David Newman allegations

[Angry Birds]

true, besides the obvious this could be a reason. I am not sure where else but in FL for arnp's (b/c of the phd) they're allowed to use their title as long as they say the actual job position afterwards
" I am DR SMITH....your nurse practioner"

but then I can't even remember the type of ravioli I had for lunch today.

This is a double scam that these NP's are running. They don't have an MD (Doctor of Medicine) and they use their "PhD" to call themselves doctor. Not only do actual PhD's *NOT* use "Dr" in the medical/patient context ("Someone's choking on their food! Is there a doctor here?"), BUT their "PhD" is not respected in the PhD community either, since it does not observe the rigorous education/research requirements that most PhD programs consist of, which involves a decade of education (undergraduate, master's, 4-10 year PhD program). Everything is express for them, i.e. 10-month nursing program!

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[southerndoc]

This is a double scam that these NP's are running. They don't have an MD (Doctor of Medicine) and they use their "PhD" to call themselves doctor. Not only do actual PhD's *NOT* use "Dr" in the medical/patient context ("Someone's choking on their food! Is there a doctor here?"), BUT their "PhD" is not respected in the PhD community either, since it does not observe the rigorous education/research requirements that most PhD programs consist of, which involves a decade of education (undergraduate, master's, 4-10 year PhD program). Everything is express for them, i.e. 10-month nursing program!

My state doesn't allow this in a healthcare setting. Only MD, DO, MBBS, DMD, DDS, and OD may call themselves doctor in a healthcare setting. Not only must you have the degree, but you must have a license a swell.

 

[EctopicFetus]

Yes. Hence "fame" is relative. Even within EM there are probably less than 10 names that 50% of EM docs could rattle off. Bridstrike, yes I agree. He isnt making 500k for a single surgery.

 

[quicknss]

i believe his trial starts on the 18th so we should have some info soon

 

[quicknss]

sorry it is now june 23rd https://iapps.courts.state.ny.us/we...ype=C&recordNum=d4jXFsYcPRcg3GXOY_PLUS_/ydA==

 

[filhodeinferno]

Funny thing happened at our grand rounds the other week. Sometimes we watch short TED talks or interesting EM speakers. The attending put on a 5 minute something-or-other from good old Dr. Newman. Something about how to build repor with patients or some crap. Lotta laughing, and it took about half way through for someone to fill her in on why there was so much commotion. She felt bad afterward, but we all had a good laugh.

 

[Birdstrike]

Funny thing happened at our grand rounds the other week. Sometimes we watch short TED talks or interesting EM speakers. The attending put on a 5 minute something-or-other from good old Dr. Newman. Something about how to build repor with patients or some crap. Lotta laughing and it took about half way through for someone to fill her in on why there was so much commotion. She felt bad afterward, but we all had a good laugh.

Ouch. Awkward.

 

[meister]

How is his attorney letting this go to trial? He is going to get annihilated.

 

[Birdstrike]

How is his attorney letting this go to trial? He is going to get annihilated.

Maybe his client insists.

 

[Food]

Any updates?

 

[RustedFox]

Any updates?

Nice Avi. I may have said this to you before many years ago... but I can't remember.

 

[Food]

Nice Avi. I may have said this to you before many years ago... but I can't remember.

Haha, maybe at some time, somewhere.

 

[KarlPilkington]

Looks like he is scheduled to be in court today.
Still amazingly bad news for all involved.

 

[Jlaw]

So he did give her propofol. http://nypost.com/2016/06/23/doc-ga...e-before-ejaculating-on-her-face-prosecutors/

 

[GeneralVeers]

He's toast.

 

[meister]

Amazing. Also amazing that his attorneys are letting this go to trial.

 

[doctalaughs]

Yeah they offered him 4 years - he shoulda taken it, served his time and then moved outta the country with what money he has left since no way hes ever practicing medicine again.


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[WilcoWorld]

So he did give her propofol. http://nypost.com/2016/06/23/doc-ga...e-before-ejaculating-on-her-face-prosecutors/

Well that clears up the greatest source of my skepticism for this accusation. Cynically, it was never the egregiousness of the actions or some belief in the benevolence of doctors that caused me doubt. It was always the claim that David Newman used morphine to drug someone that I found hardest to believe. Morphine is not an amnestic, and David Newman clearly understands pharmacology, so the story didn't make sense. Now that they've found propofol in her system, that stumbling block has been removed and it's all become sickeningly clear.

 

[Rendar5]

Agree with wilco

 

[Robotic Wis-Hipple]

"morphine" fit the doctors misusing opioids/ opioid epidemic political agenda though.

I thought it was off from the start based on the patients description of the medication burning, I knew if it was done it was prop/etomidate.

 

[MSmentor018]

I hope that's all the pt's that were affected and not like the bill cosby thing
guess the NNT (number need to trial) = 5

 

[e30ftw]

What a disgrace.

 

[GeneralVeers]

I can't believe anyone is this stupid. He can place a central line, figure out complex medical problems, and teach students/residents, yet commits an act of sheer idiocy!

 

[Birdstrike]

All below is hypothetical fake, imaginary and fictional. All invoke "alleged" and not related to any real life patient or court case. Any such similarities are 100% coincidental.

Well that clears up the greatest source of my skepticism for this accusation. Cynically, it was never the egregiousness of the actions or some belief in the benevolence of doctors that caused me doubt. It was always the claim that David Newman used morphine to drug someone that I found hardest to believe. Morphine is not an amnestic, and David Newman clearly understands pharmacology, so the story didn't make sense. Now that they've found propofol in her system, that stumbling block has been removed and it's all become sickeningly clear.

I alluded to this back in the very beginning that it had to be propofol. It made sense then and still does now. The (fictional) accuser reported that the nurse first gave her morphine. Let's assume that dose was morphine. We have no reason to think otherwise. This memory was formed a period of time before the (fake, imaginary hypothetical) doctor pushed medicine was (allegedly) given. Then the (alleged/fictional) assailant comes along, pushes a thick milky white drug that burns. Within seconds she's unconscious and would be expected to have some amnesia in the time immediately before and after the drug is going in. Whether he said to her "I'm giving you morphine" or "I'm giving you some medicine" or "I'm giving you some morphine and propofol" or whether she even remembers that part 100% word for word is irrelevant. Her recollection is that he put some medicine in her vein that burned and made her immediately become unconscious and that drug was obviously propofol. It's 100% consistent.

The "morphine" is a red herring. It's there in her statement but is essentially irrelevant to what's obvious in other parts of her statement. My guess is that the propofol given caused her to be a little fuzzy on the exact words spoken in the immediate seconds before the propofol was given. The other possibility is that he gave her propofol but specifically told her out loud it was morphine, either for plausibility in case she recalled it later or mentioned it to the nurse, or in case the nurse or someone else over heard him saying what he was supposedly giving her. If he was caught pushing the med, or the patient parroted the name of the med back to the nurse later after she woke up, having been given morphine wouldn't likely raise as much of a red flag with an experience nurse or other medical staff as would have had propofol pushed when no deep IV sedation would ever be justified or explicable, whereas an analgesia would. Shows premeditation and forethought.



Jan 20, 2016

Anyone notice that the alleging victim said the injection burned going in? Morphine doesn't burn much. Propofol does. Morphine isn't a very good sedative/hypnotic. Propofol is. Propofol fits the story, & possible modus operandi much better, from the standpoint of criminal profiling.






"Allegedly"

 

[Angry Birds]

I can't believe anyone is this stupid. He can place a central line, figure out complex medical problems, and teach students/residents, yet commits an act of sheer idiocy!

Well, it's beyond stupidity. It's straight up evil. He's a bad man and should get locked up. He should even get a harsher penalty than a regular person on the street, since he abused his position of power to do what he did.

An atrocious act. Actually, it wasn't just one atrocious act. He has been accused of multiple such acts, and who knows how many this turd got away with.

 

[redswingline]

If your #4 scenario happened, I doubt Dr. Newman would have left red flag bread crumbs leading back to him. Keep in mind that he was the Director of Clinical Research at Mt. Sinai School of Medicine so in that position as a physician-researcher he'd have an alternate route to access meds. Dr. Newman has a meded website
called channel line and recent subjects of discussion involved case studies re: ketamine and propofol. It could be an unfortunate coincidence in light of the January patient's allegations. But no doubt the D.A.'s office is already on that website like white on rice. Regarding sexual predators, the smart ones probably are careful not to show obvious "odd behavior" tell signs. There was a case in Canada recently ( 1 year ago) wherein a highly regarded popular anesthesiologist sexually assaulted 21 female patients while in the OR with staff nearby not being the wiser. I truly hope Dr. Newman is innocent of the alleged crimes. But if he is guilty, he needs to pay dearly. http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2...ht_gets_10_years_in_jail_for_sex_assault.html

Where can I find these studies? What's the website?

 

[PlutoBoy]

Any updates on this?

 

[Birdstrike]

Thousands of America's docs in sex abuse scandal http://fxn.ws/29hupCA

 

[Arcan57]

Thousands of America's docs in sex abuse scandal http://fxn.ws/29hupCA

That's an awesome article. And a great example of how over a long enough timeline any rare event can accumulate enough occurences to sound scary.

 

[BAM!]

That's an awesome article. And a great example of how over a long enough timeline any rare event can accumulate enough occurences to sound scary.

Just for fun, running some numbers from rough estimates:

number of doctors in US - 1000000
patients per day - 16
years since 1999 - 17
number of patient visits since 1999 - 70720000000
number of sexual abuse cases since 1999 - 2400
chance of sexual abuse incidents - 0.000003%
Cases per 100,000 patient visits. - 0.003393665158

That works out to 1 sexual abuse every 29,466,667 patient visits. (30 million!!)

 

[BAM!]

Sooo.... will he be able to cash in on his disability insurance for psychiatric illness?

 

[MSmentor018]

Sooo.... will he be able to cash in on his disability insurance for psychiatric illness?

only if his policy covers going nuts, otherwise he's going to have to work for those cigs in the joint

 

[Birdstrike]

only if his policy covers going nuts, otherwise he's going to have to work for those cigs in the joint

David Newman smokes?

 

[future_dr_house]

David Newman smokes?

Of all the things that could shock you about this guy...this is what you focus on?


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[KinesiologyNerd]

only if his policy covers going nuts, otherwise he's going to have to work for those cigs in the joint

 

[Birdstrike]

Of all the things that could shock you about this guy...this is what you focus on?


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You must be new around here.

 

[MSmentor018]

David Newman smokes?

duuno but I figured he's going to need some trading currency. I don't think a jailhouse doc make much about the license plate guy

 

[witzelsucht]

maybe he could be like when Dr house gets locked in the clink and gets a job as an orderly but then cracks the case!

 

[MSmentor018]

any updates?

 

[Birdstrike]

Most recent update I've seen:

"Mt. Sinai doc gave 'medically appropriate' breast exams: lawyer" http://nydn.us/2afFOqX

 

[meister]

I still don't understand why he is not taking a plea deal. A jury will have a field day with this one.

 

[northernpsy]

I still don't understand why he is not taking a plea deal. A jury will have a field day with this one.

Yeah, this is baffling (but then again, the whole thing is baffling). All I can speculate is that either this guy is incredibly arrogant and still thinks he can outsmart the prosecution somehow, or just totally in denial about the fact that he's toast.
I feel terrible for the women this happened to. How will they ever trust a male doctor again? I have had some really good male doctors over the years who I sincerely believed were not getting any kind of sexual thrill out of examining me or other female patients (since I have examined enough patients myself and God knows I have never been turned on by performing a genital or rectal exam), but all it takes is hearing about one pervert to make people suspicious of all male doctors.

 

[deleted126335]

I still don't understand why he is not taking a plea deal. A jury will have a field day with this one.

Maybe there isn't any offer from the prosecutor. Famous prominent doc, flagship hospital, lots of media attention, overwhelming evidence, why offer anything? Trials like this can launch a prosecutor's political career.


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[RooibosTea]

Funny how the original gut reaction was to assume the accuser was lying.

 

[WilcoWorld]

Funny how the original gut reaction was to assume the accuser was lying.

Unfortunately, that is the typical response to rape accusations in our culture.

 

[deleted126335]

Unfortunately, that is the typical response to rape accusations in our culture.

There is supposed to be a presumption of innocence for all accused. Rape allegations are frequently "he said. she said." Absent corroborating evidence, most of those accused should not be found guilty of a crime. Doesn't mean that they shouldn't be believed.

this case is why: http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB959125092804683918

also, in Newman's case people on this board identifying with the doctor.

 

[northernpsy]

Funny how the original gut reaction was to assume the accuser was lying.

I don't think you can blame people for being skeptical until the evidence came out to prove it happened. The skepticism was not because people don't take rape seriously, but because it is hard to believe that a doctor would not only be thinking of his patients in a sexual way, not only decide it was worth risking his career by doing something sexual with a patient, not only decide to ejaculate on a patient right in the middle of a treatment room, but do it without her consent and misusing medication to do it. It's a bizarre scenario that I would find really far fetched in a piece of fiction. Welp, here we see truth really is stranger than fiction.

Without evidence, these kinds of cases are always hard because you do need to balance compassion for people who have genuinely been assaulted vs. not destroying the life of an innocent man. As a woman, I certainly am vehemently opposed to rape, but sometimes people do make false accusations for various reasons.

 

[WilcoWorld]

There is supposed to be a presumption of innocence for all accused. Rape allegations are frequently "he said. she said." Absent corroborating evidence, most of those accused should not be found guilty of a crime. Doesn't mean that they shouldn't be believed.

this case is why: http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB959125092804683918

also, in Newman's case people on this board identifying with the doctor.

Just to make sure I understand you - are you saying that the current rate of rape prosecutions is appropriate and not a cause for concern?

 

[WilcoWorld]

I don't think you can blame people for being skeptical until the evidence came out to prove it happened. The skepticism was not because people don't take rape seriously, but because it is hard to believe that a doctor would not only be thinking of his patients in a sexual way, not only decide it was worth risking his career by doing something sexual with a patient, not only decide to ejaculate on a patient, but do it without her consent and misusing medication to do it. It's a bizarre scenario that I would find really far fetched in a piece of fiction. Welp, here we see truth really is stranger than fiction.

I was among the skeptical when this case broke. I agree that skepticism is the most reasonable response when faced with a story that is as crazy as this.

But there's a larger problem with rapes occurring under less crazy circumstances. In those cases, most (including myself) are inclined to apply a disproportionate amount of skepticism.

When someone reports a carjacking, our first response is NOT to say "Are you sure you didn't send signals that it was OK for him to borrow your car? Why were you driving in that neighborhood at that time if you didn't want someone to take your car?" When someone reports a mugging we don't ask "were you drinking when it happened?" But when someone reports a rape, these questions are routinely asked.

I am concerned that our culture's degree of skepticism with respect to rape prevents victims from reporting and emboldens people like Dr.Newman.

I am NOT suggesting that those accused of rape should not have the right to due process - they should, and so should murderers. I AM suggesting that the way we respond to rape victims should change.

 

[deleted126335]

Just to make sure I understand you - are you saying that the current rate of rape prosecutions is appropriate and not a cause for concern?

I am sure that rapes are under reported and many that are reported are not prosecuted because of the rules under which our justice system operates. But absent changing the some of the bedrock principles of our justice system....presumption of innocence...reasonable doubt, etc. the amount of prosecutions are probably appropriate and cause for concern.

Are you really advocating going down the path of changing those principles? If not how would you fix this admittedly terrible problem?


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