Can someone help me make sense of this?

[LAPsyGuy]

Aside from this thread (which is a bit of a joke), can you provide 3 to 5 concrete examples of "bullying"?

If you can't then I don't think you can be taken all that seriously.

My point was more subtle than "you are bullies!" Perhaps another strawman.

I'm saying that this is he attitude of cyber bullies. Has the behavior gotten worse than simpleminded rudeness? It's been fairly invalidating to some. My point is that believing that the Internet is different than the rest of the world leads to that extreme.

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[LAPsyGuy]

Uh, you said I said something I didn't say.

This is getting ridiculous.

I stated that you hinted at it. I didn't quote you. How is that dichotomous?

 

[empathiosis]

"This thread has jumped the shark of professional discourse and positive contribution, and is being closed."
I don't understand how threads can be locked due to this, yet certain individuals are allowed to make comments on almost every thread that is most definitely outside of professional discourse and positive contribution... Not much congruence there.

Let's go back to the initial post in this thread, which was actually a reasonable plea for understanding which no one has really addressed in any meaningful way.

Professional discourse is invoked whenever anyone objects to the writing of a small group, but the writing of that small group is allowed to continue unhampered, whether or not it's unprofessional. Makes no sense. You can't claim this isn't a professional environment and then close threads due to unprofessional content. Oh, sorry, yes you can, cause you can do whatever you want.

 

[WisNeuro]

*Yawn* again. Same argument from a select few people who are viewing things differently than a majority on here. I get far more positive feedback, front and backchannel, than negative feedback. Some people don't like advice/feedback that is different from what they feel. It happens. Some people take the advice and some refuse to, no matter the way the facts are delivered. This won't change.

 

[Pragma]

I stated that you hinted at it. I didn't quote you. How is that dichotomous?

I don't believe I ever hinted at that - perhaps you should be elaborating. You innately seem to know exactly what all posters on here think and feel, so you should enlighten me and the rest of us.

The dichotomous part is just a general observation. For instance, just a few posts ago you indicated that people who post something gruff here either have to be that way in real life or that they are fulfilling a fantasy. I believe you used the term "pathetic" to describe those people, which could only fall into those two categories. I was simply pointing out that making black and white comments like that (which are clearly wrong) isn't going to help folks take you seriously.

 

[empathiosis]

*Yawn* again. Same argument from a select few people who are viewing things differently than a majority on here. I get far more positive feedback, front and backchannel, than negative feedback. Some people don't like advice/feedback that is different from what they feel. It happens. Some people take the advice and some refuse to, no matter the way the facts are delivered. This won't change.

Who's the majority here? What constitutes a majority here? As I see it, the majority is lurkers. You and your group of friends are actually a minority, a pretty powerful one, but a minority nevertheless. My guess is that the majority thinks SDN is helpful when they're applying for stuff and then leave it behind because the environment is exclusive and clubby, which is why participation has decreased in recent years.

People's objections lately have very little to do with content and everything to do with the attitude of posters who think *yawn* is an appropriate reply to a post. But whatever. You don't care, that much is understood. It's your right not care.

 

[LAPsyGuy]

*Yawn* again. Same argument from a select few people who are viewing things differently than a majority on here. I get far more positive feedback, front and backchannel, than negative feedback. Some people don't like advice/feedback that is different from what they feel. It happens. Some people take the advice and some refuse to, no matter the way the facts are delivered. This won't change.

How do you know it's the majority? Perhaps you are confusing the majority with the vocal majority.

 

[empathiosis]

I think the take-away is that the VA is a pretty chill place to work cause you have time to monitor SDN for large parts of the day to help clueless youth.

 

[LAPsyGuy]

I don't believe I ever hinted at that - perhaps you should be elaborating. You innately seem to know exactly what all posters on here think and feel, so you should enlighten me and the rest of us.

The dichotomous part is just a general observation. For instance, just a few posts ago you indicated that people who post something gruff here either have to be that way in real life or that they are fulfilling a fantasy. I believe you used the term "pathetic" to describe those people, which could only fall into those two categories. I was simply pointing out that making black and white comments like that (which are clearly wrong) isn't going to help folks take you seriously.

Ok. I saw it.

 

[LAPsyGuy]

Back to real life! Hope to jump back on when things slow later this month. Be well.

 

[WisNeuro]

I think the take-away is that the VA is a pretty chill place to work cause you have time to monitor SDN for large parts of the day to help clueless youth.

Oh man, you have no idea! Also, the good starting salary and pretty sweet benefits!

 

[erg923]

why are we always being congratulated for not caring?

 

[WisNeuro]

why are we always being congratulated for not caring?

Honestly, I think it's because we care too much.

 

[Peacemaker36]

As a relative newcomer, one thing that has stood out for me is when people who support freestanding professional schools are accused of being recruiters. Does anyone have actual knowledge about that? Because if there is no evidence then it's not a helpful comment; it's certainly dismissive, and it probably could be classified as bullying. On the other hand, if there is evidence then the perpetrator(s) should be booted.

 

[smalltownpsych]

Cyber bullying. OMG
Because Erg is sarcastic and blunt and Wis tends to be just blunt. I have been the victim of Wis's bluntness more than Erg's sarcasm. Mainly when I make a speculative claim which I do tend to do from time to time. I fail to see how any of it is an example of bullying.

 

[WisNeuro]

Cyber bullying. OMG
Because Erg is sarcastic and blunt and Wis tends to be just blunt. I have been the victim of Wis's bluntness more than Erg's sarcasm. Mainly when I make a speculative claim which I do tend to do from time to time. I fail to see how any of it is an example of bullying.

Give me your lunch money. I'll expect it via Paypal by noon. If not, I'll see you at the cyber flagpole after work.

 

[smalltownpsych]

Give me your lunch money. I'll expect it via Paypal by noon. If not, I'll see you at the cyber flagpole after work.

Now that is bullying.
More seriously though, I do work with kids who have been severely bullied and ridiculed. Same stuff as when we were kids: fat, socially awkward, deformity, sexual or gender issues, large breasts, small breasts, short, tall, too smart or too dumb. You name it. Sometimes it happens through social media and texting, sometimes face to face. The medium of delivery is just a media buzz word "cyber bullying" more than some major change in childhood experience. The biggest shift being that the bullies can keep going on the kid at home. Nevertheless, I think it is ridiculous to label differences of opinion and lack of kindness as bullying. By that metric, by just saying that I think an opinion is ridiculous then it is bullying?

 

[cara susanna]

As a relative newcomer, one thing that has stood out for me is when people who support freestanding professional schools are accused of being recruiters. Does anyone have actual knowledge about that? Because if there is no evidence then it's not a helpful comment; it's certainly dismissive, and it probably could be classified as bullying. On the other hand, if there is evidence then the perpetrator(s) should be booted.

This is pretty common across message boards, though. I'm on a musical theatre one where anyone who gives a positive review of a show is called a "shill." Granted, that message board is so mean that I'm afraid to post on it.

 

[Layla Jams]

I'm a lurker. I come around here for one reason: to eat some popcorn and enjoy the show. There are a lot of wannabe Brian Leiter's on this board, but the attempts at "merciless rhetorical spankings" here are to Leiter's what JV is to the NFL. Nonetheless, there's enough acrimony and d-baggery to make for some good popcorn time

 

[CheetahGirl]

eat some popcorn and enjoy the show

Like I said before...Some of us care about the anonymous reputation we try to uphold. Therefore, you won't find me being sacrastic, blunt, or crass unless I can pull it off being witty too...which is usually not.

So I enjoy balancing out the love.

And if SDN has a bad reputation on FB...send me those links. I'll meet them after cyber school and show them who's boss.

 

[PsyDr]

I'm gonna need your popcorn money. Would be a shame if something happened to your emoticon....

 

[Pragma]

I'm a lurker. I come around here for one reason: to eat some popcorn and enjoy the show. There are a lot of wannabe Brian Leiter's on this board, but the attempts at "merciless rhetorical spankings" here are to Leiter's what JV is to the NFL. Nonetheless, there's enough acrimony and d-baggery to make for some good popcorn time

1) I have to admit I had to look Leiter up because never had heard of him.
2) Do you really eat popcorn? Makes for a messy screen/keyboard.
3) Acrimony is a natural reaction to the state of the field as is. Some of us want to promote more conservative admission practices.

 

[CheetahGirl]

I'm gonna need your popcorn money. Would be a shame if something happened to your emoticon....

 

[WisNeuro]

You know, I'm starting to think of this as a business opportunity. Who wants to create a new forum site. We can name it SDNWEIAWANFGH. The "Student Doctor Network Where Everyone Is a Winner and Nobody's Feelings Get Hurt." Who's in?

 

[psych844]

This is reminding me of the trigger warning phenomenon.

 

[Pragma]

We can name it SDNWEIAWANFGH. The "Student Doctor Network Where Everyone Is a Winner and Nobody's Feelings Get Hurt." Who's in?

What is this? A Center for Ants?!!!

Your post made me think of that. Thank you because it was so much better than this thread.

 

[WisNeuro]

Well, I guess we can also use the site to help kids who can't read good, too.

 

[CheetahGirl]

For the Pop-culturally challenged, Figure A

 

[cara susanna]

Only if we acknowledge that even the top SDN posters can't not die in a freak gasoline fight accident.

 

[deleted656923]

I like how we're able to see clear alliances by who "likes" whose posts on this thread Now I know which members to trust and which ones to avoid like the plague.

Also, since we're now doing random emoticons:

 

[Pragma]

I like how we're able to see clear alliances by who "likes" whose posts on this thread Now I know which members to trust and which ones to avoid like the plague.

Also, since we're now doing random emoticons:

Oh come on now. Alliances? We all like orange mocha frappucinos!

 

[WisNeuro]

Alliances? Sweet! This is like a really lame version of Survivor!

 

[cara susanna]

I'd like pretty much anyone's posts if they contained Zoolander quotes. True story.

 

[Layla Jams]

1) I have to admit I had to look Leiter up because never had heard of him.
2) Do you really eat popcorn? Makes for a messy screen/keyboard.
3) Acrimony is a natural reaction to the state of the field as is. Some of us want to promote more conservative admission practices.

1. Leiter is amazeballs. He's not-infrequently a total ass on LR ("Leiter Reports"), but he's incisive as hell (in case you're wondering: hell is very incisive -- as incisive as BL )
2. Yes, I absolutely eat popcorn. Literally. A lot of popcorn. Sometimes it's Pop Secret, but usually Smartfood. I have astonishing powers when it comes to creating no mess even whilst engaging in what are messy activities for ordinary folk.
3. Can't disagree with you on that point. I prefer to play nice (pretty much all the time, in all pretty much all contexts), but I do sometimes have private "oh, honey..." moments during the popcorn-munching. Although, then again, I also have private "dude, wtf? Don't be such an ass all the time" moments during the miraculously immaculate popcorn fest. That's the glory of lurking, I suppose. We lurkers are ALWAYS right. Dance for us, puppets!

So, in a nutshell -- or, shall I say, in a kernel...

Leiter is one cool nerd. He also writes a mean essay, 'specially 'bout Nietzsche
I have a superhuman ability to refrain from making any mess
Both sides in this whole long back-and-forth thread have valid points (told ya I like to play nice)
​

Now, back into the shadows goes this lurker. I don't like to come out from behind them too often, as I tend to get sucked into all things discussion. In fact, I may be popping (get it? popping? hehe) back out soon...while I struggle to return to the dark & tidy shadows of my lurkdom. Moderation is not my forte.

PS what would the order be if these were ranked from best to worst: Neuroskeptic, Mind Hacks, James Coyne, Neurocritic, Notes from Two Scientific Psychologists

PPS I forgot to mention that I also typically drink root beer (A&W, mostly) when I'm popping some corn and "oh honey..." "dude, wtf..." -ing

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Oh come on now. Alliances? We all like orange mocha frappucinos!

I like coffee...black.

Weirdo.

 

[Pragma]

I like coffee...black.

Weirdo.

All I can say is...

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

The movie that keeps on giving! I'm stoked to see the second one, as the first was so over the top…it actually was funny.

 

[futureapppsy2]

I'd like pretty much anyone's posts if they contained Zoolander quotes. True story.

Zoolander 2 looks so underwhelming, though...

 

[cara susanna]

Zoolander 2 looks so underwhelming, though...

I think that it looks terrible. Zoolander is one of my favorite movies, so it saddens me.

 

[futureapppsy2]

I think that it looks terrible. Zoolander is one of my favorite movies, so it saddens me.

Mte. You just can't sequel comedy well, IMO. Pitch Perfect 2 was so disappointing...

 

[bmedclinic]

Minneapolis, great city.

did sleep conf there a few years ago (2011) I was surprised by how much I liked it. But that was "summer" there. Brrrr..

 

[bmedclinic]

Two more things:
1) I'm doing a CE talk this week on sleep disorders, in case anyone wants me to bring that show to our possible conference for CE credits.
2) I dont know that my feels have ever gotten hurt on here. For those going into psychology that get their feels hurt easily, gotta say, uh, maybe not the right field for you. I personally expect psychologists to be emotionally competent, but also tough. If you cant handle it, do something else. I'm not saying people should be rude, but I rarely see outright rude behavior on here. True, annoyance when the same foolish topics come up, but not people being rude. I think maybe, just maybe people on the other keybards (correctly) identify that as sarcasm and either chuckle or move along.

 

[clinpsyc87]

Why do people act like anyone is trying to censor anyone? The hallmark of Socratic debate is civility and respect, and we have calmly requested others hold themselves to the standards of professionalism and etiquette characteristic to the dialogue of scholars. I find myself in more productive debate on Reddit

 

[WisNeuro]

Many of us see no problem with the standards of professionalism seen here. And, etiquette is highly subjective.

 

[smalltownpsych]

Why do people act like anyone is trying to censor anyone? The hallmark of Socratic debate is civility and respect, and we have calmly requested others hold themselves to the standards of professionalism and etiquette characteristic to the dialogue of scholars. I find myself in more productive debate on Reddit

Since you mentioned professional standards, are you actually in a mud/fud program (aka PTSP) or is that an inaccurate representation of your status?

 

[cara susanna]

Why do people act like anyone is trying to censor anyone? The hallmark of Socratic debate is civility and respect, and we have calmly requested others hold themselves to the standards of professionalism and etiquette characteristic to the dialogue of scholars. I find myself in more productive debate on Reddit

Can I ask for examples of debates here that you found uncivil and disrespectful?

 

[Pragma]

Haven't seen the thread. I shouldn't be here. Currently in crunch mode so looking for last ditch procrastination methods However, the problem is clearly and irrefutably millennials who can't handle their !#!!@# and think that freedom of speech shouldn't be allowed.

http://www.breitbart.com/tech/2015/11/23/study-40-of-millennials-oppose-offensive-free-speech/

I couldn't resist

 

[erg923]

Can I ask for examples of debates here that you found uncivil and disrespectful?

I once told someone to "calm down." I also call some people's advice "terrible or "silly."

I'm sure much crying was to be had.

 

[MCParent]

Haven't seen the thread. I shouldn't be here. Currently in crunch mode so looking for last ditch procrastination methods However, the problem is clearly and irrefutably millennials who can't handle their !#!!@# and think that freedom of speech shouldn't be allowed.

http://www.breitbart.com/tech/2015/11/23/study-40-of-millennials-oppose-offensive-free-speech/

Agree.

This is A Thing in politics, called the "horseshoe theory." As in, the ends of the horseshoe bend ever nearer.

Everyone is in favor of free speech for speech they agree with; you're only in favor of it if you're in favor of it for speech you disagree with. The lack of critical thinking abilities among college students now is mind-blowing.

 

[erg923]

Agree.

This is A Thing in politics, called the "horseshoe theory." As in, the ends of the horseshoe bend ever nearer.

Everyone is in favor of free speech for speech they agree with; you're only in favor of it if you're in favor of it for speech you disagree with. The lack of critical thinking abilities among college students now is mind-blowing.

I am hopeful, and fairly confident, that we would all agree that such a nonsensical lack of tolerance for speech (or images) that you don't agree with is not something we want SDN to turn into.

I rather like the heated debates highlighted by some frustration and sarcasm, humor, and defensive mechanisms on both sides. Its the real world. Its good for ya.