HELP with MCAT preperation with no science pre-requisites

[Teah7]

I am 42 and I am finishing my nursing undergraduate degree in 1 year. Due to my age I was afraid that taking all the science pre-requisites would take me two more years, that is why to my surprise I found few US MD schools that do not require any science prerequisites and would not look down at my application as long as I have an average MCAT score (27 or more as an old version score type). I will need to study the content of all the sciences all by myself so that I can achieve good enough core on MCAT.

I am a good self-learner.

Please, if you can, advise me if you know what kind of review can help me handle so much material and teach me things that I need to know to do well on MCAT.

If you do not know the answer to my question, please, do not judge me, if you can. Thanks for reading this.

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[PNWisBest]

What MD schools in the U.S. require no science coursework? I've never heard of that before.

 

[Teah7]

What MD schools in the U.S. require no science coursework? I've never heard of that before.

Thank you very much for your reply.

I was also surprised after I read the following:

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/competency-based-admissions.1122824/

They recommend science pre-requisites, but not require it. Of course it will be safer to take all the pre-requisites

 

[Teah7]

I also found this information about AAMC-s new initiative after I did a search on yahoo. This is the link to my yahoo search result when you click on the link you will see a pdf file that is from AAMC.org. :

http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=AwrT...mmary.pdf/RK=0/RS=OyOaIsNhrZr17VC.9Cqoa6aUtxc-

 

[Cawolf]

I think you should reconsider your plan.

There are hundreds of students who put the time in to go back and complete the required courses, why should you be any different?

If you are concerned about your age, consider pursuing the NP route after working in the field for a bit.

 

[nontradjd]

I'm not sure I see Competency-Based as a move away from looking at science coursework. It seems to be a move away from require specific courses. However, the competencies include:

Scientific Inquiry: Applies knowledge of the scientific process to integrate and synthesize information, solve problems and formulate research questions and hypotheses; is facile in the language of the sciences and uses it to participate in the discourse of science and explain how scientific knowledge is discovered and validated.
...
Living Systems: Applies knowledge and skill in the natural sciences to solve problems related to molecular and macro systems including biomolecules, molecules, cells, and organs.

Human Behavior: Applies knowledge of the self, others, and social systems to solve problems related to the psychological, socio-cultural, and biological factors that influence health and well-being.

That seems to me like coursework in the sciences is still applicable and possibly even necessary.

You also say you completed your "undergraduate degree." To me, that sounds like a BSN. If it is a BSN, I'm not sure how many pre-reqs you'd have left. My stepmom just finished her RN and has already been required to take Gen Chem, Phys, Bio, A&P, and Stats. Her BSN will include Org Chem, Bio Chem, and Micro.

 

[mavric1298]

^^ Posted at the same time

And how you propose having a science based competency without taking any classes? The idea is getting away from strict "you XXX class", but rather you need the things you would have learned in a series, or instead of needing "2 terms of calculus", you need a competency in quantitative reasoning. They aren't meaning for you to not take science classes - if that's how you understood it, that's not the way it is. And I'm sorry, but doing well on the MCAT without the classes? Good luck with that - even the full blown prep courses aren't meant to teach you the subjects, they are a minimal review of over 2 years worth of classes, enough to jog your memory and review what will be on the test. By no means are any of the prep material mean to be taken instead of the prerec classes. Not to mention once you get into medical school how quickly you would fail your first 2 years of classes that draw on a lot of the base knowledge of pre-reqs

 

[Teah7]

I think you should reconsider your plan.

There are hundreds of students who put the time in to go back and complete the required courses, why should you be any different?

If you are concerned about your age, consider pursuing the NP route after working in the field for a bit.

Thanks, Cawolf for your reply and input. To become NP I would need 2 years more for Masters and 2 more years for PhD, total of 4 years and meanwhile I could finish MD or DO school. I look at the +3 years of residency as a work, not as a school, that is why to me medical school is not 7 more years of school, but 4 more years, of course after I get in, if I ever get in. I have also heard that NP-s might not be recognized in many states. Due to my husbands mining major I will have to be flexible to often relocate and unlike many new doctors I will live in a very remote rural areas where there is an extreme shortage of doctors. I think I can benefit to communities that are very desperate for doctors. This is what motivates me the most. I have taken sciences before but it was 12 years ago.

As for your response why should I be any different I would say that it is not me who has any power to change requirements, it is schools that change their requirements, so please, do not judge me so harshly, because it you could, you might have also loved the idea of saving yourself thousands and thousands of dollars in science pre-requisites costs and might have attempted to self-study for MCAT. Unless I master the content I would not be able to get a sufficient score on MCAT and I would not take anyone else's spot.

If I ever get into MD school I would love to go for a primary care area because in rural remote areas this is the biggest shortage of all. Wish you the best.

 

[Teah7]

I'm not sure I see Competency-Based as a move away from looking at science coursework. It seems to be a move away from require specific courses. However, the competencies include:



That seems to me like coursework in the sciences is still applicable and possibly even necessary.

You also say you completed your "undergraduate degree." To me, that sounds like a BSN. If it is a BSN, I'm not sure how many pre-reqs you'd have left. My stepmom just finished her RN and has already been required to take Gen Chem, Phys, Bio, A&P, and Stats. Her BSN will include Org Chem, Bio Chem, and Micro.

Yes, it is BSN. My science pre-requisites have been taken 12 years ago that is why they would not be good for MD schools, I do not remember much. Congratulations to your stepmom that she got in RN school and finished it. I get always inspired when I hear about people going back to school and not letting their age discourage them.

 

[nontradjd]

Yes, it is BSN. My science pre-requisites have been taken 12 years ago that is why they would not be good for MD schools, I do not remember much. Congratulations to your stepmom that she got in RN school and finished it. I get always inspired when I hear about people going back to school and not letting their age discourage them.

Ah, ok, that makes it more understandable. And thanks. I think she's pretty awesome for it. Her goal is to get her Master's.

It's going to be super great if I end up deciding on medicine and going back to her and my dad in 4-5 years and being like "Hey guys, remember when I said I was going to get a real job and pay off all those student loans you cosigned? Yeah, instead, I'm going to double my debt and get another doctorate. K, see ya next holiday!" Especially considering I've heard my mom discourage my youngest brother from being a doctor multiple times. Lol.

Anyway, I'm blabbing on irrelevancies. If this is the route you want to take, then take it. But I think you're severely limiting your options by only applying to Competency schools and I don't think it's the best route.

But, to attempt to answer your original question, for study techniques, having done well on the ACT (90th percentile) and LSAT (93rd percentile) and passing the bar exam by a decent margin through self-study, I can tell you what works for me for standardized tests: practice tests. Usually, I take a steady stream of them while using study books to strengthen my weak areas. Obviously, I've not studied or looked at MCAT study materials, so I don't know how well it would work. If you're sure that you're weak in all areas, I would grab textbooks and self-study if I didn't want to or couldn't take classes.

 

[Sonny881994]

Don't usually response on here but really want to save you from heartache and wasting your time...you WILL NOT get in into any MD school without science courses and the fact that you think an MCAT around 27 is good enough to get in also signal that you are severely misinformed. There are common sense admission rules and getting science courses is one of them. It is so integrated to the admission process that most people don't even think it need to be written out. Unless you are Sho Yano please do not expect to get in unless you choose to go the normal route like everyone else

 

[Deranged Medic]

Once again, this may not be the advice you want to hear, but it's the advice you need to hear: do not try to take the MCAT without taking the actual science classes it tests. I would be willing to place big money on a bet this will end badly for you. There are no shortcuts to med school. Slow and steady wins the race.

 

[Teah7]

Don't usually response on here but really want to save you from heartache and wasting your time...you WILL NOT get in into any MD school without science courses and the fact that you think an MCAT around 27 is good enough to get in also signal that you are severely misinformed. There are common sense admission rules and getting science courses is one of them. It is so integrated to the admission process that most people don't even think it need to be written out. Unless you are Sho Yano please do not expect to get in unless you choose to go the normal route like everyone else

Thank you Sonny881994 for taking your time and responding to my post. I might be misinformed or might be in denial, but the school that I spoke to told me that they took students with MCAT as low as 24 last year and 27 was their average MCAT. I hope they told me the truth. I will more carefully look into this and play safe. May this school is not as good s other US MD schools, but even if this is case it would be better than even the best Caribbean schools because of the limited residency spots for FMG/IMG.

Do you know what is the best MCAT review for mastering the content? Good luck to you and I sincerely appreciate your effort to safeguard me from heartbreak.

 

[Teah7]

Once again, this may not be the advice you want to hear, but it's the advice you need to hear: do not try to take the MCAT without taking the actual science classes it tests. I would be willing to place big money on a bet this will end badly for you. There are no shortcuts to med school. Slow and steady wins the race.

[URL='http://forums.studentdoctor.net/members/deranged-medic.469496/']Deranged Medic, thanks for your comment. I will try my best not to let my older age rush me, so that I do not end up "jumping from hot pen to a fire" . (In my home country this is a famous proverb).

Yes, I should not risk having a bad score of MCAT as my 1st score, on my records.[/URL]

 

[mavric1298]

You can skip over my post, but again, if you haven't taken science courses, you haven't master the competencies and won't get in. The whole point isn't that you don't need science classes. I'm not trying to be mean, but it's the way it is. I'll say it one more time since you still haven't acknowledged it - competencies aren't mean to get you out of science classes, they are solely meant that you don't have to take specific classes.

What classes did you take 12 years ago, and why don't they count? You are skipping over this bit of info - if you already took your prerecs but they were 12 years ago, they still count and this whole convo is a mute point.
What school are you taking about - the MSAR lists all the data and it would be easy enough to check - I can even do it for you if you say which school.
You would only apply to 1 school? You know the average is 14-16?

And again, I'm going to flat out say it like other have in this post, MCAT without the classes is just a horrible, horrible idea. The average matriculation MCAT is a 31, which is the 84th percentile. Do you think you can be competitive with people that are doing the same prep that you are, but have taken the classes? Sit down, take an 8 hour full length practice test and pretend it's the real thing, it will give you a baseline of where you are at.

Another piece of info you have left out is your undergrad GPA's.

We will help, but you have to be realistic and also help us help you by providing the info we would need to weigh in on your situation. And if you are give advice, actually listen to it and think about it, even if it's not what you want to hear.

 

[Teah7]

You can skip over my post, but again, if you haven't taken science courses, you haven't master the competencies and won't get in. The whole point isn't that you don't need science classes. I'm not trying to be mean, but it's the way it is. I'll say it one more time since you still haven't acknowledged it - competencies aren't mean to get you out of science classes, they are solely meant that you don't have to take specific classes.

What classes did you take 12 years ago, and why don't they count? You are skipping over this bit of info - if you already took your prerecs but they were 12 years ago, they still count and this whole convo is a mute point.
What school are you taking about - the MSAR lists all the data and it would be easy enough to check - I can even do it for you if you say which school.
You would only apply to 1 school? You know the average is 14-16?

And again, I'm going to flat out say it like other have in this post, MCAT without the classes is just a horrible, horrible idea. The average matriculation MCAT is a 31, which is the 84th percentile. Do you think you can be competitive with people that are doing the same prep that you are, but have taken the classes? Sit down, take an 8 hour full length practice test and pretend it's the real thing, it will give you a baseline of where you are at.

Another piece of info you have left out is your undergrad GPA's.

We will help, but you have to be realistic and also help us help you by providing the info we would need to weigh in on your situation. And if you are give advice, actually listen to it and think about it, even if it's not what you want to hear.

You are a very kind person to write all the above and take additional time in your busy schedule to even reply to my question 2nd time. Thanks. I have taken my prerequisites not only 12 years ago, but they are from non-US school. US medical schools allow science pre-requisites to be from outside US or Canada. I have never taken Biochemistry and Physics II. My GPA is 3.83 and I was going to start studying for MCAT for 1 or 1.5 year starting from June so that I can have enough. I am not in denial of the fact that my chances to get in would be much better if I take all science pre-requisites.

The school I was talking about is East Tennessee State and if I become their resident first before I apply, their in-state acceptance rate is 11%. It means that my 1st RN job after I finish my nursing school needs to be in East Tennessee. MCAT score range of their applicants was 26 - 33. With my GPA I think my MCAT score needs to be at least 28. They said that they will not look down at my application if I did not take my pre-requisites as long as my MCAT is good enough.

If I apply to only this school I know I will be running a huge risk. If I take all the pre-requisites and apply to other schools I will be out of state applicant and acceptance rate for out of states are less than 3%. That is why 11% for East Tennessee State seems better as an in-state applicant. May be I am too much of a optimist or have not yet "woken up and smelled coffee". If I get in East Tennessee medical school I will be 44 y.o. when I start it. That is why it so hard for me to want to take 2 more years in retaking all the science allover. I am still going to take Physics II and Biochem anyway because I have never taken them before.

 

[Cawolf]

Thanks, Cawolf for your reply and input. To become NP I would need 2 years more for Masters and 2 more years for PhD, total of 4 years and meanwhile I could finish MD or DO school. I look at the +3 years of residency as a work, not as a school, that is why to me medical school is not 7 more years of school, but 4 more years, of course after I get in, if I ever get in. I have also heard that NP-s might not be recognized in many states. Due to my husbands mining major I will have to be flexible to often relocate and unlike many new doctors I will live in a very remote rural areas where there is an extreme shortage of doctors. I think I can benefit to communities that are very desperate for doctors. This is what motivates me the most. I have taken sciences before but it was 12 years ago.

As for your response why should I be any different I would say that it is not me who has any power to change requirements, it is schools that change their requirements, so please, do not judge me so harshly, because it you could, you might have also loved the idea of saving yourself thousands and thousands of dollars in science prerequisites costs and might have attempted to self-study for MCAT. Unless I master the content I would not be able to get a sufficient score on MCAT and I would not take anyone else's spot.

If I ever get into MD school I would love to go for a primary care area because in rural remote areas this is the biggest shortage of all. Wish you the best.

I understand, I was just offering a suggestion. I would also consider that many rural areas use NP as their primary care providers.

I am a bit younger than you, but I went back and took my pre-reqs (only spent $150 on MCAT prep) and am applying this cycle. I am definitely not judging you, just offering an opinion from my perspective. I was in your shoes and had to make similar decisions (though with different constraints). I would make sure you truly consider all options before attempting to apply to medical school in this fashion.

 

[mavric1298]

But if you do all the pre-reqs, you can apply broadly to private schools. Yes acceptance rates are down at 3% or less for out of state, but keep in mind almost half of all applicants are accepted; there are 731,595 applications, but those are just 49,480 applicants, and 20,343 matriculate - So that number seems very low, it's because people are applying to 15 schools and going to only one. I still think you should take the extra time to do pre-reqs. Also explore DO, I see no reason to exclude it, but I don't know about competence policies with it.

And that is wayyyyyyy to long to start studying for the MCAT, most of the material isn't that in depth, it's just the shear volume. I did a 4 month prep course and most of the info we needed from the first couple weeks was out of my head by time I finished. And it isn't a test that can just be reasoned thru.

In the scheme of things, what is a year and half to finish pre-reqs? It's nothing, and you might possibly waste a lot more time being denied if you don't do it right from the start. If you did summer term, it wouldn't even be a full 2. Shortcuts to get into medical school generally don't work out for people, so if this is really how you are set on doing it, best of luck to you.

 

[Goro]

I think that this would be extremely foolish.

Even the schools that don't have requirements "recommend" them.

But if you insist, try Khan Academy.

I am 42 and I am finishing my nursing undergraduate degree in 1 year. Due to my age I was afraid that taking all the science pre-requisites would take me two more years, that is why to my surprise I found few US MD schools that do not require any science prerequisites and would not look down at my application as long as I have an average MCAT score (27 or more as an old version score type). I will need to study the content of all the sciences all by myself so that I can achieve good enough core on MCAT.

I am a good self-learner.

Please, if you can, advise me if you know what kind of review can help me handle so much material and teach me things that I need to know to do well on MCAT.

If you do not know the answer to my question, please, do not judge me, if you can. Thanks for reading this.

 

[occams_razor]

You are a very kind person to write all the above and take additional time in your busy schedule to even reply to my question 2nd time. Thanks. I have taken my prerequisites not only 12 years ago, but they are from non-US school. US medical schools allow science pre-requisites to be from outside US or Canada. I have never taken Biochemistry and Physics II. My GPA is 3.83 and I was going to start studying for MCAT for 1 or 1.5 year starting from June so that I can have enough. I am not in denial of the fact that my chances to get in would be much better if I take all science pre-requisites.

The school I was talking about is East Tennessee State and if I become their resident first before I apply, their in-state acceptance rate is 11%. It means that my 1st RN job after I finish my nursing school needs to be in East Tennessee. MCAT score range of their applicants was 26 - 33. With my GPA I think my MCAT score needs to be at least 28. They said that they will not look down at my application if I did not take my pre-requisites as long as my MCAT is good enough.

If I apply to only this school I know I will be running a huge risk. If I take all the pre-requisites and apply to other schools I will be out of state applicant and acceptance rate for out of states are less than 3%. That is why 11% for East Tennessee State seems better as an in-state applicant. May be I am too much of a optimist or have not yet "woken up and smelled coffee". If I get in East Tennessee medical school I will be 44 y.o. when I start it. That is why it so hard for me to want to take 2 more years in retaking all the science allover. I am still going to take Physics II and Biochem anyway because I have never taken them before.

Your GPA is great, so you are starting in a good place.

According to MSAR, the average MCAT for accepted applicants at East Tennessee State University is a 30, not a 27. I'm not sure why they told you 27 was their average... That is very strange.

 

[Teah7]

Yes, you are right, 30 on MCAT is the average for East Tennessee State University and 27 is the lowest score they allowed among those whom they accepted, so MCAT of 27 would put me in 10th percentile with those whom they accepted, in other words, even if I was an in-state applicant, instead of having 11% chance, I would have 11% : 10 = 1.1% chance. I am starting to believe finally that I would not be able to do well on MCAT without taking all the science pre-requisites allover. I have forgotten most of the content from my science classes that I took in 2002. I have only taken Organic Chem I and Pathophysiology and gotten A in both classes. Thank you all for helping me, I wish everyone the best luck to get into schools of your #1 choice.

 

[JazzyPreMed]

I am 42 and I am finishing my nursing undergraduate degree in 1 year. Due to my age I was afraid that taking all the science pre-requisites would take me two more years, that is why to my surprise I found few US MD schools that do not require any science prerequisites and would not look down at my application as long as I have an average MCAT score (27 or more as an old version score type). I will need to study the content of all the sciences all by myself so that I can achieve good enough core on MCAT.

I am a good self-learner.

Please, if you can, advise me if you know what kind of review can help me handle so much material and teach me things that I need to know to do well on MCAT.

If you do not know the answer to my question, please, do not judge me, if you can. Thanks for reading this.

I recent heard of a school in NY that does this. IF you feel like you can study for the MCAT and take it without taking the courses why not? Who are any of these people to say you cannot do it? They do not know you or what you ar capable of. Just because lots of people when back to school and had to take the courses doesn't mean you have to. Go for it....lots of people have to re-teach themselves the material before taking the MCAT, it's the same thing.

 

[shoal]

Just a heads up, 3 yrs of residency is not just work. It is slave labor, brutual hours and complete bend over backwards and take it. You have a very false sense of med school and residency, do some shadowing. 6 days left in residency and ill finally be out. Gl

Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk

 

[jl lin]

I recent heard of a school in NY that does this. IF you feel like you can study for the MCAT and take it without taking the courses why not? Who are any of these people to say you cannot do it? They do not know you or what you ar capable of. Just because lots of people when back to school and had to take the courses doesn't mean you have to. Go for it....lots of people have to re-teach themselves the material before taking the MCAT, it's the same thing.

Even if there is a small possibility somewhere, the truth is, statistically speaking, the odds would not be in her/his favor. I think OP should get some old MCAT FLs right now and see how she/he does on them. This may help give some realistic insight; but analyzing the admission statistics is a wake up too.

 

[LingoLaine]

Even if you COULD get INTO med school without the basic science requirements, that doesn't mean you SHOULD, because you are unlikely to get OUT OF med school successfully. As an older student myself, I took only the usual required science classes, and my experience has been that those were not enough. I did not feel adequately prepared for medical school, and if I had the chance to do it again, I would not only ABSOLUTELY POSITIVELY take the basic classes you're proposing to skip, but ALSO TAKE extra preparatory coursework (biochemistry, physiology, genetics, anatomy, etc.)

 

[Teah7]

I recent heard of a school in NY that does this. IF you feel like you can study for the MCAT and take it without taking the courses why not? Who are any of these people to say you cannot do it? They do not know you or what you ar capable of. Just because lots of people when back to school and had to take the courses doesn't mean you have to. Go for it....lots of people have to re-teach themselves the material before taking the MCAT, it's the same thing.

JazzyPreMed, you have no idea how much your words and reply mean to me. You are very kind, compassionate and non-judgmental person. We need doctors like this. May God bless you and give you the strength to reach all your goals.

 

[jl lin]

I appreciate Jazzy's kind and comforting approach; but, as Dr. Midlife has well said, "Reality is your friend." If she didn't say it, I am sorry I don't remember who said it right now. That's good advice definitely for pursuing and going through medicine, and it's good advice for life.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

Yeah, I'm going to predict this is not going to end well at all.

I seriously doubt any of these schools that say prerequisites are "optional" have really accepted someone who has never taken any.

 

[Teah7]

Yeah, I'm going to predict this is not going to end well at all.

I seriously doubt any of these schools that say prerequisites are "optional" have really accepted someone who has never taken any.

I took the majority of the science pre-requisites but not from US, for the science pre-requisites to count, they need to be taken in US colleges. I have only taken Organic chem 1 and pathophysiology in US and got A -s in both. 4 of the MD schools that that started going for "competency based admissions" told me that they do not even look at the list of pre-requisites and they would need to know my GPA and MCAT score, as well as if I have gotten undergraduate degree. They even told me that with no science prerequisites I do not even have to have higher MCAT score compared to an applicant with all the science pre-requisites completed. I do not think that they would have concealed the truth just to hope to receive an application fee for an additional applicant.

 

[Teah7]

Even if you COULD get INTO med school without the basic science requirements, that doesn't mean you SHOULD, because you are unlikely to get OUT OF med school successfully. As an older student myself, I took only the usual required science classes, and my experience has been that those were not enough. I did not feel adequately prepared for medical school, and if I had the chance to do it again, I would not only ABSOLUTELY POSITIVELY take the basic classes you're proposing to skip, but ALSO TAKE extra preparatory coursework (biochemistry, physiology, genetics, anatomy, etc.)

I agree to what you said. I have met a woman in my city who was 55 and she did not retake her pre-requisites, she took them 25-30 years ago for her nursing school and she got into a foreign medical school. she is now in her 2nd year of her residency. getting into foreign medical schools is easier of course then getting accepted in US MD schools. but studying in foreign (big 4 Caribbean) is harder especially if a student tries to get matched in US residency. At least I am not trying to take a big risk and go for foreign MD sch0ols because to get a match a student has to have A grades. 97% of US MS school applicants got matched this year and this tell me that students who might have even C grades got matched (as long as they applied to an type of residency that their USMLE step 1 score qualified for), If I ever get into U school and pass the classes and if I my USMLE score is low but a passing level, I can always apply to less competitive residencies like - Psychiatry, primary care or family medicine. I am not setting myself for saying the above, I am just psychologically preparing myself for the scenario if I get passing grades in difficult subjects like Biochemistry and etc.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

I took the majority of the science pre-requisites but not from US, for the science pre-requisites to count, they need to be taken in US colleges. I have only taken Organic chem 1 and pathophysiology in US and got A -s in both. 4 of the MD schools that that started going for "competency based admissions" told me that they do not even look at the list of pre-requisites and they would need to know my GPA and MCAT score, as well as if I have gotten undergraduate degree. They even told me that with no science prerequisites I do not even have to have higher MCAT score compared to an applicant with all the science pre-requisites completed. I do not think that they would have concealed the truth just to hope to receive an application fee for an additional applicant.

You make good points. I guess you can try, but keep a plan B in mind. I only say that because 4 schools is a very small amount of schools. Even the top students get rejected at many schools.

If you're a nurse already, just become an NP. It's a 2 year degree and you don't do residency.

 

[Yellow-Orange]

Thanks, Cawolf for your reply and input. To become NP I would need 2 years more for Masters and 2 more years for PhD, total of 4 years and meanwhile I could finish MD or DO school. I look at the +3 years of residency as a work, not as a school, that is why to me medical school is not 7 more years of school, but 4 more years, of course after I get in, if I ever get in. I have also heard that NP-s might not be recognized in many states. Due to my husbands mining major I will have to be flexible to often relocate and unlike many new doctors I will live in a very remote rural areas where there is an extreme shortage of doctors. I think I can benefit to communities that are very desperate for doctors. This is what motivates me the most. I have taken sciences before but it was 12 years ago.

If I ever get into MD school I would love to go for a primary care area because in rural remote areas this is the biggest shortage of all. Wish you the best.

Hey Teah7, if you're still reading this thread, I just wanted to say I think it's really great you want to work in a medically undeserved area. There is definitely a lot of need for that. But I think you might be a little confused on the requirements to become a NP.

First, it might not take four years. I think there are two year programs, especially since you're already about to get a BSN. And someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but there are ph.D's in nursing, but I don't think that's what a NP degree is. I think it's still just a 2-4 year masters. I mean if you can find a med school that doesn't require science classes, I bet you can find a two year NP program.

Second, it's a lot easier for a nurse to transition to a NP than a DO/MD. I think there a lot more resources and you don't have to completely go back to school just to take the MCAT. Instead you probably take the GRE, which your BSN probably covered more the material on the GRE than then the MCAT. I'm also willing to bet one of your nursing mentors or counselors at your school will be able to give you more information than about NP too.

Three, in the primary care setting, I don't think there's much of a difference between NP, or PA, or MD/DO. When I go to the doctor, I usually see the NP or PA, not the actual physician. And even in the ER I work at, there are PAs and NPs that do the same thing the doctors do. I've been there a month, and I don't see a difference in what they do at all.

Fourth, you said you considered med school residency as work instead of school, but I just wanted to make sure you know you're not getting paid a doctor's salary for those residency years. I mean, you'll probably make more as a BSN than you would a resident. I think the salary they pay you is as little as possible.

 

[Yellow-Orange]

Also just wanted to say I've also never heard of a NP not being allowed to work in all states. You might want to ask one of the counselors at your university to clarify that more.

 

[ChrisMack390]

This strikes me as a horrible idea.

 

[jl lin]

Three, in the primary care setting, I don't think there's much of a difference between NP, or PA, or MD/DO. When I go to the doctor, I usually see the NP or PA, not the actual physician. And even in the ER I work at, there are PAs and NPs that do the same thing the doctors do. I've been there a month, and I don't see a difference in what they do at all.

Fourth, you said you considered med school residency as work instead of school, but I just wanted to make sure you know you're not getting paid a doctor's salary for those residency years. I mean, you'll probably make more as a BSN than you would a resident. I think the salary they pay you is as little as possible.

Disagree with the above emboldened statement. The only advantage I MIGHT give would be to those nurses or midlevels that had worked in a lot of clinical medicine already and have gotten YEARS of full time expertise one gains through the right kinds of clinical areas; but even then, 9.99999 times out of 10, their overall knowledge in limited compared to those that has been to medical school, past licensing exams, had a good residency, became board certified, etc.

And there is just no way this would be applicable to primary care w/ say IM or Peds--not even for the rarer critical care NP programs and nurse experience. The latterNP may have a bit more insight on some very specific critical care management compared to say some FM, but overall, NP programs cannot and do not beat MS and strong residency programs, etc. Even in primary care, THEY ARE NOT EQUIVALENT.

 

[mavric1298]

I'm normally all for the "don't listen to the mean, mean people telling you that you can't do it", but seriously, this is such a horrible idea. Just retake the classes. Simple. No one is saying you don't have a chance of becoming a doctor. People are just saying the path you wish to take, gives you literally almost no possibility of getting in. Why wouldn't you just do it correctly from the start, so when you do get in (which I'm sure you would if you put your mind to it), that you won't fail out after spending/loaning boatloads of money.

 

[Rocketdog]

Hope I can help. Macric1298 is right on point here. I'm 46 y/o and applying next year. I went be back to school when I was 45 and currently in the process of "taking all the classes" and I'm sooooo glad I took the harder route. Medicine isn't about trying to "get out" of challenging academics.

Would you like your Physician to tell you " Sure glad I skated thru my undergrad years finding the least challenging route to get into medical school?"

Another tone I feel here: As if these posts are all saying " Once I get into medical school all my challenging academics will magically be gone".... trying to convince yourself that the challenge of getting accepted to med school was, in it self, the most difficult hurdle you will face. You will look back on UG O chem and laugh, chuckle at Biology, grin at physics. Your medical school courses will make your UG learning look like preschool.

Don't worry about your age. Two things you are going to have to "leave behind" as you journey to become a Physician: 1. How long it's going to take 2. How much it's going to cost. While you can (somewhat) control number 2, number 1 will only continue to rise.

When I went back to school full time at ASU, I was surrounded by younger people. Some were 18 some were 50. About a month back into my degree program the weirdness went away and I was just another student. I got over it quickly. The younger students I have spoken with told me they actually like having my decades of past experience in the classroom. I've been able to articulate real world working from theory and classroom learning.

Hope you find your way. Best of luck.

 

[Teah7]

Thank you all for telling me the bitter truth. I have decided not to let myself be tempted by shortcuts excusing it by the age issue. Instead I have realized that it is safer to retake all the classes. slower and safer speed will help me do well in MD/DO school if I get in. Thanks to all again.

 

[Teah7]

Hope I can help. Macric1298 is right on point here. I'm 46 y/o and applying next year. I went be back to school when I was 45 and currently in the process of "taking all the classes" and I'm sooooo glad I took the harder route. Medicine isn't about trying to "get out" of challenging academics.

Would you like your Physician to tell you " Sure glad I skated thru my undergrad years finding the least challenging route to get into medical school?"

Another tone I feel here: As if these posts are all saying " Once I get into medical school all my challenging academics will magically be gone".... trying to convince yourself that the challenge of getting accepted to med school was, in it self, the most difficult hurdle you will face. You will look back on UG O chem and laugh, chuckle at Biology, grin at physics. Your medical school courses will make your UG learning look like preschool.

Don't worry about your age. Two things you are going to have to "leave behind" as you journey to become a Physician: 1. How long it's going to take 2. How much it's going to cost. While you can (somewhat) control number 2, number 1 will only continue to rise.

When I went back to school full time at ASU, I was surrounded by younger people. Some were 18 some were 50. About a month back into my degree program the weirdness went away and I was just another student. I got over it quickly. The younger students I have spoken with told me they actually like having my decades of past experience in the classroom. I've been able to articulate real world working from theory and classroom learning.

Hope you find your way. Best of luck.

I am so glad for you and I would like to thank you for taking your time and writing your encouragement to me. That is very kind of you. You greatly helped me to find a strength in me to ignore my age and start wanting to take all my pre-requisites. Good luck to you and I wish that you get in the school of your preference. I will be applying in 2017 or 2018.

 

[BryanBeid]

I just finished going through and taking all the pre reqs after going to a semester of law school. I'm only 25, but I was classmates with a 50 year old who took all of the classes with me. Just throwing more evidence into the situation. If he can do it, you can!

 

[jl lin]

I think that this would be extremely foolish.

Even the schools that don't have requirements "recommend" them.

But if you insist, try Khan Academy.

I agree w/ Goro OP. You haven't taken physics and biochem, so what is the big deal? At best you'd at least have to take ChemII and OChem I & II again (from >12ys ago), b/c you at least have had Bio I and Chem I required in order to do your A&P and Micro pre-reqs for nursing. I say, if you have decent grades in Bio I/Chem I (and it they are the 4 cr/ labs for science majors), then refresh up on them, take the rest of the Chems, Bio II, Physics, and Biochem, and do well in them. I am also presuming that have had Stats for science majors and research course/s, Gen Psych, Child/Developmental Psych, Abnormal Psych, and Sociology as well in your BSN program. So if you are good in these, and you have a decent command of the English language and good grades in these, just make those other sciences a priority along with other needs in your app. At this point, if you want to increase your odds, you would then be in a better position to prepare and re-take MCAT to put you in the >90%tile.

Your age isn't the issue. The issue is sGPA and cGPA (with MCAT as not really competitive) and having a firm grasp on the required pre-reqs and being able to demonstrate that to a school.

Many people believe the fairytale that getting into MS is the hardest part. Ask pretty much anyone in MS or post-MS, and they will tell you otherwise, b/c there are loads of exams to take from Steps to licensure and BC. MCAT is not the only hurdle. And it's all so massively expensive, so. . .

 

[KaBoom'd]

Thanks, Cawolf for your reply and input. To become NP I would need 2 years more for Masters and 2 more years for PhD, total of 4 years and meanwhile I could finish MD or DO school.

NP plus PhD? Check your source. I met someone a few weeks ago that's a writer and going into an intensive 2 year RN/NP program. No background in healthcare to NP in 2 years. Good luck.