At what age do you plan to retire?

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At what age do you plan to retire?

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  • 50-54

    Votes: 7 14.3%
  • 55-59

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  • 60s

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  • never

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  • Total voters
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D

deleted158872

At what age do you plan to retire from practicing Dentistry?

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I don't ever plan on retiring from dentistry. I plan on practicing until 50 working full time. Once I hit 50, I plan on practicing 2 days a week (or however much to cover my basic life expenses) and rest of my time on the links drinking corona. This way I can use all of my retirements savings for splurging/traveling/etc. Once I physically can't practice anymore, I plan on volunteering my time teaching students at my nearby dental school. Also, I don't care how much you love your significant other. Seeing each other all day 7 days/week doing absolutely nothing will make both of you go a little crazy.

Ultimately, I want to reach the point of my career where I don't have to practice dentistry, but I want to.
 
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I noticed the dentists who practiced the longest are the ones who truly enjoy going to their private practice to see patients they had for 30-40 years, and staff who are still around over those years. They don't it for the money at that point, they just go to work for their patients and staff, because that value and lifestyle becomes their pursuit and keeps them happy.

Then there are dentists who went through divorce, not enough money to retire, Etc.

When I go to local CE course these days, I'm the only one in the room who is in his 30's, everyone else in the room has gray hair. Some dentists openly say "well I'm working to not retire and die early", "I'm not doing it for the money anymore", or "I come to the CE course to stay connected with friends I went to school with".

In reality, dentists are getting older and grayer like the rest of society. Expect a lot of dentists to work beyond retirement, because life expectancy will be well into 80-90 years in the coming decades.
 
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Status: Pre-dental

Well I am just speaking the truth from watching my father. He's now approaching 50 and dramatically slowed down his practice. He mainly goes to the practice to mentor young associates who are willing to learn. I asked if he ever plans on retiring, and he quickly said no. He enjoys what he does and says it's much better than sitting around doing nothing.
 
ill probably work until im 45...the work can get to you after a while...ive got a few other endeavours id like to do in this lifetime
 
Most dentists are horrific savers so it's not a choice they can make. I am 45 and have pondered this question with myself almost everyday for the past 3 years. I initially planned on early retirement and have reached my financial goal at 45. My current nonworking passive income is more than what most dentists make so I'm not so motivated to drill and fill anymore. But I don't hate dentistry yet I don't like it either, so I work 25hr week now cause it's easy money. I have decided to delay full retirement until 50 cause I haven't decided what to do other than sleeping all day.:(
 
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26. The whole DMD thing is just to market myself for the ladies.
 
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With the amount of loans I'm about to take out for school I plan on retiring when I'm 156.
 
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Most dentists are horrific savers so it's not a choice they can make. I am 45 and have pondered this question with myself almost everyday for the past 3 years. I initially planned on early retirement and have reached my financial goal at 45. My current nonworking passive income is more than what most dentists make so I'm not so motivated to drill and fill anymore. But I don't hate dentistry yet I don't like it either, so I work 25hr week now cause it's easy money. I have decided to delay full retirement until 50 cause I haven't decided what to do other than sleeping all day.:(
Dr. Daurang, do you have your own practice(s)? If so, after how many years after your graduation did you decide to open one? I understand that your debt amount could be much less than us which gave you a much better opportunity to reach the financial goals faster but if you were going to have $430K-500K of debt after graduation, what are the things that you would have done differently?

Sorry if I asked too many questions but I really think that you are a very wise and experienced dentist after reading many of your previous posts. Also, since you are Vietnamese (I assumed), do you think it has given you the advantage to attract more VNmese patients?
I'm hoping to hear more of your experiences. Please feel free to PM me or reply to this post if you are comfortable. Thank you so much.
 
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Most dentists are horrific savers so it's not a choice they can make. I am 45 and have pondered this question with myself almost everyday for the past 3 years. I initially planned on early retirement and have reached my financial goal at 45. My current nonworking passive income is more than what most dentists make so I'm not so motivated to drill and fill anymore. But I don't hate dentistry yet I don't like it either, so I work 25hr week now cause it's easy money. I have decided to delay full retirement until 50 cause I haven't decided what to do other than sleeping all day.:(
Man... If you have that much downtime, I need to come fly out to my old city and grab a bite with my mentor. :)
 
Dr. Daurang, do you have your own practice(s)? If so, after how many years after your graduation did you decide to open one? I understand that your debt amount could be much less than us which gave you a much better opportunity to reach the financial goals faster but if you were going to have $430K-500K of debt after graduation, what are the things that you would have done differently?

Sorry if I asked too many questions but I really think that you are a very wise and experienced dentist after reading many of your previous posts. Also, since you are Vietnamese (I assumed), do you think it has given you the advantage to attract more VNmese patients?
I'm hoping to hear more of your experiences. Please feel free to PM me or reply to this post if you are comfortable. Thank you so much.

I built my practice in 2000 as soon as I got my license. My school debt was $200k from dental and $50k from undergrad. Henry Schein lent me another $80k for construction of the practice. Yes I was crazy but it's a high risk high return concept. Dental office is the second most successful startup business so it's worth the risk. Also, the surest way to become financially independent and a millionaire is to have your own business. If I fail I can always work 9-5 for corporate for the rest of my life like everyone else.

Then came the housing crash of 2008 and all these foreclosures were selling pennies on the dollar. Previous $120k-$150k homes were selling for $25k-$40k so I bought them all with all my cash to rent out.

Only 25% of my pts are VNmese. I don't concentrate of them and I don't advertise to them or anyone else. I stopped advertising cause 95% of new patients are referrals.
 
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I built my practice in 2000 as soon as I got my license. My school debt was $200k from dental and $50k from undergrad. Henry Schein lent me another $80k for construction of the practice. Yes I was crazy but it's a high risk high return concept. Dental office is the second most successful startup business so it's worth the risk. Also, the surest way to become financially independent and a millionaire is to have your own business. If I fail I can always work 9-5 for corporate for the rest of my life like everyone else.

Then came the housing crash of 2008 and all these foreclosures were selling pennies on the dollar. Previous $120k-$150k homes were selling for $25k-$40k so I bought them all with all my cash to rent out.

Only 25% of my pts are VNmese. I don't concentrate of them and I don't advertise to them or anyone else. I stopped advertising cause 95% of new patients are referrals.
Thank you so much for replying to my questions! Dr. Daurang, you are officially my role model. :)
 
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Dental office is the second most successful startup business so it's worth the risk. Also, the surest way to become financially independent and a millionaire is to have your own business.

Agree on your second sentence (though it depends where and how efficiently the business is run, which I'm sure know already)

Out of curiosity what do you consider the most successful startup business (you labeled dental as #2). Psychiatry? CPA office? Silicon Valley Tech?
 
I'm retiring at 47. haha specifically at that age because I'll be 27 at graduation and want to do 20 years with the Army.
 
I'm retiring at 47. haha specifically at that age because I'll be 27 at graduation and want to do 20 years with the Army.

1. Love your avatar.
2. Why Army? as opposed to Navy?
3. Is the army pension enough?
 
Two more years or when my retirement plan hits 4 mil. Whichever comes first.
 
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Two more years or when my retirement plan hits 4 mil. Whichever comes first.
How long did it take you to get to that goal?

Dow is down 300+ points today, I invested in more tangible investment (real estate, dental practices, etc. - which should be worth at least $5 million by retirement after I pay off all the debt in 10 years) in my first 5 years as a dentist.

My Edward Jones banker calls me every month to invest in retirement accounts. I'm shooting to jump on it sometime next year.
 
Cold Front...what are you doing investing with Edward Jones? Are you making them rich or yourself rich? :annoyed: They don't care about your financial well being. They just want your a piece of your money. Nobody can take care of your money as good as you. Maybe you got too much money you deserve to be ripoffed!

It sucks that they don't offer to help us make money when we really need it. But when we already make so much money (even more than them) they offer to help make us more money when we least need them (with zero guarantee except their instant 5% fee and 2% annual fee.) LOL.
 
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Cold Front...what are you doing investing with Edward Jones? Are you making them rich or yourself rich? :annoyed:
Ha! My accountant said exact same thing.

I don't really return their calls, but they keep telling me how they have other dentists as clients, some putting away as high as $200k a year to catch-up on their retirement goals - dentists in their 40's.

Still on the fence with IRA and the whole market stability. I have seen serious casualty in 2008 recession through people I know.
 
In their 40's putting away $200k a year to catchup? They're already way ahead of the game if they can put away that much after tax! Why they need some idiot to scam them 5% right off their $200k for? Are these dentists trying to catch up to Bill Gates or Warren Buffet? NUTS!

DOW is down 300+ today? GOOD!!! I only buy stuffs on sale and the stock market is no difference. Buy good companies and it will more than likely go up within a week or two. I've made $30k this year on Apple alone just buying it on drop and selling it the following week. If it keep dropping buy some more to average out and wait it out til it rise. If you wanna retire early buy Apple stocks but don't buy Apple phone!
 
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In their 40's putting away $200k a year to catchup? They're already way ahead of the game if they can put away that much after tax! Why they need some idiot to scam them 5% right off their $200k for? Are these dentists trying to catch up to Bill Gates or Warren Buffet? NUTS!

DOW is down 300+ today? GOOD!!! I only buy stuffs on sale and the stock market is no difference. Buy good companies and it will more than likely go up within a week or two. I've made $30k this year on Apple alone just buying it on drop and selling it the following week. If it keep dropping buy some more to average out and wait it out til it rise. If you wanna retire early buy Apple stocks but don't buy Apple phone!

I've told this many times but most people I've met with an Apple product cant seem to grasp this easy concept. Hate to sound cynical but American society got real dumb with baby boomers and onwards

http://www.cnbc.com/id/102581574?__source=msn
 
In their 40's putting away $200k a year to catchup? They're already way ahead of the game if they can put away that much after tax! Why they need some idiot to scam them 5% right off their $200k for? Are these dentists trying to catch up to Bill Gates or Warren Buffet? NUTS!

DOW is down 300+ today? GOOD!!! I only buy stuffs on sale and the stock market is no difference. Buy good companies and it will more than likely go up within a week or two. I've made $30k this year on Apple alone just buying it on drop and selling it the following week. If it keep dropping buy some more to average out and wait it out til it rise. If you wanna retire early buy Apple stocks but don't buy Apple phone!
My exact thoughts. You can't save save save, then put it into vehicles that give you less control, specially with fees that's higher than your city and state taxes.

I think passive income and paying off debt is way to go. So far I have a goal of growing my business 10% a year in profits (which is about $60k a year) - which is normal rate for an office that has potential for growth. Plus cutting debt related expenses/payments at a rate of $60k a year, which can only go for so long, but leads to lower overhead. That's a total of $120k a year more in 2015 take home from my 2014 income. To me, it is better rate of return than investing in retirement accounts in the short and long term.

This will soon equate to zero student debt, mortgage and practices paid off, auto paid off, real estate investments that has lower debt.... That's a tangible multi-million networth by retirement age, and most of it is appreciating with time, maybe at a better pace than retirement accounts.

It's not fun to worry all the time about keeping your income up. After refinancing and paying down debts for the past few years, that was a better feeling than making more money and getting taxed a lot. I would rather work less and make less and enjoy everything else there is to life. That's the dream "feeling".

2013: Worked 6 days a week.
2014: 5 days a week.
2015: 4.5 a week. (5 years out of school).
2016-2020: 4 days a week.
 
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Is the 120k take home before or after taxes?
 
My exact thoughts. You can't save save save, then put it into vehicles that give you less control, specially with fees that's higher than your city and state taxes.

I think passive income and paying off debt is way to go. So far I have a goal of growing my business 10% a year in profits (which is about $60k a year) - which is normal rate for an office that has potential for growth. Plus cutting debt related expenses/payments at a rate of $60k a year, which can only go for so long, but leads to lower overhead. That's a total of $120k a year more in 2015 take home from my 2014 income. To me, it is better rate of return than investing in retirement accounts in the short and long term.

This will soon equate to zero student debt, mortgage and practices paid off, auto paid off, real estate investments that has lower debt.... That's a tangible multi-million networth by retirement age, and most of it is appreciating with time, maybe at a better pace than retirement accounts.

It's not fun to worry all the time about keeping your income up. After refinancing and paying down debts for the past few years, that was a better feeling than making more money and getting taxed a lot. I would rather work less and make less and enjoy everything else there is to life. That's the dream "feeling".

2013: Worked 6 days a week.
2014: 5 days a week.
2015: 4.5 a week. (5 years out of school).
2016-2020: 4 days a week.

Are you saying that you don't invest in securities at all? I think this is flawed because capital is aligned with governmental power and market forces; why wound't you want to align your financial interest with them? I understand avoiding high fees but there are a lot of firms like Vanguard that offer no-load funds for you to invest in and avoid them. Think about it this way - would you like to directly benefit from the effects of globalization, automation, and regulatory capture or do you want to suffer from it? This is all without considering compounding interests etc.
By avoiding securities all I see downside. Indeed, every other investments you've mentioned are exposed, albeit more indirectly, to much of the same risks, market forces, or corrections. Although, I'm not saying it's a bad thing to do stuff outside of securities.
 
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Is the 120k take home before or after taxes?
This is pre-tax savings through debt reduction/expenses and business growth take home. Let's assume $120k each year of savings in the following example.

2014: $X take home.
2015: $X + $60k business growth profit + $60k savings from debt service/expenses = $X + $120k ($Y) addition pre-tax income.
2016: $X + $Y + $ additional business growth + $ additional debt payment cuts/expenses = $X + $Y (from 2014) + $120k = $X + $240k

It's just an example and a realistic goal under the right circumstances.
 
Are you saying that you don't invest in securities at all? I think this is flawed because capital is aligned with governmental power and market forces; why wound't you want to align your financial interest with them? I understand avoiding high fees but there are a lot of firms like Vanguard that offer no-load funds for you to invest in and avoid them. Think about it this way - would you like to directly benefit from the effects of globalization, automation, and regulatory capture or do you want to suffer from it? This is all without considering compounding interests etc.
By avoiding securities all I see downside. Indeed, every other investments you've mentioned are exposed, albeit more indirectly, to much of the same risks, market forces, or corrections. Although, I think a strong case can be made for diversification outside of securities and obtaining other forms of passive income.
I'm not 100% against security investments, but I truly believe in tangible investment as a better option personally. You have more control of your portfolio, and not subject to retirement accounts' age limits, taxes, penalties and fees to get passive income. You can always sell your real estate investments before you turn 59 and pay capital gain taxes at 15%, versus waiting until age 59 to withdraw your IRA at 20%+ tax rate and face additional fees on the way.

http://www.bbc.com/capital/story/20140501-how-the-rich-stay-rich
 
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I'm not 100% against security investments, but I truly believe in tangible investment as a better option personally. You have more control of your portfolio, and not subject to retirement accounts' age limits, taxes, penalties and fees to get passive income. You can always sell your real estate investments before you turn 59 and pay capital gain taxes at 15%, versus waiting until age 59 to withdraw your IRA at 20%+ tax rate and face additional fees on the way.

It's not quite that simple. When you sell your real estate you also pay your depreciation recapture which will wipe out of your gain. If you're in high tax bracket, IRA will save you 40% tax ($20k) on that $53,000 annual deposit plus the money is fully protected from creditors/lawsuits. You don't need that money until 59 anyway so keep as cash and buy when the market crash like me. My point is you gotta be well diversified to take advantage of negative market and gubmint changes.
 
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At what age do you plan to retire from practicing Dentistry?

are you doing some type of research with all these polls?

I am not answering this question!!
 
It's not quite that simple. When you sell your real estate you also pay your depreciation recapture which will wipe out of your gain. If you're in high tax bracket, IRA will save you 40% tax ($20k) on that $53,000 annual deposit plus the money is fully protected from creditors/lawsuits. You don't need that money until 59 anyway so keep as cash and buy when the market crash like me. My point is you gotta be well diversified to take advantage of negative market and gubmint changes.
How many negative markets can we experience in a life time? I have only seen one (2008), and if it happens like the last one, it could last a decade.

The bottom line is, how much money is enough to not worry about money at all? And have more than enough that you need to live very comfortably, travel and see the world, and to last beyond retirement. Experts throw numbers, like 80% of your current income. But that's only true if you still have debt (mortgage, student loans, practice loans, etc), but the debt eventually goes away, well before retirement, and you have those savings to make your life even more comfortable. Not to mention social security income, retirement accounts and other passive income that one earns over the years. Plus if one ever decides to still work beyond retirement (for non-financial reasons) and not use all those savings and additional income, how much more is enough?

Yes there will be inflation, new tax laws, yes there will unforeseen expenses, you could bow out of dentistry early for various reasons, or not even make it to age 59. But above all, the odds are still in favor of life being tough in the beginning for most dentists, and much smoother towards the end - financially, if most things fall in place.

I'm certainly not worried about it with 30-35 years of my career still ahead of me. I should be debt free in 5-7 years, and still have 25-30 years left to go to work. I would do it for my soul then than money, because I should have more than enough to not worry about debt at that stage. Plus all the other; 3 days a week work schedule and the better lifestyle that comes with it.
 
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Is a good basic understanding of what you need assuming you are retiring soon. The challenge is how to get there. Starting early and being consistent is certainly in your favor as is living somewhat below your means. If you marry, marry well. A solid second income not only raises your lifestyle but it also accelerates your pace toward financial independence. Avoid financial disasters (divorce or divorce with young children) if your goal is to retire early or investing in business adventures you know very little about. Live a healthy lifestyle to avoid unnecessary medical expense and to enjoy your financial freedom.
 
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