Do dentists make a lot of money?

[pumpUup]

There are so many dental office in my town and I am thinking where to go and open my office once I graduate from a dental school. There is at least one in each block.

I read an article that says 3 dentists retire for every 2 dentists graduate from dental school but I don't see dental clinic disappearing. I only see them appearing.

Some people say that general dentists don't make a lot of money and the only way that dentists can survive is to specialize and become orthodontist or periodontist.

How much did general dentists make about 5 yrs ago, now, and how much do you think they will make in the future?

Money isn't my reason to become a dentist. I am aware that there are other occupations that I can make more money but I still want to know how much dentists make.

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[Destiny11]

There are so many dental office in my town and I am thinking where to go and open my office once I graduate from a dental school. There is at least one in each block.

I read an article that says 3 dentists retire for every 2 dentists graduate from dental school but I don't see dental clinic disappearing. I only see them appearing.

Some people say that general dentists don't make a lot of money and the only way that dentists can survive is to specialize and become orthodontist or periodontist.

How much did general dentists make about 5 yrs ago, now, and how much do you think they will make in the future?

Money isn't my reason to become a dentist. I am aware that there are other occupations that I can make more money but I still want to know how much dentists make.

Median annual wages of salaried general dentists were $142,870 in May 2008. Earnings vary according to number of years in practice, location, hours worked, and specialty. Self-employed dentists in private practice tend to earn more than salaried dentists. Dentists who are salaried often receive benefits paid by their employer, with health insurance and malpractice insurance being among the most common. However, like other business owners, self-employed dentists must provide their own health insurance, life insurance, retirement plans, and other benefits.



http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos072.htm

 

[AmpedUp]

You'll definitely be paid what you're worth in dentistry - if that means anything to you. But never mind that, focus on what's important and that is the nature of the career itself, which is more patient-oriented than business-oriented (it's in the package, but it shouldn't be a priority by all means).

 

[wantVCUdental]

If you are going to dentistry for money, then you my friend must not be very bright/is terrible at math.
In fact, anyone going in to healthcare profession to make money is just not very good at Math.

4 years of college + 4 years of dschool/medschool (200k+ in debt) + 4 years of opportunity cost/stress from dschool + 2-10years working as an associate making just about 150k after 8!!! years of college education.

Don't get me wrong, dentistry makes much more money than other graduate studies, but again, those are not studies that you go in to make money.

If you want to make real money, be an entrepreneur, go to a brandname undergraduate institution and network.

 

[GTFOOMICT]

Median annual wages of salaried general dentists were $142,870 in May 2008. Earnings vary according to number of years in practice, location, hours worked, and specialty. Self-employed dentists in private practice tend to earn more than salaried dentists. Dentists who are salaried often receive benefits paid by their employer, with health insurance and malpractice insurance being among the most common. However, like other business owners, self-employed dentists must provide their own health insurance, life insurance, retirement plans, and other benefits.



http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos072.htm

This bls.gov is terrible. You think anyone would take out $300k in loans to make that average? Nope.

But that's ok. Let people google dentists and think this!

The ADA has much better data. You have to login though so find a daddy dentist to get it for you.

 

[dentalWorks]

Some people say that general dentists don't make a lot of money and the only way that dentists can survive is to specialize and become orthodontist or periodontist.

I hope you realize that a dentist (not a specialist, just a good-ol average general dentist) has.... a HUGE potential to make some serious $$$. Dentistry and many other healthcare fields, are USUALLY not dictated by the job but more so on HOW MANY hours the dentist is willing to work.

If your going to graduate dental school, and only wanna work 3-4 days a week and less than 30 hours per week.... then your probably lucky to pull 100k or so. But on the other hand, if your like one of those psychos who are willing to push 60+ hours per week (in their own practice or working as associates), then your going to CLEAR a boat load of $$$. How much? Not exactly sure, every location and every arrangement is different, but I would imagine 200-300k.

I don't like to use this example to prove my point, but here is a prospective for you, my sister opened her brand new office back in 2008, she has a small operation (1 office manager + 2-3 assistants), she sees about 15-20-ish patients a day. She does have great business skills tho, her overhead from what she explains is about 25%, and from what I gather, that office clears about 420k a year..... she works 4 days a week and about 35 hours per week...... You do the math how much she is making, she is 41 years of age with 3 kids

 

[dentalWorks]

If you are going to dentistry for money, then you my friend must not be very bright/is terrible at math.
In fact, anyone going in to healthcare profession to make money is just not very good at Math.

4 years of college + 4 years of dschool/medschool (200k+ in debt) + 4 years of opportunity cost/stress from dschool + 2-10years working as an associate making just about 150k after 8!!! years of college education.

Don't get me wrong, dentistry makes much more money than other graduate studies, but again, those are not studies that you go in to make money.

If you want to make real money, be an entrepreneur, go to a brandname undergraduate institution and network.

I don't agree with this. I am never against someone going into healthcare JUST for the money. I mean, if they can earn that DDS/DMD, to me, they are qualified to work in my mouth. Now if they are total *****s, and never get their procedures done correctly, then I don't care if they love dentistry or just love the monetary gains, to me that dentist shouldn't be licensed.

Going into healthcare (like dentistry) is a VERY sound business plan. So what if you spend 50k on undergrad and 300k on dental school. Last time I checked, the average dentist (right out of dental school) averages between 90-120k (and these are on the lower end of the spectrum when it comes to dental salaries).... And if they open their own practice 2-5 years down the line, expect to double/triple that number.

Not many non-healthcare fields out there guarantee (or come as close as possible to guaranteeing) their graduates to make 100-300k 10-years after graduation. And being an entrepreneur? thats always MUCH easier said than done. Do you have ANY idea how hard it is to be a successful (and I mean more successful than a dentist) as a entrepreneur? Do you know how many people start a brand new business and less than 1-2 years away, end up closing shop or worse, work JUST to pay off the overhead without making any profits? IMO, its easier to be a dentist than a successful entrepreneur.

 

[jonishere5]

This bls.gov is terrible. You think anyone would take out $300k in loans to make that average? Nope.

But that's ok. Let people google dentists and think this!

The ADA has much better data. You have to login though so find a daddy dentist to get it for you.

The ADA gets their statistics from bls.gov, as well as their own surveys, check out their source in their brochure. Also bls.gov has many different statistics about how much dentists make.

 

[dentalWorks]

This bls.gov is terrible. You think anyone would take out $300k in loans to make that average? Nope.

Oh I get it, your being sarcastic here

 

[peanutb123]

If you are going to dentistry for money, then you my friend must not be very bright/is terrible at math.
In fact, anyone going in to healthcare profession to make money is just not very good at Math.

4 years of college + 4 years of dschool/medschool (200k+ in debt) + 4 years of opportunity cost/stress from dschool + 2-10years working as an associate making just about 150k after 8!!! years of college education.

Don't get me wrong, dentistry makes much more money than other graduate studies, but again, those are not studies that you go in to make money.

If you want to make real money, be an entrepreneur, go to a brandname undergraduate institution and network.

You are not very good at math

MANY MANY people do go to graduate studies NOT b/c of their interest but b/c of the 20% increase in their salary + their company is either paying for it or there are only jobs available for grad studies. Plus to be a manager or to be promoted in many companies you need masters. If you want to go to VP in a company you need years and years of experience(but if you get laid of in the middle you are done... back to the beginning... yes just like snakes and ladders) then you need at least 2 masters and sometimes JD degrees.

if higher education is not required then many people would stop their studies at high school. Plus now a days with undergrad alone its hard to find a job. You need masters or higher education.

Regarding your comment about people in health care... So far by observing my relatives and couple friends. I HAVE NEVER SEEN THEM WORRY about money. In fact they worry about where to invest all the money they have made... I never seen a jobless dentist or a doctor... BUT I HAVE SEEN ALL KIND OF JOBLESS Majors...

PS. If money isnt the motivator we would not have such brilliant doctors, dentists, etc... and many breakthroughs in science. Motivate the brightest everyone wins...

 

[redchesus]

Do you have ANY idea how hard it is to be a successful (and I mean more successful than a dentist) as a entrepreneur?

I very much agree with you on this. It is pretty hard to make it as a successful entrepreneur. For every mega-successful entrepreneurial story you hear, there's got to be like 10 others that have failed that you didn't hear about.

One's chances of becoming a successful dentist after D-school is way higher than becoming a successful entrepreneur. And if one has good business sense, why not team up with an engineer and invent something, like the Oral-B guy .

 

[wantVCUdental]

You are not very good at math

MANY MANY people do go to graduate studies NOT b/c of their interest but b/c of the 20% increase in their salary + their company is either paying for it or there are only jobs available for grad studies. Plus to be a manager or to be promoted in many companies you need masters. If you want to go to VP in a company you need years and years of experience(but if you get laid of in the middle you are done... back to the beginning... yes just like snakes and ladders) then you need at least 2 masters and sometimes JD degrees.

if higher education is not required then many people would stop their studies at high school. Plus now a days with undergrad alone its hard to find a job. You need masters or higher education.

Regarding your comment about people in health care... So far by observing my relatives and couple friends. I HAVE NEVER SEEN THEM WORRY about money. In fact they worry about where to invest all the money they have made... I never seen a jobless dentist or a doctor... BUT I HAVE SEEN ALL KIND OF JOBLESS Majors...

PS. If money isnt the motivator we would not have such brilliant doctors, dentists, etc... and many breakthroughs in science. Motivate the brightest everyone wins...

I SAID THEY MAKE GOOD LIVING! I said if you are going in to the profession for money, anything in healthcare is not worth it.
And by way you think, you don't come from a brand name school and you haven't had interaction with people who make SERIOUS money.

 

[jonishere5]

Here is a good source for dentist/dental specialty salaries from the ADA, keep in mind this is looking at NET MEAN income.

 

[peanutb123]

I SAID THEY MAKE GOOD LIVING! I said if you are going in to the profession for money, anything in healthcare is not worth it.
And by way you think, you don't come from a brand name school and you haven't had interaction with people who make SERIOUS money.

lol by the way you talk/think you dont have real life experience...

 

[Destiny11]

PS. If money isnt the motivator we would not have such brilliant doctors, dentists, etc... and many breakthroughs in science. Motivate the brightest everyone wins...

Well not everyone wins. Medicare, special needs, emergency, and other patients that these doctors cannot profit from are often left out.

 

[peanutb123]

Well not everyone wins. Medicare, special needs, emergency, and other patients that these doctors cannot profit from are often left out.

I partially agree with you but thats not the point that i was trying to make. I was talking about cures, breakthroughs etc...

Here i the part that i disagree with you. I am not too knowledgeable at this area. But i did read some sad stores. Some international dentists who attend d-school usually work in medicare shops... until they get their green card. and in these shops its all about how fast they can do a procedure and how many can they see in a day determines their salary. And guess what... where a regular boutique dentist takes his time to see 10 patients whole day. The medi-shops has to see like 30 patients to profit from, otherwise they wouldnt be able to 'profit' to pay their DA, hygienists, etc...

But i do understand where you are coming from. But sadly money is what makes the world go round.

In these case most of the medicare patients win.

you know many poeple who do not have much... look at these professionals as idols and try to imitate them so one day they can achieve them... and in a sense money is a motivator.

 

[7 Iron]

I don't like to use this example to prove my point, but here is a prospective for you, my sister opened her brand new office back in 2008, she has a small operation (1 office manager + 2-3 assistants), she sees about 15-20-ish patients a day. She does have great business skills tho, her overhead from what she explains is about 25%, and from what I gather, that office clears about 420k a year..... she works 4 days a week and about 35 hours per week...... You do the math how much she is making, she is 41 years of age with 3 kids

Wow... how in the world did she manage 25% overhead? Particularly in a new practice!

 

[dentalWorks]

Wow... how in the world did she manage 25% overhead? Particularly in a new practice!

She doesn't over-hire folks. She has 2-3 assistance, and thats it. She does not / will not hire a hygeneist, she likes to do all the work herself. she tries her hardest to do things without involving 3rd party vendors, like to the extend of even ordering office supplies herself, except with lab works, this she can't avoid.

 

[yappy]

So she does her own cleanings? or she just doesnt provide hygeine at all

 

[dentalWorks]

So she does her own cleanings? or she just doesnt provide hygeine at all

she does the cleaning herself

 

[molar3]

the oral surgeon i work for has made millions....hes compalined to me about his taxes before which is why i know thiss....but then again he is like in his 60s i think. he drives like 3 benz's....... then again, oral surgery is quite a speciality to be accepted to.

if you want money though, and dont care for this profession too much, go into business, they make bank and they make it much faster. Heck just go work on wallstreet.....

 

[Medwell]

According to the latest data, the overall median income in the USA for people over the age of 15 who worked with earnings in 2005 was $28,567. 75.39% of individuals made less than 50k/year. That same year, the median household brought in $44,389. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Person...reau.2C_median_income_for_total_labor_force-5

Yes, dentists make a lot of money, despite what your incredibly flawed perception of reality may be telling you.

Some people say that general dentists don't make a lot of money and the only way that dentists can survive is to specialize

is one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard.

 

[Medwell]

the oral surgeon i work for has made millions....hes compalined to me about his taxes before which is why i know thiss....but then again he is like in his 60s i think. he drives like 3 benz's....... then again, oral surgery is quite a speciality to be accepted to.

if you want money though, and dont care for this profession too much, go into business, they make bank and they make it much faster. Heck just go work on wallstreet.....

Telling someone "if you want to make money, go work on wallstreet" is like saying "if you want to make money, become a professional athlete" or "become the President of the USA."
Yeah, great, but that's really not an option for the majority of people.

 

[Lethstang]

To the haters,

Op clearly states money is not his primary concern, he's merely curious. Kids, get of your high horses. If you put yourself through 8 years of college to work on teeth without thought of compensation, you're a *******.

Thx

 

[molar3]

haha medwell is was a joke relax!

 

[lululime]

Didn't y'all learn about the Marshmallow Test? Going for dentistry is like forgoing that marshmallow for many, many years! Yet, we do this and risk our financial well-beings in the short run not just for the financial security of a job, but for the privilege of the ultimate dream job.

 

[Imanm]

Here is a good source for dentist/dental specialty salaries from the ADA, keep in mind this is looking at NET MEAN income.

great link.
ty

 

[ajusf16]

Didn't y'all learn about the Marshmallow Test? Going for dentistry is like forgoing that marshmallow for many, many years! Yet, we do this and risk our financial well-beings in the short run not just for the financial security of a job, but for the privilege of the ultimate dream job.

are you talking about fluffy bunny?
[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpP8yPjhk40[/YOUTUBE]

 

[HoustonDAT]

To the haters,

Op clearly states money is not his primary concern, he's merely curious. Kids, get of your high horses. If you put yourself through 8 years of college to work on teeth without thought of compensation, you're a *******.

Thx

Check and mate

 

[lululime]

are you talking about fluffy bunny?
[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpP8yPjhk40[/YOUTUBE]

haha noooo.

Here's the theory of the test: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNvvL9j_SIs

And here's some funny kids being tested (skip to 0.45 s): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgCL3GnmIfY&feature=related

 

[chicagodds]

Yes dentists make a lot of money, IF you have low overhead, good location, good employees, willing to work hard and advertising.

I work 3 days a week, and some Saturdays. My partner works Monday and Friday, and the rest at his other clinic. At the end of the year I will be at 345k with payroll and distribution. My partner will be at around 400k.

I'm 30 years old and graduated in 2006, my partner is 31 and graduated in 2005.

Some guys I graduated with are well around 500k, but these guys work 6 days a week, ridiculous late hours. And then there are some who are associating b/w 100k to 200k.

Overall, dentistry is a great field and I recommend everyone to consider it prior to going into medicine. The lifestyle and stress free environment is completely worth it.

 

[pumpUup]

Yes dentists make a lot of money, IF you have low overhead, good location, good employees, willing to work hard and advertising.

I work 3 days a week, and some Saturdays. My partner works Monday and Friday, and the rest at his other clinic. At the end of the year I will be at 345k with payroll and distribution. My partner will be at around 400k.

I'm 30 years old and graduated in 2006, my partner is 31 and graduated in 2005.

Some guys I graduated with are well around 500k, but these guys work 6 days a week, ridiculous late hours. And then there are some who are associating b/w 100k to 200k.

Overall, dentistry is a great field and I recommend everyone to consider it prior to going into medicine. The lifestyle and stress free environment is completely worth it.

How do you know where the good location is? I am impressed that you guys make so much money. I am not even interested in making that much. Even half of what you guys make is gonna be more than enough for me.

What I am really worried about is
1st of all, I heard that it's very expensive to open a office
2nd, I don't know where to open
3rd, how to ask people to come to my office when they see hundreds of other dentists.

I don't mind working 7 days a week, 10 hrs a day.
But I am worried that if there is no patient, there is no work to do.

You said you have a partner. How did you find a partner? Did you guys gather money together and opened one office? Is it better to hire hygienists or better off to clean teeth by yourself?

 

[fishyfishy]

I never seen a jobless dentist or a doctor...

LOL... sure, it's rare, but it happens.

Go to the first page of threads in the "dental" forum. Search for the title that says "what should an unsuccessful dentist do?" with the first sentence: I'm again unemployed, this time for four months so far. Out of nine resumes I sent out, I only got one interview, for which I didn't get the job.

PS. If money isnt the motivator we would not have such brilliant doctors, dentists, etc... and many breakthroughs in science. Motivate the brightest everyone wins...

LOL... I think the best science and medicine is done when motivated by passion for the field, actually... In fact, I don't know a single research scientist who is in their field so they can be big ballin with thier ferraris and lamborginis.

 

[avatarftw]

Gosh, no. Not another idealistic pre-dent or pre-med student that "doesn't want money since its evil". There is nothing wrong with getting paid what you are worth. Why are there sacrificial lambs that don't want to make a certain amount of money. You'll especially have earned your keep when you are a dentist, doctor, pharmacist, podiatrist, etc. I keep on hearing people say, "I grew up poor, so I would work 70 hours a week for 40,000 a year." Money is not evil; it makes the world go 'round. You have to secure your financial independence before you help others financially. It is, obviously, easier to do so when you make more money.

Does anybody else get annoyed when people just don't want to make a fair compensation for their hard work?

Also, it depends on your definition of "a lot of money." Some think that 50,000 a year is a ton of money. Others scoff at 10 million a year. One health care CEO made 98.6 million dollars in exercised stock options a year ago. To him, a doctor or dentist salary is peanuts.

How do you know where the good location is? I am impressed that you guys make so much money. I am not even interested in making that much. Even half of what you guys make is gonna be more than enough for me.

What I am really worried about is
1st of all, I heard that it's very expensive to open a office
2nd, I don't know where to open
3rd, how to ask people to come to my office when they see hundreds of other dentists.

I don't mind working 7 days a week, 10 hrs a day.
But I am worried that if there is no patient, there is no work to do.

You said you have a partner. How did you find a partner? Did you guys gather money together and opened one office? Is it better to hire hygienists or better off to clean teeth by yourself?

 

[Baani]

Do u ppl have similar opinions (about job opportunities/money) for the foreign trained dentists who pursue 2-yr international dentist programme and obtain the DDS degree?

 

[peanutb123]

LOL... sure, it's rare, but it happens.

Go to the first page of threads in the "dental" forum. Search for the title that says "what should an unsuccessful dentist do?" with the first sentence: I'm again unemployed, this time for four months so far. Out of nine resumes I sent out, I only got one interview, for which I didn't get the job.



LOL... I think the best science and medicine is done when motivated by passion for the field, actually... In fact, I don't know a single research scientist who is in their field so they can be big ballin with thier ferraris and lamborginis.

Very rare for unemployment but i am pretty sure its easy to find a job then other fields... the thread you were mentioning, I have added my input regarding the ops decision to go into other fields...


regarding your second comment... have you seen them getting paid less than 80K...? yes there must be passion. But if that passion does not pay... I am pretty sure they will look into other options. I said money is the motivator, but i never said that everyone would become millionaires ballers...

If you also look at some of the research scientists... They leave their home countries(not b/c there are no resources available) to come here b/c the mighty $ pays better for the amount of work they put into their research.

 

[chicagodds]

How do you know where the good location is? I am impressed that you guys make so much money. I am not even interested in making that much. Even half of what you guys make is gonna be more than enough for me.

What I am really worried about is
1st of all, I heard that it's very expensive to open a office
2nd, I don't know where to open
3rd, how to ask people to come to my office when they see hundreds of other dentists.

I don't mind working 7 days a week, 10 hrs a day.
But I am worried that if there is no patient, there is no work to do.

You said you have a partner. How did you find a partner? Did you guys gather money together and opened one office? Is it better to hire hygienists or better off to clean teeth by yourself?

You have to pick a place on a busy intersection, with walking traffic. Ideally the best places to start an office are in medical practice buildings. The cost is cheap and the other doctors can refer patients to you. The best is when a pediatrician is on staff. Peds and Dentists work wonders together.

It can be very expensive to start up if you pick companies such as Patterson, or Schein to help you plan and build out your clinic. Look into smaller names, private guys that give you the personalized attention you need, and will also come a lot cheaper too. Get the equipment that works. Don't spend money on a fancy autoclave or Hu-Friedy instruments, get something that will work.

Where to open is tricky. In larger cities, its very saturated with offices, but the population is so great with patients. In smaller cities, you can be the only dentist around getting all the patients, or barely getting any. The key is to find that perfect mix of good insurance patients, cash patients, and medicaid patients. That is where you will profit the most.

The way you will have patients see you is if you offer services that the next guy can't. Get good at oral surgery. Get good at endo, take an implant course, start doing limited ortho, etc. Don't refer anyone out, unless absolutely necessary. You'd be surprised on how many dentists out there are scared to pull a tooth, lol....

Met my partner in dental school. Get in with someone you were good friends with and is willing to work hard and has the same attitude and philosophy towards dentistry that you have. Then you will work well together.

We took a small loan out and bought everything, made our money back within the first two months. I wouldn't bother with a hygienist initially, unless you get so swamped with patients, and find yourself busy with other stuff, then yes. Otherwise its just someone whom you've hired to take money out of your pocket for something that you could have done for yourself.

After year 3 of associating I believe everyone is ready to jump to opening an office. Gotta take the risk to get the reward, and it will be well worth it, don't be scared.

 

[fishyfishy]

yes there must be passion. But if that passion does not pay... I am pretty sure they will look into other options.

I think you don't really understand what the term passion means. You are saying that if someone is truly passionate about something, they will still go into another field because they aren't making enough money?

have you seen them getting paid less than 80K...?

I worked in genetics research for 3 years, my gf worked in bio fuel research for 2 years. The only people who made over 80K had PhDs (6 yrs+ to obtain). Most research scientists with over a decade of experience had salaries limited at 120K. Guess who made double or triple that with half the experience? Finance dept, and management.

If you also look at some of the research scientists... They leave their home countries(not b/c there are no resources available) to come here b/c the mighty $ pays better for the amount of work they put into their research.

I feel like you are making many many assumptions about a field you probably have very little experience with. Actually, most research scientists come to the US because our educational system is superior with superior resources. Many researchers I have spoken to prefer living back home due to cheaper living expenses, and lower taxes.

 

[dentalWorks]

I think you don't really understand what the term passion means. You are saying that if someone is truly passionate about something, they will still go into another field because they aren't making enough money?

Well, yeh. Im sorry friend, but many times, "passion" doesn't pay the bills, it doesn't help secure a good college trust fund for your children, it doesn't help you establish your own business (which is a reward in itself), and finally, passion alot of times, flat out sucks when it comes to compensation and job security. There are many aspects to life OTHER than "passion", like establishing a steady (and good) cash flow for your family is far more important that your personal interests, irrespective of how humanitarian they might be.

I worked in genetics research for 3 years, my gf worked in bio fuel research for 2 years. The only people who made over 80K had PhDs (6 yrs+ to obtain). Most research scientists with over a decade of experience had salaries limited at 120K. Guess who made double or triple that with half the experience? Finance dept, and management.

You are right. The upper management (and finance) folks DO make more money than your average researcher. But here is the million dollar question, how easy is it to land a high-paying job in management these days? What happens when you spend 10-15 years establishing yourself at a firm, and probably pushing 150-200k a year, and OUTTA NO WHERE, layoff period comes around and you were the first to go...... thats right, back to unemployment for the next 6-9 months earning 350 dollars a week. And the scenario I just described can happen to any researcher as well, any engineer, ANYONE who basically works for a company that he doesn't own nor have any shares in.

I feel like you are making many many assumptions about a field you probably have very little experience with. Actually, most research scientists come to the US because our educational system is superior with superior resources. Many researchers I have spoken to prefer living back home due to cheaper living expenses, and lower taxes.

Right again, but what does that REALLY equate to? Strong educational system = superior resources = superior labs and lab equipment = if they finally come up with a breakthrough = self satisfaction + $$$$$$$$$$$$ (the ladder being most important)



Now trust me, I do believe there are good-natured people out there, those who TRULY care about improving humanity as a whole by providing their scientific breakthroughs.... but lets not kid ourselves, MAJORITY of people aren't exactly like that.

 

[BestDoctorEver]

Dentists make good living...The ones that I know in South FL have big house (in some cases more than one) and drive luxury cars. I am positive they must have a nice income to be able to pay for these stuffs.

 

[redchesus]

(the ladder being most important)

*imagines a really important ladder*

 

[davidae85]

simply put....... dentists make AAAALLLLLLOOOOT of freakin money......

it gets listed as one of the top 5 highest paying professions in the U.S every year.....

youll have so much money, youll be wiping your ass with it......

just make sure you never become arrogant or snobbish. thats what happens to people.... well it seems like its already happened to some people on this forum....

 

[coolslugs]

simply put....... dentists make AAAALLLLLLOOOOT of freakin money......

just make sure you never become arrogant or snobbish. thats what happens to people.... well it seems like its already happened to some people on this forum....

 

[In2Infinity]

Well i've shadowed with two dentists, and this is in a smaller town in Ontario. The periodontist said he makes usually 400k a year. Some years a bit less, depending on obviously how busy he is. He said right out of dental school, a dentist working for someone else would make about 40% of the amount of bills they dish out - which again is very nice for paying back some big loans.

The general dentist i have shadowed with, although he is one of the most popular in the town, said that once you are a partner in a business, you can make between 250k-300k.

Besides for these two occasions, i have no idea what other dentists make, and only had a general idea up until a while ago. I could be making these values up but i am not, and they do seem pretty sweet! I am sure that no one would go through all the trouble of very hard work and studying in university and in dental school if they were going to come out with a DSD degree and be making the same cash as your average business worker.

 

[peanutb123]

I feel like you are making many many assumptions about a field you probably have very little experience with. Actually, most research scientists come to the US because our educational system is superior with superior resources. Many researchers I have spoken to prefer living back home due to cheaper living expenses, and lower taxes.

I am not gonna repeat what DentalWorks has said...

But, let me tell you this. If they prefer cheaper living+Low taxes... then why do they come to America... OHH wait they dont tell you about the cheaper salaries that they receive for their hard work.

what you have said about educational system being superior is very true, but if there is no $/high paying jobs to back it up then there wouldnt be so many people immigrating to this country just to get "educaiton".


For ex. just look at the all the engineering fields... $$$

US 1 year job salary := 4-5+ years Job salary in other countries... NOW YOU TELL ME... why do people come to US.

regarding your comment about my assumptions/ my little experience... I have done my MS studies along with these people and i have worked with these people so i do know a thing or 2 about how these people think.

 

[HoustonDAT]

The way you will have patients see you is if you offer services that the next guy can't. Get good at oral surgery. Get good at endo, take an implant course, start doing limited ortho, etc. Don't refer anyone out, unless absolutely necessary. You'd be surprised on how many dentists out there are scared to pull a tooth, lol....

It boggles my mind when I see some dentists habitually let easy money walk right out of the door.

 

[df2390]

just posing a question. Does it pay to become an oral surgeon? the reason i am asking is because if you calculate how much they have to take out in loans, 4 yrs dental school, then 4 yrs of residency (could be another 2 yrs of tuition for med school if the oral surgeon decides to get his md) then you are looking at 400k + in loans.

 

[dentalWorks]

just posing a question. Does it pay to become an oral surgeon? the reason i am asking is because if you calculate how much they have to take out in loans, 4 yrs dental school, then 4 yrs of residency (could be another 2 yrs of tuition for med school if the oral surgeon decides to get his md) then you are looking at 400k + in loans.

I am not an oral surgeon, nor do I know what the reasons are for people to go into it.... but I can imagine that folks going through those rigorous 4+ years of residency don't exactly do it for the money. They do it cause its something that interests them (the job style that is).

However, you might be right, if someone is doing healthcare PURELY for the money (and there is NOTHING wrong with that), then maybe finishing 4 years of dental school and right away getting into the job market might sound like a better business plan, since you start hitting that nice income while your classmate spends the next 4-6 years doing residency making a fraction of what you make..... And by time he finishes the residency, you'll mostly like have established your own private practice.

 

[fishyfishy]

Well, yeh. Im sorry friend, but many times, "passion" doesn't pay the bills, it doesn't help secure a good college trust fund for your children, it doesn't help you establish your own business (which is a reward in itself), and finally, passion alot of times, flat out sucks when it comes to compensation and job security. There are many aspects to life OTHER than "passion", like establishing a steady (and good) cash flow for your family is far more important that your personal interests, irrespective of how humanitarian they might be.

You also clearly do not understand what passion for a job means. Passion for something means it is first in your life. Passion for a job means not dating or marrying until you have accomplished what you set out to. Passion means not caring if you are rewarded for what you do, because you do it for the satisfaction it gives you. Passion is sacrifice. Sad that you don't know this... It's OK, it is a sad product of a younger generation being sucked into a materialistic hole.

Right again, but what does that REALLY equate to? Strong educational system = superior resources = superior labs and lab equipment = if they finally come up with a breakthrough = self satisfaction + $$$$$$$$$$$$ (the ladder being most important)

It doesn't take a genius to realize that your equation is quite flawed. I don't know when superior education started equaling "if they make a breakthrough" which somehow then equals "$$$??" I'll just put it as this: when you make a scientific breakthrough, it does not guarantee any type of money. If you make a breakthrough, you will get published, your name will garner respect, and you will be able to pull in more grant money: FOR FUTURE RESEARCH. Now, if you happen to be business oriented, then you may apply for a patent on your breakthrough, if perhaps it has some type of commercial value (the vast majority of research outcome does NOT have commercial value). Now, if you are able to get a patent, you need to hope a VC or established business will actually want what you discovered, and then negotiations can begin. Finally, if you strike a deal and make some money, you pay a huge percentage back to whatever facility you worked with to make that discovery (i.e. at Stanford, we had to pay 50% of any earnings or grants, immediately). Of course taking off taxes and etc, and you actually got paid quite little for the amount of time and energy you spent.. That is, if you made it through all the loopholes I just described. Did you know any of this when you created that silly equation?

Now trust me, I do believe there are good-natured people out there, those who TRULY care about improving humanity as a whole by providing their scientific breakthroughs.... but lets not kid ourselves, MAJORITY of people aren't exactly like that.

Truth. And an unfortunate one at that too.

US 1 year job salary := 4-5+ years Job salary in other countries... NOW YOU TELL ME... why do people come to US.

Hm... this really depends on so many variables I find it funny that you have put it in an equation as well.

Let me give you something to ponder: I have two sisters, one in the US, one in an Asian country. Both work in similar fields. The one in the US makes 85K, and has 30% income tax, 9% sales tax, 1.5K/mo rent, car payments, gas, insurance, etc. The one in Asia makes 60K, 20% income tax, no sales tax, 800/mo rent (with >sq ft) no car payments, gas, insurance, etc (public transport) and cheap food. Interestingly enough, the sister in Asia manages to save a good 10K/yr more than the on in the US... Not such a simple equation, is it?

US used to dominate the world economy. This simply is not true anymore. If people are not willing to think outside that box, then it is their (your) loss.

Anyways, this discussion has totally tangented off topic. The bottom line is that if you are in DENTISTRY for money, you will be sorely disappointed by the return on investment. Read more threads and educate yourself on the real, total costs of a dental education and cost to start a business, as well as the CURRENT economic situation of many dentists. Dentistry is not a smart way to get rich, it just provides a relatively stable career.

 

[fishyfishy]

I am not an oral surgeon, nor do I know what the reasons are for people to go into it.... but I can imagine that folks going through those rigorous 4+ years of residency don't exactly do it for the money. They do it cause its something that interests them (the job style that is).

However, you might be right, if someone is doing healthcare PURELY for the money (and there is NOTHING wrong with that), then maybe finishing 4 years of dental school and right away getting into the job market might sound like a better business plan, since you start hitting that nice income while your classmate spends the next 4-6 years doing residency making a fraction of what you make..... And by time he finishes the residency, you'll mostly like have established your own private practice.

DUDE. You need some help with your math.

Avg GP makes 200K/yr. Avg OMFS makes 400K/yr. Avg GP starting pay is ~100K/yr. Do the math. Realize that the OMFS will supercede the GP VERY quickly unless the GP somehow has insane business skills and has managed to set up a thriving business chain in this ridiculous economic climate. Even then, the GP will have startup costs and business loans that will far outweigh the OMFS operating costs.