General surgery / PhD / Volunteering Abroad - Possible?

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Allonsy

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I'd like to know if it's possible to balance doing clinical research, general surgery, and volunteering abroad with programs such as Doctors Without Borders or other NGOs. If so, is the following a good plan to follow?

I've already graduated with a degree in neuroscience and a minor in psychology. I have ~1.5 years of research done in a nutrition lab and will have my name published in a paper by the end of this year.

I did not do much clinical work during my undergrad (besides a year of volunteering at a hospital), but I spent two weeks in Honduras on a medical mission with two doctors and two dentists along with other volunteers. It was through this experience that I discovered my love of volunteering abroad. After that, I spent three months in Tanzania volunteering in a rural hospital. Here, I was allowed to participate in surgeries (it was a really rural hospital; the surgeon was not qualified to be a surgeon and my limited skill-set made me a more qualified assistant nurse than the nurse whose job it really was). Of course, being able to help perform surgeries has led to my desire of becoming a surgeon. Currently, I am in Vietnam. I opted to volunteer for an NGO this time, thinking that I would most likely be working through NGOs when I wanted to volunteer in the future. However, work at the NGO is turning out to be less that exciting so I will be back in a hospital next week. I will be in Vietnam until end of August.

The reason I am volunteering abroad is that I want to be sure it is someplace I want to take my career. If I somehow grow tired of this, I would redirect my career towards studying neuroscience as it was initially my favorite field of interest. I realize this entire year would be a waste if I do end up switching back, but I want to be sure.

My main questions lay in what I want to do after this. Here is the general outline:

Two years in the same nutrition lab I have worked in before
--Provides me with more than enough lab experience
--Plan on studying for/taking my MCATs during this time
One year in a Masters for Nutrition in Global Health (hopefully at LSHTM)
--Helps me gain a better understanding of what kind of nutritional research still needs to be done to best help third world counties. I could use this information to point my PhD work in a certain direction
--Also gives me the tools to perform research on a larger scale. I realize getting grants for this kind of research may not come immediately.
Apply to MD/PhD programs
--Due to my low overall GPA (3.47), I don't see myself getting accepted at this stage
Do a SMP (more likely)
--Try my best. Succeed. Then reapply to MD/PhD programs.
General surgeon / Trauma surgeon
--I know my interests may change once I'm in medical school, but a general surgery seems to be a good skill set to have when going abroad.

Is this a feasible plan or I am just wasting a lot of time?
I want to be able to spend my vacation days abroad. Is that possible if I'm running a lab?
If not, would it be better for me to pass on working in the lab, take a masters of global health, and then apply to a SMP?

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I'd like to know if it's possible to balance doing clinical research, general surgery, and volunteering abroad with programs such as Doctors Without Borders or other NGOs. If so, is the following a good plan to follow?

Yes as an academic surgeon, but you don't need a PhD to do clinical research. Focus on getting into medical school if that is your goal. If you plan to do basic research as a surgeon with a PhD, good luck to you, but you shouldn't plan to do much NGO work as that life would be extremely committed.

The reason I am volunteering abroad is that I want to be sure it is someplace I want to take my career. If I somehow grow tired of this, I would redirect my career towards studying neuroscience as it was initially my favorite field of interest. I realize this entire year would be a waste if I do end up switching back, but I want to be sure.

It doesn't really work that way. If you get a PhD to do research you stay 150% committed to that pathway if you want to do serious research. You can't just flit between things. If you really want to do global health and global health oriented research as a surgeon, you could consider MPH or master's programs.

I'm not a big fan of SMPs. An SMP is required if you don't have the pre-med requirements. I imagine you've already taken them as a part of your undergrad work. Thus, my standard recommendation is to continue to take graduate or high level undergrad classes and do research. This is typically far, far cheaper than a SMP. Also, the competition within an SMP is extremely high, and you can't count on one to improve your GPA. I generally don't recommend master's programs unless they are free, and even then they typically stretch you rather thin so that you don't publish, have to teach (doesn't count), and don't save you any time on your MD/PhD program.

I don't know if the research you've done would really count as basic research. I'm not really sure what kind of research you wish to pursue as a PhD, but MD/PhD programs are typically geared towards basic bench research (animals, cells, molecular interactions). If your existing research is along those lines, great. If not, and you decide you really do want to pursue MD/PhD, I'd recommend trying to shift your research. Generally, MD/PhD programs will expect you to be 100% committed to research, such that if you take time off you spend the lion's share of your time doing research.
 
I'm really not seeing how a MD/PhD program would contribute to reaching your goals at all. The research that needs to be done into third-world health problems isn't the more mechanistic research that MD/PhD programs tend to prepare you for, but more the bigger picture health systems kind of stuff.

That's not to mention most MD/PhD programs don't tend to look kindly on applicants who want to pursue a career in clinical research--they prefer them to fit a more basic science, physician/scientist type of mold.

It seems that MD/MPH would be more up your alley. There are also lots of international health fellowships you could look into further down the line.

ETA: for those who do fit the more standard MD/PhD type and are wondering whether international work can fit in with running your own lab, I've seen young faculty starting up their own lab try to also spend a month or so overseas volunteering. It never seems to last more than a year or two--the time constraints of running a lab are great, and even if you have good people and everything is running well it is hard to keep that going without you for a month.
 
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Yes as an academic surgeon, but you don't need a PhD to do clinical research. Focus on getting into medical school if that is your goal. If you plan to do basic research as a surgeon with a PhD, good luck to you, but you shouldn't plan to do much NGO work as that life would be extremely committed.

Thanks Neuronix. I've been looking through the forums and you're honestly helping everywhere haha. This is the answer I was looking for. I have a greater priority for my NGO work than I do for research so, as much as it pains me to type this, I will pass on the PhD.

It doesn't really work that way. If you get a PhD to do research you stay 150% committed to that pathway if you want to do serious research. You can't just flit between things. If you really want to do global health and global health oriented research as a surgeon, you could consider MPH or master's programs.

Ah, sorry. I wasn't being clear. When I said "redirect my career," I meant do it before I'm in medical school. So if my current volunteering abroad doesn't work out, I'd forget about NGO work in the future and then focus on neuroscience in my PhD after I apply.

The Masters for Nutrition in Global Health was a MPH related masters that I planned on doing after my 2 years of research. Since I no longer plan on going for the PhD, I will instead do a Masters in Global Health the year before I apply to medical school.

I'm not a big fan of SMPs. An SMP is required if you don't have the pre-med requirements. I imagine you've already taken them as a part of your undergrad work. Thus, my standard recommendation is to continue to take graduate or high level undergrad classes and do research. This is typically far, far cheaper than a SMP. Also, the competition within an SMP is extremely high, and you can't count on one to improve your GPA. I generally don't recommend master's programs unless they are free, and even then they typically stretch you rather thin so that you don't publish, have to teach (doesn't count), and don't save you any time on your MD/PhD program.

The research lab I am planning on returning to is at the same university I attended for my BS. I was not planning on taking any classes at that time, but I can do as you advised. Would you recommend doing another major or just taking any classes that I enjoy?

I don't know if the research you've done would really count as basic research. I'm not really sure what kind of research you wish to pursue as a PhD, but MD/PhD programs are typically geared towards basic bench research (animals, cells, molecular interactions). If your existing research is along those lines, great. If not, and you decide you really do want to pursue MD/PhD, I'd recommend trying to shift your research. Generally, MD/PhD programs will expect you to be 100% committed to research, such that if you take time off you spend the lion's share of your time doing research.

I suppose "nutrition" does make it sound like something else but yes, it has all been bench research.

So to recap, spend two years continuing to do research and taking classes to boost my GPA. Then do a MPH masters and apply to medical school.

Thanks for all your help!
 
It seems that MD/MPH would be more up your alley. There are also lots of international health fellowships you could look into further down the line.

I agree. Would you recommend doing the MPH before medical school or during? I've read about people saying that doing it before helped them get the right perspective before they entered medical school. Would doing it during medical school have its own benefits?
 
The research lab I am planning on returning to is at the same university I attended for my BS. I was not planning on taking any classes at that time, but I can do as you advised. Would you recommend doing another major or just taking any classes that I enjoy?

Take high level BCPM classes that you can get As in ;). Typically if it's your state school or you're working there, you can get classes for free or cheap compared to very expensive SMPs. In the end, nobody really cares about SMPs and majors, just that GPA number, unless you're doing an SMP linkage which I don't think you'll really need...

And you're welcome. Glad we could help you sort things out.
 
Take high level BCPM classes that you can get As in ;). Typically if it's your state school or you're working there, you can get classes for free or cheap compared to very expensive SMPs. In the end, nobody really cares about SMPs and majors, just that GPA number, unless you're doing an SMP linkage which I don't think you'll really need...

My science GPA, as of now, is a 3.3. I took the majority of my science classes in my first two years and didn't do well in them. There has been an upward trend and I got A's the science classes I took senior year, but the damage had already been done. If I continue to take classes now and receive A's, will the upward trend be enough even if I can't raise my GPA that high (up to a 3.50 BCPM GPA)? Or should I seriously consider a SMP linkage?

How does returning to a college for a second degree work, exactly? I went to UC Davis. Since I missed this application cycle, I will have to apply for Fall 2013, meaning I cannot take any classes this year. Since it will take me two years of taking classes to raise my GPA a significant amount, that means I will be working in the lab for three years. Do you think it is worth going this route and spending this much time instead of doing a SMP linkage?
 
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My science GPA, as of now, is a 3.3. I took the majority of my science classes in my first two years and didn't do well in them. There has been an upward trend and I got A's the science classes I took senior year, but the damage had already been done. If I continue to take classes now and receive A's, will the upward trend be enough even if I can't raise my GPA that high (up to a 3.50 BCPM GPA)? Or should I seriously consider a SMP linkage?

It's a borderline situation. With a mid-30s MCAT score, I think you still stand a decent chance of acceptance with the upward trend. A 3.5 BCPM GPA isn't a huge deal, honestly. If you can get your overall GPA up over 3.5 though I think it would help.

How does returning to a college for a second degree work, exactly? I went to UC Davis. Since I missed this application cycle, I will have to apply for Fall 2013, meaning I cannot take any classes this year. Since it will take me two years of taking classes to raise my GPA a significant amount, that means I will be working in the lab for three years. Do you think it is worth going this route and spending this much time instead of doing a SMP linkage?

Most undergraduate institutions will allow former graduates or often just anyone in the community to take their courses for credit. If you do this, the tuition is generally a couple thousand per semester, as opposed to a SMP which is much more expensive. Sometimes if you're working at that institution, you can even get the courses for free. You generally just have to talk to the right office to get permission to register. Now if that isn't an option where you live, you may have to go to a nearby university or do something drastic like a SMP.

I think you're focusing too much on your GPA. Averages are averages and you're not too far off that benchmark for lower tier and state schools. You have a lot going for you otherwise with the research and the international experience. You don't need to take several years out. If you're ready, prep hard for the MCAT. Take it in June and see how you do. If you score above say a 34, I think you're ready to apply this year. If you go this route, get your LORs in order asap so you'll be ready to apply. Now you may not get in, in which case you take about 2 upper level science classes a semester, get As in all of them, and reapply next year.
 
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Thank you for the quick response.

I'm still in Vietnam until August, so I do not feel like I will be able to prepare/go home early to take the MCATs yet. However, I now plan on doing research for a year when I return, during which I will take more classes, study for/take the MCATs, and apply in 2013. This will also let me get some more up to date LORs.

Thanks again for clarifying everything!
 
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