An out of nowhere change from pre-med to pre-pharm

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mmk64

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Recently I had an epiphany that medicine (especially it's future) is not the field for me. Fortunately (as I now have come to see it) I have been rejected 2 cycles in a row. Instead of applying a third time, I decided to look into the field of pharmacy because since graduating college and getting my MS degree in Medical Sciences and doing independent reading with my free time, I have come to realize how much I am interested in pharmacology. I've seen the huge amount of options I'll have with a PharmD degree, and how I can incorporate that with my desire to be a neurologist (psychiatric pharmacy for example)


What sucks is that I am 24 years old, finished undergrad in 2008, and everything I've done has been geared toward medicine. I have extensive shadowing and clinical experience in the medical field, but none involving pharmacy. I would like to start pharmacy school next fall, but I realize that I need to come up with a great personal statement and submit the pharmcas ASAP! But I have no pharmacy experience to put on there, just medical. Adcoms will prob think that I am doing this as a backup! Should I start shadowing a pharmacy right now and put that on the application and explain my newfound interest, and say that I will be pursuing a job in a pharmacy during the application cycle? Not to mention that I have to study for the PCAT and take that ASAP as well. My undergrad GPA is a 3.3 (from a good school) with a BS in economics, graduate GPA of 3.8, and hopefully I can do well on the PCAT (scored a 33 on the MCAT so the pressure is on haha). Was my epiphany too late or do I have a decent shot at an acceptance for next fall? It just seems hard to make myself stand out this cycle since I am just thinking about starting to shadow just now while others started in undergrad :/


I feel like I've wasted so much of my life before figuring out what I really want to do

edit: Oh yeah, all of my LORs are from professors and doctors that say how I would be a good physician, not really applicable. And I'm not in school so I can't get new ones...how does that work?

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Well, let's be honest here...ARE you looking at pharmacy as a backup? If so, don't do it. There are many reasons for this but since it is almost 1am, I have to go to bed and return tomorrow to thoroughly respond to your post.
 
Well I'm not applying to medical schools because I don't want to have the temptation to go if accepted, so it's not a backup at all
 
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I feel like I've wasted so much of my life before figuring out what I really want to do

So much of your life? You're 24. When I was 24, Hajjii was still shooting at me on a daily basis. You are not old, you still have a lot of time... so get rid of that particular attitude ASAP.

As far as the switch-over, your LoRs will not be satisfactory now, no. However, whatever they wrote about you being an excellent physician should easily be re-writable for Pharmacy. Approach them ASAP. It's still early in the cycle... you might as well apply to schools.

Get cracking on your personal statements and start looking into schools, and get a PharmCAS account going. It's not too late... eveni f you don't get accepted, no big deal. Assuming you do well on the PCAT and are only applying to PCAT schools, you should be fine.
 
Well, let's be honest here...ARE you looking at pharmacy as a backup? If so, don't do it. There are many reasons for this but since it is almost 1am, I have to go to bed and return tomorrow to thoroughly respond to your post.

i say this person go for it. Better him than someone with a lower GPA with less schooling.
 
You want to get in for next fall? Then, you better send your applications now. Setup your PCAT in august or whenever the soonest possible. Applications that are accepted from July 2010 to Dec 2010 will be for starting in August 2011. Most schools are rolling admissions, so the sooner the better.

Send in your apps now and work on your PCAT and LoRs!
 
I was in the same boat last year except I was 22 when i applied for pharmacy school... i took the october pcat and submitted my application on pharmcas in oct...i applied to 10 schools, and got an interview for 9, but decided to go to 3 interviews and got accepted to all three schools.... my Lors jus switched medicine with pharmacy... and my personal statement could be geared towards pharmacy and medicine.... All you have to do is get the ball rollin and you will be fine....Feel free to contact me if you have any questions. Good luck!
 
Having any experience in the medical field at all will help you get into pharmacy school. Shadowing at a pharmacy would be a great idea. In the interview you can talk about how you realized you are more interested in pharmacology and when you shadowed you realized that is definately what you want to do. I also got a BS in business in 2008 and I am starting pharmacy school this fall. So don't feel like it is too late! I have a friend who is 28 and just starting pharm school. If you want to start school next fall, many of the schools deadlines for applications are in December, and many of them tell you the last PCAT you can take is in October.But all schools are different. Some deadlines are later and earlier. I don't know how MCAT scoring works, but if a 33 in a good score, then you should be good to go on the pcat, but I would probably get a book (like kaplan) just to get familiar with the format because it is different than the MCAT. Good luck!
 
You're not in a bad situation, at all, as most admissions windows are opening around now. Like P4Sci said, you're not too old (or even close to it). I was a pre-med convert, too, so I can relate to your situation a little bit.

When you say you want to start next Fall, we're talking Fall of 2011, right? Just doing a dummy check here. If so, you have time to sign up for the August PCAT still (with a late fee). That way, if you bomb it, you can still sign up for the October PCAT as a backup after getting the August results back.

Are there any schools in particular you're looking at?
 
I agree with the above suggestions. I just think it is important to know what you are getting into. You should learn more about the field through shadowing or volunteering. I just don't want you to go through 4 years and then be unfulfilled because deep down you wanted to be a neurologist. To become a psychiatric pharmacist, you will most likely have to do a residency, but the specialization residency comes after the pharmacy practice residency. So, for that specific field you're looking at 4 + 2. You are young, though (as others mentioned), so time shouldn't be an issue. You would end up being done with pharmacy around the same time that you would have been done with medicine. I think the great thing about pharmacy (and this is one of the reasons I chose pharmacy over medicine to begin with) is the versatility of the PharmD degree. In medicine, once you complete your residency, you are essentially locked into that field. Although it is not impossible to move into another field, you would have to move the sun and stars to get into something else. With pharmacy, you can move into various sectors throughout your career (inpatient, community, ambulatory, academia, etc.) if you are smart about it. There are many, many things you can do with a PharmD and the scope is expanding as pharmacists become more utilized, particularly in the inpatient setting. I suggest you learn more about the role of the pharmacist before you just jump into things. For one thing, you wouldn't be doing any diagnosing (which, I would assume, is part of the reason you like neurology) or prescribing (except in limited areas and always within scope of practice). The other thing to consider is the pay. The pharmacist's salary is right around 100K in most places. You can make more if you maneuver yourself into managerial or director positions or into administration. I have known some pharmacists with a salary that is quite high but they are typically a rarity. If you are truly that interested in pharmacology and, after you learn more about the role of the pharmacist, then I say go for it. But, be realistic about it. There are other fields you might also want to consider like PA.
 
I picked up a PCAT book and wow it is very different than the MCAT. It's much less intense and intimidating but honestly I think it'll be harder for me because I had the bio and math so long ago (high school haha), and I hate analogies because my vocab sucks. So I don't think August will work, I'll have to take it in October. What kind of score would make this process comfortable for me? Do I need in the 90th percentile or so?

I am overwhelmed with info right now. So I need to fill out the pharmcas ASAP...I assume they will want pharmacy experience on there so I can get attention for an interview and explain myself. So I guess I need to start volunteering first so I can put that I've started on there, and say I'll be looking for a job in a pharmacy as well? I do have research with cholinesterase inhibitors and enzyme kinetics from undergrad, so I assume that's a good thing.

ALSO, should I stress the fact that I excelled in a "Special Master's Program"? I assume no one here knows what that is. It's a program where people with low GPAs (in premed world) enroll and first year medical school classes in order to prove they can handle the work (I also did 1 semester's worth of pharm during a 1 month period, which despite the ridiculous pace it opened up my eyes to how much I love drugs). So I would like to point that out and say hey, I was able to rock 1 year of med school and be at the top of the program (I have an awesome letter from the dean), but I don't want to come off as bragging or that I think medical school is harder or anything like that (in fact I think pharmacy school will be a good bit harder for me)

As far as letters go, I'm a bit confused. Assuming I get interviews, I will want to talk about how I wanted to be a doctor until mid 2010 and then explain my "epiphany" (sounds so dramatic...but it kinda is)...but won't it look weird if letters from 2008 say that I would make a good pharmacist? Wouldn't my story make more sense if it said doctor instead? After all, shouldn't a person that is capable of being a good doctor be able to be a good pharmacist and vice versa?

I've heard that there is a lot of variety in pharmacy schools, unlike med schools. I'm an Alabama resident, so obviously I'll apply to Samford and Auburn, along with a ton more schools (I applied to 17 med schools and got 2 interviews.

Thanks for the kind words and support everyone...and I hope that I don't come off like I haven't done my research, but I have a lot on my plate and feel like I am wasting time the longer I wait. I've been so berated as a pre-med that despite my high intellect my ego has been bruised, and I have no feel for how competitive I am for pharmacy school

Rxlea, yes, the lack of options with an MD as opposed to the increasing number of options with a PharmD is a huge motivator for me. Giving up on medicine to me is like breaking up with a girl that you love but don't see a future with, it's tough indeed but pharmacy has always been in the back of my mind
 
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Is there any reason why you are suddenly switching from pre-med to pre-pharm? I mean, aside from getting rejected twice and also because you have this sudden interest in pharmacology. Could you be more detailed about what you like about pharmacology that offers you something in which medicine can't? No offense, but your lack of detail leads me to believe that you're simply discouraged from medicine and want to pursue something "easier." Not accusing you of anything at all, that's just my impression from your post. Or maybe you already explained that in another post, I didn't really read all the posts. But yeah, care to explain?
 
OP did you not apply to DO schools? a 33 would have you at nearly a shoe in.
 
Is there any reason why you are suddenly switching from pre-med to pre-pharm? I mean, aside from getting rejected twice and also because you have this sudden interest in pharmacology. Could you be more detailed about what you like about pharmacology that offers you something in which medicine can't? No offense, but your lack of detail leads me to believe that you're simply discouraged from medicine and want to pursue something "easier." Not accusing you of anything at all, that's just my impression from your post. Or maybe you already explained that in another post, I didn't really read all the posts. But yeah, care to explain?

The most important reason is that I do not want to be part of a socialized system where physician autonomy will dwindle away. I will have many options with a PharmD degree. Sure I'll have to settle with some things with pharmacy, like the fact that I'm not crazy about chemistry...but I would be settling for a lot more as an MD (aside from the **** outlook for MDs in the future IMO, having to deal with patients all of the time has been a big negative for me). If you read my posts, you would have seen where I said pharmacy will probably be harder for me than medicine. Difficulty has nothing to do with my choice.

edit: I really like drugs. I spend hours reading up on how medications work and the optimal choices for problems like depression and what not. At this point I can recognize nearly all drugs (with the exception of antibiotics and antifungals and what not) and give a simple overview of how they work. All for kicks and giggles.
 
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...but I would be settling for a lot more as an MD (aside from the **** outlook for MDs in the future IMO, having to deal with patients all of the time has been a big negative for me). If you read my posts, you would have seen where I said pharmacy will probably be harder for me than medicine. Difficulty has nothing to do with my choice.

i'm not sure the outlook for pharmacy is great either. as frustrating as the application process is, i think you should stick it out and apply to med school. you should also apply to a few DO schools if you don't mind the letters at the end of your name. physicians have just as many niche areas as pharmacy ie: clinical research, industry, nuclear medicine, docs abroad, etc. also consider specialties such as radiology where you can essentially work from home with minimal patient contact. your entire resume is geared towards medicine so why not give it another shot?
 
Explain please!!

You need to diversify. That is what I was told by my DOP = Pick some good rotation sites for your elective rotations and intern in different sectors while in school (inpatient and community, for example). I've seen some retail pharmacists experience difficulty with trying to move into an inpatient setting because they lack hospital or other type of experience. From what I was told, don't overspecialize and try not to get stuck in one sector!
 
From what I was told, don't overspecialize and try not to get stuck in one sector!

Oh no, second person to say that!! How do you define overspecialize? The sectors I'm looking at might be too specialized. :(
 
The most important reason is that I do not want to be part of a socialized system where physician autonomy will dwindle away. I will have many options with a PharmD degree. Sure I'll have to settle with some things with pharmacy, like the fact that I'm not crazy about chemistry...but I would be settling for a lot more as an MD (aside from the **** outlook for MDs in the future IMO, having to deal with patients all of the time has been a big negative for me). If you read my posts, you would have seen where I said pharmacy will probably be harder for me than medicine. Difficulty has nothing to do with my choice.

edit: I really like drugs. I spend hours reading up on how medications work and the optimal choices for problems like depression and what not. At this point I can recognize nearly all drugs (with the exception of antibiotics and antifungals and what not) and give a simple overview of how they work. All for kicks and giggles.

Have you considered a PhD in neuropharmacology or a combined PharmD PhD? If patient care is not exactly your passion, these might be fields you might want to look into.
 
Well I'm not applying to medical schools because I don't want to have the temptation to go if accepted, so it's not a backup at all

Have you applied to the Caribbean med schools? Is that where you're getting rejected from? Because SGU and Ross are really good with good USMLE pass rates and everything.

As for pharm school, do whatever you feel like doing. It's nobody's business where you apply to and either you get in or you don't, whether it's a back up or not. You should do whatever you want to do, and tailor your application accordingly. You might also want to just let your LOR writers know about your epiphany.
 
Why is it that pharmacy is usually plan B for failed pre-med students? They are two completely different fields..is it the money?
 
Why is it that pharmacy is usually plan B for failed pre-med students? They are two completely different fields..is it the money?

1. Money
2. Similar pre-requisites and curricula needed to apply
3. They've taken the MCAT so the PCAT will be a snoozefest (assuming they did well)
4. Money
5. What else would they do? The kind of person who wants to be a physician is not the kind of person who wants to be a second-in-command chart monkey like a PA or Rad Tech.
 
1. Money
2. Similar pre-requisites and curricula needed to apply
3. They've taken the MCAT so the PCAT will be a snoozefest (assuming they did well)
4. Money
5. What else would they do? The kind of person who wants to be a physician is not the kind of person who wants to be a second-in-command chart monkey like a PA or Rad Tech.

Yea, but the PA and Rad Tech think they're above us lol
 
If you really wanna be on the top of the totem pole and don't wanna be a doc, you can a nurse. I know many RNs who think they **** gold bricks lol

Did you know that the bottom of the totem pole is actually where the most elder, most respected people are? Funny that we don't even know what we say half the time...
 
Why is it that pharmacy is usually plan B for failed pre-med students? They are two completely different fields..is it the money?

they're still somewhat similar, if you practice clinical pharmacy, from what i've seen and heard. just that you focus on the meds.

also pharmacy is plan B because pharmacy schools accept 2.8 undergrad GPAs whereas you wouldn't have an ass's chance for med school unless you waited until you were 40 to apply, or went to mexico. and the stress is a lot, lot, less, from what my med school/resident friends are telling me.

also to OP, yes, stress your SMP GPA. I did the same thing as you (SMP to boost GPA, except it was an SMP tailored towards Pharm, not med school). Seems like the interviewers will take into account that you've been through graduate classes and realize you can handle the load, at least that's what it sounded like to me. although if you did well in the SMP, don't they usually just accept you into their med school?
 
desklamp,

you seriously did an SMP for pharmacy school? Was it advertised as such?

OP,

Pharmacy is not what you think it is. If you don't have any experience, get some. I made the mistake of not working/volunteering/shadowing in a pharmacy before I matriculated. I had absolutely no idea of what to expect. (Other than reading people's experiences on SDN, haha.) I'm not knocking the profession, but from day one I realized that it wasn't for me and have been quite miserable for the last two years. Seriously, do your research first.
 
The most important reason is that I do not want to be part of a socialized system where physician autonomy will dwindle away.

Oh boy.

I agree with PP, go shadow a pharmacist before you consider applying.
 
desklamp,

you seriously did an SMP for pharmacy school? Was it advertised as such?

uhhh not really. it was advertised as a masters program with a concentration in pharmacology. the description said it was tailored towards those looking to go to pharm school, or those wanting to continue on to a PhD in pharmacology. we didn't take classes with first year pharm students, but rather with the first year PhD students. idk if "SMP" is a good name for it, i think they called it something else, but it was in the same category as the SMP for med school. it had a pretty big emphasis on research, so tbh i think they tacked on "for future pharmD students" just to make it sound more appealing.

i honestly didn't choose it as a bridge for pharmacy school, but more because i waited til the last minute to apply, it was the only program of which the deadline hadn't passed, and i had no idea what i wanted to do at that point in time, just that my GPA had to go up. better to get a degree out of it with an option to continue to a higher degree, than retake a bunch of classes and possibly get nothing out of it.
 
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you should consider what everyone else says. and if you still want to apply to pharmacy, then i've heard that schools like students who are "older" and have had an epiphany like yours.
 
Recently I had an epiphany that medicine (especially it's future) is not the field for me. Fortunately (as I now have come to see it) I have been rejected 2 cycles in a row.
Sounds like posthoc rationalization than any epiphany.
 
The most important reason is that I do not want to be part of a socialized system where physician autonomy will dwindle away. I will have many options with a PharmD degree. Sure I'll have to settle with some things with pharmacy, like the fact that I'm not crazy about chemistry...but I would be settling for a lot more as an MD (aside from the **** outlook for MDs in the future IMO, having to deal with patients all of the time has been a big negative for me). If you read my posts, you would have seen where I said pharmacy will probably be harder for me than medicine. Difficulty has nothing to do with my choice.

From your quote above, I say you should utilize your economics degree and go into finance or consulting.

You're totally deluding yourself if you think the outlook for pharmacy is any better than medicine. If you have a problem with dwindling physician autonomy, just what autonomy do you think most pharmacists have? Many in retail (the vast majority of pharmacists) can't even take a bathroom break without permission. And pharmacists don't deal with patients?

You do realize that pharmacy is a health care profession also?

:rolleyes:
 
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