Does PD and Residency Faculty have to be Board Certified?

[pinkyj731]

Hi,
Does the PD of the program and program faculty have to be board certified? Is this a rule by ABPN? I'm sure they have to have completed residency and at least be board eligible, but in order to be employed as faculty in the program, shouldn't their medical knowledge have to be up to date and at least up to par with a passing board score every 10 years per ACGME/ABPN?

Thanks

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[FlowRate]

shouldn't their medical knowledge have to be up to date and at least up to par with a passing board score every 10 years per ACGME/ABPN?

You give the boards too much credit.

 

[PikminOC]

Not quite. The ACGME just says that they have to acceptable qualifications. For the PD this is typically board certification but could be say a foreign equivalent if they trained in a different country. In practice nowadays most hospitals are requiring board certification but some do not (yet) require and there are quite a few excellent psychiatrists who are not board certified. They don't have to have completed residency training, they could have completed an equivalent training in another country. Also older psychiatrists have lifetime certifications so don't have to do MOC which is BS anyway

What foreign equivalent? To become a psychiatrist in the us, you have to complete residency here. Are u referring to a pd who didn't complete residency here?

 

[splik]

What foreign equivalent? To become a psychiatrist in the us, you have to complete residency here. Are u referring to a pd who didn't complete residency here?

that is not quite true. Prior to 2005 psychiatrists from other countries (such as the UK) could practice in the US. I know at least one PD who did not complete residency training in the US at one of the largest psychiatry departments in the country. Also technically if a hospital sponsors you in many states you could technically work without having completed US residency training but you would never be able to work anywhere else. Unfortunately as board certification etc is increasingly be required by insurance companies this is becoming less viable.

 

[PikminOC]

that is not quite true. Prior to 2005 psychiatrists from other countries (such as the UK) could practice in the US. I know at least one PD who did not complete residency training in the US and is not board certified at one of the largest psychiatry departments in the country. Also technically if a hospital sponsors you in many states you could technically work without having completed US residency training but you would never be able to work anywhere else. Unfortunately as board certification etc is increasingly be required by insurance companies this is becoming less viable.

Interesting. I have not come across these docs. Is it only with psych or with other fields too? India as well?

 

[WingedOx]

that is not quite true. Prior to 2005 psychiatrists from other countries (such as the UK) could practice in the US. I know at least one PD who did not complete residency training in the US at one of the largest psychiatry departments in the country. Also technically if a hospital sponsors you in many states you could technically work without having completed US residency training but you would never be able to work anywhere else. Unfortunately as board certification etc is increasingly be required by insurance companies this is becoming less viable.

I have a hunch who yinz might be referring to...

 

[Blitz2006]

Actually this is much more common in surgical subspecialties like trauma surgery and anesthesia especially at academic medical centers where pay is low so they find it hard to find people. From what I understand this is now becoming very difficult because of the need for board certification but it was not unheard of for people from the UK, Ireland, Australia, NZ and a few other countries to come and practice in the US having completed training elsewhere. If you look at the anesthesia faculty at many academic medical centers they are often foreign trained. However sometimes they completed a subspecialty fellowship (but not residency) in the US. I can't imagine it was ever possible to work here with training from India.

This is correct. I know a family friend who trained overseas, and practices orthopedics in an academic center. But a lot of these foreign docs practice in the U.S on a "restricted license", meaning they can only work in that specific academic institution (so they can't move from Harvard to Yale, etc) and are unable to do PP if they wanted to.

So very restrictive.

But this is many years ago (1990s), not sure if this model still exists.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

Rules on restricted licenses vary by state, but the ACGME is the entity that requires PDs to be board certified. The language does have some wiggle room suggesting that arguments that a PD possesses roughly equivalent qualifications would be considered. On top of this is the trend that most academic medical centers require all physicians to be board certified. I agree with FlowRate, being board certified doesn’t guarantee you aren’t a complete idiot.

 

[daru1]

So what about states like Oklahoma that are saying that board certification can't be a condition of employment? Or did I get some bad info on that MOC law? I'm not BC, and never will be (I have better things to spend my money on). The insurance companies here don't have that as a requirement.

 

[MacDonaldTriad]

It depends on the bylaws of what ever staff association process your hospital has for granting treatment privileges. If you don't to hospital work, then it is up to the insurance carriers.

 

[ara96]

I thought it was super important to pass boards from an employment standpoint. I'm shocked that major academic institutions don't require this. Why am I splitting hairs over my PRITE studying then?

 

[splik]

I thought it was super important to pass boards from an employment standpoint. I'm shocked that major academic institutions don't require this. Why am I splitting hairs over my PRITE studying then?

why are you? the PRITE is supposed to be a learning tool to give you a sense of how your doing, allow your program to evaluate its strengths and weaknesses in teaching various topics, has nothing to do with the boards and the new PRITE is very divergent in content from the boards

that said, yes most major academic institutions require passing the boards

 

[Shikima]

There used to be a time that boards were optional and voluntary.

 

[daru1]

There used to be a time that boards were optional and voluntary.

They still are. For the life of me I can't figure out why people think differently.

 

[clausewitz2]

I have a hunch who yinz might be referring to...

You don't have to be a jagoff about it...

 

[psychotropical]

They still are. For the life of me I can't figure out why people think differently.

Every desirable and civilized place in the country is starting to require them at hospitals. The system is geared towards exams and expanding knowledge.