Calling DOs/MDs alike, the AOA/AMA, Student Doctors

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paramediclizard said:
Well I guess we should agree to reconnect in 10 or 20 years to see who got the better education, cooler job, the bigger house, drives the nicer car and has the hotter wife...I'm sure it will be you with your bigger, badder, more business educated self (well maybe not the wife part, I think I got that one nailed:thumbup:).
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Well, it looks like I'll be educated in a dirty, crime ridden city called Manhattan, in a medical school that doesn't even teach OMM, trying to get a low paying academic physician job, live in a pretty small house, drive a beat up import and have a wife who doesn't try to spend my money dry by going to beauty parlor everyday.

I fail indeed.
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Is anyone surprised this school is in trouble?
Is anyone unhappy this school is in trouble?
Does anyone except for RVUs 40K/yr tuition paying students want it to succeed?

I care for fellow students, I teach students, and but RVU is a disgrace to our profession.

The school has been controversial since its conception and will continue to be so.
I hope its student leave, transfer, reapply and we shut this embarrassment down.

I wish the students well, however, as intelligent students you cant play dumb on the idea you choose to attend a for profit school. Maybe you were given a good sales pitch to attend, but my empathy will not sway me to support this schools existence.
I have heard too many lies by the AOA on this issue (first and foremost that tax code prohibits the AOA from not granting this school a charter - BS). This school further adds negative stigma to all DOs and to our proffession and any right minded person not caught up in the AOAs PR non sense can see right through carribean med school.

RVU = American University of the Carribean branch DO campus in Colorado.
Shut it down.
 
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beyond the for-profit model, which is clearly a terrible model for medical education, this school, as a business, is incrediblly mismanaged.

think about, all the board of trustee members are fired, replaced with immediate family members of the owner of the school.

those board of trustee members were charged with the mission of guiding students and improve medical education of the region. They were locally prominent physicians that provides gateway to rotations and residencies.

Owner of the school, Tien, just ****ed where he eat.

How can this school have quality rotations if they managed to pissed off attendings at the regions?
 
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Everyone takes chances in life. Unfortunately it appears you guys took the wrong one. Quit and reapply if you don't think its any good, just don't sink another $90,000 into the place if its something you are not interested. No one is going to "save" anything and if things are that bad the school will just fail to become accredited. Also, students applying should take heed to threads like these when looking for a school.

Sorry guys and best of luck.
 
It is not surprising that RVU is being run as a mirror campus of AUC. As a private, for-profit it is Tien's right to do so. Why is anyone surprised that this is happening? COCA and the AOA did nothing to stop this. The party line was, "we will observe them and hold them to a higher standard". So now what? The future of this profession hinges on the AOA and COCA's response to this. Clearly, this is being run as a way to print money on the hopes of medical students. Quality, research and service don't enter in to the equation. If the AOA/COCA permits this to go on and does not intervene to provide the oversight they perviously stated would be assured, then this is the first step in the end of this profession. Next step, the US Department of Education will see what a mess COCA has made and remove them as an accrediting body for DO schools. Enter the LCME, which will become the only body authorized to accredit medical schools. How many of our schools could pass their standards? Finally, CMS simply stops paying for DO residencies and stops paying claims to DO's from non-LCME schools.
Can't happen? That what they said about Tien running away with RVU because of its "independent" board.
The students are in the best position to stop this. Withdraw, start over, do whatever is necessary to protect your futures. Without money, it becomes just another Denver office complex.
 
well boohoo for RVU. I hope this school tanks and as for their students, stay away from our schools! To you RVU students, the rest of the osteopathic community looks down upon this school and are greatly saddened by your choice to go to this money-corruption-fest. sorry, but we don't care about this school and consider this your punishment for agreeing with for-profit education.
 
HarMegido said:
well boohoo for RVU. I hope this school tanks and as for their students, stay away from our schools! To you RVU students, the rest of the osteopathic community looks down upon this school and are greatly saddened by your choice to go to this money-corruption-fest. sorry, but we don't care about this school and consider this your punishment for agreeing with for-profit education.
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Calm down. You do not speak for everyone.
 
DO Anes said:
It is not surprising that RVU is being run as a mirror campus of AUC. As a private, for-profit it is Tien's right to do so. Why is anyone surprised that this is happening? COCA and the AOA did nothing to stop this. The party line was, "we will observe them and hold them to a higher standard". So now what? The future of this profession hinges on the AOA and COCA's response to this. Clearly, this is being run as a way to print money on the hopes of medical students. Quality, research and service don't enter in to the equation. If the AOA/COCA permits this to go on and does not intervene to provide the oversight they perviously stated would be assured, then this is the first step in the end of this profession. Next step, the US Department of Education will see what a mess COCA has made and remove them as an accrediting body for DO schools. Enter the LCME, which will become the only body authorized to accredit medical schools. How many of our schools could pass their standards? Finally, CMS simply stops paying for DO residencies and stops paying claims to DO's from non-LCME schools.
Can't happen? That what they said about Tien running away with RVU because of its "independent" board.
The students are in the best position to stop this. Withdraw, start over, do whatever is necessary to protect your futures. Without money, it becomes just another Denver office complex.
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Dr. M speaks the truth. Again.
 
HarMegido said:
well boohoo for RVU. I hope this school tanks and as for their students, stay away from our schools! To you RVU students, the rest of the osteopathic community looks down upon this school and are greatly saddened by your choice to go to this money-corruption-fest. sorry, but we don't care about this school and consider this your punishment for agreeing with for-profit education.
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Got to love the goodness of people/professional unity. Don't blame the students, blame the accrediting bodies trying to make their bottom line. Saying things like 'they (students) knew what they were getting into' is super unfair, and skips over far too many variables. Colbert is right, you shouldn't declare 'our schools (whatever the hell that means)' as off limits.

With that said ... from what I can understand, this is a huge slap in the face, makes DOs look like a half-assed, pay your way, sort of thing. Also, I highly doubt this huge call for change is going to rally up and take everything over. Look at comments from the future of the profession who basically tell the RVU students - their peers and future collegues - to go **** themselves. I'm 99% sure statements will be made, people with 'chairman' and 'president' infront of their name will ensure everyone that everything is fine and misunderstood ... it will slowly melt away and nothing will change.
 
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Ridiculous! People attending this school work just as hard as you and deserve to succeed just as much as you and your touro colleagues. Maybe we should all just try being supportive. O and as a Colorado resident I can tell you the community has nothing against the students and the majority don't care about the for profit status. P.s. Yes I'm seriously bothered by recent changes to my possible future a school. But the students here are of the highest calibur- at least they don't spend their time wishing failure on their colleagues.
 
I also feel sorry for the students at RVU, it is not their fault that this has occurred. However, when the proposal was approved in 2007 I was against a for profit institution and the students there could have researched it a bit better before committing their careers to this. Can for profit work? I suppose, but it is highly suspect in its motivation. I have to side with Dr. M, and many of my colleagues here: before another class gets stuck in this mess, or worse, federal agencies start taking away AOA power of approving their own school, COCA and the AOA should rescind the accreditation. This could seriously tarnish not just the RVU students but all DOs.
 
COBuffs said:
Ridiculous! People attending this school work just as hard as you and deserve to succeed just as much as you and your touro colleagues. Maybe we should all just try being supportive. O and as a Colorado resident I can tell you the community has nothing against the students and the majority don't care about the for profit status. P.s. Yes I'm seriously bothered by recent changes to my possible future a school. But the students here are of the highest calibur- at least they don't spend their time wishing failure on their colleagues.
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RVU = epic fail.
 
drmsm said:
I also feel sorry for the students at RVU, it is not their fault that this has occurred. However, when the proposal was approved in 2007 I was against a for profit institution and the students there could have researched it a bit better before committing their careers to this. Can for profit work? I suppose, but it is highly suspect in its motivation. I have to side with Dr. M, and many of my colleagues here: before another class gets stuck in this mess, or worse, federal agencies start taking away AOA power of approving their own school, COCA and the AOA should rescind the accreditation. This could seriously tarnish not just the RVU students but all DOs.
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Amen. This could not only tarnish all DOs, but healthcare at large.

DO Anes (Dr. M.) has been a voice crying out, with everyone throwing stones at him, but RVU students should realize that he has been their best friend in this fight.

RVU students, FLEE. RVU accepted applicants, FLEE. RVU wannabes, FLEE. This place is bad news. Don't say nobody warned you.
 
COBuffs said:
Ridiculous! Maybe we should all just try being supportive. the students here are of the highest caliber- at least they don't spend their time wishing failure on their colleagues.
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No one is against RVU students, but many are against the school.
You cannot ask DOs or other OMS to come running in support for something they believe is an embarrassment
to the profession (for profit school). RVU damages our own credentials as DOs, and so we are against the school.

Are the students of high quality? Im sure. Does that mean we should support RVU? Absolutely not.

The school is a carribean med school on US soil. If the AAMC (who banned this sort of nonsense years ago)
decided to allow for profit schools, RVUcom would dump OMM and apply to offer MD degrees.

The only reason the school exsist in the first place is due to market demand to become a physician (aka less seats than applicants).
If that market didnt exist, this school would never fill its applicant seats (nor would any carribean med school).

The school is an experiment, and studnets shuold be aware of that and who are considering attending it in the future should too.

Its for profit status causes all sorts of conflicts including that the owner can simply dictate this sort of non-sense.
Secondly, students are in a compromising situation as they are the revenue stream of the corporation.

Sudents "choose" to attend this project, and they can "choose" to leave. If you think you were lied to or deceived
about the school and are owed something then seek legal advice. Blame the AOA/COCA for sanctioning this
non-sense and pretending they could do nothing at all, but dont ask us to support this for profit embarrassment.

I support the students, but not the school, and we should not let the facts and conflicts that arise with for profit
medical education be neglected to appease 150 students. CLOSE RVU COM!
 
RVU students need to apply to our schools just like everyone else and need to meet their new school's standards. Schools shouldn't just adapt students from RVU. By simply adopting these students, it shows that we supported RVU's processes. Dear AOA, it's ok to make a mistake and it's also ok to admit it; but it's absolutely NOT ok sanction a school that is run by the greedy little troll, Yife Tien. Sorry if me and my colleagues don't seem like we're supporting RVU or it's students, but this one school can destroy the whole profession as a whole is nothing is done about it.
 
HarMegido said:
RVU students need to apply to our schools just like everyone else and need to meet their new school's standards. Schools shouldn't just adapt students from RVU. By simply adopting these students, it shows that we supported RVU's processes. Dear AOA, it's ok to make a mistake and it's also ok to admit it; but it's absolutely NOT ok sanction a school that is run by the greedy little troll, Yife Tien. Sorry if me and my colleagues don't seem like we're supporting RVU or it's students, but this one school can destroy the whole profession as a whole is nothing is done about it.
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I notice by your MDapps that you applied to RVU. What would have happened if it were your only acceptance?
 
engineeredout said:
I notice by your MDapps that you applied to RVU. What would have happened if it were your only acceptance?
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actually i never finished filling out its secondary. i found out it was for-profit while looking on its website for things to write about in my secondary:D. i would have never gone if it was my only option; it would been impossible for this school to be my only acceptance.
 
DO Anes said:
IIf the AOA/COCA permits this to go on and does not intervene to provide the oversight they perviously stated would be assured, then this is the first step in the end of this profession. Next step, the US Department of Education will see what a mess COCA has made and remove them as an accrediting body for DO schools. Enter the LCME, which will become the only body authorized to accredit medical schools. How many of our schools could pass their standards? Finally, CMS simply stops paying for DO residencies and stops paying claims to DO's from non-LCME schools.
Can't happen? That what they said about Tien running away with RVU because of its "independent" board.
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Close RVU. Disband the AOA and COCA. They don't care and don't listen. What a joke. And if our schools can't pass LCME standards, then maybe they should be closed too.
 
Let me start out by saying those posting that are in fact attending the RVU are in NO way the singular voice of the student body. In fact I believe the '100' of students that signed the petition did so do to the pressure/in your face attitude of those who drew up the petition. As an RVU student I blatantly refused to sign the petition. I am outraged that these student believe they can speak for me.
As for the rest of you from other schools bad-mouthing the name of RVU, get a life. If you've never been to the school or attended our classes, what exactly makes you an expert on our school? The fact is our curriculum is top notch as is our faculty. We've been educated by some of the most well-known faculty across the nation. If you think you are superior, think again, and maybe focus on your own education and not ours. And a great deal of thanks for the 'continued success' of our school. Your maturity levels and empathy for fellow medical students and future colleagues is astounding.
As for the 'supposed' shuffling of the higher ups. Act like you've been there. Regime changes occur everywhere from Fortune 500 companies to major athletic teams. Its the nature of the beast. Please don't let any students here 'pretend' to know what exactly has happened. There is only speculation.
The fact remains...the students are receiving a great education and will be fully prepared to practice as physicians in their respective communities.
 
First off, it's a shame to hear that Dr. Martin got ousted. We were sad to lose him at Nova because he was such a strong advocate for the students. Even when he didn't do things we agreed with, in the end it was in our best interests. I felt that regardless what business model RVU had, it would do well by the students with Dr. Martin at the helm.

RVU, by it's nature, does not harm the osteopathic profession. It harms the governing body and their judgement (perhaps), but the other DO schools really shouldn't worry. No more so than MD schools as a whole worry about caribbean schools harming the allopathic profession as a whole, making it harder for their applicants to get jobs. Within both systems there are good schools and there are bad schools, and residency programs and employers know that.

To say that RVU will be unable to turn out good doctors because of the business model hasn't been proven one way or the other. Unfortunately, this experiment can only yield results by running its course. We can theorize and make educated guesses, but in the end the only definitive proof will come once graduates get minted.

RVU had/has a lot of things going for it. It's a stand alone school, which I prefer (I have a thing against branch campuses, but that's a topic for another thread). It's in a geographically distinct location, and in a big city. Those two things alone made me happy to see the school come into being. The for-profit angle... well, perhaps not the best idea, but I couldn't (and still can't) say it's a bad thing.

If it reaches the point where sub-par students are able to buy their way into medical school because nobody else can afford to go there, then RVU will become the DO equivalent of a caribbean school and the graduates will suffer as a result. It may be there now, but there's no proof in either direction. But I'd bet that the majority of current students don't fall into that category and would have been able to secure a spot at another school if RVU hadn't sprung into being.

There's no good answer for what to do from here. I used to be pretty solidly in the "let RVU do it's thing and see how it turns out" because I trusted the guy steering the school. Now I'm not so sure. I can't say it will fail and be a blight on the osteopathic profession (because I don't believe one school can do that... it can just blight itself). I don't know the quality of doctors that the school will turn out, but that's a problem that any new school has and can't be blamed on RVU's for profitness.

All I know is I'm glad I didn't go there and that I don't have to worry through this mess. I feel bad for those who do.
 
It's not about the students, curriculum, or whatever at RVU. There is of course no reason that they all couldn't be top notch. But the issue is with the for-profit status. That, coupled with the fact that for-profit schools are severely frowned upon philosophically and are not allowed whatsoever under MD rule is the problem. So, why would they be allowed under ours? Sure, its all probably just perception (which is sad), but in the end, that's apparently what counts.
 
HarMegido said:
well boohoo for RVU. I hope this school tanks and as for their students, stay away from our schools! To you RVU students, the rest of the osteopathic community looks down upon this school and are greatly saddened by your choice to go to this money-corruption-fest. sorry, but we don't care about this school and consider this your punishment for agreeing with for-profit education.
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haha, too funny...

says the person who got rejected from almost every MD school he applied to, and is now talking s.hit because he was lucky enough to not be in the position of having only one acceptance.

You sir are nothing but a joke.
 
toothless rufus said:
But the issue is with the for-profit status. That, coupled with the fact that for-profit schools are severely frowned upon philosophically and are not allowed whatsoever under MD rule is the problem.
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I have been known to be slow at times, and in fact numerous university based placebo controlled double blinded studies have independently confirmed that at other times I'm just an idiot.

So forgive my ignorance when I ask, but what's so philosophically bad about a for-profit school?
 
Doctor Bob said:
I have been known to be slow at times, and in fact numerous university based placebo controlled double blinded studies have independently confirmed that at other times I'm just an idiot.

So forgive my ignorance when I ask, but what's so philosophically bad about a for-profit school?
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I found this wikipedia paragraph interesting:

The accreditation of RVUCOM generated some controversy before the school held its first class. Like all osteopathic medical schools, RVUCOM is accredited by a board of the American Osteopathic Association (AOA) Commission on Osteopathic College Accreditation (COCA). Unlike the other 28 osteopathic and 126 MD medical colleges in the US, RVUCOM is organized as a for-profit corporation.[11] Critics claimed the AOA's approval of a for-profit school "erodes creditability" of osteopathic medical schools, especially in comparison to their MD counterparts.[64] The Liaison Committee on Medical Education, which accredits the MD-granting US medical schools, has banned for-profit schools.[65] School officials insist the for-profit status of the school will not compromise the integrity of its educational mission.[66] 2007-2008 AOA president and orthopedic surgeon Peter Ajluni, D.O. responded, "there are many socially minded for-profit companies that contribute time, resources, and profits to their communities" and "for-profit institutions like RVUCOM can further the cause of osteopathic medicine in the United States."[67]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osteopathic_medicine_in_the_United_States
 
HarMegido said:
well boohoo for RVU. I hope this school tanks and as for their students, stay away from our schools! To you RVU students, the rest of the osteopathic community looks down upon this school and are greatly saddened by your choice to go to this money-corruption-fest. sorry, but we don't care about this school and consider this your punishment for agreeing with for-profit education.
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I have been one of the most staunch opponents of RVU on this board. That said, it is just bad form to wish someone harm or wish their future be ruined even if they did choose a for-profit school. While the students do bear some of the responsibility for going to RVU, who among you cannot say that you would have gone were it your only acceptance?

DODoc78 said:
The fact is our curriculum is top notch as is our faculty. We've been educated by some of the most well-known faculty across the nation.
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Medical education rests on the clinical portion of the education, not the classroom and definitely not the first year. You cannot claim to have a top notch curriculum until you actually know if you even have rotation spots much less a solid clinical education.

RVU sets a dangerous precedent. Students will always flock to a place where they can get an education and become a doctor. This is witnessed by the fact that the many carribean schools that are not part of the Big 4 carribean schools get plenty of students. It is the responsibility of the governing body to ensure it's students dont get screwed over. It seems like COCA just isnt proactive enough to stop this from happening.

Right now the school doesnt deserve to be shut down, but they should be smack-dab in the middle of COCA and the AOAs radar.
 
Instatewaiter said:
I have been one of the most staunch opponents of RVU on this board. That said, it is just bad form to wish someone harm or wish their future be ruined even if they did choose a for-profit school. While the students do bear some of the responsibility for going to RVU, who among you cannot say that you would have gone were it your only acceptance?



Medical education rests on the clinical portion of the education, not the classroom and definitely not the first year. You cannot claim to have a top notch curriculum until you actually know if you even have rotation spots much less a solid clinical education.

RVU sets a dangerous precedent. Students will always flock to a place where they can get an education and become a doctor. This is witnessed by the fact that the many carribean schools that are not part of the Big 4 carribean schools get plenty of students. It is the responsibility of the governing body to ensure it's students dont get screwed over. It seems like COCA just isnt proactive enough to stop this from happening.

Right now the school doesnt deserve to be shut down, but they should be smack-dab in the middle of COCA and the AOAs radar.
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Great post. Fair, to the point, etc.
 
bioman2006 said:
It's time to get off the failboat, kids. Withdraw or transfer.
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Great advice coming from an MS-ZERO...:caution: (you've just been served a yellow card...)

Focus on your own issues...or come up with something more productive.
 
IgnisDU said:
As the dust has begun to settle I am cautiously optimistic that my primary goal can still be met at RVU, to gain a medical education.
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The primary goal of medical school is not to gain a medical education. The primary goal is to get a job.

If you go to medical school for four years, pass your boards, graduate, and don't match or scramble into a residency you've gained a medical education.

With $150,000-$200,000 in student loans, you're also so far up unemployment creek without a paddle you'll wish you'd never been born.

The problem with pre-med is that you can't see past that first hurdle to get a sense of what others exist on the course. RVU is counting on your shortsightedness to turn a buck.
 
I wonder how much $ Tien is actually making?

39k/student x 160 students (or so) = $6,200,000 this year, and like $12.5 million next year.
Less start-up costs, operating expenses, taxes, all the beauracracy associated with starting up a school, plus paying faculty and staff.

I think it wil take a few years before he really makes $$. By letting a dean go he at least saves one salary.
 
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paramediclizard said:
Great advice coming from an MS-ZERO...:caution: (you've just been served a yellow card...)

Focus on your own issues...or come up with something more productive.
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how are you going to have rotation spots when you pissed off and fired all the local physicians on your board? just sayin'
 
The students of RVU want to get through medical school just like everyone else. They all chose RVU for their own reasons but they also chose on the perception that RVU's business status would not keep them from achieving their medical goals.

Whether or not it does remains to be seen. Some people will overplay it and some will brush it off as a hiccup.

I am not at all surprised this happened, and no one else should be either. I dont think this will spell imminent demise for RVU. There are too many as$es willing to fill those seats, for-profit or not. If you dont attend RVU or read this forum you would never even know this happened.

To me, it sucks that this is happening because it will ultimately not bode well for the perception of osteopathic medical schools, and there's a brand-spanking-new med school in my home state that is looking mighty shady right now.
 
BruceBanner said:
The students of RVU want to get through medical school just like everyone else. They all chose RVU for their own reasons but they also chose on the perception that RVU's business status would not keep them from achieving their medical goals.
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Setting aside the "for-profit" issue for a moment, why would a pre-med choose to go to a school with so much controversy surrounding it? I guess if it was your only choice, then I could see that...but if given a choice between any other DO/MD school vs. RVU? Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only thing I can think of that RVU has going for it is location (Colorado is the bomb!). One pro vs. an exhausting list of cons...
 
bioman2006 said:
Ooouch, burning me with a lame soccer reference. I think I'll go curl up in bed and cry myself to sleep.

Then again, if I had been accepted to only one medical school, I would be rabidly defending it too. Judging from this post, you had a similar opinion about RVU until it was all you had left.

But I'm done here. Best of luck to you and I hope all of the students get through this matter with a positive outcome.
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why the sudden change of opinion, lizard?
 
Instatewaiter said:
I have been one of the most staunch opponents of RVU on this board. That said, it is just bad form to wish someone harm or wish their future be ruined even if they did choose a for-profit school. While the students do bear some of the responsibility for going to RVU, who among you cannot say that you would have gone were it your only acceptance?

Medical education rests on the clinical portion of the education, not the classroom and definitely not the first year. You cannot claim to have a top notch curriculum until you actually know if you even have rotation spots much less a solid clinical education.

RVU sets a dangerous precedent. Students will always flock to a place where they can get an education and become a doctor. This is witnessed by the fact that the many carribean schools that are not part of the Big 4 carribean schools get plenty of students. It is the responsibility of the governing body to ensure it's students dont get screwed over. It seems like COCA just isnt proactive enough to stop this from happening.

Right now the school doesnt deserve to be shut down, but they should be smack-dab in the middle of COCA and the AOAs radar.
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I agree with Jagger that this is a fair post. I will note, however, that "if it was my only acceptance" I would not have gone, more to the point, I would not have applied due to the for-profit status. This is a non-issue since the school did not exist when I applied. As someone who has taught in higher education for nearly 8 years now, continuing this while I was in medical school, I cannot stomach the outright for-profit schema this school proposed and operates under.

As stated, there will ALWAYS be someone to fill the seats. Supply and demand in medical education has always favored the schools, so there will always be behinds to fill the seats. What was also noted, regarding rotations is doubly true, however....several OMS-I students have defended the school as having a positive learning environment, BUT having good ROTATION spots is far more important than having someone who can lecture and provide the proper text; you can lecture in a tent if you have a motivated student.

The fact of the matter is this school has been on the questionable radar from day one, and not even a year into its existance there has been turnover that is also notable and fairly disruptive. Coming from a school that had notable events due to fraud I am well aware of the shadows that can hang over a school. However, in that case it was more than just the DO school.

In this case, as I mentioned in my post before, this could become a far more serious issue to ALL the osteopathic field if the government becomes involved. As someone who completed the degree, I value what I and others have had to work for. It was hard enough to get respect in some MD circles, and get an ACGME residency. We don't need to be setback again by what this could become. The AOA and COCA really need to be serious about this and consider that the "experiment" may have already failed.
 
Doctor Bob said:
I have been known to be slow at times, and in fact numerous university based placebo controlled double blinded studies have independently confirmed that at other times I'm just an idiot.

So forgive my ignorance when I ask, but what's so philosophically bad about a for-profit school?
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Ha ha! Yeah...I knew "philosophical" was a poor choice of words, but I couldn't think of a better one. :oops: Maybe "ethical" or "lame?"
 
DO Down,

You are the worst kind of coward, sniveling and hiding behind a handle on SDN. As a fellow RVU student I am disgusted by your treachery and machinations, Lauding Ronnie B. Martin who was nothing but a charlatan and autocrat and at the same time airing RVUCOM's business on the internet becuase of your own shortcomings. If you are so self-assured in your beliefs why don't you reveal your named to myself and the rest of our classmates right now. I for one, will pull no punches. I think your conduct is grounds for immediate dismissal. Not only do you not have the facts straight but you are extrapolating from very limited information--in earlier times they would call what you do yellow journalism. Short of someone who sits on the board of trustees there is no way you would be privy to those "facts" you posit in your first post. You should be ashamed and I hope you for your sake you weren't stupid enough post any of these messages from your home IP because I WILL find out who you are and expose you to the entire student body. So you asked for the bull now you are going to get the horns. That's not a threat it is a promise so I hope you have a plan B for your medical career because you're going to need it.
 
You may find it surprising, based on all this trash-talking, that RVUCOM is actually a very good school. Our professors are experienced in starting up new schools, have years of teaching experience, are experts in their fields, and are providing us with a top-notch education. We have a state-of-the-art facility, best in the country at the moment. I feel good about the boards, and I think that everything will fall into place given time.

Why do you all want our school to fail? For shame, whether you go here or not. That's hardly the spirit of a future physician.

Colorado needs our school. We have a mission to provide more primary care physicians--there is a need for 600 physicians to graduate each year to meet the needs of Colorado, and the only medical school in Colorado only graduates 150 students.

I'm proud to be part of this flagship. I'm not "second rate," thank you very much. I wanted to be part of this institution.

I am terribly disappointed in all the mindless and pointless crusading that is going on--it's a lack of responsibility, of forethought for the student body, for the reputation of our school, and NO, YOU DO NOT SPEAK FOR EVERYONE--please speak for yourself, particularly in this forum. I, for one, did not sign the list. I, for one, am not eager to see the school implode.

The very people who have been affected by the corporate decisions, whether they were unjustly terminated or not (as students we aren't exactly sitting in on the board meetings), have suggested that we focus on our studies and look towards building a good reputation for our school by being good students and good future physicians, not on tearing down Yife Tien, or the rest of the administration.

Whether the owner makes money or not is not my concern, short of the school running out of funds, and should the school fail, there are provisions in place, namely a trust fund, for transfer to other accredited schools at RVUCOM's expense.

It is incredibly naive and short-sighted to think that there is no politicking in academe or business for that matter. Good, deserving people lose their jobs every day, administrations across the country change, and although it may not be fair, it's not an excuse to bring down the entire student body and the reputation of our school on the basis of innuendos and misguided passion.

If you want to do us all a favor, get off the high horse, calm down, and work on your studies. We have a lot of exams to go before the end of the year.
 
Do down wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy over did what has happened at our school. 149 of us do not agree with him. He has lied to all on sdn and now sits quietly after students have become aware of what has happened on sdn. So for everyone who is on the bandwagon.....its all for nothing, you all have been lied to just as we have by our own classmate. :(:(

if he really beleives he has a case he will tell the truth and what his name is and if it is the truth then we cant get mad at him....but he wont since its lies

thats as simple as it gets.
 
Lastmanstanding said:
DO Down,

You are the worst kind of coward, sniveling and hiding behind a handle on SDN. As a fellow RVU student I am disgusted by your treachery and machinations, Lauding Ronnie B. Martin who was nothing but a charlatan and autocrat and at the same time airing RVUCOM's business on the internet becuase of your own shortcomings. If you are so self-assured in your beliefs why don't you reveal your named to myself and the rest of our classmates right now. I for one, will pull no punches. I think your conduct is grounds for immediate dismissal. Not only do you not have the facts straight but you are extrapolating from very limited information--in earlier times they would call what you do yellow journalism. Short of someone who sits on the board of trustees there is no way you would be privy to those "facts" you posit in your first post. You should be ashamed and I hope you for your sake you weren't stupid enough post any of these messages from your home IP because I WILL find out who you are and expose you to the entire student body. So you asked for the bull now you are going to get the horns. That's not a threat it is a promise so I hope you have a plan B for your medical career because you're going to need it.
Click to expand...

woah, woah, woah. Cool your horses. This is very close to crossing the line.
 
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