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Aye, that's me.
I royally messed up in undergrad as a pre-med and have no idea what to do with my life now.
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wanna be friends?
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@Upwardtrendfornow If you want to try out computer science, just tell me and I'll give you some links to sites that will help you get started. The software industry, for the most part, doesn't care what degree you have but rather how good of a programmer you are. Hell, the software company I work for has only about half of its employees with CS or ECE degrees.
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Yes, you can find me at weenie hut jr's.
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Well, I took the time off and I have decided that eventually, I do want to go into the medical field. I guess the interest developed a little too late but ideally, I want to go into dentistry as I planned. Are there Caribbean dental schools or DO type programs for Dentistry that do grade replacement like there are for med schools?
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Surely this is a question for the dental forums. Good luck to you, though!
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Oh C'mon now. I know I haven't been around and I'm responding to an old comment, but it's the "med school or Goldman is the only thing that exists" attitude that pops up on the pre-allo boards that just screams "lives in a bubble, still in school with no real world experience".
Strong work, except the fact that I was a financial analyst before medical school and that I was on the super-day interview committees.
I love the "I know medicine, therefore I know how other careers work, but really, I don't."
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I have a question, did the OP ever explain what happened? Well, what obstacles he faced and struggled the most with through his undergrad years. I am a current undergrad and could use the advise.
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I know I am not the best person to give you advice right now ..since I myself am starting my premed studies soon but I still want to stay this..
please don't give up, there is still hope ,Ive seen some people go back to school after
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hi
hum I know I am probably not the best person to give you advice right now since I am going to start my PRE MED studies soon, but I have to say this..
don't lose hope.. don't give up .. if medicine is really what you want to do .. don't lose hope ,there is still a chance.
I've seen some full time working adults going back to school for medicine and become doctors.
hum I know I am probably not the best person to give you advice right now since I am going to start my PRE MED studies soon, but I have to say this..
don't lose hope.. don't give up .. if medicine is really what you want to do .. don't lose hope ,there is still a chance.
I've seen some full time working adults going back to school for medicine and become doctors.
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If you actually enjoy science/ health, I suggest just looking for entry level positions that seem health/ science related. I'm currently in a gap year and got a full time job as a phlebotomist at a plasma center. Comes with full benefits and all that, and I have pretty much no prior work experience besides some part time stuff with the university. You could work as a lab tech or something else. Your current goal should be to just find an entry level job that's in the career direction you want to go in. After working for a while, you can then at least feel comfortable with a steady income and then reevaluate where you want to go from there. Just getting work experience in something will be very valuable.
Who knows? you could end up actually liking the job you get and find out that there is enough opportunity to move up the chain that you end up deciding to just follow that path. Or, you might find another opportunity and be able to use your work experience to grab a better job. Or, maybe you decide you want to pursue something entirely different and go back to school... either way, your best option now is to just get a job so that you can start building experience and get to have some amount of income.
Who knows? you could end up actually liking the job you get and find out that there is enough opportunity to move up the chain that you end up deciding to just follow that path. Or, you might find another opportunity and be able to use your work experience to grab a better job. Or, maybe you decide you want to pursue something entirely different and go back to school... either way, your best option now is to just get a job so that you can start building experience and get to have some amount of income.
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I'm apologizing beforehand because this post will sound harsh but I have worn your shoes and walked the path you are about to embark on...
Why? Why do you want to go into the medical field? Have you ever worked with a dentist? Shadowed one? Throughout this thread I have not actually seen you say WHY you want to take this path. Not your parents, not your family, YOU. Why are you doing this? You can take a much easier path. One that involves making money, opening a retirement account, security. After two weeks of soul searching you just decided to embark on a path that might not even reward you with ANYTHING. So, how much are you willing to risk? How much are you willing to sacrifice?
Now you do not need to answer me, nor anyone else on this forum. But you need to answer these questions to yourself. Especially those last two questions. Now...
YOU ARE A FAILURE AND YOU DID THIS TO YOURSELF.
Internalize what I just said and let it harden you. Let it drive you. You already received a taste of it on this forum but it is only the beginning. The world will not forget, why should you? Most people, they do not know what it is like to fail to the degree in which you and I have. They do not know what it feels like to see all the C's, D's, F's roll down on their transcripts. They do not know what it feels like to to have a respected professor crush their spirit in his office because he thinks he knows better. They do not know what it feels like to have an admired attending physician tell them to stop pursuing medicine because of their GPA. They do not know what it feels like to have their own flesh and blood disown them for pursuing their dreams.
They do not know what it feels like to overcome their past one moment at a time.
But I know, because this has all happened to me and this will all likely happen to you. At this juncture I give you a 1/10 chance of making it to dental school. The same odds for me when I graduated college. The cynics will use that to convince you to quit and will say to you, "NINE PEOPLE FAILED!" but I say, "Someone succeeded." I succeeded. I am not a minority and I did not check off any disadvantaged boxes so I know it can be done.
I do not need to tell you the price of failure because you probably already know. So...How much are you willing to risk? How much are you willing to sacrifice?
Why? Why do you want to go into the medical field? Have you ever worked with a dentist? Shadowed one? Throughout this thread I have not actually seen you say WHY you want to take this path. Not your parents, not your family, YOU. Why are you doing this? You can take a much easier path. One that involves making money, opening a retirement account, security. After two weeks of soul searching you just decided to embark on a path that might not even reward you with ANYTHING. So, how much are you willing to risk? How much are you willing to sacrifice?
Now you do not need to answer me, nor anyone else on this forum. But you need to answer these questions to yourself. Especially those last two questions. Now...
YOU ARE A FAILURE AND YOU DID THIS TO YOURSELF.
Internalize what I just said and let it harden you. Let it drive you. You already received a taste of it on this forum but it is only the beginning. The world will not forget, why should you? Most people, they do not know what it is like to fail to the degree in which you and I have. They do not know what it feels like to see all the C's, D's, F's roll down on their transcripts. They do not know what it feels like to to have a respected professor crush their spirit in his office because he thinks he knows better. They do not know what it feels like to have an admired attending physician tell them to stop pursuing medicine because of their GPA. They do not know what it feels like to have their own flesh and blood disown them for pursuing their dreams.
They do not know what it feels like to overcome their past one moment at a time.
But I know, because this has all happened to me and this will all likely happen to you. At this juncture I give you a 1/10 chance of making it to dental school. The same odds for me when I graduated college. The cynics will use that to convince you to quit and will say to you, "NINE PEOPLE FAILED!" but I say, "Someone succeeded." I succeeded. I am not a minority and I did not check off any disadvantaged boxes so I know it can be done.
I do not need to tell you the price of failure because you probably already know. So...How much are you willing to risk? How much are you willing to sacrifice?
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@Upwardtrendfornow If I haven't thoroughly pissed you off and you are still reading this here is some more practical advice.
First step, crush the DAT. I would recommend teaching if you can, somehow. If you can successfully explain things like nucleophilic substitution, solubility rules, RNA transcription,...cube counting?? I'm looking at wikipedia and what is being tested on the DAT? Anyways, you can explain stuff like that you could probably answer any question the DAT throws at you. You cannot do well here, great no biggie. You cut your losses and do something else. You are probably only down a few thousand bucks. Succeed here...the rabbit hole will only get deeper.
Next step, go do a Special Master's Program (SMP). Fork over that $50k+ so you can take first year medical school classes alongside the medical students and be graded on their curve. You do well, that is place in the top third or quarter of the class, and there will be almost no doubt you can handle the academic rigors of dental school. Many courses in the first two years of medical and dental school are the same. I believe Columbia dental and medical students basically share the same class.
In the meantime, do all the things that pre-dental students do to buff their application...you should probably ask a dentist what that would be as this is beyond my experience.
This should also be a journey of self-discovery and self-improvement. Become more focused and mature yourself. Unlearn your bad habits. Do not take the DAT until you are ready. Do not go do an SMP until you are ready. Example, I know people that did an SMP and continued to religiously play video games that destroyed their second chance for medical school!
This process will take years. Have patience. Have confidence. Steel yourself against the hate because there will be no shortage of that I guarantee you. Good luck buddy
First step, crush the DAT. I would recommend teaching if you can, somehow. If you can successfully explain things like nucleophilic substitution, solubility rules, RNA transcription,...cube counting?? I'm looking at wikipedia and what is being tested on the DAT? Anyways, you can explain stuff like that you could probably answer any question the DAT throws at you. You cannot do well here, great no biggie. You cut your losses and do something else. You are probably only down a few thousand bucks. Succeed here...the rabbit hole will only get deeper.
Next step, go do a Special Master's Program (SMP). Fork over that $50k+ so you can take first year medical school classes alongside the medical students and be graded on their curve. You do well, that is place in the top third or quarter of the class, and there will be almost no doubt you can handle the academic rigors of dental school. Many courses in the first two years of medical and dental school are the same. I believe Columbia dental and medical students basically share the same class.
In the meantime, do all the things that pre-dental students do to buff their application...you should probably ask a dentist what that would be as this is beyond my experience.
This should also be a journey of self-discovery and self-improvement. Become more focused and mature yourself. Unlearn your bad habits. Do not take the DAT until you are ready. Do not go do an SMP until you are ready. Example, I know people that did an SMP and continued to religiously play video games that destroyed their second chance for medical school!
This process will take years. Have patience. Have confidence. Steel yourself against the hate because there will be no shortage of that I guarantee you. Good luck buddy
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As much as I think the tone is a bit harsh (I think that method works on some people, but not as well for the OP), you raise an amazing point...
What happened in two weeks for you to make that decision?
I wonder if the OP really thought it through hard, or he's letting his age and immaturity show.
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go be a paramedic, I'm an EMT and I see some pretty AVERAGE individuals becoming paramedics.
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average individuals become doctors too. Whats your point?
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Depression and mental health issues, did not get them addressed until later in my undergrad years after I saw a psychiatrist. Had family issues as well (parents going through divorce) and issues with things like coming up with rent to pay for college so I had to work while taking upper level science courses. Some of it had to do with my mom pressuring me to go the pre-med route but I kinda found the love for dentistry along the way, got discouraged after I saw my GPA, and now went back to thinking how I can work around this and make dental school a reality.
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I think other posters have raised good points though. If you are absolutely certain that it's either dental or nothing, they have given you ways to go all in and dedicate a lot more time and energy to pursing it. What redlobsteractual said will give you the best shot at dental school I imagine. But, you have not explained why you want to be a dentist, and it sounds more like just trying to make your parents happy.
Honestly, you sound like you still have some growing up to do. My advice would be to make sure you are 100% certain you want to be a dentist before shelling out the time and money to do an SMP. You must realize that the things you said for why your grades are poor, although may seem like decent excuses, and I'm sure are enough to hinder many people's success, still are things that PLENTY of other pre-meds on here have had to deal with and still overcame with flying colors. There is a huge difference between one or two poor semesters and 100's of credits of bad performance. If those things where going on, then continuing to just slog through college with poor grades shows a lack of judgment.
So, IMO, the wise thing to do from here 100% depends on WHY you want to be a dentist and just how SURE you are of it. Have you even shadowed a dentist? What do you know about dentistry? My dad was an orthodontist who owned his own clinic and my brother is a current dental student so I could try to answer your questions (although obviously current dentists could give you better answers.)
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+ 8 sideways
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I am not going to ignore my mistakes from the past, I've made some brutal mistakes that I am afraid might even haunt me for life. I'll admit that I have been a victim to some poor circumstances throughout my life but if others have excelled in bad circumstances, I have no excuse.
After taking more than two years to really examine myself, I've noticed my biggest weakness is that I was never proactive in life and was extremely laid back. My biggest weakness is the reason I am not a competitive applicant for professional schools and the reason I am a failure in life right now. Having that feeling of defeat and knowing that you failed is something that will keep you up for many nights and make you lose sleep, it is not a feeling anyone wants to have. I literally drew out diagrams on a piece of paper and wrote stuff out to examine what made me so careless, when I finally found out what it was, I fixed it.
Addressing that major weakness and learning to absolutely loathe it is what brought me here, it is why I posted this thread and joined this forum. I saw my life flash before my very eyes, even though I am in my early 20s I know how time can fly by in the blink of an eye. A part of me saw a future where I was living pay check to pay check barely able to make ends meet and other scenarios where I was on the streets begging for money as I slept in a cardboard box. At that point, I realized that if I am so careless to let my GPA die then I might as well be careless enough to where I end up a bum on the street.
The hate for that carelessness I had is what made me post this thread and stay on this forum. I have had users on here call me all sorts of name and consistently berate me, but I am willing to deal with it, because I freaking deserve it for being the imbecile I was in my younger years. If I could just go back in time and beat the younger me senseless to where he is laying in a hospital bed knowing what a buffoon he was for messing up his life, I would do it in a heartbeat.
Those 3 semesters of 4.0s showed me that I am better than that careless version of me. I could work as a lab tech for the rest of my life or a school teacher, but I feel like if there was a way for me to get a second chance and have a shot at dental school, I would capitalize on that opportunity and excel.
After taking more than two years to really examine myself, I've noticed my biggest weakness is that I was never proactive in life and was extremely laid back. My biggest weakness is the reason I am not a competitive applicant for professional schools and the reason I am a failure in life right now. Having that feeling of defeat and knowing that you failed is something that will keep you up for many nights and make you lose sleep, it is not a feeling anyone wants to have. I literally drew out diagrams on a piece of paper and wrote stuff out to examine what made me so careless, when I finally found out what it was, I fixed it.
Addressing that major weakness and learning to absolutely loathe it is what brought me here, it is why I posted this thread and joined this forum. I saw my life flash before my very eyes, even though I am in my early 20s I know how time can fly by in the blink of an eye. A part of me saw a future where I was living pay check to pay check barely able to make ends meet and other scenarios where I was on the streets begging for money as I slept in a cardboard box. At that point, I realized that if I am so careless to let my GPA die then I might as well be careless enough to where I end up a bum on the street.
The hate for that carelessness I had is what made me post this thread and stay on this forum. I have had users on here call me all sorts of name and consistently berate me, but I am willing to deal with it, because I freaking deserve it for being the imbecile I was in my younger years. If I could just go back in time and beat the younger me senseless to where he is laying in a hospital bed knowing what a buffoon he was for messing up his life, I would do it in a heartbeat.
Those 3 semesters of 4.0s showed me that I am better than that careless version of me. I could work as a lab tech for the rest of my life or a school teacher, but I feel like if there was a way for me to get a second chance and have a shot at dental school, I would capitalize on that opportunity and excel.
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Its rare that people admit their faults out loud, and I respect that.
So here's what you do then if you truly want to go down this path, dominate the DAT or MCAT. That may still not be enough to prove your capabilities. Do a SMP and dominate that...in this order exactly, for if you:
A. Don't / Can't dominate, then that should be the first sign that you may not be able to do it. You will be out a couple hundred this way rather then thousands. At this point, I would probably call it quits. I'm not going to go into semantics whether MCAT/DAT represents capabilities of one to succeed in professional school...
B. If you do dominate, use that confidence to roll into a SMP.
Does this suck? Yes, yes it does. But, the cards are on the table now, what are you going to do?
So here's what you do then if you truly want to go down this path, dominate the DAT or MCAT. That may still not be enough to prove your capabilities. Do a SMP and dominate that...in this order exactly, for if you:
A. Don't / Can't dominate, then that should be the first sign that you may not be able to do it. You will be out a couple hundred this way rather then thousands. At this point, I would probably call it quits. I'm not going to go into semantics whether MCAT/DAT represents capabilities of one to succeed in professional school...
B. If you do dominate, use that confidence to roll into a SMP.
Does this suck? Yes, yes it does. But, the cards are on the table now, what are you going to do?
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You've now missed the point of two consecutive posts.
You now have demonstrated your lack of awareness consecutively. Strong work.
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Well that seems like the plan, I wonder if SMPs are really that forgiving though.
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Go into another field.
I don't want to be mean, but the harsh reality is I don't think being a MD doctor is possible...
You COULD try DO - and look at your grade replacement - have you calculated that?
I'd recommend nursing.
So what makes you want to be a doctor?
I don't want to be mean, but the harsh reality is I don't think being a MD doctor is possible...
You COULD try DO - and look at your grade replacement - have you calculated that?
I'd recommend nursing.
So what makes you want to be a doctor?
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The aim was to go into Dentistry.
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I didn't read past the first post - but why is this posted in pre-med?
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OP was distraught, kind of posted every where it seemed plus his situation wasn't entirely unique to dental so we engaged in discussion.
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Is nursing school an option right now?
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Do you like coding? you can be a computer programmer and make over 80k. look into appacademy or hack reactor.
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You probably need better grades than you have to get into nearly any kind of school program. However, school is not your only avenue to finding work that pays well and is satisfying. Open source software is a field that is growing rapidly, easy to teach yourself, and allows you to learn and get work without regard to your GPA or even what you studied in school, as long as you have the skills. If you want a marketable skill that can lead to a stable career there are lots of options besides medicine, learning computer programming is just the one that comes to mind first for me.
If you don't have money or access to the various code academies, you can start getting involved with an open source project directly. Drupal in particular I know has a great program for teaching newcomers how to contribute: http://drupalladder.org/
If you're near Chicago or can travel there, I also recommend Dev Bootcamp: http://devbootcamp.com/ They are not only good about teaching people technical skills, but also contributing to a positive culture in the industry.
If you don't have money or access to the various code academies, you can start getting involved with an open source project directly. Drupal in particular I know has a great program for teaching newcomers how to contribute: http://drupalladder.org/
If you're near Chicago or can travel there, I also recommend Dev Bootcamp: http://devbootcamp.com/ They are not only good about teaching people technical skills, but also contributing to a positive culture in the industry.
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Why is a thread from last year being brought back up now?
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Probably because of the feature where it suggests similar threads below the reply box, with no regard for how old those threads might be. I've accidentally brought a few back from the dead that way.
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I've finally been around for long enough that a thread I was involved in got necro bumped...
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Interesting, I did not expect this thread to be bumped, thanks to whoever liked my posts and bumped this thread.
I am looking into it, I got on code academy and am working with that right now but it does seem like the field is relatively unstable in regards to finding a stable career. I've heard that layoffs are very much the norm and some guy in a third world country can easily do the job, still trying by learning Java and Python right now though.
I am looking into it, I got on code academy and am working with that right now but it does seem like the field is relatively unstable in regards to finding a stable career. I've heard that layoffs are very much the norm and some guy in a third world country can easily do the job, still trying by learning Java and Python right now though.
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Hey OP - it sounds like you are still finding yourself, what you are interested in, and what you care about. It can be tough, but it is a very important journey. I wish you the best of luck in your travels.
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Step 1: Become a nurse.
Step 2: Become an APRN.
Either that or redo so many courses that a DO school will take you.
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As a recently-ex-programmer-by-choice, I would suggest that if you are good at what you do, that is largely irrelevant. Companies are absolutely hiring. The big threat right now has not really been outsourcing (except for very very entry level positions) but rather the growing lack of VC funding for a lot of companies... but despite that, many of them are doing well and sticking around. You need to hone your skills though, and that's where contributing to open source projects comes in. It's free and a great way to show potential employers that you know your thing. Check out OpenHatch.
I would specifically call out codecademy and many bootcamps (including some that "promise" you a job) as starting points and not too useful especially if you're thinking of the likes of Google. The only people I see succeeding that way are super motivated and are usually picking up programming _again_ (e.g. because of motherhood or late discovery partway into an unrelated degree) and they're being hired for more than just a superficial ability to code.
You might want to consider my past career as a middle ground if you find that you enjoy writing code! Scientific and health software can be a uniquely useful and challenging experience. That's actually what got me started on thinking about applying to med school even though I'm in my late 20s.
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I kinda do have a plan though.
1 - Find a job, with my degree in the sciences I am looking for something as a lab tech to hold me up and put a roof over my head, not like I want to live in NYC or anything right now.
2 - Learn some coding on the side and get good enough to where I can find employment.
3 - Study for the GMAT for the next 3 years, very confident that I can get a 700+ on it because if I was a business or finance major my GPA would have easily been over a 3.7
4 - Try to get into a top 25 MBA program, I know that my GPA will be a setback but I think I might be able to get into at least one.
5 - Try to get into finance that way, pretty sure I can handle Investment Banking and Management Consulting as a job. If I wasn't pressured into medicine, I would have been a finance major and I am 110% sure my GPA would have been damn close to a 4.0
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Thank you, I am working with code academy right now.
I hope you make it into med school, sure you would made an amazing doctor!
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I'll tell you a quick story about my god-brother. He got his degree in bio, didn't do so well, didn't get into med school. Decided to take some IT classes on the side, now he's making six figures and does IT consulting and is very happy. Don't lose hope, your career is definitely not over at 21. Having a plan is the first step of succeeding
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Have quite a lot of confidence there in your abilities with another degree. I'm glad you're thinking of a path, but overconfidence can be your downfall.
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Please, finance classes are a cakewalk compared to hard pre-med sciences. I know for a fact that if I was allowed to major in finance, my GPA would be in the 3.8 to 3.9 range.
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I take it you haven't taken math finance and quantum finance.... and financial economics. Those areas will make premed courses look like a complete joke.
Some examples:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black–Scholes_equation
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Random_walk_hypothesis
Optimization theory (which requires multivariate calculus) is also very important in solving many key economics/finance problems. Advanced statistics and regression analysis play major roles as well. So yeah, i would easily argue that finance as a whole is a lot harder than premed courses.
Rote memorization and some minor applications will help you excel in upper level bio courses. The same approach will lead to a decisive failure in finance courses (as well as in math/chem/physics courses). Don't underestimate the difficulty of finance.
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I would dominate the life out of a finance major, it is a cake walk compared to the pre-med track.
Finance MIGHT have a couple of tough courses here and there but compared to the pre-med track, it is a cake walk. If my major was finance in college, I would have graduated with at least a 3.7 GPA easily. As a matter of fact, if the opportunity for me to break into banking still existed, I would literally take a bunch of tough finance classes for a semester and walk out with a 4.0.
- Joined
- Jun 17, 2014
- Messages
- 63,099
- Reaction score
- 154,727
Okay good luck with that bro. Too bad the same didn't happen with your rigorous bio major.
- Joined
- Dec 11, 2014
- Messages
- 15,262
- Reaction score
- 23,963
This kid's arrogance just annoys the piss out of me. Good luck friend. If you're going to go into finance I hope you find forums that fit your new career path better.
