting it here since I am pre-MD:
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Hi fellow forumers! I'm a 31 (almost 32) yr old Non Traditional aspiring pre-med who has been lurking for awhile, getting educated on the many helpful threads, and am looking for some advice on what to do next.
After a lucrative but unfulfilling decade-long corporate career, I'm interested in becoming a doctor as a 2nd career and have been vetting this option over the past months through shadowing, volunteering, talking with friends in medicine, etc. I am aware of the amount of work this entails (2-3 years of post-bacc classes + a possibly glide year for applications) + 4 years of medical school + 4 or more years of residency.... and that I likely won't be done with med school until I am almost 40 and will finish residency in my early 40s. (I'll likely also be earning less as a primary care doc than I do in my corporate job, but I'll be happy.)
However, my questionable undergraduate stats and lack of any science classes seem to be a problem, and I'm currently trying to figure out what to do next to make my dream of becoming a doctor happen. Unfortunately, doing well in classes as a pre-business student was low on my priority list, and I threw my time into internships, interviewing, networking, extracurriculars (basically anything but making an effort to study properly), and my grades are now sub-par. On the other hand, I am somewhat confident I can do well when I actually try. I graduated high school with a 4.3 at the top of my class at a competitive school with a Perfect SAT score, so I know I'm good at taking tests and can do well when I put in effort. However, from reading SDN and talking with friends in med school, it sounds like poor undergrad stats (no matter how long ago) may potentially be a limiting factor and keep me out of med school.
Fellow SDN-ers, what would you do with these stats to work with?
Summary of my info and stats:
-31 (almost 32) yr old, Female
-work experience: successful past 10 years in business / corporate roles at tech companies, at a director level since age 26 and has managed teams of 12+ employees. Pursuing MD as 2nd career (career change)
-B.A. in a non-science degree at a Top 3 Ivy League University in 2006
-University Official Transcript shows 3.2 GPA; however, with my preliminary AMCAS calculations (counting repeated classes twice, converting quarter to semester units, etc.) shows what looks like a AMCAS cGPA of 3.0 (yikes) and no real sGPA to speak of (only took 1 stats class and received a 3.0 in it, but I can still improve this)
-126 semester credit hours completed using AMCAS conversion chart (190 quarter system credit hours)
-started volunteering, shadowing, etc. but has no research experience yet
-Would strongly prefer MD for several reasons after careful research (snobbery is not one of them)
-Not married (in long term relationship; significant other is supportive), no mortgage or debts (unless you count rental properties I own for side income), and can fortunately finance post bacc and med school using savings if accepted without taking out loans
-No real science or math classes yet. I did take 1 stats class in college.... not sure if that counts. There was also a Pass/Fail linear algebra class I took (passed), AP credit in Calc and Physics from high school (I don't think I actually remember anything after so many years). Basically, I'm starting from scratch as far as required classes go.
-Texas resident (this is relevant to the Academic Fresh Start clause mentioned below where I can basically discard my undergrad GPA for Texas med school apps)
I've been struggling with figuring out the best course of action to make my dream of a 2nd career in medicine become a reality. Here are what I think are my options:
1. Option A: 2nd Bachelor's + Academic Fresh Start (90+ new credits in 3 or 4 yrs depending on full vs part time. Full time likely in 3), applying MD: Declare Academic Fresh Start (so all grades >10 years ago don't count under my GPA - https://www.tmdsas.com/medical/texasAcFrshStrt.html)and Do a DIY Post-Bacc as at a local public university in Texas. Would need 90 NEW semester credit hours (around 3-4 years of additional school depending on if I go full or part time) due to Academic Fresh Start policy, since I would lose all course credit from my 1st bachelor's (though having earned the degree will still show up.
PROS:
-Can literally start over with a clean slate by Texas law and achieve an up to 4.0 cGPA and sGPA if I study and can get the grades. However, Fresh Start's way of reporting grades is only good for the TMDSAS app for Texas public medical schools (there are 7-8 of them, not including Baylor which is private). My cGPA would still show my undergrad grades. If I get a 4.0 for 90 semester units in my 2nd bachelor's, my cGPA for AMCAS will likely only be around a 3.42. This path would maximize my chances of getting into MD schools in TX... but will this GPA be enough to have a shot at private out of state schools...?
CONS:
-Additional 1, maybe 2 years of post bacc coursework to meet the 90 hour requirement after declaring Academic Fresh Start. Takes 3 yrs to complete post bacc instead of 2... 4 years if I only do classes part time while working and don't do a full load each semester. Will I also need a glide year...? This means I will be 34-35 yrs old when applying to med school and ~36 when matriculating if all goes well and graduating around 40. Would I be too old / would the extra year or two be worth it in exchange for the clean slate on Texas GPA and potential for an unblemished near or perfect 4.0 on Texas med school apps?
2. Option B: DIY Post Bacc at Local State University in 2-2.5 years without Academic Fresh Start, looking to apply MD
PROS: Only take 2-2.5 years to complete pre-med required classes, saves a bit on tuition (Texas tuition is around $6k per semester, for reference)
CONS:
-Would AMCAS ad comms look unfavorably or negatively upon the fact that I attend a "perceived less rigorous" program if I go to a local state 4 yr university? (I don't want to be seen as a "cop-out" after having gotten my BA and performed poorly at a top 3 undergrad by ad comms, though I personally think a great education can be gotten at a state school as well and don't get too hung up on "prestige" myself...but ad comms might?)
-I would be more limited as to how much I can raise my GPA, since my undergrad GPA would count on both AMCAS nationwide and TDMSAS Texas med school apps. Max GPAs possible (assuming 4.0 in all classes from now on, which may or may not actually happen):
-If 35 new semester hours taken: 3.22 cGPA (*assuming I did the AMCAS calcs correctly)
-If 45 new hrs: 3.25 cGPA
-If 55 new hrs: 3.31 cGPA
-If 65 new hrs: 3.35 cGPA
...though would 2-2.5 yrs be enough to get the new subjects on the MCAT in, as well? (Sociology, Psychology, Stats, etc.)
3. Option C: Formal Post Bacc for Career Changers (Out of State) 2-2.5 yrs without Academic Fresh Start, looking to apply MD
PROS:
-Same as above, less years before being eligible to apply for med school
-Possible "perceived" benefit by AdComs at having been at a formal post bacc program that may be deemed "more rigorous" (ex: Harvard Extension / HES, Upenn, Columbia post bacc, etc.)
-Possible linkages.... though I'm not sure if my undergrad GPA would rule me out completely as a candidate for linkage. I notice a lot of the linkages have min undergrad GPA requirements that are higher than my AMCAS one
CONS:
-Possibly slightly more expensive due to out of state cost of living and relocation
-Need to move out of state temporarily for post bacc (not sure if I would still be eligible for Texas residency when I apply to med schools later)
------
So that's my situation and my options. To any experienced SDNers who took the time to read my post, thanks so much in advance for reading and for your advice. I greatly appreciate any opinions from those who have been in similar situations or are more knowledgeable regarding med school admissions and post bacc programs.
What would you do if you were in my shoes?
--
Hi fellow forumers! I'm a 31 (almost 32) yr old Non Traditional aspiring pre-med who has been lurking for awhile, getting educated on the many helpful threads, and am looking for some advice on what to do next.
After a lucrative but unfulfilling decade-long corporate career, I'm interested in becoming a doctor as a 2nd career and have been vetting this option over the past months through shadowing, volunteering, talking with friends in medicine, etc. I am aware of the amount of work this entails (2-3 years of post-bacc classes + a possibly glide year for applications) + 4 years of medical school + 4 or more years of residency.... and that I likely won't be done with med school until I am almost 40 and will finish residency in my early 40s. (I'll likely also be earning less as a primary care doc than I do in my corporate job, but I'll be happy.)
However, my questionable undergraduate stats and lack of any science classes seem to be a problem, and I'm currently trying to figure out what to do next to make my dream of becoming a doctor happen. Unfortunately, doing well in classes as a pre-business student was low on my priority list, and I threw my time into internships, interviewing, networking, extracurriculars (basically anything but making an effort to study properly), and my grades are now sub-par. On the other hand, I am somewhat confident I can do well when I actually try. I graduated high school with a 4.3 at the top of my class at a competitive school with a Perfect SAT score, so I know I'm good at taking tests and can do well when I put in effort. However, from reading SDN and talking with friends in med school, it sounds like poor undergrad stats (no matter how long ago) may potentially be a limiting factor and keep me out of med school.
Fellow SDN-ers, what would you do with these stats to work with?
Summary of my info and stats:
-31 (almost 32) yr old, Female
-work experience: successful past 10 years in business / corporate roles at tech companies, at a director level since age 26 and has managed teams of 12+ employees. Pursuing MD as 2nd career (career change)
-B.A. in a non-science degree at a Top 3 Ivy League University in 2006
-University Official Transcript shows 3.2 GPA; however, with my preliminary AMCAS calculations (counting repeated classes twice, converting quarter to semester units, etc.) shows what looks like a AMCAS cGPA of 3.0 (yikes) and no real sGPA to speak of (only took 1 stats class and received a 3.0 in it, but I can still improve this)
-126 semester credit hours completed using AMCAS conversion chart (190 quarter system credit hours)
-started volunteering, shadowing, etc. but has no research experience yet
-Would strongly prefer MD for several reasons after careful research (snobbery is not one of them)
-Not married (in long term relationship; significant other is supportive), no mortgage or debts (unless you count rental properties I own for side income), and can fortunately finance post bacc and med school using savings if accepted without taking out loans
-No real science or math classes yet. I did take 1 stats class in college.... not sure if that counts. There was also a Pass/Fail linear algebra class I took (passed), AP credit in Calc and Physics from high school (I don't think I actually remember anything after so many years). Basically, I'm starting from scratch as far as required classes go.
-Texas resident (this is relevant to the Academic Fresh Start clause mentioned below where I can basically discard my undergrad GPA for Texas med school apps)
I've been struggling with figuring out the best course of action to make my dream of a 2nd career in medicine become a reality. Here are what I think are my options:
1. Option A: 2nd Bachelor's + Academic Fresh Start (90+ new credits in 3 or 4 yrs depending on full vs part time. Full time likely in 3), applying MD: Declare Academic Fresh Start (so all grades >10 years ago don't count under my GPA - https://www.tmdsas.com/medical/texasAcFrshStrt.html)and Do a DIY Post-Bacc as at a local public university in Texas. Would need 90 NEW semester credit hours (around 3-4 years of additional school depending on if I go full or part time) due to Academic Fresh Start policy, since I would lose all course credit from my 1st bachelor's (though having earned the degree will still show up.
PROS:
-Can literally start over with a clean slate by Texas law and achieve an up to 4.0 cGPA and sGPA if I study and can get the grades. However, Fresh Start's way of reporting grades is only good for the TMDSAS app for Texas public medical schools (there are 7-8 of them, not including Baylor which is private). My cGPA would still show my undergrad grades. If I get a 4.0 for 90 semester units in my 2nd bachelor's, my cGPA for AMCAS will likely only be around a 3.42. This path would maximize my chances of getting into MD schools in TX... but will this GPA be enough to have a shot at private out of state schools...?
CONS:
-Additional 1, maybe 2 years of post bacc coursework to meet the 90 hour requirement after declaring Academic Fresh Start. Takes 3 yrs to complete post bacc instead of 2... 4 years if I only do classes part time while working and don't do a full load each semester. Will I also need a glide year...? This means I will be 34-35 yrs old when applying to med school and ~36 when matriculating if all goes well and graduating around 40. Would I be too old / would the extra year or two be worth it in exchange for the clean slate on Texas GPA and potential for an unblemished near or perfect 4.0 on Texas med school apps?
2. Option B: DIY Post Bacc at Local State University in 2-2.5 years without Academic Fresh Start, looking to apply MD
PROS: Only take 2-2.5 years to complete pre-med required classes, saves a bit on tuition (Texas tuition is around $6k per semester, for reference)
CONS:
-Would AMCAS ad comms look unfavorably or negatively upon the fact that I attend a "perceived less rigorous" program if I go to a local state 4 yr university? (I don't want to be seen as a "cop-out" after having gotten my BA and performed poorly at a top 3 undergrad by ad comms, though I personally think a great education can be gotten at a state school as well and don't get too hung up on "prestige" myself...but ad comms might?)
-I would be more limited as to how much I can raise my GPA, since my undergrad GPA would count on both AMCAS nationwide and TDMSAS Texas med school apps. Max GPAs possible (assuming 4.0 in all classes from now on, which may or may not actually happen):
-If 35 new semester hours taken: 3.22 cGPA (*assuming I did the AMCAS calcs correctly)
-If 45 new hrs: 3.25 cGPA
-If 55 new hrs: 3.31 cGPA
-If 65 new hrs: 3.35 cGPA
...though would 2-2.5 yrs be enough to get the new subjects on the MCAT in, as well? (Sociology, Psychology, Stats, etc.)
3. Option C: Formal Post Bacc for Career Changers (Out of State) 2-2.5 yrs without Academic Fresh Start, looking to apply MD
PROS:
-Same as above, less years before being eligible to apply for med school
-Possible "perceived" benefit by AdComs at having been at a formal post bacc program that may be deemed "more rigorous" (ex: Harvard Extension / HES, Upenn, Columbia post bacc, etc.)
-Possible linkages.... though I'm not sure if my undergrad GPA would rule me out completely as a candidate for linkage. I notice a lot of the linkages have min undergrad GPA requirements that are higher than my AMCAS one
CONS:
-Possibly slightly more expensive due to out of state cost of living and relocation
-Need to move out of state temporarily for post bacc (not sure if I would still be eligible for Texas residency when I apply to med schools later)
------
So that's my situation and my options. To any experienced SDNers who took the time to read my post, thanks so much in advance for reading and for your advice. I greatly appreciate any opinions from those who have been in similar situations or are more knowledgeable regarding med school admissions and post bacc programs.
What would you do if you were in my shoes?
Sadly, I've ruled out DO and Caribbean after much careful research and consideration for a number of personal reasons - it'd have to be MD for me.
