MD Chances ? 3.7 cGPA 3.65 sGPA 509 MCAT (low CARS)

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Em4234

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International citizen + very low CARS+ stats that are clearly below average for Canadian applicants who get into US schools= almost zero chance at MD. Out of the 14 DO schools that take internationals you might be competitive for them depending on other factors.
 
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I see a lot of schools that consider Canadians in the same pool as US citizens (Georgetown, GW, etc) and the whole point of not having a cut off is to read an application as a whole ! I dont think having one set back = 0 chance of getting in ! my application is pretty good in other areas (LOR, ECs and equivalent of (12, 7, 12, 12 MCAT) Ive got these scores twice which shows I didn just get lucky (on top of a 4.0 GPA taking 13 courses in last academic year !).
Beside a 509 is equivalent to 30- 32 which is a good score I believe.
Well I cant apply to DO becuz I dunt meet the English requirements yet (2 courses) but thanks for your input :)
International applicants are not the same as domestic applicants (even at the schools that consider them).
Using your examples: GW matriculated only 5 of 624 international applicants, GT 3/642.

We are looking at an MCAT of 509 as the equivalent of a 30; not a bad score, but not competitive for an international applicant unless you have something you are not sharing. 3 MCAT's is not a plus, either.

There are 62 med schools that consider international applicants.
Eliminate those that took less than 4.
Apply to those remaining with a median MCAT near 30.
If there are an insufficient number, consider the DO schools that have taken internationals.
 
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What do you guys suggest someone (ESL) with a low verbal do then ? Just give up ! I wanted to attend SMP and most of them said my GPA is too high (GT specifically told me that) and its a waste of time since I am already a strong applicant :( I guess someone with low verbal should consider Caribbean schools then ! There is something you can do for any short comings but VB ! low GPA = SMP weak ECs = take a gap year Low verbal = do not go to Med school :( its just sad ! Well Imma apply and hope for the best I guess

Thanks for sharing your opinion guys :)

Whatever you do do not consider what's in the bold.

You can potentially be a competitive applicant for the DO schools that take internationals.
 
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Thanks ... 4 years of hard work taking full course load and maintaining a good GPA + working for financial reasons + tons of ECs + 90% percentile in science sections of MCAT and still not good enuf for any schools cuz of VB :( it's heart breaking

Hey there man,

If you don't mind considering a longer term investment, start reading and reflecting on what you read and practice CARS only for at least a year. I was reading fervently on many things ranging from ethics, humanities, public health, health advocacy/policy etc. I was unsuccessful with a 8 VR and a bad interview my first time. I applied and got in the year I finished my degree two years later (long roller coaster journey filled with emotion, getting rejected initially, brought back for an interview, getting in etc) and it was well worth it. I improved as a better person, critical and holistic thinker. My VR improved as a bonus from 8 to 11 during that time. (EDIT: mistaken score, my apologies, fixed now)

I'm ESL too so I totally get it, but we can't use that as an excuse. We just have to keep pushing forward and do our best to improve our chances. Giving up means that you won't succeed with certainty.

Best wishes,
 
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Hey there man,

If you don't mind considering a longer term investment, start reading and reflecting on what you read and practice CARS only for at least a year. I was reading fervently on many things ranging from ethics, humanities, public health, health advocacy/policy etc. I was unsuccessful with a 8 VR and a bad interview my first time. I applied and got in the year I finished my degree two years later (long roller coaster journey filled with emotion, getting rejected initially, brought back for an interview, getting in etc) and it was well worth it. I improved as a better person, critical and holistic thinker. My VR improved as a bonus from 8 to 12 during that time.

I'm ESL too so I totally get it, but we can't use that as an excuse. We just have to keep pushing forward and do our best to improve our chances. Giving up means that you won't succeed with certainty.

Best wishes,
Thank you for your kind words. I know that being an ESL is not a good excuse but do you really think taking the mcat for the 4th time is wise ? Most medical schools suggest you not to :( I dunt mind applying next year and re-taking the MCAT. At this point I just dunno wat to do... Maybe I should apply for masters and re-apply in a couple of years ...
 
Thank you for your kind words. I know that being an ESL is not a good excuse but do you really think taking the mcat for the 4th time is wise ? Most medical schools suggest you not to :( I dunt mind applying next year and re-taking the MCAT. At this point I just dunno wat to do... Maybe I should apply for masters and re-apply in a couple of years ...

It's not ideal and I would definitely NOT do it unless I can improve at least 2 points with reasonable expectations.

To give you an idea, I wrote it 5 times. Once I bombed with a 25. Then in my youthful zeal + stupidity I wrote it three times in one year but got the same score three times. I took a break from writing it since I saw no improvements but decided that an 8 VR in Canada, even with a decent GPA and strong ECs can be lethal for Canadian MD, so I sucked it up and wrote it for the 5th time after about two years. I got a 32 but my VR changed a lot which was worthwhile (I'm ashamed to say my sciences definitely went down since I didn't prioritize that enough and the science concepts were not as fresh in my mind). Unfortunately I was an idiot and the new score I earned didn't go through admissions and they still used the 31.

In Canada there's no real penalty for writing multiple times... but be careful some schools now limit how many times you can write the exam (ex. USask say applicants can only write a max of 5 times ... they may have changed that number).

For the US though doing it multiple times with little to no improvement hurts you more than it helps. You need to make a hard decision and commit only when you develop a strategy and demonstrate growth.
 
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It's not ideal and I would definitely NOT do it unless I can improve at least 2 points with reasonable expectations.

To give you an idea, I wrote it 5 times. Once I bombed with a 25. Then in my youthful zeal + stupidity I wrote it three times in one year but got the same score of 31 three times. I took a break from writing it since I saw no improvements but decided that an 8 VR in Canada, even with a decent GPA and strong ECs can be lethal for Canadian MD, so I sucked it up and wrote it for the 5th time after about two years. I got a 32 but my VR changed a lot which was worthwhile (I'm ashamed to say my sciences definitely went down since I didn't prioritize that enough and the science concepts were not as fresh in my mind).

In Canada there's no real penalty for writing multiple times... but be careful some schools now limit how many times you can write the exam (ex. USask say applicants can only write a max of 5 times ... they may have changed that number).

For the US though doing it multiple times with little to no improvement hurts you more than it helps. You need to make a hard decision and commit only when you develop a strategy and demonstrate growth.
Wow ! You absolutely deserved getting accepted ! I know an adcom in U of T who told me the same thing ! To just retake when I am ready and the rest of my app is pretty solid. I have alrdy applied to US med schools if I didn get in I will def work hard on my CARS re-write get a masters degree meanwhile to further improve my GPA and apply in Canada. Hearing success stories like yours is truly inspiring thanks for sharing man I feel much better now! Wish you all the best in your studies :)
 
Wow ! You absolutely deserved getting accepted ! I know an adcom in U of T who told me the same thing ! To just retake when I am ready and the rest of my app is pretty solid. I have alrdy applied to US med schools if I didn get in I will def work hard on my CARS re-write get a masters degree meanwhile to further improve my GPA and apply in Canada. Hearing success stories like yours is truly inspiring thanks for sharing man I feel much better now! Wish you all the best in your studies :)

I'm more active on the Canadian version of this forum. Perhaps you've heard of premed101? I come back here to see if I can help others out ... and I gotta admit it... it's somewhat more entertaining here.

http://forums.premed101.com/

This is what I wrote about course-based and thesis-based masters programs and comparing/contrasting them in the context of Canadian medical school admissions

http://forums.premed101.com/index.php?/topic/86360-course-based-vs-research-based-masters/?p=960539

This is my journey after failing the first time. It was a humbling experience and I wouldn't change it for anything (well less tears wouldn't hurt).

http://forums.premed101.com/index.p...ss-stories-non-trad-style/page-20#entry953358

If you have any other questions, feel free to let me know =D

Take care,
 
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I'm more active on the Canadian version of this forum. Perhaps you've heard of premed101? I come back here to see if I can help others out ... and I gotta admit it... it's somewhat more entertaining here.

http://forums.premed101.com/

This is what I wrote about course-based and thesis-based masters programs and comparing/contrasting them in the context of Canadian medical school admissions

http://forums.premed101.com/index.php?/topic/86360-course-based-vs-research-based-masters/?p=960539

This is my journey after failing the first time. It was a humbling experience and I wouldn't change it for anything (well less tears wouldn't hurt).

http://forums.premed101.com/index.p...ss-stories-non-trad-style/page-20#entry953358

If you have any other questions, feel free to let me know =D

Take care,

EDIT: That said......... writing the exam many times isn't really the best reflection of determination as much as it reflects poor decision making. I definitely did not deserve to get in based on my MCAT. Hard word and determination combined with holistic and critical thinking skills will make you a better thinker. By being humanistic, empathetic, and a person with integrity + compassion you can develop the foundations for "soft" skills to succeed. There are so many times where I hear arrogant posts from various pre-meds across North America and it's such a shame. Remember to focus on doing your best and affecting change around you... that's all you can really ask of yourself anyways.
 
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EDIT: That said......... writing the exam many times isn't really the best reflection of determination as much as it reflects poor decision making. I definitely did not deserve to get in based on my MCAT. Hard word and determination combined with holistic and critical thinking skills will make you a better thinker. By being humanistic, empathetic, and a person with integrity + compassion you can develop the foundations for "soft" skills to succeed. There are so many times where I hear arrogant posts from various pre-meds across North America and it's such a shame. Remember to focus on doing your best and affecting change around you... that's all you can really ask of yourself anyways.

EDIT2: One last thing............... I know you set your sights on the US and more recently posted that you're gonna apply for Canada. You should plan to apply for both CAN and US schools (focus more on DO with your VR stats as an international). You have to cast the net wider (another mistake I made before).
 
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EDIT: That said......... writing the exam many times isn't really the best reflection of determination as much as it reflects poor decision making. I definitely did not deserve to get in based on my MCAT. Hard word and determination combined with holistic and critical thinking skills will make you a better thinker. By being humanistic, empathetic, and a person with integrity + compassion you can develop the foundations for "soft" skills to succeed. There are so many times where I hear arrogant posts from various pre-meds across North America and it's such a shame. Remember to focus on doing your best and affecting change around you... that's all you can really ask of yourself anyways.

Hahaha Loved all your comments def going to read all about your story ! Yeah thats what Ive heard alotta ppl advise you to stay away from SDN cuz of all the negative and discouraging msgs you get (obvsly not everyone is like that) but I welcome any opinion and I know everyone has their own story/abilities. The key is to focus on yourself and think about what to do to improve your chances. I will def keep you posted on my progress its nice to talk to someone who has gone tro the same experiences.
 
EDIT2: One last thing............... I know you set your sights on the US and more recently posted that you're gonna apply for Canada. You should plan to apply for both CAN and US schools (focus more on DO with your VR stats as an international). You have to cast the net wider (another mistake I made before).
True but I heard that pre-req has to be taken prior to applying for DO schools and I do not have English requirements right now ! I will look into it tomorrow again and see if there are any exceptions. I dunt really see a difference between an MD or DO since you do the same thing anyway and I am not planning to live outside US/Canada
 
Yes, exactly that...go for Plan B, or try a med school in one of the Commonwealth countries (NOT the Caribbean though) and hope that it's possible to practice in Canada, as it will be very hard to practice in the US.

Or take the damn English classes and try DO schools. Alas, mine requires permanent resident status, or citizenship.


What do you guys suggest someone (ESL) with a low verbal do then ? Just give up !
 
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Yes, exactly that...go for Plan B, or try a med school in one of the Commonwealth countries (NOT the Caribbean though) and hope that it's possible to practice in Canada, as it will be very hard to practice in the US.

Or take the damn English classes and try DO schools. Alas, mine requires permanent resident status, or citizenship.
I am taking both English courses this fall. Thank you :) I will look into those.
 
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