David Newman allegations

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
Status
Not open for further replies.
Arcan57 said:
Most of the actors have long since moved on to other projects so I don't think there's any hope a plea deal would get ER back on the air.
Click to expand...

Plus they killed Goose years ago.
Members don't see this ad.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
xaelia said:
In somewhat related news, you'll soon be able to hear my sultry voice replacing David on the Annals podcast.

(does anyone even listen to it?)
Click to expand...

Every month, man. Probably within the first 48 hours after it's been a out (I realize I have a problem). That's my second favorite medicine podcast (2nd only to EM:RAP).
 
I'll ask this, if Newman did what he is accused of, what in the Hell happened to him? Looking at the behavior and acts alleged, that's some flip out. Wife, kids, important job... sheesh.
 
Danbo1957 said:
I'll ask this, if Newman did what he is accused of, what in the Hell happened to him? Looking at the behavior and acts alleged, that's some flip out. Wife, kids, important job... sheesh.
Click to expand...
Wife, kids, important job hasn't stopped a lot guys from doing dumb ****...like former presidents. :rolleyes: If he did do it...he's certainly not the first and certainly won't be the last to "risk it all" doing something like this.
 
I love the annals podcast because of David.

No offense to anyone else, but little chance I would continue to listen without him.
 
xaelia said:
:(

We'll try not to blow it.

And if we do, just give 'em feedback and they'll find new replacements. I can handle the criticism.
Click to expand...
What will you be wearing, when podcasting?
 
Members don't see this ad :)
Danbo1957 said:
I'll ask this, if Newman did what he is accused of, what in the Hell happened to him? Looking at the behavior and acts alleged, that's some flip out. Wife, kids, important job... sheesh.
Click to expand...

It's a bizarre story but IF allegations are true and your question is on the level, these are a few theoretical possibilities ( abnormal psych textbook theories) that come to mind:

1. mid-life crisis ( subject was age 45)- targeting young women in their 20's to claw back feeling youthful?

2. inflated ego due to EM rock star status - which brought out latent narcissistic personality disorder - "I'm not hurting them physically or mentally 'cause they're asleep and the world is my oyster anyway" syndrome

3. addiction to porn - erotic fantasy world is applied to real life

4. alpha domination of powerless sexy young women - maybe subject was rejected/humiliated by pretty women in his youth? he gets his comeuppance ( no pun intended)

5. high risk = high reward for a person who seemingly has everything but he wants more - danger, thrill of getting away with it

6. a tour at Abu Gahraib Hospital in 2005 - PTSD stretch 10 years later

No doubt psych attendings/residents could identify more complex, nuanced theories.
 
Jackie-Chan-WTF.jpg
Hyde said:
It's a bizarre story but IF allegations are true and your question is on the level, these are a few theoretical possibilities ( abnormal psych textbook theories) that come to mind:

1. mid-life crisis ( subject was age 45)- targeting young women in their 20's to claw back feeling youthful?

2. inflated ego due to EM rock star status - which brought out latent narcissistic personality disorder - "I'm not hurting them physically or mentally 'cause they're asleep and the world is my oyster anyway" syndrome

3. addiction to porn - erotic fantasy world is applied to real life

4. alpha domination of powerless sexy young women - maybe subject was rejected/humiliated by pretty women in his youth? he gets his comeuppance ( no pun intended)

5. high risk = high reward for a person who seemingly has everything but he wants more - danger, thrill of getting away with it

6. a tour at Abu Gahraib Hospital in 2005 - PTSD stretch 10 years later

No doubt psych attendings/residents could identify more complex, nuanced theories.
Click to expand...
 
Hyde said:
Denbo asked a seemingly genuine question and I responded. What's the problem?
Click to expand...

The easier to explain problem is that the reasons you gave are a what's what list of implausibility as recited by someone who slept through their psych 101 class and was trying to plagiarize a Wikipedia article for their term paper.

ER rock star status and porn addiction... LOL.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Hyde said:
It's a bizarre story but IF allegations are true and your question is on the level, these are a few theoretical possibilities ( abnormal psych textbook theories) that come to mind:

1. mid-life crisis ( subject was age 45)- targeting young women in their 20's to claw back feeling youthful?

2. inflated ego due to EM rock star status - which brought out latent narcissistic personality disorder - "I'm not hurting them physically or mentally 'cause they're asleep and the world is my oyster anyway" syndrome

3. addiction to porn - erotic fantasy world is applied to real life

4. alpha domination of powerless sexy young women - maybe subject was rejected/humiliated by pretty women in his youth? he gets his comeuppance ( no pun intended)

5. high risk = high reward for a person who seemingly has everything but he wants more - danger, thrill of getting away with it

6. a tour at Abu Gahraib Hospital in 2005 - PTSD stretch 10 years later

No doubt psych attendings/residents could identify more complex, nuanced theories.
Click to expand...


Dude. Why are you posting on this thread/sub-forum when you have absolutely nothing useful to add? ....ok, you are trolling, I get that...but aren't there more appropriate places to do that...pre-allo?

You obviously know nothing about emergency medicine, emergency rooms, pharmacology, or David Newman. Therefore, you have nothing useful to add to this topic.
 
link2swim06 said:
Dude. Why are you posting on this thread/sub-forum when you have absolutely nothing useful to add? ....ok, you are trolling, I get that...but aren't there more appropriate places to do that...pre-allo?

You obviously know nothing about emergency medicine, emergency rooms, pharmacology, or David Newman. Therefore, you have nothing useful to add to this topic.
Click to expand...
FYI I'm a med student, one who had thought about doing ER as a specialty in the future. David Newman was a hero. I've read his book and I've probably listened to more of his podcasts than many posting on the thread. Besides which medical "status" should not matter with regards to this particular thread discussion about the David Newman criminal case. In case you have not noticed, the allegations have been published widely in non-medical specific newspapers and blogs like NYT, Wash Post, Huff Post, etc etc. In terms of what's useless to add, who are you to judge? What have you contributed to this thread? I've made more focused observations about the case at hand than some who go off track arguing about inter-departmental rivalry and others who post juvie gif's ad nauseam. The David Newman case is significant not just because of the alleged criminal actions but also because he's embraced a rock star public figure status for the ER specialty. Don't you get the potential negative ramifications on the specialty itself? David Newman challenged accepted "safe tried and true" medical practices - he brought new found respect and gravitas to the ER specialty. What happens to his medical theories if he's found to be a flawed individual and physician?
 
Last edited:
Hyde said:
FYI I'm a med student. Not that medical "status" should matter with regards to the thread discussion about the David Newman criminal case. BTW in case you have not noticed, the allegations have been written up in widely distributed public newspapers and blogs like NYT, Wash Post, Huff Post, etc etc. In terms of what's useless to add, who are you to judge? What have you contributed on this thread? I've made more focused observations about the case at hand than some who go off track arguing about inter-departmental rivalry and others who post juvie jpg's ad nauseam. The David Newman case is significant not just because of the alleged criminal actions but also because he's embraced a rock star public figure status for the ER specialty. Don't you get the potential negative ramifications on the specialty itself?
Click to expand...

You just don't get it, at all. Nothing makes sense in this case whatsoever. This is why you don't see any attending on this thread saying, 'oh, just a mid-life crisis.' If you worked in emergency medicine you would understand this.

Do you personally know all the commonly obtainable meds available to a physician in the ED?
What clinical effect do they have and what is their durations?
How many times have you personally performed procedural sedation?
How many hours have you worked in an emergency department as a physician?
How often does a staff member walk into a patient's room in a typical ER?
How many patients does a physician typically see per hour in the ED and how much spare time do they have?
How many times have you told a patient you are not giving them dilaudid for their b.s. compliant and they tell you they are going to sue you or 'get you fired?'

So yes, your medical status has something to do with this thread. This is EM residents and attendings discussing a topic with a common core knowledge. You are making points I'd expect to see from a non-medical person on Huff Post. And by doing so you are trolling people in this thread.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
link2swim06 said:
You just don't get it, at all. Nothing makes sense in this case whatsoever. This is why you don't see any attending on this thread saying, 'oh, just a mid-life crisis.' If you worked in emergency medicine you would understand this.

Do you personally know all the commonly obtainable meds available to a physician in the ED?
What clinical effect do they have and what is their durations?
How many times have you personally performed procedural sedation?
How many hours have you worked in an emergency department as a physician?
How often does a staff member walk into a patient's room in a typical ER?
How many patients does a physician typically see per hour in the ED and how much spare time do they have?
How many times have you told a patient you are not giving them dilaudid for their b.s. compliant and they tell you they are going to sue you or 'get you fired?'

So yes, your medical status has something to do with this thread. This is EM residents and attendings discussing a topic with a common core knowledge. You are making points I'd expect to see from a non-medical person on Huff Post. And by doing so you are trolling people in this thread.
Click to expand...

I answered a question raised by an attending named "Danbo1957" who I believe is a Surgical Attending. Oh, cover your eyes - an ER doc's ultimate rival! Obviously he was curious to hear opinions from everyone or he would not have asked the question in a non-focused way. He did not direct his question specifically to EM residents and attendings, which you might have realized if you had not helicoptered yourself into page 7 of a long thread to do your bully routine. BTW, your list of ED duties may be relevant to a job description posting but they have little to do with the case discussion at hand.
 
Hyde said:
BTW, your list of ED duties may be relevant to a job description posting but they have little to do with the case discussion at hand.
Click to expand...

It wasn't a list of ED duties. It was a post to demonstrate how experience lends judgment to the current allegations. Of which you clearly have none.

I get it. Anonymous forum. Freedom of speech. But people on this forum are taking issue with your behavior because you are passively attacking David's character behind his back. You are gossiping. In the bad sense of the word.

Please pick up on the social cues. And if you want to sit at the adult table, start acting like one.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
BAM! said:
It wasn't a list of ED duties. It was a post to demonstrate how experience lends judgment to the current allegations. Of which you clearly have none.

I get it. Anonymous forum. Freedom of speech. But people on this forum are taking issue with your behavior because you are passively attacking David's character behind his back. You are gossiping. In the bad sense of the word.

Please pick up on the social cues. And if you want to sit at the adult table, start acting like one.
Click to expand...

Experience leads to good judgment??? Seriously? Consider the criminal allegations regarding the questionable judgement of an experienced "ER icon". People are taking issue with "my behavior?" How have I behaved in an unseemly matter? I think you need to have your optical prescription adjusted - right now you seem to be blind to bad behavior under your nose which has been noted in numerous publications. Passively attacking "David's character"? Really? You're on first name basis, are you? News flash - "David's character" was undermined by "David's" own alleged actions. Have you bothered to check the NYCPD's website for "David's" charges? Use the Google. The multiple felony and misdemeanor charges are enumerated for the public at large to read. The charges did not come as a result of an anonymous forum posting or freedom of speech or gossiping or passive attacks. Dr. Newman is accused of very serious criminal charges for his, no one else's, behavior. I didn't start this thread - it was well underway before I joined in and only because of my interest in ER as a specialty. There were many posters "at the table" discussing the case. They weren't members of a fraternity that I could see. Instead of being upset with me for contributing sensible comments, maybe your energies would be better used if they were focused on the high profile accused who has brought substantial negative publicity to your specialty. Mt. Sinai Hospital, NNT, Annals of Emergency Medicine have positioned themselves away from Dr. Newman. They have disassociated themselves from Dr. Newman and are being notably circumspect. Maybe that's what you should do instead of attacking people who are not accused of criminal behavior or abusing a position of trust. Also you might want to show more empathy for the alleged victims - put that hat on IF it still fits and is not too small -instead of circling the wagons to protect "David."
 
Last edited:
Hyde said:
Experience leads to good judgment??? Seriously? Consider the criminal allegations regarding the questionable judgement of an experienced "ER icon". People are taking issue with "my behavior?" How have I behaved in an unseemly matter? I think you need to have your optical prescription adjusted - right now you seem to be blind to bad behavior under your nose which has been noted in numerous publications. Passively attacking "David's character"? Really? You're on first name basis, are you? News flash - "David's character" was undermined by "David's" own alleged actions. Have you bothered to check the NYCPD's website for "David's" charges? Use the Google. The multiple felony and misdemeanor charges are enumerated for the public at large to read. The charges did not come as a result of an anonymous forum posting or freedom of speech or gossiping or passive attacks. Dr. Newman is accused of very serious criminal charges for his, no one else's, behavior. I didn't start this thread - it was well underway before I joined in and only because of my interest in ER as a specialty. There were many posters "at the table" discussing the case. They weren't members of a fraternity that I could see. Instead of being upset with me for contributing sensible comments, maybe your energies would be better used if they were focused on the high profile accused who has brought substantial negative publicity to your specialty. Mt. Sinai Hospital, NNT, Annals of Emergency Medicine have positioned themselves away from Dr. Newman. They have disassociated themselves from Dr. Newman and are being notably circumspect. Maybe that's what you should do instead of attacking people who are not accused of criminal behavior or abusing a position of trust. Also you might want to show more empathy for the alleged victims - put that hat on IF it still fits and is not too small -instead of circling the wagons to protect "David."
Click to expand...

Lol.

Looks like you went off the deep end.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 5 users
link2swim06 said:
You just don't get it, at all. Nothing makes sense in this case whatsoever. This is why you don't see any attending on this thread saying, 'oh, just a mid-life crisis.' If you worked in emergency medicine you would understand this.

Do you personally know all the commonly obtainable meds available to a physician in the ED?
What clinical effect do they have and what is their durations?
Click to expand...

The DA said he had his own stash... :rofl:
 
Hyde said:
FYI I'm a med student, one who had thought about doing ER as a specialty in the future. David Newman was a hero. I've read his book and I've probably listened to more of his podcasts than many posting on the thread. Besides which medical "status" should not matter with regards to this particular thread discussion about the David Newman criminal case. In case you have not noticed, the allegations have been published widely in non-medical specific newspapers and blogs like NYT, Wash Post, Huff Post, etc etc. In terms of what's useless to add, who are you to judge? What have you contributed to this thread? I've made more focused observations about the case at hand than some who go off track arguing about inter-departmental rivalry and others who post juvie gif's ad nauseam. The David Newman case is significant not just because of the alleged criminal actions but also because he's embraced a rock star public figure status for the ER specialty. Don't you get the potential negative ramifications on the specialty itself? David Newman challenged accepted "safe tried and true" medical practices - he brought new found respect and gravitas to the ER specialty. What happens to his medical theories if he's found to be a flawed individual and physician?
Click to expand...

It's unlikely that many people outside of EM could have told you who Newman was prior to these allegations. There are no "rock star public figures" in EM, at least ones that aren't fictional TV characters. The potential ramifications for the specialty are that if he is convicted we are likely to face an uptick in copycat allegations from patients with secondary gain on their mind. Newman isn't the only voice in the EBM crusade and the very nature of his work means that it's reproducible regardless of who's doing it. The movement is hurt more by a lack of quality data and the flood of studies asking the wrong questions then by one individual's actions.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Hyde said:
FYI I'm a med student, one who had thought about doing ER as a specialty in the future. David Newman was a hero. I've read his book and I've probably listened to more of his podcasts than many posting on the thread. Besides which medical "status" should not matter with regards to this particular thread discussion about the David Newman criminal case. In case you have not noticed, the allegations have been published widely in non-medical specific newspapers and blogs like NYT, Wash Post, Huff Post, etc etc. In terms of what's useless to add, who are you to judge? What have you contributed to this thread? I've made more focused observations about the case at hand than some who go off track arguing about inter-departmental rivalry and others who post juvie gif's ad nauseam. The David Newman case is significant not just because of the alleged criminal actions but also because he's embraced a rock star public figure status for the ER specialty. Don't you get the potential negative ramifications on the specialty itself? David Newman challenged accepted "safe tried and true" medical practices - he brought new found respect and gravitas to the ER specialty. What happens to his medical theories if he's found to be a flawed individual and physician?
Click to expand...


So much about your online persona is so obviously fake and fabricated that I doubt virtually everything you write including (but not limited to!) your status as a medical student.


Ignore starting............




Now.
 
Hyde said:
What happens to his medical theories if he's found to be a flawed individual and physician?
Click to expand...

Nothing should happen to his medical theories if he's found guilty. His scientific claims should be judged on their rationale and the evidence supporting them, not by the character of their author.

Hyde said:
Mt. Sinai Hospital, NNT, Annals of Emergency Medicine have positioned themselves away from Dr. Newman.
Click to expand...

This is really too bad, and exactly why I requested that we pause discussion on this until the facts are actually known. I understand why a hospital would put him on leave while the investigation is underway, patients need to be protected until we know one way or the other. But the folks at the NNT and Annals of EM do not have the same concern - they're concerned with their image. As scientific institutions they should be above that. Unless Dr. Newman himself asked them to take his name down, I think that they ought to be ashamed of themselves.
 
I'm not sure why we are at all responding to the obnoxious trolling by M1 who thinks he knows emergency medicine - which by the way if the comments made here is truly reflective of their personality, I'll be glad that he or she doesn't choose our specialty
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 users
Maybe he was and is a great ER doctor...can we accept that as a human being some (if not all) people seriously fail sometimes, without the ED docs here taking it as an assault on their professional identities ? Basically nobody here really knows what happened...so let's just take a break and wait for the investigation !
 
There are several assumptions that still need to be addressed:

POINT

1) He "said" he was injecting morphine. There is no way to tell if it was morphine, ketamine, etomidate, but it was clearly short-acting. If it was any of the sedation medications, then he could have been required by his hospital policy/state board to push his own medications (I have to push my own propofol in Florida). There is weight to the "victim's" statement that the doctor injected something.

2) If it was a sedative/hypnotic agent then her entire testimony should and will be brought into questions.

3) If his back was turned to the patient and she heard certain "noises" while under the influence of a medication, that means nothing, because his back was turned to her. There would be no way for her to know what she heard (unless she saw what was making the "noise"). She never stated she SAW anything.

4) She felt something hit her face and dress and "saved the evidence." Again - she never stated that she SAW anything. If there was a single time during this entire encounter that she would see something incriminating, that would have probably been the "closest" view of what was going down.

None of her story will hold any weight in a court or deposition, and an investigation will only yield findings if the sample in her bag has his sperm. Period.

Typical ER patient complaint bull that likely has very little to do with reality.

COUNTERPOINT

1) She is a victim, mortified, and emotionally shocked, and her memory is hazy of the entire sequence of events.

2) Dr. Jagoda "offered to call the police."

3) There was more than one person in the room who was being sexually inappropriate (maybe she was too and things "got weird.")


This will be interesting to follow and see where the truth lies...
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
NinerNiner999 said:
There are several assumptions that still need to be addressed:

POINT

1) He "said" he was injecting morphine. There is no way to tell if it was morphine, ketamine, etomidate, but it was clearly short-acting. If it was any of the sedation medications, then he could have been required by his hospital policy/state board to push his own medications (I have to push my own propofol in Florida). There is weight to the "victim's" statement that the doctor injected something.

2) If it was a sedative/hypnotic agent then her entire testimony should and will be brought into questions.

3) If his back was turned to the patient and she heard certain "noises" while under the influence of a medication, that means nothing, because his back was turned to her. There would be no way for her to know what she heard (unless she saw what was making the "noise"). She never stated she SAW anything.

4) She felt something hit her face and dress and "saved the evidence." Again - she never stated that she SAW anything. If there was a single time during this entire encounter that she would see something incriminating, that would have probably been the "closest" view of what was going down.

None of her story will hold any weight in a court or deposition, and an investigation will only yield findings if the sample in her bag has his sperm. Period.

Typical ER patient complaint bull that likely has very little to do with reality.

COUNTERPOINT

1) She is a victim, mortified, and emotionally shocked, and her memory is hazy of the entire sequence of events.

2) Dr. Jagoda "offered to call the police."

3) There was more than one person in the room who was being sexually inappropriate (maybe she was too and things "got weird.")


This will be interesting to follow and see where the truth lies...
Click to expand...

Nothing but a somewhat tarnished reputation will come out of this if there is no sperm on that gown. I certainly wouldn't think any less of him.
 
PlutoBoy said:
Nothing but a somewhat tarnished reputation will come out of this if there is no sperm on that gown. I certainly wouldn't think any less of him.
Click to expand...

What if she saved his sperm from a prior encounter
 
I find crazy ex, crazy angry patient, and crazy psychotic patient all much more likely possibilities than an attending in a busy teaching ED having a stash of controlled substances and the opportunity to ejaculate on anyone without a resident, medical student, or nurse barging in to either check on the patient or talk to him about another patient...
 
Psai said:
Maybe you've been lucky in your life but I've dated a girl or two that I could definitely see doing this kind of thing
Click to expand...
I have a knack for picking the most dysfunctional but hot women. The hotter they are they crazier they are...it neverrrrrrrr fails. As the song says...Make and ugly women your wife you'll be happy for the rest of your life, except in bed lol!!!
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
HoosierdaddyO said:
I have a knack for picking the most dysfunctional but hot women. The hotter they are they crazier they are...it neverrrrrrrr fails. As the song says...Make and ugly women your wife you'll be happy for the rest of your life, except in bed lol!!!
Click to expand...

crazy-hot-scale-chart-barney-stinson-how-i-met-your-mother.jpg
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
DeadCactus said:
I find crazy ex, crazy angry patient, and crazy psychotic patient all much more likely possibilities than an attending in a busy teaching ED having a stash of controlled substances and the opportunity to ejaculate on anyone without a resident, medical student, or nurse barging in to either check on the patient or talk to him about another patient...
Click to expand...

Don't forget medic, tech, or registration staff.
 
Serous Demilune said:
Sorry which politicians know this dude exactly? And why would one person's actions jeopardize an entire field of 10s of thousands of doctors? I don't understand what you're trying to say. Ben Carson, an actual famous doctor, hasn't really affected neurosurgeons in the public eye so I don't see how this guy would.
Click to expand...

I think what he was trying to say, but his thought went a bit off the rails, is this: Newman is one of the stronger voices of academic EM and travels the country debating other fields on things that impact national health policy (like tPA). If he goes down for a crime, does that just look bad on him or does that hurt our national standing as people who actually impact academic medicine trends/national treatment guidelines.

I personally think that given the massive majority of our influence comes not from any individuals works, but from ACEP guidelines... there are plenty of other academic people who can pick up his torch as "the" academic voice. And really thats just an honorific, its the combined work of everyone conglomerating in the ACEP guidelines that make the difference. We have at least 10 I can rattle off who can easily replace him in their own way. But I admit that he had to be in the top 3 overall if I were to place his capability to be "the" academic voice among those 10. He is damn good at what he does (not the sexual assault part. the research part)
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
DocEspana said:
yea... not sure what that was about and i was the person being yelled at,,,
Click to expand...
Either you are dense, or being disingenuous, but I see that, despite you saying before that "idk why I am even replying", now, you can't let it go. My most logical conclusion is that you drunk post a lot.
 
I think this whole thing raises important questions about chaperones and how to protect yourself from false allegations as a trainee. As a student, I doubt it would be possible to have a chaperone with you every time you interact with a patient (unless you paid for your own medical assistant to follow you around all day). Is there anything we as male trainees can do to protect ourselves? Obviously, one could get a nurse or MA to chaperone (or ask the resident/attending to see the patient with you at the same time) if there is any suspicion that the patient is behaving abnormally, but this is against the current ED culture (and the nurses may or may not agree to help you). I'm also not sure I have the experience to detect every patient with these types of intentions, so could fail to get the chaperone in the one case I really needed one. I think an extra layer of complexity is added when you consider trainees in this scenario, because students don't want to be burdensome/annoying to their supervisors (who are evaluating them) by asking them to assign you a different patient, or by taking a long time to see patients because you are trying to find chaperones etc. Its kinda messed up that we even have to think about this.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Next unread thread

Similar threads

Z
Article published of the first hand account of the victim of Newman's sexual assault
2
Replies
93
Views
8K
Rendar5
R
Hamhock
  • Locked
Newman. And now this...
2 3
Replies
122
Views
12K
deleted109597
D
J
Another "sex assault" allegation
Replies
43
Views
6K
Promethean
Promethean
K
alleghany
Replies
4
Views
1K
KasaNOVA
K
C
allegheny anyone?
Replies
0
Views
882
CueDoc
C
Top