Hillary Clinton vs. Donald Trump

[nonociceptors]

Let's just assume Trump isn't some maniac who will destroy foreign relations. As I posted above, for economic reasons alone, there is no rational reason to vote for him. That is, unless you don't care that our country will be $10 trillion more in debt just so people making $400k +can get a major tax break. Hillary needs to pull the Republican trick and stand in front of that debt ticker while rattling off Trump's tax "plan." I love how people who deem themselves to be "fiscal conservatives" talk about voting for Trump. If you do so, please do not refer to yourself as such. Ever. Not one person who intends to vote for Trump can explain how this will not seriously harm our economy. Yet, vote for him they will because they want "change" and he "tells it like it is." It amazes me that people who think like this are even adults, let alone future dentists.

And the people who are voting for Bernie are all way more knowledgeable, his plans are flawless, and none of his stump-points are so painfully optimistic that they border on childishness. Look, I'm not defending Trump's plan because I have my own problems with it, and with him as a candidate in general, just like you. It just bugs me when people #feelingthebern think they're somehow impervious to populism. Trump and Bernie supporters have more in common than either side wants to admit. They're both demagogues catering to different types of (generally) low-information voters. The main difference is one is still in the race and the other has had no chance for a while now, which most people could see if they weren't still in the process of stroking themselves to his promises.

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[NutritionIllinois]

And the people who are voting for Bernie are all way more knowledgeable, his plans are flawless, and none of his stump-points are so painfully optimistic that they border on childishness. Look, I'm not defending Trump's plan because I have my own problems with it, and with him as a candidate in general, just like you. It just bugs me when people #feelingthebern think they're somehow impervious to populism. Trump and Bernie supporters have more in common than either side wants to admit. They're both demagogues catering to different types of (generally) low-information voters. The main difference is one is still in the race and the other has had no chance for a while now, which most people could see if they weren't still in the process of stroking themselves to his promises.

I agree that there is no defense to the Trump plan. And you can love or hate Sanders, but at least he had a plan to pay for his anticipated increased spending. The Tax Foundation is a conservative group which gives very favorable economic growth predictions to Republican plans. Yet even that group says of Sanders' plan:

"If we account for the economic impact of the plan, it would end up raising $9.8 trillion over the next decade." So please do not compare the plans of Trump which will lose $10 trillion to Sanders' plan which will gain $10 trillion, and write both off as the same degree of craziness. But Sanders is not relevant at this point, and people who are asked to defend Trump's plan always deflect.

 

[GypsyHummus]

I think Trump is gonna win. I am a bit ambivalent to this notion, but ultimately happy about him winning and I'll explain why.

Washington is a mess. It's bloated, corrupt, and frankly, squeezing the working class people with their tax policies. Current laws are stifling economic growth and as a recent college grad, I'm having a very hard time finding work full time. The Government is getting far to controlling and too large for my liking, so something has to be done in the next couple years, otherwise we are gonna experience anouther economic collapse.

Things I do not like about Trump:
-He wants to grow our military, but our budget just can't afford it at this point.
-He hasn't laid out a healthcare plan yet and being that we are going into healthcare, that makes me a bit nervous.

Things I like about Trump
+For good or for ill, he will shake up the establishment. Politicians have carefully been creating this picture of corruption with an etch a sketch, and Trump is gonna turn it upside down and shake it.
+We need a wall. Our welfare can't support any more illegal immigrants, and many who cross the boarder illegally are criminals. I'm all for legal immigration, but for some reason, everyone has a visceral reaction when I say the wall is a good idea. Don't people lock their doors at night?
+I like his tax plan. Although i would have preferred Tes Cruz's tax plan, I feel like Trumps will encourage economic growth.

 

[NutritionIllinois]

I think Trump is gonna win. I am a bit ambivalent to this notion, but ultimately happy about him winning and I'll explain why.

Washington is a mess. It's bloated, corrupt, and frankly, squeezing the working class people with their tax policies. Current laws are stifling economic growth and as a recent college grad, I'm having a very hard time finding work full time. The Government is getting far to controlling and too large for my liking, so something has to be done in the next couple years, otherwise we are gonna experience anouther economic collapse.

Things I do not like about Trump:
-He wants to grow our military, but our budget just can't afford it at this point.
-He hasn't laid out a healthcare plan yet and being that we are going into healthcare, that makes me a bit nervous.

Things I like about Trump
+For good or for ill, he will shake up the establishment. Politicians have carefully been creating this picture of corruption with an etch a sketch, and Trump is gonna turn it upside down and shake it.
+We need a wall. Our welfare can't support any more illegal immigrants, and many who cross the boarder illegally are criminals. I'm all for legal immigration, but for some reason, everyone has a visceral reaction when I say the wall is a good idea. Don't people lock their doors at night?
+I like his tax plan. Although i would have preferred Tes Cruz's tax plan, I feel like Trumps will encourage economic growth.

I think you are wrong on at least one account. I believe Trump wants to decrease military spending. But who knows, because he changes almost daily. But he wants to make it leaner and stronger. Sounds good, but the usual lack of specifics. As far as the positives, shaking up the establishment is not inherently good. Even if Trump's plan "will encourage economic growth" (I guess you believe in trickle-down economics), the fact is that the Tax Foundation concluded Trump's plan will cost $10 trillion AFTER ACCOUNTING FOR PERCEIVED GROWTH. Given that you are willing to sink our country $10 trillion more into debt, your claim that "welfare can't support any more illegal immigrants" doesn't ring true. Your claimed concern about debt makes no sense if you support Trump's tax plan.

 

[GypsyHummus]

I think you are wrong on at least one account. I believe Trump wants to decrease military spending. But who knows, because he changes almost daily. But he wants to make it leaner and stronger. Sounds good, but the usual lack of specifics. As far as the positives, shaking up the establishment is not inherently good. Even if Trump's plan "will encourage economic growth" (I guess you believe in trickle-down economics), the fact is that the Tax Foundation concluded Trump's plan will cost $10 trillion AFTER ACCOUNTING FOR PERCEIVED GROWTH. Given that you are willing to sink our country $10 trillion more into debt, your claim that "welfare can't support any more illegal immigrants" doesn't ring true. Your claimed concern about debt makes no sense if you support Trump's tax plan.

If I recall correctly, Trump was gonna get revenue from tariffs. All in favor for that if it lowers my income tax.

Also, military spending is a huge number in the 10 trillion, so if he does indeed cut military spending and make it lean, that would be fantastic.

The guy is a business man and really good at managing money. Just for some perspective: last I heard, Trump spent somewhere between 69-80 million on his primary campaign and won. Hillary spent 189 million on her campaign thus far and still hasn't been able to knock out a 72 year old socialist who hasn't held a job in the private sector all his life. I think if there is anyone who can manage money, it would be Trump.

 

[hellofuturedentists]

+We need a wall. Our welfare can't support any more illegal immigrants, and many who cross the boarder illegally are criminals. I'm all for legal immigration, but for some reason, everyone has a visceral reaction when I say the wall is a good idea. Don't people lock their doors at night?

I'm sorry, I just had to respond to this one. The wall isn't going to happen. This is simply part of his xenophobic rhetoric to get the uninformed redneck vote. As far as I know, his best plan for building a wall is "Mexico will pay for it. Believe me. I'll make them pay for it" Why the **** would Mexico pay for it? If you can find any other plan more detailed than that explaining how this will be accomplished, I am all ears because I am dying to know how people like you legitimately think this will happen. And please, for the love of god, don't come back with some bull**** like "he's a great leader and an excellent negotiator. He'll get it done."


And, just for fun, http://www.moneytalksnews.com/why-youre-probably-better-investing-than-donald-trump/

He's not that great at managing money. He just has a ton of it to burn

The guy is a business man and really good at managing money. Just for some perspective: last I heard, Trump spent somewhere between 69-80 million on his primary campaign and won. Hillary spent 189 million on her campaign thus far and still hasn't been able to knock out a 72 year old socialist who hasn't held a job in the private sector all his life. I think if there is anyone who can manage money, it would be Trump.

 

[Incis0r]

independents will stay home and not vote

Oh trust me, my friends and I (all registered independents) will vote.

 

[GypsyHummus]

I'm sorry, I just had to respond to this one. The wall isn't going to happen. This is simply part of his xenophobic rhetoric to get the uninformed redneck vote. As far as I know, his best plan for building a wall is "Mexico will pay for it. Believe me. I'll make them pay for it" Why the **** would Mexico pay for it? If you can find any other plan more detailed than that explaining how this will be accomplished, I am all ears because I am dying to know how people like you legitimately think this will happen. And please, for the love of god, don't come back with some bull**** like "he's a great leader and an excellent negotiator. He'll get it done."

Well, let's first come to a conclusion on weather or not the wall is a good idea in the first place, because if one does not believe a wall is a good idea, then much of what I will try to convey will simply bounce off, as people have a visceral and violent reaction to this idea for some reason. My great grandparents were immigrants to the USA, but they came in legally. I don't understand why everyone just can't process the idea of having a wall.

In my opinion, a wall is an excellent idea. We are currently going through a massive influx of illegal immigrants that our system, welfare to medical to dental even, just can't sustain. This is before we get to the part about the people crossing illegally, as technically without the appropriate papers, all of the people are breaking the law/are criminals. Furthermore, what Trump says is true, Mexico is not sending their best people. Did you know that 80% of the women who cross are raped? By the people helping them cross! There is a massive drug influx coming along with these people as well, so this is something that can't be swept under the rug, and I do have to give the Donald kudos for bringing it to national attention. I would be willing to pay more in taxes for said wall, I didn't even care if Mexico was going to pay for it

So we have identified the problem, lets talk about this wall and how Mexico will pay for it. I confess, I couldn't understand why Mexico would pay for a wall to keep criminals and drugs into their country, but after doing some research, Mexico really depends on the USA for a lot of things. Ford was apparently going to build a plant in Mexico, but Trump has threatened sanctions if they follow through. Through negotionations and trade deals, we will make enough money off of Mexico to pay for the wall, be it through tariffs, exports, or other means. So not that Mexico is gonna write a check to the USA for the wall, but the money that we will be gaining via the trade deficients we used to run with Mexico are going to "pay for" the wall. It will be in a indirect way.

 

[Incis0r]

So not that Mexico is gonna write a check to the USA for the wall, but the money that we will be gaining via the trade deficients

Exactly- According to the Office of the United States Trade Representative, we had a $58 BILLION trade deficit with Mexico in 2015. I was thinking the $10B would be shaved off of that in an "indirect way"- like you so nicely explained.

 

[hellofuturedentists]

Well, let's first come to a conclusion on weather or not the wall is a good idea in the first place, because if one does not believe a wall is a good idea, then much of what I will try to convey will simply bounce off, as people have a visceral and violent reaction to this idea for some reason. My great grandparents were immigrants to the USA, but they came in legally. I don't understand why everyone just can't process the idea of having a wall.

In my opinion, a wall is an excellent idea. We are currently going through a massive influx of illegal immigrants that our system, welfare to medical to dental even, just can't sustain. This is before we get to the part about the people crossing illegally, as technically without the appropriate papers, all of the people are breaking the law/are criminals. Furthermore, what Trump says is true, Mexico is not sending their best people. Did you know that 80% of the women who cross are raped? By the people helping them cross! There is a massive drug influx coming along with these people as well, so this is something that can't be swept under the rug, and I do have to give the Donald kudos for bringing it to national attention. I would be willing to pay more in taxes for said wall, I didn't even care if Mexico was going to pay for it

So we have identified the problem, lets talk about this wall and how Mexico will pay for it. I confess, I couldn't understand why Mexico would pay for a wall to keep criminals and drugs into their country, but after doing some research, Mexico really depends on the USA for a lot of things. Ford was apparently going to build a plant in Mexico, but Trump has threatened sanctions if they follow through. Through negotionations and trade deals, we will make enough money off of Mexico to pay for the wall, be it through tariffs, exports, or other means. So not that Mexico is gonna write a check to the USA for the wall, but the money that we will be gaining via the trade deficients we used to run with Mexico are going to "pay for" the wall. It will be in a indirect way.

Nope. Nope. Nope. None of that. Nope. First of all, let's pretend that 80% statistic is true, and please give a source that isn't Donald Trump, because most of what he says has been proven a lie by Politifact (http://www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-trump/). Are the women crossing over rapists as well? Or do they not count in the statistic? Anyway, I'm not arguing with you because clearly you think somehow a wall is going to remedy the situation.

Anyway, regarding this "trade deficit" that seems to just so perfectly pay for a wall (and what about wall maintenance? Is that included...), I would love if you'd read how that is not true: http://www.politifact.com/florida/s...-trump-says-course-mexico-can-pay-wall-becau/. I also urge you to look more into Trump's statements with Politifact. You can also look into Hillary's, Bernie's, and even Obama's. It's not a liberal website, in case you're worried about that. You can look at Cruz, Kasich, Rubio, the works. They may not all have stellar truth records, but they are far bette than Trump's. Trump is just a liar. Please educate yourself. If you're going to be a Trump supporter, at least back it up with legitimate information. And if you refuse to read it and educate yourself, I can't discuss this any further. Probably shouldn't anyway.

EDIT: Here's one more that specifically talks about Trumps thing about how Mexico is sending their worst people.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...p-mexican-government-they-send-bad-ones-over/

 

[NutritionIllinois]

Nope. Nope. Nope. None of that. Nope. First of all, let's pretend that 80% statistic is true, and please give a source that isn't Donald Trump, because most of what he says has been proven a lie by Politifact (http://www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-trump/). Are the women crossing over rapists as well? Or do they not count in the statistic? Anyway, I'm not arguing with you because clearly you think somehow a wall is going to remedy the situation.

Anyway, regarding this "trade deficit" that seems to just so perfectly pay for a wall (and what about wall maintenance? Is that included...), I would love if you'd read how that is not true: http://www.politifact.com/florida/s...-trump-says-course-mexico-can-pay-wall-becau/. I also urge you to look more into Trump's statements with Politifact. You can also look into Hillary's, Bernie's, and even Obama's. It's not a liberal website, in case you're worried about that. You can look at Cruz, Kasich, Rubio, the works. They may not all have stellar truth records, but they are far bette than Trump's. Trump is just a liar. Please educate yourself. If you're going to be a Trump supporter, at least back it up with legitimate information. And if you refuse to read it and educate yourself, I can't discuss this any further. Probably shouldn't anyway.

EDIT: Here's one more that specifically talks about Trumps thing about how Mexico is sending their worst people.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...p-mexican-government-they-send-bad-ones-over/

They aren't interested in facts. I post about the cost of his tax plan, and The response is that he's a "businessman" and "really good at managing money." Forget the it is impossible not to become deeper in debt after his massive tax cuts, and forget that there will be much less money to manage. You have to figure if we are this deep into this and they still love Trump, facts don't matter to them, which is a scary thought.

 

[hellofuturedentists]

They aren't interested in facts. I post about the cost of his tax plan, and The response is that he's a "businessman" and "really good at managing money." Forget the it is impossible not to become deeper in debt after his massive tax cuts, and forget that there will be much less money to manage. You have to figure if we are this deep into this and they still love Trump, facts don't matter to them, which is a scary thought.

Lol that's why I didn't want to reply to this anymore. Like I said in a comment before, people rarely change their political opinions once they're formed. If people on this forum read Politifact and still support Trump, nothing I could possibly say will change that, so it's not worth my time

 

[Scumbag_Steve]

.

 

[powerballwinner]

Oh trust me, my friends and I (all registered independents) will vote.

Yeah that was a dumb comment lol, turnout will definitely happen in the general election, especially since the dnc won't have machines "unavailable" and independents can vote. Hillary has no chance against trump honestly, and Biden is a Bernie supporter so I'd rather Biden, but I doubt they'll ignore Bernie for the nomination because that'll cause chaos probs

 

[SrJulio]

Yeah that was a dumb comment lol, turnout will definitely happen in the general election, especially since the dnc won't have machines "unavailable" and independents can vote. Hillary has no chance against trump honestly, and Biden is a Bernie supporter so I'd rather Biden, but I doubt they'll ignore Bernie for the nomination because that'll cause chaos probs

Let's wait and see. If you think the DNC will support Sanders, then you don't know any politics. I am not supporting Clinton because I thought she would be a better president or because of her policies, I just don't want Trump and there is no other choice.

Well, based on multiple reports I saw, turnout would be low due to the high unfavorability of Trump and Clinton. I guess we will wait and see

 

[powerballwinner]

Let's wait and see. If you think the DNC will support Sanders, then you don't know any politics. I am not supporting Clinton because I thought she would be a better president or because of her policies, I just don't want Trump and there is no other choice.

Well, based on multiple reports I saw, turnout would be low due to the high unfavorability of Trump and Clinton. I guess we will wait and see

Unfortunately you're right, we live in a broken system and corrupt politics

 

[SrJulio]

So sad that a lying corporate puppet who should have been in jail is the lesser of two evils compared to an orange orangutan with zero governing experience or intellect. Is this the best America can offer? God help us

 

[Ligament]

many who cross the boarder illegally are criminals.

Um..100% of invaders who cross the border illegally are criminals, by definition. They have crossed the border...illegally.

 

[NutritionIllinois]

Um..100% of invaders who cross the border illegally are criminals, by definition. They have crossed the border...illegally.

Trump has said essentially that Mexico sends criminals to the Unites States illegally. In other words, he claimed that the illegal immigrants were criminals BEFORE they came here, not as a result of simply being here. Trump's claims have zero factual support and were designed to stir up unwarranted fears among a crazy base.

 

[xerxes106]

If I recall correctly, Trump was gonna get revenue from tariffs. All in favor for that if it lowers my income tax.

Also, military spending is a huge number in the 10 trillion, so if he does indeed cut military spending and make it lean, that would be fantastic.

The guy is a business man and really good at managing money. Just for some perspective: last I heard, Trump spent somewhere between 69-80 million on his primary campaign and won. Hillary spent 189 million on her campaign thus far and still hasn't been able to knock out a 72 year old socialist who hasn't held a job in the private sector all his life. I think if there is anyone who can manage money, it would be Trump.

Where does this "really good at managing money" idea come from? The guy refuses to disclose any income related information and the only knowledge that you have of him being good with money were his successes in the 80s and how often he goes "I have this much money blah blah I spend this much blah blah." He maintains his wealth and knows the loopholes, whoopty-doo. If he were good with money he wouldn't have a gold plated elevator and his own 757 airliner, he would've put the money somewhere more intelligent. I don't like either candidate but I'd wager the Clintons are better at making money and not blowing it on useless crap than Trump is.

 

[schmoob]

Trump has said essentially that Mexico sends criminals to the Unites States illegally. In other words, he claimed that the illegal immigrants were criminals BEFORE they came here, not as a result of simply being here. Trump's claims have zero factual support and were designed to stir up unwarranted fears among a crazy base.

Careful with words like "essentially" and "basically said."
What he wants is Mexico to have accountability to avoid situations like the San Francisco murder.
I have spoken to many Mexican-Americans on the matter, and you would be surprised at how many of them agree with Trump. There are many violent offenders that cross illegally to this country. They get deported, they come back. He wants accountability. Think of the border patrol agents and how many of them are Mexican-American, yet the National Border Patrol Council, which represents nearly 17,000 CBP agents has officially endorsed Trump.

Where does this "really good at managing money" idea come from? The guy refuses to disclose any income related information and the only knowledge that you have of him being good with money were his successes in the 80s and how often he goes "I have this much money blah blah I spend this much blah blah." He maintains his wealth and knows the loopholes, whoopty-doo. If he were good with money he wouldn't have a gold plated elevator and his own 757 airliner, he would've put the money somewhere more intelligent. I don't like either candidate but I'd wager the Clintons are better at making money and not blowing it on useless crap than Trump is.

What he does with HIS money is not our business. Apparently he is good enough at managing money to be able to blow it on things like a gold plated elevator and a 757.


Everyone is so judgemental. Why are there not more people judging Hillary? She has broken some major rules.

 

[Incis0r]

@schmoob , can I buy you a ginger ale?

 

[xerxes106]

Careful with words like "essentially" and "basically said."
What he wants is Mexico to have accountability to avoid situations like the San Francisco murder.
I have spoken to many Mexican-Americans on the matter, and you would be surprised at how many of them agree with Trump. There are many violent offenders that cross illegally to this country. They get deported, they come back. He wants accountability. Think of the border patrol agents and how many of them are Mexican-American, yet the National Border Patrol Council, which represents nearly 17,000 CBP agents has officially endorsed Trump.


What he does with HIS money is not our business. Apparently he is good enough at managing money to be able to blow it on things like a gold plated elevator and a 757.


Everyone is so judgemental. Why are there not more people judging Hillary? She has broken some major rules.

What he does with his money is not our business? The guy is running for the highest office on the planet, it is our business. I want a president, not my 8 year old nephew who thinks gold elevators are cool. If he had had blown millions on coke and sex trafficking children you'd still be going "its none of our business guys, what about Hilary?! Benghazi guys! Emails!!! Generic owned by corporations and crooked comment!"

 

[SrJulio]

Careful with words like "essentially" and "basically said."
What he wants is Mexico to have accountability to avoid situations like the San Francisco murder.
I have spoken to many Mexican-Americans on the matter, and you would be surprised at how many of them agree with Trump. There are many violent offenders that cross illegally to this country. They get deported, they come back. He wants accountability. Think of the border patrol agents and how many of them are Mexican-American, yet the National Border Patrol Council, which represents nearly 17,000 CBP agents has officially endorsed Trump.


What he does with HIS money is not our business. Apparently he is good enough at managing money to be able to blow it on things like a gold plated elevator and a 757.


Everyone is so judgemental. Why are there not more people judging Hillary? She has broken some major rules.

Saying Clinton has not been judged is ridiculous. Despite where she stands on issues, the Clintons have been in the public spotlight for decades, whitewater, Lewinsky, Benghazi, just to name a few. Whereas Trump has not been publicly scrutinized like other politicians. That's why he gets mad whenever someone gets under his skin.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[NutritionIllinois]

Careful with words like "essentially" and "basically said."
What he wants is Mexico to have accountability to avoid situations like the San Francisco murder.

Yes, I know how Trump supporters are so particular about any assertion being 100% based on fact. See quote below. Happy?:
"The Mexican government forces many bad people into our country because they're smart. They're smarter than our leaders, and their negotiators are far better than what we have, to a degree that you wouldn’t believe. They're forcing people into our country. … And they are drug dealers and they are criminals of all kinds. We are taking Mexico’s problems." AND "When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.” So this guy has actually said that Mexico sends criminals here. Totally false.

 

[SrJulio]

Yes, I know how Trump supporters are so particular about any assertion being 100% based on fact. See quote below. Happy?:
"The Mexican government forces many bad people into our country because they're smart. They're smarter than our leaders, and their negotiators are far better than what we have, to a degree that you wouldn’t believe. They're forcing people into our country. … And they are drug dealers and they are criminals of all kinds. We are taking Mexico’s problems." AND "When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.”

Talking to Trump supporters are like talking to Fox news viewers, they live in a bubble. haha

 

[NutritionIllinois]

Talking to Trump supporters are like talking to Fox news viewers, they live in a bubble. haha

I am just amazed how they are so adverse to facts.

 

[schmoob]

What he does with his money is not our business? The guy is running for the highest office on the planet, it is our business. I want a president, not my 8 year old nephew who thinks gold elevators are cool. If he had had blown millions on coke and sex trafficking children you'd still be going "its none of our business guys, what about Hilary?! Benghazi guys! Emails!!! Generic owned by corporations and crooked comment!"

Are you really comparing him spending money on things that are incredibly illegal and immoral, to what you consider tacky, overpriced, and unnecessary? If he spent his money on drugs and sex trafficking children, then yes it is absolutely our business because it indicates more than just his money management, especially as a President.
But if you think that his own personal wealth management is up for your judgement because it is reckless of him to buy a plane or to have a gold plated elevator, then you are simply wrong. What else could he have done with his money? Anything, right? What else should he have done with his money? None of our business.

I am just amazed how they are so adverse to facts.

That's fine. I will support my maniacal narcissist, while you continue to support your lying criminal (who's ego is no smaller). Are you going to acknowledge that she's a criminal? Or are you so adverse to facts?

 

[NutritionIllinois]

Are you really comparing him spending money on things that are incredibly illegal and immoral, to what you consider tacky, overpriced, and unnecessary? If he spent his money on drugs and sex trafficking children, then yes it is absolutely our business because it indicates more than just his money management, especially as a President.
But if you think that his own personal wealth management is up for your judgement because it is reckless of him to buy a plane or to have a gold plated elevator, then you are simply wrong. What else could he have done with his money? Anything, right? What else should he have done with his money? None of our business.



That's fine. I will support my maniacal narcissist, while you continue to support your lying criminal (who's ego is no smaller). Are you going to acknowledge that she's a criminal? Or are you so adverse to facts?

Nice deflection. My main criticism of Trump is on POLICY, and I brought out his preposterous tax plan and the differences that plans will have on the debt. And insane beliefs like Mexico is exporting criminals. Your attempt to equate the problems the two have is laughable, but defend Trump's tax policy and after that we can discuss the criminal. But quickly I would define a criminal as one who has been convicted of a crime, which is why I don't toss around the word criminal against Trump, despite fraud being a crime. So my answer is no, I don't consider either Trump or Clinton to be criminals.

 

[xerxes106]

Are you really comparing him spending money on things that are incredibly illegal and immoral, to what you consider tacky, overpriced, and unnecessary? If he spent his money on drugs and sex trafficking children, then yes it is absolutely our business because it indicates more than just his money management, especially as a President.
But if you think that his own personal wealth management is up for your judgement because it is reckless of him to buy a plane or to have a gold plated elevator, then you are simply wrong. What else could he have done with his money? Anything, right? What else should he have done with his money? None of our business.



That's fine. I will support my maniacal narcissist, while you continue to support your lying criminal (who's ego is no smaller). Are you going to acknowledge that she's a criminal? Or are you so adverse to facts?

Thank you for validating my point that fiscal responsibility and ethics ARE the public's business when running for president. Reckless wealth management isn't a negative when running for an office that helps dictate the fiscal state of 300 million Americans? Well, gee whiz, someone get MC Hammer on the ballot. He can do whatever he wants with the money, it's his money. But how he spends his money and if he did it ethically is also indicative of who he is as a person and what he'll be as a president and absolutely fair game.

 

[Ligament]

Yes, I know how Trump supporters are so particular about any assertion being 100% based on fact. See quote below. Happy?:
"The Mexican government forces many bad people into our country because they're smart. They're smarter than our leaders, and their negotiators are far better than what we have, to a degree that you wouldn’t believe. They're forcing people into our country. … And they are drug dealers and they are criminals of all kinds. We are taking Mexico’s problems." AND "When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.” So this guy has actually said that Mexico sends criminals here. Totally false.

It matters to the USA whether Mexico is sending criminals to the USA illegally.

It ALSO matters to the USA that Mexican criminals are coming to the USA illegally, by any means and motive.

MANY of the invaders are criminals in Mexico. Not all, but Many.

The fact is there should be ZERO invaders coming into the USA through mexico, domestic housewife or serial murderer, does not matter. NEITHER Should be here.

 

[schmoob]

Nice deflection. My main criticism of Trump is on POLICY, and I brought out his preposterous tax plan and the differences that plans will have on the debt. And insane beliefs like Mexico is exporting criminals. Your attempt to equate the problems the two have is laughable, but defend Trump's tax policy and after that we can discuss the criminal. But quickly I would define a criminal as one who has been convicted of a crime, which is why I don't toss around the word criminal against Trump, despite fraud being a crime. So my answer is no, I don't consider either Trump or Clinton to be criminals.

Thank you for validating my point that fiscal responsibility and ethics ARE the public's business when running for president. Reckless wealth management isn't a negative when running for an office that helps dictate the fiscal state of 300 million Americans? Well, gee whiz, someone get MC Hammer on the ballot. He can do whatever he wants with the money, it's his money. But how he spends his money and if he did it ethically is also indicative of who he is as a person and what he'll be as a president and absolutely fair game.

You folks have your views and I have mine. That's the beauty of this country. It's obvious that I'm not going to change your views, and you're not going to change mine. Vote for whoever you want, as long as your vote is as informed as possible, and you truly believe what you are doing is best for our country. I'm glad that you folks at least took some time to research before making a decision.

Agree to disagree?

 

[powerballwinner]

Guys don't bother arguing with schmoob, or anyone else that has their mind set on Trump... or Hillary for that matter. They don't want to acknowledge reality
I'm just amazed how Bernie is off the radar in media and most americans, its very sad

But this should show who her supporters are and what they're up to: http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/hillarys-pathetic-cover-up-of-tpp-support/

 

[Scumbag_Steve]

.

 

[Incis0r]

Agree to disagree?

We need to build a firewall here on SDN....and the Dems are gonna pay for it.

Yes. I went there.

 

[schmoob]

Guys don't bother arguing with schmoob, or anyone else that has their mind set on Trump... or Hillary for that matter. They don't want to acknowledge reality
I'm just amazed how Bernie is off the radar in media and most americans, its very sad

But this should show who her supporters are and what they're up to: http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/hillarys-pathetic-cover-up-of-tpp-support/

Yes yes we get it, everybody's ignorant and no one knows reality; only you.
Enjoy your reality.

 

[powerballwinner]

Yes yes we get it, everybody's ignorant and no one knows reality; only you.
Enjoy your reality.

It wasn't an attack to you really, just people who see Trump or Hillary as viable candidates don't want to realize the reality behind them. But just like last thread , thats EXACTLY what i meant /s, good job bud

 

[xerxes106]

You folks have your views and I have mine. That's the beauty of this country. It's obvious that I'm not going to change your views, and you're not going to change mine. Vote for whoever you want, as long as your vote is as informed as possible, and you truly believe what you are doing is best for our country. I'm glad that you folks at least took some time to research before making a decision.

Agree to disagree?

After all we've been through? Of course. Friends forever. <3

 

[TthDec]

This is exactly why I don't follow sports. This thread is a mess.

 

[Incis0r]

Genuinely curious- what do you guys think of this?

 

[SrJulio]

Genuinely curious- what do you guys think of this?

flip flop flip flop... Is this even news? Every politician does this, but Hillary Clinton does not even bother to hide it. She has no shame, maybe that's why she is on her way to be the president. Cannot wait to see how the Clinton machine destroys Trump, or maybe it's the other way around. No one knows what is going on in this election

 

[powerballwinner]

flip flop flip flop... Is this even news? Every politician does this, but Hillary Clinton does not even bother to hide it. She has no shame, maybe that's why she is on her way to be the president. Cannot wait to see how the Clinton machine destroys Trump, or maybe it's the other way around. No one knows what is going on in this election

Yeah she doesn't hide it (except emails and speeches), but the problem is that when she is asked about it she'll blatantly lie to the public, even though there's record of it since she doesn't hide it. This election gives me more anxiety than dental apps

 

[Scumbag_Steve]

.

 

[Incis0r]

Wow I'm surprised- I just took this quiz and @Scumbag_Steve is right- Gary Johnson 2016!

 

[hellopeople]

Widespread support of Donald Trump is a thing here?
Is that just b/c he's republican? I don't get it.

 

[SrJulio]

Wow I'm surprised- I just took this quiz and @Scumbag_Steve is right- Gary Johnson 2016!

Was not surprised to see Sanders as my top choice, but sadly he lost. Johnson will be on the ballot, so at least he has a chance

 

[Dmitry]

Trump

 

[powerballwinner]

Was not surprised to see Sanders as my top choice, but sadly he lost. Johnson will be on the ballot, so at least he has a chance

Honestly I think I want hillary to be indicted more than i want to be accepted to dental school

 

[SrJulio]

Honestly I think I want hillary to be indicted more than i want to be accepted to dental school

The director of the FBI is a republican, just saying

 

[powerballwinner]

The director of the FBI is a republican, just saying

#Comey2016