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Fundus Camera for color and FA

Discussion in 'Young Ophthalmologists' started by eyebolit, Nov 28, 2010.

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  1. eyebolit

    eyebolit Junior Member

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    Does anyone have any experience w/ Canon CF-1 Digital Mydriatic Retinal Camera? It's a slightly more economical and more ergonomic alternative to Topcon 50DX. Any sugestions for color/FA camera will be welcome.
  2. intoxicatedtiger

    intoxicatedtiger

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    I'm getting a Topcon NW8F nonmydriatic/mydriatic FA camera. Comes with imaging software. I was told that the Topcon 50dx mydriatic requires separate imaging software that costs an additional $15 to 20k. Not sure about the Canon.
  3. eyebolit

    eyebolit Junior Member

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    Topcon NW8F looks like a good camera. How much is it? The only function I wish it had is to be able to image peripheral fundus and not just macula.
  4. intoxicatedtiger

    intoxicatedtiger

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    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that imaging the peripheral retina was only a matter of taking a picture while the patient is looking up, down, left, or right. At least that's how I remember it being done in residency. In terms of the angle of coverage, the NW8F has 45 degrees, whereas the 50DX and CF-1 has 50. Although the Canon CX-1 nonmydriatic/mydriatic has 50 as well.

    Cal Coast quoted the NW8F at $38K, whereas the 50DX would go for $46Kish with the imaging software. I did see the CF-1 going for $33K on Veatch Ophthalmic, but not sure if that includes the software. I'd be curious to find out what you decide.

    The CX seems to have autofluorescence whereas the NW8F does not. Not sure if it matters to you.
  5. eyebolit

    eyebolit Junior Member

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    You are right that you can image some periphery by having pt look in the direction you want to image. There are also cameras like Canon CF1 and CX1 and Topcon DX50 that tilt up and down and to the sides and you are able to image further in periphery and you are less dependent on patient compliance.
    Have you done a demo on NW8F? How good are the images, FA? Is it easy to focus? I had the same quote for 33K for CF1 and it looks pretty impressive and less expensive than the rest. I will likely demo it. I think it comes w/ it's own canon software preloaded.
  6. intoxicatedtiger

    intoxicatedtiger

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    I havent demo'd the nw8f. It was a last minute decision and is pretty much a blind buy. The only images that I looked at were the ones online. You are definitely correct about the tilt options with the periphery. I should look into how good it nw8f is in capturing the periphery. I don't have to get to the Ora, but I would like to have the option to look for nonperfusion in the periphery.

    I was looking at the cf-1. The brochure might suggest that you might have to buy the actual camera separately. The cx-1 looks like it goes for $47k. If the cf-1 does come with imaging software, that probably is the best deal. I really don't need a nonmydriatic option, and would rather get something with more fa function.
  7. eyebolit

    eyebolit Junior Member

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    Have you checked out OIS eyescan? I demo'ed it recently and wasn't too impressed w/ color photos it takes as colors are very washed out. Red free were good and I suppose FA is probably ok. Two great things about it is that it's portable, doesn't take up much space and costs much less. They are promising better color photos but who knows. I wish it was a total package. Sounds like you do retina, so do I. What OCT are you using?
  8. intoxicatedtiger

    intoxicatedtiger

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    Actually, I'm comprehensive. I just had a ton of retina experience in residency.

    I inquired about the nw8f capability for capturing the periphery, and the vendor told me about "internal fixation, mosaic style" which I have no idea what it means, but he says it goes out to 92 degrees. I'm still going with the nw8f because the nearest vendor doesn't sell the canon, and I'd rather have good relationship with someone nearby for future maintenance issues. Also, I don't anticipate doing too many fa's anyway. Are you hiring a photographer or tech? I'm going to start out doing the whole thing on my own, since California doesn't allow photographers to start IV's anyway.

    I haven't looked at the OIS. We did use the imaging software in residency, and I thought the graphics were good, albeit super slow. I did think that OIS emr was crap though.

    The other camera I saw on the market was Kowa VX-10. Not sure what reputation Kowa has, but you might want to look at it.

    As for OCT, I got the Cirrus 4000. Would've preferred the Heidelberg, but not for $100k+. I still don't know what the difference between a Cirrus 400 and 4000 is, but got suckered into buying the 4000. The Topcon SD OCT actually looks pretty decent too by the way.

    As an aside, I've been blogging every step of my startup experience. Feel free to check it out at http://iballdoc.blogspot.com. Good luck with your practice.
  9. eyebolit

    eyebolit Junior Member

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    Thanks for sharing your experience. It's a great resourse for anyone starting out. I have picked up that I need corporate NPI which I didn't have.

    Wanted to share my experience today. I had IView OCT for a visit today to check it out. It's portable and quick, but it has a big weakness for retina as only does 5 lines or 2 lines. It doesn't produce that many sections through the retina and u could easily miss mild fluid. So I will be going for Heidelberg or Zeiss.

    Have you used your Haag Streit Stimuli Digital Acuity system? How do you like it?
  10. intoxicatedtiger

    intoxicatedtiger

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    Thanks for reading my blog. I appreciate it.

    As for the OCT, since in your specialty, the smallest pocket of fluid on one cut could sway you into reinjecting someone, you probably want to be as confident as possible that your patients are truly dry. If you can afford to go with the Heidelberg, you should. It's way cool. Also, you have the option of upgrading to an FA/OCT. Not sure how good the Spectralis' FA capabilities are, but it's there.

    With the Zeiss, you'll have the option of going with the Cirrus 400 or 4000. I think the cost difference is $10,000. I really don't know the difference. You probably want to inquire.

    I've used the Haag Stimuli in residency. Overall, it does what I want it to do. The remote control is pretty flimsy though, and mine broke in my last year. Also, the remote control buttons are really confusing, but once you get the hang of it, it's ok. I haven't tried any other systems.

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