Choosing psychiatry: then and now

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DrFrasierCrane

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As September and ERAS draws ever closer, I am still quite confused on which specialty to pursue. I am very interested in psych but go back and forth between a few other specialties.

1. For those of you that felt choosing a specialty was not an easy choice back in 4th year, what ultimately swayed you towards psychiatry? How would your reasoning change if you were to remake your specialty choice today?

2. Similarly, and perhaps more importantly, what misgivings did you have at the time and how legitimate/silly did those concerns turn out to be?

Thank you!

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I would choose it faster now. I have no doubts I chose the right profession. I was considering FM/IM/Psych and ER. I had pretty good scores with excellent LORs for each and I think I would have been happy in ER or psychiatry looking back. I am very happy I didn't do primary care because its become a factory like process.

I went to psychiatry because of lifestyle and because I liked psychiatry. I think I made the right choice because I work very close to a regular work week and live a 'normal' lifestyle. I am about to go into outpatient private practice with a group and it will increase my pay and make my life even easier. I am not someone who lives to work but I do love my work so psychiatry provides me with that balance.

I had misgivings about reputation (stigma), psychologists taking over, low pay, stressful job because of the 'crazy' patients. The stigma is there but its mild. The psychologists, NPs are trying to make inroads but the more I see what they can do, I realize that psychiatrists are the experts in mental health (many people don't get it though). The 'crazy' patients are in every specialty and once you know whats going on, its good to help those who need it.
 
I too would choose it faster now. At first it was hard for me to choose psych over derm/rads/gas, but psych is really the most fun with an excellent lifestyle. How many interns love what they do? I know I do. I'm actually a little disappointed to be a PGY-2, but then I remember I get an extra $1500. I am bribed easily. :)
 
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I was also torn between Psych and EM. At the time I was very concerned about spending my life working in a stigmatized field. It seemed like the biggest deal in the world. However, I had worked in mental health prior to medical school and ultimately I chose the field I was most familiar with (the devil I know vs . . . ). Essentially, it came down to a coin toss (I was back and forth until the last moment).

Looking back I definitely made the right choice. Psychiatry has many faults, but the field is vast and you will be able to do what you enjoy and leave (most of ) the rest.

It's a bit philosophical, and I know you're looking for practical advice, but I'd suggest the following book.

http://www.randomhouse.com/kvpa/gilbert/

The basic idea is that humans are really really bad at predicting what it is that will make us happy. We think we want one thing, and then aren't satisfied when we get it. For one, we've changed by the time we get that thing. Also, you don't really know what that thing is that you think you want until you already have it and by then it's too late!
 
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I am having a difficult time as well choosing what to do. I am really interested in psych and I feel that I have a natural ability to do it (I'm INTJ if that means anything to anyone), but the stigma and low pay are serious considerations. My grades/scores are high enough for any specialty, including derm.

I ask the same thing as what the OP asked. However, I also want to ask what other specialties all of you were considering in addition to psych. I figure those who are in psych may be interested in other fields that offer similar rewards (eg. abstract problem solving). I'm am speaking only to those who chose psych out of personal desire and not because it was easy or some other reason (like some people I know).
 
It is nice to see several people on here who chose psych and love what they do. That is the most important aspect for me: what I choose to apply to in the next few months will determine my life for the next 30 years, and I want to make sure I choose right.

I also have the stats for several competitive specialties, but have been drawn to psych for a variety of reasons.

I'd like to hear what other specialties some of you residents/attendings considered, how you came to your decisions, and if you are happy now where you are at.

I (and I suspect the previous poster and many others) just need that extra boost and encouragement to go with what we most likely already know is right.
 
I considered IM --> heme/onc or ID, as well as combined IM/Psych.

There were a host of factors that helped me make the decision. I knew I could be a fine internist. But I realized I could be a great psychiatrist. Big fish, little pond, as a friend says. If you really dedicate yourself to quality practice, it's very easy to distinguish yourself.

Factors such as lifestyle, variety of the practice settings and hours, intellectually stimulating, and that any tiny bit of research could move the world forward (compared to how much will we really learn about the heart in the next 20 years). Psychotherapy, med management, serving the underserved, varied subspecialty opportunities.
 
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This is a great thread. I'm an MSIV who was recently struggling with the same decision Psych vs IM vs anesthesiology and have now decided to go with Psych. I think the combo of intellectual interest and lifestyle are what helped me make my decision in the end. Good luck to all of you who are still on the fence.
 
i am extremely interested in psych....but i have a different story


my mother is a child psych...my sister is a child psych fellow...im starting my first year of medical school in about 1 month...i have worked with my mom and have always found psych to be absolutely amazing...its just so interesting...i shadowed a derm...a family doctor...anesthesiologist...all of them were cool, but for some reason psych is still the most intellectually stimulating field in my opinion. Granted, i do think i will love medicine and learning about the human body, and i look forward to going on rotations in different fields...if i didnt want to learn about the body, medical school would be hell lol...but in the back of my mind, psychiatry is my favorite so far.

maybe its because i know more about it than any other field? I routinely read up on new research articles (not about psych medications, but on random things regarding behavioral psych and just how people function...look up PsychNews on twitter, its awesome)

so i made a psychiatry interest facebook group for my class a few weeks ago...only 1 person joined lol, but i think in time more people will join and lose their fear of being stigmatized. I mean i totally get the stigma....i hear it, i see it...and honestly..i dnt really care about it anymore. no matter what anyone tells me, nothing is more interesting and worth fixing than the human mind.
so right NOW i like psych and want to do it....but will that preference continue? I dont know...i could end up being a surgeon who knows...
maybe in 4 years ill be joining some of you guys!!
i learned in the past year that no matter what i do, i cant really control life..it just happens....someone here just mentioned they flipped a coin to determine their career....thats insane....but genius
 
Thanks to all those who have replied. It seems there are many med students out there, as I'm sure is the case every year, eager to hear from current residents/attendings. Are there any other psychiatrists who frequent this board who would be so kind as to post their answers to my above questions? It would be MUCH appreciated.
 
I didn't find it a difficult choice, so I initially excluded myself from replying.

My questions entering my clerkship were 1) will I like these patients? and 2) will my medicine go to waste? My wife also was concerned 3) that patients' problems would be too emotionally burdensome.

Answers 1) YES...and I felt that I really was helping people, even starting to "save lives".
2) Not at all...and there were new things to keep on top of--QT intervals, cytochrome p450 interactions, etc...
3) Nope. For the most part, when that double airlock closed behind me, the problems stayed there. Occasionally one does encounter a particularly heart-wrenching situation, but any physician with a human heart will have those from time to time.

Beyond that, I loved working in teams with social workers and nurses, and I soon discovered the contrast in resident lifestyle between psych and my runner-up, Internal Medicine. That was the final nail in that coffin!
 
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Psych vs Primary care for me.

At this point I am glad I chose psych. The only I thing I find myself looking back on is the Marcus Welby ideal of a primary care practice and the ease and flexibility of setting up a PCP practice. In summary I liked psychiatry more and can still open my own practice and deliver the quality of care that no large box store health system can dream of offering.
 
Ah yes, I remember back in 3rd year being very torn between Psych vs. IM (with a subspecialty in heme/onc or endo). I also seriously considered Emergency Medicine.
Now that I'm a resident in Psych, I definitely think that I made the right choice.

Reasons I decided against the IM/heme/onc route:
-I like "bread and butter" psych a lot more than I like "bread and butter" IM, and I've always believed it's best to make sure you'd be happy in the main specialty just in case some circumstance prevents you from going on to fellowship
-At my med school, the IM residents seemed pretty miserable and some of the IM attendings were kind of mean. I think that malignancy is more prevalent in IM than it is in psych.
I've seen lots of people switching from IM/FM to psych, but not nearly as much of the other way around. I suspect that this may in some cases be because it's easier to switch from IM to Psych than vice versa (to switch from IM to psych, you can get credit for doing a PGY-1 in IM and still graduate from a Psych program on time, but you have to start over as an intern if you switch from psych to IM) but it does seem like overall psych people are more satisfied with their jobs than IM people are.
-I felt like I could potentially make more of a positive impact in psych. Psych needs more good med students who have a genuine interest in the specialty and genuinely have compassion for mental illness. There are already plenty of good med students interested in IM.
-In IM, you WILL see a lot of mental illness in your chronic pain patients and such, but you're in a far worse position to actually address their true underlying issue than when you see these patient in a psych context.


Reasons I decided against EM:
-PRESS-GANEY scores! Go ask the folks on the EM forum what they think of press-ganey scores and I bet you'll get an earful. The current trend at many hospitals is to make the
EM departments very focused on "customer satisfaction" even though giving the patient what they want is frequently in conflict with practicing good medicine.
I was at a hospital that did track customer satisfaction for the psych department too :) but at least in psych, people tend to understand intuitively that the patients are not necessarily always in the best position to recognize what help they need.
-The specialty can be tough on the body. Even though I am not THAT old, things like
leaning over somebody to suture and the constant "jumping up and down" aspect of EM aggravated my chronic back pain. The frequent sleep schedule changes are also tough.
-Even though having a lot of days off is great, you may not get to spend as much time with your family if you work nights/weekends/holidays
-Sometimes I think med students don't get a full taste of what the pace in EM is really like (since they usually only carry a few patients at a time and obviously always have backup). It is far different as a resident or an attending, especially if you end up in a solo coverage situation.
-I didn't like the idea of being tied to a hospital. It's nice that in psych you have the option of opening your own office if you want, and it's a realistic option even in the current business climate. Obviously not an option in EM.

Misgivings about psych? I did worry about if I would forget about medicine. We do enough medicine in psych that I don't think that will happen though. Good psychiatrists need to be able to recognize when a general medical condition is masquerading as a psych problem or exacerbating it (Two things you learn fast: Even psych patients get sick with other problems sometimes, and you should never take the ED's word that the patient is "medically cleared").
I love Psych. The patients are really interesting and you have a lot of flexibility in how your practice. It's a good field.
 
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Reasons I decided against EM:
-PRESS-GANEY scores! Go ask the folks on the EM forum what they think of press-ganey scores and I bet you'll get an earful. The current trend at many hospitals is to make the
EM departments very focused on "customer satisfaction" even though giving the patient what they want is frequently in conflict with practicing good medicine.

This. When I was a scribe in an ER before med school, the hospital was VERY focused on these stupid numbers. Customer satisfaction, door to doc time, door to discharge time. Administrators constantly on your back to go faster and improve the numbers. I already worked corporate retail for a bunch of years, I'll pass thanks.

It's not that I don't think you can use objective measures to improve performance. The problem is that you can't just use them blindly...sometimes crap happens and you couldn't have gone any faster. Or, as the hospitalists are finding out, you've already hit your maximum productivity, and they still expect a 10% improvement from last month/year.
 
Honestly I dont think you should let compensation deter you from doing psych. Im a third year and im getting offers that average about $220 for a 40-45 hour work week usually with no call. This is also working 9-5. If you are willing to work harder you can easilty make alot more.
 
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Honestly I dont think you should let compensation deter you from doing psych. Im a third year and im getting offers that average about $220 for a 40-45 hour work week usually with no call. This is also working 9-5. If you are willing to work harder you can easilty make alot more.


wait....did you just say you got offers to make 220k a year working 40-45 hours a week?!!?!?!............i said i loved psych because it was interesting and i like people....but with a starting offer like, holyy hell thats amazing i think im in love
 
Honestly I dont think you should let compensation deter you from doing psych. Im a third year and im getting offers that average about $220 for a 40-45 hour work week usually with no call. This is also working 9-5. If you are willing to work harder you can easilty make alot more.

Are these offers in Boston, or are you looking elsewhere in the country?

As far as my own answer to the question, I just finished my first week of internship so I can't yet answer the question about whether this was the right choice. I went to medical school because I was interested in the brain, and I only considered psychiatry and neurology. For me, the question was, what could I give up? Could I give up seeing seizure patients (I am fascinated by seizures) or could I give up seeing psychotic patients? Like a lot of the other posters, it came down to the "bread and butter" -- I like mood disorders more than movement disorders and schizophrenia perhaps a little more than seizures. Lifestyle factors were more or less equivalent. Neurology residency includes more internal medicine and intensive care, which I tolerated in medical school but did not love. Neurologists have less "stigma" and make somewhat more money in the end. Based on the (many) neurologists I asked about their career choices, they aren't as excited about what they do as psychiatrists are, and the reasons many of them chose neurology over psychiatry are reasons that don't apply to me (eg, "I don't like crazy people," "I need to do procedures," "I need real solid diagnoses with lab tests," etc). I went to the American Academy of Neurology conference in 2010 and had a chance to ask a lot of neurologists to compare their field to psychiatry, if they considered psychiatry, and it was those conversations that ultimately made the difference.

Here's crossing my fingers that psychiatry was the right choice. So far, so good, but as I said, it's only been a week!
 
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wait....did you just say you got offers to make 220k a year working 40-45 hours a week?!!?!?!............i said i loved psych because it was interesting and i like people....but with a starting offer like, holyy hell thats amazing i think im in love

That's about right for starting private sector salary down south as well.
 
these are offers im getting all over the country. A few in the midwest, small cities like Milwaukee. Also a few which are higher on the west coast..
 
kumar28, I'm curious if you've seen any job offers for C/L psych? Any idea, generally, what the pay is like in comparison to general psych practice?
 
these are offers im getting all over the country. A few in the midwest, small cities like Milwaukee. Also a few which are higher on the west coast..

220 for general or for having a fellowship?
also would the location of residency impact salary offers?
 
220 for general or for having a fellowship?
also would the location of residency impact salary offers?

I know someone who left their child fellowship after a year to take a general job for ~$225, 40h/wk, nice group, very limited call, Mid-atlantic suburban town.

These types of offers do not seem uncommon, but can we all hush up about how awesome psych is? I don't need anymore competition for this years' residency spots. Thanks. :D
 
I know someone who left their child fellowship after a year to take a general job for ~$225, 40h/wk, nice group, very limited call, Mid-atlantic suburban town.

These types of offers do not seem uncommon, but can we all hush up about how awesome psych is? I don't need anymore competition for this years' residency spots. Thanks. :D

This is why we generally don't respond to the "what salary can I expect?" posts.... ;)
 
Ha! Sorry guys/gals..i'll try to keep it on the D/L..

to answer pistol pete..i have not had any offers which pertain to C/l..obviously thats not what I want to focus on but im sure someone on the board could help u with that..
 
I know someone who left their child fellowship after a year to take a general job for ~$225, 40h/wk, nice group, very limited call, Mid-atlantic suburban town.

These types of offers do not seem uncommon, but can we all hush up about how awesome psych is? I don't need anymore competition for this years' residency spots. Thanks. :D

dude psychiatry is the worst specialty ever....:cool:
 
dude psychiatry is the worst specialty ever....:cool:

I know. I'm really rethinking my decision. Between the low salaries, the long hours, the heavy call, the violent/stalker patients, the encroachment of psychologists (and psych NP's, ha), the horrible job market, and the endless night shifts, I just don't think I'm cut out for psych. It's too bad, because I really enjoyed it. Oh well, I guess I'll do Path instead...
 
I know someone who left their child fellowship after a year to take a general job for ~$225, 40h/wk, nice group, very limited call, Mid-atlantic suburban town.

These types of offers do not seem uncommon, but can we all hush up about how awesome psych is? I don't need anymore competition for this years' residency spots. Thanks. :D
.

For the hours you work this specialty pay's about midway through the spectrum. I cannot imagine a psychiatrist working 60 hours/week not making a very high salary. The same cannot be said for internists or PCP.
 
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For the hours you work this specialty pay's about midway through the spectrum. I cannot imagine a psychiatrist working 60 hours/week not making a very high salary. The same cannot be said for internists or PCP.

My friend. Not only did you necro a 4 year old thread but you completely missed Digitil's sarcasm.
 
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For me it was psych vs derm vs rads. Sports medicine was a distant 4th.

Hi! I am in the same situation. Broad choices.
Sports medicine / Radio / Psychiatry
This is an old post, so can anyone update us on how they feel now about their previous choices? Thank you so much!
 
Rads is taking a nose dive right now. It is too easy to outsource. Don’t know much about sports medicine, but psych is just as strong as it was when this thread started. I like psych, and so does almost everyone who posts here. Major sampling bias actually. :watching:
 
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