"Funny quotes from 'less informed' pre-meds," On-Topic Edition

[Conflagration]

\I admire your tenacity but with a 3.2-3.4 GPA as a caucasian your odds of success aren't the best... 22.8% are accepted to a medical school. If you know your MCAT you have a better measure. The sexism that women and men apply to women entering the workforce is pretty depressing, but being a nurse is a great job too imo...

I keep trying to convince my non-medical friends to consider it (as well as PA). Great salary, relatively short career training + helping people. Wishing you all the best with your cycle!

My aggravation was more with the fact that she deemed me incapable of being a doctor because "I looked like a nurse" (still not sure what the hell that means, tbh), or that I was somehow beneath her for whatever perceived rationale she had. Particularly when she was doing worse than I was, and I would have helped her (and tried to help her), and she still was being nasty about it. You don't do that with friends- hence why she's my ex-friend.

And, by all means, I'm relatively early in the process, I'm still figuring out what I want. But to have someone talk down to you after telling them your goals is some serious BS, particularly since she knew full well I was getting a lot of comments for it.

Nursing at this point would be investing in another 2 years of a program that may or may not be what I want, which would be frustrating. I have a year left of essentially fluff and two gen-eds for a Math degree, which is why, at this time, it doesn't make sense for me to deal with nursing school, although I would consider it if I felt so called while shadowing.

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[aristrutz523]

I finally have one! I'm currently taking a summer class and this guy who still has his 4.0 told me that since he has his 4.0, is in ROTC (not enlisted) and "will have great recs" , "All I need is whatever is equivalent to a 25 on the MCAT since I have a 4.0. I don't want to do research if it's for free. I might shadow and volunteer a little bit this year, but I really don't want to do anything for free. Teachers asked me to TA for them but I said no because it was unpaid". I told him that I volunteer at both a hospital and a free clinic and described the positions and he told me they weren't medical enough. I told him it was still patient contact and he told me he wanted something more medical. We're juniors and he's going to be applying next May.... He also isn't a member of any clubs or anything but is planning on joining some stuff this year only fall semester. He doesn't want to do anything spring semester.

 

[hellofuturedentists]

"I'm only taking one science class now, intro to biology. I don't want to pile on too many science classes at once because it might be too hard. Next semester, I will try general chemistry"

Something tells me med school may be a bit more of a heavy courseload than taking only one introductory science course

 

[samac]

"I'm only taking one science class now, intro to biology. I don't want to pile on too many science classes at once because it might be too hard. Next semester, I will try general chemistry"

Something tells me med school may be a bit more of a heavy courseload than taking only one introductory science course

Now that's fair for your first freshman semester. My only science course was my intro to bio, our advisor set it that way so we get used to college coursework. Second semester was gen chem and A&P

 

[Goro]

He'll mature someday. The military makes people grow up really fast, too.

I finally have one! I'm currently taking a summer class and this guy who still has his 4.0 told me that since he has his 4.0, is in ROTC (not enlisted) and "will have great recs" , "All I need is whatever is equivalent to a 25 on the MCAT since I have a 4.0. I don't want to do research if it's for free. I might shadow and volunteer a little bit this year, but I really don't want to do anything for free. Teachers asked me to TA for them but I said no because it was unpaid". I told him that I volunteer at both a hospital and a free clinic and described the positions and he told me they weren't medical enough. I told him it was still patient contact and he told me he wanted something more medical. We're juniors and he's going to be applying next May.... He also isn't a member of any clubs or anything but is planning on joining some stuff this year only fall semester. He doesn't want to do anything spring semester.

 

[aristrutz523]

He'll mature someday. The military makes people grow up really fast, too.

He won't be enlisting. He's applying after this year to medical school. He only did ROTC for the free ride in college -_-

 

[hellofuturedentists]

Now that's fair for your first freshman semester. My only science course was my intro to bio, our advisor set it that way so we get used to college coursework. Second semester was gen chem and A&P

Maybe. At my school, though, it was highly advised to take intro to bio and general chemistry at the same time. I think she ended up dropping pre-med before she had to take organic chemistry

 

[Conflagration]

He won't be enlisting. He's applying after this year to medical school. He only did ROTC for the free ride in college -_-

I thought getting the scholarship meant that you had to enlist for as many years as you got aid.

On topic: I had a guy tell me that he was going to "test out of all the chemistry classes" and become a pharmacist. Like, no, you can't test out of Orgo, and even though you can for General Chem, it's ill-advised unless you really know your stuff. And what the hell did he think pharmacy school was going to be, Flavoring Cold Lollipops For Miscreant Children 101?

 

[nwts]

I thought getting the scholarship meant that you had to enlist for as many years as you got aid.

Technically, no, ROTC graduates do not enlist because participating in ROTC ends in being commissioned as an officer. Enlisting is when people who are not officers join the military. It tends to sound like just a difference in choice of terms to non-military people, but there is a huge difference to military personnel because there is an entirely different set of ranks for commissioned officers than for enlisted service people.

I know that what you actually meant with your post was that ROTC has a service requirement. I just thought I'd post about the meaning of the word "enlist" because I see a few people have used it in reference to officers, and I thought people might want to know the difference between enlisting and being commissioned as an officer.

 

[Conflagration]

Technically, no, ROTC graduates do not enlist because participating in ROTC ends in being commissioned as an officer. Enlisting is when people who are not officers join the military. It tends to sound like just a difference in choice of terms to non-military people, but there is a huge difference to military personnel because there is an entirely different set of ranks for commissioned officers than for enlisted service people.

I know that what you actually meant with your post was that ROTC has a service requirement. I just thought I'd post about the meaning of the word "enlist" because I see a few people have used it in reference to officers, and I thought people might want to know the difference between enlisting and being commissioned as an officer.

Oh, thanks. Both of my parents were enlisted Army, I forgot that there were different terms for starting service as an officer. (My dad was an E-5 then because a Green Beret, my mom was an E-3 and worked as a nurse in the L&D ward at a base.)

 

[Goro]

Well, there's someone who won't be a doctor. He'll probably end up being one of those pre-med psychos posting on reddit.

He won't be enlisting. He's applying after this year to medical school. He only did ROTC for the free ride in college -_-

 

[Bookish]

My favorite type of new premed is the starry-eyed ambitious type with actually no clue what he/she is doing.

During my very first biology class of college a student boasted that she was going to go to Johns Hopkins to become a pediatric cardiothoracic surgeon. I made a mental note to keep track of this one. She applied to PA school but was rejected.

 

[BamaNicole]

Well, there's someone who won't be a doctor. He'll probably end up being one of those pre-med psychos posting on reddit.

Danggit.....now I have to waste time and read reddit because I'm curious.

 

[Goro]

Put sunscreen (SPF 50) on your eyeballs. The immaturity levels alone can be retinotoxic

Danggit.....now I have to waste time and read reddit because I'm curious.

 

[missmd123]

Put sunscreen (SPF 50) on your eyeballs. The immaturity levels alone can be retinotoxic

I just looked myself. Besides being immature, a lot of them don't know how to spell. One of them wrote that they were "getting real ancy about [their] DO transcript." Ancy!!! Oh my god

 

[Affiche]

My favorite type of new premed is the starry-eyed ambitious type with actually no clue what he/she is doing.

During my very first biology class of college a student boasted that she was going to go to Johns Hopkins to become a pediatric cardiothoracic surgeon. I made a mental note to keep track of this one. She applied to PA school but was rejected.

Hahaha this reminds me of my first day of discussion in intro bio. We went around the room and introduced ourselves/our majors and one girl said, "I'm pre-med and will go to medical school either here or Johns Hopkins". Context: pre-med isn't a major at my school and we're a top 10 medical school lol. I had another class with her 2 years later and she was on academic probation as a film major lmao.

 

[cloudmurder1]

Put sunscreen (SPF 50) on your eyeballs. The immaturity levels alone can be retinotoxic

I've sustained injuries from those levels on that "forum"

 

[Red Lobster Actual]

He won't be enlisting. He's applying after this year to medical school. He only did ROTC for the free ride in college -_-

There is no "free" when you take Uncle Sam's dollars. If he does not make it in this round he will not be able to reapply for at least another 5 years, which is when his contract with the military is up.

Eh...I empathize with him though. I was a totally idiot clueless pre-med when I was 21. Took me many years to grow up and get in. 5 years can mature one greatly, especially 5 years in the military.

 

[narvik2016]

I am new to SDN, but I am feeling inclined to post here...

Another student who worked in the same research lab as me was also planning to go to med school. He didn't realize you had to apply over a year in advance of starting med school. He was planning to apply in June to enter in August... as in 2 months later! He obviously learned the hard way that this is not how it works, so he continues with the cycle and takes a gap year. Doesn't have any volunteering, ECs, shadowing... I mean seriously NOTHING except some undergrad research. Obviously, he did not get in... I think he reapplied, but no idea where he is at now. Actually kinda feel bad for him.

 

[MrLogan13]

I am new to SDN, but I am feeling inclined to post here...

Another student who worked in the same research lab as me was also planning to go to med school. He didn't realize you had to apply over a year in advance of starting med school. He was planning to apply in June to enter in August... as in 2 months later! He obviously learned the hard way that this is not how it works, so he continues with the cycle and takes a gap year. Doesn't have any volunteering, ECs, shadowing... I mean seriously NOTHING except some undergrad research. Obviously, he did not get in... I think he reapplied, but no idea where he is at now. Actually kinda feel bad for him.

Not sure how this even happens these days with such an abundance of information available at your fingertips.

 

[Dr. Retractor]

Not sure how this even happens these days with such an abundance of information available at your fingertips.

Some people take bad advice to heart whether it be from uninformed advisors, professors, parents, friends, etc. and then don't do their due diligence because they think the advice they heard was the end-all-be-all. So it definitely happens... a lot.

 

[Flashfan]

My lab partner didn't bother to listen to the advice of our premed advisor. He is applying this year with no research, no clinical volunteering and 1 day of shadowing. He seems to think that being a DIII athlete will make up for his lack of volunteering. I have no idea about his GPA, but he didn't make the Dean's List so I am assuming less than 3.5.

 

[mw18]

Hahaha this reminds me of my first day of discussion in intro bio. We went around the room and introduced ourselves/our majors and one girl said, "I'm pre-med and will go to medical school either here or Johns Hopkins". Context: pre-med isn't a major at my school and we're a top 10 medical school lol. I had another class with her 2 years later and she was on academic probation as a film major lmao.

My favorite type of new premed is the starry-eyed ambitious type with actually no clue what he/she is doing.

During my very first biology class of college a student boasted that she was going to go to Johns Hopkins to become a pediatric cardiothoracic surgeon. I made a mental note to keep track of this one. She applied to PA school but was rejected.

Weird and slightly ironic that when people asked me about my plans after school I said "any med school that will take me."

 

[Incis0r]

Well, there's someone who won't be a doctor. He'll probably end up being one of those pre-med psychos posting on reddit.

He could go straight to med school after ROTC by obtaining an Educational Delay from his active duty service obligation (ADSO). However , he would have to fulfill this ADSO by becoming a doctor for the branch that funded his undergrad immediately after medical school. If he decided to take a HPSP scholarship, he would have to pay back the obligations consecutively, not concurrently. His total obligation (assuming full rides through med and undergrad) would then be 8 years and he would have to have taken the HPSP from the same branch as the ROTC.

 

[Affiche]

Weird and slightly ironic that when people asked me about my plans after school I said "any med school that will take me."

Right? One of my good friends just finished M1 at Harvard and I distinctly remember her sitting in the stairwell of our dorm sophomore year crying her eyes out because she bombed an O-chem midterm. I actually remember her saying (between sobs), "I don't even want to go to Harvard or Yale, I just want to go somewhere!"

 

[panda16]

Weird and slightly ironic that when people asked me about my plans after school I said "any med school that will take me."

AMEN

 

[badger12]

A senior in high school told me they were going to major in "pre-cardiac surgery." Oh honey.

 

[missmd123]

This girl freshman year wouldn't stfu about being premed (in fact, she used it as a tool to attract men... o__O) and now we're going into our senior year and she doesn't have good enough grades for med school so she's pursuing PA school. Now she wont stfu about PA school!!! And she ALWAYS talks about how it makes SO much more sense to become a PA rather than a doctor because "PA's make just as much as doctors, have way less schooling, are way more respected, get to see patients more, and have way more time for their kids. Plus, everyone would rather see a PA than a doctor nowadays!"
She's dating my boyfriend's best friend so I can't yell at her for being so ignorant and just plain annoying. Needless to say, she's annoying.

 

[Incis0r]

This girl freshman year wouldn't stfu about being premed (in fact, she used it as a tool to attract men... o__O) and now we're going into our senior year and she doesn't have good enough grades for med school so she's pursuing PA school. Now she wont stfu about PA school!!! And she ALWAYS talks about how it makes SO much more sense to become a PA rather than a doctor because "PA's make just as much as doctors, have way less schooling, are way more respected, get to see patients more, and have way more time for their kids. Plus, everyone would rather see a PA than a doctor nowadays!"
She's dating my boyfriend's best friend so I can't yell at her for being so ignorant and just plain annoying. Needless to say, she's annoying.

Many people who do that are generally insecure about their profession...the fact that she says it so frequently near you means she is just looking for approval from you. She's trying to justify her choice....maybe the way to make her talk less about it is to agree with her and make her feel validated?

That said, she's not entirely wrong.
She's wrong about:
1) Income
2) Respect

She is right about:
1) Less schooling

Toss-Up:
1) Seeing patients. Many physicians are in research or stuff like the FDA so I mean yeah in that case PA can see more patients. When I volunteered in a hospital, I saw the doctors consistently sitting behind their desks/computer screens while the nurses carried out the treatment plans.

2) Time for kids- I'm not sure...do PA program grads need to go through the 80hr/week residencies after schooling? If they do, then yeah this point she is wrong about.

 

[missmd123]

Many people who do that are generally insecure about their profession...the fact that she says it so frequently near you means she is just looking for approval from you. She's trying to justify her choice....maybe the way to make her talk less about it is to agree with her and make her feel validated?

That said, she's not entirely wrong.
She's wrong about:
1) Income
2) Respect

She is right about:
1) Less schooling

Toss-Up:
1) Seeing patients. Many physicians are in research or stuff like the FDA so I mean yeah in that case PA can see more patients. When I volunteered in a hospital, I saw the doctors consistently sitting behind their desks/computer screens while the nurses carried out the treatment plans.

2) Time for kids- I'm not sure...do PA program grads need to go through the 80hr/week residencies after schooling? If they do, then yeah this point she is wrong about..

Oh yes, some of the things she mentioned are in fact correct, as you've noted. Overall, however, she makes sweeping generalizations and says kind of negative things about physicians now which is annoying considering a year ago all she did was talk up the fact that she was going to be a doctor.

Yes, I think she is looking for validation not only from me but from everyone around her. In general, she's kind of an attention seeker so that doesn't surprise me. I also think she expects people to swoon over her because she has big career-oriented aspirations.

 

[Incis0r]

Oh yes, some of the things she mentioned are in fact correct, as you've noted. Overall, however, she makes sweeping generalizations and says kind of negative things about physicians now which is annoying considering a year ago all she did was talk up the fact that she was going to be a doctor.

Yes, I think she is looking for validation not only from me but from everyone around her. In general, she's kind of an attention seeker so that doesn't surprise me. I also think she expects people to swoon over her because she has big career-oriented aspirations. .

Good luck to you lol

 

[Oh_Gee]

Put sunscreen (SPF 50) on your eyeballs. The immaturity levels alone can be retinotoxic

disclaimer: do not put sunscreen on your eyes please

 

[turrgavi]

Saw this one on the old thread.

"Finally finished the MCAT, now that's done, I don't have to worry about standardised tests anymore! " *smiles ignorantly*

Still makes me giggle when I think about it.

 

[BamaNicole]

Saw this one on the old thread.

"Finally finished the MCAT, now that's done, I don't have to worry about standardised tests anymore! " *smiles ignorantly*

Still makes me giggle when I think about it.

I had a friend who went to a Caribbean school as a way to "get around the MCAT."

They were surprised to learn that standardized tests don't end with the MCAT.

 

[samac]

It's not a pre med thing, but I'm amazed by how much of the general population doesn't understand what med school is.
I usually answer the "what do you want to be?" question with "I'm not really sure. I like emergency medicine, but I've really not seen that much"
People then tend to respond with a comment about being a nurse or, my most recent favorite, so you're going to be an EMT?

I'm just going to start telling people I'm going to doctor school.

 

[Cotterpin]

@samac I tend to have kinda the opposite problem. When I went back to school to do the premed requirements, some of my friends would not stop saying things like, "How's med school going?" And I had to keep explaining to them how it works. And then when I graduated undergrad, they were like "So, you're a doctor now!" And I'm just like "No........."

 

[nwts]

My mom was talking to a coworker, and he was appalled to learn about all the stuff I'm doing for my application. He was telling my mom about a student he knows who applied to medical school a couple years ago. This student only applied to two medical schools, one of which was an out of state school that is very unfriendly to out of state applicants. He did not apply to his state school. He had no clinical experience. He hadn't taken any science classes in college because he figured that the 2 dual enrollment science courses he took in high school would get him through the MCAT, and then he could explain in interviews why he hadn't taken any science courses in college.

 

[resiroth]

No, they're suggesting the opposite. They're advising friends who they don't think can cut it in med admissions to consider PA and nursing careers. Less of a "hey, consider this!" and more of a "yeah, you aren't gonna make it...you should consider a backup career which by the way is awesome I swear!"

Er, no. I suggest it because it's one of the fastest ways to making 6 figures and start treating patients.

Economically PA is likely better than primary care, especially if you go the surgery route. Believe it or not a lot of people don't like the idea of 300k in debt (ends up being 500k by end of residency)+ minimum 7 (usually 8-10 years) compared to the much shorter PA pathway of ~2 years + 1 year surgical residency if you want to make around 150k.

Tuition at PA programs is often under 50k, compared to 220-240k for medical school, and you start making money in 2 years as opposed to 7.

I feel like people on this forum are very disconnected from what most people in life want. Even though personally I'm committed to an 8-10 year (MD) pathway, the vast majority of people think that's truly insane.

PA programs are also an amazing opportunity to break into the surgical field without spending 9 years in training. If someone is 30 they could be in the OR at 33 or 39, choice is easy for a lot of people.

Finally, yeah, it is a lot less competitive. On SDN this is seen as a terrible thing for some reason. Plenty of smart people can get a 3.5 if they're thinking of going PhD initially for ex. On SDN that person would be told to do a Postbac (40k of debt) and then try to apply (maybe getting in, maybe not) vs with PA they would be halfway done! Maybe completely done if they have to do another cycle in the hypothetical MD pathway!

Suggesting alternate pathways is never diminishing someone's accomplishments. On this website people no longer shriek about how terrible DO is, maybe in another few years people will be more open minded about PA's.

 

[samac]

Er, no. I suggest it because it's one of the fastest ways to making 6 figures and start treating patients.

Economically PA is likely better than primary care, especially if you go the surgery route. Believe it or not a lot of people don't like the idea of 300k in debt (ends up being 500k by end of residency)+ minimum 7 (usually 8-10 years) compared to the much shorter PA pathway of ~2 years + 1 year surgical residency if you want to make around 150k.

Tuition at PA programs is often under 50k, compared to 220-240k for medical school, and you start making money in 2 years as opposed to 7.

I feel like people on this forum are very disconnected from what most people in life want. Even though personally I'm committed to an 8-10 year (MD) pathway, the vast majority of people think that's truly insane.

PA programs are also an amazing opportunity to break into the surgical field without spending 9 years in training. If someone is 30 they could be in the OR at 33 or 39, choice is easy for a lot of people.

Finally, yeah, it is a lot less competitive. On SDN this is seen as a terrible thing for some reason. Plenty of smart people can get a 3.5 if they're thinking of going PhD initially for ex. On SDN that person would be told to do a Postbac (40k of debt) and then try to apply (maybe getting in, maybe not) vs with PA they would be halfway done! Maybe completely done if they have to do another cycle in the hypothetical MD pathway!

Suggesting alternate pathways is never diminishing someone's accomplishments. On this website people no longer shriek about how terrible DO is, maybe in another few years people will be more open minded about PA's.

I've seen very few people complain about PAs on here, but rather offer it as an alternative to those who may not be as competitive. The problem is that if you're not competitive for MD or DO school you don't tend to be competitive for PA school either, so why recommend it when it's not a viable option for weaker candidates?

 

[resiroth]

I've seen very few people complain about PAs on here, but rather offer it as an alternative to those who may not be as competitive. The problem is that if you're not competitive for MD or DO school you don't tend to be competitive for PA school either, so why recommend it when it's not a viable option for weaker candidates?

My understanding was average gpa for PA was 3.3-3.7 (middle 50%) with the median at 3.5 (at least that's for duke). Meanwhile most MD schools are around 3.7-3.8 median, with only say 10% getting a 3.5 (and these people often are URM or edge cases than representative).

You also can avoid the MCAT and generally the GRE requirements are lower and it's widely seen as an easier test (SAT 2.0).

As an example
Person has a 3.4 and is interested in medicine.
PA is strong chance.
DO is a less strong chance but still very possible especially with grade replacement (they are creeping closer to 3.6 these days), could also have okay chance without
MD is generally a no without a Postbac (bunch more money and time)

Why would I recommend PA over DO?
Tuition is ~160k less
You start working 5 years earlier (6 if you take another year for grade replacement or don't get in)
You're not sure if you want to assist in surgeries and want that option open to you

Why would I recommend DO?
You absolutely cannot stand the idea of being overruled by a Dr. And want complete autonomy/ability to run a practice (increasingly hard these days).

PA school is cheap enough a lot of families could loan you the cash, and if you live at home you can pay them back before your DO counterpart has graduated med school.

With interest on your loans accruing immediately and throughout residency your ~300k principal ends up being closer to 400k, leaving you with 28k in interest only on your payments.

Finally if you want to do surgery I would say the average person has a greater chance ending up in the OR as a PA if they were borderline for MD and clearly a much greater chance than if they were DO. Yeah, it's different, but for some people that really want to be assisting in the OR PA is a viable option.


TLDR DO/MD is not a "better" version of PA. They are completely different pathways with different goals and different pros and cons. If someone wants to be working, seeing patients and making money they can do so in 2 years vs 7, and that advantage is huge for the average person.

 

[PlasticBag]

My understanding was average gpa for PA was 3.3-3.7 (middle 50%) with the median at 3.5 (at least that's for duke). Meanwhile most MD schools are around 3.7-3.8 median, with only say 10% getting a 3.5 (and these people often are URM or edge cases than representative).

You also can avoid the MCAT and generally the GRE requirements are lower and it's widely seen as an easier test (SAT 2.0).

As an example
Person has a 3.4 and is interested in medicine.
PA is strong chance.
DO is a less strong chance but still very possible especially with grade replacement (they are creeping closer to 3.6 these days), could also have okay chance without
MD is generally a no without a Postbac (bunch more money and time)

Why would I recommend PA over DO?
Tuition is ~160k less
You start working 5 years earlier (6 if you take another year for grade replacement or don't get in)
You're not sure if you want to assist in surgeries and want that option open to you

Why would I recommend DO?
You absolutely cannot stand the idea of being overruled by a Dr. And want complete autonomy/ability to run a practice (increasingly hard these days).

PA school is cheap enough a lot of families could loan you the cash, and if you live at home you can pay them back before your DO counterpart has graduated med school.

With interest on your loans accruing immediately and throughout residency your ~300k principal ends up being closer to 400k, leaving you with 28k in interest only on your payments.

Finally if you want to do surgery I would say the average person has a greater chance ending up in the OR as a PA if they were borderline for MD and clearly a much greater chance than if they were DO. Yeah, it's different, but for some people that really want to be assisting in the OR PA is a viable option.


TLDR DO/MD is not a "better" version of PA. They are completely different pathways with different goals and different pros and cons. If someone wants to be working, seeing patients and making money they can do so in 2 years vs 7, and that advantage is huge for the average person.

You're making valid arguments from a practical standpoint (financially, timewise, practice-wise) but I would always urge someone to think, how do you see yourself in ten, twenty years from now?

For those who see themselves climbing up the ladder, getting involved in teaching or research, MD/DO is a much better choice. I think a lot of pre-meds would be happy to be a PA for the first few years (yay, I get to do real clinical work!) but couldn't imagine themselves in an assistant role still at forty or fifty.

On the other hand, those who want more breadth than depth would probably like being a PA because you get to switch specialties and sample different things.

 

[cactus8910]

Hey guys, I thought this was the "on topic" edition...

 

[lets_operate]

Student: "So you're taking the MCAT this april then? I'm gonna take it in the summer."
Me: "Oh really? I'm like, super nervous about it, especially since no one really knows what it's going to be like. How have you been studying?"
Student: "Oh, I haven't studied yet. I'm just gonna cram two weeks before and see how it goes. If I do bad, I just won't go into medicine!" *smiles*
Me: "..........."

Never really heard what happened to her...

 

[DokterMom]

Suggesting alternate pathways is never diminishing someone's accomplishments. On this website people no longer shriek about how terrible DO is, maybe in another few years people will be more open minded about PA's.

I wish that were true. Far too often, people suggest alternate pathways (PA and nursing in particular) to female applicants as exactly a means of diminishing their accomplishments. A very sad, but unfortunately still true, reality.

With all due respect to the professions of nursing and PA -- but it's not the 'top of the food chain' job MD/DO is.

 

[blackroses]

I wish that were true. Far too often, people suggest alternate pathways (PA and nursing in particular) to female applicants as exactly a means of diminishing their accomplishments. A very sad, but unfortunately still true, reality.

With all due respect to the professions of nursing and PA -- but it's not the 'top of the food chain' job MD/DO is.

This is very, very true. I want a dollar for every time someone at the hospital I volunteer at (whether patient, doctor, nurse, or other) has suggested I look into nursing, PA, or NP - then turned around and congratulated other (male) volunteers on their progress towards becoming a doctor.

I could have bought myself a seat at a medical school by now!

 

[resiroth]

I wish that were true. Far too often, people suggest alternate pathways (PA and nursing in particular) to female applicants as exactly a means of diminishing their accomplishments. A very sad, but unfortunately still true, reality.

With all due respect to the professions of nursing and PA -- but it's not the 'top of the food chain' job MD/DO is.

Why stop at MD/DO? MD is then top of the food chain relative to DO. And people graduating from top MD schools and residencies are top relative to those that don't. And general surgeons are top of the food chain relative to family medicine. And neurosurgeons are top of the food chain relative to general surgeons. And neurosurgeons with fellowships are top of the food chain relative to those without.

Point is it never ends. You'll never be "top" until you've spent 13 odd years training which is crazy. Even then someone will have gone to a better fellowship or have a more successful practice or have more publications in the field etc.

The idea of a food chain just diminishes the accomplishments of others and is kind of a disgusting practice. It's not productive to think of where you are in a food chain. You'll drive yourself crazy.

 

[Incis0r]

Why stop at MD/DO? MD is then top of the food chain relative to DO. And people graduating from top MD schools and residencies are top relative to those that don't. And general surgeons are top of the food chain relative to family medicine. And neurosurgeons are top of the food chain relative to general surgeons. And neurosurgeons with fellowships are top of the food chain relative to those without.

and Dentists are at the tippy-tippy top b/c we do surgery and medicine combined

cue flamewar

 

[Cotterpin]

Why stop at MD/DO? MD is then top of the food chain relative to DO. And people graduating from top MD schools and residencies are top relative to those that don't. And general surgeons are top of the food chain relative to family medicine. And neurosurgeons are top of the food chain relative to general surgeons. And neurosurgeons with fellowships are top of the food chain relative to those without.

Point is it never ends. You'll never be "top" until you've spent 13 odd years training which is crazy. Even then someone will have gone to a better fellowship or have a more successful practice or have more publications in the field etc.

The idea of a food chain just diminishes the accomplishments of others and is kind of a disgusting practice. It's not productive to think of where you are in a food chain. You'll drive yourself crazy.

I don't think the point here is about being at the top of the food chain. It's more about women being encouraged to be less ambitious.

 

[HuskyBabe]

Why stop at MD/DO? MD is then top of the food chain relative to DO. And people graduating from top MD schools and residencies are top relative to those that don't. And general surgeons are top of the food chain relative to family medicine. And neurosurgeons are top of the food chain relative to general surgeons. And neurosurgeons with fellowships are top of the food chain relative to those without.

Point is it never ends. You'll never be "top" until you've spent 13 odd years training which is crazy. Even then someone will have gone to a better fellowship or have a more successful practice or have more publications in the field etc.

The idea of a food chain just diminishes the accomplishments of others and is kind of a disgusting practice. It's not productive to think of where you are in a food chain. You'll drive yourself crazy.

And on another note, doctors and surgeons are never at the top of the food chain. Hospital administrators and the board are the ones controlling the hospitals and facilities, and they report to someone higher than them. The ladder keeps going and going. If everyone would just focus on doing theirs jobs correctly and stop worrying about trying to be in a position of control, things would go a lot more smoothly. But again, this is way off topic. Let's get back to some funny pre-med stories!

 

[wildzodiac]

Sorry, but you guys aren't very good at staying on topic! Looks like I have to work double time to get this thread back on track. Lucky for us all, I have a few stories to share with you guys about this girl I um... had this "fling" with a few months ago. She was a sophomore undergrad at Hopkins while I just graduated undergrad and got accepted to dental schools. Although I give her credit for being a part of Hopkins undergrad, I can't help but share some of the conversations we had about getting ready for professional school in general.

Setting: First date. Dinner at some schmuck place.
Me: Oh so your considering medicine. That's great! How many hours of shadowing have you done so far?
Her: I haven't really done any.
Me: How do you know that medicine is what you want to do if you haven't shadowed?
Her: Oh, well a lot of the Hopkins med students come in and advise us so that's even better experience.
(I kid you not, that was her response.)

Low and behold, she also has ABSOLUTELY NO ECs. NO research. NOT involved with any clubs. NO shadowing. NOTHING. She justifies her lack of ANYTHING due to the sole fact that she goes to Hopkins for undergrad. She was so confident that she will get accepted to multiple medical schools because she is half Puerto Rican and plans to play the race card once the time comes (something that I absolutely despise.) She has about a 3.2 GPA.


Fast forward a few weeks:
Setting: A fancy, candle-lit dinner. Suit and tie dress code.
Me: When are you going to apply?
Her: Next June.
Me: Get some research, exposure, keep the grades up, study your butt off for the MCAT, and do what you need to do and you'll be a shoe-in at a lot of places. (trying to give her the benefit of the doubt.)
She grabs my hand from across the table, looks me dead in the eye, and proceeds to have this garbage spew out of her glossylpharyngeal cavity.
Her: Honey, I'm already a shoe-in at a lot of places (she was being dead serious.)

Fast forward a few more weeks.
Setting: Her place.
Me: Yeah, you should really do some research and what not. Do something. One year really comes fast! *slight chuckle*
Her: Yeah, I'll get into a Hopkins Med.
Me: (slightly pissed at her lack of common sense and cockiness) Okay look, imagine that you're an ADCOM for a minute.
Her: What's an ADCOM???
Me: Um... yeah, you're an admissions person at a medical school looking to accept one of two students, Student A is from a state school with a 3.8, worked all through college to pay for college, was part of a few clubs and held some leadership positions in them, did a bunch of shadowing, did research, tutored on the side, and managed to keep their grades up. Student B has a 3.2 from Hopkins and that's it. Who do you pick?
Her: They both sound pretty competitive to me. But Student B went to Hopkins.
Me:


At this point, I pretty much had enough of this specimen which tarnishes the name of the great institution that she represents.
Setting: Her place after coitus.
Her: Besides me, do you know of anyone who went here?
Me: Actually, now that I think about it, I worked with this girl who went to Hopkins for undergrad. She actually was pre-med. If I remember correctly, I think she had a 3.6 GPA, and was really involved with research. She didn't get into any med schools including Hopkins when she applied. After applying again, she got into some school in Virginia. She is now an M1!
Her: Yeah, she is definately lying, There is no way she got a 3.6 here.
Me: I mean, she was half Cuban so I guess she was unable to play the race card.
Her: Cubans aren't URM in medicine you idiot! She sounds like a *****!


Soon after, I decide to cut the tie between us. Two months go by, I had enough dealing with this "less informed" girl who represents everything wrong with pre-professional students. She texted me out of the blue one day about her getting a part-time job during the summer.

Her: I don't get it wildzodiac! I applied to so many places within walking distance. I applied to restaurants, clothing stores, everything. You name it. I go to Hopkins! Don't they see that?! I go to FRICKIN' HOPKINS! WHAT DON'T THEY SEE!
Me: (After telling her this several times in the past.) You're planned alma mater can only get you so far...


Random story of same girl:

Her: What was your GPA when you applied?
Me: 3.8 sGPA and 3.8 oGPA
Her: Hey that's pretty good! Oh wait, I forgot. You went to (insert name of state school)


The preceding stories were all 100% true in nature and had no instances of embellishments.