Chance Me Honestly Please

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
R

RU1992

Full Member
10+ Year Member
Joined
Apr 20, 2012
Messages
593
Reaction score
1
Hey everyone. I'd really appreciate your insight on if I stand a realistic chance this cycle. I'm getting nervous with all these interview invites going out. I had asked this before, but a few things have changed since then. An honest, even harsh, critique please. (Selected African American ethnicity)

GPA: 3.68 and 3.58 (overall and science)- AADSAS gpa
DAT: AA:19 TS:18 PA:14 BIO:17 OC:20 GC:20 RC:20 QR:19

2nd batch- Applied to UMDNJ, Temple, Detroit Mercy, NYU, VCU, Marquette, Howard, Meharry, Western, Case, Oklahoma, Arizona, Midwestern AZ/IL, Coloardo, Iowa, Kentucky, Louisville, Boston, Minnesota, Nova (All supplementaries done and fees paid)

Extra Curricular: Shadow a general dentist, did summer program at UMDNJ, work at a hospital, research at UMDNJ, a lot of leadership experience on campus, volunteer experience, 3 year Biology graduate from Rutgers. Thanks!
Members don't see this ad.
 
I don't think you'll get any interviews because of your PAT score of 14. Retake DAT. GPA, ECs seem fine.
 
Thanks for your response! But from the ranges in the ADEA 2012 book, it seems that a bunch of schools took a score of 14 on the PAT section. Isn't that realistic?
 
Members don't see this ad :)
Although a 14 on the PA is like 15th percentile, I have seen schools accept students with that low of a score. However, they may have had other stats/EC to compensate for the horrible pat score.
 
I'm not sure, but check the schools if they accept a PAT of 14. Numerous schools accept a minimum of 17 on the DAT, but I don't remember if they were referring to all DAT sections or if it w as the AA.
 
Thanks for the response... In your opinion, do you think my statistics can compensate for the PAT score? By the way, of the schools I applied to, 9/21 took a student with a 14 PAT score in last year's entering class.
 
@Blue: I already checked the schools I applied to, and all of the ones that I applied to do not have a strict cutoff of a certain score. Except Howard, but they tend to ignore their cutoff based on last year's statistics...
 
RU1992 said:
Thanks for the response... In your opinion, do you think my statistics can compensate for the PAT score? By the way, of the schools I applied to, 9/21 took a student with a 14 PAT score in last year's entering class.
Click to expand...

The research and leadership exp looks pretty good in my opinion, but I can't guarantee it'll compensate for the pat score.
 
Perhaps consider retaking the DAT? I think if you retake it and can up your PAT score, and let all of your schools know that you are taking it again, it might help :)
 
Because you are an URM, exceptions might be made for PAT. There is no clear cut answer about your chances. I think you have a decent shot at some of those schools. Best of luck! Let us know how it goes for ya!
 
Last edited:
RU1992 said:
Hey everyone. I'd really appreciate your insight on if I stand a realistic chance this cycle. I'm getting nervous with all these interview invites going out. I had asked this before, but a few things have changed since then. An honest, even harsh, critique please. (Selected African American ethnicity)

GPA: 3.68 and 3.58 (overall and science)- AADSAS gpa
DAT: AA:19 TS:18 PA:14 BIO:17 OC:20 GC:20 RC:20 QR:19

2nd batch- Applied to UMDNJ, Temple, Detroit Mercy, NYU, VCU, Marquette, Howard, Meharry, Western, Case, Oklahoma, Arizona, Midwestern AZ/IL, Coloardo, Iowa, Kentucky, Louisville, Boston, Minnesota, Nova (All supplementaries done and fees paid)

Extra Curricular: Shadow a general dentist, did summer program at UMDNJ, work at a hospital, research at UMDNJ, a lot of leadership experience on campus, volunteer experience, 3 year Biology graduate from Rutgers. Thanks!
Click to expand...
You're an URM with those stats? Congratulations. You most likely will be admitted to Howard and Meharry.
 
DoeAdeer said:
You're an URM with those stats? Congratulations. You most likely will be admitted to Howard and Meharry.
Click to expand...

If DoeAdeer thinks you are going to be admitted, then you are in for SURE ^_^
 
Last edited:
Haha but to be honest though, I'd prefer to go ANYWHERE other than those two schools. DoeAdeer, or anyone else, do you think I stand a chance at any other schools on this list? If so, which ones? Thanks for all the input guys!
 
Members don't see this ad :)
Sounds like you are looking for someone to sat yes you have a chance and anyone who doesn't say that you have an excuse to contradict them. Nobody can tell you for sure and since you've already applied you'll find out soon enough. Just because a school took someone with a 14 PAT doesn't mean that same person didn't have a 24+ in every other subject with a 4.0, not likely but something counteracted it. Good luck though, we'll all need it.
 
RU1992 said:
Haha but to be honest though, I'd prefer to go ANYWHERE other than those two schools. DoeAdeer, or anyone else, do you think I stand a chance at any other schools on this list? If so, which ones? Thanks for all the input guys!
Click to expand...
I wouldn't be surprised if you got rejected from all of them besides Howard and Meharry.
 
RU1992 said:
@Blue: I already checked the schools I applied to, and all of the ones that I applied to do not have a strict cutoff of a certain score. Except Howard, but they tend to ignore their cutoff based on last year's statistics...
Click to expand...
Alrighty, just remember that those who got into dental school with a PAT of 14 may have been very exceptional somewhere else in their application. I'm not sure though, but you might have a chance. My biggest concern is your PAT and Bio scores. They are pretty low especially the PAT. I would think that the PAT is one of the most important scores because you will need to have good hand-eye coordination as a dentist. I can imagine that dental schools use your PAT as an assessment if you are fit for dentistry. I would recommend retaking your DAT to raise your PAT, but just make sure that you do even better on your OC, GC, and RC since you got 20's. :)
 
If all else fails retake the DAT, with a higher PAT your options of schools will be vastly improved. In my humble opinion the PAT is the easiest section of the DAT to study for and you could literally improve your score dramatically with 3-4 days of studying maybe even less...

Best of luck.
 
Thank you all for the input. I'm not trying to make "excuses", as you put it, I simply said one thing regarding schools taking a 14 PAT score in the past. I just wanted an honest opinion. And in regards to the PAT section determining if you're fit for dentistry, I don't think that's necessarily true. It's way more important to be able to deal with patients in a vast array of settings. I don't think the PAT can even give a fair assessment of your hand-eye coordination, as you put it, as folding patterns on paper and determining what kind of hole something will fit through seems very irrelevant in that regard. And I did study for the PAT, it's just my score didn't reflect that and the study materials I used weren't adequate for that section. But you guys are right in regards to improving my PAT score if all else fails, since that would broaden my list of schools. I just don't know if I should accept Meharry or Howard or retake the DAT and apply next cycle. I'm not sure if these schools would limit my job hunt in the future or even impact my salary. Any take on that? Thank you guys again!
 
Yeah standardized tests aren't exactly good predictors of much besides how much effort you put into them. A 30 AA just means your smart (very smart even with a sprinkling of genius) but not necessarily that you'll be the best dentist ever!

OP, your chances are not great in most places thanks to the DAT issues your already well aware of. A retake would be helpful, but perhaps not necessary. The URM status is going to help you plenty and like DoAdeer said your almost guaranteed a seat in Meharry and Howard. Even if Meharry and Howard aren't your favorite, if they get you to become a dentist, I'd be happy enough with them! The rest you applied to shouldn't be too offended by that PAT, but frankly you wouldn't be the most sought after candidate. I say that with no malice in my heart,I just want to be honest. I wish you the best of luck!
 
I completely agree with your point! And I really appreciate your sincere advice. Which schools other than Meharry/Howard do you think won't be "too offended by my PAT" and I maybe stand a chance at? And honestly, if a retake isn't necessary and I can get in somewhere with these scores, I'll just go with it. Because I can't retake until October, and by then, I'd be looking at next cycle anyways.
 
i mean...you'll def get interviews based off of the URM status. but if you don't, you'll know it was bc of that PAT
 
:/ stupid PA section... Which schools do you think I have the best shot of getting interviewed at, in your opinion?
 
RU1992 said:
:/ stupid PA section... Which schools do you think I have the best shot of getting interviewed at, in your opinion?
Click to expand...

dude, i honestly have no idea. neither myself nor any of the sdn pre-dents/dental students/dentists can give you a realistic answer. we can only go by the adea book, to be honest. there's much more to the process than gpa/dat ranges presented in a book. no one really knows how the adcom goes about application reviews. for all we know, maybe they do the "stair" test with our applications...or maybe they pin our apps to a board and throw darts at them to see which one's they pick lol. all joking aside though, i'm not really sure how the application cycle works for URMs. my guess...all the schools you applied to might give you a shot? you're a "minority" with a high gpa. you'll be fine.

just chill out and stop fretting over it. the process is out of your hands. just sit back, enjoy what's left of the summer. be vigilant around this time next month bc that's when the ball really starts rolling.

i'm on edge myself, as interviews for nova and nyu have gone out. but i try to enjoy my days without refreshing my e-mail every 10 mins :)
 
Last edited:
Haha I guess everyone is freaking out on here so it carries over. I need to block this site somehow! But yeah, a few schools started sending out interview invites so that's what had me thinking in the first place. I was okay until then! I hope we'll both be fine...
PS: I hope my application is the biggest one on the dartboard ;)
 
RU1992 said:
Haha I guess everyone is freaking out on here so it carries over. I need to block this site somehow! But yeah, a few schools started sending out interview invites so that's what had me thinking in the first place. I was okay until then! I hope we'll both be fine...
PS: I hope my application is the biggest one on the dartboard ;)
Click to expand...

yeah, i completely understand. this whole process sucks.
 
RU1992 said:
Hey everyone. I'd really appreciate your insight on if I stand a realistic chance this cycle. I'm getting nervous with all these interview invites going out. I had asked this before, but a few things have changed since then. An honest, even harsh, critique please. (Selected African American ethnicity)

GPA: 3.68 and 3.58 (overall and science)- AADSAS gpa
DAT: AA:19 TS:18 PA:14 BIO:17 OC:20 GC:20 RC:20 QR:19

2nd batch- Applied to UMDNJ, Temple, Detroit Mercy, NYU, VCU, Marquette, Howard, Meharry, Western, Case, Oklahoma, Arizona, Midwestern AZ/IL, Coloardo, Iowa, Kentucky, Louisville, Boston, Minnesota, Nova (All supplementaries done and fees paid)

Extra Curricular: Shadow a general dentist, did summer program at UMDNJ, work at a hospital, research at UMDNJ, a lot of leadership experience on campus, volunteer experience, 3 year Biology graduate from Rutgers. Thanks!
Click to expand...

You will have no problem getting interviews. One low score on the DAT won't ruin your chances. Will SOME exclude you based on that? Maybe, but the majority will look beyond it to your other qualifications.

Bottom line is that you have a good GPA with a 19, and are a URM. Enough said.
 
You really think so GolfGuy? Do you know any one that was in a similar situation as me or what are you basing it on? Thank you so much for your input by the way! Means a lot...
 
RU1992, seems like you want an answer right now about which schools you should be expecting...no one knows!

have patience my friend! That is all we can do at this point!
 
diene said:
RU1992, seems like you want an answer right now about which schools you should be expecting...no one knows!

have patience my friend! That is all we can do at this point!
Click to expand...


Agreed. Everything on SDN is speculation and I think saw a similar post a while back from you as well.

If you really want a more valid answer, I would call up a school and ask.


What I would do: I would definitely retake with the 14PA and 18TS. Even if you got an above average GPA, most school use the DAT is hedge against the grade inflation. Retake and if you score really well (even though it's late in the cycle), you can probably still make it.

keep your head up bud.
 
The thing is, retaking it at the earliest would be in October. By the time the schools receive the scores, I'd be into next cycle anyways so I don't think it'd be worth it to retake it if I can still get interviews/acceptances somewhere. Unless getting a job and your salary as a general dentist depends on the dental school you graduate from? Is that true?
 
RU1992 said:
The thing is, retaking it at the earliest would be in October. By the time the schools receive the scores, I'd be into next cycle anyways so I don't think it'd be worth it to retake it if I can still get interviews/acceptances somewhere. Unless getting a job and your salary as a general dentist depends on the dental school you graduate from? Is that true?
Click to expand...

I don't think that's true. Whatever schools you come out from, it will all come down to you as a dentist. Do you show passion about the profession? How is your experience with patitents while in dental school? How are your skills? Are you truly compassionate about improving yourself in the field? That sort of things determines yourself as a dentist, not the school you're from. We have about 61 dental schools in the US, and I wholeheartedlly believe that each and every one of those schools have world class standards and provide a superb education to their prospective students. So the first step right now is not to fret about how you are going to get a job after graduation. The first step right now is to get into ONE dental school, no matter what.
 
And remember, with a decent board of stats, you don't get to pick the schools. The schools choose you, if you're lucky.
 
Always remember, you can't get into a school that you don't apply to. Be believing, be happy, don't get discourage. Things will work out.
 
I completely agree with your comments and I appreciate your input. All I meant by my comment was that, if Howard and Meharry put me at a disadvantage when searching for a job or earning a higher salary, then I would have a plan in mind if they were the only schools to accept me. On the other hand, I understand exactly what you're saying and whole heartedly agree that the school you go to or even your stats don't make you a better dentist or interact better with patients. That's a whole different ballgame.
 
Go where you get it. Don't be so picky as to skip an acceptance just to wait another year. You are Dr.____ no matter where you go. I shadowed a dentist from Howard and he is a beast at clinic. He opened the first African American owned dental office in Austin, TX. If you feel self-conscious... definitely retake it. PAT is more valued than you think. The dental student makes himself a good dentist..the school just provides the platform to do so. Just my 2 cents. Good blessings on everything.
 
mtinamer said:
I don't think that's true. Whatever schools you come out from, it will all come down to you as a dentist. Do you show passion about the profession? How is your experience with patitents while in dental school? How are your skills? Are you truly compassionate about improving yourself in the field? That sort of things determines yourself as a dentist, not the school you're from. We have about 61 dental schools in the US, and I wholeheartedlly believe that each and every one of those schools have world class standards and provide a superb education to their prospective students. So the first step right now is not to fret about how you are going to get a job after graduation. The first step right now is to get into ONE dental school, no matter what.
Click to expand...

:thumbup:
 
an OMFS that i shadowed went to northwestern. where is this school now? it doesn't exist anymore. what is he doing now? making a good living for himself and providing excellent care.

as long as you get into a dental school, you'll be o.k.
 
DocToothache had a compilation where he lists how important each school ranks certain sections of PAT. I'm going to try to find it and let you know. (either editing this post or PMing you the link).

EDIT: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=657139

There you go. No schools says PAT is unimportant but some of them care less about PAT than others. Seems like most of your schools fit the bill. Also if you do retake in Oct, you can still apply that score to this cycle. It would certainly be late, but not necessarily TOO LATE.
 
@neosmiles and predent: I completely agree with what you're saying. All dental schools are going to get you your degree and allow you to make a good living. I was just trying to see if one school would give me a better opportunity than another at getting a job or a higher salary, but based on what you guys are saying, all the schools are going to put me in the same direction I guess. As long as I get into a dental school, I think I'll just go wherever I get in.
@usha: Thanks for the file! I actually took a look at this before I applied to the schools and picked the schools based on this and on their DAT ranges. Yeah, most of the schools on my list seem to care a little bit less about the PAT than the other sections which kind of gives me a better shot. I hope at least. And I don't really think a score being released early November would really give me a solid shot this cycle, and I also don't think I can be well prepared during the semester as well to be honest with you. I'm not sure at this point :/ it really depends on if any schools contact me by the end of August or early September. I'm not sure if they will though :/
 
Everything looks good except for the 14 PAT score. With that low of a PAT, I believe you may want to consider a retake to be a competitive applicant. Best of luck.:thumbup:
 
Would that one score really hold me back from getting accepted into 1 of 21 schools?
 
A re-take wouldn't hurt, if you could improve. It's fine if you retake a little bit late too. There is still plenty of time for them to receive the new scores.

However, just try to be patient. Some people have received early invites, but just give it time. I got my first 2 interview invites last cycle on August 18th (BU and Creighton), then had 4 more come throughout the fall. I think I was in the 2nd or 3rd mailing batch.
 
So your advice is just to remain patient and go with the scores I already have, as opposed to having the schools wait on a DAT retake which would be at the earliest October 3rd? Is that what you would do in my situation?
 
RU1992 said:
So your advice is just to remain patient and go with the scores I already have, as opposed to having the schools wait on a DAT retake which would be at the earliest October 3rd? Is that what you would do in my situation?
Click to expand...

Actually..a low PAT score could hurt you but I would still apply especially if you plan on retaking it.
 
I'm sorry, but I'm a bit confused. So what exactly would you do? I've already applied to all of these schools and have made no indication that I plan to retake the exam (since I can't take it until October 3 at the earliest and that would put my application on hold until early November). I figured this way, at least I am early in the application cycle. Would you handle the situation differently? Thanks again for all of your help!
 
Last edited:
Just be patient, anything can happen throughout the fall. It's still really early. However, there wouldn't be any harm in letting the schools know you plan on retaking the DAT, signing up for a retake in October and studying for a retake for the next few months. Worst case scenario: you don't get in this cycle, but you would still have (hopefully) improved scores for next cycle.
 
preDENT1210 said:
an OMFS that i shadowed went to northwestern. where is this school now? it doesn't exist anymore. what is he doing now? making a good living for himself and providing excellent care.

as long as you get into a dental school, you'll be o.k.
Click to expand...


Your main point is that the dental school you go to doesn't really matter, because you'll be a dentist at the end, which is true. However, the example about Northwestern is a bad example. Northwestern was regarded as one of the better dental schools when it was around.
 
So if what you guys are saying holds true, what distinguishes a Harvard dental school graduate from a Howard one?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Next unread thread

Similar threads

B
chance to get off the waitlist (deleted)
Replies
2
Views
365
btou113
B
Amani Sniknej
Chance Me. Late Applicant
Replies
6
Views
754
Mr.Smile12
Mr.Smile12
3
Chance me please
Replies
4
Views
2K
Mr.Smile12
Mr.Smile12
Dr.dentist.dds
CHANCE ME PLEASE!!
Replies
17
Views
2K
Mr.Smile12
Mr.Smile12
S
What is my chance to get off waitlist?
Replies
6
Views
850
macsak
M
Top