MD Canadian applicant, limited financially

[medorded]

I'm applying this year and was wondering if my outlook is bright for this year. Due to the expense of applying + flights etc. I'm not sure that I can apply, at least to as many schools, next year. I'm applying to Canadian schools as well, but wanted to increase my chances and would have nothing against practicing in the US.

Stats:
cGPA=3.93 sGPA=3.98 MCAT 11P/10V/12B

ECs:
Shadowing ~80hrs
2 years of summer research
Various sports, not at a competitive level
Tutoring (4-5 hrs/week for 4 years)
TAing several courses throughout undergrad
Several volunteer positions helping underprivileged kids
Several competitive scholarships
Playing in a band, frequent local shows
Other brief (6-8 month) minimum wage type jobs

School list:

Michigan State
Case Western
Dartmouth
New York U
Oakland
Rosalind
Wayne State
Virginia Commonwealth
Tufts
Georgetown
George Washington
Einstein

Thanks!

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[GrapesofRath]

Invest in MSAR and check schools that take internationals(62 do, I don't know if you did this already)

33 is on the somewhat lower side of things for Canadian applicants coming to the US. It has been done before but you would want to have a broad list of realistic schools. Given you are in a situation where you can't spend too much, I'm not sure if focusing your efforts on US schools is the best idea. Your time might just be better spent going all in on Canadian schools(where your stats seem sufficient).

 

[medorded]

Invest in MSAR and check schools that take internationals(62 do, I don't know if you did this already)

33 is on the somewhat lower side of things for Canadian applicants coming to the US. It has been done before but you would want to have a broad list of realistic schools. Given you are in a situation where you can't spend too much, I'm not sure if focusing your efforts on US schools is the best idea. Your time might just be better spent going all in on Canadian schools(where your stats seem sufficient).

These schools have all been confirmed to accept Canadians. I'm applying to every Canadian school that I make the cutoffs for. There aren't very many med schools in Canada, so typically people won't ever skip one that they are eligible for. Most people will be able to apply to ~8-10 at most, and since it's just as difficult to get in to each individual school, it's that much harder when you're so limited by the number of schools. That's why I'm applying to the US.

 

[GrapesofRath]

Well check to see how many internationals the schools that accept take and if they have taken any recently. Both of these important

Check out schools where your mcat is at or above a schools median. Oakland and VCU are the types of schools that fit that description. Einstein Case and NYU and those types do not

 

[NewHorizons]

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[medorded]

Hello there!

Did you already submit primaries? You may still be ok just because your GPA and MCAT is more competitive. If you really want to increase your chances the best is to just apply early... would you consider applying next year to save finances? Try to get into a Canadian school in the meantime?

What is your residing province? How many times have you tried? Good luck though man and best wishes.

Yup I'm expecting to get verified any day now. I was basically wondering if it seems like I'd be more likely than not to get a few interviews. This is my first year applying (just graduated) and I've applied to Canadian schools too, Ontario resident.

As for the schools I chose @GrapesofRath , I'm only slightly below the medians for those schools you pointed out, is that really enough to warrant not submitting secondaries? It would save a chunk of change if my outlook is bleak with those 3. For the others I'm at or above median I believe, just checked MSAR.

 

[WedgeDawg]

Yup I'm expecting to get verified any day now. I was basically wondering if it seems like I'd be more likely than not to get a few interviews. This is my first year applying (just graduated) and I've applied to Canadian schools too, Ontario resident.

As for the schools I chose @GrapesofRath , I'm only slightly below the medians for those schools you pointed out, is that really enough to warrant not submitting secondaries? It would save a chunk of change if my outlook is bleak with those 3. For the others I'm at or above median I believe, just checked MSAR.

I do not have much experience with this personally, but my understanding is with international applicants, "slightly below median" is equivalent to effectively DOA. Look at it from their perspective - what incentive do they have to admit a below median international applicant (even from Canada) when they have thousands of above median domestic applicants?

 

[WedgeDawg]

Is his GPA and MCAT really below the median? I had friends get in to the US with lower stats than this guy here. Not to diminish the calibre of US students getting into these programs... but when I see people with <3.5 or <30 MCATs asking if they have a chance and people being encouraging.... then I think to the people in ON that pretty much get laughed if they want to get into any med school in Canada if their GPA is <3.9..... I just don't get it. That said, most of my friends that did get into the US applied immediately to the second. My one friend had 3.90 and a 39 MCAT got into Columbia and was rejected at the UofA.

Maybe this is my ignorance on the topic since I'm not as familiar with applying in the US, but in Canada pretty much everyone that applies have <3.8 GPAs. As an out of province applicant you need a minimum of 33 on the MCAT to not get screened out. That said, Canadian schools do allow students to remove their weakest year if they have 4+ years of education from the calculations, which may explain the higher GPA. Some schools only look at the most recent years etc... eh maybe I'm getting too worked up over this.

The difference in GPA calculation between US and Canada (which are elucidated in the "you Americans have it easy" thread in pre-allo) explains this discrepancy. As for MCAT, 33 is below median for Case, Dartmouth, NYU, and Einstein, which are 36, 34, 37, 34, respectively. OP would be competitive for the rest of the schools on their list, provided these schools all accept international applicants.

 

[NewHorizons]

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[medorded]

I do not have much experience with this personally, but my understanding is with international applicants, "slightly below median" is equivalent to effectively DOA. Look at it from their perspective - what incentive do they have to admit a below median international applicant (even from Canada) when they have thousands of above median domestic applicants?

Thanks, that makes sense. Can anyone else confirm how bad it is for internationals just below median (just because you're not 100% certain Wedge)? Would I at least have a decent shot at Dartmouth and Einstein (only 1 below on MCAT) and maybe drop Case Western and NYU?

 

[WedgeDawg]

Thanks, that makes sense. Can anyone else confirm how bad it is for internationals just below median (just because you're not 100% certain Wedge)? Would I at least have a decent shot at Dartmouth and Einstein (only 1 below on MCAT) and maybe drop Case Western and NYU?

I think you're okay leaving, Einstein in there (make absolutely sure through MSAR that they 1) accept internationals and 2) don't have extremely low interview and matriculation rates for internationals), Dartmouth is a toss-up, but I would recommend no (this would be the best place to get others' opinions), and dropping Case and NYU for sure.

That's very fair and that alone may explain all the difference. Sometimes I wonder though for those who do screw up a year really badly, or turn things around. In the US they may have to try a post-bacc, but in Canada they may not have to... does the extra schooling really make a difference or do you feel that it one can prove themselves without having to do it... this is more philosophically speaking. I find the similarities and differences very interesting.

I think that a post-bac isn't for someone who messes up one year and does well the other three. It's more for people who have consistently performed below average (as it pertains to medical school admissions). It's rare that people with GPAs above a 3.5 are advised to pursue postbac work. If we draw a parallel to Canada (with the assumption of one year is dropped), someone with a 3.3, 3.9, 3.8, 3.9 would have a high 3.8 GPA in Canada and a 3.7 in the US. Both of these GPAs are absolutely fine and no postbac work would be recommended. A more likely applicant to be advised to pursue postbac work is someone with a 3.3, 3.2, 3.4, 3.7 for a 3.4 overall. The Canadian system (even dropping two years) wouldn't save this person either.

 

[NewHorizons]

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[NewHorizons]

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[medorded]

Anyone else have any input?

 

[GrapesofRath]

WedgeDawg said it all there. What I'll add is don't just look for schools that take internationals; there are some that take very few or those who haven't taken in a couple years. Those are obviously much less optimal.

The schools with 33 median MCATs and under have to be your target. If you really want to spend time on schools with 35+ median averages(Einstein Case etc) go ahead but you need a good thorough list of 33 median or lower MCAT schools.