How bad would it look if I did a large amount of clinical experience in a short period of time?

[mrh125]

I'm a recent graduate from undergrad and didn't have time to do much clinical experience on top of research, non-profit work, a job, and classes (I did shadow a psychiatrist and cardiologist briefly once though). Now that i'm out i'm a scribe for a GI doc and am going to have 100 hours completed by the end of this month. Would that look bad on an application if that is most of my clinical experience? I'm just curious and what I probably will do is to keep volunteering until June (when I apply) and get like 500 hrs of clinical experience, assuming I dont have to retake the mcat. How much better would that look to med schools?

I want to show that i'm actually dedicated and not just looking to tack on hours. I'm enjoying being a scribe, but at some point I want to switch to a job where I can get paid (is there any way to get paid and gain clinical experience?) and take some time off so i'm not burnt out for med school.

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[mehc012]

I'm a recent graduate from undergrad and didn't have time to do much clinical experience on top of research, non-profit work, a job, and classes (I did shadow a psychiatrist and cardiologist though). Now that i'm out i'm a scribe for a GI doc and am going to have 100 hours completed by the end of this month. Would that look bad on an application if that is most of my clinical experience? I'm just curious and what I probably will do is to keep volunteering until June (when I apply) and get like 500 hrs of clinical experience, assuming I dont have to retake the mcat. How much better would that look to med schools?

I want to show that i'm actually dedicated and not just looking to tack on hours. I'm enjoying being a scribe, but at some point I want to switch to a job where I can get paid and take some time off so i'm not burnt out for med school.

100hrs is 2.5wks of f/t work. It's only a month or so of half-time work. That hardly demonstrates any long-term exposure.

 

[mrh125]

100hrs is 2.5wks of f/t work. It's only a month or so of half-time work. That hardly demonstrates any long-term exposure.

Why is long term exposure needed and how much time counts as long term (would 4 months be enough?) A lot of people do a few hours a week for like years, I'm doing 8 hrs a day 4-5 days a week, so i'm thinking that should be comparable. Honestly, as a scribe I got the hang of my role pretty quickly and there aren't many surprises.

 

[SnakeOilForSale]

I mean yeah it does look a little bad, but what can you do about it? Just put down whatever you can.

 

[mehc012]

Why is long term exposure needed and how much time counts as long term (would 4 months be enough?) A lot of people do a few hours a week for like years, I'm doing 8 hrs a day 4-5 days a week, so i'm thinking that should be comparable. Honestly, as a scribe I got the hang of my role pretty quickly and there aren't many surprises.

It just looks bad to start a full-time job and then quit a month (or even a few months later). Seriously, ask any employer anywhere.

 

[mrh125]

It just looks bad to start a full-time job and then quit a month (or even a few months later). Seriously, ask any employer anywhere.

Yes I see what you're saying, but it's part time volunteering though.

 

[SunsFun]

Do you have a good explanation as to why you didn't get any clinical exposure earlier?

 

[mehc012]

Yes I see what you're saying, but it's part time volunteering though.

How is 40hrs/wk part time?
Also, just saw that it's for GI...makes more sense now.

 

[mrh125]

Do you have a good explanation as to why you didn't get any clinical exposure earlier?

I was super busy with a large amount of time spent doing research (I was trying to get published, which didnt happen but I ended up spending an enormous amount of time on various research projects), non-profit work which I was brought into by a professor I did research with, a job, and school and already overloaded with all of that. t I just didn't have the time before I graduated and if I did it would have compromised my work in other endeavors. Would med schools view that as reasonable?

Also, aside from that other stuff I did there was the mcat which was pretty much the most time consuming thing i've ever studied for in my life.

 

[SunsFun]

I was super busy with a large amount of time spent doing research (I was trying to get published, which didnt happen but I ended up spending an enormous amount of time on various research projects), non-profit work which I was brought into by a professor I did research with, a job, and school and already overloaded with all of that. t I just didn't have the time before I graduated and if I did it would have compromised my work in other endeavors. Would med schools view that as reasonable?

Sounds like you're making excuses to be perfectly honest with you. Every premed is busy, some a lot more than others. It is pretty much expected that you have to find some way to get long term clinical exposure be it volunteering on Saturday or Sunday night.

 

[Pacna]

Sounds like you're making excuses to be perfectly honest with you. Every premed is busy, some a lot more than others. It is pretty much expected that you have to find some way to get long term clinical exposure be it volunteering on Saturday or Sunday night.

+1

That said, I don't know that you have many other options. Take the experience and make it sound good.

 

[mrh125]

Sounds like you're making excuses to be perfectly honest with you. Every premed is busy, some a lot more than others. It is pretty much expected that you have to find some way to get long term clinical exposure be it volunteering on Saturday or Sunday night.

It's not an excuse at all actually. Studying 8 hours a day on top of a job, internships, and research is overwhelming on its own. I actually had to cut back on research, internships, and quit my job so I could maintain my grades. I had basically had to choose between fulfilling every single thing on the checklist of stuff you need to do as a premed (volunteering, mcat, job,internships, research, good grades) and maintaining my gpa. I chose the latter and have A+s in o-chem to show for it.

As for the mcat 6-7 or more hrs a day for around 6-7 months is unbelievably time-consuming. Honestly, when I first found out how much clinical experience premeds were expected to do on top of everything else I was speechless, because not every premed can do all of these requirements on top of school and all their other responsibilities and expect everyone to without exception is a tad unreasonable to say the least. everyone has different circumstances and not everyone can balance all of this stuff on top of school and other responsibilities.

Also, by actually being able to focus on clinical experience instead of treating as a side activity that I'm just getting through on top of a long laundry list of responsibilities i'm getting more out of it than I would had I attempted it as an undergrad.

 

[Pacna]

It's not an excuse at all actually. Studying 8 hours a day on top of a job, internships, and research is overwhelming on its own. I actually had to cut back on research, internships, and quit my job so I could maintain my grades. I had basically had to choose between fulfilling every single thing on the checklist of stuff you need to do as a premed (volunteering, mcat, job,internships, research, good grades) and maintaining my gpa. I chose the latter and have A+s in o-chem to show for it.

As for the mcat 6-7 or more hrs a day for around 6-7 months is unbelievably time-consuming. Honestly, when I first found out how much clinical experience premeds were expected to do on top of everything else I was speechless, because not every premed can do all of these requirements on top of school and all their other responsibilities and expect everyone to without exception is a tad unreasonable to say the least. everyone has different circumstances and not everyone can balance all of this stuff on top of school and other responsibilities.

Also, by actually being able to focus on clinical experience instead of treating as a side activity that I'm just getting through on top of a long laundry list of responsibilities i'm getting more out of it than I would had I attempted it as an undergrad.

8 hours a day for undergrad? Were you taking 30 credits?!

 

[SunsFun]

It's not an excuse at all actually. Studying 8 hours a day on top of a job, internships, and research is overwhelming on its own. I actually had to cut back on research, internships, and quit my job so I could maintain my grades. I had basically had to choose between fulfilling every single thing on the checklist of stuff you need to do as a premed (volunteering, mcat, job,internships, research, good grades) and maintaining my gpa. I chose the latter and have A+s in o-chem to show for it.

As for the mcat 6-7 or more hrs a day for around 6-7 months is unbelievably time-consuming. Honestly, when I first found out how much clinical experience premeds were expected to do on top of everything else I was speechless, because not every premed can do all of these requirements on top of school and all their other responsibilities and expect everyone to without exception is a tad unreasonable to say the least. everyone has different circumstances and not everyone can balance all of this stuff on top of school and other responsibilities.

Also, by actually being able to focus on clinical experience instead of treating as a side activity that I'm just getting through on top of a long laundry list of responsibilities i'm getting more out of it than I would had I attempted it as an undergrad.

I sympathies with you as I had some very tough semester as nontrad working full time while doing everything else full time as well. I slept about 4 hrs on average yet I still found 4-8 hours a week to volunteer in clinical settings. Adcoms are not likely to cut you some slack for being too busy to volunteer. It is just a bottom line.

 

[mrh125]

8 hours a day for undergrad? Were you taking 30 credits?!

Remember not everyone works, learns, or has the same skill-set as you. I took 20 units for 3 quarters (2 of those quarters I had research weighted as 3-5 units), in other quarters I took 12 or 15 and the classes were just really hard and time-consuming and it took a lot of time to be able to do well in them such as o-chem. I put the time in to succeed in school and got the grades and had I done less I wouldnt have a gpa that was a good enough for med schools and have had to gain lost ground on the mcat. And had I not chose to focus on my grades and instead did clinical experience with research and everything else I'd have to hear about how my grades aren't good enough and lots of premeds have 3.8 gpas and I'm just "making excuses" because I couldn't handle an avalanche of responsibilities on top of school. I'm pushing myself the hardest I can given my skill-set, deficiencies of my own, and learning abilities.

 

[HarryPlopper]

It's not an excuse at all actually. Studying 8 hours a day on top of a job, internships, and research is overwhelming on its own. I actually had to cut back on research, internships, and quit my job so I could maintain my grades. I had basically had to choose between fulfilling every single thing on the checklist of stuff you need to do as a premed (volunteering, mcat, job,internships, research, good grades) and maintaining my gpa. I chose the latter and have A+s in o-chem to show for it.

As for the mcat 6-7 or more hrs a day for around 6-7 months is unbelievably time-consuming. Honestly, when I first found out how much clinical experience premeds were expected to do on top of everything else I was speechless, because not every premed can do all of these requirements on top of school and all their other responsibilities and expect everyone to without exception is a tad unreasonable to say the least. everyone has different circumstances and not everyone can balance all of this stuff on top of school and other responsibilities.

Also, by actually being able to focus on clinical experience instead of treating as a side activity that I'm just getting through on top of a long laundry list of responsibilities i'm getting more out of it than I would had I attempted it as an undergrad.

Med schools like to see that you're busy and you're trying to improve. A large amount of clinical experience in a short time obviously isn't as good as it being spread out but Adcom understand the circumstances if you are doing other things that show commitment, particularly research.

All in all, don't kill yourself volunteering. It's important, but not nearly as important as grades or MCAT.

 

[mrh125]

I sympathies with you as I had some very tough semester as nontrad working full time while doing everything else full time as well. I slept about 4 hrs on average yet I still found 4-8 hours a week to volunteer in clinical settings. Adcoms are not likely to cut you some slack for being too busy to volunteer. It is just a bottom line.

Thank you. balancing all these responsibilities is really trying with med schools and the whole premed process is really difficult and all I seem to hear is "good is not good enough". I managed to do well in college after doing really poorly in high school and working to deal with lack of study techniques, focusing issues, and time management issues - that wasn't good enough "you need a 3.6 gpa or higher", I pushed myself even harder to achieve that, started being able to do well in courses and actually get consistent good grades for the first time in my life, and "that wasn't good enough you need e.c.s, research, publishing looks good and I also wanted to be able to research" - I got research and worked towards being published, did non-profit work, got a job and it was hard to balance my grades and I had to withdraw from classes for a quarter and take a reduced load even w/o that stuff. "you need to maintain your gpa because numbers matter for medical schools", I cut down on my hours of research, non-profit work, and a job all while hearing about reasonable the expectations of being able to do all that stuff on top of classes supposedly was. I got the grades and had to hear "med schools like to see students who study for their mcat on top of classes", so I did that which got unbelievably frustrating (it's a really difficult exam, lots of the material emphasized on it wasn't covered super well in my undergrad so i had to learn a lot of new stuff, and I was taking really difficult upper div classes and had to make major come backs on each final to get my gpa which was a 3.59 up to a 3.60+ gpa and when I graduated I did pull off a 3.62 gpa.) and even after studying for 6-7 months and utilizing all the resources available my scores were still borderline 30 on official AAMCS exams (highest I got on one was a 31) "but med schools only want students with a 30 [30 as a bare minimum] above on the mcat", so I took the mcat and am waiting on my score. To makes matters even worse I discovered how important volunteering was for med schools on the day of my last final in undergrad (I always thought I could volunteer a little, shadow a few docs and that'd be enough and I also wanted to actually get something out of the experience and have it be meaningful), so instead of actually getting a chance to enjoy myself in my graduation period I end up having to do a ton of digging to turn this lemon into lemonade and get volunteering (I was willing to invest as much time as needed as noted by the fact I am completing over a hundred hours a month) all while hearing "med schools want students who volunteer on top of all their other responsibilities as an undergrad and many med school students would love to work 50+ hrs a week at a clinic".

Also, if you add mental fatigue and sleep deprivation into the picture it just gets even more unsavory, not to mention that I had very little quality of life on top of all those responsibilities ( i'm not some gifted prodigy who can just sit in class, barely pay attention, multi-task and just get all As. it takes me all the time i've got, I set up office hours with professors often times every school day, wasn't afraid to look stupid, spent a lot of time with study groups, hundreds+ flashcards, re-reading notes, the book, looking up all sorts of resources to get concepts to do well). Not to mention it gave me very little time to truly value and appreciate what I was doing). If you pile this many responsibilities on the average person it becomes more of a laundry list than anything and harder and harder to actually get something out of what you're doing. People can only do so many things and I did the most I could and honestly, I would rather do one or two things for med school and have them be meaningful (if that were possible and unfortunately it isnt) and actually get something out of it than have to complete a ton of different things at once. Imagine being tugged on by like 5 different people in totally different directions, that's what the whole premed process is like for me. Not to mention I received consistent poor advice and discouragement from the premed counselors.

 

[mehc012]

Thank you. balancing all these responsibilities is really trying with med schools and the hole premed process is really difficult and all I seem to h...ear is "good is not good enough". I managed to do well in college after doing really poorly in high school and working to deal with lack of study techniques, focusing issues, and time management issues - that wasn't good enough "you need a 3.6 gpa or higher", I pushed myself even harder to achieve that, started being able to do well in courses and actually get consistent good grades for the first time in my life, and "that wasn't good enough you need e.c.s, research, publishing looks good and I also wanted to be able to research" - I got research and worked towards being published, did non-profit work, got a job and it was hard to balance my grades and I had to withdraw from classes for a quarter and take a reduced load even w/o that stuff. "you need to maintain your gpa because numbers matter for medical schools", I cut down on my hours of research, non-profit work, and a job all while hearing about reasonable the expectations of being able to do all that stuff on top of classes supposedly was. I got the grades and had to hear "med schools like to see students who study for their mcat on top of classes", so I did that which got unbelievably frustrating (it's a really difficult exam, lots of the material emphasized on it wasn't covered super well in my undergrad so i had to learn a lot of new stuff, and I was taking really difficult upper div classes and had to make major come backs on each final to get my gpa which was a 3.59 up to a 3.60+ gpa and when I graduated I did pull off a 3.62 gpa.) and even after studying for 6-7 months and utilizing all the resources available my scores were still borderline 30 on official AAMCS exams (highest I got on one was a 31) "but med schools only want students with a 30 [30 as a bare minimum] above on the mcat", so I took the mcat and am waiting on my score. To makes matters even worse I discovered how important volunteering was for med schools on the day of my last final in undergrad (I always thought I could volunteer a little, shadow a few docs and that'd be enough and I also wanted to actually get something out of the experience and have it be meaningful), so instead of actually getting a chance to enjoy myself in my graduation period I end up having to do a ton of digging to turn this lemon into lemonade and get volunteering (I was willing to invest as much time as needed as noted by the fact I am completing over a hundred hours a month) all while hearing "med schools want students who volunteer on top of all their other responsibilities as an undergrad and many med school students would love to work 50+ hrs a week at a clinic".

Also, if you add mental fatigue and sleep deprivation into the picture it just gets even more unsavory, not to mention that I had very little quality of life on top of all those responsibilities ( i'm not some gifted prodigy who can just sit in class, barely pay attention, multi-task and just get all As. it takes me all the time i've got, I set up office hours with professors often times every school day, wasn't afraid to look stupid, spent a lot of time with study groups, hundreds+ flashcards, re-reading notes, the book, looking up all sorts of resources to get concepts to do well). Not to mention it gave me very little time to truly value and appreciate what I was doing). If you pile this many responsibilities on the average person it becomes more of a laundry list than anything and harder and harder to actually get something out of what you're doing. People can only do so many things and I did the most I could and honestly, I would rather do one or two things for med school and have them be meaningful (if that were possible and unfortunately it isnt) and actually get something out of it than have to complete a ton of different things at once. Imagine being tugged on by like 5 different people in totally different directions, that's what the whole premed process is like for me. Not to mention I received consistent poor advice and discouragement from the premed counselors.

Chill. Life is hard, we get it. You're a rockstar. Please stop telling us to imagine the premed life...we're right there with you.
I don't disagree with your plan/priorities, but it's coming across very 'my life is so difficult, guys!'
Not finding out that volunteering is important is a matter of poor research.
Choosing to take the MCAT during a semester was YOUR choice.
Who cares what the average person can/will do? This is about what YOU can do, and about what the best applicants can do. 'Average of any group which is not the one I am competing against' is a meaningless thing.

100hrs in a month is not some miracle super-difficult deal. It's working part-time. If you don't need the paycheck right now and can do it with a volunteer position, awesome. But let's not pretend that it's some herculean feat.

Yes, some people are ridiculously over-the-top in this process. It is not expected that everyone is able to do that...but it is looked upon favorably if someone can.
It's perfectly fine if you cannot do everything, and it shows intelligence and maturity to recognize what YOU can do happily and well in a semester and then to really push yourself to your limit. In the end, it comes down to 'do the best that you can do at all stages of this process.' But you lose a lot of that credit when you complain about the fact that you chose to push yourself to your limit and then throw in a bunch of excuses.

 

[mrh125]

Chill. Life is hard, we get it. You're a rockstar. Please stop telling us to imagine the premed life...we're right there with you.
I don't disagree with your plan/priorities, but it's coming across very 'my life is so difficult, guys!'
Not finding out that volunteering is important is a matter of poor research.
Choosing to take the MCAT during a semester was YOUR choice.
Who cares what the average person can/will do? This is about what YOU can do, and about what the best applicants can do. 'Average of any group which is not the one I am competing against' is a meaningless thing.

100hrs in a month is not some miracle super-difficult deal. It's working part-time. If you don't need the paycheck right now and can do it with a volunteer position, awesome. But let's not pretend that it's some herculean feat.

Yes, some people are ridiculously over-the-top in this process. It is not expected that everyone is able to do that...but it is looked upon favorably if someone can.
It's perfectly fine if you cannot do everything, and it shows intelligence and maturity to recognize what YOU can do happily and well in a semester and then to really push yourself to your limit. In the end, it comes down to 'do the best that you can do at all stages of this process.' But you lose a lot of that credit when you complain about the fact that you chose to push yourself to your limit and then throw in a bunch of excuses.

I thought of 100 hours a month as a lot honestly (when im working on something 8 hours a day that is a lot of time), but that makes sense, what would full time be? I'm not making excuses I'm putting everything about me on the table/developing acontext and I have no problem working hard and I compete more against myself than others because realistically I wouldn't have been able to accomplish any of the stuff I mentioned 3-5 years ago. It's just hearing "most people do x, y,and z on top of underwater basket-weaving while climbing mount everest" gets tiring. I want to be a competitive applicant for medical schools, so I can actually get into medical school and my other goal is to have some quality of life and actually be able to enjoy what i'm doing and have it amount to something given how much time all of us put into this premed business and being told that we need to complete even more requirements to be a competitive. I'm not trying to just complain about my life and I rarely do that. I only posted that to drive home the point that every person has different circumstances and not everyone can balance everything even though it may have come across wrong.

I didn't take the mcat during a semester, I took it the month after I graduated, I started studying in like june (6-7 months before I took it). The volunteering business you're right about, but I did the best I could given my own circumstances and how informed I was at that particular time. Also, now I get a new opportunity to actually make more of clinical experience and get something out of it now that I'm not under as much pressure.

 

[mehc012]

I thought of 100 hours a month as a lot honestly (when im working on something 8 hours a day that is a lot of time), but that makes sense, what would full time be? I'm not making excuses I'm putting everything about me on the table/developing acontext and I have no problem working hard and I compete more against myself than others because realistically I wouldn't have been able to accomplish any of the stuff I mentioned 3-5 years ago. It's just hearing "most people do x, y,and z on top of underwater basket-weaving while climbing mount everest" gets tiring. I want to be a competitive applicant for medical schools, so I can actually get into medical school and my other goal is to have some quality of life and actually be able to enjoy what i'm doing and have it amount to something given how much time all of us put into this premed business and being told that we need to complete even more requirements to be a competitive. I'm not trying to just complain about my life and I rarely do that. I only posted that to drive home the point that every person has different circumstances and not everyone can balance everything.

I didn't take the mcat during a semester, I took it the month after I graduated, I started studying in like june (6-7 months before I took it). The volunteering business you're right about, but I did the best I could given my own circumstances and how informed I was at that particular time. Also, now I get a new opportunity to actually make more of clinical experience and get something out of it now that I'm not under as much pressure.

It's all about the phrasing!

At any rate, the bottom line here was meant to be:
You asked how bad it would look if you did a large amount of clinical experience in a short period of time.
The answer is, essentially, not as good as an extended period of service, and not as bad as not doing it.

You can't go back and add it in the past...and you don't necessarily want to. It sounds like you really pushed yourself in ugrad, and that is something you can be proud of and talk about. So do your thing now, and when it comes up phrase it as "I really pushed myself in school by doing xyz. After graduation I realized that I wanted more exposure to the medical field before making the plunge, so I decided to volunteer as a scribe at a GI place."
What you SHOULDN'T do is suddenly quit after a month without moving to something else. It's one thing to move forward from an activity (though preferably there would be at least a small clinical experience committment so that you don't look like you were just checking boxes in a rush) to another one...that shows that you found a new position or hobby or wanted to see different things. It paints an entirely different picture if you rush in a chunk of hours and then walk away, never looking back, and not really doing anything else. THAT would imply that you were cramming in what you thought you could, as a minimum, and then dropping it as soon as you could.

 

[kyamh]

It's all about the phrasing!

At any rate, the bottom line here was meant to be:
You asked how bad it would look if you did a large amount of clinical experience in a short period of time.
The answer is, essentially, not as good as an extended period of service, and not as bad as not doing it.

You can't go back and add it in the past...and you don't necessarily want to. It sounds like you really pushed yourself in ugrad, and that is something you can be proud of and talk about. So do your thing now, and when it comes up phrase it as "I really pushed myself in school by doing xyz. After graduation I realized that I wanted more exposure to the medical field before making the plunge, so I decided to volunteer as a scribe at a GI place."
What you SHOULDN'T do is suddenly quit after a month without moving to something else. It's one thing to move forward from an activity (though preferably there would be at least a small clinical experience committment so that you don't look like you were just checking boxes in a rush) to another one...that shows that you found a new position or hobby or wanted to see different things. It paints an entirely different picture if you rush in a chunk of hours and then walk away, never looking back, and not really doing anything else. THAT would imply that you were cramming in what you thought you could, as a minimum, and then dropping it as soon as you could.

100% agree. My application's clinical volunteering is pretty smooshed into a short period of time. I'll be honest, I was checking a box - my volunteer interests have been outside of healthcare.

I've been asked about my clinical volunteering during interviews and have honestly explained that I decided to apply to medical school late in my college career, and knew that I would not have a lot of time given my post-graduation job has crazy hours. Interviewers were happy enough after I continue to talk about how I have squeezed in more shadowing in the last year and have made other attempts to gain insight about medicine (such as asking physicians who work near me to meet for lunch to chat about their path to medicine).