Getting kicked out?

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fluoropHore

fluoropHore

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Are you actually getting kicked out? As in, your school has given you some sort of notice that you've been dismissed? Or are you just nervous about someone finding out about your dishonesty and kicking you out?

If it's the former, I'd get a lawyer. ASAP.
 
I think DO schools care about your COMLEX score more than what you got on the question banks. If they do kick you out, then get a lawyer.
 
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Ceusina said:
Are you actually getting kicked out? As in, your school has given you some sort of notice that you've been dismissed? Or are you just nervous about someone finding out about your dishonesty and kicking you out?

If it's the former, I'd get a lawyer. ASAP.
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No, I haven't received any notice yet, but am receiving messages that foreshadow academic dishonesty. Best case scenario, does AD get put on my record and PDs give a serious side eye? Like, did I just F myself? F.
 
From the schools standpoint the action of "fudging" the Qbank questions raising questions about your honesty and integrity. They are within their rights to hold you accountable for your actions and this could include a disciplinary hearing which as a result may result in expulsion. You either can fight it (unlikely as you admit you messed with the numbers), or you can own it and plead for leniency. This is a big mistake, magnified because it was over such a minor issue. If you are willing to do this when so little is on the line then what will you do when the stakes are much higher. Why did you decide to cheat on the Qbank anyways?
 
Oo Cipher oO said:
From the schools standpoint the action of "fudging" the Qbank questions raising questions about your honesty and integrity. They are within their rights to hold you accountable for your actions and this could include a disciplinary hearing which as a result may result in expulsion. You either can fight it (unlikely as you admit you messed with the numbers), or you can own it and plead for leniency. This is a big mistake, magnified because it was over such a minor issue. If you are willing to do this when so little is on the line then what will you do when the stakes are much higher. Why did you decide to cheat on the Qbank anyways?
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Thanks, yeah, good points. I didn't have medical documentation at the time and they weren't being lenient themselves on the issue. Honestly, I haven't had much luck with the administration taking my issues seriously even with documentation. I think I have bad luck sometimes.
 
Welp, there goes 2+years of school down the ****ter.
 
fluoropHore said:
No, I haven't received any notice yet, but am receiving messages that foreshadow academic dishonesty. Best case scenario, does AD get put on my record and PDs give a serious side eye? Like, did I just F myself? F.
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No. You don't get an IA and a second chance, you get dismissed. There is no room in the medical profession for sloppy and dishonest physicians.
You say you did something you didn't and you can end up killing someone as a result.
 
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IlDestriero said:
No. You don't get an IA and a second chance, you get dismissed. There is no room in the medical profession for sloppy and dishonest physicians.
You say you did something you didn't and you can end up killing someone as a result.
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Yes, I know. I own this. This was made in desperation. Thanks for the reply.
 
Hypothetically, could a school kick someone out for even the most seemingly minor reasons? As long as the school could come up with some reason that is supported by the student handbook ("professionalism", "dishonesty", etc), how much leeway do they have.

yea, lawsuits can be won if "arbitrary and capricious" action can be proven, but as far as I know, that is very difficult.
 
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I'm not saying you are going to be expelled but that the possibility defiantly exists. You should contact someone at the school that you can talk to. If you have a faculty advisor that you feel comfortable with I'd start there. You want someone on your side or at least someone who can advocate for you. As this can also be a stressful time for you, you should seek out counseling services that your school offers. This is especially true if you feel depressed or preoccupied with ideas of self harm. My advice is to own up to the mistake. You may have been pressured because of health issues and seemingly inflexibility with school requirements and this caused you to make a poor decision.
 
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Well, I learned my lesson. I was between a rock (medical issue) and a hard place (imo bad administrative policies that left no leeway for extenuating circumstances or else FAIL). I guess I chose the bad door.
 
Oo Cipher oO said:
I'm not saying you are going to be expelled but that the possibility defiantly exists. You should contact someone at the school that you can talk to. If you have a faculty advisor that you feel comfortable with I'd start there. You want someone on your side or at least someone who can advocate for you. As this can also be a stressful time for you, you should seek out counseling services that your school offers. This is especially true if you feel depressed or preoccupied with ideas of self harm. My advice is to own up to the mistake. You may have been pressured because of health issues and seemingly inflexibility with school requirements and this caused you to make a poor decision.
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Thanks, unfort I don't feel close to any faculty or admin that would vouch I'm worth my salt.
 
fluoropHore said:
Ok, what if they *just* put academic dishonesty on my transcript..Can I get a lawyer then? Like, this isn't a g'damn exam. I worked too hard to get to this point for this nonsense. ... Maybe. I've been told I have an ass like a fine baked ham.
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If they just put it on your transcript and you still drag a lawyer into it, you're asking for trouble down the line. You deserve that AD on your transcript. Dishonesty is dishonesty, period. Own it and move on, and be glad if they keep you around.
 
Lawyers will take your money, but they will be worse than useless. No judge will overturn a medical school decision if it involves academic performance or professionalism/code of conduct violations. (Yes, med students have sued all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court and lost.)
 
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costales said:
Lawyers will take your money, but they will be worse than useless. No judge will overturn a medical school decision if it involves academic performance or professionalism/code of conduct violations. (Yes, med students have sued all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court and lost.)
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I am not 100% certain, but as far as I know, if one can show that there was another student who did X (ie fail a class, board, etc) but was not dismissed, they could potentially have a case for "arbitrary/capricious" conduct. may not apply to this person but fwiw...
 
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OP is not claiming mistreatment or discrimination. Regardless, there is never a good reason for cheating or falsification, there is no remediation for this type of behavior, and consequences are career-ending.
 
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it has been a long time for me since medical school, by "question log" , do you mean an exam? If you cheated or tried to cheat on an exam, that is a pretty big offense. I don't actually understand what you did, so could you elaborate on what exactly you did?
 
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user3 said:
Hypothetically, could a school kick someone out for even the most seemingly minor reasons? As long as the school could come up with some reason that is supported by the student handbook ("professionalism", "dishonesty", etc), how much leeway do they have.

yea, lawsuits can be won if "arbitrary and capricious" action can be proven, but as far as I know, that is very difficult.
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Interesting -- there was a rumor at TCOM that a select committee of the faculty prior to graduation would get together and vote on whether to allow the class to graduate -- started off when classes were smaller as a vote on each student and when the classes got large, it became a "go/no-go" on the entire class -- if the class was a "no-go", then they went through each student individually -- it was supposed to be a method to prevent allowing people that had passed everything but were deemed to be dangerous (and you can be an A student and be dangerous) from graduating and potentially cut loose on an unsuspecting public -- heard it from one faculty member but never substantiated it beyond that ---

As everyone else here has said, you need to own this and beg for leniency and offer some suggestions on how you're going to change -- I would be looking at remedial programs that physicians get sent to when they've screwed up, CME in medical ethics that YOU pay for, offer to do work like this in the presence of a proctor -- heck, go sit in the dean's office to do it if you have to, etc. All they can say is,"No" and boot you -- and you're no worse off than you were
 
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user3 said:
I am not 100% certain, but as far as I know, if one can show that there was another student who did X (ie fail a class, board, etc) but was not dismissed, they could potentially have a case for "arbitrary/capricious" conduct. may not apply to this person but fwiw...
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This is correct. If you can show that you were treated differently than others and specifically if you were treated differently because of discrimination that's where you would have a case

NOTE: that doesn't seem to apply to OP but more of a future reference thing. Also, if some part of you thinks you should speak with a lawyer, you probably should. Yes, they will take your money and no one likes having to deal with them, but they can pick up on things in school's policies and procedures that you might otherwise miss. It's better to get one as a precaution and avoid screwing yourself over than, you know, actually screwing yourself over.
 
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Yeah, I did 'fess up and explain. they were v. understanding, considering my situation. i think my opener didn't capture the scope of the infraction, which was deemed quite piddly (but still not inconsequential)... basically, if you're ever between two hard choices, take the fail. all of my options (lawyer, gigolo) were mostly in jest.
/thread
 
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