Help! Should I send AMCAS to my schools with a bad first MCAT while waiting to take a SECOND MCAT?

[Pericynthion]

My AMCAS application was just processed/verified as of today. I have a bit of dilemma because I screwed up my most recent MCAT exam (verbal 7, physical sciences 12, biology 11). I know that the 7 in verbal will be a red flag to most schools so I'm planning to retake it on July 24th, which would mean my score would be released in August.

My question is: should I bother sending out my application right now to any of the schools? I know that they can see that I'm going to retake my MCATs in July but they're not obligated to wait around for that second score. I'm afraid that they'll just see my first score and reject me immediately.

On the other hand, I'm afraid that by the time my score is released in August, I'll be very late in submitting my entire application to the schools.

Does anyone have any experience about this situation? Do you think I should wait for my second score and submit in August? Or should I submit to my list of schools now and hope that they won't look at my application until my second score? (Yes, I've considered the possibility of getting an even worse score on my second attempt but I'm not going to entertain that scenario unless it actually happens...I'm stressed out enough as it is, haha.)

Some background information if it helps:

I went to Cornell University for undergraduate studies.

I majored in Economics and minored in East Asian Studies, while taking premed courses. My GPA is 3.8, my science GPA is 3.83.

I'm currently on my first gap year, working as a Research Technician in an HIV lab with Mass. General Hospital in Boston. During this year, I finished up my premed requirements at the Harvard Extension School, taking both Orgo I and Orgo II and earning an A- in both of these courses.

Many of my past internship experiences have been related to healthcare but from the business side: I worked in a healthcare startup in Boston, and then interned for a healthcare venture capital firm in NYC. I volunteered with Boston Children's Hospital (Nephrology Division) for one winter break. I've also shadowed a geriatric psychiatrist, ENT, pediatric nephrologist, infectious disease specialist, internal medicine clinicians, primary care physicians, and neuro-oncology specialists.

Thanks for any advice you can provide!

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[Catalystik]

My AMCAS application was just processed/verified as of today. I have a bit of dilemma because I screwed up my most recent MCAT exam (verbal 7, physical sciences 12, biology 11). I know that the 7 in verbal will be a red flag to most schools so I'm planning to retake it on July 24th, which would mean my score would be released in August.

My question is: should I bother sending out my application right now to any of the schools? I know that they can see that I'm going to retake my MCATs in July but they're not obligated to wait around for that second score. I'm afraid that they'll just see my first score and reject me immediately.

On the other hand, I'm afraid that by the time my score is released in August, I'll be very late in submitting my entire application to the schools.

Does anyone have any experience about this situation? Do you think I should wait for my second score and submit in August? Or should I submit to my list of schools now and hope that they won't look at my application until my second score? (Yes, I've considered the possibility of getting an even worse score on my second attempt but I'm not going to entertain that scenario unless it actually happens...I'm stressed out enough as it is, haha.)

Some background information if it helps:

I went to Cornell University for undergraduate studies.

I majored in Economics and minored in East Asian Studies, while taking premed courses. My GPA is 3.8, my science GPA is 3.83.

I'm currently on my first gap year, working as a Research Technician in an HIV lab with Mass. General Hospital in Boston. During this year, I finished up my premed requirements at the Harvard Extension School, taking both Orgo I and Orgo II and earning an A- in both of these courses.

Many of my past internship experiences have been related to healthcare but from the business side: I worked in a healthcare startup in Boston, and then interned for a healthcare venture capital firm in NYC. I volunteered with Boston Children's Hospital (Nephrology Division) for one winter break. I've also shadowed a geriatric psychiatrist, ENT, pediatric nephrologist, infectious disease specialist, internal medicine clinicians, primary care physicians, and neuro-oncology specialists.

Thanks for any advice you can provide!

I suggest adding schools for which you are competitive now and adding more that are suitable after the second score comes back (the entire application will be received by new schools within a business day). If your second score is available later in August, you won't be "Very Late" provided you have all your Secondary essays written for schools you anticipate adding so your turn-around time is quick when formally asked to submit them.

My bigger concern is that you may have as little as one month of active clinical experience. Shadowing alone is not going to reassure many adcomms that you know what you're getting into. Do you have a plan to augment your contact with sick and injured folks?

 

[Pericynthion]

I suggest adding schools for which you are competitive now and adding more that are suitable after the second score comes back (the entire application will be received by new schools within a business day). If your second score is available later in August, you won't be "Very Late" provided you have all your Secondary essays written for schools you anticipate adding so your turn-around time is quick when formally asked to submit them.

My bigger concern is that you may have as little as one month of active clinical experience. Shadowing alone is not going to reassure many adcomms that you know what you're getting into. Do you have a plan to augment your contact with sick and injured folks?

Thanks for your response. That's a good idea...once I get this second MCAT out of the way, I'll start doing write-ups for secondaries.

The problem was that I didn't decide to be premed until my senior year of college. Trying to cram all the prereqs into one year plus working part-time and doing research part-time made it very difficult for me to find time to volunteer at a hospital during college, especially since there was really only one hospital in the city.

Since graduating, I've devoted my gap year to working full-time at my research position, using evenings to take my last prereq, and studying for the MCAT. The earliest I can do more volunteering with a hospital would be in the fall of this year, so I can't write anything about that on my application.

To be honest, I'm not sure if getting more volunteering would help, especially if I end up doing something with no patient contact...?

 

[Catalystik]

Maybe you could consider clinical sites aside from hospitals, like skilled-level nursing homes, rehab center, VA, family-planning, or low-income clinics, or a hospice program. And I agree that you shouldn't accept a volunteer position in a gift shop when you need patient contact.

 

[mrh125]

a 30 mcat isnt bad. chill

 

[Pericynthion]

a 30 mcat isnt bad. chill

It's not bad but I was averaging 34-35 on my practices and I don't think getting less than a 10 will look good to any mid-tier school. =\

 

[mrh125]

It's not bad but I was averaging 34-35 on my practices and I don't think getting less than a 10 will look good to any mid-tier school. =\

your phys sci and bio sci section scores are really good do you really want to risk having them drop ? you hit a 30. also real mcat =/= practice tests

 

[mrh125]

Also just an FYI i got a good balanced score on my first mcat and retook bc i knew i could do better. i retook and improved in two sections and did worse in another. verbal is the hardest section to improve in and i want from a really high score in verbal to a lower score in verbal and a lot of people also got a low score on verbal on that test. every mcat is different and you may not improve. it's an unnecessary risk. fight your battles wisely.

 

[Pericynthion]

your phys sci and bio sci section scores are really good do you really want to risk having them drop ? you hit a 30. also real mcat =/= practice tests

Also just an FYI i got a good balanced score on my first mcat and retook bc i knew i could do better. i retook and improved in two sections and did worse in another. verbal is the hardest section to improve in and i want from a really high score in verbal to a lower score in verbal and a lot of people also got a low score on verbal on that test. every mcat is different and you may not improve. it's an unnecessary risk. fight your battles wisely.

I understand what you mean but I've already signed up and paid for another exam - might as well give it another go. Again, I know 30 isn't "bad" but it is fairly average and it is not competitive enough for some of the better schools. Whether or not you think I should be applying to these schools is a different debate but I really would like to have a good shot at them and a 30 isn't going to cut it.

 

[Polonium-210]

I was in a similar dilemma but with PS. I ended up with a 30 on my third attempt (9, 10, 11). I have been told below 7 on any one section is considered a red flag. I would also echo the concerns above about limited clinical exposure. That may be more of a liability than your verbal score. However, no one can accurately prognosticate the whims of adcoms.

 

[mrh125]

I understand what you mean but I've already signed up and paid for another exam - might as well give it another go. Again, I know 30 isn't "bad" but it is fairly average and it is not competitive enough for some of the better schools. Whether or not you think I should be applying to these schools is a different debate but I really would like to have a good shot at them and a 30 isn't going to cut it.

a 30 + a strong application can open a lot of doors and a 7 in VR isn't the end of getting into a good school.

 

[Pericynthion]

I was in a similar dilemma but with PS. I ended up with a 30 on my third attempt (9, 10, 11). I have been told below 7 on any one section is considered a red flag. I would also echo the concerns above about limited clinical exposure. That may be more of a liability than your verbal score. However, no one can accurately prognosticate the whims of adcoms.

How many hours should I have for pure clinical volunteering? I volunteered with Children's Hospital's Nephrology Division for 4 weeks, 8 hours/day so that's 160 hours. Other exposure was during shadowing sessions, which total to 100. I can sign up for more clinical volunteering but again 1) it won't be until the fall or winter, which means I can't really talk about it effectively for my application and 2) there's always a chance I'll get put somewhere with no patient contact.

 

[Polonium-210]

My clinical exposure vastly outweighed my volunteering, mostly because I enjoyed shadowing much more than I did volunteering. I had a little over 500 hours of pure clinical exposure spread across a variety of specialties, though the a significant chunk of the time was spent in family medicine and otolaryngology. I was stretching it to get 120 hours of volunteering in five years. Five hundred is probably excessive for what you need. In my personal opinion, I would say shoot for 200. But as a disclaimer, there are much more informed people on this forum when it comes to getting accepted into medical school. I spent a lot of my time in college preparing for medical school, and not preparing for getting accepted to medical school. Hence it took a second round of applying for me to get accepted.

 

[Catalystik]

How many hours should I have for pure clinical volunteering? I volunteered with Children's Hospital's Nephrology Division for 4 weeks, 8 hours/day so that's 160 hours. Other exposure was during shadowing sessions, which total to 100. I can sign up for more clinical volunteering but again 1) it won't be until the fall or winter, which means I can't really talk about it effectively for my application and 2) there's always a chance I'll get put somewhere with no patient contact.

The average listed shadowing is about 50 hours, so you're fine there (assuming the patients were interacting with the doc during that time rather than lying on an operating table unconscious). Your active clinical gross hours are fine, too, with the brevity being more the concern. Average listed is 150 hours over 1.5 years when volunteerism is the source of exposure. Having longevity in this type of activity is a demonstration that you like being around sick and injured folks (not just the business side of medicine) and that you've thoughtfully considerd medicine over a long time rather than impulsively deciding to be a doctor. You might be fine, as different schools weigh these factors differently. Or you might not, thus my frequent admonition to live your application year as if you might need to reapply, continuing to shore up weak areas in your application. Continued improvements also have the benefit of providing fodder for Secondary essays, update letters (where allowed), and interview conversations, which might tip a decision in your favor if adcomms are on a cusp regarding your application.

 

[Pericynthion]

So an update...my new MCAT score ended up being 35 (PS 13 / 11 V / 11 BS)!

I guess I can breathe a little easier now. : )

 

[Lawpy]

So an update...my new MCAT score ended up being 35 (PS 13 / 11 V / 11 BS)!

I guess I can breathe a little easier now. : )

Congrats! Job well done.

 

[Pericynthion]

The average listed shadowing is about 50 hours, so you're fine there (assuming the patients were interacting with the doc during that time rather than lying on an operating table unconscious). Your active clinical gross hours are fine, too, with the brevity being more the concern. Average listed is 150 hours over 1.5 years when volunteerism is the source of exposure. Having longevity in this type of activity is a demonstration that you like being around sick and injured folks (not just the business side of medicine) and that you've thoughtfully considerd medicine over a long time rather than impulsively deciding to be a doctor. You might be fine, as different schools weigh these factors differently. Or you might not, thus my frequent admonition to live your application year as if you might need to reapply, continuing to shore up weak areas in your application. Continued improvements also have the benefit of providing fodder for Secondary essays, update letters (where allowed), and interview conversations, which might tip a decision in your favor if adcomms are on a cusp regarding your application.

Hey Catalystik, I have a much more detailed summary of my extracurriculars/work experiences up in this thread: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/thr...-88-sgpa-35-mcat-chances-school-list.1095183/
If you have some free time, do you care to look at my chances?