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Will you be blacklisted during fellowship if you attend a prestigious fellowship but fail either part of your ap/cp boards on the first attempt?
Will you be blacklisted during fellowship if you attend a prestigious fellowship but fail either part of your ap/cp boards on the first attempt?
I mean wouldn't you be regarded as "second class" status by your attendings.
I mean wouldn't you be regarded as "second class" status by your attendings.
My genuine feeling was that admission to a prestigious fellowship implies that you are very good at what you do, ..
My genuine feeling was that admission to a prestigious fellowship implies that you are very good at what you do, and it is a great, deep shame to fail the boards since it is a reflection of your knowledge and performance as a resident. I also felt that I was disrespecting my program director and I'd be letting down everyone who ever vouched for me in the first place. Although I plan to subspecialize and practice only the particular field I'm going into, and I score very high in this subject area in the RISE, my feeling is still that a truly "great" doctor is not one who might have struggles with this sort of thing at all.
... my feeling is still that a truly "great" doctor is not one who might have struggles with this sort of thing at all.
No, not true at all.
Why is that not true? We're supposed to be doctors. Its what we do. If you're performance at work and in career is not excellent, then what is the point to our lives? everything else in our lives should be secondary, and geared towards optimizing our performance capability in our work. Why make excuses? Failure on the boards = did not know the material well enough to pass. I literally can not fathom why you wouldn't be considered second rate. At the same time, I know some fellows who have failed and I wouldn't think twice about considering them as competent. Contradictory sentiments, maybe that's why i'm posting in an attempt to gain some perspective.
Why is that not true? We're supposed to be doctors. Its what we do. If you're performance at work and in career is not excellent, then what is the point to our lives? everything else in our lives should be secondary, and geared towards optimizing our performance capability in our work. Why make excuses? Failure on the boards = did not know the material well enough to pass. I literally can not fathom why you wouldn't be considered second rate. At the same time, I know some fellows who have failed and I wouldn't think twice about considering them as competent. Contradictory sentiments, maybe that's why i'm posting in an attempt to gain some perspective.
If you're performance at work and in career is not excellent, then what is the point to our lives? everything else in our lives should be secondary, and geared towards optimizing our performance capability in our work.
So you don't think potential employers, your program director, or fellowship director, or residents would look down on someone who fails, and you don't think our peers or superiors would be justified in looking down on these failures of people? Among people who failed at our program, some are definitely looked down upon and perceived in a different light and it definitely casts a shadow through which these individuals are defined. I can't help but feel this is justified knowing some of these individuals and their level of focus and dedication. People who are most knowledgable and professional and competent are highly regarded and those who are weak, lazy, unfocused, comprise another group. My feeling is individuals who failed boards should take stock of their lives and realize failing to come through at the most critical moments is nothing short of sin in our profession, and this would undoubtedly forever cast a shadow over the rest of fellowship, especially if you go to a fellowship that is highly selective.
So you don't think potential employers, your program director, or fellowship director, or residents would look down on someone who fails, and you don't think our peers or superiors would be justified in looking down on these failures of people? Among people who failed at our program, some are definitely looked down upon and perceived in a different light and it definitely casts a shadow through which these individuals are defined. I can't help but feel this is justified knowing some of these individuals and their level of focus and dedication. People who are most knowledgable and professional and competent are highly regarded and those who are weak, lazy, unfocused, comprise another group. My feeling is individuals who failed boards should take stock of their lives and realize failing to come through at the most critical moments is nothing short of sin in our profession, and this would undoubtedly forever cast a shadow over the rest of fellowship, especially if you go to a fellowship that is highly selective.
Why is that not true? We're supposed to be doctors. Its what we do. If you're performance at work and in career is not excellent, then what is the point to our lives? everything else in our lives should be secondary, and geared towards optimizing our performance capability in our work. Why make excuses? Failure on the boards = did not know the material well enough to pass. I literally can not fathom why you wouldn't be considered second rate. At the same time, I know some fellows who have failed and I wouldn't think twice about considering them as competent. Contradictory sentiments, maybe that's why i'm posting in an attempt to gain some perspective.
So you don't think potential employers, your program director, or fellowship director, or residents would look down on someone who fails, and you don't think our peers or superiors would be justified in looking down on these failures of people? Among people who failed at our program, some are definitely looked down upon and perceived in a different light and it definitely casts a shadow through which these individuals are defined. I can't help but feel this is justified knowing some of these individuals and their level of focus and dedication. People who are most knowledgable and professional and competent are highly regarded and those who are weak, lazy, unfocused, comprise another group. My feeling is individuals who failed boards should take stock of their lives and realize failing to come through at the most critical moments is nothing short of sin in our profession, and this would undoubtedly forever cast a shadow over the rest of fellowship, especially if you go to a fellowship that is highly selective.
I wonder how many people here posting encouragement that it is okay to fail the boards were unsuccessful on their first try. I want to believe its okay and that passage or failure on the initial attempt is multifactorial and not necessarily a reflection of who you are as a person or who you going to be as a pathologist, but I still can't help but think these are things people only say to make themselves feel better about something that is fundamentally wrong. Failure is not okay at our level, it is sin. When you are in charge of people's lives, you have to set up your own life so that your output towards that endeavor is maximized. Failing the boards is a reflection of having failed to live appropriately and mature in your knowledge enough that you would ensure you pass. The shame of failure in the eyes of colleagues and instructors would be justified. Anyways, i expect my result to come back any day now so maybe all of this is moot point. I definitely wasn't confident when I walked out of the exam.
Think whatever you want bro, but you are going to have issues when you start practice thinking like that.
I wonder how many people here posting encouragement that it is okay to fail the boards were unsuccessful on their first try. I want to believe its okay and that passage or failure on the initial attempt is multifactorial and not necessarily a reflection of who you are as a person or who you going to be as a pathologist, but I still can't help but think these are things people only say to make themselves feel better about something that is fundamentally wrong. Failure is not okay at our level, it is sin. When you are in charge of people's lives, you have to set up your own life so that your output towards that endeavor is maximized. Failing the boards is a reflection of having failed to live appropriately and mature in your knowledge enough that you would ensure you pass. The shame of failure in the eyes of colleagues and instructors would be justified. Anyways, i expect my result to come back any day now so maybe all of this is moot point. I definitely wasn't confident when I walked out of the exam.
i have been asked in deposition if i ever failed a board exam.