Do smaller university pre-meds still have a shot @ harvard/stanford med?

[deleted621740]

Just curious what everyone's two cents were. Is it realistic to graduate from a smaller university and get into harvard/stanford medical school? (Considering that gpa, MCAT, and EC's were competitive enough) ??

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[Bovary]

Yes. Maybe graduates from schools like Harvard/Yale/etc get a slight bump, but your alma mater is not likely to be the single factor that holds you back. If your grades, scores, experiences, letters, etc. are all exceptionally strong, then you'll have a comparable shot at Harvard med.

 

[otterxavier]

From http://hms.harvard.edu/departments/admissions/applying/selection-factors/admissions-statistics : Members of the Fall 2013 HMS entering class are from 72 undergraduate institutions.

So at least 10% of the students who entered HMS last year did their undergrad at schools that aren't in the top 50. At least.

 

[theseeker4]

Just curious what everyone's two cents were. Is it realistic to graduate from a smaller university and get into harvard/stanford medical school? (Considering that gpa, MCAT, and EC's were competitive enough) ??

Yes, assuming stats are good enough, and the ECs are impressive enough, they would have a shot.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

So you're only applying to 2 schools? Why not include Penn, Hopkins, UCSF, and Wash U to increase your chances (from any undergrad).

 

[Goro]

I would love to hear what my learned colleague @LizzyM would have to say on this, as she is an Adcom member at a school of this caliber.

Just curious what everyone's two cents were. Is it realistic to graduate from a smaller university and get into harvard/stanford medical school? (Considering that gpa, MCAT, and EC's were competitive enough) ??

 

[Dr. Retractor]

I think it's much more difficult. I go to a school that's not small (in terms of # of students) but it's RNP on USNWR. Not too many people get into medical school at all from my school and those that do are all DO/<top 50. People here definitely do well on their MCAT (I know quite a few with 35+ scores) and have reasonable to above average ECs but the fact that they went to this school definitely holds them back, and I expect the same fate. I guess it has to do with the fact the (perceived) quality of education is low so adcoms think we aren't well prepared for med school.

 

[LizzyM]

What do you mean by "smaller"? There are small schools that are very highly regarded and small schools that are not. Liberal arts colleges (LACs) that are hard to get into and who admit just the cream of the crop are highly regarded by adcoms. At the other extreme, an applicant from a small LAC that is everyone's "safety" will have more of a challenge. Often the concern is that a student at such a school had an easier time earning A's in such a school compared with a student at a school that is loaded with students who graduated in the top 5% of their HS class. Therefore, as well as having an exceptionally high GPA, a student from a less competitive undergrad institution (and this goes for some big state schools, too) needs to have a MCAT that shows that the GPA was genuine.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Some schools that are not nationally ranked (this is the case with mine) have science professors with PhD's from very prestigious universities/departments. They may not have the MIT grant $, but nevertheless, they have the tools to prepare their students for careers in science and health (and this also applies to professors with PhD's from lesser known programs). In addition, their LOR's are certainly valued by top med schools, otherwise my peers would not have received interview invites and acceptances from Stanford, Columbia, NYU, Hopkins etc.

Edit: If the school has smaller science classes, then the professors will know you better and this is obviously advantageous in terms of LOR's.

 

[Lil Mick]

Yes, it is possible (even MD/PhD). You just need a solid gpa, high MCAT, and great extracurricular activities like the other students applying to those schools typically have. Send me a pm if you want to know my stats/ECs for an idea of what you need from a lower-ranked undergrad...

 

[medicalmnt]

Small private LAC include schools range from Vassar/Colby to SomeRandomNeverHeardBefore College.
Vassar/Colby are one of the best UG schools in USA. I think you should give us a list of schools you're planning to go to. That's like saying I go to large public unversity and acting like they're all the same. UVA>>>>>Wyoming State Institute College University.

Back on topic, I know LAC schools tend to have a grade inflation and depending on the school you're competing against 4.3 HS 2,400SAT students or 2.0 1300SAT students.
Wherever you go, try to get a 4.0 and 45. Don't care what other people think until you get rejected from everywhere with 4.0/45mcat and you're not socially awkward and adcoms specifically tell you "you're not in because you went to some random school"

 

[deleted621740]

So you're only applying to 2 schools? Why not include Penn, Hopkins, UCSF, and Wash U to increase your chances (from any undergrad).

. No I'm not only applying to 2 schools, I used those two schools just for the sake of the question and regarding all schools of harvard/ stanford caliber

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

. No I'm not only applying to 2 schools, I used those two schools just for the sake of the question and regarding all schools of harvard/ stanford caliber

I was kidding. Although, which other schools constitute the Stanford/Harvard caliber? Is it just Hopkins, Penn, and UCSF? Or can we also include Columbia and a few others? Believe it or not, ppl even have "prestige arguments" about the aforementioned schools.

 

[Skittsie13]

@LizzyM, I realize this can be pretty subjective, but what would you say is the ranking cutoff for a highly-regarded liberal arts college, and what would it be for one that adcoms are skeptical of?

 

[LizzyM]

top 25 or top 50 might be the cut off for some adcom members. There might be regional biases -- if a school is small but well regarded regionally, you could have a good shot at med schools that are nearby or if you get an adcom reviewer who comes from that region and is familiar with the school.

 

[Dr. Retractor]

top 25 or top 50 might be the cut off for some adcom members. There might be regional biases -- if a school is small but well regarded regionally, you could have a good shot at med schools that are nearby or if you get an adcom reviewer who comes from that region and is familiar with the school.

So if an applicant came from a school that is unranked, that would weaken the application drastically? Even with same or better stats and ECs as someone who went to a top 20?

 

[LizzyM]

With the same stats, the student from the higher ranked school will be considered stronger because the GPA was earned in a tougher climate (all those HS 4.0 SAT 2400's). If the grades and scores are top notch (39/3.9) then a no-name school is less of an issue and if the school is in a state that isn't otherwise represented at that med school or the applicant is from a state that is not otherwise represented, then it might work to the applicant's advantage.

 

[spik]

Just curious what everyone's two cents were. Is it realistic to graduate from a smaller university and get into harvard/stanford medical school? (Considering that gpa, MCAT, and EC's were competitive enough) ??

Yes, two of my friends from my mid-tier public school (definitely not in top 50) ended up at Harvard and Yale.

 

[ojy77511]

If the cut off is 25 thats crazy.. Major top public universities would be cut out...

 

[LizzyM]

If the cut off is 25 thats crazy.. Major top public universities would be cut out...

It is not that anyone from a school not in the top 25 is not considered, but that they aren't given brownie points for having attended a "top school" where it is assumed that the competition was brilliant and that grades reflect that.

 

[ThisCouldBeYou]

It is not that anyone from a school not in the top 25 is not considered, but that they aren't given brownie points for having attended a "top school" where it is assumed that the competition was brilliant and that grades reflect that.

I love your comment here @LizzyM …. brownie points! That's not quite the same thing as "gpa x 10 + MCAT + 1/-1" but something extra nonetheless.

 

[moop]

It is not that anyone from a school not in the top 25 is not considered, but that they aren't given brownie points for having attended a "top school" where it is assumed that the competition was brilliant and that grades reflect that.

I love your comment here @LizzyM …. brownie points! That's not quite the same thing as "gpa x 10 + MCAT + 1/-1" but something extra nonetheless.

That's probably the best way to actually reflect what they think of a top school transcript. "Top school? Great, that's a little better," not "Top school? Great, so he's got a 3.95, not 3.85 as his transcript says." The former seems much much more realistic.