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Uh so. Who is the booster? If there is one? From way back when? Or was that an item?

I mean they don't need to out themselves but if anyone knows who that is it just occured to me that I have no idea and I wanted to be sure said person actually exists.
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WildZoo said:
Uh so. Who is the booster? If there is one? From way back when? Or was that an item?

I mean they don't need to out themselves but if anyone knows who that is it just occured to me that I have no idea and I wanted to be sure said person actually exists.
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I am aware of this person. Go figure? lol
 
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I am having a hard time here. I think we only have a convert left. There isn't much left for me to figure out. That indicates to me that either someone is playing damn well if an original if left, or I have messed up somewhere. which is possible, but I would like to think not. haha
 
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vetmedhead said:
For everybody looking for PBC you should know that she's taking the GRE again right now. I don't know if she'll be back before lynch closes or not.
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Oh this is a funny find, how in the world did VMH know this I wonder? :p The things you find when reading through wolf posts.
 
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So, I have zero info on guise and WZ except the life attempt and head bonking. However Kam has spoken up at least for guise, and I trust Kam. I don't believe it is LIS for reasons, and FFM hasn't been around enough in my mind to be considered a wolf. It could be that someone in Ruatha completely missed the abs reveal that she was bringing me back last night, but consider that lower on the likely scale. I don't know. This is why I think there is only one left.
 
Lupin21 said:
I am aware of this person. Go figure? lol
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Ok good, just again trying to cover all bases. I tend to forget a lot of things over the course of the game so I'll reread and be like OH NO WE MISSED THIS. But I'm glad it's nothing this time.
 
Lupin21 said:
So, I have zero info on guise and WZ except the life attempt and head bonking. However Kam has spoken up at least for guise, and I trust Kam. I don't believe it is LIS for reasons, and FFM hasn't been around enough in my mind to be considered a wolf. It could be that someone in Ruatha completely missed the abs reveal that she was bringing me back last night, but consider that lower on the likely scale. I don't know. This is why I think there is only one left.
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See I get myself into these positions because I don't share my role with anyone ever unless I absolutely have to. Have extra reason not to do so here. The rest of my role shouldn't matter since we're looking for a convert, but in case you are in any way worried about an original, I am F'lessan.
 
WildZoo said:
See I get myself into these positions because I don't share my role with anyone ever unless I absolutely have to. Have extra reason not to do so here. The rest of my role shouldn't matter since we're looking for a convert, but in case you are in any way worried about an original, I am F'lessan.
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haha! I didn't have you down as an original by any means due to the headbonking. That bonking is the whole game. :laugh:
 
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Lupin21 said:
So, I have zero info on guise and WZ except the life attempt and head bonking. However Kam has spoken up at least for guise, and I trust Kam. I don't believe it is LIS for reasons, and FFM hasn't been around enough in my mind to be considered a wolf. It could be that someone in Ruatha completely missed the abs reveal that she was bringing me back last night, but consider that lower on the likely scale. I don't know. This is why I think there is only one left.
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Could it be that they saw it but let her bring you back because if they killed her the spotlight would be on Ruatha? Meanwhile since they let her do it, it soft clears the whole group?

I mean, these are tough numbers for a single convert, I can see some fancy play happening.
 
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WildZoo said:
Could it be that they saw it but let her bring you back because if they killed her the spotlight would be on Ruatha? Meanwhile since they let her do it, it soft clears the whole group?

I mean, these are tough numbers for a single convert, I can see some fancy play happening.
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Ooo. I hadn't really thought about that. Does that point to conceit that I would be too big a threat to bring back?!
 
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Lupin21 said:
Ooo. I hadn't really thought about that. Does that point to conceit that I would be too big a threat to bring back?!
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Hehe. Maybe ;) Which, yeah, you are too big of a threat, and a wolf in a position where they think they have a real good chance of winning would NOT do what I'm proposing. But I'm thinking of myself in the end of Trilt's Favorite Things game. The other wolves were all dead like 2 days after I was converted. 14 players left or something like that. You know you're not gonna win but you want to drag it out as long as possible, and if letting someone get resurrected gets everyone to look to the other hold, that's at least a shot at a few lynches before the focus is back on Ruatha, before people get paranoid again. Meanwhile if you kill the resurrector, chances are you get lynched sooner rather than later.

Not saying it's definitely what happened, but I'm not discounting the possibility of a convert in Ruatha at all.
 
Lupin21 said:
So, I have zero info on guise and WZ except the life attempt and head bonking. However Kam has spoken up at least for guise, and I trust Kam. I don't believe it is LIS for reasons, and FFM hasn't been around enough in my mind to be considered a wolf. It could be that someone in Ruatha completely missed the abs reveal that she was bringing me back last night, but consider that lower on the likely scale. I don't know. This is why I think there is only one left.
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Just to be clear on this, I'm confident Guis isn't an original but don't have any way of knowing whether or not she's a convert. So she's not our third party, but beyond that, I don't know.

Got off work so I'll take some time to look back through things before committing to a lynch.
 
Kam325 said:
Just to be clear on this, I'm confident Guis isn't an original but don't have any way of knowing whether or not she's a convert. So she's not our third party, but beyond that, I don't know.

Got off work so I'll take some time to look back through things before committing to a lynch.
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nah. I got what you were saying. One of the reasons I am still thinking we may not have an original. I am waiting to see what all is said on this point to finalize that decision.
 
I'm bringing up an old theory, but with more people dead it could be more useful.

Telgar Tithes
N1 - MJ - confirmed villager
N2 - Kam - almost certainly village. also almost certain this tithe went through.
N3 - WZ - i know i'm village, but, ya know, can't say it's "confirmed."
N4 - guis - hmm, a possibility
THREAD - no injuries
N5 - MJ; night cancelled
N6 - MJ - confirmed village
N7 -FFM - tithe went to Promo
THREAD - Kam and WZ injured

One of these injuries is accounted for by the night cancellation.
If our theory about missed tithes = number of players injured is correct (it has held true, mostly), then I see two options here.
1) Guis withdrew her tithe. This is...complicated though...because that means someone should have been injured in the first thread fall. If it was guis, then fine, she lied and said she wasn't injured. BUT she also sent me the healing item to use on n6, which doesn't make sense if she was injured herself.
2) Kam lied about her injury. I just find this highly unlikely. When I talk about a desperate wolf favoring fancy play, I don't mean downright insane play, and that's what this would require.

So perhaps here I have talked myself into this theory completely falling apart. I kind of wanted to cross reference with Ruatha. But again if we never missed a night besides the night cancellation, I just don't understand two of us being injured. :shrug:
 
Trilt said:
KC is a nicer mod than I. Mistakes will happen, and l will absolutely work on the back end to try and make up for it, but I don't generally like to confirm things on thread. I like when people lie about me too much to set that precedent.
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I'm not saying a mod should correct a lie that a player made about them. I've lied - and I think a lot of us have - a number of times about what a mod said.

But when a mod makes a mistake that could influence play (as in, mod makes a mistake, player says "hey the mod goofed up", and then people don't believe the player), I feel like the mod has the obligation to step in and confirm that mistake. Otherwise the mod's mistake is determining the direction of play rather than the players.
 
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Smattering of things as I start looking back through:
  • Re: the missing Ruatha tithe. I don't think it was STB for reasons. I don't think it was Promo for reasons. So I feel like RM must have withdrawn. I don't think he could have been the convert N1, way too early. But he could still be our lone wolf or chaos, but only if there's another way to explain the 2 kills the night he was bonked. If Gwen did come with an extra kill at conversion, RM could be the original loner we're looking for.
  • VMH screwed up on something when, backed into a corner, she posted a doctored role claim in our hold PM. Not only did the role PM seem like it could have easily been edited from a wolf-with-a-conversion-ability role, but is started like this---"Toric is the ambitious "Lord" Holder of Southern hold." You can see where I'm going with this. Assuming she worked on the cover in wolf PM before posting, the convert (the only member of her pack I believe was still alive and able to chat with her at that point) missed correcting this. There are some players I think would immediately recognize and point out the mistake. Others might not have run into similar villager-code tells in the past.
 
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**************
LetItSnow said:
I'm not saying a mod should correct a lie that a player made about them. I've lied - and I think a lot of us have - a number of times about what a mod said.

But when a mod makes a mistake that could influence play (as in, mod makes a mistake, player says "hey the mod goofed up", and then people don't believe the player), I feel like the mod has the obligation to step in and confirm that mistake. Otherwise the mod's mistake is determining the direction of play rather than the players.
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Oh, of course I don't mean a mod would correct a lie. My point there is that when a mod verifies (on the thread) that there has been a mistake, it sets precedent for them doing it again. That takes lying about the mod screwing up out of a liar's arsenal, because other people could ask it to be verified like before. I usually just apologize and try and fix things on the back end by offering to do something for the player to make up for it, which they could potentially use as "proof"... but which could also be faked by a wily wolf. If that all makes sense.

More generally, I just try not to **** up and make that moot, lol. Just doesn't always work. :)
**************
 
Flim Flam Man said:
So it would have been better to have two redirections instead of one that didn't have a net affect (except for wz not getting blocked)
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Are you saying that redirections are negative, and that it is better if there are fewer of them? That doesn't argue well for you. The goal of night actions is not to avoid having a net effect. They are opportunities to investigate other players and learn from interactions. You basically kept two players from being able to use their abilities, and gained no new information for the village by doing so.

If you didn't know that LIS was a blocker, and thought that their ability might have been harmful, then directing it at me wasn't benign.

If you did know that LIS was a blocker, then redirecting that to me when you knew that I was just going to redirect someone else's ability was not benign.
 
Ok, so I have reread the entire thread looking for interactions between the known wolves and other players, plus picking up other little tidbits where I could. Narrowed down my list enough that I'm pretty comfortable with the lynch today, since I feel FFM could be the convert or the mysterious third party. Posed a "crazy" theory last night concerning AM that most everyone else in my hold shut down, so I'll leave that alone. After FFM I have Deva and RM as possible options for converts, though really not much for the third party unless it's LIS, which I still think would be super underpowered.
 
Promethean said:
Are you saying that redirections are negative, and that it is better if there are fewer of them? That doesn't argue well for you. The goal of night actions is not to avoid having a net effect. They are opportunities to investigate other players and learn from interactions. You basically kept two players from being able to use their abilities, and gained no new information for the village by doing so.

If you didn't know that LIS was a blocker, and thought that their ability might have been harmful, then directing it at me wasn't benign.

If you did know that LIS was a blocker, then redirecting that to me when you knew that I was just going to redirect someone else's ability was not benign.
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Can be negative. Depends on who i use it on. I didn't know much about LIS, so i chose him. I chose you randomly.

That is all they're is too it
 
No plurality in this game, right? I'll unlynch if so, I want the full cycle available.
 
@Lupin21 , what do you think of the ability RM used on you? Could it fit with our third party?
 
WildZoo said:
Ok, so I have reread the entire thread looking for interactions between the known wolves and other players, plus picking up other little tidbits where I could. Narrowed down my list enough that I'm pretty comfortable with the lynch today, since I feel FFM could be the convert or the mysterious third party. Posed a "crazy" theory last night concerning AM that most everyone else in my hold shut down, so I'll leave that alone. After FFM I have Deva and RM as possible options for converts, though really not much for the third party unless it's LIS, which I still think would be super underpowered.
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Chaos is ridiculously overpowered most of the time. It is why chaos rarely wins
 
Flim Flam Man said:
Chaos is ridiculously overpowered most of the time. It is why chaos rarely wins
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There's a healthy balance though. I mean, you have to give them something, and if you're going to give them one ability... idk, blocking just doesn't seem like it would be it. Too much reason for both wolves and villagers to want to get rid of you. Just my opinion.
 
WildZoo said:
There's a healthy balance though. I mean, you have to give them something, and if you're going to give them one ability... idk, blocking just doesn't seem like it would be it. Too much reason for both wolves and villagers to want to get rid of you. Just my opinion.
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Healthy balance unless you are chaos.

I doubt LIS is chaos personally, but blocking is only a little inferior to redirecting one action per night
 
Flim Flam Man said:
Healthy balance unless you are chaos.

I doubt LIS is chaos personally, but blocking is only a little inferior to redirecting one action per night
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Only a little, yes, but inferior still. You're ahead on my list because I think you could be either of the people we're looking for.
 
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Lupin21 said:
If the wrong person were targeted, it would be unfortunate.
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Is there any evidence anywhere the ability was used twice on N2?

Did anyone still alive receive a tithe on N1 that doesn't fit with any known roles (aka could have been from RM)?
 
Trilt said:
**************

Oh, of course I don't mean a mod would correct a lie. My point there is that when a mod verifies (on the thread) that there has been a mistake, it sets precedent for them doing it again. That takes lying about the mod screwing up out of a liar's arsenal, because other people could ask it to be verified like before. I usually just apologize and try and fix things on the back end by offering to do something for the player to make up for it, which they could potentially use as "proof"... but which could also be faked by a wily wolf. If that all makes sense.

More generally, I just try not to **** up and make that moot, lol. Just doesn't always work. :)
**************
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Yeah, agreed. It does take "the mod screwed up" out of the arsenal, but I'm ok with that. There are TONS of other "the mod said" lies to be utilized. I just don't like when a mod goof - and we all make them - alters the course of play.
 
WildZoo said:
Hey isn't @LetItSnow the one who is always saying that lynching a blocker is just about the next best thing to lynching a wolf? :p

Or was it the other old man... :thinking:
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I can't speak for SOV (and I'm not sure how he feels about blockers) but you are mostly correct..... I've always said that if we accidentally lynch a villager blocker I feel it's not the worst thing in the world. Certainly better than accidentally lynching some other ability.

But I don't think it's smart to lynch a villager just because they are a blocker. That's dumb.

There are a few times I'm ok intentionally lynching a villager: 1) As a wolf, 2) When they are being particularly idiotic and are hurting the villager cause.

I think I voted to lynch myself once as a villager because people were so focused on my villagerness vs wolfness that I just felt it was better to break my own egg and move on.
 
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LetItSnow said:
I can't speak for SOV (and I'm not sure how he feels about blockers) but you are mostly correct..... I've always said that if we accidentally lynch a villager blocker I feel it's not the worst thing in the world. Certainly better than accidentally lynching some other ability.

But I don't think it's smart to lynch a villager just because they are a blocker. That's dumb.

There are a few times I'm ok intentionally lynching a villager: 1) As a wolf, 2) When they are being particularly idiotic and are hurting the villager cause.

I think I voted to lynch myself once as a villager because people were so focused on my villagerness vs wolfness that I just felt it was better to break my own egg and move on.
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Completely joking, it just suddenly occurred to me that I had seen you make that argument before, when someone had claimed to be a blocker, that it didn't matter much because accidentally lynching a villager blocker was no big deal.

You're a better man than me, I don't think I'm capable of breaking my own egg.
LetItSnow said:
P.S. Lynching CHAOS is the next best thing to lynching a wolf. Lynching a villager blocker is third. :)
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Heh. True enough.
 
Flim Flam Man said:
Can be negative. Depends on who i use it on. I didn't know much about LIS, so i chose him. I chose you randomly.

That is all they're is too it
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Randomly? Did you not read the thread yesterday?

You were the only one who tithed yesterday. I publicly said that I had received your tithe. (Though I didn't reveal what your ability was, even when I was suspicious of it AND once I understood it better, I made sure that no one was using my suspicion as the basis of their lynch of you.)

I just think that would make me a poor choice for randomly redirecting someone's ability onto. What if LIS had been the wolf, instead of a blocker?
 
Promethean said:
Randomly? Did you not read the thread yesterday?

You were the only one who tithed yesterday. I publicly said that I had received your tithe. (Though I didn't reveal what your ability was, even when I was suspicious of it AND once I understood it better, I made sure that no one was using my suspicion as the basis of their lynch of you.)

I just think that would make me a poor choice for randomly redirecting someone's ability onto. What if LIS had been the wolf, instead of a blocker?
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If LIS was the wolf, you would be dead or converted. :idea:

You didn't give up my role, but it is out there now. I am going to be lynched anyway.

I would state my role name, but it would lead everyone to think i was a wolf.
 
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