PhD/PsyD How much are PsyD salaries?

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
My brother went to a group treatment for panic disorder. So there was supposed to be a group of about 10 people, it ended up mostly him showing up..and he really wasn't impressed. He felt that for most part the "therapy" was sort of pointless. And this is at one of the most respected institutions in Canada. Maybe he'll change his mind as time goes on, as I do think he's a bit better.

Part of his annoyance at the process is that I think he thinks he got labelled so fast - a quick 30 minute consultation gave him a different diagnosis than his family doc (who gave him something else). Part of the problem as well is some days he thinks he has a specific issue, other days he doubts his diagnosis and if he has mental illness, and nobody is able to clarify it one way or another. He also noted that a lot of the stuff they said sort of didn't get through because he's anxious so it's hard to pay attention (you are sort of self-focused)...you are listening, but not really.

Members don't see this ad.
 
But I'll also say that in my experience the loudest voices trumpeting evidence-based interventions are frequently those who don't do full-time clinical work, don't enjoy clinical work, or are neuropsychologists.

Which means what, to you?
 
I think it's interesting that the loudest voices aren't, for the most part, the people doing most of the therapy. I understand one reason is that poorly-trained therapists have few professional choices apart from private practice, and so the field is full of practicing therapists who don't know better.

But I don't think that's the whole story.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
Which means what, to you?
I think it's interesting that the loudest voices aren't, for the most part, the people doing most of the therapy. I understand one reason is that poorly-trained therapists have few professional choices apart from private practice, and so the field is full of practicing therapists who don't know better.

But I don't think that's the whole story.
You're still not saying what that means to you, though.
 
I think it's interesting that the loudest voices aren't, for the most part, the people doing most of the therapy. I understand one reason is that poorly-trained therapists have few professional choices apart from private practice, and so the field is full of practicing therapists who don't know better.

But I don't think that's the whole story.

I don't see anything like this. Some of the strongest proponents of evidence based treatments that I have worked with have been full-time therapists. Maybe it's a bias on this board since we have a large proportion of npsych's, but in the real world, I don't see anything like what you describe.
 
I think it's interesting that the loudest voices aren't, for the most part, the people doing most of the therapy. I understand one reason is that poorly-trained therapists have few professional choices apart from private practice, and so the field is full of practicing therapists who don't know better.

But I don't think that's the whole story.

I trained in a clinical scientist training program and I am now in a primarily clinical position. I will say there are many factors that "pull" me away from evidence-based practice (the pressure to see anyone regardless of their likelihood of benefit, patient preferences, time limitations, etc.). I still get the best results (subjectively and objectively) and feel the most effective when I actually use my core training and skills.

I'm curious about what you are referring to when you say "the whole story." Are you suggesting that people who develop treatments are out of touch?
 
I do evidence based treatment with everyone. This does not mean a run manual with everyone-a minority actually. I just want to make sure we are being clear about that, al la doing behavioral activation and cued relaxation training for depression/anxiety vs chit-chatting about their relationship with their mother for 6 sessions.
 
I do evidence based treatment with everyone. This does not mean a run manual with everyone-a minority actually. I just want to make sure we are being clear about that, al la doing behavioral activation and cued relaxation training for depression/anxiety vs chit-chatting about their relationship with their mother for 6 sessions.
Only 6?
 
How could you possibly get to the root of why your mother is the cause of your noncompliance with your medical regimen in only 6 sessions? Truly, you must be a miracle worker.

because she invalidated by feelings by saying my SDN postings were mean. Only took once session...
 
Members don't see this ad :)
When you're in school, 80k-100k sounds like an unfathomable amount of money. When you start making that, you realize the take home is much smaller. 80k is around 5400/month without state taxes. Then deduct the maximum for your 401k, because you are starting later than everyone else, and your take home is around 4000. Now you'll probably want a mortgage, so following the 30% rule you can afford about 260k worth of house with property taxes. Now you have 2800/month for food, cars, childcare, savings, insurance, student loan debt, and saving for your child's education. Say 500:month in car paymentsx2, groceries $500, 250 for college fund which won't pay for your kids education at all when inflation is accounted for, $400 for leisure+ eating out+ vacation fund, $200 for cable and Internet and phone.... You're not even thriving.
I'm not planning on being a single dad. Where is my wife's income?
 
I'm not planning on being a single dad. Where is my wife's income?

More student loans and after hours childcare.....

I'm not saying that one cannot have a comfortable life on 80k. I am trying to illustrate the deficit in understanding of how day to day finances end up working. One could stay single, live in a car for 10 years, end up a millionaire, and retire to Belize. One could marry an heiress, VC, neurosurgeon, or investment banker and their income/lifestyle would be vastly different. One's perspective on how to spend money can also drastically change any scenario.
 
More student loans and after hours childcare.....

I'm not saying that one cannot have a comfortable life on 80k. I am trying to illustrate the deficit in understanding of how day to day finances end up working. One could stay single, live in a car for 10 years, end up a millionaire, and retire to Belize. One could marry an heiress, VC, neurosurgeon, or investment banker and their income/lifestyle would be vastly different. One's perspective on how to spend money can also drastically change any scenario.
This is why I only date professionals. Yes they also have expenses but double the income and increase expenses by a quarter and the situation becomes a lot less bleak
 
Prison jobs are difficult to fill despite salary range. Psychologist jobs in Corrections in the three State where I am licensed range from 45,000 to 85,000 and they seem to run continuous advertising year around. Private Practice with multiple contract may get income in the 150,000 to 200,000 range.

I think prison work would be cool. Only part time though. I feel the mind is more interesting when cornered in certain situations.

Also, my faith looks on visiting the imprisoned as a corporal work of mercy.
 
I think prison work would be cool. Only part time though. I feel the mind is more interesting when cornered in certain situations.

Also, my faith looks on visiting the imprisoned as a corporal work of mercy.

Just to be clear, as a psychologist, you are not going to the prison for the same reason/purpose/function that St Pius X did.
 
upload_2015-12-9_12-18-37.jpeg
Heyoooo!
 
Just to be clear, as a psychologist, you are not going to the prison for the same reason/purpose/function that St Pius X did.

Does the reason matter - you're there to heal in a certain way, right?
 
Only within my scope of practice/purview of my license. I wouldn't want to confuse/blur the line between delivering psychological interventions and anything else like spiritual counseling/support.
 
Does the reason matter - you're there to heal in a certain way, right?

Not necessarily. ie., forensic evaluations, staff training, research, etc.
 
Does the reason matter - you're there to heal in a certain way, right?
I personally think that it is important to keep distinctions between my personal spiritual and charitable practices and my paid professional work. To go into the reasons would lead to a long philosophical debate, but the shorthand version is that clear boundaries are an essential element of good practice.
 
Not necessarily. ie., forensic evaluations, staff training, research, etc.
Are training and research not done for the good of our clients and humanity in general? I also don't agree that spiritual and mental health work should be separate. Not that I should be going places with bible tracts etc but that spiritual concerns are intertwined with mental health when it related to grief/loss, existential concerns etc
 
Are training and research not done for the good of our clients and humanity in general? I also don't agree that spiritual and mental health work should be separate. Not that I should be going places with bible tracts etc but that spiritual concerns are intertwined with mental health when it related to grief/loss, existential concerns etc

You can agree or disagree with whatever the hell you want. Doesn't change the research base and professional roles/guidelines.
 
You can agree or disagree with whatever the hell you want. Doesn't change the research base and professional roles/guidelines.
Where do either of these say I'm not allowed to counsel a client who feels betrayed by their higher power/idea of God because they suffered a loss?
 
Are training and research not done for the good of our clients and humanity in general? I also don't agree that spiritual and mental health work should be separate. Not that I should be going places with bible tracts etc but that spiritual concerns are intertwined with mental health when it related to grief/loss, existential concerns etc

In the roles I mentioned, it means they arent your patients, thus "healing" them in some fashion is not the goal. There is no doctor patient relationship.

The role of psychologist is fundamentally different than that of a priest/chaplain. I frequently talk about this with our priest. If you dont want them to be seperate, the you should be a chaplain.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Where do either of these say I'm not allowed to counsel a client who feels betrayed by their higher power/idea of God because they suffered a loss?

You can. You are also ethically obligated to refer to spiritual authority/counselor when the matter turns from counseling about the behavioral sequela, and into spiritual guidance within their faith.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
You can. You are also ethically obligated to refer to spiritual authority/counselor when the matter turns from counseling about the behavioral sequela, and into spiritual guidance within their faith.
I agree, and I don't claim to offer guidance. But even a cursory glance at available research suggests I should allow my therapeutic session to be a safe space for the client to explore their own spiritual beliefs in the context of their mental health.
 
I agree, and I don't claim to offer guidance. But even a cursory glance at available research suggests I should allow my therapeutic session to be a safe space for the client to explore their own spiritual beliefs in the context of their mental health.

No one said it shouldn't be.
 
No one said it shouldn't be.
I was referring partially to "I personally think that it is important to keep distinctions between my personal spiritual and charitable practices and my paid professional work" and the general attitude although PSYDR's knee-jerk misrepresentation of the literature is certainly a surprise
 
I was referring partially to "I personally think that it is important to keep distinctions between my personal spiritual and charitable practices and my paid professional work" and the general attitude although PSYDR's knee-jerk misrepresentation of the literature is certainly a surprise

I agree with smalltowns statement as well. My previous comment made no mention of the clinician disusing his/her own spiritual battles or beliefs, right?
 
You like having nonsensical discussions.
 
You like having nonsensical discussions.
Said the guy calling people "dummie" and then editing it because you misspelled that word? You are an embarrassment and a disgrace.
 
You like having nonsensical discussions.

I don't think he is particularly informed on the subject matter of professional psychological practice, but it's a important discussion and not nonsensical.

I dont think name calling helps anyone's argument here.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
I dot think he is particularly informed on the subject matter of professional psychological practice, but it a important discussion and not nonsensical.
I am well informed and could cite research. My earlier point is that I consider all my research and work with clients to be a contribution spiritually and professionally to the world
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
I was referring partially to "I personally think that it is important to keep distinctions between my personal spiritual and charitable practices and my paid professional work" and the general attitude although PSYDR's knee-jerk misrepresentation of the literature is certainly a surprise

Show me the dsm5 diagnosis for spiritual difficulties and the evidence based treatment for this disorder. You know, cause you're well informed.
 
Show me the dsm5 diagnosis for spiritual difficulties and the evidence based treatment for this disorder. You know, cause you're well informed.
I think it is better conceptualized as a symptom. "Anxiety" or "isolation" or any of the things we treat may be associated with different pathologies. If someone is anxious about spiritual issues I would treat anxiety. If they are depressed... I would treat it as depression. Did you actually look this up and see research? Because what research is emerging suggests spirituality should be addressed if the client so needs.
 
I think it is better conceptualized as a symptom. "Anxiety" or "isolation" or any of the things we treat may be associated with different pathologies. If someone is anxious about spiritual issues I would treat anxiety. If they are depressed... I would treat it as depression. Did you actually look this up and see research? Because what research is emerging suggests spirituality should be addressed if the client so needs.

What does "addressed" mean? I think thats the key disagreeing factor here. No one said that its "off limits." We have said, your role is limited within this capacity as a psychologist.
 
What does "addressed" mean. I think thats the key disagreeig factor here. No one said that its "off limits." We have said, your role is limited within this capacity as a psychologist.
If by "no one" you mean yourself I agree, and take no issue with you. But I do take issue with being called a "dummie" after psydr provided no rationale for implicitly declaring it off limits.
 
Top