GF with <210 Step 1, Lackluster Clinical grades. Is Anesthesia still possible for her?

[Lexdiamondz]

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[ERRES2288]

As the title states, my GF is currently a 4th year and we're trying to couples-match (myself in EM, her in Anes) however her grades & boards scores aren't great. We're both US Allopathic, top 10 ranked med school in the NE and were hoping to match in NYC. What's the likelihood that she could even match in anesthesia, let alone couples match this cycle?

Any red flags? Is she above a 200? When is she taking step 2?

 

[nimbus]

Should be fine.

http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Charting-Outcomes-2014-Final.pdf

 

[Psai]

Very high. There are a ton of programs in nyc ranging from top tier programs to not so top tier.

 

[pjl]

How strong are you? Will you be so awesome that EM programs will assert leverage to get you?


Sent from my iPad using SDN mobile app

 

[Consigliere]

As the title states, my GF is currently a 4th year and we're trying to couples-match (myself in EM, her in Anes) however her grades & boards scores aren't great. We're both US Allopathic, top 10 ranked med school in the NE and were hoping to match in NYC. What's the likelihood that she could even match in anesthesia, let alone couples match this cycle?

Time to get a new girlfriend.

 

[Chloroform4Life]

Tell her to apply neurology...then she can make 1 mil per year while you stay home and play golf.

 

[deleted162650]

Tell her to apply neurology...then she can make 1 mil per year while you stay home and play golf.

Sugar Mama's . . .

 

[Lexdiamondz]

Any red flags? Is she above a 200? When is she taking step 2?

Taking step 2 at the end of the month. She got a pass in one core clerkship and no honors, but otherwise no red flags. She's above 200

 

[Lexdiamondz]

How strong are you? Will you be so awesome that EM programs will assert leverage to get you?


Sent from my iPad using SDN mobile app

I've got no issues on my own (241 Step 1, honors in a couple core clerkships + honors in home EM SubI and ICU Sub-I), but I'm not a stellar EM applicant by any means. I won't have issues matching in the NE.

 

[Psai]

I've got no issues on my own (241 Step 1, honors in a couple core clerkships + honors in home EM SubI and ICU Sub-I), but I'm not a stellar EM applicant by any means. I won't have issues matching in the NE.

Depending on what your sloes say, I'm sure you will have little trouble matching into the program of your choice

Gf has plenty of options but em is nice because the best programs aren't the big name ones. I could see you both at monte or something. But if I were you I'd just go for a 3 year + fellowship. There's no rule that says you have to be at the same hospital either

 

[Arantius]

You sure you want to couples match with only a gf? I can see engaged or wifed... But You could be stuck seeing an ex a year from now at every GME event. Just saying.

 

[hookgrip]

As the title states, my GF is currently a 4th year and we're trying to couples-match (myself in EM, her in Anes) however her grades & boards scores aren't great. We're both US Allopathic, top 10 ranked med school in the NE and were hoping to match in NYC. What's the likelihood that she could even match in anesthesia, let alone couples match this cycle?

This will help both of you a ton. Apply broadly and you should both match with no problems.

My advice would be to rank all possible combinations, even the ones that involve one of you not matching. That way, you should have the exact same chances of matching as if you entered the match by yourself.

 

[Got Em]

I've got no issues on my own (241 Step 1, honors in a couple core clerkships + honors in home EM SubI and ICU Sub-I), but I'm not a stellar EM applicant by any means. I won't have issues matching in the NE.

???

241 Step 1, honors in a few clerkships, honors in EM sub-I = excellent applicant

Your chances of matching is essentially 99% by yourself unless you have > 1 red flag, do horrible on every interview, or do something to torpedo your app. Typical SDNer

 

[Psai]

It's not about matching anywhere, he's worried about being able to match to the same place with his gf who is below average. He's also humble

 

[AlphaBeta<3]

Did you guys meet in med school?

 

[deleted171991]

As the title states, my GF is currently a 4th year and we're trying to couples-match (myself in EM, her in Anes) however her grades & boards scores aren't great. We're both US Allopathic, top 10 ranked med school in the NE and were hoping to match in NYC. What's the likelihood that she could even match in anesthesia, let alone couples match this cycle?

As others have said: consider whether you two are a good fit for the future. There is really not much reason for constantly weak academic performance except for IQ. Medicine is not rocket science. Make sure she's that special person before getting into a couples match.

To my dear usual critics: the simple fact that a 210 scorer (less than 190 when adjusted to "inflation" since 2006) can not only contemplate, but have a good chance of matching into anesthesia, speaks volumes about how low we have sunk. Going into anesthesia now is like moving into a bad neighborhood: your house might be a mansion inside, but your friends and family couldn't care less, because outside it's still all garbage, violence and ugliness, and the resale value is only going down.

 

[hookgrip]

To my dear usual critics: the simple fact that a 210 scorer (less than 190 when adjusted to "inflation" since 2006) can not only contemplate, but have a good chance of matching into anesthesia, speaks volumes about how low we have sunk. Going into anesthesia now is like moving into a bad neighborhood: your house might be a mansion inside, but your friends and family couldn't care less, because outside it's still all garbage, violence and ugliness, and the resale value is only going down.

I am not sure how a "210 step 1 scorer having a good chance of matching into anesthesia" says anything about how the field has sunk. Anesthesia is in the same place it's always been...moderately competitive, but not as competitive as specialties such as ortho, plastics, or derm.

Consider this:
A US grad with a 200 on STEP 1 has around a 75% chance of matching anesthesia. Source: http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Charting-Outcomes-2014-Final.pdf

The same US grad would have a 90% chance of matching into child neuro, 85% chance of matching into diagnostic rads, 80% chance of matching into EM, 95% chance of matching into FM, 90% of matching IM, 90% chance of matching med-peds, 90% of matching neurology, 75% chance of matching Ob-Gyn, 95% chance of matching path, 90% chance of matching peds, 80% chance of matching PM&R, 90% chance of matching psych, and 80% chance of matching rad-onc.

Also, OP mentioned he and his GF were at a top 10 med school, which helps more than you might think. Coming from a top 10 school is easily worth another 10-15 points on STEP 1.

 

[deleted171991]

I am not sure how a "210 step 1 scorer having a good chance of matching into anesthesia" says anything about how the field has sunk. Anesthesia is in the same place it's always been...moderately competitive, but not as competitive as specialties such as ortho, plastics, or derm.

Consider this:
A US grad with a 200 on STEP 1 has around a 75% chance of matching anesthesia. Source: http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Charting-Outcomes-2014-Final.pdf

The same US grad would have a 90% chance of matching into child neuro, 85% chance of matching into diagnostic rads, 80% chance of matching into EM, 95% chance of matching into FM, 90% of matching IM, 90% chance of matching med-peds, 90% of matching neurology, 75% chance of matching Ob-Gyn, 95% chance of matching path, 90% chance of matching peds, 80% chance of matching PM&R, 90% chance of matching psych, and 80% chance of matching rad-onc.

Also, OP mentioned he and his GF were at a top 10 med school, which helps more than you might think. Coming from a top 10 school is easily worth another 10-15 points on STEP 1.

Step 1 scores used to be a big deal in anesthesia, for the simple reason that they are highly predictive of performance (this is a specialty where basic science knowledge is paramount). Also, while top 10 might matter when one judges class percentile, this candidate provides a general and consistent picture of mediocrity, which didn't use to define anesthesia back when there was a better future and fewer residency spots. That's all.

As I said: one might own a palace, and it still won't be worth that much in a bad neighborhood. Friggin greedy academic hospitals; they would double the residency spots if they could.

Let's look at another indicator, if we can find it: the number of foreign grads matched into anesthesia. Ten years ago it used to be about 4%.

 

[aimedicine]

1. The better question is how does a med student in top 10 med school score sub 210 on Step 1....?

2. And people are saying its a plus that she is from top 10 school, but shouldnt be more of a red flag that she is from "top 10" med schoool that she couldnt even break 210

3. Encourage her to apply to fam med, i hear 2016 starting salary is now 225k for them or psych (starting salary 250k), which is pretty much what amesthesia gets you these days plus you avoid all the stress...plus you can pick your location in terms of residency and practice because those 2 fields are in such high demand

4. Or Apply to anesthesia and you will match with 210, no question about it....sadly thats what its come down to. The field is fkd, thanks to Gen X.

 

[patriot6]

Let's look at another indicator, if we can find it: the number of foreign grads matched into anesthesia. Ten years ago it used to be about 4%.

 

[bashwell]

1. The better question is how does a med student in top 10 med school score sub 210 on Step 1....?

2. And people are saying its a plus that she is from top 10 school, but shouldnt be more of a red flag that she is from "top 10" med schoool that she couldnt even break 210

3. Encourage her to apply to fam med, i hear 2016 starting salary is now 225k for them or psych (starting salary 250k), which is pretty much what amesthesia gets you these days plus you avoid all the stress...plus you can pick your location in terms of residency and practice because those 2 fields are in such high demand

4. Or Apply to anesthesia and you will match with 210, no question about it....sadly thats what its come down to. The field is fkd, thanks to Gen X.

3) Another good choice for her is IM. Anecdotally I hear they're starting at similar salaries to what you quote for FM and psych, and after a few years the potential to go much higher. And they are also in demand in lots of places. Plus the option to subspecialize in some great subspecialties.

 

[deleted171991]

Table

I think that only includes the main Match, nothing after it. I am pretty sure that the prevalence of FMGs among anesthesia residents used to be around 4%.

 

[patriot6]

I think that only includes the main Match, nothing after it. I am pretty sure that the prevalence of FMGs among anesthesia residents used to be around 4%.

Yeah, that's from charting the outcomes; NRMP data.

Do you mean that out of match positions would have driven down the FMG percentage from 15.9% (match data posted above) to 4%?

 

[Doctor4Life1769]

Step 1 scores used to be a big deal in anesthesia, for the simple reason that they are highly predictive of performance (this is a specialty where basic science knowledge is paramount). Also, while top 10 might matter when one judges class percentile, this candidate provides a general and consistent picture of mediocrity, which didn't use to define anesthesia back when there was a better future and fewer residency spots. That's all.

As I said: one might own a palace, and it still won't be worth that much in a bad neighborhood. Friggin greedy academic hospitals; they would double the residency spots if they could.

Let's look at another indicator, if we can find it: the number of foreign grads matched into anesthesia. Ten years ago it used to be about 4%.

Are you for real?
Since when was anesthesia ever as competitive as derm, ortho, radiology, etc?
210 step 1 is a 210 step 1
If she busts a 240 or higher on step 2 she is golden
Of course if she did I'd say she should consider other specialties over anesthesia

 

[patriot6]

I think that only includes the main Match, nothing after it. I am pretty sure that the prevalence of FMGs among anesthesia residents used to be around 4%.

And if I'm interpreting the new 2016 data correctly, the percentage of FMGs who occupy filled positions is 11.6%.

Though, I am surprised by how the # of anesthesiology positions has exploded since the 90s.

 

[deleted171991]

Yeah, that's from charting the outcomes; NRMP data.

Do you mean that out of match positions would have driven down the FMG percentage from 15.9% (match data posted above) to 4%?

I have no idea. I distinctly remember looking at the prevalence of FMGs back when I was applying, and it was in the low-mid single digits on paper.

 

[deleted171991]

And if I'm interpreting the new 2016 data correctly, the percentage of FMGs who occupy filled positions is 11.6%.

Though, I am surprised by how the # of anesthesiology positions has exploded since the 90s.

That 11.6% I can believe.

If that's true, would you believe that the prevalence 10 years ago, on 30% fewer spots, was higher than it is today?!

 

[patriot6]

I have no idea. I distinctly remember looking at the prevalence of FMGs back when I was applying, and it was in the low-mid single digits on paper.

It's actually quite possible your 4% number is accurate. I realized the 80-something % I posted in the table above is just U.S. seniors - this wouldn't include U.S graduates and osteopathic graduates. My b.

3) Another good choice for her is IM. Anecdotally I hear they're starting at similar salaries to what you quote for FM and psych, and after a few years the potential to go much higher. And they are also in demand in lots of places. Plus the option to subspecialize in some great subspecialties.

U.S. seniors accounted for <50% of total internal medicine positions and family medicine positions filled this year. I know that you're not speaking to that, and that specialization matters, especially in IM, but I thought I'd mention it since I've got the NRMP data open right now.