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How much does IQ factor in to medical school success?

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical Allopathic [ MD ]' started by One More Rep, 04.01.08.

  1. One More Rep

    One More Rep

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    I have searched for information regarding the average IQ of medical students and practicing physicians. I cannot find anything. Does anyone know of a study regarding this correlation? Also, what are your opinions on this? Do you think someone will be a more successful medical student/physician if they have a higher IQ or does it have no impact? Discuss away! :D
  2. Isoprop

    Isoprop Fascinating, tell me more

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    well sure, if you go by the classical definition of IQ, i'm sure someone who is mentally retarded cannot succeed in medical school. his disability would make it not feasible to undertake such an endeavor. so yeah, intelligence in that regards definitely matters.
  3. taponthecloud

    taponthecloud

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    likelihood of success in med school according to iq:

    below average: not likely
    average: likely
    above average: likely

    *nothing is guaranteed in med school*
  4. tiedyeddog

    tiedyeddog

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    Actually, I think about your question like yoursoften. I have come to the conclusion that a higher IQ couldn't hurt you but this quote speaks my mind on the subject:
    “Leaders aren't born, they are made. And they are made just like anything else, through hard work. And that's the price we'll have to pay to achieve that goal, or any goal.”
    Vince Lombardi
  5. EpiPEN

    EpiPEN Aegis of Immortality

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    lol
  6. 1956Goldtop

    1956Goldtop

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    One would need at least an average IQ to comprehend the material necessary to be a physician, but I suspect that past that it is mostly hard work (unless you are talking about 2 standard deviations above that).
  7. physiologyguy

    physiologyguy Member

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    anyone know thier IQ? maybe list them here - IQ, MCAT, USMLE1, etc...
  8. taponthecloud

    taponthecloud

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    ps... my success likelihood vs. iq chart has been scientifically proven.
  9. Law2Doc

    Law2Doc 5K+ Member Moderator Emeritus

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    Actual IQ tests are not used in higher education in the US because the test results are considered horribly flawed and biased. Thus folks tend to only do IQ tests for bragging rights (eg joining organzations like MENSA) in the US. So I would put absolutely no stock in an IQ score, and nor do med schools, law schools, dental schools etc. But if your question is really do smarter people do better in med school, as a doctor, etc., then the answer is obviously yes.
  10. gamepad

    gamepad

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    IQ plays a huge role in medical success, however, its role is contrary to many people's understanding. IQ has an inverse relationship with success.

    In most fields, having a high IQ is very beneficial. In medicine it is the opposite. Having too much logic undermines the entire medical process.

    I implore you, if you or anybody you know has a higher than average IQ (90-110), take precautionary steps to ensure this individual does not enter the field of medicine. The lives of many innocent are at stake.
  11. taponthecloud

    taponthecloud

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    :laugh: i wish i were cursed with that infliction, then.

    EDIT: or is it... I wish I were inflicted with that curse.
  12. searun

    searun

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    The top docs are smart. Very smart. But to my eternal regret, the top lawyers are much smarter, and more charismatic, and better paid, at least the trial lawyers are more charismatic, not the accounting types who ended up in tax law and estate planning who could not get a date in high school, but who must be kicking butt at the 20th year class reunion. Alas, the tax lawyers and the estate planners have great retirement accounts, and the trial lawyers drink too much but they get the girls. The docs, well, not so many girls. From a guy's perspective.
  13. mfrizzo3

    mfrizzo3

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    IQ = -14.5
  14. taponthecloud

    taponthecloud

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    you don't speak for me, sir.
  15. searun

    searun

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    Pride cometh before a fall. So exactly what do you take pride in, Sir, your mind and intellect or your, ...., well this is polite company, but if you take pride in that appendage, then, sir, I applaud your self confidence.
  16. taponthecloud

    taponthecloud

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    the greatness of humanity is falling and getting back up. over and over and over again.
  17. dd128

    dd128

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    What's a top doc? Attending physician?

    Anyway, of course doctors who've been around a while are going to be extremely smart. The same is true for virtually anyone in their given field or profession. I've had humble professors who were geniuses in all sense of the word say they aren't smarter than anyone in the class, they have just been doing it for so long they have a great deal more information. I'd say smart is a relative term, much like intelligence. I would go out on a ledge and say the majority of physicians are smart. But to compare the "smartness" of a physician to that of a lawyer or estate planners is like comparing apples to oranges. IMO.
  18. biggiesmallsiz

    biggiesmallsiz

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    above average: MD
    below "above average": DO
  19. iA-MD2013

    iA-MD2013 Moderator Emeritus

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    that's not nice!!!
  20. MossPoh

    MossPoh Textures intrigue me

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    That is a path best avoided, especially since some of the DO schools have average stats higher than some of the MD schools. It also really has nothing to do with the IQ question.

    You obviously can't be retarded for medical school, but in most cases, hard work trumps straight up intelligence. There are always exceptions. Everybody knows of that guy who can just retain everything with no work, but most people aren't that guy.
  21. Quix

    Quix Herr Professor Moderator Emeritus

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    Yeah, let's not go there.

    On topic, all I know is that I can usually tie my shoes correctly in three tries or less.
  22. searun

    searun

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    Absolutely, you must get back up over and over again. With great enthusiam, I might add. The cream always rises to the top. Or so they say. If you like milk. Or cream.
  23. DBR

    DBR

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    only retarded people an go into DO schools i heard
  24. Quix

    Quix Herr Professor Moderator Emeritus

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    What's cool is that the analogy still works with high-fat-content feces in septic tanks!
  25. Quix

    Quix Herr Professor Moderator Emeritus

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    Did I stutter? This is flame-baiting.
  26. DBR

    DBR

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    hey hey lay off me there big guy. i just sayin what i heard from my doctor who aint no DO if you were wonderin/
  27. iA-MD2013

    iA-MD2013 Moderator Emeritus

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    ewww
  28. Quix

    Quix Herr Professor Moderator Emeritus

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    That justifies the comment...how?
  29. biggiesmallsiz

    biggiesmallsiz

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    haha hey quixy, i bet DO's probably take >= 4 tries to tie their shoes.

    ahahah ur awesom
  30. Quix

    Quix Herr Professor Moderator Emeritus

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    My awesomeness aside, I'd really prefer not to turn this into a MD/DO whack-a-mole thread.
  31. biggiesmallsiz

    biggiesmallsiz

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    bet DO's would win the "whack-a-mole" contest.


    did you know cavemen apparently had super fast reflexes?
  32. medguy83

    medguy83 Member

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    I'm sure there must be some study out there correlating IQ and success in medicine, but more often than not I think other personal qualities like endurance, dedication, are more indicative of sucess. From what I've seen the subject matter in medical school isn't any more complicated or difficult than your basic premed courses. The challenge really lies in the volume of material, so obviously the lazy genius will be faced with more of an uphill battle than the other guy who isn't as bright but has a stronger work ethic. At one of my interviews this was actually brought up. It seems my interviewer's younger brother was able to breeze through college and did very well on the mcat (something like a 39) went to med school and ended up dropping because 1.) It was too much work 2.) He realized he didn't like sick people and 3.) he couldn't get high as a doc. He dropped and went into law.
    His point, as well as mine here is that while intelligence is a neccessity, persistence and a passion for what you do are equally important if not moreso concerning success in medicine.
  33. DBR

    DBR

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    your frend sounds like a genius that i know of excpet if he really were that smart hed just get high anyway and tell the cops to **** off and shoot them if they ever came around. thats what my dad does and he is a fbi agent that retired.
  34. Doublecortin

    Doublecortin

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    what the hell is your problem! :mad:. BAN this fool!!!
  35. 1956Goldtop

    1956Goldtop

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    uhh okay??

    ^ Referring to DBR's post
  36. flip26

    flip26

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    I saw some research indicating the average IQ for physicians is around 125...a little higher for PhDs...but physicians had the highest average for professionals...
  37. lex

    lex

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    I think when it comes to medicine (premed, med school, and beyond), hard work and persistence is key. Without it, I don't think anybody even with a super IQ will succeed. Most people with high IQ like to get quick results without lots of effort, obviously because they don't have to. To be in medicine is a bit counter intuitive for them.

    I must say that my IQ is above average (140) and I do prefer doing math (I'm a Math major) than memorizing intro biology because I don't have to study (or very little) for math. In fact, in some of my math courses, I never attended the lecture, only came for the exams, and still got solid As. But for orgo, bio, etc., I had to come to the lecture (dammit).. I disliked the learning process because I had to memorize a lot (more memorization than comprehension, unfortunately). I did, however, only had to read once or most, twice, for courses like psych or history just to pull an A. (I'm lazy in a way). I managed to pull all As in my science courses (other than math) because I actually studied and read the books (shocker!). It has been a humbling experience, I must say. Maybe those with IQ 160 and above would not need to study, but in general, without hard work, I probably would have flunked.
  38. mfrizzo3

    mfrizzo3

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    Which Scale?
  39. bozz

    bozz

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    IQ tests are BS :laugh:
  40. mfrizzo3

    mfrizzo3

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  41. bozz

    bozz

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    Does anyone here know of a pretty darn accurate online IQ test?

    Janitors from 75 - 110? They've obviously never seen Good Will Hunting :D
  42. parto123

    parto123

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    Where are you getting this from? This couldn't be further from the truth. Talk to any clinical, neuro or school psychologist, and they will tell you how important these tests are and the prevalent of their use. They are not used for graduate school admission because they were not designed for this purpose.

    There is controversy surrounding the exam (but much like with evolution, much of this is political and ideological), but its validity is almost uniformly accepted in the scientific and educational world.
  43. One More Rep

    One More Rep

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    Thanks for the responses. I have a lot of interest in psychology and am actually doing an internship with a psychologist right now. I don't know about higher education, but we love to IQ test those young'uns! I was tested in kindergarten and put into the gifted track. I have never had to try too hard for academic success and I would love to continue the trend in med school! ;)

    Obviously, I realize hard work is a huge factor in med school and I am slowly trying to teach myself diligent, intensive study habits. I am still a couple years away from applying since I am postbac and work full-time, so I have time to get the formula right.

    I guess I was just hoping I could stroll into the interview, say, yo, I am pushing 140, can we just skip the b.s and go get a beer? :laugh:
  44. :laugh: If only it were that easy!

    There are plenty of people in med school with high IQs - just like there are people with more "average" IQs who still succeed through hard work.

    My tested IQ is high but I certainly had my struggles through undergrad and med school.
  45. Maxprime

    Maxprime Higgs chaser

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    If you have a high enough IQ, you don't even have to do rotations - you only have to consume all grapes that are peeled for you and repress your urge to sweat whilst being fanned.

    Blade can probably attest that, due to his huge brain, he came out of the womb with his current level of medical knowledge and dexterity. After all, doctors don't know very much, they figure it all out for the first time on a case by case basis.
  46. :laugh:

    Your last sentence often isn't THAT far from the truth, though, in more exotic, rare cases.
  47. MossPoh

    MossPoh Textures intrigue me

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    Same here, with the exception of medical school since I'm not there. My greatest problem has never been intelligence, but rather the fact I get distracted every 10 seconds and never study. Those iq tests are pretty crappy. They did one to find out the averages in the european countries, and it seemed to be more of a pissing contest than anything. The smarter countries such as Poland generally weren't doing too stellar, so it hasn't helped them much. I was bombarded with iq and achivement tests as a kid. They wanted to send me off to some honors school and take classes with college kids when I was 14 and now? Well now I have a crappy gpa and will be lucky to get in anywhere.
  48. BlitzSleep

    BlitzSleep Junior Member

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    Don't worry about it. People like him usually drop out of college :)
  49. Bartelby

    Bartelby

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    You guys are probably underestimating the IQ of the "average" medical and premedical students around you. Completing a rigorous college program at a good school with mostly A's so that you can pay for the privilege of going through an extremely rigorous four year program followed up by years of intense training is not something your "average" IQ person generally does. Realize that in your circle of friends (who are likely well-educated and reasonably successful) the "average" people are probably actually well above the population average, and thus even your "average" friends are relatively high IQ.

    Don't misunderstimate yourselves.
  50. pride4jc727

    pride4jc727

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    I think IQ does play a role, but not that much. Like what others have said, I believe that it is your motivation and other personal factors that get you further along in medical school and a subsequent career. But then again, I am just a lowly pre-med, so what do I know?

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